Why didn't King Viserys & Princess Rhaenys just marry to prevent The Dance Of The Dragons?

[@WorldOfWesteros]

Just for the record, i know they were already married and i do talk about that in the start of the video. The idea for this video came from taking with some fans who had not read the book, and were asking this question given the show does not do a great job with the time line. The point i wanted to made with this video is even if they did somehow marry it came with its own set of problems that could still turn into a dance of the dragons like situation sooner or later.

[@christoperwallace6197]

I thought the timeline was fine in the show. Pretty clear to me. It always moved forward, and there was always a line about how much time has passed

[@Rhaenarys]

The show literally starts withe The Grand Council and both standing next to Jaeharys...with their spouses lol. People just need to pay better attention lol.

[@christoperwallace6197]

@@Rhaenarys agreed. No hate on the above video. But the timeline wasn't confusing at all. Everything was laid out.

[@nikkie1843]

Rhaenys was already married and pregnant when the Council was called making Viserys heir to the throne and Viserys was already married Aemma. When both where old enough to be married no one expected for it to be necessary. The old king had 2 sons in line for the throne and both of those sons were well loved and had heirs of their own. His first born only had Rhaenys but he was expected to have more children. Sadly he was killed before he could have anymore children. Viserys' father had 2 boys and was expected to rules after the Old King. But fate stepped in and both were killed before that could happen. Rhaenys was also still married when Aemma died. Honestly all Viserys had to do, to avoid war was not marry Alicent....

[@ediearcher7224]

Viserys married Alicent firstly to get the Faith on his side (Targaryens and the Faith had a difficult relationship) and secondly to create a spare in case Rhaenyra died. His mistake was not declaring to the Council that Rhaenyra was still his heir after Aegon was born.

[@teitoklein8207]

@@ediearcher7224 nah, alicent wud still hv claimed the same thing she did.

[@justasimmerr]

He could have also married Aegon and Rhaenyra to avoid conflict

[@teitoklein8207]

@@justasimmerr theres still the question of who will actually sit on the throne, plus older men and younger women were the norm, but I don't think the other way around is much prevalent, and yes we had some examples of that in the current timeline specifically with Margeary Tyrell but we don't know if it was acceptable during the dance of the dragons.

[@tracys169]

Viserys had to marry to make 'spares.' Rhaenyra was his heir, true, but what happened if she dies? Either by giving birth (similar to her mom's fate) or any other sickness (Viserys' and Daemon's father died due to some unexplainable stomach issue/pain).The only heir would've been Daemon then, but Viserys didn't seem to trust Daemon to rule as he wants a peaceful ruler to follow after his and he knew his brother well. Viserys' mistake was believing that there would not be usurpation from the younger 'spares' he created. And that the realm was ready for a woman to rule over them. Imo, although gross af, Rhaenyra should have been wed to Aegon (ew I know) to avoid from any civil war. Otto actually suggested it. The issue is, Rhaenyra would be considered 'too old' to bear children (welp, she'd be in her 30s when her husband would be ready to perform his husbandly duty to sire heirs).Of course Otto didn't care about that at all, heck, he'd probably (hope) expect Rhaenyra to have the same fate as her mom.

[@FerretJohn]

Aside from the fact that Rhaenys was already married to Corlys Velaryon, Viserys didn't see the Civil War coming. Viserys was a good man but blind to just how deep the animosity between Rheanyra and Alicent had grown or how great Alicent and her sons ambitions were.

[@gerardjagroo]

I wouldn't call it ambition to want what is rightfully yours. The Iron Throne is Aegon's (miserable little blighter that he is) both by the Laws and Traditions of Westeros and by the Precedent set by the Great Council of 101AC King Jaehaerys 'the Conciliator' was wise enough to affirm this precedent but apparently Viserys thought he knew more than the man who ruled the Seven Kingdoms for over 5 decades No wonder the Iron Throne rejected him (by cutting him)

[@thebl3mish]

@@gerardjagroo Aegon wouldn't have been born if it weren't for Otto's ambition on power. He carefully calculated that Alicent produce legitimate heir so that his decendants rule it all. And if being King doesn't grant you the power to name your heir then what does? - And it is mentioned in Old Valerya it was VERY common for women to rule it was not until some Westerosi traditions that merged into Targaryen dynasty but that is of course the duality of the dance of the dragons - you have a very Westorosi greens and a very Valereyan blacks each fighting over their traditions and ideals. In the show Viserys thought naively that his heirs would protect Rhaneara along with Alicent - and it would have worked if Otto weren't so ambitious and paranoid telling her Rhaneara would murder her half brothers to make her throne more legitimate.

[@3esln]

​@@thebl3mish were Was it ever stated that Valyria had gender equality. The andal parts of westeros ar probably the second 'best' (it still sucks) place in westeros for woman. Also Allicant and house Hightower is a variables. You can easily change them with Lannisters or Velaryons and still have the same end result.

[@thebl3mish]

@@3esln I never mentioned gender equality per se I mentioned ruling class were both female and male; there are several mentions for instance there is a mention of many women dragonlords such as Jaenara and the fact that the Valyrian word for prince is mentioned to be genderless (could also mean a woman princess). You can see however that on Westerosi tradition first of all legitimacy is more important than blood (many examples of bastards being shunned from power) and far from that gender played a role in it as well prefering male heirs to woman heirs as shown in Game of Thrones - it is not to say woman were never queens of course but for example Tommen - a boy was crowned instead of giving power to the mother queen (she took it once all her male heirs were dead). Hightower is more than just any house really it is one of the oldest of them all and have a lot of traditions and lineage from the First Men - Lannisters on the other hand are quite a "new" house.

[@samyloaiza98]

@@3eslnnot at all, viserys was supposed to marry Laena, since Rhaenyra also married into the Velaryons, they wouldn't have fought the same war. A lot would have changed too if Rhaenyra had married her uncle instead of Laenor, since all her children would be trueborns. So no, not at all the same without Otto's stupidity.

