Why Disney's Frollo is Too Evil (Hunchback of Notre Dame Analysis)

Does Claude Frollo's complexity really shine, or is he about as compelling as a drab little crab? Let's find out
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[@alize0623]

PS: in the novel, Esmeralda is 15 years old, kind of naive, and absolutely infatuated with Phoebus who tries to take advantage of her sexually

[@djgamer5458]

wat

[@randomalienfrommars0567]

Aaaaand then he leaves her for a wealthy french noblewoman. And Frollo ends up killing her..... that girl truly can't catch a break huh ;-;

[@alize0623]

DJ GAMER Yeah

[@alize0623]

Emmi the Cat Frog I wanted to beat EVERYONE up in that damn book. Especially the author character

[@JohnDoe-xf8ew]

Esmerelda was also discovered to be the long lost daughter of the woman who initially tried to have her imprisoned. The woman is later stabbed to death when she realizes the truth because she tried to protect Esmerelda.

[@lancejburns]

In the original, Frollo and the Archdeacon are the same character, disney essentially split all of Frollo's positive aspects away and turned them into a separate character.

[@dutchik5107]

Does make kids less likely to develop trust issues of any adult that's nice to em

[@farmerboy916]

An adaptation that explicitly shows the audience that (playing on him having literally good and bad sides within a cohesive but perhaps fracturing whole) could be utterly brilliant.

[@ScarletStarManor]

which I still prefer over the original way he was, I feel he's a lot better being a corrupt judge than the archdeacon and everything, more enjoyable for me.

[@birdieberry]

Despite the nerfed character, the change was probably a smart commercial move for Disney; it could have alienated Catholic audiences, especially since during that time in the 90's the "pedo priest" controversy was blown full force in the public consciousness.

[@asariarchie5734]

birdieberry Catholic audiences already felt alienated by the film. Disney should have gone all out and stuck with the serious tone. It would have increased buzz for the film and made it more popular.

[@Pyrus425]

“Why does he hate Gypsies in the movie?” Idk man he’s French it ain’t that much of a stretch

[@sirsleepsalot6811]

Gypsy’s were actually treated like trash during this time period as well so being that Frollo is a public figure during this time it really is no surprise

[@pesciisthebestcharacter5100]

I don't even know what the fuck a gypsy is.

[@nekogaming5300]

@@pesciisthebestcharacter5100 then you don’t have any reason to comment

[@pesciisthebestcharacter5100]

@@nekogaming5300 can you tell me what it is?

[@caixo5604]

@@pesciisthebestcharacter5100 Gypsies are a nomadic folk of Europe

[@lukayaroslav9914]

"The kind of evil that doesn't realize that it's evil, is the worst kind of evil there is." - Weather Report -

[@silverthedruid4754]

Is ThAt a MoThErFuCkInG JoJo ReFrEnCe

[@lukayaroslav9914]

@@silverthedruid4754 yes

[@highadmiraljt5853]

First- funny jojo refrene momento Xd Second- reminds me of handsome jack from the borderlands video game franchise.

[@GodInHumanForm]

Do you believe in gravity?

[@AgentLando]

the duality between Pucci and weather

[@bheronz]

Frollo : *stabs Phoebus* Also Frollo : Why would Esmeralda do this?

[@yvyrose195]

Sounds like an Eric Andre meme to me.

[@alejandraayala8815]

10/10 great use of the meme

[@adumb7124]

Who killed Phoebus?

[@jessicadinep8709]

lmao perfect

[@lisaleyendekker8305]

Frollo: (stabs Phoebus) also Frollo: Esmerelda, why'd you stab him?

[@PineapplePineapplePineapplePin]

Actually, Disney *Intentionally* made Frollo as evil as possible to get rid of the "Evil is Cool" stereotype

[@SamGlaze]

Too bad it backfired because Frollo is clearly the coolest

[@redoned.8446]

Samuel Glaze ah yes, wanting to kill a baby and seduce someone and later almost burn them alive is so tight

[@eevee1583]

@@redoned.8446 It's the closest we get to cool

[@balanc-joy9187]

That's what I thought first too. What bothers me in the musical is that Quasimodo is shown to be more delusional in the musical (I haven't seen it, but the stuff I've heard bothers me) like his gargoyles urging him to kill Frollo...

[@dominickperez2952]

@@redoned.8446 Hell Yeah it is! ( pun intended )

[@Sataandagi96]

You call it "too evil", I call it "historically accurate".

[@imdrum6881]

LMAOO

[@orangeslash1667]

@MecherWulf Fun Fact: Disney confirmed that movies Frollo is based on Amon Goeth from Schindler's list!!!!

[@tophatcat1173]

Yeah, frollo not only could exist in the real world, but almost definitely did exist in the real world.

[@jaserror]

still accurate until now - look at your typical GOP and NRA representatives and grifters.

[@JohnnyCageRock]

@@tophatcat1173 Read about Heinrich Kramer. Aka the author of the "Malleus Maleficarum". The man responsible for making witchcraft a feminine crime all because he was a clearly sexually repressed individual. So much so that his one and only witch trial he made prior writing the book, was dismissed as he was clearly obsessed with the sexual activities of the accused. She got away, he got salty about it, therefore he had to tell the world that woman are essentially the bane of evil. What a prick.

[@quinnschulte9291]

As a Catholic myself, what I love about the religious aspect of this movie is how instead of looking to god and asking for help and forgiveness, he looks at everyone else and uses paper thin logic to explain how this is their fault or even god’s fault for making him feel this way. A textbook narcissist who can’t have an arc because he refuses to change and looks at himself as god.

[@chileanyways196]

Same!!

[@jendoe9436]

Pride is known as the chief sin for a reason. Lucifer could have remained one of God’s best and most beloved angels, but instead he put his own ideas above God’s and tried to overthrow Him.

[@brandanimations3790]

There's something that i find interesting that I saw in the video, Schaffrillas says that Frollo gets crazier as his lust progresses and this is what sin is, a deordinated passion that if given enough time, makes the person mad as we see with Frolo in the plot. There's also some supernatural stuff in the plot like the gargoyles in which I genuinely think are a Guardian Angel.

[@RandomGuy-ej5dr]

Catholic but you write God with the small g.

[@CounterCurseMantra]

​@@RandomGuy-ej5drhe even mispelled catholic. Its spelled pedophile*

[@Don-ds3dy]

Drowing a baby in a well would also contaminate the water supply. So evil.

[@minabrunkhorst9954]

Oh, damn. I didn't even think about that!

[@isaiahadams1208]

Mina Brunkhorst Me either

[@miamackenzie9946]

we were all to focused on the immediate evil we didn't see the evil lying underneath

[@louise4152]

Oh shit-

[@paintitpeachydontforgetthe539]

*shudders* how-how hOrRiBlE!!!!

[@UnculturedSwineStudios]

Why is there a large crowd of people lining up at my door asking for money

[@oasis9615]

Uncultured Swine Entertainment considering you're a swine, you must be a piggy bank.

[@mr.cesseri2056]

OwO

[@nerdwarp112]

I love your profile picture. It’s such a powerful image.

[@Trailminer]

It’s the man, the myth, the legend.... The pig.

[@TriptuneRadio]

Cause I'm the one holding the gun

[@noahh6186]

"Villain who has no flaws" Uh excuse you, Tamatoa can't flip over when he's on his back, I'd say that's a pretty big flaw.

[@marcossandrosilva6979]

It's because he's the true hero of the movie

[@rockhistoria2537]

He's just to powerful to be left free

[@beast6213]

that's not a flaw, it's a weakness, which is different

[@noahh6186]

@@beast6213 I know this is probably not a super serious comment so don't feel the need to pay any mind to my reply. That said, I feel like it depends on how you define flaw and weakness. Like, the way I personally see it, his shell being shaped/weighted in such a way that he can't get up when flipped over is a flaw, both due to his biological design and his greed, and when he is flipped over it then becomes a weakness. So in a way it's both, to me at least.

[@beast6213]

@@noahh6186 not sure if this would be the t cubical definitions but for example, Achilles' heel would he his weakness (though it could also be mental/emotional, not purely physical) but his hubris is his flaw (what would ultimately cause or lead to a downfall) but that's just my view on it.

[@masterspark9880]

There are many people in real life even today who hate Romani people for no reason. Just because he doesn’t have a reason to hate them doesn’t mean it’s unrealistic for him to hate them

[@lydia8526]

Though I am sure people in real life have (both understandable and dumb) reasons to hate romani people or anyone in general

[@RubyBlueUwU]

It’s like he forgot that racism was a thing for the duration of this video 😬

[@catalayalafaye5337]

Also the therm can be quite offensive, so maybe he should have used another one.

[@spencerfrankclayton4348]

@@catalayalafaye5337 No.

[@festethephule7553]

@@spencerfrankclayton4348 The proper word is Roma I believe, with "Gypsy" being widely considered offensive.

[@matti.8465]

"Abusive father figure who shows concern for his son but more for his reputation" That just sounds like Buck from Chicken Little.

[@thesupervideogamenerdmore3171]

*A year later* "Don't worry, they'll get over it..."

[@davidclout6286]

“That was his mistake!”

[@luigivercotti6410]

Also Leopold from Amadeus, possibly?

