Why Goku VS Kratos Isn’t Close

[@ToasterXD]

ZEEEEUSSSS 1. - “But the dragon ball afterlife is a higher dimension!” Wanted to clear up a comment I’ve been seeing. The Daizenshuu scan that states that afterlife in the world of Dragon Ball is dimensionally transcendental, meaning it exists beyond the dimensions of the living world. However, this conflicts with the fact that the afterlife in Dragon Ball is said to be based on Buddhism, which emphasizes spiritual transcendence rather than physical dimensions. In Buddhism, the afterlife is believed to be a continuation of the cycle of birth, death, and rebirth (samsara) that is driven by karma, the accumulation of actions and intentions that determine one's destiny. The ultimate goal in Buddhism is to attain enlightenment, or nirvana, which is a state of liberation from the cycle of samsara and the suffering it entails. In the context of Dragon Ball, it's possible that the idea of a dimensionally transcendental afterlife is a creative interpretation of the Buddhist concept of spiritual transcendence. Rather than existing in a physical dimension beyond the living world, the afterlife in Dragon Ball may be portrayed as a realm of spiritual transcendence that is separate from the physical world. 2. - “You didn’t bring up Kratos feats.” What? The feat proposal I made is that Thor has the ability to destroy the Yggdrasil, a mythical tree in Norse mythology that is said to transcend time and space and is infinitely large and 5-dimensional. This feat would suggest that Thor possesses immense power and strength, capable of destroying an object that is seemingly invincible and beyond the limits of physical reality.

[@robertdawnypozo9397]

For Goku's information, you didn't use the feat that he overcame a jump in time and that in the fight with Broly, Gogeta broke reality with the shock of powers and they teleported to a space where time and space did not exist and even so. they were able to move and goku is currently stronger than that, in the fight with infinite samas there is talk that he is scattered throughout infinity including timelines, goku moving in a place where nothing existed and vegeta destroying the time room that also is infinite... the video seemed more to inflate Kratos than a power scaling

[@goliathxanatos706]

Agreed. The all knowing dude in Super seemed to be based visually and somewhat personality wise on a Buddah who's achieved Nirvana. There's a lot of similarities to real world religions and ideologies from way back in OG Dragonball. But in regards to the individual realms, it makes sense. Despite the macrocosm, each realm is it's own self contained space with few exceptions interacting with one another. That's something most fans don't realise. But at the end of it all, it simply doesn't compare to that of the GoW universe.

[@evilCODrays]

Ok, first there are gods that have reached enlightenment in Buddhism, they literally have become the universe. Their dementionanal scaling of which surpassed the universe, as they are literally the universe. Similar to the afterlife being above the known universe as we see it. Second without proper context, take it at base value, all interpretations of said statement are valid until specified. Third, about ur last paragraph, we have seen goku come back and physically interact with people, earth and villans. So it being a spiritual thing is a touch of a grey line. It's further even more confirmed because they're still dead, shown with say vegeta having a halo or goku etc. They're still dead yet are interacting with the real world. Maybe a combination of both, since goku could use ssj3 more efficiently when dead then alive as the strain wasn't as big. Though who truly knows, it's still worth mentioning that the afterlife has been stated to be a higher demention.

[@antoinepolnareff8970]

Those scans are also counted and stated by Toriyama in posterior interviews. + In Japanese those scans have the kanji for higher mathematical dimension, so indeed is a Higher plane. Also Broly movie feats puts Goku already Beyond all physical laws by default.

[@TrippieMint]

There’s a simpler debunk for the after life scan Notice how it says transcendental and not transcendent? Well transcendental means “relating to a spiritual or nonphysical realm.” From Oxford’s languages We already know that the after life is a spiritual and non physical realm and it makes sense it would mean this more so then it being dimensionally transcendent of the living world lmao

[@dellano-]

Kratos gets a racism buff against gods so as long as goku doesnt mention he's a god he's fine.( Shout out the guy who said this first )

[@blauwbeer556]

Goku isnt a god tho, he just has the powers of them. Or is that the gimmick of the GoW series, Kratos just beating up gods that dont do their jobs (idk, never played the games).

[@dellano-]

@@blauwbeer556 bro its a jokes dont try to ruin the fun -_-

[@blauwbeer556]

@@dellano- am incredibly not sorry >~

[@sumansaxena2277]

@@blauwbeer556 1. Goku absorbed God Ki in his base form and now can sense God ki which basically makes him A God. So technically, Super Saiyan God makes him Super Saiyan God^2 and Super Saiyan blue makes him Super Saiyan God^3 Super Saiyan 2. No, Kratos didn't kill gods for that

[@X_xWolfx_X]

@@blauwbeer556 so does that mean beerus isn’t a god because he wasn’t born a god.