[@lasloapollo4312]

We all know who the true king would be in that relationship😂😂😂

[@WorldOfWesteros]

100% for sure without a doubt

[@aegorbittersteel2154]

And the other person would probably be completely OK with it😄

[@lasloapollo4312]

@@aegorbittersteel2154 Just let him play with his Lego's.

[@smittypwnz]

Viserys the kind open handed King, Rhaenys the strong and shrewd Queen perfect combo. Rhaenys rules, Viserys entertains. Also as the other comment says he gets to enjoy playing with his legos more 😂

[@jessjess23brooks89]

​@@smittypwnz Honestly, perfectly balanced power couple.

[@TheSconas]

Viserys and Rhaenys, Rhaenyra and Daemon, Viserys and Laena .... Rhae's kid and Alicent's kids ... I feel like we drove through so many safe stops and went full derp right into the dance of dragons for fun

[@michaprzybysz1877]

No self respecting noble will marry his daughters to bastards. That’s just fact of life. If meagor with teats used her brain and either made sure leanor was the father anyone with a bit of imagination can make it happen or at the very least find a dragonseed as an donor it could have been made. Not possible with the trio looking like regular folk.

[@TheSconas]

@@michaprzybysz1877 Which is why I mentioned the first three pairings.

[@pastelpurpledeathbed]

havent seen someone mention derp in...ages.

[@samyloaiza98]

@@michaprzybysz1877the description Maegor with teats is described by historians and the victors, the greens, are described way nicer in the book so what does that mean for the blacks? The reality is that the show will tell what actually happened since it's being created by Martin and is an objective point of view not what different historians said. That's who real life works too, there is what one country says about a war, what the other says and what actually happened.

[@mayacarraway8953]

@@michaprzybysz1877 I mean we don't know if the issue was just that he was gay or that he couldn't have kids at all. What I don't get though, is why Viserys made that match in the first place. I get it was too appease the Sea Snake but it was a dumb move on his part.

[@oppionatedindividual8256]

The real reason? George worked back from only two targs alive, so all the rest had to die, the dance was great for that

[@mateussalema9330]

By the time Rhaenys married Corlys no one was seriously expecting her parents to have more children, she had been an only child for over sixteen years. The most logical step would have been to marry her to Viserys to avoid disputes over the sucession. The fact that this didn’t happen can only really be explained by “the plot demanded it”.

[@AntoineVello]

This is 500% the truth. Especially since Aemon died at 37 ... In medieval times ... with only one daughter. This is so odd that you almost have to ask if they were doing it wrong.

[@WorldOfWesteros]

For me a lot of those details steam from the fact that GRRM created the world history working backward from what he had already established and published. It is very clear to the reader that Aemon and Jocelyn were likely not going to have any more children and it does stick out as odd. Then again GRRM does have a few of these large age gaps between siblings, there is a 19 year age gap between Daeron ii and his sister Daenerys, but then again we have record of lots of still births and of course Aegon iv's countless bastards.

[@TrueYellowDart]

I haven’t heard many folks talk about important “dragon regulation” really should have been re: the Targaryens. With Targaryens needing to marry other houses from time to time, without dragon regulation, eventually a true challenge would arise. Imagine if the timeline had progressed to the point where dragons were still around for the Blackfyre Rebellions - the carnage would have been insane.

[@jonathanutsuundelikwo3669]

How feasible would the "dragon regulation" be, only way that can reasonable work is to not allow dragon rider marry out of the family, i.e whoever marries a dragon rider(male or female it doesn't matter) the spouse(male or female) marries into house Targaryen. The alternative of actually trying to prevent dragon riders from giving their children dragon eggs or letting them claim unbonded dragon can't and won't work. You will just be asking for multiple dance of the dragons. What will you do if someone forbidden from riding a dragon bonds with a dragon, do you send them to the wall, take their head or send them to exile? The family members of the new dragon rider would just let you do this? You can't enforce a meaningful "dragon regulation". They only people that the King can successfully stop from riding dragons to some degree are his immediate family; you know the people you actually want to be able to ride dragon. Like imagine Viserys told Rhaenys or Daemon that their children won't be allowed to ride dragons, they would just tell Viserys to eat grass. The whole dragon egg incident between Viserys and Daemon could only be resolved because Daemon allowed it to be resolved. Imagine if Daemon refused, there's nothing Viserys could have done

[@TrueYellowDart]

@@jonathanutsuundelikwo3669 We don’t know what (if any) customs Valyria itself had around this. Maybe since they had so many nukes around they all knew not to nuke each other. But dragons are a finite and radically game-changing resource once it was time to conquer Westeros. Regulation probably would have had to have started with Aegon I or not at all. The egg custom hadn’t started yet. You’re right that Vizzy I couldn’t have just up and tried to start regulation - too late by then and would have caused huge family issues. Aegon and his sisters would have all needed to agree on said rules and put them into law right away so that every child knew the expectations and penalties. And smarter people than I would have to figure out what those rules would be. But something along the lines of only mainline family members having dragons - so maybe no bonding until after marriage (for girls) and some kind of age limit for boys. But if ya don’t regulate those nukes and all it takes is a marriage for nuke proliferation to occur, then you’re eventually going to have nuke civil war - it’s basically unavoidable given Westerosi politics.