[@thestanman1486]

Buck Mccluck likes to fuck

[@snakeaddict2810]

Just proves there's a good way to do it, and a _very bad way_ to do it.

[@FletcherReedsRandomness]

Here's my stance: Disney Frollo is a better villain, but Novel/Play Frollo is a better character.

[@lianulbrich9995]

Big mood

[@alyzz9863]

By "play" you mean the one based on novel, or the one based on Disney film?

[@bigounce4968]

@@alyzz9863 He means the one in the play, the whole point of the video 😂

[@alyzz9863]

@@bigounce4968 y'know, people in comments section are talking about both Notre Dame de Paris and Hunchbag of Notre Dame, so I couldn't be so sure.

[@Mars-dw2zc]

novel > play > movie imo. play’s pretty good but he has half the complexity he does in the book

[@dkisausome]

After watching this, I realize this could actually be a Disney movie that could actually _use_ a remake, if they take after the stage musical adaption.

[@bett1826]

YESSAA

[@genevieveowusu885]

But done RIGHT.

[@unicornbarfingrainbows7599]

If Disney remakes it they’ll most likely censor or downplay it

[@dkisausome]

@@unicornbarfingrainbows7599 Yeahhh, seems likely, actually...

[@TheKnowledgeMan101]

@@dkisausome Actually, Disney confirmed that they're gonna go dark for the remake of THOND

[@arieltallen5732]

Heaven's light vs Hell fire. I love that they literallyade their songs opposites to show the effect she had on them, showing their true intentions.

[@crischiva1936]

If you think about it, both songs speacknabout "love" and the need of affection, but in complete oposite ways

[@doctorwholover1012]

I love how it shows how two extremely different people can see a person and perceive them in entirely different ways based on their morals/upbringing/beliefs, like, even as Quasimodo was raised by Frollo with Frollo's ideals + teachings, he wasn't a carbon copy of him and had his own views +values.

[@killertofu9188]

"Who is the monster and who is the man?"

[@orangeslash1667]

@@doctorwholover1012 Fun Fact: Disney confirmed that movies Frollo is based on Amon Goeth from Schindler's list!!!!

[@kimberly.z]

@@doctorwholover1012 nature vs nurture! (cough, *megamind*, cough)

[@kennyflanders8337]

Fun fact about Frollo: The Disney executives intentionally made Frollo as evil as possible because they wanted to remove stereotype and saying that "Evil is cool" among Disney Villains

[@heatherpony]

The bad guy is an unlikable religious fanatic. Yes.

[@misterminutes4504]

It didn't work. I still love villains

[@misterminutes4504]

@@Ari-vc5lg Haha disney

[@tainasiman2107]

same thing probaly on removing be prepared from live action lion king

[@Isabelle-hv6ny]

But he has one of the best songs.

[@alexandergilles8583]

Religion is like a knife. In the hands of a chef, it can be a tool for compassion, beauty, and wonder. In the hands of a murderer, it can be a tool for violence, suffering, and division. If someone uses religion to make lives miserable, it’s not necessarily their religion that is making them awful. It’s the way they wield it.

[@TheJawesomeOne]

Well said

[@sassythehumansylveon5803]

PREACH BRUH

[@lorax1274]

Exactly It can give hope as much it can give death

[@thefunny1359]

I'm 14 and this is deep

[@crisredfield2]

Yep, everything can be twisted into a weapon of hatred by people who only want an excuse to make others miserable. Most notably religion and politics. I'm Catholic myself, but I despise with passion people that use their faith to justify their hate for others.

[@himdevil2391]

I completely disagree. Making Frollo evil from the very start and showing him progressively get worse just hammers home the fact that these types of people are never self-aware of how wicked they are. Making a villain sympathetic doesn't automatically make them complex and I really wish that type of thinking would die. Frollo was 3 dimensional because of how realistic his portrayal was. He's so convinced he's right that he fails to see how wrong he is. This results in him committing almost every sin by the end of the movie despite constantly emphasizing his righteousness. And even with how deplorable Frollo's actions are. He still feels human due to his mindset very much being prevalent in real people. I agree that the theatre adoption of him was great. But I very much prefer the movie Frollo. Him being their evilest villain is why so many people give the movie praise. Adding on to why I disagree that he was too evil. Other than that, great video. It's nice to see your take on him.

[@YouKnowImOnMyPeriodYah]

Fr! It’s that bullshit where Disney tried to give every villain a sad backstory (cough cough, cruella and maleficent) and then idiots in the comments spew sad quotes that villains are “misunderstood”. Okay? But the villain attempted murder/murdered people, idgaf if their story is sad lol

[@samcochran8203]

While that is a fair assessment of how movie Frollo was shown in his cruelty and underhanded villainy, it falls victim to one assumption, that movie Frollo doesn't feel like he's doing something wrong at any point, part of what makes Hellfire so great is that it's not just him grappling with the fact that he's feeling, in his opinion, such fallible emotions that any common man or sinner would have, but even more so towards someone he doesn't even give the full benefit or acknowledgment of being human, simply because they don't believe the way he does, being torn between what he's feeling now and the fact that feeling the very feeling itself is against what he believes in, and even entertaining this feeling means his worldview of himself is shaken as he is now just like any other member of the vulgar weak licentious crowd, he is but a man, falling to his base instincts, his sins, his damnation. He entertains the notion for just a bit, that he feels he is failing in his duty/authority as a judge of the wicked, but then he turns it into his own self conclusion that he is the judge of the wicked, so he must be right in what he is feeling, he is gaslighting himself at this point, thus begins his failure in seeing his error and true sin. In this way, as is echoed in the mantra of the movie, who is the monster? Frollo goes from being an arrogant prideful despicable person in cunning control of his inner demons and directing them upon who he deems as wicked through his dirty dealings, to a monstrous villain who has lost all control of his inner beast, and is being mindlessly driven by his puppeteering emotions, base human drives, and his mighty demons. Musical Frollo is still better as he shows a more reasonable descent into this thing he becomes, and it's a lot more impactful as he was originally someone who could've turned off this path like Schaff said, but as he just keeps going, it really shows how the worst of monsters are the ones that used to care, but no longer do.

[@himdevil2391]

@@samcochran8203 I hate to be rude but could you please use paragraphs and spacing. This was a wall of text that was very hard to read. As for your point, you've just described all the reasons why the movie Frollo is better in my eyes, no offense. It's not unrealistic for Frollo to be a despicable person from the start. Zealots all throughout history have shown to not alter their thinking in the slightest due to narcissism and pride. I don't understand why it's so hard to accept some people simply put are awful. They don't need a reason to be, they just are and too blindsided by their own wickedness to change. Movie Frollo was a much-needed reminder of this. And I thank Disney for showing just how messed up he is without sugar-coating it. Schaff is free to believe that the play version is better, anyone is. I still rightfully stand by the movie version though.

[@samcochran8203]

@@himdevil2391 @Himdevil23 no rudeness put across, I totally do that sometimes with my whole giant text boxes, but as to why I put forth all the reasons behind Frollos villainy you had written before, I just felt the need to clarify a bit why I think he was aware of his faults, whereas you said he wasn't, or at least he was not totally admitant of how awful a person he was, I feel he was aware, he just justified it as his duty to be judge and punisher of those he deemed wicked in the ways of his belief. And for sure people are realistically despicable that way without reason nor care of changing, no offense taken at all. But as to why you think movie frollo is more villainous, I put forth one point that I'm gonna try to put across in a more understable way, I just want to see your take on it. Who would you deem as a more villainous person? Between 2 people, 1 is someone who was malicious cause their just an ahole to everyone no matter what, was already convinced they way of being ruthless is vindicated, and starts to go off the rails in a way that's not entirely out of character or out of turn for them. Number 2 is someone who genuinely wanted to do better at first, was antagonistic towards a lot of certain people because of their past trauma they associate with those people, who then slowly becomes worse and worse and just ends up not caring anymore, because they justify things and trick themselves into believing they are in the right, which ends up all culminating due to them secretly harboring a great and unreasonable hatred for the people they attribute their trauma to, trauma that other people cannot control nor be held reasonably responsible for. Who would you say is truly more villainous? Something I like to think about in reference to questions like this, who is more evil, the one who never could be bothered to be good, or the one who doesn't care about being good anymore?

[@himdevil2391]

@@samcochran8203 Well of course the one that didn't care in the first place. With no empathy for others, there's a lot of destruction that they leave in their paths. And you're just left questioning how lower they'll stoop and rooting for their downfall.

[@ChattinBoxingWYB]

Disney's most human and realistic villain! The fact that he's so complex and that world has had a history of highly misguided religious zealots. Is what makes Frollo relatable and terrifying.

[@LucarioBot]

And he’s based off of schindlers list’s depiction of Amon goeth who was a lot tamer than the real deal

[@user-qv2mc3dw5o]

‘Relatable’

[@ttry1152]

@@user-qv2mc3dw5o where u ever bullied as a child?

[@crypt5129]

relatable

[@marocat4749]

Yep, he is scary human

[@youronetruegodcthulhu5043]

If that's him "resisting her", I'd hate to see him NOT "resisting her".

