Why Bramblestar is a TERRIBLE Character

[@SuddenSugar1023]

The main thing that FiresStar and BrambleStar have in common is killing their half brother

[@starstrixx_owl]

Lol

[@Someperson12532]

I didn't think of that lol.

[@GoldRetriever]

Firestar killed scourge,Bramblestar killed Hawkfrost

[@nonwolf5015]

Oh yeah lol

[@Grace-2010op]

💀💀

[@spookystorms5318]

Honestly I wish squilf and bramble had more of a sibling relationship

[@wolfywonder8480]

Honestly! Looking back, they remind me more of Maya and Phoenix from the Ace Attorney series. In other words - complete sibling energy, absolutely nothing beyond a platonic relationship.

[@butterstickrose2186]

Yeah we would of just had to hope they weren't into Sweet Home Alabama

[@dutch-falls]

They r cousins too I think-

[@orchidoxs126]

​@@dutch-falls I think they are distant cousins, But that's through retcons I mean ash was her uncle (through retcons) as well. Most of thunder coa is related to squif in some way now.

[@dutch-falls]

@@orchidoxs126 that too,honestly. it scares me.

[@JlMBO11]

i used to like brambleclaw. hell, he used to be one of my favorite characters. but the erins have a habit of absolutely destroying characters with significant potential. he became unlikable. he treated squirrelflight like garbage, and his whole character went down the toilet. he was simply shoved to the side, and, as stated in the video, all of his likability ran dry QUICK

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

Oh definitely! He was slipping before that but like. He just. Idk. His mental state completely destroyed him in my opinion. No confidence whatsoever left. But in reality we all know the Erin's just didn't pay enough attention to how he was written. Thus his character went down the toilet.

[@finnsnow2495]

@@BlurpleBeanCo Exactly, the whole relationship was sooo poorly written it's sad.

[@fearlesswolf5633]

Kinda like how finleap went from happy go lucky to complete dog shit. I know and appreciate how planned out it was, but I didn’t really like the message they set out. And every main character from one arc goes completely chad the next. For example, twigbranch and ivy pool.

[@scribbledoodl3830]

Well maybe it was because they want to make more drama because they probably got bored of the story so far and they are well known for making cats people hate also I agree they completely destroyed bramble star but I think they wanted to make the story interesting

[@banana_muffin_isabell8093]

@@scribbledoodl3830 I agree

[@Blossomie4]

I think in concept, the kits of Firestar and Tigerstar falling in love sounded like it was full of potential at first. But I believe a lot of the issues surrounding Bramblestar’s character was the execution. They try to make him out to be this “grand” leader, but the way the Erins portrayed that... ugh. It just came out as cruel and manipulative, and it’s such a shame to see all that potential wash down the drain.

[@Blossomie4]

It also pisses me off more because he was originally, a character I could relate to heavily when it came to the relationship with him and his father. My own mother is a very shitty person who I’m glad is out of my life, and I’m very determined to be nothing like her. So seeing a cat like him end up being almost just as bad as Tigerstar (even if he didn’t kill anyone) just makes me sick.

[@coyotemoonc3258]

I feel like if the TigerStar conflict was still happening it would have worked better.

[@PastryPuff9339]

And they had Leafpool and Mothwing RIGHT THERE

[@BugsyBugYT]

@@PastryPuff9339 I couldn't agree much more plus then the tiger n fire prophecy would be fulfilled and squilf could be single

[@7waterdrops_7]

The amount of emotional abuse Bramble put Squirrel through was just insane; the things he said/did to her are parallel to real-life narcissistic/emotional abuse. I still to this day do not understand why the Erin’s wrote their relationship and just didn’t see any issues? Like it’s kind of scary that they saw it as “normal” because it was just terrible

[@hotarutoshihiro4521]

Yeah and not to mention people say they’re both equally horrible to each other. Like.. no my guy.. no.... that’s not true, there’s a clear power dynamic and there’s clearly more love in one character than the other 😬😬😬

[@7waterdrops_7]

@@hotarutoshihiro4521 Fr- I hate it when people say that because it doesn’t even take that much to notice said power dynamic. The whole cycle of abuse that Bramble puts Squirrel through and nobody noticing it is so frustrating to read

[@_enderarts_3161]

Squirrelflight’s Hope really brought that out to me when he made Squilf tell him everything that she wanted to do for his approval. I used to only kinda like him before I read Squilf’s Hope and now I hate him

[@Kheluichollow]

@@hotarutoshihiro4521 actually it is kinda true. In moon kitties theory of bramble x squirrel relationship she states that Squirrel Basically used Ashfur a way to get bramble jealous. And I think they were always basically toxic to each other.

[@essaytime]

@@Kheluichollow No, she definitely didn't use Ashfur. There's even a scene when she's surprised because Brambleclaw is jealous.

[@essaytime]

I know this was said, but I really disagree with putting Ashfur as a good choice anywhere. The video is nice, but the Ashfur part itself... Ashfur was also toxic to her. He was never treating her like a real cat, my personal comparison to how he treated her is ,,a fragile, delicate flower". Pretty, but little, dumb and most likely only living a safe life when there's a strong warrior's arm they could lay on. He's overprotective and solves all the problems for her despite her plain statements that she doesn't want it. When she explains to him that she isn't into him, she loves him in a friend way, he refuses to listen to her arguments, tries to guilt trip her about choosing a murderer's son and that he only ,,thinks of her good", also using his mother's death as a bargaining chip. He maybe was there for her, but for constantly trying to grab her attention (the BrambleSquirrel crissis 1 may have in fact never happened, if he didn't try to get her to sit with him when Brambleclaw was already trying to explain something) and solving the problems for her while she doesn't want it. I don't think it is even right to state that he'll be still a better choice, as he would make her feel belittled and dumb all the time. When it comes to the Three, he perhaps would get angry at her and demand her exile, he'd be worse than Bramble. And if he ever became a leader, or even without becoming a leader, the ,,YOU DISAGREE WITH ME? TRASH!" will look the same, I bet. A nice mate for Squilf will be Shrewpaw or the good old TPB Brambleclaw when Erins didn't look for drama all the time.

[@finnsnow2495]

Exactly. Ash is worse in my opinion or at the very least the same degree of bad as Bramble. I think he'd try to kill her for the kits thing. Kill her and the kits because he wouldn't care about them only Squirrelflight. In fact now I'm thinking about it Ash would probably use them to keep Squirrel to himself, when he relizes they aren't his he'll have a breakdown.

[@essaytime]

@@finnsnow2495 I agree, it'll be likely for him to baby trap her, especially since Jayfeather looks kind of like him

[@holly205]

I. AGREE. SO MUCH OML. JUST *FACTS*

[@essaytime]

@@holly205 also thanks!

[@sandywolfr26]

Read the broken code to see what ashfur is like as a leader. He possessed bramblestar and he is much worse.

[@calliethewolfcat2183]

My sister and I actually created an alternate universe where Squirrelflight told the Clan that Ashfur was the father, not Brambleclaw. And it goes from there. Hope to fully have it written out one day.

[@commonlesbianw]

caps)) That sounds INTERESTING af

[@girl6090]

When your finish with it, could you right it out in the comment.

[@GobboProtector]

Ashfur wouldnt have been a good dad shown by his horrible mentoring. id love to see that

[@ink.miz2]

@@girl6090 im sure he was just upset that he was mentoring lionpaw

[@TheAutisticFrog]

Woah, if you do have that fully written out can you read it on your channel? I would love to listen to that.

[@mallow828]

wait- I just realized- all the parents (or one of) of most leaders were kinda little idiots (Bluestar: Stormtail, Tallstar: Palebird and Sandgorse, Crookedstar: Rainflower, Brokenstar: Yellowfang and Raggedstar) does child neglect make you a better leader???

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

Pfft. No idea. I never actually thought about that before.

[@fearlesswolf5633]

Ya ikr, there are a few videos talking abt how repetitive the Erin’s are with these kinds of things

[@Blossom_Flower-d1q]

Wait the parents or the leaders cause Tallstar and CrookedStar are beans and great leaders?