[@jonathanutsuundelikwo3669]

@@TrueYellowDart I would say the wasn't really a time, anyone could have started regulating dragons. It didn't make political & logical sense to do. I think post dance & pre Aegon, the number one determinant was the available dragon, with a handful of dragons, regulating dragons was a moot point, all the available dragons were already bonded or had made it known they did not want to be disturb. Aegon & his sisters couldn't really do it either. They had more pressing matters. Dorne had killed a dragon leaving them with just two, they was a tenous peace with the faith, their hold over Westeros was still on fundamentally shaky grounds, preventing their children from riding dragons would cause more harm than good, at this point having more dragons was better than having fewer especially since most dragons would have been small (when compared to Balerion & Vhagar). At they end Aegon & his sisters only had two children with one of them Maegor showing no apparent interest with wanting to bond with a dragon. They really needed as many of Aenys children to try to bond with dragons. Jaehaerys was the closet person who could have regulated dragons. In canon, he restricted his later children access to dragons, only 3 out of 13 children (I know some of them died young) became dragon riders and for the most part just 3 grandchildren became dragon riders (Viserys barely even counts as a rider for a very brief moment). They were barely any dragonrider to make trying to regulate dragons a meaningful endevour Concerning the initial point of dragons existing up to the Blackfyre rebellion. Regardless of if there were laws to regulate dragons, I highly doubt Aegon IV would have actually prevented his bastards especially Daemon from trying to bond with a dragon, he would actually encourage it. If he was going to prevent anyone it would be Daeron and his children

[@glenesis]

Rhaenys was too kind when she chose not to cook the Greens in the Sept.

[@joeybulford9055]

She could have just ended the whole thing right there

[@drycell476]

she ain't no kinslayer

[@chad63]

and thats why she was never named queen it would be a waste on her

[@AccountHolder007]

That’s the entire reason I don’t pity her death. She couldn’t be the strong/tough leader her time needed for a swift resolve. The greens were not at all as valyrian pureblood as the Targaryans and Velaryon, so they shoulda been wiped the moment they declared war against the true lineage and went against the king’s wishes.

[@jopepe2867]

I gotta look at timelines but Id imagine that they still had family members alive that made it a moot point by the time they were married off for other connections.

[@alexturlais8558]

They could just be crowned equal monarchs. That happened with William and Mary in Britain.

[@wilku1378]

Jaehaerys did the same to Rhaenys as he did to the daughters of his brother Ageon the Uncrowned, that is, he stole their crown. since maegor targaryen was a usurper, the rightful king was ageon uncrowned and after his death, the throne should go to his eldest daughter and her mother rhaena should rule as regent because he had no male heir and in such a case, the daughter inherits everything. the same in the case of aemon, since he was the successor of jaeherys, after his death the throne should go to the daughter of the prince of dragonstone since he had no male heir. so if he awarded the throne to rhaenys (I will ignore the long reign of jaehaerys), he would undermine his right to the throne and admit that the inheritance should be in a direct line, and he himself was a usurper just like the maegor.

[@sankarkrishnan407]

When the old king agrees to the marriage of Rhaenys and Viserys the access of dragons go to another family. After 115 A C House Velarayon had 3 dragons including Vhagar. Politically also Princess Rhaenys must marry someone in the family. Corlys only want a Princess. Princess Viserra was an ideal choice.

[@jordanthompson1418]

Finally, someone said it. If they were really considering Rhenys as Queen, then Viserra should have been offered to the Sea Snake like Daella was, and Rhenys betrothed to Viserys by age 10 (when it was obvious the heir wasn't producing anymore kids). Viserra is the only daughter who did nothing wrong and was offered 0 choice (because politics all of the sudden). She died because of that. I think the Sea Snake would have taken the offer. Rhenys had other Velarayon candidates too (some not 21 years older than her...) but chose Coryls for his money, power, and prestige. Had her father not died she would have been well suited to become Queen with a powerful consort to back her up. I think that's why she chose that moment (when the famous matchmaker Queen was upset with the King) to ask King J to marry Coryls. He wouldn't think much about it and wasn't going to consult Queen A either. At the time it was well played. But as is Game of Thrones, someone dies and mucks everything up.

[@felooosailing957]

You do a great job explaining why this did not happen. However, I think that your larger intention of understanding the background of the Dance of the Dragons has to be commended, and then even extended. In a sense, Targaryen succession problems, which still haunt the politics of Westeros and Essos to the days of Daenerys, started with Aegon choosing to marry both Visenya and Rhaenys. Criteria of primogeniture and proximity, along with claims of illegitimacy, started with the conflict that involved Aenys, Prince Aegon and Maegor. Also, a little bit later, the issue of gender starts with Rhaena and Margot, and impacts the relationship of Jaehaerys and Alyssane.

[@mrizwan7566]

I remember reading an interesting comment that dragons would still be dead even if the dance was avoided. The way house targaryen dynamics were some other civil war would have happened in house targaryen. Original commenter suggests that it would have been blackfyres who would been dragon riders and blackfyre rebellion would be faught with dragons. Although highly unlikely but it would be interesting to see bloodraven, bittersteel and daemon blackfyre as dragon riders.

[@WorldOfWesteros]

I 100% agree that at some point a dance of the dragons like conflict was inevitable especially with how many different branches were created during Jaehaerys reign. I don't personally see it being the Blackfyre's who fight that war however. With no dance, basically everything that allows Aegon IV to even exist no longer happens, thus no House Blackfyre. But i could see a break away faction like them still being created at some point. I made a video a long time ago about how giving House Velaryion access to dragons was always a questionable idea, as soon as another faction has the power of dragons, it only takes something very minor to set of a chain reaction to creat a dance like event

[@mrizwan7566]

@WorldOfWesteros agree on all your points.