[@JunieBug]

Holy cow, you're right-

[@yates3815]

That's just the animated version

[@bucketsoupe]

Your one true god Cthulhu oh, that’s that scene where he literally tries to rape her...yeah

[@heyheyheyheyheyhey76]

Talking about lust in a child's movie. That was one tough act from Disney. Frollo was a sexual predator. To be fair though nothing about the movie in general was for kids.

[@jeremysworld3061]

@@heyheyheyheyheyhey76 except the gargoyles

[@asingleleghair7628]

Fun fact: I went to a showing of this musical and Quasimodo's actor was actually deaf! He would sign the lyrics to songs while one of the gargoyles would sing for him. It was awesome

[@johnaustindelozier2056]

Bro was this in Seattle???

[@littlemisstfc]

It happened at a showing I watched years ago too! :D

[@Alchemy818.]

Thats awesome!

[@sunshinesolace3540]

That's amazing!

[@tonycommodore8929]

YES!!! They did that for the production in La Mirada. I saw both the La Jolla American Premier with Michael Arden(Director: Once On This Island) and Patrick Page(Hadestown) as Quasi and Frollo respectively. Both hugely talented and the show was great.. Then 2 years later in La Mirada, with a deaf actor speaking the role of Quasi and the lead gargoyle as his singing voice. It was spectacular and a far superior production. Moved me to tears multiple times, with the beauty of the way Quasi was portrayed. The later production also fixed the Chorus/Gargoyles narrative. I still MUCH prefer the Berlin staging, especially towards the end with Made of Stone going right into Someday and Finale Ultimo. But the La Mirada version was GORGEOUS! Thank you Cathy Rigby!! I still feel Disney Theatrical really missed the mark in NOT bringing this to Broadway with no money spared.

[@spimuru5040]

Holy shit the “this child is my cross to bear” part hit me. The sheer subtle shitheadery in that sentiment is staggeringly realistic. Just look at those certain religious mothers of autistic people, looking at their offspring as a burden that they are obliged to love rather than an actual person. Definitely one of the scariest real life sentiments expressed in a movie.

[@darkartsninja]

Honestly, that sentiment covers a lot of parents of disabled children not just autistic kids. Far too many of those parents see their children as a divine "punishment" or sin that they must carry with them. Even strangers fall into this trap. One of my favorite Tiktokers, @crutchesandspice, has cerebral palsy and she cannot remember the number of times random strangers said they'd "pray for her."

[@Icepiq72]

Frollo wasn’t “too evil” for the movie, he was just a lot more visibly evil. The hypocrisy and his self-righteousness is still there, but the movie made his evil intentions a lot more visible because it’s advertised to kids and also because they didn’t have the time to flesh out his character

[@tomnorton4277]

They did flesh out his character though. Even went as far as going into his psyche and his literal subconscious in the Hellfire scene. The cloaks chanting "mea culpa" were Frollo's subconscious trying to become conscious in order to get him to stop.

[@jadenk1409]

Frollo: *starts singing HELLFIRE* Notre dame cathedral: *sweats intensively*

[@CreeketsCreek]

Okay that was a good one xD

[@alicebydinger]

Too soon m8, too soon

[@jairoavila6092]

@@alicebydinger ur probs the same person who says it's too soon to make Holocaust jokes.

[@sky0kast0]

Holocaust ... Just can't be funny... Without reaching by calling it a Clown Holocaust

[@alicebydinger]

@@jairoavila6092 r/woooosh

[@pessoaanonima8435]

*Did I miss a character?* My strange brain: yes,the goat

[@theMRsome12]

It was in the original book? Does that help?

[@ColdNapalm42]

The goat was a major character in the book. No really.

[@Mark-ye2tn]

Djali!! Yes the goat was the main reason Esmeralda was put on trial for witchcraft because the people of medieval france couldn't understand teaching animals tricks.

[@pessoaanonima8435]

@@Mark-ye2tn :0

[@sethhowell3067]

Well I’m sorry to disappoint you, but there’s no goat in the musical

[@chrussublah4264]

the only thing I fundamentally disagree with is Frollo needing a reason to be racist. Having a neat little reason for the sake of narrative works great for fantasy media with fantasy races (think DnD) but doesn't really work for this story set mostly in real life. Sinti and Roma were historically hated all across europe for being "others". Like how certain racial and ethnic groups were and still are hated all across the world, for no personal reason beyond them being part of those groups. Most people in Nazi Germany didn't have a deeply personal reason to hate the Jewish population. The hate originated in stereotype and discrimination and culminated to a hatred that lead to violence and genocide. It was the same for Sinti and Roma people. So no I don't think Frollo needs a reason for the hatred that was commonplace among people of that time, because it kind of downplays the fact that people don't NEED reasons to be racist. Because there is no rime or reason, no logic to racism as a whole.

[@Aqueox]

"Most people in Nazi Germany didn't have a deeply personal reason to hate the jewish population " Seeing as Nazi Germany was a Christian nation, yes. Yes they did. It's called THOSE WHO KILLED CHRIST. THE SYNAGOGUE OF SATAN.

[@hannahlarocco4699]

What do you the nazis have to do with anything

[@Aqueox]

@@hannahlarocco4699 The guy is probably jewish and has a hate boner for anyone White and Christian. It's kinda their thing.

[@chrussublah4264]

@@hannahlarocco4699 it was an example of a racist group in history that hated people for purely racist/antisemitic reasons, to proof that Frollo having a personal reason for his racism is not necessary. It's a weird thing to try to give a bigot an actual personal and (arguably) understandable reason to hate an ethnic group/race, when that is almost never the case in history. It frames Bigots like Frollo as "Oh he's just a bad apple" when the bigotry against Romani people in Europe was a systematic issue, not a individual one

[@xdsmile5359]

Idk I guess genocide makes one famous

[@The_Jho]

Fun fact, they changed the golden rule in school, it’s now “treat others how they want to be treated” probably due to the jokes of “what if we want to be treated poorly?”

[@noattendance9801]

My school seems to be behind on that

[@snappishtemperament213]

School in general never really believed in that rule, either version. If any school I ever went to said it more than once ever or actually tried to hammer it into us at any point, the hypocrisy of it all would blind the staff.

[@allurajane4979]

that's stupid. what if THEY want to be treated badly

[@TurquoiseIcy]

Such a weak argument, people who treat people badly won't care if they want it or not. Thank God I am out of the education system.

[@MrJoeyWheeler]

So if people want to be treated like a king we should do so? That's actually worse.

[@Just_Some_Guy_with_a_Mustache]

Shout out to that guy who coughed through every scene of that musical.

[@thelittlemanfromthedraftbo6805]

Poor guy let him cough. I know the struggle of trying to retain a cough just to not be annoying

[@bluegloriousgames]

💜

[@dylanroot6401]

Atleast the actors probably didn't hear it, typically auditoriums and theatres are constructed to project sound outwards, not bring them into the stage

[@johnrebelet5754]

The KZbin wanderer.....

[@bleh1569]

@@thelittlemanfromthedraftbo6805 yup

[@prinplup121]

“Movie Frollo never T-poses!” *Shows only clip of movie Frollo T-posing*

[@yeethittter1285]

*Also shows footage of movie Frollo T-posing at the ground*

[@I.AlexiosLucullus]

@@yeethittter1285 yeah. Frollo is prostrating eg a sign of the penitent

[@luisalbertoarenasaraya4579]

Power of God is his strength.

[@zanemob1429]

*T-pose to assert dominance*

[@idkwhatimdoing5268]

It's more of a V pose

[@cheezemonkeyeater]

I *have* read the book. I'll clear up some things as I go. First, Quasimodo wasn't related to Frolo in the book. In the book, someone abandoned him as a baby on the steps of the cathedral and all of the nuns wanted to kill him, but Frolo took him in. This put a wedge between him and many other members of the clergy because they thought the child was a demon and Frolo had made a contract with it by taking it in. Frolo had this driving need to help people, even at risk to himself in the book, so this was in keeping with his character. He at one point even went so far as to risk infection during the Black Plague to help comfort and heal the sick - as much as they could heal for the time period, anyway. Frolo had no problem with gypsies in the book, as far as I recall, that was a change made in the book's first film adaptation that just kinda stuck. In the book, his real personality flaw was gynophobia. Not sexism, actual gynophobia - he was terrified of women and the idea of being with them. It was more than just religious fervor, because he would be actively combative with the nuns and other women that worked in and around the cathedral. His conflict with Esmeralda wasn't because she was a gypsy, but because she was a woman, but he used the fact that she was a gypsy and gypsies were disliked by the populace to stir up hostility towards her in the community. And it all was just because he happened to look out the window and see her and think, "oh, she's kinda hot." That thought created a kind of cognitive dissonance in him that he couldn't resolve and at first he just tried to drive her away, but when none of his attempts worked, he tried more aggressive strategies, getting more and more insane over time until he tries to kill her. His descent into madness is a huge tragedy in the book, because he ends up getting not just himself, but everyone he cares about killed as a part of his obsession. And it was all so needless. All he had to do was let it go, but he couldn't do it. "Frolo still has his 'a lesson needs to be learned' bit." Also different in the book. In the book, Frolo isn't even there. Quasimodo gets arrested by the police for trying to help Frolo kidnap Esmeralda, but when he sees the police coming, Frolo ditches Quasimodo and leaves him to take the blame alone, never going to see him on the pillory because he doesn't want to implicate himself. I can't remember if Frolo felt bad about this, or if he was too far gone at that point, because the novel is a bit non-linear with how it reveals Frolo's whole story and I can't remember the exact order of events. I think this might have been the moment that Frolo starts to go over the edge, though; letting his adoptive child take the fall for him is the first really serious thing he does (before it was just harassment) and I think that's what drives Frolo into the notion that he's damned himself and thus convinces himself that he deserves Esmeralda because - in his rationale - she tempted him into evil, so she owes it to him. Yeah, the book is pretty on point about the way men like him think about women. In the book, Esmeralda does claim sanctuary in the Cathedral, but not from Frolo. At least, not directly. She flees the police because they believe she murdered Pheobus, when it was actually Frolo who stabbed Phoebus and then framed her for the murder, hoping she'd get sent to prison and not be around town anymore. Phoebus, for the record doesn't die, but they still go after her for attempted murder. And that's the point where Frolo just straight up attempts to rape her and is stopped by Quasimodo. That's the final breaking point, because that's the moment where Frolo realizes he's jealous of Qausi and is like, "Welp, I'm a lost cause, might as well just go scorched Earth on everybody."