[@uglyfense7754]

Ah Brokenstar, the best leader

[@redaurora8602]

This topic is really hard for me, my parents were a lot like Bramble and Squirrel, like down to a tee. Even if i didn't read the books learning what tgey were like nearly broke me, because it just made me remember so much of that time. By now im just enraged at the Erins, that they made something that could, and *did* trgger a lot of bad memories not only for me but for others, abd still put Bramble in a pedestal and break poor Squirrel down. Im honestly just dreading that they pull a "BuT SqUrEl ReAlIsEd He DiD iT BeCaUsE hE lOvE hEr", cause this books are read by inpresionabke young minds, that can kead them to not recognise this time of situation, im just so dissappointed in the writers.

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

Oh my gosh I understand completely! I'm really sorry you went through this. But ya. It was poor foresight on the parts of the writers. I've heard them claim there's meant to be nothing wrong with their relationship as well and he wasn't meant to be written or seen as abusive, but he VERY clearly is!

[@Icepiq72]

I agree with you that Bramblestar was very abusive, but Ashfur would not have been better. Also, Squirrelflight didn’t even like Ashfur, he just got possessive and obsessed. Bramblestar would eventually have done the same to Jessie. I feel like Bramblestar and Ashfur just aren’t meant for love because of their abusive nature. Squirrelflight deserves someone that she can love and receive love from.

[@shibatheinu7394]

No Squirrel Flight is a idiot- she need's to die XD

[@orchidoxs126]

I both agree and disagree Squif did like ashfur, just ultimately not as much as Brambleclaw. But I agree he would've been just as bad or more abusive then Brambleclaw. He helped kill her dad , took on of his lives just because she didn't want to be his mate in the end. Treid to kill her adopted kits a year (s?) Later for the same reason. And then possessed her mate, manipulated her, and threw her off the leader rock when she confronted him. If Ashfur was told to be the 3's father, and then after the secret was told, he would've lashed out violently like everytime he has in cannon, and he holds grudges for years.

[@somerandomwolftherian]

..Like Tawnypelt?? :D

[@Icepiq72]

@@somerandomwolftherian tbh preferably someone closer to her own age

[@somerandomwolftherian]

@@Icepiq72 That is fair enough, better than Daisy tho (I imagine her to be an old woman)

[@tockaluz]

I disagree with your stance on Ashfur. He was pretty much infantilizing Squirrelflight, something that she didn’t want or need. He developed an obsession with her and I don’t think there’s any denying that Ashfur was responsible for his actions, especially his failed murder attempt of the three. I think that Squirrel flight with Moonlight when she was alive, or even with Jessy would’ve been fine.

[@Moxxie73]

I Respect your opinion but that was after SF Got with BS ,And he would have never gotten obsessive as if were the fact that he and SF Were kinda seeing each other.

[@Quarter_BeetheSkid]

@@Moxxie73 if someone has the capabilities to attempt to murder someone else’s children out of jealousy, that is a huge problem that won’t just be solved from getting what they want. The issue with Ashfur being obsessive would have come up later, trust me, either because he thinks Squirrelflight doesn’t love him enough or because he continues to get into spats with Brambleclaw whenever Bramble and Squirrel talk to each other or anything that might go wrong. Getting rejected by a crush wouldn’t make any normal cat murderous. Ashfur has some issues…

[@BugsyBugYT]

@@Quarter_BeetheSkid true that

[@wonderfulkath4051]

I agree

[@luvxoxundertalehazbinhotel1835]

SquilfxShrew or SquilfxJessy would be cute

[@loseram4]

I personally find Bramblestars relationship with Squirrelflight really abusive if I’m honest. And this is coming from a person who’s been in an abusive relationship themself.

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

Honestly I dont disagree with you. I have also been in an abusive relationship but. Kinda don't wanna discuss those things so it was easier to discuss my folks fighting during my childhood.

[@loseram4]

@@BlurpleBeanCo oh yikes! im so sorry man. And that’s totally understandable that you don’t wanna talk about it, I gotta say I was a bit uncomfortable as well when they started to fight a lot.

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

@@loseram4 the way he treated her in Squirrelflight's Hope most especially bothered me.

[@loseram4]

@@BlurpleBeanCo Oh definitely, you really were right when he had so much potential to be a great leader. The writers definitely threw him in the shitter

[@butterscotchpancakes2909]

Don't get me wrong I totally agree with the points you made about Bramblestar's and Squirrelflight's relationship. However I don't think Ashfur would have been a good choice for her either considering how even before the fire scene he was kind of possessive of her.

[@siqxyre8473]

Honestly, all this drama and shit has made me love him even more. I absolutely love the concept of him realizing how absolutely insecure he is after becoming leader. Without his mentor's eyes on him he panics, terrified that he will ruin the clan. Nevermind the CANON "after sunset:" scene where leafpool gets a prophecy that he will destroy the clan, a prophecy she realizes from his own words. In the newest novella about spotfur, he says for himself that he's trying to lead like firestar, but doesn't know if he can live up to him but he'll try. His whole personality is traumagenic, definitely from his father. As a fellow traumatized fellow cause my good ol' dad I find his skittish paranoid personality understandable. He definitely shouldn't be mates with squirrel though, his fear of rejection and need to control the opinions of others about him in fear they'll hate him otherwise is not suitable for being a mate. He shouldn't have a mate, he needs cat therapy. I'll clarify more later, in a google doc, since my rambling goes on a LOT more than KZbin comments can handle.

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

Lol. I am working on a video completely psycoanalyze-ing him. I think there's a lot more depth to his character than most people see. And I'll explain that while he's a bad character, he's also one of my favorite character arcs. Even if the Erin's didn't write him like that on purpose. There's a lot one can analyze in his behavior and what has fueled his decisions and such. And I'm gonna go majorly in depth about it.

[@RocNRol.]

I mean, I kinda do agree.

[@hannahladybuggirl89]

*slaps with slipper* PLZ WATCH UR LANGUAGE! There are people who don’t want t

[@notoriusbookworm48]

Here after the newest book "River" and I honestly don't even understand what the heck they're trying to do with him anymore?? why is he being so cold and weird?

[@vyrraee]

​@@notoriusbookworm48honestly I'll stop reading after they have their first litter bc it's pointless. They ruined him so bad.

[@jynx1463]

I agree with you. Thats all true

[@silenteye9547]

I'm the 69th like, this is my final form

[@jynx1463]

@@silenteye9547 oof

[@crazyeeveelady3636]

I don't know if Ashfur would have been a better choice for Squirrelflight. If he couldn't handle a rejection he most definitely couldn't handle the truth about the Three

[@juniperbliss]

As a person who's had to deal with parental issues and has been exposed to such since i was born, I have to completely agree with Bramblestar and Squirrelflights relationship. Their relationship comes off as forced and unstable.

[@nicorozner7417]

This is where I stand in all this Squilf controversy: Who ever said she needs a mate? Why choose between Ashfur and Bramblestar when they're both bad? She doesn't NEED a mate to be leader, or deputy, or even have kits; Leafpool took care of that for her. Just let her be a single she-cat. Nothing bad would come of it. In fact, her life would probably be way better! And hey, maybe this is aromantic, asexual me talking, but I don't really see the point in getting married anyways.

[@FantasticFawnleap]

I hate Squirrelflight!

