Why Final Fantasy Versus XIII's Story Was Scrapped

Today, we look at the mystery of Final Fantasy Versus XIII's Story being completely rewritten for XV and how it likely came about.
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#FinalFantasy #FinalFantasyXV #FFXV

[@voicesbymic5346]

I will never get over the possibility of what XV could have been

[@megaham1552]

I doubt it would have been that good tbh

[@Crocogator]

Dragoon Luna, Grandpa Noctis and Redeemed Ardyn killing God would have been a nice conclusion. Totally in tone with the wild last bosses of most FFs. Instead we got a book? :(

[@kevinvu5432]

@@megaham1552 would've been better than what we got

[@Gxmwp]

@@megaham1552 I agree considering how Kingdom Hearts has been for thr last few years, but I'd like to think we would have at least gotten a complete game with a satisfying enough ending

[@RaeBordz27]

@@megaham1552 nah ur just toxic

[@Mezzy]

I would love to see Nomura create something where he's allowed to run wild with his ideas. Where he doesn't have to hold himself back because of a company's rules. Kingdom Hearts is too limited because of Disney and FF7 Remake is an already established story. I would love to see what Nomura can do when he's not shackled.

[@Evergladez]

I'd agree if he could get it out in a reasonably amount of time.

[@thessk_2870]

Verum Rex is our hope

[@HadeaRin]

Only after he is done with either FF7R or whatever continuation he planned for KH. He can only do 2 big project max or else he'll start spewing dark joke.

[@XanderVJ]

We know what would happen: the whole project would go down due to over ambition. I think Nomura can do great things, but he NEEDS someone to keep him on very short leash.

[@ShiyoukaHalphas]

Yep. Just like Hideo Kojima. Maybe Sony can do the same with Nomura

[@agravain9006]

I spent so many years of my life waiting for a dream, and now...thats where it will exist with me.

[@OmegaKatanaXIII]

At least make the elements into other problems.

[@amandeepsharma9874]

Damn /:

[@y2kjetters317]

Emiya Shirou theres still hope w verum rex

[@eddystubes]

KH 3 indeed

[@redboytokyo]

I want my dark final fantasy game :(

[@shunalicekazami]

seeing stella in the thumbnail made me miss her sm 😭

[@melancholycollie1466]

I see her but I'll never know her in depth and that's gonna bug me for life 😔

[@sebastienc.2257]

You can’t miss something you’ve never experienced. That’s anxiety.

[@leaneverland5551]

SAME !

[@jordanharrelson8500]

Almost 3 years later and it still stings. What I wouldn't pay to see a reboot of versus with Stella. All I can do is pray that somehow Verum Rex is a loose tie to that and the KH3 DLC will provide some answers.

[@Angel_alanis]

You still waiting for Verum Rex?

[@SS3Jake.]

This just makes me appreciate the newest South Park episodes bashing the way China ruins our/everyone's media even more.

[@mrbabluep]

How about it's greedy developers? I doubt China was so thirsty for the game, SE wanted more money - that's why THEY decided to change it (if it's valid at all anyway)

[@firasbajjar]

popo It is both. Greedy game developers and stupid dictatorship in china.

[@megaham1552]

@@firasbajjar Tabata wanted to make the changes his way, it didn't really have much to do with China

[@akiraasmr3002]

@@firasbajjar You people hate China so much but dont complain about the evil US who has done worse to other countries. China doesnt have an evil dictatorship you guys believe US government propaganda when it comes to China but other things you say you dont.

[@KokoLockhart]

If there's anything I want in my life, is for Versus XIII to see the light of the day. It's weird, I just CAN'T get over the fact with what it could've been as I've been following the project since 2006. It just held this mystery and this potential badass epic dark story behind Nomura's lead. I feel like if it wasn't a mainline Final Fantasy title, Square wouldn't have tried to push the Chinese market as much and I'm really disappointed that they had to scrap so many awesome ideas just to please the rules in the country.

[@ZeranZeran]

The older trailer looks so much better, it's like a movie. The facial expressions are amazing. There's an english dub on youtube that's really good!

[@hnfiiinc5993]

It is our common wish, brethren.

[@hnfiiinc5993]

@@ZeranZeranit’s almost 2023. I’m almost double my age and went through so much good/bad. Unspeakable, inexplicable things. Even after Hell and back, Nomura’s trailer gives me chills. It’s creative, artistic, and downright beautiful. We were robbed. Robbed of art not made manifest.

[@ZeranZeran]

@@hnfiiinc5993 It's nice to know I'm not the only one who feels this way. Nomura was robbed too. I honestly have hope in him to bypass any legalities. I think he's going to surprise people still, in a big and creative way. He seems like he's been planning something for a long time.

[@angelreaper1000]

yes pls let there be a versus XIII

[@TheJozzi]

I will never get over Versus, I want square to make it reality, even if it's a different project in the future.

[@fattiger6957]

It would be nice to see the Versus XIII story in at least manga or novel form.

[@springstar4793]

Exactly my thoughts

[@NutBuster99]

wud be shit anyways

[@Megan-nr7xe]

@@NutBuster99 ooo so edgy

[@danschultz999]

Something tells me Nomura isn't going to die without releasing his true story. I hope it's written in his will 😂

[@bowzofoshu6695]

I wish they'd release a book with the original story and concept arts

[@harrue]

It won't sell in China, so it will never be made.

[@exileforever2508]

Dane L why?