[@bensonfang1868]

This would have happened if Corlys didn’t pursue rhaenys or was already betrothed to one of Jaehaerys and alysanne’s daughters. Viserys and rhaenys are only 2 years apart anyways. Daemon and aemma can marry (they’re much closer in age so aemma won’t marry so young)

[@neyragrat]

To add to that, he could have Rhaenys claim Dreamfyre, Viserys claim Meleys after his mom dies, Daemon claim Sheepstealer (if Aemon dies Gael claims Caraxes). All dragons are occupied by Targaryens, all claims settled and life going on smooth as butter. Then Viserra can marry either Baelon or Corlys. Although i think Corlys is a better option. She is vain and spoilt, and Corlys is rich and could use a trophy wife Plus Daemon marries Gael Maybe Baelon marries Aemma in like 100AC

[@liamcollins9183]

I think that by the time Rhaenys first met Corlys, the chances of Aemon and Jocelyn have more children were fairly low, so it's not like people couldn't see a high possibility of Rhaenys being in contention for the throne. Once that was clear Jaehaerys should have either publicly accepted Rhaenys being Aemon's heir, with Corlys as her consort, or betrothed her to Viserys to unite the two claims. If he went with the first option, he could have made a stipulation that Laenor would take the name Targaryen when he became King, similar to how Jacaerys would. Laenor may have married Laena in Targaryen fashion, or possibly still married Rhaenyra in this alternate timeline. He would probably have the same trouble having legitimate children of his own, which might be more problematic given the claim runs through his blood rather than Rhaenyra's. But if he married Laena this might not be such a problem as she's next in line anyway. Viserys probably wouldn't have been so hell bent on having a son, so maybe Aemma Arryn doesn't die, in which case he doesn't marry Alicent and have further children with her. Not sure how Daemon would fit into all this, probably just lurking in the background causing trouble 😅.

[@mayacarraway8953]

Ideally, Viserys should have annulled the marriage Daemon and Rhea had and wed him to a Targaryen or Velaryon. I guess in this alternative timeline, it would be Rhaenys doing the annulling but it should have happened regardless. They were stupid to marry outside of their own family so much. I think the more ideal scenario would have ironically been Viserys and Rhaenys marrying and Daemon and Aemma marrying. I realize that means no Rhaenyra but... it would have kept the peace the best.

[@nantuckettorrance1664]

Ok, it is better to look at it this way: 1. Viserys and Aemma was a fine match. 2. Rhaenys and Corlys…also fine. Now… 3. Daemon should have been betrothed to and married Rhaenyra from the jump. Nothing with the Vale gal. 4. After Aemma’s death, Viserys should have married Laena. Remember, Laena is five years older than Rhaenyra-and only fifteen years younger than Viserys. 5. Moreover, Jaehaerys and Alysanne should have been better with the matchmaking of their daughters and spearheaded more dragonriders: a. Maegelle should have married, not been made a Septa; b. Saera should have been married off to someone from House Velaryon, Baratheon, Stark, Blackwood, Martell, Dayne, or Arryn; c. Viserra should have been married off to someone younger and hotter-and from House Velaryon, Baratheon, Stark, Blackwood, Martell, Dayne, or Arryn; d. Gael should have been married off by age fifteen/sixteen (to one of the aforementioned Houses) to prevent her from dallying with (and getting taken advantage of by) that musician at age nineteen/twenty. 6. Baelon should have remarried after the death of Alyssa. One of his sisters, or someone from House Velaryon, Baratheon, Stark, Blackwood, Martell, Dayne, or Arryn. 7. Laenor and Alicent are cast-offs…married to others. Or even to each other (8. Jaehaerys could have also considered legitimizing Saera’s three sons-and giving them the last name Targaryen.)

[@WorldOfWesteros]

I'm gonna save this comment and come back to it because you've brought up a lot of very good points i hadn't thought about before

[@nantuckettorrance1664]

@@WorldOfWesteros Awesome! 👍🏾👍🏿

[@maishaahmed915]

There is nothing wrong with Maegelle being a septa. GRRM should have made her a writer of medical books like Hildegard of Bingen.

[@mayacarraway8953]

Honestly, it wouldn't have mattered what happened to Alicent in this case. They could have ignored her entirely. Another scenario I think would have worked well is Viserys and Rhaenys marrying and Daemon and Aemma marrying

[@jessjess23brooks89]

She should have just taken both for husband. The perfect triachy power couple. I kid, I kid... Sorta.

[@madambutterfly1997]

The dance was preventable from multiple angles. Had certain marriages happened and certain marriages not happened if a certain individual had just did his duty in spite of his sexuality. If another individual didn’t resort to obvious paternity fraud, even though she had better options.

[@Kadasberry11]

Doing the duty legit goes hand in hand with sexuality lol grow up

[@bagbyjamez]

Also worth mentioning that even if anyone at court considered a match between Rhaenys and Viserys before the former's marriage to the Sea Snake, it may not have mattered as King Jaehaerys may have been planning to pass over Rhaenys anyhow. Jaehaerys's opinions on women - particularly the women in his family - were likely marred by his experiences with his mother, sister Rhaena, niece Aerea, and especially his daughters who all gave him a lot of grief during his lifetime. It's never mentioned to my knowledge that Rhaenys was troublesome for her grandfather, but all the same, he probably was reticent to have her in the direct line of succession, and a match with Corlys may have been a convenient way of getting her out of the way. Corlys was a good political match in that House Velaryon was an old and extremely powerful ally to the Targaryen dynasty, but Corlys as a Velaryon very likely had little Targaryen blood himself (despite years of intermarriage between the houses) and his place in the line of succession, if any, to the Iron Throne would be very low and probably weakened Rhaenys's claim just by association. A marriage to Corlys conveniently helps to sidestep her claim while giving her a place of honor as the Lady of Driftmark as a tricky means of compensation for her lost inheritance.

[@mayacarraway8953]

So if we go with that logic, a critical mistake made was marrying Daemon to Rhea. That should not have happened. They should have made a better match for him, whether it be to Rhaenyra or to Laena.

[@bagbyjamez]

@@mayacarraway8953 Daemon’s marriage to Rhea occurred when both Laena and Rhaenyra were still little little kids with Laena being like 4-5 yrs old and Rhaenyra a newborn. At the time it probably seemed like a good match but if the powers that be had planned to marry Rhaenys and Viserys all along, Daemon would have likely married Aemma. I’m still kind of curious why you say marrying Daemon and Rhea was a bad choice though? I mean considering Rhaenys + Corlys and Viserys + Aemma, I’m not really sure who else Daemon could have married at the time that would have been clearly better for Targaryen interests. Thoughts?