[@M4t_P4tGT]

AroAce Squilf makes me very happy

[@nicorozner7417]

Brambleclaw: I will fight for my wife and be a good person with an interesting story arc. Bramblestar: i"M GoNNa dO tHE SaEm KArAKTEr arC AgaN ANd aBuSe My wIfE YEET

[@tamayako2000]

Seeing all the BrambleXSquirrel stans still going around is concerning because it shows how much people have normalized fighting in relationships. Note that I said fighting, not disagreeing. Disagreements are inevitable, but the moment it escalates into yelling, insults, blame and periods of giving the silent treatment, then it's just. not good. I grew up around relationships like that and they're emotionally scarring for everyone involved. Please don't normalize that people. It's fucked up and shouldn't be taken as okay. I'm so glad you and a lot of other people are speaking up about how fucked up it is. Your Ashfur take kind of bothers me, though. (not hating don't worry lol I'm not actually mad) No, Ashfur wouldn't have "been okay if Squirrel chose him". Don't try to blame his spiral on Squirrel, she should never be responsible for his actions, let alone to blame for him trying to *murder her family.* She wouldn't have been happy with him because she didn't return his feelings, and she shouldn't be responsible for making him happy by being in a relationship with someone she wasn't romantically into. (speaking from experience, having someone be blatantly into you while you clearly don't return the feelings can be a very, VERY uncomfortable situation that can generate a lot of guilt) I agree that post-rejection, the Erins kind of twisted his character for the sake of making him into a villain for the next arc and making Bramble look better, he was genuinely an "okay" guy before that(barring a few issues that probably could have been fixed with communication, I dunno for sure) but what happened happened, and what happened is canon. He wouldn't be a good fit for Squirrel at all. If his reaction to the breakup was any indication, he probably would have still snapped either way if he found out the kits weren't his, if Squirrel HAD chosen him. Claiming he would have been reasonable about the secret is just not realistic because of how he reacted to not being Squirrel's bf. He probably would have snapped and tried to kill Squirrel or the Three because he was "wronged" by being lied to. Saying you "don't blame him" for trying to murder her family over unrequited love is also pretty uncomfortable. There are a million better ways to try and tell her "hey you're in an abusive relationship, and I want you out of it" and he decided to be selfish and lash out because she "wronged" him. He didn't even care that she was in a shitty relationship, all he cared about was the fact that she didn't choose him. He even says, "I have no quarrel with Brambleclaw. (...) My quarrel is with you, Squirrelflight." so he's acting purely out of selfishness. That is not okay or understandable in the slightest. Even if he was angry at her for being in an abusive relationship and not picking a way out, that's still very messed up and borders on victim blaming. And regarding Jessy, who's to say Bramble wouldn't have treated Jessy just as badly as he treated Squirrel? TL;DR: Ashfur wouldn't have been the better choice, both he and Bramblestar are canonically garbage. Squirrelflight shouldn't have to choose between a guy she doesn't love and a guy who treats her like shit, and whether or not they act out shouldn't hinge on her choices.

[@finnsnow2495]

I don't understand why people always say Ash is better. There are people like that in the world and someone who is that obsessed with someone else will invetible break. Ash was a classic stalker personality and stalkers often kill the objects of their affections when they get rejected. Even if Squirrel didn't reject him if they were in a relationship he'd soon realize fantasy can't meet reality and break. That moment would be the kits not being his or something else. But, I think Squirrel would quickly break up with him he's possessive and Squirrel wouldn't tolerate that espically if she was deputy. I'm not even sure why Squirrel needs a mate. She is ambitious and determined cat who had potential to be leader, Tallstar never really had a mate and he was fine. Mousefur never officially had a mate either.

[@tamayako2000]

@@finnsnow2495 One of my friends put it best: Squirrel shouldn't have to choose between a loveless marriage and an abusive one.

[@mr.doggothegreat7287]

I would like to point out that I’m pretty sure Squirrelflight at one point had a small interest in Ashfur hence why she went to him even if a little bit. She saw SOME potential in him, I don’t think she’d court someone she didn’t at least have an interest in at first. And the way I see it if she did choose Ashfur his character wouldn’t be what it was (in canon) because then he’s the protagonist and not the antagonist so the writers would have a completely different view on his character. And while he was overprotective that is up to Squirrelflight to decide if she is okay with that and wants to work on it. Being worried for you s/o is normal in controlled doses! The story is what it is because of the writers wanting to make Ashfur a villain, so of course it’s not hard to see the writers would flip it and have Squirrelflight love him and they’d have a healthy relationship or maybe a rocky one or who knows! We can’t determine character in fiction like in real life because at the end of the day, someone is writing this character to be this way! Now I am not excusing Ashfur’s canon behavior nor do I think his current canon personality would be better for Squirrelflight but I also think it’s not a simple answer since the whole story would be different at that point! But I agree Bramblestar isn’t toxic because of Squirrelflight he’s toxic because that is his character, being with Jessi would not have changed that but maybe he could work on it and be better (just in general he should work on it) Now I haven’t read the books in forever so if I missed something please correct me but I just wanted to share my perspective! TLDR: canon Ashfur is a villain, but that was a writer’s choice! Bramblestar as a person (cat) is toxic!

[@finnsnow2495]

@@mr.doggothegreat7287 I thibk Squirrel went to Ashfur as a means to get away from Bramble. Almost every instance they hung out was after a fight with Bramble. She never really wanted to be with him just use him as a means to be away from Bramble. Kinda like some cheater will hook up with a woman just to get away from their wife but would never progress their relationship with the person they hook up with. I get what you're saying about the writers changing his character up but I'm just using his established character in canon. I'm assuming that sometime after arriving at the lake Squirrel rejected Bramble and went with Ash. In this case both their characters are the same and Ash was already a bit toxic being needy and possessive so that trend would have likely continued. Again I'm assuming his traits are the same because if they made him a protagonists he wouldn't be Ashfur anymore. Kinda like what they did with Tigerheartstar like that's not the same Tigerheart that he was prior to the train, same with Breezepelt. Those are basically different characters now because of where the writers wanted to go. I'm just assuming for the sake of continuity that Ash would have 100% been a horrible choice compared to Bramble if the only thing that changed was for her to initially choose him.

[@mr.doggothegreat7287]

@@finnsnow2495 Thank you for clarifying. I can totally see her using him as an escape it happens in real life too! I understand and I don't think Ashfur as he is depicted in canon is a good choice and some of his traits are shown before the reveal! You state that you're assuming and that's why I brought up my original point. As viewers we're assuming he'd be exactly the same but that's not true since we don't know what he would actually be like. We see what the writers wanted these characters to be good or bad. By making him a protag (and by extension making him good) he'd simply be a different Ashfur from the one we see in books, thus making the books we've gotten no longer canon! The writers kinda already did that with his character in the canon story! You mention Tigerheartstar and that's exactly my point! The writers can force characters to be what they need in stories so that's why I'm skeptical to say this different Ashfur would be the same as the canon book one! And with his character being toxic, needy, and possessive as the "protag" they would want him to likeable (or at least if he's a "good" guy) so those traits can be worked on. Just as in real life people can work on these traits and get better!

[@mandatorycorgi4]

WOW THIS IS AN AMAZING RANT!! Not to sound biased, but any rant talking Bramblestar down is an A+ video in my book. Sadly, It's so easy for me to dislike his character.

[@redaurora8602]

Same, throw Brambleclaw off the high-rock

[@stormSeven]

@@redaurora8602 Highrock isn’t high enough. Highstones is what we should be considering or maybe just yeet him off the tip of Mount Everest it should be high enough for him to learn a lesson.

[@starstrixx_owl]

@@stormSeven no throw him off the sky

[@_miichu_]

Bramblestars and Jessie's relationship was very nice, and I was happy to see them be mates in future BUT NOPE, Jessie's gone and squirrel flights there, honestly Jessie x Bramble was a good ship... I don't really like Bramblestar and Squirrelflight as mates

[@hipoo8394]

ik this is two months ago but i want to share it. i just hate jessie. like she's soooo annoying. she has no noticeable flaws. she doesn't have to train to get the skills of a wild cat. and she just does everything easily.

[@flamindorito]

He would've manipulated her even more because she's not as feisty as Squirrelflight.

[@FantasticFawnleap]

@@flamindorito ..

[@Gracewillwood2837]

@@FantasticFawnleap Bro stfu all your comments are about blaming the victim (Squirrel) and supporting the abuser (Bramble), I see you on EVERY Squirrelflight and Bramblestar video and It's so annoying and stupid.

[@nugget8967]

I agree to an extent, however I do not think Ashfur would’ve been a great choice either. When I read it I saw him as very possessive and controlling, however I do think he was a better choice. If Leafpool hadn’t come along with the Three, I would’ve preferred her to stay single or get an entirely different mate other than those two. Squilf deserved so much better, and Bramble was really done dirty by the authors.