[@harrue]

@@exileforever2508 Because Chai-NA is bending everyone over

[@springstar4793]

Seriously. Or just make a novel or something. A manhwa would be great

[@Megan-nr7xe]

@@harrue a novel being sold to a different market could work but it probably wouldn't make enough profit for them to see it as a viable business venture

[@Crocogator]

"We couldn't do death." Oh. Here it comes. The government scared of a skull.

[@Darth_Bateman]

Didnt winnie the pooh just threaten to turn bones into dust?

[@petercampi2840]

@@Darth_Bateman He did. When the protests started up in Honk Kong he was quoted saying "Oh bother!"

[@ZhangtheGreat]

It's not the government being scared of a skull. It's what skeletons represent within some Chinese superstitions. Fair or not, there are still lots of Chinese consumers that base their purchasing decisions on superstitious premonitions, and companies have to take that into consideration when marketing.

[@ZhangtheGreat]

@Lord of the memes98 Hard to change something that's been around for centuries, if not millenniums. The last Chinese president actively urged citizens to follow science and avoid superstition, but that's easier said than done, and marketing has to consider that when trying to sell.

[@willazeppeli]

only to Chinese Communist Party regime

[@kingisking3445]

What can I say? Versus XIII was my most wanted! I have never been this excited to play a game. Even to this day it's so hard... knowing it didn't come out. It's really sad. I'm still watching the Versus XIII Trailers. I'm just so addicted to it. Maybe one day... we may see the reawakening of Versus XIII. The figure that still lies asleep in the fantasy.

[@jeffreyali3644]

Good news, kh looks to revive ff vs 13

[@shaira9984]

We will definitely keep on waiting...

[@RobinsMusic]

@@jeffreyali3644 oof

[@jeffreyali3644]

@@RobinsMusic The DLC makes it more obvious

[@danschultz999]

Just from what I saw, it's the only RPG I've ever had any real interest in, I really enjoyed what XIII brought to the table too. But this was the game we all needed... Rip Stella.

[@RulerOfYore]

You know as much as I love XV I still want to see what V-XIII Had to offer maybe we’ll get something outta Verum Rex if that ever becomes a thing one can only hope.

[@ooynd7099]

Same

[@gracekim25]

World Of Versus yeah

[@RikuHino]

Artistic integrity, Creative vision who cares I need that sweet sweet green money

[@daydreamerjohn8101]

Isn't it the best! The absolutely ideal way to motivate designers to scrap actual quality content and to boot halve your portions by calling part of the game DLC

[@TheRayny]

sadly there's a balance to that. Companies always make arm races against each other to compete, and if there is a well of untapped money ( and one as big as china ) they are extremely compelled to pull from it. This isn't even for profits, but rather for sheer economical value ( that is the sum of both liquidity and assets ). It's a mess.

[@sammybh7788]

I’m questioning the wisdom of marketing to repressive nations like China.

[@MrDracoSpirit]

There love of cenorship stoping intresting idea get out. It's effecting films too. :(

[@fusiontoa18]

Its so hilariously ironic especially on movies containing sjw crap yet cater to chinaaaa

[@vaiyt]

Capitalism doesn't care about democracy, human rights or free speech

[@littlekitsune1]

There's no wisdom in it. Only money.

[@SeraphCircle]

@@HuyVu-lx1mf China is communist only in name.

[@asdaz0r]

The truth is that these are just changes to certain concepts that could have easily been censored or switched out to something different but close enough for the story to make sense. The actual reason VsXIII's story was scrapped is because Tabata just wanted to make a different game and not Versus XIII. Tabata himself said that when he first took over, he wanted to make XV a multiplayer co op game, where you would go through the story online with 3 other friends for a party of 4. An idea that was scrapped and later re-emerged in the form of Comrades. XV and Versus have vastly different stories so it's not like China was the only reason for removing stuff, cause they didn't simply "remove" concepts and themes, they completely rewrote the entire story and kept the bare minimum from Versus for marketing reasons (confirmed by both the 2016 leaker and Tabata himself). For one, the characters are entirely different people, interviews with both Tabata and Noctis JP VA have confirmed that Noctis and co were different characters in Versus and even spoke in different manners. Tabata's reason for changing these characters was because he simply did not like them, as he said himself. He even gave to Prompto some of Noctis quirks as in Versus Noctis was originally going to use his phone to take photos. Another reason for the massive changes in the narrative is also Tabata's obsession with western game design philosophies and his heavy push for open world, to the point where he ignored his team telling him the world would end up being empty. This alone made it impossible to have a focused linear story but also resulted in huge chunks of the already rewritten story to be scrapped (like Gralea, Cartanica, red moon etc) and thus the story was rushed in the second half with a shitload of details removed from it. The constant changes to the story due to various reasons might have resulted in Nomura leaving in 2013 (since Ferrari said that in 2013 the story kept changing after "the young team" joined) but the main reason Versus XIII's story was scrapped is simply because Tabata never had any intention of telling that story.

[@88zsurla]

@@EresirThe1st Exactly. Tabata had to make FF15 a main title that is not connected to 13 at all, that alone forced him to change the story. Besides, didn't Tabata also say about 25% of the game was done? So its not like he had a lot to go on, he had to do it differently. Considering the mess in a development, FF15 overall is a good game in my book, it made me feel, I loved its characters and connection between them and the great emotional ending. Story was rushed of course but that is hardly a surprise since Tabata was pressured to finish it. I remember someone mentioned they made a huge chunk around Shiva that had to be completely scrapped due to deadlines. We also know they had a few vast locations that they didn't have the time to complete thanks to fans who managed to see the unused files in the PC version.