[@ReporterRed]

Why didn't Aegon and Rhaenyra marry for the same reason?

[@kingk9407]

The heir presumptive ( Rhaenys ) & the heir apparent wed would’ve united the realm . Both grandchildren to Jaehaerys & Alysanne , both nearly fully Valyrian ( Rhaenys’s mother was Baratheon & Velaryon ) , & both dragon riders .

[@blumelodiez]

Viserys shouldve just let Daemon and Rhaenyra marry, or better, never had more children SONS no less with Alicent. Instead, he left Rhaenyra to the wolves and did fuck all. Rhaenyra's claim would've been stronger had she had "pure" Targaryen children (I love her Strong Sons bt we can't deny they complicated things). We can understand Viserys not trusting his favorite child with his rogue of a brother, but it was the best option than literally anything he had ever done as king.

[@pitoseavy4523]

You are delusional thinking viserys was gonna trust deamon with anything 😂 that's literally the only reason rhaenyra became heir 🤦🏾‍♂️you team black idiots are 🤡s it's literally shown in the show if he didn't banish deamon he would still be heir he would not remarry or change anything but the moment he listened to Otto the first time you can't stop mid way💯

[@umitencho]

Because no one likes stories with no conflicts. He just married the wrong cousin. Plus he wasn't the default heir when he was born, there were others, but they kept dieing. His claim was being a male & the heir to the previously chosen heir: his father; so I can see the argument being that he would have become king anyway under the previous arrangement. What his grandfather should have done was set out clear rules when gender is the issue or Viserys should have called a new council after his son by Allicent was born. Or maybe never remarry after Aemma died, and taught Rhaenarya how to rule and focus on getting her married.

[@JoseGonzalez-pn5zl]

The dance was bound to happen sooner or later it was inevitable. What’s to stop another Targaryen from pulling a Maegor and jumping the line because he feels like he would be a better fit??

[@Maegorthecrueltargaryen]

Then how come no one did and besides i doubt anyone would give a targaryen bastard a dragon and even then there wouldn't be enough support for him to start a full on dance so it would be one dragon against twentie

[@seanmota424]

​@Maegorthecrueltargaryen technically all these upcoming dragonseeds are targaryen bastards they are just handing dragons to. Lol

[@JoseGonzalez-pn5zl]

@@Maegorthecrueltargaryen well of course as we see later with the blackfyre this house is it own enemy if some one didn’t challenge there claim from the outside then it probably would of happen inside.

[@Maegorthecrueltargaryen]

@@seanmota424 they only did that as a desperat mesure because they didn't have enough dragons to fight the greens

[@kevinroark5815]

Rhaenyra would've still fought the sons of Rhaenys to get the throne.

[@Mortablunt]

The real answer is Martin is convinced the default state of humanity is megalomaniacal psychopath.

[@user-pc9px8nu1o]

I don’t understand how if King J’s second son was made heir after his first son, wasn’t Viserys 2nd in line at that point? Why did the great council happen? The way I see it, male only succession was set as precedent twice, once with King J making his second son heir over Rhaenys/Laenor, and another time with the great council. But King V threw that all out the window to make Rhaenyra heir. It’s all his fault. King V was just one guy who wanted equal succession, but the whole of Westeros decided on male only. This is what Otto realized. The lords wanted male only. Sure he had ambition, but he realized male only would lead to peace. No King V making Rhaenyra heir, no dance.

[@lasloapollo4312]

He didnt care about equality. King V only cared about Rhaenyra. Otherwise he would put Helaena third in line instead of Aemond.

[@davidlewis5312]

but they don't want male only. Every single Andal house follows Linear male succession. I am Lord, my first heirs are my sons, then my daughters, then my eldest brother, then his sons, then his daughters, etc. I have no idea why they elected for the more confusing Absolute version.

[@davidlewis5312]

also Otto just realized he could put his grandson on the throne otherwise he would have supported Daemon over Rhae because under the blessed council of 101's bespoke decree Daemon was the rightful heir until Aegon was born but NOPE, Otto didn't like Daemon (and vice versa) so did everything he could to push him aside.

[@nathanguava883]

Jo had three sons Aemon and Baelon and Vaegon. Aemon was heir and had a daughter Rhaenys who was pregnant with Laena at the time of Aemons death at war. Jo named Baelon as heir skipping Rhaenys and her unborn child (who might have been a son). The reason for Jo’s decision was that Baelon had been trained to be Aemon’s hand and was the only adult male, with two sons Viserys and Daemon, which actual experience and patriarchy combined provided certainty and was a no brainer. But then he died suddenly. Corlys began raising his massive fleet and allies to support the claim, not really in support of Rhaenys like the show depicts; not for Laena either, but Laenor who had now been born was was the male of the eldest line (Aemons line), an obvious choice and would be heir with no question if born just a little earlier. Rhaenys was a Baratheon as well. Daemon begun raising sellswords to press Viserys claim as Baelon’s eldest son and thus what seemed like an obvious candidate too. Viserys wife Emma was an Arryn of the vale. So essentially the council was necessary to avoid an imminently pending civil war. It was probably suggested by Vaegon who Jo visited after Baelons death and had become an archmaester of the citadel; and thus refusing any claim to become heir himself and giving Jo an out.

[@lasloapollo4312]

@@nathanguava883 i also think that Saera kind of soured Jaehaerys opinion on women taking power.

[@89Ayten]

Why didn't King Viserys & Princess Rhaenys just marry to prevent The Dance Of The Dragons? Because GRRM needed to write a story. It's so silly to pose these questions for fictional events.

