Why China could push Putin into war with NATO over Taiwan | Peter Apps

"If you start even a small war in Europe while you're going to Taiwan, you're going to significantly overstretch the United States."
NATO's greatest challenge could be deterring China if they see war in Europe as cover to seize Taiwan, Author and Journalist Peter Apps tells Frontline on Times Radio.
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[@carlcramer9269]

About NATO enabling the arming of Ukraine, I have an example of that to give. I am from Sweden, and Sweden has publicly stated that we won't consider giving Gripen to Ukraine until we are in NATO.

[@anthony64632]

Why not as Gripen are awesome jets ?

[@carlcramer9269]

Because without NATO membership, we need them ourselves.

[@trout1187]

⁹cartoons

[@anthony64632]

@@trout1187 ,yes Xi Jiping is a Winne the Pooh Cartoon

[@elgorrion52]

Lucky that China ddn't get to take over SAAB

[@ikku4321]

When countries can't go 'higher', then they'll have to go wider. Authoritarian countries struggle with it the most. It's weird that developed countries don't recognize this effect until everybody has been draged into war.

[@bryandimery6509]

Thats a pretty good way to talk about america. Thats why they have 600 bases in other countries and demand fealty

[@adrianwhyatt1425]

​@@bryandimery6509No, because America is not an authoritarian country unlike Russia, China, Iran and North Korea who oppose it.

[@tim211292]

​@@bryandimery6509ask which countries don't want those US bases in their country. Most of them are wanted so your statement is very silly.

[@belteshazzarbenyakovleib4009]

@@bryandimery6509600 times people f%$&*% around and found out .

[@18_rabbit]

@@bryandimery6509 that number sounds high but regardless, EVERY SINGLE base is badly wanted by the country. Many places we've left where the righteous residents wanted us to stay, but thugs ruled the day, e.g. Afghanistan during Trump. Your rhetoric may have been valid decades ago ,but no longer is. The U.S. has done the hard work ,ie civil-society connections and justice-based operations. Your propagandistic notions are simplistic populist garbage.

[@brettvercoe2127]

The opportunity to make real positive changes for the environment and the climate before it was too late frittered away because of the actions and threats of a couple of small statured madmen.

[@merkyuk]

Well Amazon will certainly make a huge profit in future on underpants.

[@lasalleny]

I have now just discovered (ignorant me) Peter Apps. Now I will look for him everywhere starting with his book. Thanks, Times Radio, for introducing (to me) this amazing intellect.

[@jackbolder5734]

Also, the US has funded the Chinese military for 20 years now by allowing industrial military espionage and providing education to use that

[@allah547]

Yes

[@fortpark-wd9sx]

It seemed that a part of the neo-con plan was to cultivate pro-US Chinese students with the aim of creating a future compliant regime in Beijing. Seemed that this plan had not worked very well. 🙄🙄

[@scottkrater2131]

If they allowed it, it be called something other than espionage. And since we're not at war with China, we should what ban all Chinese from the country? Like Europe has no Chinese and North Koreans in their countries?

[@sharonsmiler]

Great interview thank you ❤

[@caseyleedom6771]

If you listen to only a part of this video, go to 30:25 mm:ss where Peter Apps is asked about the possibility of a direct conflict between NATO and Russia. The answer will scare you.

[@joecater894]

we had a direct conflict with germany for 5 years and both sides had tons of gas ... never got used though. I can see a similar situation with nuclear weapons and war.

[@gramsmith1366]

How can anyone claim that there is a real possibility that Russia could directly attack Nato. They're barely holding their own against Ukraine!

[@michaelwang6125]

:3 the sub text of "would China Push Putin to fight" is already an understatement when Xi kind of enabled Putin to strike at Ukraine as a distraction and pressure against USA. Ukraine ironically was one of the nation that was very supportive of Beijing and even their general public view China favorably by over 60-77% in 2021~ during the pandemics and also provided Beijing with its submarine tech that the soviet won't sell to China. Guess Israel isn't the only one that got hit from behind despite how supportive they have been towards China in recent years/decade but than again; they should have see what happened to Ukraine and not learn anything from it. (partly because it was dealing with internal p politics)

[@jordie4423]

It does scare us. In Holland we have a big campaign nowadays to find new recruits for the army, since many years Holland is now increasing defense spending. 🇳🇱 kzbin.info/www/bejne/gHytemuEh5djoLssi=4cpEGoDLurwcuHcp The European continent is on the eve of a big struggle between the authoritarian east and the liberties we have enjoyed in the west.