[@zsurvivalist7996]

@Final Fantasy XIII I mean nomura is the one who trashed the whole thing and then it was given to tabata.

[@swordofetro8291]

This post is mostly accurate, but Nomura shall at last have his vengeance. The Goddess stirs in her sleep. The return of The Versus Epic shall return. It is now destiny. Deus dormit...only a while longer. - Zeal

[@nope-hx4xm]

@@zsurvivalist7996 Nope, Nomura is not the one that trashed it, he begun the versus after all, the thing is, he had several other projects and SE wanted him on those and not on versus. Then came the new console generation and a new engine, so square decided to ditch all the progress already done. This also wasn't expected to be a cash-cow, it was a spin-off. One they didn't have much expectation, hence why they didn't invest much in it. That was a mistake, has the works they thought would sell well, didn't. And now the company was in a dire state. So they decided to begin production of kingdom hearts 3 to earn back some trust, but FE was in a literal shithole. And one of their moves was to remake 7. Luckily they didn't have to, has it turns out the spin-off become massively popular, so they decided to turn into into a numbered entry, and that meant they had to modify the story so it could pass most countries censors. With pretty much crippled its story and character potential. Furthermore, They had to rush it, in order to earn something and to fill the time gap before kh3. So they got Tabata to do that in FF-XV and made Nomura work with KH3. Tabata tried to bring as much of versus into xv has he could, but that ended up only being a few powers a few snippets of story and lore. Heck nearly all the story till the leviathan has mostly been a reworked/stripped story beats of the original versus. Noctis was meant to be in the battle of insomnia, but had to be replaced by Nyx, the road trip shit, was meant to be them running away has far away from insomnia has possible to escape imperial forces with were pursuing them. There's ravus in his blood hunt for noctis for killing his sister. The whole noctis family are essentially demons in the making, 'regis horn if you missed it' as well the mechanic where noctis can see who's about to die, and must attempt to save them. Remember the stupid Jared deal? Originally noctis was meant to try to save him, but failed due to a lack of power. So he tried to get revenge on imperial commander that did it. Not the, lets get our car back.

[@littlekitsune1]

@@88zsurla Agreed. For what he had to work with and how pressured he was, he seemed to put a lot of work into trying to "fix" the lacking plot and less fleshed out aspects of characters, even if in obnoxiously roundabout ways like the movie + anime + DLC stories. It felt like he clearly wanted to do more with it, but was too confined. I'm not going to say people shouldn't judge the product for what it is instead of what it was supposed to be, because they absolutely should, but I can't help being salty at Square Enix's piss-poor management and letting Nomura do whatever the hell he wants, including nearly killing FF15 and delaying KH3 to the ends of the earth because he kept retconning things.

[@Aergia90]

>sees versus XIII >press like button immediately.

[@mazokuwolf1279]

I don't think it's China. Games like God of War and Horizon feature cult/religious aspects and are not banned. China really only bans games that might destroy their image nowadays. I don't see why they would ban ff13 verses.

[@NoctLightCloud]

the thumbnail alone😭

[@MorelloZzT7]

hey

[@Nayuta94]

FF15 soundtrack is so beautiful

[@netwizard2003]

ABSOLUTELY

[@KeyBladeMaster-Dan]

Even if the game sucks the goddess that is Yoko Shimomura always delivers

[@HadeaRin]

Can't argue when it is Yoko Shimamura who made the piece. Loving her ever since I pick up Legend of Mana back in 2000

[@colpugno7]

I'd love to see a dark FF. 15 was dark but not enough. Verum Rex might be our last hope?

[@boycottwarhammer6016]

What we first saw: sci-fi romeo and juliet in a sprawling city What we got: FF the hangover in a sprawling nothingscape

[@RayOfTruth]

The game won't be made, but I'd like to see a manga or light novel telling Nomura's original story.

[@shibba2517]

Because of China... C'mon you know that song! Because of China I never play Versus XIII original plot Because of China I learned that Lucis would worship the Reapers Because of China I find it hard to accept Fnal Fantasy XV as it is Because of China I am disappointed

[@cattya4406]

1.china is not the only country that has laws against superstition in media you know. 2. if companies were not so greedy they could have just forgone the chinese market if they valued creative freedom. 3. Explain why stella was scraped. explain why the Romeo and Juliet plot was scrapped, explain why the directors were changed. None of those had to do with religion.

[@whowantstotalkaboutmurders4177]

Because of China, we're in a pandemic Because of China, people have died Because of China, people have lost jobs Because of China, we have to wear a mask Because of China, many things are either delayed or cancelled Because of China, we have to be separated Because of China, 2020 sucks

[@RaggenZ]

Great another smart guy think is all China because media and politicians say so, probably not because China being too strong makes other western countries need whatever it takes to put China down?