[@joltyflare]

I personally don't mind Bramble X Squirrel early on, it's after he becomes leader where I dislike them more. I don't dislike couples simply because they bicker, it really depends on why they bicker and their dynamic. That being said, I mostly dislike how people hate that people in this Fandom hate on people who like ships or dislike ships. And other fandoms. I'm happy that you don't as far as I can see! :)

[@snickerpoodles]

Squilf should've went with Tawny smh

[@Anaea]

Yeah! If they wanted to keep the FirexTiger thing going on they should have went with Tawnyflight

[@dilflover07]

no but I respect your opinion

[@sp1k328]

exactly

[@kittykat6665]

This would have been such a wonderful ship. Perhaps Tawny could have re-joined Thunderclan and Bramble would have been set on a better path as a leader with his sister there. So many missed opportunities.

[@PastryPuff9339]

I feel like Leaf and Moth could have worked as well

[@acinomthecat]

How about crowsquirrel? There’s no unbalanced dynamic, and Squirrelflight would honestly be a more interesting mate than Leafpool. Since Crow and Squirrel both mourned for Feathertail, this relationship could’ve grew from 2 immature apprentices trying to one up each other, into 2 cats finding comfort in each other when they both feel like outsiders in their own clan.

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

Makes sense. And I feel like the dynamic here would be a lot more of a friendly competitive type. And their arguments would be a lot less volatile if they had any. I mean I could see two stubborn cats butting heads but not in a malicious way.

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

Although I will forever Stan SquirrelShrew

[@acinomthecat]

@@BlurpleBeanCo Absolutely. Even back then, I found Brambleclaw’s and Squirrelpaw’s dynamic as really weird, since its an adult warrior arguing with a young apprentice, and this is supposed to be “banter” as “romance”. And yes, Shrewpaw is more loving than Bramblestar and Ashfur will ever be.

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

@@acinomthecat definitely! I would actually enjoy seeing SquirrelCrow. And I will always wish Shrew had lived.

[@FranticScribbles]

Honestly I agree I think CrowSquirrel would have been a more interesting dynamic then what we got. I also really wish Shrewpaw lived because other than Squirrel’s relationship with her family, her relationship with Shrew was the only healthy one. SquirrelShrew would have been such a healthy relationship. I think Shrewpaw, Crowfeather and even Stormfur would have been much better mate options for Squirrelflight then Ashfur and Brambleclaw

[@Storm_Chaser325]

I know this is old, but Ashfur also wouldn't have been a good mate, he was treating squirlflight like she she couldn't do anything and its why she didn't like him. Stormfur or shrewpaw (if he lived) would have been better likely. Because if ashfur could do the things he did, he always could, and I wouldn't be surprised if he would have been worse than bramblestar, that scares me a little.

[@PommieTheYoomie]

Facts

[@BeforeColors]

When I clicked for some tea on Bramble I did not expect to see my art from 2015 lol! Great video, all very well said👍 Nice to see it's not as controversial to dislike SquirrelxBramble now. The fandom really has grown!

[@finnsnow2495]

I can't take any argument seriously that suggests Ashfur as a good choice. So, we really think an attempted murder now murder now abuser is the best choice. Bramblestar is a golden mate compared to Ashfur. We don't think something else would have turned Ashfur to lash out. He is obsessive and dangerous and always was when it came to Squirrel. She rejected him and he couldn't get over he was absolutely consumed by her letting it affect every part of his life. After he died he was still focused on her...Look what he's doing to an entire clan for one stupid cat he dated once like years ago. Filled with anger and spite he would have been obsessive with Squirrel if they were in a relationship probably possessive of her and she wouldn't take that. She'd break up with him and we'd have the plot all over again but his anger would probably be worse. I don't think Bramble and squirrel are healthy. I think they are both bad for each other in fact if Bramble wasn't with Squirrel I think he'd be a better character. They wear on each other, Bramble does it to Squirrel more but I think the intent from the writers from the start were to make it a push each other's buttons but still love each other clichè. Unfortunatly the writers suck at writting and developing stuff like that so since Squirrel is more intresting we only see scene where Bramble is being a dick to her. At the start this was more balanced but even so I felt the writers were writting scenes that lacked context. Like in the New Prophecy Bramble and Ash get in a cat fight about Squirrel. She didn't really do anything to indicate this or even really talk to Ash at this point. But, Sand then turns to her and says she needs to fix things so her clanmates don't fight. Like I swear that makes no sense for sand to say that unless there was suppose to be a scene where Squirrel really pissed off Bramble using Ash. All throughout the New Prophecy there are things characters say about them that just don't add up. It's through how other characters percieve them that I think the writers intention was different but they were just way too lazy to convey it properly and since it was never fleshed out correctly it just looked worse and worse as their relationship progressed. But, again at this point Bramble and Squirrel should not be a couple they should have stopped being one honestly after the three were revealed. But, please never use Ash as a good alternative because it invalidates everything you say. Like I said Ash was and is way more abusive and dangerous than Bramble ever is or was. If Ash was a good alternative he would have been more like Thrushpelt and supported Squirrel and been a friend or he would have distanced himself and let her go. But, no because Ash isn't healthy he'd never let her go and unless the descion was him he'd never support her.

[@timberdew]

Neither is good for squirrelflight honestly

[@thelanktheist2626]

Neither is good, but Ashfur is still better because he tried to get rid of Bramblestar via possessing him. Still very bad, but Bramblestar is way worse anyway.

[@finnsnow2495]

@@thelanktheist2626 He didn't try to get rid of Bramblestar he used him to get to Squirrelflight. Just because Ashfur' s plan involved Bramblestar being out of the picture doesn't mean he was better espically with how he treated her as Brambleclaw.

[@thelanktheist2626]

@@finnsnow2495 Fair. But I can’t reasonably say that Bramblestar is a saint compared to Ashfur, of which he is definitely not. Even with the attempted murder, treason, and demon possession, Ashfur still isn’t that much worse.

[@finnsnow2495]

@@thelanktheist2626 Oh I agree with that. Bramble is no saint for sure I just think Ash being better is insane. Because honestly if Squirrel left Bramble I think he'd be petty for a bit with her but probably eventually just leave her to his own. He already proved he can have other relationships. Like I said before Squirrel and Bramble are toxic for each other but on their own they're not that bad. Bramble still isn't great but idk I never found as toxic with anybody else

[@bo1932]

i loved brambleclaw and squirrelflight so much in the beginning, during the second arc. then bramblestar got annoying lol

[@izabizsmith333]

You're correct in the original release of the last hope he does ask her to be his mate. I would send a picture of that part but I lost my original copy and had to buy a new one.

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

Oh thank goodness! I thought I was losing it. XD

[@throwawayaccount570]

As a person who FEELS like Squirrelflight in a relationship that is OBVIOUSLY toxic, it is VERY hurtful to see people treating Bramblestar like he's in the right and like Squirrelflight is a entitled brat who is trying to gain guilt from the reader for her, very VERY hurtful. It's nice to see people calling out his actions. Bramblestar abuses his power to control Squirrelflight and he's refusing to see reason, just because she disobeyed his orders to do what's right, SHE is apparently in the wrong. When Squirrelflight was a ' brat ' she was an apprentice, look back at how Cloudtail acted. Nobody talks about that! So why Squirrelflight? I honestly think it's DISGUSTING to blame the victim, (this is kinda extreme but I'm pissed off so I'm gonna say dumb sh*t) it's like going to a child who's been ab**ed by their parents and go, " It's your fault you acted like you're entitled. Stop getting mad they disciplined you! " My situation isn't as bad as Squirrelflight's but it's enough sh*t to make me curl up into a ball, cry & hyperventilate when I hear the song, " Don't start now " because it reminds me of him. Edit: Wtf is this grammar, lmao time for editing

[@snowheart4077]

I'd like to precise that his terrible behavior towards Squirrelflight was clearly before he was leader, he was an a*shole with her, no need for him to be leader, at this point... Before knowing that, I already knew I didn't like this character And I hate him even more, and I found out why

[@axelcosmoanddawgs]

Ngl Bramblestar and Squirrelflight had so much potential. Like when Squirrel almost died in Eclipse, he said “I’ll be right here when you wake up, sleep well my lovely” or smth He was so sweet wth

[@FantasticFawnleap]

BramblexSorreltail B%#%hflight doesn’t deserve a mate at all!