[@caseyleedom6771]

@@jordie4423, I'm curious about your thoughts on the recent Dutch General Election win by Geert Wilders's Party for Freedom (PVV). That seems to have disappeared from the news of late. How are things going on that front? And, perhaps more importantly, what news source should I use to keep up with that? Thanks!

[@alertbri]

All the more reason to stop Russia in Ukraine.

[@johnadam2885]

The west is already defeated in both the military and economic front. So it too late to stop Russia in Ukraine. Where have you been ?

[@AntonioRomero-te4cb]

​@@johnadam2885 In bizarro world, on denial island, on the middle of the kool-aid ocean hanging out with Mr Roarke and tattoo.

[@goonerboz6023]

If Ukraine said they don't want to be in NATO the war would stop

[@Blanka1100]

Nato is not a reason for Putin. It is a excuse. Putin wants Ukraine and he could invade non Nato Ukraine only. @@goonerboz6023

[@user-qu6qg7sk4v]

​@@goonerboz6023If pootler stopped being a lunatic scumbag, the war would stop.

[@BV-co7hy]

Russian NATO membership??😂 Just look at their membership of the UN !Veto ,Veto🫨 veto😶‍🌫️

[@carlcramer9269]

I love the expression "sea change", especially in circumstances that have nothing to do either with the sea, death, or aesthetics.

[@midimusicforever]

China better not try

[@TR-xr4ut]

4 countries vs the rest of the world? not difficult to know the outcome.

[@joeyransford9078]

@@TR-xr4ut I don’t think is going to be only 4 countries against the world. I think we all gonna be for a shock if something like that magnitude happen and we should try and persuade peace as much as we can instead for warmongering. And I will tell you this if something like that happens we won’t need a mobilisation cuz it won’t be necessary

[@damitcam]

Guys numbers wont matter this will result in nuclear escalation.

[@mebsrea]

Unfortunately, and this is the problem with dictatorships, it’s not China that decides, it’s Xi Jinping. The same reason why the US needs to hold its nose and ensure Donald Trump doesn’t return to the White House, as the craven kowtowing to Donald Trump by elected Republicans who certainly know better indicates that Trump would rule as a de facto dictator himself, regardless of any supposed constitutional constraints.

[@carnthecorby]

​@TR-xr4ut It won't be easy. You'll also have countries indirectly involved like Middle Eastern oil tycoons, Pakistan etc. The ones fighting will be the US, Japan, Australia, Philippines, South Korea, Taiwan etc. Against China, Russia, North Korea etc.

[@eddieokpara3549]

Cuba didnt have that right of self determination. Such hypocrisy

[@turbolevo8703]

“Yer know” X1000

[@junelew3744]

Yer know, yer focused on the most important aspect of the interview. Not. A little anally retentive?

[@Mrgaryaaron1]

Excellent guest. Very good interview and questions you asked.

[@raymondreaney6988]

Thank you Peter! Great interview!

[@gayatrijohnston]

Where can one get the book on Amazon?

[@Tmuk2]

Have you tried Amazon?

[@perrycomeau2627]

happy days are here again

[@indiejones3349]

Dang no link to his book? Cold

[@niklasnorberg5071]

He didn't even get the title right. That organisation is doing the exact opposite.😂😂😂

[@ryankitson3999]

Common, seriously, Putin's tanks wouldn't make it 50 yards in to NATO territory without getting totally obliterated. They couldn't even take Kyiv and are stuck in a stalemate and have barely made any progress. He'll never start a conflict with NATO. Doesn't have the personal or capacity to occupy. Ukraine, Moldova, Georgia, Kazakstan and Azerbaijan are his limits

[@andrewphoenix3609]

You've been reading the propaganda too much, your analysis is completely delusional. Ukraine is on its knees, Putin didn't need to take Kyiv, it was never his objective. He wasn't invading a country, but protecting Russians in east Ukraine and stopping the expansion of NATO.