[@glitchwalker5422]

XIII, initially, was a disappointment for me. Then a few years later, I got reading the lore and found I really loved how rich it was. This made the concept of Versus XIII more exciting for me, as it shared the mythos of XIII. It essentially seemed to follow a similar story, but from the perspective of a country where Etro was the dominant deity, rather than Pulse or Lindzei. Similarly, Type-0 had your nation's dominant deity as Pulse. In Lightning Returns, as an outsider, worshippers of Etro seemed like very depressing nihilists... Which makes sense, with the upbringing and values Lightning would have being based in a society where a different "God" was followed. Versus XIII looks like it would give us a world where we can identify, essentially, with death worship. There are some fascinating elements that remain; Insomnia appears as a benevolent dictatorship, which is insular and refuses to engage with the outside world. You could say this is because of war, but equally North Korea says the same to its own citizens. If I lived and grew up in North Korea, I don't think my world view would be much different to what the citizens believe in Insomnia. That we are being walled in and isolated because of the "evil" outside forces, and given life and nourishment thanks to our benevolent leader. In a nutshell... It allows a framework to explore religious and political concepts, in a world and way that is easy to identify with, without directly offending any particular religion or community. It's such a shame.

[@shunkun8668]

This might have been a small reason. But the main reason is definitely that there was no ffv13 story to begin with. It was all just concepts that Nomura had, and didn't even connect them. He only had a plan, but not a written story. He just had cool ideas, that he would later try to tie together, but ofc that never happened

[@danschultz999]

This is literal lies, he's stated many times he has the full script.

[@haleyadams731]

@@danschultz999not to mention there is literal artwork from versus from the original artist as well they just didn’t get as far with that as Nomura did with the game script itself though he did state as well he had reworked it a couple times since the original trailers release

[@kaleknelson8429]

I still hope this project comes back some day, because there's so much that can be done and explored with it, that it would be a shame to just let it die.

[@LuciferinHel]

I want my R-16 Versus, it doesn't need to be as big as a main title.

[@christina.morris]

I'll always wish we could have gotten Versus XIII instead of XV, which ended up being a massive disappointment.

[@A_Box_of_Rocks99]

Same. I tried so hard to enjoy XV but it's just such a boring, poorly made game.

[@OmegaKatanaXIII]

@@A_Box_of_Rocks99 same here i wanted to love ff xv but hated it every time i picked up the controller.

[@OmegaKatanaXIII]

@@INeedJesus55 perfect example i let my bro finish it for me

[@superlombax1561]

Kevin Morris Imagine Versus XIII being released and still sucking.

[@fattiger6957]

@@A_Box_of_Rocks99 There's hints of brilliance in FFXV, just Square utterly fumbled the execution in almost every way (storytelling and gameplay being the worst)

[@akiinmoonlight79]

could have been such a masterpiece ...😭♥️ (still love 15 tho)

[@OmegaKatanaXIII]

You will love ffxv more if you know about ffvsxiii and its history. Glad your open minded about vsxiii tho.

[@Lucira]

@@OmegaKatanaXIII like?

[@josueloya2683]

@@OmegaKatanaXIII I doubt that... Because all the VsXIII fans always blame the XV fans and hate the work of Tabata and his team. It's a fact.

[@OmegaKatanaXIII]

@@josueloya2683 wrong man just take look at the production trailers and concept alone it's a different plot and tone than the final product yet your happy have a mediocre product than what we shoulda gotten.

[@maj0ga.]

From what I understood I think Stella was actually undead, wonder if that's why she was changed into Luna... I would really like to see the original concepts for VersusXIII someday tho think KH4/Verum Rex be closest thing we get :/

[@jasminkrieger8464]

Auron was too no problem

[@megaham1552]

I'm not trying to defend China but I'm sure there was much more to it than just that, like Tabata didn't need to get rid of Stella. They could have easily kept the story while make some minor changes to the images/meanings, at the end the day Tabata wanted to make the changes he did because he had a different vision

[@kevinvu5432]

I agree with stella. But my problem i also think that the build up to Luna was so stale....

[@Davethawave1999]

Exactly. Versus XIII was too ambitious for its own good which is why Tabata was brought in. They needed to release the game as quickly as they could, which is why so much was scrapped and changed. Blaming China is a copout

[@raphtalia2727]

@Daiyaan Slamang What are you talking about, lol? Feel like you should do a bit more research. First of all, Stella was still IN when they changed the name to FFXV. Her CGI model was revealed literally next to Noctis' lol. Not only that, but when the concept was still in the works; I believe it is also in 2013 trailer. There is a young Noctis with a blonde child (obviously was Stella) This would mean Noctis and Stella most likely were childhood friends. Again they do interact at the party shown in that one trailer. But it appears that the two have never met until adulthood. Few years or a year later, boom. She's Luna.

[@Wol1427]

@@raphtalia2727 Great, now you know she's Luna, problem solved.

[@j3fk4]

Agreed. And if Nomura could deliver his "promise" before he had to be replaced by Tabata, this game wouldn't have to be renamed to FF15 and has its story scrapped. And then the game would have been on sale by 2012-2013 (or at the super very least by early 2014), SE might not even need Chinese money and those stupid instant noodle cup, AUDI, etc sponsor if it's realeased during that time.... You might have hyper great story, hyper high concepts, and/or big ideas, but if you can't execute it, then it's nothing. Blaming others (Alien, China, ISIS, Trump, Hillary, Recession, Millenials, Golden Age, greedy capitalist, shitty communist, etc) for your failure to execute what you have in mind will only further confirm your weakness.