[@arghajitchakraborty8130]

I really wanted to believe that bramble was a good character. Really, if you ask me, it was Tigerstar who corrupted him. After tigerstar started appearing in bramble’s dreams, even though he told himself he would just use tigerstars training to be a more loyal cat, he kinda just started to look for ways to become leader. In the new prophecy, when they traveled to the sun drowned place, I think maybe bramble and squirrelf could have been together. Anyway, in my opinion, it was tigerstar appearing in his dreams that turned him into a bad character.

[@randomstranger9913]

It bothers me so much though how in the newest book they called SQUIRRELFLIGHT the bad mate. Like- tf?! And if ya want evidence I can go find the page and sentence

[@PandaFan581]

Man, when I read all of the parts where BrambleStar was treating Squirrelflight terribly, I thought... "If Squirrel flight breaks up with BrambleStar, then it's party time, sing hallelujah!" Seriously, Squirrel flight deserves better than to be treated like trash, if anything treat her like a Queen!

[@flyingfridgezzz7347]

I really don’t agree on the Ashfur thing though, because if he’s a psycho enough to try to get revenge on Squilf for the rest of eternity there’s blind to have been other problems with his creepy obsession with her. And he did baby Squilf more than she liked. Squilf, in my opinion, should’ve found someone different from those two or just stayed single and independent 💪

[@coyotemoonc3258]

Cats called Shrew& Squirrel paired together would have been adorable. After his death Ashfur was better. I really hate how his charachter was butchered I really do. They could have used a more worthy villain in the Broken Code. I vote scourge due to his rejection by Tigerclaw. I had hope maybe the outside view would encourage the change in the code but alas.

[@notgreatgale]

hey, at least the book ACKNOWLEDGED that stormtail wasn't treating moonflower right, and shellheart had the decency to divorce rainflower when she became awful... but the erins don't want to acknowledge how generally awful bramble and squirrel have been for each other. sunken cost fallacy HAS to play some sort of part in it because... they must've convinced themselves that squirrelflight and bramblestar were perfect for each other in the new prophecy and just. never wanted to admit they were wrong. OKAY JUST GOT TO THE ASHFUR PART OF THE VIDEO, i'd like to put a reminder that squirrel was NOT at fault for not choosing him, nor was it inevitable that he would've been better for her... and it definitely isn't her fault that ashfur became awful and abusive!! that logic should stay in 2009 :) but otherwise good video!!

[@Halxq]

I agree, except with your point about Ashfur. If Ashfur gets this upset about rejection that he SUCCESSFULLY attempts second-hand/third-hand murder against his leader and attempted murder of THREE INNOCENT CATS, he shouldnt be mates with Squirrelflight. It’s a huge sign that he is possessive and obsessive, and they shouldn’t be together at all. Ashfur wouldn’t be a good mate, and would probably be just as bad as Bramblestar, if not worse.

[@MidnightWhisper]

Probably even worse. Imagine how he'd react to finding out they weren't his kits at all, but Leafpool's. He already tried to kill them to hurt her for rejection, who knows what he'd have done. He may have very well still tried to kill Firestar just to punish Squirrelflight for lying to him, or attack Leafpool and leave the clan without a medicine cat because she caused this, or a war with WindClan by killing Crowfeather or something. That would've actually been even more traumatizing to the three if the cat they believed was their father went on a murder spree as they themselves are trying to absorb the truth.

[@Halxq]

@@MidnightWhisper Absolutely true. He would not handle it well at _all_

[@CobaltCreations]

I agree with this 100% Tho I gotta warn u.. Sad machine aka one of ppl u used videos from is a big bramblestar stan and even with the recent stuff is excusing his actions and spreading misinformation on him n stuff... Thought you should know. You can see the comments they liked in their no regrets pmv and its really yikes.

[@CobaltCreations]

however I gotta say Ashfur wouldve been awful either way. I mean if he cant take her not having feelings for him and cant take no to a relationship its likely he wouldnt allow her to say no to other things and probably wouldve been pretty forceful.... Most men like that just... Are really toxic people.

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

Well they may like my next video on him. Where I psycoanalyze his behavior in extensive depth. Explain all his behavior and decisions and stuff.

[@milli5968]

i mean... they just have different opinions on a fictional character that you may consider bad, i don't think it's fair to make a big deal out of it lol

[@CobaltCreations]

@@milli5968 ignoring canon abuse is not 'an opinion' it's spreading misinformation about a character and that in turn spreads misinformation about abuse. If you tell TEENS AND CHILDREN WHO ARE THE PRIMARY AUDIENCE FOR THESE BOOKS. That bramblestar is not abusive they may get into relationships similar to his and squirrelflights and not realize how toxic and awful it is. What Sad Machine is doing is dangerous to minors and also really petty n immature for an adult. Someone being abusive is NOT an opinion abuse is a very specific process with certain terms and conditions it must meet. Bramblestar uses the abuse cycle that's a proven fact. It's not an opinion. Take it from someone who lives in an abusive household. Sad machine should not be supported or defended.

[@tigerspruce8580]

I could've sworn that line of "I want you at my side as my deputy and mate." was a line in last hope, but the first print copy I had wasn't there was well. also agreeing with the relationship problem thing, my parents went through a divorce when I was a kid and I have memories of them fighting, this is why I didn't enjoy Squirrelflight's hope as much as other people did, just dump him Squilf you deserve better!

[@inspiredailen3275]

Agree with all Especially with lionblaze, I cant tolerate him. Lionblaze is by far the worst character

[@holly205]

I totally agree with you on a lot of the things you discussed, except the Ashfur thing, I don’t think he would have been a good mate either, I don’t really remember him much before the Squirrelflight thing, but I’ve watched several yt videos talking about him and it sounds like the relationship would have gone down hill very quickly. (Imo at least) They didn’t seem to be a good match, tbh, and he seemed pretty overprotective and borderline controlling? Also, if getting rejected is going to lead him to pretending like he’s going to kill his ex’s adopted children, then idk... doesn’t sound like the most stable person ever.. Anywho just wanted to rant Great video!!! I love a fellow SquilfXBramble hater 😂

[@AlbatrossWCUE]

I feel like after FireStar’s death, BrambleStar had lost the cat he idolized and the pressure of leadership had gotten to him way too quickly then he wanted it to, and like in the video, he tries to do what FireStar would/might act in difficult situations but it muddled his mind up. After the intense trauma in The Dark Forest, he lost complete control over his decisions and his own mind. Correct me if you think I’m wrong please

[@Grant-do9ce]

I've always thought of his more recent actions as being PTSD induced from his time in the dark forest. I don't think he's as bad as most people make him out to be though.

[@CroweKie]

As bramblestar or brambleclaw at the time was my introduction into the warrior cats series it extremely saddens me that he is only a shell of what he was.

[@hanz4485]

Thank you for this video I couldn't understand the hate for Bramblestar, as I had stopped reading the books after the journey, so I didn't understand where all the hate was coming from as he seemed like a great character.

[@justanidiot3970]

I want a Tawnystar.

[@nahimgood9240]

As someone who was in a VERY similar relationship like bramble and squirrel i was having hard time reading / listening the books because it brings up horrible memories for me. I despise it that they made squirrelflight desperate to get bramblestar back in the broken code because i myself was desperate to keep the relationship going before i realized how toxic it was. Bramble belittled squirrel and made her feel like he was talking to a kit that she wasn't. He was so toxic that i hate it that they brought him back, i would rather that he STAYED dead because squirrelflight deserves much much more. Sorry about me rambling this is just little personal.

[@Talis1717]

I feel like they need to rewrite his character, initially he was interesting but Erin ruined his potential....like why? That partly ruins the story.

[@animationarmy7975]

I have always loved Bramblestar and I think it's just bad writing that ruined his character, but I still love him and I like to think that Squirrelflight and him have a deepened relationship because of how many times they went back and forth, buuuut I'm probably gonna get insulted in the replies for this.