[@purestar9872]

Kratos: I can beat Goku Tree: *Blocks his way*

[@BigGoonie]

Clearly you have never read the GOW comic

[@nobodyask_]

​@@BigGoonieis a joke........ For the games but I love dbz so much but old kratos wins

[@s0ggybeansncheese755]

Tree solos dragon ball verse

[@krisdeltatraveler]

That's like saying Mario can't beat Goku because a castle blocked his way. If Kratos wasn't nerfed to shit by the game mechanics then he'd rip Goku apart

[@PyroniumZ]

That tree is boundless tbh

[@tyberiousTem]

Goku: **Goes SSJ god** Kratos: “a god?”

[@Iceo09]

*racism mode activated*

[@tahafawad426]

*presses circle*

[@saintzayan8205]

Ssj god isn't the same as the Greek gods kratos fought.

[@it_again]

@@saintzayan8205 my bad

[@saintzayan8205]

@@it_again okay but you get my point right?

[@mobem_edit]

the problem for kratos is that you should know the lore or narrative of the story or extra materials to scale him while goku's power mostly said or mentioned in the animanga, so people who don't go for reading stuff they would think kratos is tree level 😐💀

[@thefirstprime0124]

Which is dumb

[@revenantronin8377]

That's not "the problem", you read the lore just like you read manga... You watch cutscenes with cosmic level feats the same way you'd watch an anime. The problem is that people who know nothing about GOW always want to compare Kratos to their favorite character. Personally, I don't engage in arguments that I only know about one side only.

[@un1xify]

What type of tree we talking about here? Oak, maple, yew? Mahogany?

[@menacingpotatoleaf]

Yeah, you actually have to dig to find DB statements while GOW gives them out for free.

[@lilianpalacios3255]

@@un1xify If its maple, Kratos is Boundless.

[@0plague0]

I think people forget that Instant Transmission isn’t speed, it’s a skill that he learned.

[@EclipseEG]

Thing is it isn’t instant, it takes around half a second to actually transport him without adding the actual animation of when he does the ‘instant’ transmission so it’s a one second transmission at least

[@buttfok18063]

This is incorrect. It is stated in manga that certain techniques or characters are faster than instant transmission. Meaning it's not actually instantaneous, and its not just "a skill". Goku has also surpassed the speed of light many times over when he was just a kid, and even more than that ad an adult as you can imagine.

[@calebrumsey4838]

@@buttfok18063the actual instant transmission bit is instant it’s just he has to focus to do it

[@buttfok18063]

@@calebrumsey4838 no it isn't, read the manga.

[@buttfok18063]

@@calebrumsey4838 page 18 chapter 72. Granolah's clone moving faster than instant transmission.

[@kyoeyes]

The problem with using actually mythology to scale Kratos is that the GoW games are far removed from the actual mythology they're based on. Unless a feat is mentioned in game, you can't really assume it happened in that world. I mean Jörmungandr is supposed to be Loki's child but in the game, he's ancient before Loki is even born.

[@_tmaa_]

That’s actually wrong. See the jormungandr we see in gow 2018 is actually from the future. He came back into the past after Thor struck him at ragnarok. That snake which angrboda and Atreus give life to is the actual snake.

[@chrisbriscoe8385]

@@_tmaa_moron

[@big_boy_productions]

@@chrisbriscoe8385how is he a moron he’s correct

[@_tmaa_]

​@@chrisbriscoe8385how am I a moron headass? That's literally how it happens in God of war

[@rifarira9160]

@@_tmaa_ still different from the real life lore where jormun is his litteral child, not a random snake he gave lives

[@OGStarlightKY]

I have to clarify something that GOW fans constantly state that annoys me. Norse Kratos is NOT weaker, he’s stronger than he was in the original trilogy, Gods grow in strength as they age according to the lore, and people forget that he holds back his power to stop himself from reverting back to who he used to be.

[@_tmaa_]

the thing is he is weaker tho. hold on lemme explain. so in god of war 3 we know Kratos is no longer a FULL god this is because he needed Hades' soul to use the Hyperion gate but however he did have his god powers at the time. He admits he can no longer access his greek powers in ragnarok. Gods do grow stronger with age but only with god powers. Kratos no longer retains them in Ragnarok

[@callous2k486]

@@_tmaa_He is still a god, he says so himself. And he still had his base godly powers such as super strength and regeneration, he just doesn’t have the magic powers he had in Greece

[@deciduousoutdoors436]

He is physically stronger, but ability wise hell no. Had he kept his weapons from Greece, he wouldn't have any issue w norse

[@brandogents6624]

​@@deciduousoutdoors436he couldn't have kept them Fear Zues destroyed his weapons before he snapped Kratos neck and sent him into the visions at the end of 3. The shock Zues hits Kratos with shatters all of his weapons and equipment. He couldn't have brought it if he wanted. Only thing not destroyed was the Blade of Olympus but he clearly left that at the top of Olympus after stabbing himself

[@deciduousoutdoors436]

@brandogents6624 you missed what I said. Had he was able to bring them from Greece, he would of had no issue facing any foe in Norse.