[@Nayuta94]

When i watch FF versus 13 trailers then i think how fast time goes today we all played FF15 amazing video👍

[@devilovesdevil]

I remember when I first saw Noct in his original outfit back in middle school and thought he was the coolest looking guy ever. I wanted to cosplay this dark "hero" so bad. I wish I got to see the game it couldve been but alas it wasnt meant to be but I got happy seeing Verum Rex

[@MrNeilTV]

I remember when the ff13versus trailer dropped I loved the idea of a dark sinister sub realistic city scape...then we got ff15 which at first release I was a huuuuge fan but over the years I can count how many times I’ve replayed lol I just wish it would have stuck to the idea of urban darkness in a realistic age but meh here’s to ff7 remake lol

[@bit427]

And ff7r did not dissapoint

[@HollyJollyAru]

I still love what we got. A story of brotherhood and friendship. I think the original story was okay but not with Noctis and Co. The original story had them not as close, Noctis more of a jerk. He’s so relatable in XV that you WANT to see him succeed. You want to make these characters happy with photos and recipes and all their jokes. They’re such good characters and while the new story had some issues, I can’t imagine a different one

[@devondre79]

😂😂😂

[@MAKS_WORKS]

that brotherhood bond was always present in the original plot, but never the focal point XV . It was more the political drama between the two empires, the byproduct the crystal’s power , stuff like that was more central in versus xiii.

[@HollyJollyAru]

Arian Ahmadian From what I remember they weren’t as close as they are in XV. There was also then being traitors and just Noct not being all the nice so I’m glad they have such a good relationship now

[@MAKS_WORKS]

HollyJolly interesting. So I would say you could watch the 2011 trailer with English translation and through their conversation you can see their relationship. I wouldn’t say noct was a jerk, but he was a lot more stubborn and confident (in action mostly, cuz with Stella you can see the translation for that too, he was very calm and welcoming) . You can do the same with 2013 gameplay in citadel with prompto’s banter with noct. Also, the betrayal story line was meant for gladio’s dad being a double agent and rest with crew were mostly rumors, and the rumors themselves say it’s revealed until 2nd game so the group persona was always there. It’s hard to compare when the tones of the XV and versus are so different.

[@stefantherainbowphoenix]

He's still a jerk in FF15. You even get better rewards for being a jerk in the game.

[@Pineabble]

Whenever I think of XV and Versus XIII, I have this feeling of melancholy that I've never had before. The potential wasted and what this game could have been is truly depressing to dwell on. To think I was 14 or 15 years old when the first trailer was shown blows my mind...I still remember vividly how I was intrigued from the start with the first trailer and had no interest in XIII itself. As I learned more, the concept and world sounded so unique with such a macabre theme. I'd love to see it come to light, but I wish it would be with the original characters they were going to use and especially so for Noctis and Stella. Despite everything, I still adore Noctis from the design to his voice actor. Releasing Versus XIII and just marketing the game as an alternate universe to XV could be very interesting.

[@DragonGyrl96]

I absolutely do. The original story they were going to go with sounded like something that dived as deep as XV did, maybe deeper, but with darker themes added to it. The possibility of playing a protagonist, usually the hero, the would eventually become a villain? Of course I'd want to know that story! Everything I read said it would still find a way to end on a happier note. I wanted to know how they would get there! Yes, I absolutely would love to play VS XIII as it was planned out originally.

[@nephram1702]

I think it was too dark or testuya nomura just saw Les miserable and wanted ffxv to be a musical play.

[@MAKS_WORKS]

I think it’s a little more complicated than that. that was just a specific period, I don’t think u can build whole game around a musical.

[@jasminkrieger8464]

Versus was more shake spear than ever 15 was the Jesus, Judas story with adryn,with noctis it was link mix cloud story fall of Camelot i wanted shake Spear the difference was reagis was evil in versus 13 Mafia MAN, war was on both versions,noctis in versus suceeded defending his kingdom rather than invade Flee get it back in 15 in versus they competed for the crystals powers with tanabrea ,etro was worshipped both kingdoms having 2 prople blessed by etro with powers noctis and stella who rival and chlash while being in love with luna yeah it was aerith copy the stabbing kill part she was a healing oracle childhood friend Princess fiance instead stella wasnt a Princess noctis had not the Stress of political marriage the versus 13 noctis is colder since reagis wasnt a loving father but powerhungry instead like the kazamas on djins story in tekken

[@jasminkrieger8464]

There was more differences

[@ThatBeingCed]

Matuno's vision of XII Nomura's vision of XV Tabata's Vision of XV (Let's be honest, he didn't have the time needed to acheive it.) 3 games that I'll forever wonder about, but will never see.

[@fattiger6957]

What was XII originally supposed to be? All I know is Basch was originally going to be the protagonist (would've been much better since Vaan is a blackhole of personality)

[@ThatBeingCed]

@@fattiger6957 We don't know... But we know Matsuno couldn't finish the story writing and I feel like it shows at one point in the game.

[@Davethawave1999]

@@fattiger6957 That right there would've been HUGE

[@Ayahime0]

After all these years, I still can't bring myself to like FFXV. I remember playing FFXV feels like a chore and I wasn't really into it. The story wasn't interesting, the open world was way too open and empty. I didn't really care about the characters either and that's coming from a person who cares about fictional characters. Sometimes, I'll even forget FFXV has a story at all like your usual MMO. If there was ever a chance for Versus XIII to become a reality, I would buy it. And Verum Rex too.

[@richardberner585]

If you run around lost, not having idea how to progress, it might feel this way. But otherwise it does have story, one that I enjoyed very much. The open world to me it worked that I loved to to sit in car enjoying rides. Other than that, I wasn't too much into exploration too.