[@BiscuitDelivery]

People are forgetting about the coming actions by Venezuela and the fact that the UK and the US have obligations to respond there. Add Korea, China, and Iran to the mix, and the US could easily find itself fighting a five front war when it would struggle to fight one. We're not ready.

[@cyberslim7955]

5:00 Now he is talking the real issue!!!

[@lenkapenka6976]

this guy has read too many books and spoken to few people who were there, on all fronts

[@sybentley6675]

I am sure you are all looking forward to Tucker Carlson interviewing Mr Putin to see what he has to say. I look forward to your unbiased analysis.

[@Dungshoveleux]

Tucker's pre interview advert. 1m28s on telegraph website and 4m28s on Tucker Carlson's site because they censored the part where he spoke about MSM censorship.

[@petefrys545]

It will be the usual Carlson verbal diarrhoa

[@mebsrea]

Given that Carlson has long said he’s “rooting for Russia,” and his own former employer has stated in court that he is an entertainer and not a journalist, you know exactly what kind of bias you’ll get. He’ll always do what’s good for his personal bottom line, and that means giving the MAGA rubes what they want, regardless of the truth. Don’t forget: this is the man who raged at his bosses in internal e-mails after the 2020 election because, by correctly stating that Biden had legitimately won election, Fox’s stock price, and thus Carlson’s net worth, had dropped.

[@ashleyhayes7568]

​@@petefrys545It wasn't . Tucker is an excellent Interviwer. He allowed Putin to talk. That is what we the Viewers want.

[@petefrys545]

@@ashleyhayes7568 Content was none existent a rehash of Putin banality on untruths

[@paulironmonger301]

Thanks Peter Apps and James Hanson.

[@Mynsinger]

Got strong Harry Hill vibes from Peter

[@marcchartrand36]

Don't count on Canada being there, we don't have the forces or equipment nor the political will.

[@allah547]

That's now ,what if Rusians enter in Canada from Arctic ?

[@Liboch]

If Hannibal troops could cross the Alps with elephants, Russia also could cross the Arctic Sea with tanks

[@alexanderlazarev3570]

​@@Liboch Do we really need to do it, or really should we? You do not need Russians when you have your Trudeau.

[@RonLWilson]

The one factor we may have in this future Cuban like crisis verses the original one is that then we had Kennedy and Khrushchev (both who it seems had enough sense to back down) where now we might have Trump, Chi, and Putin where that may not be the case.

[@bryandimery6509]

Weird cause, each of the people you named have shown past restraint

[@user-jm6lz3bo4c]

Wrong. As I had and have mentioned since decades ago... ... the only factor that will turn you to the path of survival from self-destruct is really on Singapore... ... You see, the god that can handle the mess is stuck in Singapore, and in order for him to do anything, he will need to be the PM now... ... Else how? Hahahahaha... ... You are fighting predators, yet you keep the aliens' weapons... ... and you expect to win? Hahahahahaha... .. Anyway... ... this is the real factor be it however you want to laugh, mock or whatever. Once the god is not the PM of Singapore, the future will be any meetings, any policies, any world affairs or visits by leaders to Singapore will not be related to a god, and... ... means no god is in the leadership or influence of the world, and logically speaking, not hard to understand by now what will happen. Hahahahahahahahahahaha... ... You are all so fun. Mortal stupidity cannot be cured. Hard truth. You will either bow, or... ... you can handle yourselves. But can you? Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha... ... Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha... ... Holding the world for ransom is so interesting indeed. Will you bow?

[@MsNextgeneration12]

You worry about Trump even though he didn't get us into this mess we have now. Biden did don't be ignorant. 😉

[@petefrys545]

That is the worry

[@petefrys545]

​@@MsNextgeneration12 Wrong Trump believed Putin over his own intelligence services enobling Putin to believe that NATO was weak and that US wouldn't act. Trump in a second term will sell out Europe.