[@mrturtle5402]

Before people go crazy arguing over this, just wanna make sure you guys remember that both GoW and DBZ as well as DBS have some pretty goofy scaling, to the point where characters will have extreme fluctuations in strength depending on the point in the story. Although I am a pretty big DB fan, I still have to admit that Goku has some pretty inconsistent power at times, and he is incredibly hard to scale properly, especially against characters who exist within fundamentally different verses.

[@tee-ravis]

He’s not that hard to scale. Multiversal at least, and that’s in DB’s MASSIVE cosmology, so he would be much higher in any other verse

[@mrturtle5402]

I’m not arguing against goku being multiversal, since he definitely is, as it has been stated multiple times. It’s just that once you get to a certain level of power, its incredibly difficult to compare you to other universes with similar power. I’m mostly talking about certain inconsistent scaling in DBZ and DBS, like when frieza was stated to have the power to destroy the universe during the Namek saga by the narrator, which is obviously not true. And theres also several power differences in the manga and anime, like how gohan in the TOP is Kefla level in the manga, or how powerful UI sign Goku is, or if Goku is stronger than Beerus or not, since Jiren is stated to be stronger than Beerus in the anime, but isn’t stated to be stronger than him in the manga.

[@tee-ravis]

@@mrturtle5402 jiren was never stated as stronger than beerus. He was stronger than his own GoD but beerus is by far the strongest GoD. Goku is definitely not stronger than beerus

[@DirtyDev]

DBZ scaling was never inconsistent (DBS is). God of war scaling is far more ambiguous which leads to fans thinking Kratos stands a chance against Goku post The 22nd Tenkaichi Budokai (Let alone Z and Super).

[@mrturtle5402]

@@tee-ravisn a scene before the ToP, ( anime only), Whis says Jiren is stronger than Belmod, and then further mentions that Belmod is stronger than Beerus, thus, by beating Jiren in UI, UI Goku must be, (raw power wise), stronger than Beerus. However, in the manga, Whis never says this, and in the destroyer expo, Beerus is one of the two destroyers left standing, meaning his is most likely one of, if not, the strongest god of destruction, although, this isn’t proven, since the destroyer expo is never finished.

[@infiniteshrek2081]

Hey I think Goku can win but I know it's an unpopular opinion

[@geokashi357]

Goku solos gaytos is overrated

[@astrology_2]

He might be able to win because Kratos’s scaling isn’t really consistent

[@_kenz_o]

Fanboys cry about it

[@GameZone-m5r]

​@@geokashi357 goku is galactic is manga😂😂😂

[@Zerxeas]

@@geokashi357cry goku fangay

[@handzofstone1152]

Played through all of the GoW games and researched the lore extensively as well as DB, DBZ, GT, and DBS. On paper one would think Kratos is amongst the highest tier fictional characters due to his victories over actual Gods. The problem is that the Gods, Titans, and other beings from GoW don't actually scale up to many higher beings from other fictional verses and their feats and statements are greatly overexaggerated. Goku being outerversal is definitely fanboy wank and amongst the less popular opinions of the DB fandom, however he does have enough feats and actual confirmed statements along with simple powerscaling to prove that he is actually accurately rated in terms of where the general consensus has him. That said, this battle really isn't close, unfortunately. Kratos and the GoW characters are powerful, extremely so in fact, however featwise and lorewise he simply doesn't match-up to Goku and the stronger beings of DB. Plus with the way that DB writing is, even if Kratos actually did scale-up to (or even surpass) Goku, it would only be a matter of time before Goku eventually surpassed and eclipsed him lol.

[@kuroto7773]

Powerscalling does'nt work like that,also you mentioned how feats and lorewise DB is above GoW when GoW had things like a valid Higher Dimensional structure even back then in Greek game

[@abhaypatel605]

It’s not a fanboy wank, there are multiple high outer goku scales and one of them is even proved, it’s just that people don’t want to accept it, Im talking about the Koyama statements one.