[@GigiBranconi]

Very interesting, thanks for the summary! But now I am grieving that there isn't a more book accurate adaptation out there. Some small changes could be made, there are some sensitive themes that most people would rather avoid and I get that. But boy, this sounds so much more complex and interesting

[@cheezemonkeyeater]

@@GigiBranconi He really is. I love the book. I read it usually once a year.

[@gariwald4946]

In the book, Frollo isn't a bad guy at the start, It's a gifted orphan sacrificing himself for his younger brother. He becomes corrupt through his obsession of Esmeralda.

[@duchi882]

_No Cathedral was burned in the making of this video_

[@ImmaLittlePip]

Now all of Paris is burning because of you Quasimodo Quasimodo: That was his mistake!

[@adanna8552]

Ooop

[@theguyintheworks8838]

*_*quickly hides torch behind back*_*

[@XanderVJ]

Too soon?

[@eliasapollo4131]

*victor hugo be crying in his grave*

[@humblememer2640]

Frollo: *t poses* Me: no wonder why he has God's word

[@feragosmyxixarashtra7948]

Amen,my child.

[@hazmat4938]

Hes just trying to be one with the cross

[@feragosmyxixarashtra7948]

@@hazmat4938 „Cross posing”

[@ezj8262]

God's word didn't create a Nicolaitan heirarchical structure, which Jesus said He hated. Even Peter never lorded himself over the flock, nor was he ever a pope. The counterfeit system, is that of demonism with a veneer of belonging to God. As satan desired, to be 'like' the most high. Satan copies the things of God, creating counterfeits, and redirects mankind's worship of God, onto himself. Even in the book of Revelation, his desire is to put himself in the third temple (which will be built in the end times) in Israel and declare himself to be God. But you're right, there are plenty of people who wield spiritual authority over people, but not in the truth. The book of Jeremiah speaks about this. Even the movie...the Book of Eli shows that wicked people can be aware that when people think they have some kind of special mediatorship between God and man, that they can become figures of great authority. We see this with the institution of the popes, and even Muhammad's supplanting of the Israeli religion, to put himself and his views in place of it.

[@brb.8962]

A M E N

[@jess15082]

I like how Frollos character in the musical offers an explanation for Quasimodo’s personality. One small thing that always irked me in the movie was how nice and kind and normal Quasimodo acted. Being raised by frollo who was neglectful and manipulative at best as well as being in constant isolation should have absolutely fudged him up. He shouldn’t have been able to hold a conversation, much less be a functioning member of society. With frollo actually being somewhat ‘nice’ in the musical, it makes a lot more sense in that regard.

[@monsterhanna6691]

Because it shows that he didn't see Frollo as a villain since he "saved" him, never really knew his mother who actually saved him, and just because you grow up in a toxic household--or Quasi's case, technically growing up in a toxic household--doesn't automatically mean that you'll turn out exactly the same way.

[@crypt5129]

@@monsterhanna6691 I mean, technically, but it's definitely more likely

[@orangeslash1667]

@@monsterhanna6691 Fun Fact: Disney confirmed that movies Frollo is based on Amon Goeth from Schindler's list!!!!

[@thatguy3968]

@@orangeslash1667 Göth

[@orangeslash1667]

@@thatguy3968 yes

[@pumpkinomom4446]

The choir was actually one of the main reasons why the show didn't make it to Broadway, because it cost too much money to pay so many actors and the creators didn't want to cut the choir out... So sad

[@JK8]

It would make no sense without the choir lol

[@springfaux6991]

The crowd will be the choir then

[@darkstrifequeen1458]

Except having been in the choir from the musical myself, we were kind of the narrators just giving a bit more atmosphere to the musical itself.

[@falkofscrum]

In Hugo's original book, Frollo is a good caring guy. It's not until Esmeralda arrives that he BEGINS to turn evil, and then is completely evil in the third act Edit: Thanks for the likes, guys :D

[@elf-lordsfriarofthemeadowl2039]

Lust and untamed obsession can lead a man to madness.

[@DemBigOlEyes]

@Krista Star Did you even read the books omg.

[@violets.1810]

@Krista Star No, he actually was a good human being in the book before Esmeralda popped up, but his delusions and lust drove him mad. It's not Esmeralda's fault, obviously, but it's what happened.

[@na.thalie.m]

While this is not WRONG it also def isn't RIGHT. He didn't become evil, he always was. He just acted on it because his racism and classism (and also sexism) gave him an excuse to act on his dark desires and disgusting fetishes.

[@DemBigOlEyes]

@@na.thalie.m Nope. Book clearly states that he was a pious man who adopted and raised Quasimodo out of pity, even taking the brunt of the townspeople who viewed him as a freak for taking in such a monstrosity as his son. Book also clearly notes how he slowly fell into his irrational and "evil" state only after he met Esmerelda and became lustful and jealous of Phoebus and later Quasimodo.

[@victoriakapusta1306]

"I jUsT wAnT sOmEoNe tO tAlK aBOuT mUsIcAlS wITh fOr 5 hOuRs" I'm honestly right here. don't make this harder than it needs to be

[@leadingblind1629]

Hi. Nice to meet you Talk Carrie and Shrek??? 😛 people hate me

[@xPrincessJellyfishx]

@@leadingblind1629 I looooove Carrie and Shrek

[@laurakemp9026]

Same. I'm willing to talk about musicals for as long as you want.

[@elisahatz]

Victoria Kapusta Can we talk about how you shouldn’t ship dead people? *cough* Hamillton *cough*

[@Lorcan_Caradoc]

I used to right like that not anymore though

[@seanticleer4915]

Frollo is very good in the beginning of the novel. He teaches the deaf Quasimodo sign language and has philosophical discussions with him. Throughout the book, he slowly succumbs to temptation and madness. It's a very sad novel.

[@fruzsimih7214]

Yeah, especially as it does not have a happy ending and Phoebus is evil, too.

[@easternlights3155]

Yeah, one of the few books that made me openly cry (along with Magister Kampanus and Quo Vadis)

[@tomnorton4277]

@@fruzsimih7214 Phoebus was just an outright villain. There's nothing redeemable about him in the book. The movie Phoebus is a completely different character who just has the same name and job description.

[@jpickens189]

People don't like Frollo because he is complex. They like him because he describes a very real, very twisted form of evil that they have probably seen in their own lives. Hellfire helps us understand how his evil functions, how we can put it into context in our own world, and how he contrasts with Quasimodo. For a 91-minute film, we really don't need to understand the depths of the character, and having him be so spectacularly evil helps the audience understand him better with less time. The ant scene, in particular, works at conveying how his religious convictions don't function out of love for others, but out of his understanding of power. He fears God, because God could squish him like an ant, and he thinks those below him ought to fear him, because he can do the same. It may not be a nuanced take, but it is a profoundly human characteristic that is conveyed in such a small moment.

[@Tarnished-bn5gq]

People don’t like more evil villains, because that’s the point.

[@jpickens189]

@@Tarnished-bn5gq What?

[@Tarnished-bn5gq]

@@jpickens189 the point is to not like them, even hate them.

[@jpickens189]

@@Tarnished-bn5gq I mean, there is a distinction between enjoying the aesthetics and effects of an awful person in a narrative and enjoying the experience of being around or being affected by such a person in real life. Also, people aren't morally straightforward, we don't just want heroes that represent the best virtues a person can have, we also want people who represent that which we hate, that which is weak about us, and that which we secretly kind of want to be but wouldn't because, you know, empathy and whatnot.

[@thecheck968]

Here's the scariest part though: both versions are just as believable.

[@literallygaston2489]

TheCheck7 I agree, but I think the film would benefit by showing at least one moment indicating that Frollo wasn’t always 100% evil, because nobody is at the start. Like idk, he hates gypsies because one killed his family or something. Or he was actually all about justice but then gradually lost himself and became an irredeemable mess.