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

Nah. I don't allow hate in my comment section! ^^ everyone is absolutely entitled to their opinions! :)

[@animationarmy7975]

@@BlurpleBeanCo thanks

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

@@animationarmy7975 of course. ^^

[@finnsnow2495]

I agree. I don't love Bramble cause he's always been a bit bland to me. But, I still like him just for the idea of his character. Like you said their relationship and his character are victims of the Erins writting

[@animationarmy7975]

@@finnsnow2495 Yep, that goes with so many characters Lionblaze: Dovewing: Milly: Rowenstar: Toadstep: Crowfeather: And even Ashfur: Plus so many more.

[@VanillaUchiha56]

I also don't get why people say Bramble had a bad relationship with the three. In Crowfeather Trail when Crowfeather tries to talk to Lionblaze, Lionblaze claims Bramblestar as his father. He wouldn't do that if he felt Bramblestar abandoned him. Alsooooo. Bramble knew Hollyleaf killed Ashfur. He watched her do it, he claims this infront if all of Thunderclan when Thunderclan wants to toss Hollyleaf out. Through Ashfur wake, through Hollyleafs outburst at the gathering, through Hollyleafs returning he was protecting her. Not to mention there's also a scene in Bramblestar storm where he watched Lionblaze and Jayfeather mess around with eachother and tells Squirrelflight he misses Hollyleaf. He was not a bad father to the three.

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

I know. I didn't say that. But he didnt treat Alderheart and Sparkpelt the same he did those three. It was as though he lost confidence in that.

[@lovethewildlifeplzzzzzz]

THANK YOUSSSSS Moonkitti is the only other youtuber to voice the mate problem and while she was more in depth you covered more issues as a character. I appreciate you both, may starclan light ur path

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

@@lovethewildlifeplzzzzzz thanks! There's actually a follow up video to this on my channel as well. Lol but I'm glad you enjoyed it!

[@Rising2Dawn]

This is so underrated

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

Thank you! I appreciate that!

[@Rising2Dawn]

@@BlurpleBeanCo I’d love to watch more ^_^

[@Krill_Phil]

I second this completely!

[@fantalits5640]

I honestly really liked Bramblekit/paw but they HAD to ruin his character when they turn him into a warrior and later a leader.

[@cdragon7583]

I’m gonna pretend there’s nothing after the fourth arc from now on

[@honeydewart9419]

Tbh I feel like they just wanted the Tiger and Fire lines together when they paired the two

[@pigeonax]

I love bramblestar in Bramblestars Storm. I think he went through a great arc as a leader, from making decisions in Firestars pawsteps to becoming his own leader. Him slowly coming to the realization that Squilf lied to him because her bond with Leafpool was the strong bond of family and she would do anything for her, like Brambleclaw with Tawnypelt. I think he is completely reasonable in not liking when Squilf disagrees with him as a deputy, he expects unconditional support and it was literally in the warrior code that this is how leaders should be treated.

[@mickybubble1115]

Im am NOT my father,and i can be better! *continues being his father*

[@thebluestbirdofall]

For the most part, I agree with you in this video, but I’m going to get a bit nit picky with the part regarding Ashfur. Anybody who reacts the way Ashfur reacted when a potential partner doesn’t choose them is not stable or mature enough to be in a relationship with said person in the first place. Yes, I completely get it. It was unfair to him. And no, Brambleclaw in my opinion didn’t deserve to get Squirrelflight back after the way he treated her. But this doesn’t mean he gets to take it all out and her and her “children”. Characters before in this series had been faced with the same dilemma, and reacted way more maturely in that situation. Sunfall is a perfect example of that, as well as Thrushpelt. Those two characters I believe DEFINITELY would have been better options to their love interests. You are allowed to have your own views and opinions on Ashfur. I’m just stating my two cents. Great video!

[@LeafeonTheCat]

Finally, a video that explains my complex favorite character-ism with Bramble.

[@otherchannelinvideo.1103]

To be honest if bramble claw became bad because squirrelflight chose Ashfur, it would be very interesting. Also if squirrelflight becomes sad if bramblestar ever dies, I would be so disappointed, I want her to be like “Yay my abuseive mate is gone!” Also I disagree with squirrelflight when she said in darkness within ( I think ) when she said Ashfur did not love her, it was an obsession. Wait, what if all the events happend before the fire scene but Ashfur fell in love with another cat ( or that cat fell in love with him.) idk but I hated the outcome of the love triangle.

[@GoobfromdandysworldXD]

Idk why I’m seeing this now but bramblestar was literally the best character imo before he became leader, after he became leader the writers just threw him down the drain and made him become an absolute mess

[@pyrrhus1129]

This video was super well made and written! Awesome job, I'm 100% gonna sub!

[@quit.13.]

I love him but hate him 😭 Erin hunter literally ruined him 💀

[@feverdreamnonstop]

What i wanna know is why the writer's made Bramble and Squirrel a thing if Bramble was gonna be a peace of crap of a mate? XD And dont get me started on Thistel and Spotted was that even a thing or Thistelclaw being a perv like um how old is he?

[@gilramanujan8826]

I personally do still like bramblestar (but I love bramblepaw/claw), keep in mind I haven’t read all the books but I know them. I personally think that his actions in Squirrelflight’s Hope was unexceptable. And I do still think he had potential to become a good leader, in my opinion I think it was just bad writing on the story team’s part same with his character. I think they only use him for what’s necessary for the story instead of what type of character he is. Now that he is back in his body I actually do hope that he gets better. But overall this was a good analysis. And this is my opinion (pls don’t kill me). Ps: about Ashfur I disagree because I think he would have turned bad either way as his actions in the broken code proves that he is harming everything she cares about and physically abusing Squirrelflight again and again and still expects her to be with him, and in Graystripe’s Vow it’s revealed that he has always been like this as badmouths Graysteipe’s decisions and Firestar’s absence (when writing this I’m aware that he was aggressive but he was relentless).

[@Marilynn_1275]

It's true.. All of it. It was fine at the beginning but... He's awful. Poor Squirrelflight...

[@Spotted-Claws-707]

I completely disagree with the squirrel and bramble ship, it's extremely wrong of the writers to write an abusive relationship into a series FOR KIDS.

[@wooidroo2266]

Fandoms be like: 4:25

[@capri6616]

Lmao yea

[@cafeconleche9259]

SAY SHREWSQUILF IF SHREWPAW SHOULD HAVE BEEN MATES WITH SQUIRREL FLIGHT INSTEAD OF BRAMBLEBUTT

[@FantasticFawnleap]

Dude take that back!

[@Littlefox1213]

I agree tbh.

[@waltuhputyourdsawaywaltuh]

​@@FantasticFawnleap no

[@waltuhputyourdsawaywaltuh]

SHREWSQUILF ALL THE WAY BABYYYYY

[@Puppypupp]

@@FantasticFawnleap why

[@scaredstiff7176]

Brambleclaw and Squirrelflight had could've been a great couple IF Bramblestar stopped treating her like an apprentice. Brambleclaw and Ashfur weren't different deep down. They both barely trusted Squirrelflight, both infantilized her in different ways (Brambleclaw always treating her as lesser because he viewed her as an apprentice or an annoying sibiling, while ashfur undermined her intelligence and treated her like a baby). Ashfur could've been a foil character to Bramblestar, and not just in their love lives. It would've been interesting to show how both Ashfur and Bramblestar navigated their relationships, and to further show lineage doesn't matter. I know the warrior clans technically don't suffer from gender norms according to the erins (we all know that's bs), but maybe Ashfur infantilizing Squirrelflight could've been because of the way he was brought up believing that female cats are more fragile than normal or that all female cats = kits so they need to be protected more than male cats. It could've been a way to show how cultural norms aren't always right. This could've further been exasperated by his group of friends (Spiderleg). Or maybe even (and this is more likely if we are going from the "everyone is equal in warriors route"), he was traumatized by losing his mother and father and doesn't want the same to happen to Squirrelflight. So he undermines her feelings and instead opts for keeping her "safety" (we've even seen this with Skystar before). All that would've been better than the Ashfur we got. Because we have no idea why he was so mentally unstable when Squirrelifight broke up with him, or why even before that he was so possessive. Like you said in the video, Squirrelflight's love life was a chance for young kids to see how to navigate through relationships in a healthy manner. We could've watched characters develop and overcome problems in their relationships, or characters with complex family lives or history try to find understanding. Maybe even what the right thing to do is when relationships become unhealthy. Instead we were given a one dimensional villain, a glorified abusive love interest, and an open ended plot line. Super depressing.