[@kuroto7773]

@@abhaypatel605 problem with Koyama is that not only he talking something that does not/didnt shown in the main material but he himself even admitted that people shouldnt taken his statement at face value because most of them are just based on his own personal opinion

[@norah7324]

i don’t think goku will ever surpass kratos. show the fact that greek gods get stronger when they get older and the other fact that kratos continues to slam other gods and still he’s holding back while goku most of the time doesn’t hold back at all

[@petroshalkos3453]

True, goku is already hard enough to outclass but he would just become stronger over time.

[@Biggyxay123]

This is why goku and dragon ball will never win debates because despite all of the feats they do they all get minimized bc of the writers 🤦🏾‍♂️🤦🏾‍♂️the same writers who can’t even remember that saiyans had tails or that he forgot about ssj3 entirely 🤦🏾‍♂️we have to start going off of what is being shown more than what the writers say bc the inconsistencies is what kills this franchise 💯

[@StrawHatTrod-]

Honestly dragon ball is an old franchise that is still trying to keep up with the new gen, that’s why the writers totally ignore ssj3 and give goku all these weird power ups so he could keep with with the current gen. Sadly that made the show weird and cringe. Dragon ball just need to hang it up and let great anime like One Piece set the tone.

[@Josephcantor-v5p]

@@StrawHatTrod- dragon ball GT was a better ending for dragon ball and now they want to start a new franchise when the creator is already approaching the age of 70.

[@spaceowl9246]

Dragonball isn't to be taken seriosly. Yet its fans take it VERY serious. It's literally a joke franchise which only lives for short hype moments. Fucking OPM is more reliable in its power system and it's literally a comedy.

[@Biggyxay123]

@@spaceowl9246 so basically you’re tryna say people are wrong for taking dragon ball seriously when the writer was trying to make serious arcs for his characters tho 🤣🤣🤦🏾‍♂️

[@blauwbeer556]

@@spaceowl9246 i wouldn't go as far as calling it a "joke" franchise but i have to agree that it is not to be taken super seriously.

[@ikeillue8385]

I do find these kinds of videos amusing. The conclusion is that Kratos completely outclasses Goku in every way. Yet we are ignoring the fact that there was not a single feat for Kratos that was actually brought up, that puts him anywhere near Goku's level. Just vague statements about dimensional tiering, which is utter BS, and even if it wasn't utter BS, Kratos' 5d tiering, as it was claimed in this video, is nothing compared to the easy 8d+ that Goku can be scaled to. That said, when you look at actual feats done (not empty statements that could easily be interpreted as hyperbole, and ignoring dimensional tiering BS.), Kratos isn't even hitting moon busting level, while Goku is low balled at multi universal.

[@unendingvoid]

I don't like Vs community anymore these days. They favour all of the scaling chains and vague statements about dimensional tiering and lifting the heavens, scaling to someone somehow via mental gymnastics who had a only worded non visual feat of carrying the weight of infinity or something and then it so happens that that's very likely just metaphorical or symbolic of something in context of the universe. All of this just comes together to feel very unconvincing when Kratos is struggling to lift a temple that is clearly not even the size of a mountain, and people think he is stomping Goku who isn't just calced at high universal, multi etc but is literally easily scaled to it and even shown to some degree, based on how he could destroy solar systems and galaxies way before his current power level which is many many orders of magnitude higher now

[@ikeillue8385]

@@unendingvoid I absolutely agree. Its like people are more worried about trying to make their favorite characters seem incredibly powerful, than they are about objectively scaling characters. Though, the same could be said about the creators themselves, as they kind of just insert nonsense statements (that aren't supported by any of the actual feats in the series) that are there, not for any narrative reason, but specifically to artificially inflate the character's power scaling.

[@unendingvoid]

@@ikeillue8385 Yeah, but at the very least unlike the fan scalers, the creators are known for sometimes changing their views on things or saying things that are not questioned further, so they did not have an opportunity to elaborate on something that could be different. And, as far as creators go, if what they say completely contradicts what the character is shown capable of, they might as well be two different versions of the character. What's the use of a creator statement, for example, of Kratos being able to easily annihilate multiple universes or that he has infinite immeasurable speed if he's never using any of that in the story itself and just struggling his way through these antagonists. The fans will tell you every possible explanation they can think of like the light was in his eyes that day or that he wasn't trying as hard as he could or that the game is toned down for gameplay purposes even though there are cinematics that don't impact the game whatsoever which still portray these characters far more grounded than the community hypes them up to be. It's all just really silly, indirect methods of expressing that they want their preferred character to be more powerful and are willing to draw circles around content and lore and manipulate 'evidence' to get there.

[@ikeillue8385]

@@unendingvoid Indeed.