[@LusiaEyre]

I wonder if the issue would have been less of one of the sons - Aemon or Baelon - actually lived to take the throne. Once the choice was between grandchildren nd great grand children, the waters muddied further. Had Aemon been King, then the line of succession would put Rhaenys and her son firmly in the pole position. And had Baelon succeed Jaehaerys, that would establish his line as the new primary. I am sure there would be disgruntled voices, but that choice was the Old King's only, so maybe it would be seen differently? Also, the timeline explanation makes sense, even though it seems really short sighted of Jaehaerys to not consider Aemon not having other children for so long. Unless he thought Aemon's grandson could succeed him eventually? Even more short sighted was Viserys not noticing history repeating itself with him, Aemma and Rhaenyra and creating rival claimants.

[@ChildOfTheFlower]

Here is the problem, Rhaenys as Queen was always going to rub people the wrong and it seemed Aemon never had other kids with Jocelyn which could have given people a sigh of relief should Aemon's only child be a woman.

[@FlorentPlacide]

Everything said is pertinent, and many comments here are as well. If we want to add a anthropological aspect we could also say that any dynastic war is fueled by the ambition of every faction. Quelling any risk of mass disruption is of general interest and seems the best option. However this is a feudal society (as ours is becoming again) and the aristocracy holds most of the power. Thus going against the common good for personal or factional interest is expected and commonplace. A real exemple of this is the Hundred-Years War: it's not so much a war between _countries_ but a power-grab from people belonging to the same family. At the time of Joan of Arc the Duke of Burgundy was the uncle of Charles VII, whom she helped crown, the duke of Orleans was his brother and the king of England was his cousin and brother-in-law. It was just greed and desire for violence. As Varys says : _why is it always the innocents who suffer most, when you high lords play your game of thrones?_

[@javontaewhitemon6800]

Do you think if the old king would have established a doctrine to prevent kin slaying would that had possibly prevented the dance ? Since he limited the dragon riders of his time he was aware of what could of came

[@mayacarraway8953]

I am not sure it would have made much of a difference honestly. Aemond was quite ruthless.

[@barbaralanders6049]

Because he wasn't attracted to her. And neither was he to her daughter. He grew fond of Alicent, though. Well played, Otto!

[@victoriawilliams3551]

I also don't think they were worried because she was getting married at sixteen and presumably would have children quickly even if he did not have an error she could have had one, he was only thirty, so he easily could have lived in theory till that child his grandchild was old enough to take the.Throne. So I think that's a big reason why he was like okay.That's fine, even if I don't have a son, she can have a son.

[@dannyn6036]

It was said in the book that Aemon, Rhaenys’ father was so taken with Corlys that he was determined to have him wed to his daughter to ensure her succession since Corlys is a powerful and rich lord. Tho ironically when Aemon died, the marriage only served to alienate Rhaenys.

[@9xprincess]

Its still strange that with the Targaryen tradition of incest that Viserys wasn't betroted to Rhaenys and Daemon to Aemma from the beginning.

[@ayiza8511]

how would the dance have happened if Rheanys and Viserys married who would even oppose their son? the only targaryen left is Deamon and he is a younger son, he could have rebelled I suppose but he would not have a claim at all since Viserys and Rheanys as king and queen and their children are in from of him in the line of succession

[@WorldOfWesteros]

I think it likely would have prevent an Dance Of The Dragon's like event from happening for a few more generation. House Targaryen even before the dance had a civil wars and succession disputes but they were quite small scale compared to the dance. I just think it's inevitable at some point something big like the dance of the dragons would have happened and done some real damage to House Targaryen.

[@yanajara81]

Eventhough they don't mention this in the show, is quite evident in the scene from the great council that when this event happened, they both were already married.

[@tracys169]

IIRC, Rhaenys was betrothed to Corlys when she's 14? Viserys was 11 at that time. By the time Viserys was 14, he was married to Aemma Arryn (11). Rhaenys was then 17 and def. married to Corlys Velaryon.

[@RemRaye]

Respectfully, you forgot a third solution in the question of who might be the ruling party. Rhaenys and Viserys could be co-rulers, sharing in authority equally. Given Viserys's personality, however, it's likely that even if she was a mere queen consort, Rhaenys would have been the real power behind the throne anyway.

[@aprilmae274]

Only one season in-there is like to still be more information/background story coming. It is interesting AF that there are SET patterns to these deaths. Aemon gets a shaft through his throat. So will Jace-both by water.

[@aegorbittersteel2154]

1st to take the Black for House Blackfyre🗡 Honestly I find the idea of this couple hilarious.

[@aprilmae274]

agor hi! I have a question for you! Dany's lineage is Aegon the 1st, Jaehaerys and Daeron the Dragon...this is what Green Grace says. WHO did Daeron have a kid with? In text he dies at 18, no kids..but man the time he spends in Dorne. I am betting he is also a ref to 'Dornishman's Wife' song. He got a Dornish Princess pregnant. Dany HAS to be FROM Dorne, right? Does this mean SHE is THE Blackfyre and NOT Aegon-Griff? Or noble by Dornish standards..and Bastards Born by Westeros standards yet STILL an actual Queen/Princess? Is Dany a tricksie Blackfyre simply because she IS Bastard Born yet also legitimized? Or are they switching from GC TO Dornish-Targaryen? Holy shit I literally just figured out wtf ALL Doran has done and is going to do...o

[@aegorbittersteel2154]

@aprilmae274 Damn that's an amazing theory, although I hope not only because I need somebody to be related to King Daemon Blackfyre the 1st😄 I hope you are well.

[@aprilmae274]

@@aegorbittersteel2154 I hope you are well, too!