[@JP-fn5xt]

Can’t run the post office.😊

[@karstenjokumsen6264]

👍👍👍

[@draganjagodic4056]

Not mentioning shelling of Croatian towns by Serbs since 1991 absolves recent Putin's allies from their crimes in 1991 and also oversees recent Serbian claims on Croatian territory. Croatia is NATO member, Serbia is Putin's ally.

[@B.D.E.]

The Vietnamese people can relate to the Ukrainian's fight, and we stand with you. 🇻🇳♥️🇺🇦

[@AntiPutin-fm8pe]

I love Vietnamese people friendly and now howto make party

[@kaimanyu586]

So, you are on the side of the people who invaded Vietnam, killed more than 2 million people and destroyed your country? Are you aware that some Vietnamese kids today are born deformed because of the chemicals the US sprayed on Vietnamese people? So, you're against Russia who actually helped vietnam? Let me guess, you hate China too? 300.000 Chinese helped Vietnam against the US invaders, many Chinese died for Vietnam.. You don't understand this war in Ukraine. That's because you listen too much to Western propaganda, they are lying!! During the Vietnam War, they did the same, they pretend to be good guys and say Vietnam is the evil guys. Do you also agree Vietnam was evil during the war? Because that's what the West said back then. NATO created this war, they want to put missiles in Ukraine on the border of Russia, of course Russia will never accept this. Remember Cuba crisis? The US wanted to use nuclear bomb, because Russia wanted to put missiles in Cuba.. This is the same.. Also Ukraine have been killing ethnic Russians in the Donbass since 2014, these people are civilians. Do you think that's OK? Also Vietnam does not support Ukraine, they provided no help, that's good. Vietnam is loyal to Russia, a friend who helped Vietnam, when they were invaded by the US terrorists..

[@Lizardforce]

What’s going on with that jacket 😂

[@jimjoelliejack]

He’s in a wheelchair, he’s a paraplegic, take a look behind his head you’ll see a neck rest.

[@jackpool3831]

Jacket made in China

[@hugokappes4077]

oh come on,, if countries hadnt joined nato this war would have started with those countries years ago,, putin was always going to try and expand his control

[@Naval-Gazing]

I agree. That foolish question has Mearsheimer stamped all over it.

[@richardzaluski284]

Wonder why they joined 🤣🤣

[@gasman6163]

yawn, and tomorrow I might win the lottery or run a 3 minute mile. Unlikely, but I might

[@ThatUltimateFlash]

Truly insightful conversation 👍

[@hizaleus]

But Russia in the 2020s is not the same as Germany in the 1930s.

[@barriewilliams4526]

So, what is Putin going to do for men and equipment?.....

[@AntonioRomero-te4cb]

Keep growing and multiplying exponentially. 💪🇷🇺

[@user-np7st5mi1t]

What's NATO going to do you mean

[@baileygregory9192]

That's what makes it dangerous, if china were to do it without giving russia time or chance to prepare then they would find themselves on the back foot and left with only one nukes, and given that their won't be as much diplomatic backlash due to their being a world war the likely hood becomes even greater as russia only hope to attempt equalise the battle feild

[@user-np7st5mi1t]

​​@@AntonioRomero-te4cbThe fantasies you hear on here would be hilarious if it weren't for the fact that actual decisions are being made on the basis of the misconceptions you hear on here

[@barriewilliams4526]

@@AntonioRomero-te4cb I like you, you're funny😘

[@tmophead]

Speculation, didn't need that iny system.

[@bulwark3333]

Had a rethink don't get high on your own supply mate.

[@calvinaitkin-sf9up]

Would you trust either?,,i bet they dont trust each other.

[@robertkarake9791]

Why do you think they doing exercises together?? 😂😂

[@MerryOlSoulGigglesmith]

The US & UK have already been doing that

[@ChipmunkRapidsMadMan1869]

Doing what?

[@alexanderlazarev3570]

​@@ChipmunkRapidsMadMan1869 Doing exactly what they used to do.

[@mattgrant9479]

So many russian bots on here that it's actually quite funny

[@alexanderlazarev3570]

@@mattgrant9479 Have my sincere condolences to you. You should know that reality hurts.