[@charliesnark6535]

@@literallygaston2489 No, because some people are just evil. And you can't help it, maybe not from the start but nothing needs to happen for someone to be evil. Some just are

[@GayToBeHere]

@@literallygaston2489 But there's no need to have a gypsie kill his family, or it being justified. Hating gypsies was a product of his time. It would be ok to give him something that makes him less evil - like him caring a bit about quasi for example - but I really disagree with trying to tie his hate of gypsie to a backstory. Not every racist hates a certain group because they had a personal history with them.

[@miless.9429]

TheCheck7 Did you even watch the video or just wanted to post that

[@kestral63]

​@@miless.9429 The Alabama senate is 80% Frollos. Never mind convincing, we know entire herds of him exist.

[@aldensteur9107]

"my child, though your people are lost, there may be something in you that can be saved." did frollo just "you're one of the good ones" esmeralda?

[@whalesharko4465]

Yuuuuuuuuuup it would seem that way

[@Call-me-Al]

By the way, your profile picture is great

[@WobblesandBean]

Yup. That's exactly what he did.

[@WobblesandBean]

@@Call-me-Al Ha, I know right? Trans Wirt ftw 💜

[@nunabisness7191]

😬

[@barrelboople4301]

"Oooo! That's the golden rule!" I personally learned that from Twisted 😌

[@sophiehale1171]

Yeah twisted fan in the house

[@HD.418]

I would argue that Frollo in Disney is about as complex as a Disney character can get, given the other factors moving the plot forward, as well as creating and developing the other characters and their relationships. Frollo is straight out evil yes, but what makes him complex in the Disney film is that he twists the ideology of faith into justification of both his actions and hatred for gypsies and his additional desire to eradicate them. Hellfire is great in showing this complexity because not only is he fighting between his faith and belief (and hatred for Gypsies too) and the twisted lust he has for Esmeralda, but between what could be considered his ‘good’ and ‘evil’ consciousness. It is the sole reason for his struggle in that number, he knows what he feels is considered bad and the consequence for giving in to them will result worse for him, but his desire and use of twisted justification makes the argument that they deserves all that he is about to do to them, that *she* deserves it. So it makes for a very interesting character I think.

[@annareichert15]

I just thought I would point out that the "T-Pose" is supposed to be a parallel with the crucifixion. He obviously sees himself as pious and righteous, as well as the sinless one among the crowd. Every time he does something where you question his morals, he parallels the crucifixion with his body language. Just thought I would throw that out there.

[@mayhare8487]

Great observation

[@transendentemcorp]

T-pose on those sinners

[@skythelooker9208]

Yeah he just making a joke

[@Ballin4Vengeance]

Beata Maria. You know I am a righteous man.

[@rosemary_carll]

No, T-posing gets rid of the sin in any room

[@nyssarc146]

And honestly, frollos death in the play was iconic. Frollo: you don’t want to hurt me... All the gargoyles in unison: _yes you do_ Chills every time

[@bymeerabrowngothicroyal]

Nyssa R C it shows what a lifetime of abuse can do to people and also “I told you master I am very strong.”

[@demilad225]

And then comes the most chilling rendition of the main theme of the musical. It got to me without fail every time.

[@dogfur7808]

wait what does that mean

[@BowserTheSecond]

DAAAAAMNAAAAATIOOOOOON!

[@MsDannyNicole]

Okay but the lead up! shivered at “and the WICKED shall not GO UNPUNISHED” made me gasp

[@ferb1131]

Since this is from the same guy who wrote Les Miserables, it's not surprising that Frollo, like Javert, was written as the more relatable sort of antagonist who really wants to be the hero of the story but just falls short in some way, instead of just saying, "Hey guys, who's up for some evil?".

[@GigiBranconi]

Ahhh, Javert. Honestly feel bad for him.

[@lincolnlogsforleeches1422]

The musical frollo isn't less evil he's just easier to understand which makes it all the more scary and intense.

[@LucarioBot]

That’s because many don’t know that the movie version is based on a real person

[@minimaster197]

@@LucarioBot who?

[@LucarioBot]

@@minimaster197 Amon goeth

[@matthewstanley1521]

When Frollo said “You could stay here, with me” and reached his hand towards hers, my stomach dropped so fast I needed to catch my breath a little

[@dry-leaves]

I know right??!! Gosh it was so awkward oooOF

[@matthewstanley1521]

Rina It wasn’t really cause of awkwardness per se, more like it genuinely surprised, scared, and disgusted me to that extent.

[@masterspark9880]

I don’t think you’ve watched the movie then. He does much worse stuff than that

[@matthewstanley1521]

@@masterspark9880 I know he does. It’s just that he acted much more like a reasonable person in the musical at first. So the evil parts felt more shocking and real.

[@neontenebrae1918]

@@matthewstanley1521 Not to mention it is a very, VERY real and relatable situation to many, many people. That sort of luring into a false sense of comfort from someone preying on you is unfortunately something too many people experience, and the musical gets that feeling down to such a precise degree that it's HORRIFYING, honestly the cringe I felt watching that made me nearly turn the video off lmao

[@tastethepainbow]

The reason: He's the most realistic and human of all the Disney villains. Like, most of the villains are magicians, gods, and other fictional beings. There can be, however, real life corrupt religious zealots that have a lot of power. It's also, as I said, realistic, because THOSE TYPES OF PEOPLE ACTUALLY EXISTED AND STILL EXIST, with the Inquisition, the Salem Witch trails, ect. Frollo hits too close to home, to his lustful obsessions paralleling to church members of the past, and some even to this day.

[@MoskHotel]

“Oh, I should of known.”

[@tastethepainbow]

@@MoskHotel I should've know the world was wide enough for both Hamilton and m-- oh wait wrong musical.

[@ghostkai8713]

Soooo, what the musical version is, as this video very explicitly points out :V The Disney film version is a monstrous, cartoonishly so, rendition of these sorts of people. Not to say there isn’t people out there in the world who aren’t unironically as vicious and hateful and disgusting as the film rendition, but the musical version is the one closer to a tangible reality, a tangible uncomfort, and why the movie version is “too evil”. It plays that card too hard.

[@greenoftreeblackofblue6625]

What about the musical version?

[@tastethepainbow]

@@ghostkai8713 I made this comment before I finished the video.

[@cupcakedoce956]

I honestly liked the changes Disney did, they showed how some people use religion to a excuse of their acts, and also, Disney changed not only Frollo but a lot of others things like Quasimodo not being deaf, Esmeralda being pureblood gipsy (while in the book she was adopted by them) and the end. Both can be good, don't need to exist a "better than"

[@monsterhanna6691]

*gypsy

[@cantthinkofaname5046]

@@monsterhanna6691preferably Roma or Romani because g*psy is a slur

[@remithefrog350]

I totally agree. The most terrifying villains are the ones that mirror real-life abusers, especially subtle gaslighting that's hidden behind normal kindness.

[@jacobdurant5870]

In the movie version the Bells of Notre Dame says "Who is the monster and who is the man?" The musical says "What makes a monster, and what makes a man." I think that's the perfect example of the differences between the movie and musical.

[@aderose]

The “What makes a Monster and what makes a man?” Line is actually used in the reprise of Bells of Notre Dame.

[@stormyd1869]

What makes a movie and what makes a musical

[@nanax5424]

um yes and no? themovie uses both those lines in the first song in the movie and in the reprisal of the song at the end, the play uses the "what" rather than "who" so yes and no

[@darealslimshady702]

the reprise of bells at the end uses ‘what makes a monster and what make a man’ the intro to the movie is clopin telling a story to some kids, so he uses that ‘who is’ as some suspense for the story, coming full circle at the end to show the *real* message

[@majorknight859]

In both musicals "Who is the..." was used in the opening Bells of Notre Dame "What makes...." was used in the final song/reprise of Bells of Notre Dame

[@annabethdiana5857]

"I just want to find a girl I can talk to about musicals for 5 hours" BRUH LET'S GET MARRIED

[@rutemota6613]

Did he talked with you?

[@annabethdiana5857]

@@rutemota6613 no I wish 😭😭😭

[@rutemota6613]

@annabeth Dianna well that was his mistake

[@GhastlyG]

rute mota i hope that pun was intended

[@nevergonnagiveyouup1180]

@@rutemota6613 That was his steak

[@savanareherman654]

Schaffrillas Productions: *makes a Six reference* Me, a theater kid: Y E S

[@taylynhopkins]

I legit scrolled through all these comments to find someone mention this

[@cesaraguilar593]

Ahhh yes

[@xxshinanaevangelianxx]

You call it too evil, I call it a perfect chemistry of making a villain. He's a unique Disney villains because while other villains are aware that they themselves are evil, Frollo doesn't see himself as such and believes he's doing God's work. He's also the most lustful of the villains for lusting after Esmeralda. This I feel there will never be a villain like Frollo again. How Frollo was created from his personality to his design, made him 3 dimensional, which I can't say a lot about the Disney villains in the last 10 years. Some times most villains are more interesting than the protagonists.

[@evangelineperry7032]

I call it *demonic,* because of people like Frollo EXIST in real life, hate-inflecting churches, conservative christians too.

[@sebastianrodriguez3718]

Next video: Why Disney's Tamatoa is too shiny.