[@FantasticFawnleap]

B%#%hflight never trusted Bramble either!

[@scaredstiff7176]

@@FantasticFawnleap She actually did. The only two times I can think of that she didn't trust him is when he was training in the dark forest and made her think she was crazy for doubting him about it (even though she was right), and when she lied about the kits (although that was because starclan asked her to. She refused when they first suggested it because she didn't want to lie to Brambleclaw). There are also times (especially in the recent books), that Brambleclaw has not trusted Squirrelflight. Bramblestar lies to his mate about training in the dark forest (and he never says sorry about that), he also doesn't trust her judgements or decisions as a deputy (and constantly thinks she is out to get him for god knows why, risking the lives of literal kittens just to make a point). He transgressions were much worse (and far more selfish) than squirrelflight's, and this isn't even counting the amount of times he has just been an overall asshole.

[@FantasticFawnleap]

@@scaredstiff7176 She had litterly no proof that Hawkfrost was bad she was just assuming also just because she did it for Leafpool doesn’t mean she’s justified in lying to her clan and her mate also starclan only asked her to raise them not to lie about them being hers but she just assumed AGAIN!

[@scaredstiff7176]

@@FantasticFawnleap She actually did have plenty of proof hawkfrost was evil. He would constantly wish that mistyfoot didn't come back so that he could be deputy, he openly argues with her multiple times (just like mudclaw, extremely angry he didn't become deputy), he states multiple times that they should abuse the weakness of other clans to take over the whole forest (something tigerstar did), and he also says he wants to be the most powerful cat in the forest. Already suspicious behavior. But after that Hawkfrost joins the attack on windclan, with Mudclaw confirming that he was doing it for power (Mistyfoots story also backs this up and Hawkfrost's only defense is basically "nuh uh"). Brambleclaw choses to not believe the last bit, even though it makes perfect sense considering his personality and the fact that he is training with Tigerstar. Squirrelflight puts two and two together, and actually believes Hawkfrost is evil by this point. Brambleclaw denies it and says she's just saying that because of Tigerstar (even though she isn't and has legitimate proof). And to top it all off, when Hawkfrost eventually does turn out to be provable evil and takes one of Firestar's lives, Squirrelflight doesn't blame him at all (even though he was involved with the people who hurt her father). Also Starclan implies she has to lie to Brambleclaw. Yellowfang states, "Take them and raise them as your own." (as in raising them like you gave birth to them). It seems ambiguous at first, but Yellowfang basically confirms Squirrelflight has to lie to Brambleclaw after Squirrelflight replies, "What? But how could I do that? I would have to lie to Firestar, to all my clannmates, and Brambleclaw!" Yellowfang goes on to confirm, "If a lie is what it takes to save these kits, so be it." Also I'd like to point out that her mistrust of Brambleclaw wasn't for selfish reasons. She was doing it because Starclan told her to, because her sister needed her, and because she wanted to give Bramblestar the chance to have a family (because she was lied to about being barren. Unless some random kits got orphaned, they would never have the chance to rise a family together). Bramblestar's reasons were all selfish. He wanted to train in the Darkforest because at worst, power, and best, family ties. He also puts his clan at risk by training there, and Hawkfrost gives away information he got from Brambleclaw to Shadowclan so they can attack Thunderclan (he also tries to pin the blame on Leafpool without any proof). Not to mention he almost got his leader inadvertently killed.

[@FantasticFawnleap]

@@scaredstiff7176 NO SHE DIDNT!

[@cloudear3887]

Honestly, Squirrelflight is better with Stormfur, they’re just so cute together and Stormfur is better then Brambleclaw

[@shadefall9665]

FINALLY SOMEONE ELSE REALIZES ASHFUR AND JAYFEATHER HAVE SIMILARITIES

[@Shyannada14_Randomness]

I wish there was an Au where Shrewpaw lived it may have changed a lot in the series as a whole and there wouldn't have been much Drama if Squirrelflight was mates with him instead TBH

[@SHELLYTHEFOSSILIANS]

Bramblestar used to be an amazing character until like, the 3rd series, things started going downhill for me and Bramblestar right around the start of Power of Three. Once Bramblestar figured out that Jayfeather, Lionblaze, and Hollyleaf weren’t his kits, he was so mean to Squirrelflight and the three, like, dude, the three didn’t do anything to you! I absolutely the three, they are my top favs, all three. I’m on Vision of Shadows book 4, and they are still on my top favs, but Alderheart is also one of my favs. Anyway, back to Bramblestar being a horrible mate and leader, it just went downhill from Power of Three, and Bramblstar’s Storm! Like, show affection for your *mate* not a random like, Kittypet! Like, Jessy *convinced* you to stay with your *mate*, not her! Like, Bramblestar has been a horrible mate and leader, I hate him so much.

[@Emidrawz]

This was released on my birthday lmao. Fuck Bramblestar honestly

[@FantasticFawnleap]

No f B%#%hflight!

[@tommyanimates5576]

I have the old version of the last hope and it doesn't say that bramblestar ever asked squirrelflight to be his mate at the same time he asked her to be his deputy. So this just gives us even more reason to dislike him.

[@vimvandalism]

Bottom line, Bramble is abusive.

[@starlightsoiree]

NAH OKAY I REMEMBER THAT LINE ABOUT HIM WANTING SQUILF TO BE HIS DEPUTY AS WELL AS HIS MATE IN THE LAST HOPE AS WELL, I GOT A FIRST-EDITION COPY WHEN IT CAME OUT. I REMEMBER BECAUSE I WAS ABSOLUTELY DISGUSTED LMAO

[@ambermehlberg2762]

I just wanted to say OC is really cool and pretty eye-catching!

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

Thanks a ton! I appreciate it! ^^

[@ambermehlberg2762]

@@BlurpleBeanCo Well, I can't speak for others for me what I said is definitely true!

[@chetarisin3035]

I realize something. I dont think Ashfur would have reacted so viscerally (probably) about Squirrel choosing someone as a mate if it *wasn't* brambleclaw. Come on, everyone forgets that Tigerstar killed Brindleface, Ashfur is scarred from that. And Bramble is a carbon copy of his mother's killer.

[@FantasticFawnleap]

It’s not brambles fault that happened!

[@HavensCorner]

Hi, I know this is two months late, but Ashfur wouldn’t have been the better choice. With how he reacted to the secret when they weren’t together (they weren’t technically ever together at the time, mostly just friends. And it wasn’t her manipulating him either or using him), it would have been a lot worse. Now I’m not going to deny the fact he lost his mother, but that doesn’t justify his actions later on. This is no hate towards you at all, just an opinion and to point out that he might not be the best choice as a mate.

[@Jarmartini]

it’s not about ashfur having some specific vendetta against brambleclaw, it’s that ashfur couldnt take no for an answer. regardless of how he treated her before she rejected him, he’s still horrible. if her rejecting him and choosing someone else was enough to set him off into such a rage where he set out to kill her children, he was always going to hurt her if he didn’t like something that she did.

[@krisrichard2552]

I agree with all of you on this, Bramblestar is a terrible character all around. But I completely disagree about ashfur. He would've just been as bad as Bramblestar when they started dating a lot longer. If he really did love squrriel he would've left her alone. But that's just what I think. Other than that, amazing video!

[@ChrisB3274]

I liked him when he was an apprentice, in the beginning of the second series but that’s it. He started getting on my nerves more and more he wanted to be deputy. It made him seem more like tiger star, in my eyes. He was a bad mate towards squirrelflight. I haven’t read into theses series yet but, by the sounds of it, he wasn’t a good dad to his ACTUAL children. Honestly the only reason I’m glad I’m in the third ark, is because I didn’t enjoy reading through brambles point of view. Jessie? haven’t got there either but, it’s like a situation with your wife and some other lady, the husband wants second girl as new wife, and wife isn’t happy. But luckily, second girl tells him he doesn’t love her, but his actual wife..I wish the Erins will k!ll him off. I don’t think they care everybody hates him.. Also the books their not for kids where I live, I still read them. I’m in 6th grade so *shrug*

[@moonbased7796]

I honestly disagreed with the AshFur bit. Honestly although SquirrelFlight did like him at one point (which I won’t disagree on that) but honestly I don’t think he would of been a good choice of a mate for her because he was a bit controlling and obsessive towards her so if she ended up with him. I think it would of been an toxic relationship and would of been as bad if not worse than Bramblestar. Honestly, SquirrelFlight should of been single or been mates with someone else in the clan at the time.