[@King_Mac80]

The show answers this in the first scene Rhaenys is literally standing next to Corlys and I'm pretty sure she's pregnant in that scene

[@samueldrazkowski2908]

Corlys is in the scene where Rhaenys is passed over, making it seem pretty obvious she was already married

[@TaeSunWoo]

(Reads title) Me: they should’ve gotten together anyways?! 🗣️✨

[@SilverDomainShrine7]

I could see where Rhaenys and Viserys could’ve been co rulers (like Mary II and William III of the UK) But then again there would be issues considering Westeros STRONGLY wants male rulers only. Even with queens regnant in history their rule was constantly undermined just because they were women. So there would be so much complications in Westeros even if Rhaenys and Viserys were to joint rule in this scenario. Literally no one wins 😭

[@HashBandicoot356]

17 year old Viserys dipping his cookie in 12 year old milk dont sound right to me.

[@mrizwan7566]

Becaaue viserya was no where in the line of succession, and dance would have been avoided if his father prince baelon wouldn't have died. What is written about him clearly shows that he would be mmmake sure to take neccesary steps to avoid somthing like the dance.

[@DanteKahn]

Without changing who married who, best way to avoid it would have been to follow the traditions of the Andals and the laws of the kingdom and make Aegon II his heir when born. Should have done it as soon as he had the boy, then raise him to be a good man. Simple. Yes it would pass of his older sister but it would have cemented peace.

[@Apachito]

watching the tv show, at no point have i felt like viserys couldve done anything to prevent the dance of dragon. well except maybe not be delirious on his death bed.

[@therealxireen1833]

The very same reason why Rhaenyra and Daemon should have gotten married in the beginning… To keep the power within the Targaryen family like the Hightowers made Aegon and Helaena do 😂

[@ashasenjutv9079]

No king in history, IRL or fantasy would ever marry an old woman.

[@harshie101]

Before even starting the video, they were both married? What?

[@WorldOfWesteros]

Its a hypothetical discussion about how even if they were it wouldn’t have solved anything

[@ayiza8511]

Because Rheanys was already married and her father was alive. the only people asking this have not read fire and blood.

[@WorldOfWesteros]

I do think House Of The Dragon did a poor job of addressing that part of the backstory, even just a throw away line about it would have been enough to get across to viewers who only watch the show. xyz happened therefore this is why events played out how they did

[@mtverv]

Because Rhaenys wanted to pull an Antoinette and have her cake and eat it too. She wanted the Husband of her choice (Corlys Velaryon) AND the Throne. Logically she could only have had one of them and when she chose Corlys she was screwed

[@smittypwnz]

To be fair he was a renowned hero of Westeros and the richest man in the Realm. Not to mention a man grown unlike her younger cousin. As the heir to the throne through her father who was heir at the time, she probably felt comfortable with the choice but her father died soon after sadly.

[@gig7932]

I'm pretty sure by the time she got married her father and uncle were still alive so marrying a man from such a powerful house was a good idea. Also in the books the great council of 101 AC was between Viserys and Laenor not Rhaenys.

[@smittypwnz]

If Aemon had lived she likely would have been Queen or face a civil war when she tried ascending the throne. She knew her parents would not have another child and if Aemon outlived Jaehaerys he would protect her claim. Daemon would likely be the only one to contest her in the Targaryen family at that point with maybe some support from lords wanting to push Viserys or Daemon as King if Baelon was dead at the time.

[@Maegorthecrueltargaryen]

​@@smittypwnzi doubt Viserys would care enough to try and take the throne besides he didn't ride another dragon after big B(rip) and Daemon wouldn't be able to make a claim since he is a second son and he would be one dragon against many

[@smittypwnz]

@@Maegorthecrueltargaryen oh I’m not saying Viserys would, just brother and other influential lords might force him to or use him as a figurehead to oust a female Queen and what they might see as the Velaryons now ruling.

[@matl.8197]

Totally off topic and I don't know if you know the answer to this, but what are the rules for someone being called a prince/princess? Is it when you're the son/daughter of a monarch? For example, why are Rhaenys and Daemon referred to as prince(ss) if they fathers were not king? And since Rhaenys/Daemon are prince(ess), why are Leanor, Leana, Baela, and Rhaena referred to as just "lord/sir" and "lady"?

[@iprobablywontseeyourreply.7193]

The law of titles like prince and princess are determined by each monarchy and the reigining monarch. But my guess is that it’s bc they were not in the primary line of succession. If her father hadn’t become king, Rhaenyra wouldn’t be named Princess either. A monarch can change rules, label whomever they want and titles can be given and taken away as successions change. Now obviously Jahaerys’ kids and grandchildren would be styled Prince and Princess, but it muddies when we get to great grandchildren bc if it kept going like that half of the kingdom would eventually be called Prince or Princess lol. Once Jahaerys was gone, it became a title passed onto Viserys’ children and grandchildren. Had Aegon II been named heir, Rhaenyra’s line couldn’t keep using the title past her children. And Aegon could’ve stripped them all of the title anyway.

[@neyragrat]

I think for Baela and Rhaena, Daemon had been expressely disinherited. Daemon himself still maintains his Prince title since he was brother to a king, but his children would never be princes/princess because of that. As for Laenor and Laena, Rhaenys married outside the house and her line was disinherited as well. Since Rhaenys did not become heir, she is Lady of Driftmark. Idk about the rest ofthe rules though.

[@christopherhop1780]

It is because Raenys is the daughter of the firstborn and heir Prince Aemon. King Jaehaerys was her grandfather. Aemon was supposed to b king. That it y she still doesn't lose her title. Daemon, before king V decreed rhaenyra his heir, was the prince of dragonstone until Viserys has a son. Perhaps since it was with another wife and because daemon disregards aegon and aemond he still keeps his title. Anyone wishing to change his title will be vs dark sister. 😂😂😂

[@GoldenpaydirtReviews]

He should’ve never remarried, and if he was so with remarrying, he should’ve signed into law, a clause stating all kids with the Hightower family name, can inherit the throne, only hold court ship of future houses! Easy as pie! 🥧

[@hypatiakovalevskayasklodow9195]

Dance would have just been postponed. The maesters would have made it happen eventually . Agree 100%

[@jeffcordova9633]

For the brothers in black & the lord commander!! Brother Bittersteel 🗡️🗡️🗡️ I’ve wondered this for awhile & never understood why they didn’t marry Thank you for your service to the realm mi’lord

[@aegorbittersteel2154]

🍻🍻🍻🍻🍻 Hope you are well.