[@cgrn17]

Why Disney’s Tamatoa isn’t shiny enough

[@metaknight1410]

Adam Jensen That's impossible. He's perfect the shiny way he is!

[@Gloomdrake]

/420/ No. More. It’s not enough.

[@usernametaken4608]

No he's not shiny enough

[@davidpaul6290]

Next video: Why Arthur SHOULD eat lunch in this town again.

[@porsche6036]

Anyone: Twist Schafrillas: T H A T W A S H I S M I S T A K E

[@federalcasemaker]

Shrek: T H A T W A S M Y M I S T A K E

[@creepycrow31]

as soon as I read this comment, the "that was his mistake" at the end of the video played

[@anduril2132]

Lyra's Life What’s the time stamp?

[@noskhk2266]

1k likes my dude

[@laurendearnley9595]

Frollos a pretty complex character for a kids movie. He's religious, and many western children are raised in some kind of faith. He's a judge, an office we treat with inherent respect. He has a laudable goal, to make Paris a better place, but his means to achieve that are horrific. He's driven by lust against his better judgement and eventually gives in to this temptation, as many of us do, albeit without taking it to such extremes. Most Disney villains just want the vague goal of "more power" (Scar, Jafar, Ursula, Yzma), others want more clear cut but smaller goals (Evil Queen wants beauty, Gaston wants Belle, Cruella wants a coat) and the others are motivated by revenge (Hades, Maleficient, Hook). Frollo starts off hurting people because he thinks the means justify the ends in order to make Paris pure, and his own vices are what bring him down - Phoebus, Quasimodo and the rest of Paris would have let him keep on persecuting the gypsies if he hadn't gone after Esmeralda specifically and burned Paris to get her

[@zuzuomelete]

THIS!!! I mean, the movie is really just a reflection of the twisted mindset that fucked up (and still fucks up) a good chunk of the world.

[@iamtryingmybardest]

I gotta say, the opening scene with fro-yo murdering a woman ( and almost her baby ) TERRIFIED me as a child. it was scary seeing that caliber of violence straight off the bat and watching as the character who did it had no remorse. it kinda messed me up as a kid. Like damn disney chill with the whole "murdering an innocent person because theyre different" thing, youre gonna traumatize someone.... also the whole bit where fro yo was like "oH nOoO iM gOiNg To heLL iF i DrOwN ThiS bAbY" as if he wasnt going to hell for MURDERING AN INNOCENT WOMAN ( i understand that it was a cultural thing back then and he didnt necesarily view killing what he belived to be a satanic and evil being as a bad thing, he probably thought he was doing God's work at the time)

[@biggestastiest]

that's realistic too. irl pro-life religious zealots will murder a thousand women/let them be murdered but when a fetus is killed they start sharpening their pitchforks and lighting the torches

[@Aqueox]

How do we know said woman was innocent?

[@iamtryingmybardest]

@@Aqueox it was established that she was a gypsy and frollo thought she had stolen goods, but it was actually Quasimodo

[@blackheartzerotheundergrou3225]

If I remember right, Frollo was just as much in trouble for killing Quasi's mom, and raising Quasi in her place was meant to be how Frollo would atone for what he did. _and look how well that turned out...!_

[@turtlespeedrunner]

Yeah, frozen yogurt is a rather disturbing villain.

[@erebus7306]

5:48 Sometimes you don't need motivations. Back in Europe, Gypsies were widely disliked, you don't need to give specifics in your movie about why they were disliked because sometimes you don't need a reason and it works better in blind hatred.

[@mariaclaramoraes3074]

That's usually how it works in real life. But when telling a fictional story, I guess it works better if there are some explanations. Makes it more interesting and compelling to the audience.

[@jasonv2374]

It was probably an idea that was taught to him.

[@happyjohn354]

ya they were basically like the Jews at the time...

[@jolienvsndijk]

You really don't need to speak in past tense when talking about Europeans blindly hating 'gypsies'... (also; some people consider that a slur and prefer the name Romani)

[@justmike1201]

Funny how you said BACK in Europe gypsies WERE. Like Europe is still racist af. Unfortunately.

[@chaos9731]

Notre Dame: *burns down* Claude Frollo: _its free real estate_

[@milkcatdog394]

;-)

[@otakugurl4lyfe783]

Judge Claude... Not Count.

[@chaos9731]

Thanks for the grammar check

[@Historyfan476AD]

there redesign for it is horrible.

[@alexrexaros9837]

@@Historyfan476AD The mayor of Paris confirmed that it will be a perfect reconstitution. She despises "artists" who want to deform the Cathedral

[@TheDragiix3]

I'm late to the party but here some insights: Disney's Frollo is fantastic, but he is a different sort of person, he is a noble in the position refered to as "minister of justice" (not a real title) and hence a judge. The Frollo in the novel is the archdeacon of Notre Dame, he legit takes in Quasi as an abandoned infant and genuinely cares for him. This is where the real tragedy sets in. That child he put so much effort in suddenly becomes an enemy to him because he gets carried away by his lust for Esmeralda who is actually executed at the end. It's here that Frollo stands on the Notre Dame, laughing and giggling, and it's here where Quasi shoves him off the cathedral. I love the disney version, it's fantastic, but it's a different character.

[@TheHealerIzAwesome]

Patrick's performance of Hellfire is very intriguing. He performs as if his attraction and heartache are causing him physical pain. As if...there were an actual fire burning him from the inside. Movie Hellfire is great because, I think it's a representation of his insanity. They're both good performances but I think it depends on what you look for in a villain.

[@kirikakirikakirika]

To be fair, the Disney movie _does_ explain why he hates gypsies so much. At the beginning he says they're heathens, meaning they aren't Catholic-born, and indeed many of them weren't. Many of them _didn't_ believe in God, or at least not the Catholic God, and as we all know, that's more than enough to fuel someone's hatred in the Dark Ages. Then later, during the scene with the ants, he explains that they're an "infestation", meaning immegrants. He says they're filthy and destroy France. In other words, Frollo was hugely anti-immigration. And when it comes to Esmeralda, his hatred for her is mired in confusion because he feels an intense sexual desire for her, which he's been raised (via his religion) to believe is a sin. The ultimate sexual frustration. The boner that burned down all of Paris.

[@pixelman6193]

The bonus that tip the candle that burns down Paris

[@samkuperman9035]

Yeah, that’s what I was thinking. Loved this video overall, but it did irk me a little how he simplified movie Frollo a bit too much

[@ianmaluk1]

Remember though, this is the Medieval Age, our modern beliefs and opinions are biased when they are done through the lens of hindsight. From their perspective, this would rightly be viewed as an invasion.

[@internetuser528]

kirikakirikakirika he hates gypsies cuz he needs that bread man.

[@nitehunter91]

@@Deatheater4444 Please present your historical references before spilling such accusations towards an ethnicity.

[@poweroffriendship2.0]

*_After the Notre Dame Cathedral fire incident, I will never watch Hunchback Of Notre Dame the same way ever again._*

[@poopityscoop839]

Same, I couldn’t stop thinking about it when I was watching it with my friends.

[@johnnyelettrico9087]

Mr. Friendship your name doesn’t match your profile pic

[@snaketooth0943]

@@johnnyelettrico9087 Good point! He should change it to one of the all time bromances or whatever you call a female friendship!

[@inthecloudz1272]

Why not

[@snaketooth0943]

@@inthecloudz1272 Why doesn't the name match the profile pic? Because the pic is of a man being tortured, which has nothing to do with friendship. His pic should be a picture of friendship and/or happiness.

[@MissCaraMint]

It brings to light something I've been saying for years. The most terrifying thing about Slavery, the Holocaust, and any other atrocities you can think of, isn't the fact that they were committed by monsters, it's that they weren't. They were committed by normal people. Any one of us in a similar position could do the same. And that is the most terrifying think I can possibly imagine.

[@Tarnished-bn5gq]

Claude Frollo was based on Amon Goeth btw.

[@MissCaraMint]

​@@Tarnished-bn5gq I never knew that, but it makes a lot of sense looking at them side by side. Obviously the book was written before Amon Goeth was alive, but the characterisation of Frollo in the Disney movie was made in the 90s where WWII would be one of the closest real world examples to turn to to flesh out that kind of a character. A time where ordinary people did horrible things.

[@HydraSpectre1138]

Disney should adapt The Hunchback of Notre Dame stage musical into a film to serve as its live action remake. Disney isn't afraid to go PG-13 for their remakes, judging from Mulan, so a high budget adaptation of the stage musical into a film would be amazing.

[@irongirltoni]

I think they should just put it on Broadway

[@silashurd3597]

Seeing a version where this film is PG-13 would be very Fascinating too see!

[@user-ln2xu3xp9o]

"how many times does movie frolo t-pose? 0" *shows frolo t-posing on the ground*

[@pringleboi8768]

that's a Y pose

[@alexisflores6678]

You fool ,,,, hes praising the sun!