[@ashog1426]

Anybody who thinks China n Russia r chummy doesn't know history or Chinas yearning for Siberia

[@therover65]

LOL according to these “experts” China is so powerful yet at the same time they are “collapsing”.

[@ieyasumcbob]

I mean i hear about conscription and think why? I've worked my whole adult life and started when i was 12. I've had to pay a massive student loan. I don't have a car, a house, kids. Inequality is increasing and the rich are getting richer off my back. Why would i want to give any more to this society? Why would I risk my life to deal with Russian Narcissistic Greedy Oligarchs? It's the British ones who've made my life what it is.

[@kimlam8991]

The head lineis nonsense. It only try to attract more viewers

[@Sammenluola]

Brilliant interview!

[@arandmorgan]

Finally, they are talking about this. Where was this information before the Houthi attacks in the straight of Hormuz?

[@lethalchocobo1886]

lol

[@Mr456sb]

Worrying times

[@patriciajacobs5114]

This is all about power and greed who is the better leader and new clear weapons 🙏😡

[@kamil_supabase_enjoyer]

Russia and China have similar mindset. 🇪🇺🇺🇦🇺🇸

[@taniatsaregorodtseva4897]

Absolutely true!

[@louisnaidu9140]

Thanks James for another very interesting intereview.

[@smackattack4284]

Germany an industrial power? This guy is a couple years behind.

[@LightninBolt]

Good insights. Saying “you know…” every other sentence is such a distracting habit. No, I don’t “know”, just make your point.

[@MrMaster2262]

You know

[@mybeloved1313]

Praying for peace. Praying a firewall of protection all around Britain. God please protect our men, our women, and our children. 🙏

[@richardzaluski284]

Ask God to get the russians out of ukraine 🇺🇦 🤣🤣

[@samkumar4059]

Britain has to stop giving support to NatC Israel

[@rob5197]

Mind your country ( business) then

[@christinapersson2849]

Did he just say that the Soviets lost their ”life savings” ??? 😂😂😂 Their Lada? Their what savings?

[@ericteng7725]

Very interesting sounding rhetoric of the world scenario, but in the words of my nephew, "Lies!!all lies" and conjecture. Of course the guy's just trying to make a living without back-breaking labour!

[@wunderlol]

Putin's possible line of thought: "Why ever risk using nukes on the US, when promoting and helping Trump get to power will do EVER so much more damage and cost relatively little."

[@petefrys545]

True

[@chrisj2502]

You really don't know what your talking about, Trump's probably with NATO is its a money pit, and the US has a national debt of $33 trillion with an annual deficit of $1 trillion, which is obviously unsustainable.

[@joecater894]

biden has done worse though.. whilst trump isnt really ideal..

[@douglasbroccone3144]

That would be the biggest mistake for Xi

[@AahFukIt]

Tinfoil hats are strong on this channel!

[@alanconway94]

Could ...

[@draganjagodic4056]

The guest mentions shelling of the cities in Bosnia 1992. Serbs started shelling cities in Croatia 1991. Literally every, I mean every town in Croatia was shelled by Serbs beginning in September-October 1991.

[@robbliven01]

North Korea has sold their ammunition and South Korea and Japan have had enough!!!

[@TheTravelsofLinRob]

America can easily fight a land war in Europe and a naval war in Asia simultaneously. The navy won't help in Europe and the army won't help in Taiwan.

[@gregchijoff9959]

Hey man, can you tell me the magic mushrooms you're using? Please! They are trully mind altering!

[@user-dq5os4mq2v]

Siberia doesn't like putin and china wants that over Taiwan.

[@zlatkokovach7862]

More comedy gold. LOL

[@Lucpol1986]

The US can sustain multiple fronts. The giant has not yet woken up armed response wise… Ah, an interesting listen to the weekend warrior…

[@KatyYoder-cq1kc]

Let's face it, that was already happening

[@skywillfindyou]

It can't

[@Grahamgusbull]

👍🇬🇧🇺🇦

[@stephenbermingham6554]

If, if, if. 😂

[@Peter.F.C]

What ridiculous nonsense. Where do they get these fellows from?