[@unendingvoid]

@@ikeillue8385 At least it is likely that the 'meta' will always shift around as some people grow tired of the behaviour of most of these Vs community scalers. There will always be those who can see reason and be more objective and realistic, so trends can change with time

[@a_spoonxdd]

I love watching your vids, so detailed and incredible narrative voice.

[@JahWooooo]

Toaster really said i want a war

[@Axiologicalitsuki425]

Bro started the great ninja war 💀

[@aeroscantsee1665]

Toriyama and koyama don't agree with each other because toriyama himself forgor

[@pisaschitt787]

We all love kratos here, but ya'll have to actually downplay goku if you guys want kratos to win against him. Throw these 2 characters in an actual match and kratos would lose badly against ultra instinct goku (even ssj 1 goku should be enough but that's just me). Kratos's "unlimited strength" is full of bs cos it wasnt even shown in the game nor in the prequel comics. Kratos's ability to "surpass time" is non existent, that's literally just a one time special occasion and he literally needs the help of the sisters of fate (which are the only characters that holds timelines) and even they arent that strong if kratos trapped them in their own mirrors. Try putting kratos up against actual time controlling characters and he cant do a thing. The god of war universe is literally an example of all talk, where it just tells you feats through items and such but its really different on actual gameplay/execution. Even if the creators says he can do this and that, there's no way they can prove it because they didnt give the character a chance to actually show such feat (like the unlimited strength). If ya'll really want a videogame character to go against goku, why not asura from asura's wrath? The gameplay is the only proof we need. All his feats can be proven in the gameplay because he actually did it unlike most of the non existent feats in god of war. And besides, goku vs asura is a more appropriate match

[@BautistaRuiz-im2rj]

Kratos destroy goku easy

[@DirtyDev]

Finally someone with common sense

[@RAFAEL18492]

​@@BautistaRuiz-im2rjexplain then

[@theretroshogun2961]

Ya know thats my only gripe with GOW and most video game characters in general. Most don't really display there power and when they do, it's really tame compared to Lore and everything else we've been shown.

[@demonichunter7925]

Ultra instinct would only at max give him a even shot for a min tops till kratos takes it into another gear, ultra instinct has already been tagged many of times, hes gonna dodge a few times and kratos is gonna notice this and adapt, don't mess with the literal god of war, combat is his nature he doesn't practice it (he does but no where to the extent Goku does) kratos learns on the spot where as Goku needs to either loose and come back twice as hard or plot. Kratos has never been driven back in any of his fights infact whenever he fights hes the one pressing them, until now when he's trying to be more defensive, and the notion of old Norse Kratos is weaker than young Greek Kratos is only applicable in hax regards, physically hes far more terrifying. Kratos grows stronger as he ages on top of him taming his temper (which is his greatest strength unironically) he hasnt snapped yet like how his old self did (youthful version) kratos is constantly holding back in these games for Atreus sake. Kratos bolo's Goku physically, burying jirin, brutalizes Beerus, and whis... He's probably the best outside the grandaddy of angels himself. Whis still looses tho in my eyes due to cosmology size difference reasons.

[@Callsign_Reaper4]

I can agree with this video's analysis completely. People tend to not realize that the Greek and Norse pantheon in God of War are basically seperate dimensions with infinite sized universes ontop of them. The director of the series stated when asked about why both greek and norse gods saying they created the universe in their own ways with "They both did". Then keep in mind, the Greek Pantheon primordials fought before time and creation existed, making their speed simply beyond that of time itself. Thanatos, the god of death, was a primordial. And Kratos destroyed him

[@PeteP-n1x]

And goku can destroy universes infinitely bigger than ours

[@cold485]

​@@SnakeInTheRainsomeone didn't watch his fight with beerus. Ssgod. And that was unmotivated (not emotionally or whatever) goku. Who beerus kept picking on for holding back. That was also the first time in ssgod so it's the weakest ssgod. They almost destroyed the universe wutg punches clashing not even at full power. Goku has since surpassed that version of ssgod, with super saiyan blue, then ssblue kaioken, then ultra instinct. Where he easily beat jiren who could transcend time before powering up and being unmotivated, jiren with all the motivation and power up couldn't touch him. And Kratos will?

[@cold485]

@@SnakeInTheRain oh cool. I didn't know that. I thought it was close enough. But goku has surpassed jiren who has surpassed God tier destroyers, who can destroy planets with no effort at all so I imagine they can destroy universes or A universe. About the time. It was stated by an angel that jiren possesses the power to transcend time itself, and the angles know quite a lot, they were the main explainers on the ToP and where correct all the time I think with calling fights and explanations. So I think they are credible it maybe the writers made a mistake or the angles know that if someone can do that to that technique without powering up or being motivated, using little will power and use it to transcend a time trap then they could beat time itself. Using only his eyes and will. But I don't know any of this as fact. But thank you for the response.