[@team4star1]

I now will imagine the song hellfire when i praise the sun in dark souls

[@Red-jl1qr]

I'm offended by you calling that a t pose

[@kyleninjaninja]

Trying to T-pose hell

[@returnedtomonkey8886]

So. Movie Frollo: true demon from the start Musical Frollo: human that turns into demon

[@despinasgarden.4100]

Pretty munch yes

[@Ilma1984]

Novel Frollo: a very complex, torn human

[@kodiibearv]

I performed this show in a youth theatre program when I was about 15, I was a gargoyle. I was only in the ensemble, but Hunchback truly was the transition from campy school-play acting into genuine, theatrical acting. The score stretched my range like taffy, and the gargoyle robes were ungodly hot, but I don't know what I wouldn't give to go back and do that performance all over again. I'm glad this show is gaining traction among theatre fans, because by God it deserves it. (Seriously, this musical has the greatest, most chill-inducing entr'acte you will ever hear.)

[@KaiTenSatsuma]

Look man, when you have Tony Jay on voices, you *_make use of Tony Jay being on voices_* Also you have to take into account that it's also a story being told by Clopin to children, who you could consider to be an unreliable narrator *at best*

[@LordBummenbachsBalls]

So bloody true.

[@brandonhey7797]

V E R Y unreliable

[@KR1MSEL]

I like the idea of Frollo. He's a character that shows that just because you believe in a God, doesn't mean you can't be a horrible person. His character shows how religious people will try to be good and act good because they're scared of where they're going after death (Heaven or Hell in a Christian sense), more-so then actually wanting to be a genuinely good person just out of human nature.

[@karmoka11]

I guess you are talking about movie Frollo? Book Frollo straight up didnt care after a while. At one point he tells Esmeralda "L'enfer ou tu iras, j'irai aussi. Et ce sera mon paradis" (the hell you'll go to, I shall go too. And this will be my paradise) He knows he's doing very naughty things, but he's horny af. He wants to be good, but if she's forcing him to be a bad guy (by being pretty and existing), he'll be the bad guy. Also book 35yo Frollo frames 16yo Esmeralda for assault on an officer and then, when she's about to be executed tells her "c'est moi ou la potence" (it's me or the gallows). So, you know, exemplary citizen.

[@annie3180]

I think this is pretty generalizing. It's not just the fear of eternal damnation that is the cause of decent human behavior, religious or not. What I believe to be the connection between frollo and religion is how he justifies his actions, as a fight against devil (esmeralda) Frollo's vile nature also stems from the abuse of power, whether he is a judge or a priest.

[@shadow_shine3578]

My favorite part of the movie is how the two frollo and (is it esmerelda?) Contrast. Her song about religion including someone like her Contrasts the frollo song. He represents the fanatic and hateful follower, she is the gentile hoping for saving and not rejecting the religion simply because of how she is treated by a member in it. I love that song

[@asianpotatoesbeangry571]

Bro ur username is bomb

[@maliamoh3784]

AsianPotatoes BeAngry now about mine 👹👹👹

[@jacobmclemore1901]

Hades in the real religion is a good guy with a dog name spot no I'm serious

[@dropkicksofthemurphys9696]

Out of the Olympians, he's arguably one of the best in terms of morals. While others are unfaithful, war starting, mortal-smiting, maiden-raping monsters... He only harmed heroes when they specifically broke rules he informed them of. In some versions of his story, Persephone was in on him planning to marry her. Cerberus means spotted, and the name he used for Persephone means honey. Guys. His dog's name is Spot and he calls his wife Honey. Can we please agree to stop considering him to be a villain?

[@JutlandAngel]

I've been so conflicted when it comes to Disney's Hades ever since I found out about this. He's my favorite Disney Villain character wise, but originally he was a sweetheart. I get that Disney has the Death=evil and evil should be evil for evil's sake, but couldn't they just use a titan as I'm well aware that they wouldn't Hera.

[@oliviaallred8077]

I was so confused how we got talking about hadestown but understood a bit bc, ya know, patrick page, but actually i’m an idiot and completely forgot that he talked about hades from hercules 🤦‍♀️

[@jennifernaddell7222]

Kerberos can also be translated as fluffy

[@awkwardukulele6077]

Hades honestly has my vote for ‘Olympian most likely to double-tie his sneakers’

[@unisquirrel63]

In my high school, I worked backstage for the hunchback. And while listening to it about a hundred times, a theory started to bounce around in my head. What if the entire play was done inside Quasimodo's mind because he had wanted to go outside his entire life. The reason I thought of this is because of how the Quasimodo's first and last scenes were done exactly the same with gargoyles surrounding him, but the only difference was that Esmeralda's body was lying on the ground in the end. I don't know if this was done differently for other showing for other organizations, but this video kinda sparked my love for musical theatre again.

[@hydeo8154]

im opening next friday and for us there having us run off stage and change into normal cloths and come out to sing somday reprise, our directior is trying to show how a better somday is not now witch I think is neat

[@chompythebeast]

@@hydeo8154 Take that passion you use on stage and put it to praxis in the streets, friend. We only make the world better by tearing down the things that make it worse. It'll get harder before it gets better, and _we're_ the ones who need to be making it harder for the bastards

[@addyendss737]

Playing a gargoyle was hell on my knees

[@eyezodiotic3197]

"I guess we'll have to give that distinction to a villain with no flaws" Farqua-- "--tAMATOA BABEYY"

[@michaelboydston313]

90th like

[@gard3boi311]

610th likw

[@gustusjs9556]

700th like

[@kilmgx8565]

886th like

[@senpaithehandsomelad7732]

Farquad and Tamatoa

[@PriorP92]

Claude Frollo was much more sympathetic in the book compared to both the movie and the play as he took to Quasimodo with altruistic motivations. We see his struggle with his unruly brother, who constantly asked Frollo for money. In the novel, Frollo found Quasi in a window display in an orphanage and adopted him out of pure empathy, not because he was related to him. He went on to teach him sign language when Notre Dame's bell's ruined Quasi's hearing. But he had this irrational fear of women, which led him to resent/hate Esmerelda while at the same time harbor this obsession with her. This led to his inevitable, violent downfall. He's such a good, Icarus-like villain. I've loved him since the movie and even more so after I read the book years ago. I'm so glad you discovered this version of him!

[@xiaomusmash1494]

PriorP92 well put choice of words

[@DecimusYna]

Nice comment!

[@edgey_rouges7498]

wow youve read the book?

[@alicealoi4951]

@@edgey_rouges7498 you should read it too, it's a good book

[@edgey_rouges7498]

@@alicealoi4951 uhhhhh.... doesnt it end with the hunchback (idk how to spell his name) dying on Esmeralda's grave?

[@erenjoypagdilao537]

A couple years back, Seattle's 5th Avenue theater, had done a production on Hunchback of Notre Dame. And they casted a deaf Quasimodo who did sign language acting, and a voice for him dressed as one of the gargoyles. You can find videos of it. Its amazing 👏

[@MissCaraMint]

That's actually super clever. Quasimodo was deaf in the original novel after all.

[@tysondennis1016]

"Who is the monster, and who is the man?" At first glance, Quasimodo is the monster and Frollo is the man. But once you've watched the film, it's clear that Frollo is the monster and Quasimodo is the man. A lot of people seem okay at first, but turn out to be horrifying abominations.

[@asuspiciousavocado3317]

**Proceeds to talk to someone for 5 hours.** **Doesn't even remember her name.** This is why we love you, please never change.

[@idoesnothing9618]

why are you suspicious

[@idoesnothing9618]

​@@asuspiciousavocado3317 it's in your name

[@idoesnothing9618]

@@asuspiciousavocado3317 Thanks

[@carmenishere]

Absolute Chad 😆

[@lollmemmSm0keweed]

Are you that tinder girl?

[@Directionless.Sponge]

Movie Frollo: sinful perv Theatre Frollo: Nice Guy(TM)

[@bbdc1252]

Movie frollo: fictional preist Musical frollo: real priest

[@mckenzie.latham91]

@@bbdc1252 LOL the animated frollo is more real and true to the dark side of human nature...especially set in the medieval era where being different or disfigured often got you tortured and or killed... Hell people in those times used to believe that people born with disfigurements were cursed by god or as a result of some great sin by the parents...which made the child unclean. Personally i like both versions, but too pretend like one is a caricature is wishful thinking.

[@TheRojo387]

@@bbdc1252 Movie Frollo wasn't even a priest; he was a corrupt judge!

[@gaearsonist6820]

@@TheRojo387 I heard from peeps that they just made him a judge bcuz disney didn't want beef with the church

[@TheRojo387]

@@gaearsonist6820 Cowards.

[@cervitaurwitch]

My high school did this musical a few years ago in my senior year and I wasn’t part of it directly but I was an usher so I got to watch all the shows for free after getting everyone to their seats A bunch of my friends were in it which was fun One of my best friends at the time was Frollo and he was really good in that role They had a lot of really cool set pieces that the main version didn’t have It’s definitely my favorite musical to watch and the songs all slap

[@sarcardinal]

i think that the musical really capitalizes on the line “what makes a monster and what makes a man?” and i LOVE it! it really captures the main idea of the book. i’m so glad someone is talking about this musical, it’s one of my absolute favorites and it doesn’t get enough credit!

[@milchesarreal6964]

Frollo was really an amazing villain, both appearance and personality-wise Reminds me of what my Mom told me once, "The Devil does not appear as a scary abomination, It appears as a tempting drink of water." Basically the Devil does not look scary, the Devil sugar coats things. Literally taking form of what we view as a good figure Hence Frollo's character overall. "Some of the worst things imaginable have been done with the best intentions." - Dr Alan Grant, Jurassic Park III

[@notapplicable6985]

For me I like it since most people tend to rationalize their actions. Even if it is clearly hurting people.