[@Boomstickful]

Not wanting the USA to fund 90% of NATO is not wanting to pull out of it. How many NATO countries supported the USA in Vietnam =0.

[@petefrys545]

It wasn't required a war US chose to get involved in

[@RightSideNews]

New logo? Threw me off

[@shaneflemming1721]

Surely china wuda acted on taiwan by now as its 2 years in already

[@bakimc4722]

I think that China is backing Russia in this conflict with Ukraine and NATO and is helping it, but it may be a condition that Russia helps China regarding Taiwan.

[@peterdavey2767]

How many wars has China started?

[@kj1483]

0:57 by Peter Apps "Deterring Armageddon: A Biography of NATO: the astonishingly fine history of the world's most successful military alliance" The history of the world's most successful military alliance, from the wrecked Europe of 1945 to Vladimir Putin's invasion of Ukraine. NATO alliance is in many ways a parallel global history of the last 75 years. As well as all the outbreaks of seething tension between the US and its European allies - and the counter-moves of rival powers - this is also an account of just how often in those postwar years that we all stood on the edge of the most terrible abyss. Apps follows the criss-crossing threads of the Cold War and beyond. Those threads converge in our shadowed present, and the conflict in Ukraine. In order to fathom today's dark world, Apps has explored a labyrinth of once-classified history, and he brings dazzling clarity.'

[@ruslanruslan62]

Biden is a true professional.

[@marko-1987]

Taiwan make the microchips tho

[@nickgood8166]

Too many "You knows"... bailed.

[@kavangillespie5413]

Not fighting 1000 miles abroad for an argument over chow mein

[@michaelhelbrow7906]

do u want to become chinese or russian

[@seanlander9321]

Seeing as how the Taiwanese refused to repay a penny of American loans from WWII, why be taken for suckers again?

[@tadcastertory1087]

China is actually pretty happy with Taiwan about now. The last election resulted in a divided Taiwan with a slight pro-China tilt in it's parliament and and a pro-independence President. A war in Europe also harms China's tottering economy.

[@bobs_toys]

After the threats before the last election if the current president was elected, they're not, but they can't really do anything that doesn't have too high a cost. Look up "China's final warning".

[@bobsnabby2298]

Might russia cant event take one village. War against NATO will be 3 day special military operation...for NATO... russia dont understand how bad their military really is.

[@Quareat]

I think he is spot on with this, the threat is a global one, not just Russia. It is an all or nothing scenario and the chances of it happening demand increased defence preparedness in Europe, Canada, Australia etc. Some are already on this, ie Poland and Japan. More need to follow.

[@iankuah8606]

Finland has been preparing to fight the Russians since 1939. The last time they tried 200,000 Russian soldiers were left under the permafrost!

[@BuchholzerIn1]

Russia is suffering from the loss of turbines in planes, oil refineries, trains and heating systems. They are running out of seeds and people to repair machines and infrastructure. Not long and Russia is finished then NATO can concentrate on Taiwan

[@jayflynn2701]

Another pundit confused. Russia is rebuilding upgraded existing tanks, not actually building tanks from scratch

[@harrisontrevor2079]

Putin cant even defeat the Ukraine let alone Nato 😂

[@crimeajewel]

Slava Ukraine 🇺🇦 ♥️

[@alexanderlazarev3570]

Invent smth new, please.

[@LunarJim69]

PURE PROPAGANDA FROM TIMES RADIO!

[@purplecamaleon]

Elaborate

[@petefrys545]

Great interview

[@lw1zfog]

R.I.P. Gonzalo Lira, US/Chilean national, imprisoned, tortured & murdered for ‘speech crimes’ in so called ‘free & democratic’ ukraine.

[@barryshaw5660]

Britain isn’t relevant get over it.

[@richardzaluski284]

Putin on attack Europe 🤣🤣 he can't do anything in Ukraine LOL

[@kennethvenezia4400]

He wrote the book because he wanted a new, cool leather jacket 😮

[@johnhume4346]

Cooll - it's bloody awful.

[@rouz0]

😄😄😄

[@kennethvenezia4400]

@@johnhume4346 I was being polite. It is bloody awful 🙀