[@AC-ze1nh]

Dance is on Jaeherys and Viserys "the peaceful" kings. Rhaenys shouldnt have beem passed over and Viserys shouldnt have ignored the laws of the land. By changing the sucession to suit their whims, they paved the way for civil war. If Viserys wanted Rhaenerya to be Queen, he shouldnt have re married. But it would be a boring story if the Dance didnt happen

[@TheElochai]

Wasn’t Vizzy T and Rhaenys already married to other people?

[@christoperwallace6197]

I mean, at the the time theywbere getting married, at least one if not both of their dads were still alive, so there wasnt any drama on the succession.

[@s4m1r_65]

They were already married, and there were too many heirs, until there weren't

[@iantercero5380]

Sure they were already married but how come Aegon II married his sister…. Both were young? I think this is a matter of breaking away from the lore because “reasons”…. Well the reason was to create conflict.

[@donna25871]

Viserys was a good but weak man - and that is disastrous for a king.

[@alexsim8063]

Because Viserys was already married and his wife prego I guess. But yeah that would have been the best option

[@patrickrutland7138]

Werent they both married already

[@marcomartinez8621]

They were already married while the brothers were still alive

[@billygilmusic5072]

Because Alicent was insanely hot and Viserys had that dawg in him 😂

[@mehrasa3892]

Honestly it was all Aemon's fault for not having more children with Jocelyn, like dude you're the heir, you have one fucking job and that is to have a son. What were you doing for 22 years?

[@misterkevinoh]

It’s not always easy to conceive a child… Maegor never had an heirs and he was like, fuckin tons of women

[@viniciuspaiva8932]

because they were both already married? aema and corlys exist

[@gremlin7264]

They both were allowed to have love matches.

[@elizabethification771]

They were both already married by the time they became contenders for the throne?

[@ocold-gp3oi]

Or why not have Rhaenyra marry Aegon? Both inherit the throne, problem solved

[@BryndenBloodraven]

Then it would be boring history for watchers like us. Without the drama,conflict,death and destruction it wouldn't have been fun.

[@dafewger]

Love is the death of duty?

[@shellyann109]

Why didn't Viserys marry Rhaenyra to Daemon?

[@pitoseavy4523]

Why would he ? You people didn't watch season 1 ? He literally couldn't trust his brother 😂why you think rhaenyra even became heir ? Cause he couldn't trust him you think he's making close to the throne after that ? It's like we read/watch 2 different stories

[@Kodanikage]

While King J was a competent king, he wasn’t a good father.

[@RoPiDe]

What an absurd question... the Dance of the Dragons happened because of the greens...

[@piyusarkar3065]

Daemon and rhaenyra would have solved the problem as well.

[@pitoseavy4523]

Why would he ? He literally episode 1 banish him & couldn't trust him you think he gonna let him marry her after changing him as heir ? Y'all fans not watching the same story

[@RealRich305]

Isn't Aemma also a grand daughter of Jaherys!!

[@lawrencereid2767]

The grand mother made that happen lol

[@aber3970]

i think if viserys and rhaenys married won't happen the civil war between the family targaryen i know that rhaenys was married from lord corlys but maybe there chance for them to be hasbend and wife 😂i knew lot people dislike viserys (me to😊😊) but if he married to rhaenys will change lots of things maybe rhaenyra and laena and laenor be siblings in other universe okay that will be awesome but if there grandfather did that okay no problems no alicent and her carzy children wow i wish he did that from the beginning none this happened 😢😢😢

[@billberndtson]

1st to 🎶Take the long way home...🎶

[@truetory6231]

The question should not be why did Viserys not marry Rhaenys but rather why did he marry Alicent. If he was lonely he could have easily just kept Alicent as a mistress and any children they had would be bastards but the moment he married her and started to have sons, the Dance was inevitable.

[@lasloapollo4312]

Because he is too passive. He only goes after women that were presented to him.

[@lopesgabrielp]

Viserys I needed to remarry after Aemma's death... It's the "Middle Ages", people die all the time for stupid things. Rhaenyra could die in childbirth, from illness, from falling from the dragon, from murder... the king needs to get married and secure more heirs. is a dialogue that exists in HOTD, in which Viserys explains to his daughter why he needs to get married, this is his duty Anyway, Alicent is a Hightower, the oldest house in Westeros, with undeniable renown, power and money, Alicent was a good bride, even though she was the niece of Lord Hightower...

[@truetory6231]

@@lopesgabrielp I'm not saying Alicent isn't a fit bride, yes the Hightowers are not a bad house to choose from given thier lineage. The truth is any bride he married would have presented exact the same problem, the moment she gave birth to a legitimate son

[@privatechannel8462]

Why... because the author wrote it that way...

[@ghostlyjudge]

Wasnt she married already to the sea snake

[@theresapitts9550]

Because there wouldn’t be a story

[@neilcorbadura896]

whole video's AI voiced.;, stay away

[@WorldOfWesteros]

Yeah, i’m 100% not an AI, go watch my early videos and you’ll see how my presentation style has developed over time. Oddly not the first person to think this

[@verihimthered2418]

❤

[@aprilmae274]

Try looking at Corlys as a Prince. He IS. Vaemond was a Prince. Their Kingdom is Under the Sea. Rhaenys IS a Queen after Vaemond dies and Corlys levels up to King...and Rhaenyra {right Rhae? lol} WAS a Queen as well-of the West, Riverlands and Westerlands. WHERE did Corlys GO for 6 years and why? The show is going to give us the Real reasons.

[@tness93]

Nitpicking