[@theferalwolf7]

Give me the PS3 build of VS 13, with Nomura at the helm and no boardroom meddling. i would pay double the full price for that game over FF7 remake any day

[@NIXNE]

Absolutely loved FFXV. I do feel like the game ended up being very different from what I expected when I first saw FFVersusXIII

[@EliWintercross]

I was disappointed that it felt huge chunks of story were missing or rushed. But I still love the game, the characters and the world. Wish we could have gotten all the dlc.

[@KokoLockhart]

Because Versus XIII and XV aren't the same game.

[@Nyla_emotes]

I would love to play the "Verum Rex" true story. I felt like they gave us just something to appreciate the graphics of the game, but compared to ALL others FF games, FFXV was lacking a lot in the storytelling. I was so disappointed in this. If they would ever give us the true story of that game I would just forget about this Chinese version of FF and focus totally on what would be released. So sad that nowadays everything happens and rotate around money. Even creativity is killed by that. :_(

[@kizzy3563]

FF15 was so sad to play... I kept thinking about what it COULD have been.

[@christopherfarrel264]

at least if square ain't milking lightning (xiii) this game could be done sooner.

[@Dragonkid1801]

To be honest, there are a lot of story elements from versus 13 that would've worked well with ff15. The original concept was that two kingdoms were fighting over the crystal for the sake of their own kingdoms. They could've had ff15's story begin with Lucis and Tenebrae fighting their war. Luna could be an ambassador from Tenebrae trying to achieve peace with Lucis and Stella could still be around as Luna's sister and part of a military faction that thinks it's too late for peace. Niflheim would be an opportunist third party exploiting Tenebrae's conflicted political state to get a shot at overthrowing Lucis. In the process of fighting their war, the kingdoms end up abusing the crystal's power and trigger the astral's rebellion and by the extension, the starscourge. They didn't have to axe all these plot points to make FF15

[@sebastienc.2257]

You just described what 15 is, you just moved names around. Luna has a brother who did exactly what you’re suggesting for Stella.

[@hinatashoyo2999]

Years ago, I watched the trailer for Final Fantasy Versus with my dear old friend. We were incredibly excited for the game; every aspect seemed captivating. We made a pact to purchase it and experience it together upon its release. However, after many long years of anticipation, my friend tragically succumbed to cancer before he could witness the fate of this masterpiece. I can only imagine his disappointment at seeing how the game was mishandled. Brother, I hope to join you in heaven soon, where we can finally play Final Fantasy Versus together. Until then, wait for me.

[@gateauxq4604]

I really want to learn more about Versus since finishing XV tonight. Someone had leaks from 4chan-not sure if that was you but I need to hear it all since theres no more spoilers!

[@DJ_LilPaycheck]

I've needed to know this for years cause vesus XIII looked amazing

[@richardberner585]

0:15 This Prompto looks way more badass, I have to admit that.

[@ImagineXAdventures]

Yes. We got a whiney annoying bitch when we could’ve had tHIS

[@fffan11]

China probably played a part in some themes being scrapped, but when it comes to the story itself and storytelling, I believe FFversusXIII's story was just too much to handle in terms of content to develop, hence why what was supposed to be the beginning of versusXIII became a movie instead, conveniently with Noctis out of the picture.

[@MAKS_WORKS]

yeah , good point. But still If the issue was story being too difficult to turn into a game then why not just have noctis as the main character in kingsglaive? why not stick to the original plot where the crew flee insomnia amid battle?

[@mattchu9560]

They're just basically pathetic right now. Getting angry for some petty insults relating to Winnie the Pooh, slowly invading; Philippines, getting sensitive with video games, and now banning PewDiePie.

[@MrRoninFist]

I’m still in love with FFXIII Versus. I still watch the trailers from time to time.....

[@krazyxki]

Final Fantasy XV is the Fyre Festival of games. Square was more concerned about showing off than actually finishing the game. So many broken promises and disappointment that I thought I was playing a Ubisoft game. But even Ubisoft I have to give more credit to because at least their games aren't plain empty when released. I think art being destroyed by capitalism is the worst thing that can happen to art and the biggest disservice. Bad management at Square completely destroyed a masterpiece that will never see the light of day. It's a big loss that will be remembered by fans for the rest of our lives.

[@KING-ZEAL]

An Oath to Return. Long live thy line. Until Versus is born Anew.

[@dimitriosgladio059]

If verum Rex was real I would play it in a heartbeat

[@haleyadams731]

I’ve honestly always wondered why Nomura wasn’t allowed to at least turn his ideas for Versus into a novel similar to Dawn of the Future if his ideas and concepts weren’t going to be used anyways. I mean they already used his characters for a different installment, it seems very strange especially considering Tabata leaving in 2018 stops anything else most likely being made for XV in the future really.

[@DoukNoukum]

So SE is the Blizzard of the East

[@A_Box_of_Rocks99]

SE sold out, lost their identity and trashed the FF name with XV. Used to be Kings of JRPG's...now they're a joke.

[@MrInuhanyou123]

One big problem with this, consoles were banned entirely from China until only recently, especially all of last gen so there's no real reason to assume that SE cared about marketing the game in China of all things as a PS3 exclusive, when at the time, China represented almost zero percent of sales.

[@mithrillis]

Honestly sounds like a bad excuse to me. If that were truly the reason, we would have known ages ago, and there is no way Square would scrap a huge part of the system and assets that they already worked on for years just so that they could sell to a new market. They'd just change the names to something convenient and grow some meat on the reaper (a la what they did with WoW undead race) instead. This is 95% PR blame shifting.