[@servine1212]

​@@SnakeInTheRainThe best example of DBZ characters being galaxy plus is applying the canon the transformstion multipliers to their best feats (usually planet busting, or people using the goku vs beerus clash as a fight that would actually destroy the universe, which seems pretty nonsensical since far higher intensoty battles have happened "such ass beast gohan vs cell" that didnt have a similar inpact". Also dyspos light speed for absolutely shits on dbz power scaling and O love tim

[@purplesky4157]

@@servine1212bro it’s anime/fictional action. It’s super inconsistent just like every other series. Beerus and goku were definitely destroying the db macrocosm. U can’t deny that, it’s a fact. Does it make sense that after when they got stronger they didn’t do anything like that again? No but again it’s anime and dbs at that which is super inconsistent. Many series if not every series is like that. God of war is like that as well.

[@thenappyninja]

You didn't really compare. You simply gave feats and made a seemingly arbitrary decision.

[@BigGoonie]

No... Kratos has more impressive feats so he wins its that simple.

[@j_d_b.]

@@BigGoonie Hes basing his feats off thing in the GoW universe, he never found a feat that Goku and Kratos shared.

[@BigGoonie]

@@j_d_b. No... did you even watch the video?

[@powerscaleroffiction959]

@@BigGooniehe legit lowballed goku and probably highballed kratos. bro nearly said kratos is 6d somehow. and this is powerscaling, not just basing power off feats. i've already scaled goku, he scales above "infinite 5D". he just got big and has lowballed him. didn't even mention the realms beyond the multiverse.

[@repeater6852]

​@@powerscaleroffiction959POH kratos is 5D

[@millardbaldwin7650]

This wasn’t a very compelling argument for kratos being able to take goku. Like a lot of his feats are “this god did this and kratos killed him, therefore kratos has the same capability” If that’s the case then goku can breath in space since he fought fresa, that means he can regenerate like kid buu since he beat him. That means he is able to absorb planets because he beat Moro. Also I just don’t like the fact that your try to compare “creation” feats to “destructive” capability. If Elon musk can create a car therefor Elon has the destructive cabailites of a car sound stupid doesn’t it? Another point of giving kratos the same strength as others doesn’t track either. If a body builder gets stabbed in the back by a theif does that make the theif body builder levels of strength? In order to properly convey kratos strength you need calculable feats. A good example is whenever he’s holding back a Titian in GOW3 that is a feat. Saying “kratos killed Thor so since Thor did this thing, that mean kratos can too” that’s not a feat, that is speculation. So for the VS you put goku’s calculable feats against your speculations. So I would deem this argument as lacking in any compelling points.

[@somedudes6455]

Holy shit someone who actually thinks this through. Yeah you're completely right and some other things that he says that doesn't make sense is "the world tree surpasses space time", that's like saying I can run 1.89 million tonnes, the units have to actually make sense. You can't be stronger than space and time, not because space and time are that strong but because it literally makes no sense to say that. You can't be stronger than distance because they are two different ideas.

[@kombatman8802]

These are really bad analogies 😂

[@somedudes6455]

@@kombatman8802 are you gonna elaborate?

[@kombatman8802]

@@somedudes6455 Yes I will. For one he compares Goku being unable to breathe vs Frieza being able to breathe just because they fought. Acting like that’s equivalent to Kratos beating the shit out of a god on a physical and energy level and therefore using that logic to scale Kratos to the god in terms of ap. Ap is energy output. They literally have nothing to do with each other. He compares kid buu regenerating vs Goku being unable to, this is a straw man no one ever said that just because a god can create a universe Kratos also has the ability to create a universe. What is being said is that the god scales to 4D from creating a space time and Kratos is above that god. Therefore his attacks are 4D level. He compares freaking Elon “creating” a car( whatever the fuck that means you can’t create unless you have reality waiting cars you build them and Elon doesn’t even build cars in the first place) to characters literally expending the universe out of their body. No you can’t compare someone building a house which can take months all while using outside materials to help themselves, to someone housing big bang levels of energy inside of them without being phased and expending it to make the universe. He acts like Kratos beating Thor who can splinter multiversal trees isn’t a feat for Kratos. If Thor can fuck up Multiversal tree with his own strength and weapon then don’t you think that makes Thor multiversal? He didn’t have to use to broken ability or hax to do he just straight up broke it on a physical level. And the fact that Kratos can physically harm Thor and endure attacks from him going all out shows that Kratos scales to Thor. The fact that you said he was “actually thinking this through” with these terrible analogies is really telling.