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

I totally get that! It's absolutely valid. I definitely do not agree with Ashfur being her mate.

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

I think had Shrewpaw have lived he would have been a great mate to Squirrelflight

[@moonbased7796]

⁠@@BlurpleBeanCoI totally agree (sorry for the late reply) don’t get me wrong. I do agree that I do believe AshFur cared for her at one point but honestly I think ShrewPaw lived, I think he would of been a better option for SquirrelFlight if she had to be with someone (if not then let her be single)

[@duskhaze-zk4px]

I swear I remember the same thing in A New Hope! He DEFINATELY said deputy AND MATE!! Correct me if im wrong as i can't really remember when all the books came out exactly but maybe they changed it as soon as they had the idea for bramblestars storm?? idk tho?

[@cloudear3887]

Bramblestar I think is too prideful in himself as a leader, that’s why he was always an antagonistic as a leader, also why he yelled at Squirrelflight, he thinks he has authority over all cats, his leadership has been making him selfish

[@cloudii2941]

Honestly Brambleclaw and Bramblestar seem like two different characters. -_-

[@Littlefox1213]

Definitely

[@waltuhputyourdsawaywaltuh]

fr

[@RowanthekittydogOwO]

Unpopular opinion: ashfur wouldve been better as a mate than bramble (not the best mate for her but but better than bramble)Ashfur was way too overprotective and clingy but at least he actually cared about her and listened to her. Not to mention how ashfur being the “father” of the three would’ve made SOO much more sense, one of them is GRAY ffs. But i would rather have her be with shrewpaw over ash or bramble

[@FantasticFawnleap]

No!

[@FantasticFawnleap]

No to the second one!

[@RowanthekittydogOwO]

@@FantasticFawnleap why not, Shrewpaw is the best

[@Secretlyorionpax]

If the erins wanted Tigerstar and Firestar kits together, they should have just done Mothpool

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

Honestly ya. Lol

[@Jamon384]

It was my favorite couple.... I speak Spanish and there are many untranslated books so it is clear that I missed A LOT :(

[@Dorpoforp]

I honestly agree that Ashfur would have been the better choice, but NO, it had to be HIM. And the worst part is, that after broken code, he got EVEN less confident in himself. COME ON! His and Squirrel's relationship is the most dramatic and disastrous relationship through wc history. I mean, they were always back and forth so much! Are you mad at each other or not? MAKE UP YOUR MIND!

[@Jarmartini]

no, ashfur would not be a better choice. he was so upset that squirrelflight rejected him that he set off to kill her children. if squirrelflight choosing to be with someone else was enough to set him off, he was always going to hurt her. also, his actions in The Broken Code is proof enough that he never loved her, he was only obsessed with her.

[@Dorpoforp]

@@Jarmartini Actually, ashfur would have been a better choice, and here is my reasoning: 1. Ashfur would not have tried to kill Squirrelflight's kits if he was her mate. 2. Yes, ashfur was jealous and a bit clingy, but that could have easily been solved. Plus, ashfur's overcaring (and slight obssesion loL) would be better than Bramblestar's complete opposition of Squirrelflight and selfishness. Neither are very good choices (you see, Squirrelflight has poor choice in mates) and they both have very, very problematic personality traits. But my point is, Ashfur would have been better. Don't argue, I have already heard your opinion and would prefer not to have make MORE points, which would require me to reread the new prophecy, which really isn't very good. So, I respect your opinion, and this is mine. Let's leave it at that, eh? Edit: I missed some of your reply, and yes, Ashfur probably would have still hurt Squirrelflight, but would it have been much worse than Bramblestar, honestly? Either way she gets hurt, honestly, she should just stay single 🙄

[@Dorpoforp]

Also, might I add, I don't like Ashfur anymore than Bramblestar. I hate both of them almost equally. So my opinion is not because I like ashfur more than bramblestar, it just makes more sense to me. (It's all my opinion, I should have made that clearer with my original comment, sorry)

[@Jarmartini]

@@Dorpoforp yes i completely agree that she should be single. but regardless, i dont think that comparing two really bad romantic options against each other to see who would hurt her less is a good thing to do. but yes, i agree she should be and stay single.

[@Dorpoforp]

@@Jarmartini that's true loL, it doesn't exactly matter much, does it 😅

[@milowisgrosstm9290]

I'll say it once, I'll say it again. Had squilf chose ashfur, we coulda skipped a whole 1 or 2 books of drama

[@hipoo8394]

no, not really. squilf isnt wrong for rejecting ashfur. if ashfur can't take rejection, then he's not a good mate.

[@milowisgrosstm9290]

@@hipoo8394 I'm not saying shes wrong for rejecting him, I'm saying if she didn't there would've been a lot of drama that simply didn't happen.

[@milowisgrosstm9290]

@@hipoo8394 Ex: the fire scene never would've happened, sure the whole ''not my kits drama'' would still be a thing but it wouldn't have happened with ashfur attempting to kill all 3 of them, and the whole ''ashfur mystery death'' probably wouldn't have happened either. Neither would bramblestars impostor drama happen.

[@Digitalistired]

I hope Bramblestar doesn't go to StarClan for his actions towards Squirrelflight.

[@FantasticFawnleap]

She’s the bad one!

[@Mist-yc2yb]

I mostly agree with this video except for when his downfall began. When Squilf said that Hawkfrost is evil Brambletrash thought that Squilf is judging him because of his father right after she said that she is not judging him. He went on to train with his father even though he chose not to be his father as an apprentice. He should know by now that Tigerstar I is evil. This trashes out his character. In my opinion he is either an over confident jerk or an un-confident jerk. When he finally dies(in broken code ark) it is because he thought burying himself with snow is going to cure him.

[@ApricityGlow]

Are you saying Bramblestar being exposed to the cold (he wasn't buried, btw. I think he was laid out on the moor) was his decision despite being unconscious?

[@FantasticFawnleap]

Dude she literally was judging them both for being Tigerstars sons when Leafpool asked her if she wasn’t judging Hawkfrost for who his dad is B%#%hflight hesitated to deny it!

[@adrianmarsh5903]

Life < Life if new prophecy ashfur and squirrelflight had been end game (To clarify I mean ONLY new prophecy Ash not further characterization in po3 and bc. Those do not exist in this hypothetical. If they were squirrel would be better off staying single)

[@AraileLioness173]

It makes me really sad to see how far he's fallen. When Bramblestar (I know he's called Brambleclaw again) was a paw he was absolutely precious. In the Darkest Hour there was a scene where he was chasing snowflakes and I thought that was so cute WHYY ERINS DID YOU MAKE HIM SUCH A BAD CHARACTER, PERSON, AND LEADER!?

[@LilmmmkmMontoya-Pino-xd6mq]

I love Shrewpaw, he's one of my favorites! I disagree that Ashfur was better though, he was pretty over protective of Squilf. But I definitely agree that Bramblestar and Squilf are one of the worst ships in the whole universe of Warriors. But I will always ship Shrewpaw and Squilf.

[@BlurpleBeanCo]

Yes! I agree. Shrew and Squilf was always my #1 Squilf ship!

[@flyingfridgezzz7347]

The problem with the situation Squilf was put in is that if she hadn’t chosen Bramblestar, he likely would’ve just punished her like he so often does for the rest of her life. The cycle of abuse, as discussed by Moonkitti, is clearly shown in Bramblestar’s behavior and I realized this even before watching her video on it. He would have just stayed in the punishment phase until he got over it, which, knowing him and knowing warriors cats, either would’ve happened by cutting off randomly or never at all.