[@-Extra_Lives]

I would live to see this be in a final fantasy game in the future, or at least show up in kingdom hearts, if only alluded to

[@thenefariousbear4315]

Ugh even after 3 years it still ticks me off that this was thrown out in favor of 15s story. Starting to think I'll never get over this

[@tornelysian]

I am so sick of either greed or restrictive thinking crushing creativity over and over again. So many dreams never see the light. We can't evolve if we are constantly forced to fit the mold. ☠

[@jonahsahn]

This is a very timely video, considering what is going on with China and gaming (along with every other industry with HQs in the US).

[@jonahsahn]

@@INeedJesus55 um. K.

[@jonahsahn]

@@INeedJesus55 whatever you say, Boss.

[@joshuapineda1369]

Well, if the one who headed the project is someone like yoko taro or anyone who doesn't give any damn about heavy themes and censorships, maybe it will see the light of day. That said, I kinda understand Square Enix's decision. You can't release a game if it does not promise a significant financial return, especially after 10 years of development.

[@Marcharnos]

That doesn't make much sense. Sure they had to throw the reaper worshipping out, but that doesn't explain the sheer dramatic amount of changes that were made

[@HadeaRin]

So because of China we need to suffer through a boyband and forced love story? Like... wouldn't it be beautifully tragic to have Noctis kill Stella because of Bahamut vs Etro kinda dispute instead of whatever thing happening between Noctis and Luna?

[@mortifagotenebroso]

Well, the rest of the world has seen how everything is shaped to please American consumers as this was the largest market in the world... Time flies.

[@kevinvu5432]

That was still all tabata. Most of the lore could've been handled better byt the force romance is all tabata

[@mortifagotenebroso]

Snatcher Claus Not really. I prefer my safe streets, my free health insurance and my healthy lifestyle

[@contraband100]

@Snatcher Claus oh...

[@HadeaRin]

What the heck happened when I sleep??

[@mrpanicattack6688]

And we all bow down to China... Because money 😔

[@A_Box_of_Rocks99]

Not all, certainly not.

[@lastone032085]

So I got screwed out of the one and only final fantasy game that interested me because of China? South park had it right. Ugh.

[@Shadowdispel]

"money"....typical instead of satisfying the fans they decided to satisfy themselves RIP Versus XIII

[@g-alicenine]

This is so far the best reason/theory I've heard and even though I already put it all to rest long ago and still really love the ffxv we got, it does make it even easier to accept it. So thank you for this video. Good job

[@AproposDare]

I vote to retcon FF15 to have the blue-haired version of Noctis and include Lunafreya, Cindy, & Aranea as a playable characters.

[@newdivide9882]

Well that just makes me wonder about another Square Enix game that came out this year, Oninaki. You’re essentially playing as a grim reaper in an entire reaper organization as you flip back and forth between the land of the living and the dead. Did that game not release in China or what? If so, what’s the difference?

[@Samurai-no4wu]

I'll never forgive square enix for.not giving us the ff xv that was advertisted. I would have been fine with the story, but the bastards didn't even had the adacity to finish the story we got and instead said here just read this novel lol.

[@jonah_da_mann]

I've been saying this for months. Thank you!

[@robando2922]

I think we will get some of Versus in whatever Verum Rex turns out to be. 🤔

[@chaosmark101]

Was China a bigger gaming market than the U.S. back in 2013? Wasn't that when the big decision to change Versus XIII to XV took place?

[@qownsqud3207]

The darkest entry Kh combat What was once Squares trademark storytelling This really could have been the goated FF experience and instead we got... FF15 This really was squares turning point

[@Kozmo-Kamuy]

China gose to battle with X country, X county we have skulls, China we surrender

[@rolfathan]

I'm so tired of cutting quality for the sake of China. If the market is so profitable for China, then maybe it's worth it to make a Chinese version that swaps a few story elements and textures. We can keep the cool story, they spend a little extra budget to do an alternative version, but I bet the sales of less china centric content would do better in other countries. I've seen probably a dozen games and some movies have what seemed like way better stories change for China. I honestly have to wonder how much more sales of games and movie tickets would have been had in all the other countries had they sticked to their original stories. I really think it could make up for the cost difference in producing an alternative version for China.

[@megaham1552]

Yeah I doubt they had to change the whole game just because of China I think Tabata wanted to go in another direction anyway

[@netwizard2003]

Ok so basically, BC China is why a lot of our games get censored or changed.... Wonderful.

[@megaham1552]

Yeah I think there were other reasons as to why the story changed a lot as well, I think Tabata wanted to go in a different direction

[@gregorioguerrero1124]

And movies...and products in general...

[@khfreak5531]

That doesn’t mean they had to change the plot point where Noctis and Luna were originally rivals/enemies. She had similar abilities to his and they were straight up shown fighting each other. She gave off a completely different vibe than the current Luna. They were also seemingly younger. Well, I just thought that would’ve been cool if they had stuck with it.

[@densetsu4286]

You are forgetting a major reason. The game was originally episodic in nature. And that format was not green lit for ffxv. So they had to make what was essentially a multipart game and somehow get it into 1 game. Shit had to be cut and adjusted as well. Not to mention when directors change show does nearly every facet of a project change as the new dorector has dofferent visions on what the project should be. These 2 reasons are just as big as the issue with China.