[@kombatman8802]

@@somedudes6455 No the world tree doesn’t “surpass” space and time. It transcends space and time on a dimensional level. It’s literally no different than a human transcending a square. Those are two completely different meanings.

[@timcanny3246]

I'm sure you don't care, but this comment is for people who do care. I did a Power Scale based off of Gokus' Zenkai Boosts alone with the Anime SSG absorbtion into his base form, Not counting training. I started the power scale off of Gokus' Buu Base. A quick note: Zenkai boosts give a 33% boost to your base power if you are a Full Blooded Saiyan. I say Full Blooded because Hybrid Saiyans seem to work differently, but I don't need to get into that seeing as how we are just talking about Goku. So here are the results of my DBS Power Scale: Starting off of with Buu Saga Gokus' Base power level of 60,000,000. Beerus destroying him brings his base up to 79,800,000 after eating a Senzu. Goku after absorbing the powers of SSG is 6,384,000,000,000,000 Given that the SSG Multiplier is 24 Billion times base. Gokus' Base after Beerus leaves is 8,490,720,000,000,000. Goku after getting clipped by Sorbet : 1,129,265,760,000,000,000. Goku after being poisoned by Frost : 150,192,346,080,000,000,000. Goku after the Kaioken breaks his body against Hit: 19,975,582,028,640,000,000,000. Goku vs Goku Black Round 2 : 2,656,752,409,809,120,000,000,000. Goku vs Goku Black Round 3: 3.533.480.705.046.130.000.000.000. Goku Post Zamasu : 46,995,293,377,113,530,000,000,000. Hit Kills Goku : 62,503,740,191,560,990,000,000,000. Goku Vs Toppo : 83,129,974,454,776,120,000,000,000. Goku Vs Jiren Round 1: 11,056,286,602,485,220,000,000,000,000. Goku VS Jiren Round 2 : 14,704,861,181,305,350,000,000,000,000. Goku Vs Kefla : 19,557,465,371,136,110,000,000,000,000. Goku Vs Jiren Round 3 : 26,011,428,943,611,030,000,000,000,000. MUI Breaks Goku : 34,595,200,495,002,670,000,000,000,000. Goku Vs Broly : 46,011,616,658,353,550,000,000,000,000. It takes a power level of 10,000 to blow up a Jupiter sized planet and a Power level of 10,000,000,000,000 to destroy a Universe in Dragon Ball. And if you want Post Broly Movie Transformation Numbers here you go (these are just insane): Super Saiyan: 23,005,808,329,176,780,000,000,000,000,000,000 Super Saiyan 2: 46,011,616,658,353,550,000,000,000,000,000,000 Super Saiyan 3: 18,404,646,663,341,420,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 Super Saiyan God: 36,809,293,326,682,840,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan: 1,840,464,666,334,142,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan Kaioken x20: 736,185,866,533,656,800,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 Unofficial Mastered Ultra Instinct: 21,170,688,675,152,780,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 Call it B.S. if you want but these are the facts as I see them. My Formula was to take the OG number onto a Calculator and Multiply it by 0.33 and then add that result onto the OG number. These are just Zenkai Boosts and Absorbing SSG into base thanks to the Anime. It's no wonder people believe misinformation, because not many people know how to properly do research if any at all. Please listen to more than just a handful of sources, otherwise you'll believe this "Scaling" of Goku is true. Even Deathbattle only used a power level from the Battle of Gods feat, stacked a transformation multiplier to it and called it a day. I honestly thought that ToasterXD was a Valid source of info, because of Videos like "Why Goku Vs the Big 3 Isn't Close", but as we can see with this video, all he did was what Death Battle does, where he takes feats and stacks them against eachother like a toddler smashing two action figures together. I am a Diehard God of War Fan and a Diehard Dragon Ball Fan, but Kratos isn't winning this one. Even the KZbin Poll this guy put up says Goku would win by 70%.

[@BautistaRuiz-im2rj]

Cry kratos destroy this shit overrated

[@drunkenrambler8138]

Just wanna say that goku had a zenkai after the captain ginyu fight of over 100 times. So, its not 33%

[@timcanny3246]

@@drunkenrambler8138 Then you can just say this is a low-ball (I mean it is anyway because I only counted Zenkai Boosts)

[@captaincringe9480]

All those multipliers are impressive if you wanna say it means goku is like sextillions of times uni+ the problem is if even you wanna scale goku to multiversal because of that, goku no matter how big of a multiplier you'd give him would still be a finite amount of strenght into 4d. While kratos by scaling to the ydrassil is already infinite in 5d. Kratos even without being 5d (which is already beyond an infinite amount above 4d) has a multiplier infinitely greater then everything you just said. As he is infinitely high into 5d while goku once again is finite 4d.