[@mksabourinable]

My mom expressed similar to me growing up, as well as "the road to hell is paved with good intentions." Look at your impacts not your intentions. Bc it doesn't matter what your intentions were if your impacts are horrible.

[@flowerhead8134]

Very nicely expressed, well done , dude

[@dawdeuce250]

Actual quote, "some of the worst things imaginable have been done with the best intentions."

[@milchesarreal6964]

@@dawdeuce250 That's the one! Thankssss

[@leticiamonteiro8418]

I didn't watch the musical, but I've read the book. Man, you'd be surprised. The book kinda makes you feel pity of Frollo. For example, Quasimodo isn't his nephew, just a poor baby left in the front of Notre Dame by his family, that didn't want him -- and while people passed by and laughed at him for being ugly, Frollo was the only one who saw that baby as an human being. So, Frollo genuinely cares for Quasimodo (more than Esmeralda does). He is really religious and try to be humble and good. But everything changes when he meets Esmeralda, so slowly he becomes this mad monster. You can almost believe him when he says she is the Devil trying to seduce him -- of course, Victor Hugo makes a much more complex story than that, and we can see that's not Esmeralda's fault, but we can really feel Frollo's pain in throwing his life and his values away for his mad "desire" for a girl.

[@Regalecus_glesne]

There’s also a parallel with Frollo to Quasimodo. In the book, they’re BOTH outcasts. Over the years Frollow becomes more obsessed with alchemy, and, while still well respected, people fear and avoid him, much like they do with the hunchback. He becomes more isolated and twisted over the years.

[@grannyheather5137]

Something that I love about the stage musical’s version of Hellfire is that I genuinely did not know how it would end. The actor who played Frollo did an AMAZING job convincing the audience of his character’s fear of God’s judgement. During the song, he continually begs God to take Esmeralda away from not, not out of evil hatred of her, but out of genuine fear of temptation. This terrified me because as a Christian myself, I have prayed not-so-different prayers 😅 I have asked God to take temptations away from me (mostly argumentative people and cavity-inducing candies, not sexy women lol). It is only at the end of the song when stage Frollo finally crosses the line to evil: “or else let her be mine and mine alone” “she will be mine or she will burn”. In Hellfire ALONE, he goes through about four stages of character development. That is top notch writing!

[@artemiswinchester6151]

Movie Frollo was amazing. It was dark and 0-100 very fast, but he also perfectly incapsules the fact that sometimes those who claim to be the most holy are actually the most evil. He was firm in his belief that he was right so much so that it is terrifying, especially as this is a trait that has existed in the world before.

[@MetallicaFan657]

I understand why people like the more "human/relateable/sympathetic" villain. But my favorite villains will always be "I'm bad and I love it!" villains. Why? because they're simply more fun. I wish Disney would bring these villains back. We need a mix of both.

[@split776]

Also, in Frollo's case, there's really no need of complexity. Why does he hate the gypsies? Because it's 15th century France and EVERYONE hates gypsies. Why is he creepy and lust-y from the get-go? Because he wants to, and it doesn't seem like anybody's got a problem with it. I mean, I enjoy the whole "see from the other's perspective" thing in fiction, but sometimes you just don't need it. Some people are truly evil for no reason, they don't see a problem with the way they are and nothing can change them. Making them sympathetic antagonists makes them worse - less scary, less thought-provoking, and yes, less fun to watch

[@thecinematicmind]

Ronit Baraz In the movie, he believes everything he is doing is what God what wants him.

[@kali4002]

@@split776 In my opinion it's much scarier for Frollo to be more sympathetic though, especially since the disney version made him less complex than the original. Frollo was originally intended to be complex, they didn't just change it for this musical. I think the character is more fun to watch because the war within himself between his godly duty and his earthly desires is more prominent.

[@erinwolfchild4437]

All I have to say is; Hades is best villain and will always be first gay friend

[@Icheasea_T]

MetallicaFan657 plus with these modern tragic villains , they send a message that “no one is truly bad” and “evil doesn’t actually exist” witch is a dangerous outlook on life

[@DarkSol16]

Wait.... You mean I *can't* trust everyone who T-poses for me?

[@avibenhaim3905]

b r u h

[@Junaetzia]

You foolish mortal. They have already asserted their dominance over you and you aren't even aware of it!

[@yeethittter1285]

☺ T

[@hatcellucard599]

Bruh

[@hierstehtkeinname7092]

T

[@d1egomon194]

“They made him scarier by making him human” Me who wants to write a story with an iconic villain: noted

[@kylum902]

Huh, I always thought Disney's Frollo was loved Because he was pure evil (like Maleficent, The White Queen or the Evil Stepmother), not because people viewed him as complex. Maybe that was just me.

[@pyroshayniac1090]

Nah, I think you're right. People love a ballsy, edgy villain. And this guy is the baddest of them all.

[@celestiacrystal9317]

Oh, he was a complex character, I mean to me he’s the most real Disney villain there is... There were people in middle ages just like him and they weren’t deemed the villains at the time and that’s the dark part, that it was real....

[@despinasgarden.4100]

@@celestiacrystal9317 very true, he maybe don't be a character as complex as the musical or book. But he's indeed one of the most realistics and complex villain in Disney.

[@creepycrow31]

I like Maleficent from the movie Maleficent more than the original

[@fireofdawn3515]

Lyra's Life same here- I enjoyed her having a past and motive and actually ending up a good person. (I haven’t seen the second one so don’t @ me)

[@andreeaalbu6406]

fun fact: the lyrics in hell fire represent what a rapist would say to "excuse" him/herself

[@fruitysoupy]

Can confirm, it reminds me a lot of what my abuser said to the police during questioning

[@anjolaxo3875]

@@fruitysoupy I hope you find healing 🙏🏾

[@fruitysoupy]

@@anjolaxo3875 thanks I've been in therapy ever since and things are starting to improve I'm able to walk past older men now without panicking

[@STAROCiDE]

@@fruitysoupy it's good that you feel well now!

[@flickcentergaming680]

@@fruitysoupy sending you love, friend.

[@dulce_dragonesa2966]

I know this is three years old, but this made me very happy. I performed in the Hunchback musical two years ago, and it was such a blast to play in. Its definitely one of my favorite musicals, as i prefer the darker and deeper tone to the need to be bright in most musicals. I love stuff like Legally Blonde, dont get me wrong. But this was just a whole other experience

[@technicolour7619]

Frollo used to terrify me as a kid. Now as an adult he still terrifies me. He's so real. Knowing what I know of humanity like this story could have happened. A person in power with a penchant for getting his way by any means necessary... It sounds like real life. AND I DON'T LIKE IT!

[@Tarnished-bn5gq]

You aren’t supposed to like it, any in particular, you aren’t supposed to like him. He’s intentionally based on Amon Goeth, you know, one of the highest ranking members of the SS.

[@ashenone3883]

You never can have a character too evil as long as they are written properly.

[@khamulthewack4732]

And so long as they have the voice of a fallen angel.

[@kennn1910]

THats His MIstAAKE

[@ashenone3883]

NowUCMe He is a flawed character and because of that, A bad villian

[@humblememer2640]

Me: *scowls at Hans, Professor Kalahan, and Mayor Bellewether*

[@LordJagd]

Who’s the most evil character but well-written that you’ve come across?

[@Sabaism]

Hell fire is the greatest villain song ever fight me

[@theregularterrarian3933]

tyler Barrett I agree

[@vylbird8014]

A bit of trivia: When Frollo is insisting "It's not my fault!" the hooded chorus reply. In medieval latin. It translates to "It is my fault. It is my fault. It is my most severe fault."

[@Loopimay]

I mean, "Be Prepared" is also a huge jam

[@quillheart0331]

At the risk of getting slapped but...Epiphany?

[@Mastermint]

@@vylbird8014 the whole song had a chorus singing a prayer in latin and greek. it begins with a contrast, because he starts the song praising himself while the chorus confesses sins to god, mary and the saints. they sing Kyrie eleison while Frollo sings "God have merci on her/on me". beautiful and haunting. best damn song ever

[@AlanaKelsey]

Your commentary of this musical is really insightful, I appreciated that you contrasted it with the Disney movie. This is also my favorite musical, so good!

[@andyvug4evur]

It only took that second of "Get down" for me to have it stuck on my head, i would really like Schafrillas to make a video about Six (8

[@adamswift5555]

Musical: Good backstory. Movie: KILLS MOTHER, TRIES TO DROWN BABY, AND IMPRISONS 3 MEN?!

[@thelittlemanfromthedraftbo6805]

Almost burns a family and kills Esmeralda, Quasimodo and Phoebus

[@woohboywooh2263]

Also commits tax fraud in Israel through 2003-2006

[@Egghead012]

Pff, you think frollo is a villain, Meet Yuki Terumi, He's sadistic, brutal, and drowns you in despair.

[@Egghead012]

@Siper no, disney villains pale in comparison to how sadistic terumi is

[@yeethittter1285]

@@Egghead012 get outta here with your anime