[@noctojujef4837]

Justice for Winnie the Pooh

[@LoneWolf-ow8cn]

I've always liked the original concept for Versus 13/15 and wished that they would keep the same concept for the game. FF 15 had so much potential.

[@dwhitaker86]

I'm finally playing my New Game+ I got it day one and beat it fairly quickly and haven't been back to it. Now I'm doing the New Game+ with the Royal pack and all the story enhancement DLC. Currently I'm loving it. Not even using fast travel. Just enjoying the beautiful world of Eos.

[@justsaiyansteve]

The trailers for ff13 versus were amazing!

[@e-soldier3533]

Remember when creativity came before sensitivity and censorship to satisfy people's stupid feelings and everything wasn't developed strictly for profits sake? Man those were the days.

[@TheCrazyNekoGirl2123]

I think that showing things that might be shocking in bad way could be good thing. Why? Well it would serve a reminder that what might seem bad in your country might not be so bad in others. Always remember where you come from but say questions are asked "Why do you see it as bad? That's neat here we see it this way." it serves for conversation and learning about other cultures. While young kids would not play this older kids, teenagers, would and learning about other cultures through conversation is a good thing. Editing can be a good thing but don't remove something that might be shocking some where else leave it in it could be the best move you ever make. Who is to say that board would tell you to remove it? They may like the shock and how it involes the story rather than hiding it.

[@GabrielHello1]

I'm here because of Kingdom Hearts Re:Mind

[@NickeyNarioaHagman]

Verum Rex needs its own game of some kind

[@ereoleon]

someone has to have a very early version from FFXV,I'm not loosing hope , after all we have had version from the first pokemon games that never saw light until few years ago.

[@crozraven]

Oh no! It's China again ... :( But I would argue that Death goddess or Etro elements removal isn't the only big problems with the game & I think it's just one of the things that plague FFXV development since day one. I would argue the slow & torturing development of FFVXIII within years & pretty much leap between consoles is the biggest problem that carry over to FFXV. Also, take notes that China just only very recently lifting the console ban (2014-2017), so I really think the removal of this death worship religion aspects in development is very much an abrupt one. This is also what happened with the time travel elements removal that supposedly exist to dwell deep into the lore & explore some bad scenarios/endings (probably like the "Omen" trailer). It's come as no surprise as we find many residual elements like artworks & lore & assets & Pitioss Ruins & even the "Kingsglaive" movie has Etro painting inside Caelum Via. Yeah, the Pitioss Ruins ... I think you should make a in depth video about it. It has many theories among community & I myself would argue that a lot of the relics/statues actually trying to depict what the "real" lore supposed to be between gods & world's origin. It's like the devs trying to tell that this "forgotten" place contained the "hidden truth" ....

[@fattiger6957]

I have to wonder how big the console/PC market is in China. Based on everything I've heard, the most popular gaming devices is mobile by a huge margin. Multiplayer PC games seem to be popular, but I kinda doubt single-player jrpgs are big in China.

[@crozraven]

@@fattiger6957 well, just recently I believe the steam users counts as of now are 21%+ china based language players, second only to english based language players on 38%+. If you put it into perspectives with most of english based players ranging from NA + EU + many other non supported languages + self choose english language players, meanwhile that 21%+ china based language players are only from CHINA ... I don't have numbers for consoles but the fact that ban lifting just so happened & most of AAA game companies would never missed that opportunity. Also like any other Asia countries, China actually have a pretty massive market for Japan based entertainment (that includes JRPGs).

[@BlackMateriaxx]

Every time I hear you call the people watching “Ultima Weapons” I throw up in my mouth a little

[@user-fh6sm4sb4x]

The problem was multifacetted. You really think they would have completely scrapped the game if the story and everything had been completed to 99 %? I don't think so. The problem was obviously the problem all artist face from time to time: having a great idea but not enough skill or time to execute it in the right amount of time. It is a very common problem and it is the same that ff13 versus was doomed to have since it has this notion of being an absolute once in a lifetime success. This title was too complex to be written and executed by a company that had been under pressure since it changed from square soft to square enix. The story WAS NOT about what the leaker said anyway. It was a mixture of romeo and juliet and hamlet.

[@OmegaKatanaXIII]

Its been a while since you did a video on final fantasy versus xiii. And i allways wanted to here the to what really happened about ffvsxiii.

[@aznsoljacs]

I would pay more for uncensored games. Just imagine how awesome the original game would have been instead of being changed so much ;(

[@crozraven]

Again, I think your really should make a video about Pitioss Ruins/dungeons if you wanna make new contents for FFXV.

[@crozraven]

@Snatcher Claus I am just saying here. Instead of re-cycling some old news for a video, it's better to make a video about something that still rare on KZbin.

[@kilik0410]

@Snatcher Claus They just want this botchling turned into a lubberkin, nothing wrong with that....

[@kilik0410]

@Snatcher Claus I've got mixed feelings. But i do love how after XV, a lot of the haters of XIII went back and played XIII again and were like "hey this is actually kinda good" lmao :p

[@DarkRecca19]

I want to travel to the universe where ff versus exist as a full game

[@Angelblaze]

THE ONLY REASON WHY FINAL FANTASY 15 BECAME BIG WAS BECAUSE OR THE VERSUS 13 TRAILERS. PERIOD! They not only messed up the story, but also the gameplay. This game could of been so much more and vs 13 is the only reason I played 15. My 1st final fantasy game.