[@timcanny3246]

@@captaincringe9480 In Dragonball Universal+ means dimensional as well.

[@mightybatillo]

Goku could levitate 3 feet about Kratos, and he wouldn't be able to touch him. Checkmate.

[@Apocalypse_0415]

his swords are on chains

[@ozziewhite6428]

​@@Apocalypse_0415 that and he has a boomerang axe now.

[@CS1TR7]

He has ranged weapons 💀

[@ADashofSand]

He literally flies with someone else's wings in game 💀

[@SergioGT00]

Hahaha true XD

[@BlackRacer4]

One of the best scaling related videos I've seen in a while.

[@candytime-_-]

lore kratos murders, kratos feat wise has only arrow level reaction speed and mountain level AP ( You should've used xeno goku game version to make this fight more interesting)

[@jayari7674]

I mean if we go with only what we saw and not the lore of it then goku is lazer/bullet level.

[@candytime-_-]

@@jayari7674 🗿

[@datboy038]

Kratos flipped the temple(quite easily) which was stated to carry the weight of the 9 realms each of which are their own universe(infinite in size). So yeah that alone kinda outdoes EVERY feat Goku has ever done strength wise

[@candytime-_-]

@@datboy038 yet struggle to fell a tree 🗿

[@datboy038]

@@candytime-_- wtf is “fell a tree”

[@nexus_keeper]

Kratos has, according to lore, infinite physical strength.

[@Dee-sh1il]

Doesnt mean u are unbeatable..Goku is limitless technically aswell

[@theblackswordsmen-nb3xx]

"According" no he doesn't if he did the games and comics would turn out very differently cuz Zeus and the other gods even the Norse Pantheon wasn't even universal besides surtur and the primordials but even then they weren't multiversal like Goku and his vers

[@SuperBabythe2nd]

@@theblackswordsmen-nb3xxi feel like you haven’t played a god of war game before or read the lore

[@criistiaann_sw]

no

[@Re-Bourne]

​@@Dee-sh1illimitless potential kratos just straight up defies all odds without losing and nothing but raw physical strength.p

[@MrCraftyScales]

W video but I'm confused on why you didn't mention the higher dimensions that exist in Dragon Ball like the super dimensions hyperspaces or super spaces I'm not talking about the afterlife btw

[@hundredpercentfaxspitting]

Same.

[@GameZone-m5r]

dragon ball don't exist hyper space🤣🤣😂😂

[@DionAnims]

​@@GameZone-m5ryes it was lmao

[@Nobleman23]

@@GameZone-m5rClearly haven’t watch Dragon Ball at all.

[@princevegeta2715]

Those are not higher dimensional. Only around 4D

[@tickdiny7789]

Bro forgot to include both of gokus and Kratos's power of fanboys

[@BautistaRuiz-im2rj]

Fangays forece goku beat kratos

[@durhamelijah942]

@@BautistaRuiz-im2rj I’m not defending either side or picking one but calling them fangays is unreasonable and will cause conflict with said fangays

[@vulkan4108]

I feel like Beerus vs Kratos would be more fitting as yk... Beerus a good lol, good video man

[@CattusTheDevourer]

G.o.d *ahem*

[@fire3769]

Kratos literally solo the whole midball verse including zeno

[@FZresetYT]

​@@fire3769 xenoverse and heroes goes brrrr, overrated kratos can't solo that

[@fire3769]

@@FZresetYT kratos solo the whole anime not just dragon ball , video game characters are simply on another level

[@jamesrobinson5553]

​@@fire3769 and your father simply doesn't exist in your life

[@walkerweir7194]

I think both are more even then a lot of people think and I believe it could go either way just based on feats and statement interpretation alone. But both are some of the most powerful characters ever.

[@Icouldcareless9000]

Bruh goku can destroy an entire planet and go ultra instinct witch can dodge any punch no matter how fast it is

[@Aesir947]

@@Icouldcareless9000yeah, that’s a planetary feat. We have Kratos fighting a 1600ft titan that is above time and space fighting before dimensions. He wiped out the entire of Greece, killed Norse characters that are above logic and scale above space and time and scales on metaphysical cosmological conceptualtion. He killed Thanatos, Thanatos is the concept of death and lives in a realm that has no time or space, he is above the concept of death and was able to outrun death. Kratos survived being stabbed by the blade of Olympus, the blade can kill gods, titans, and immortals. Showing Kratos has true immortality. He fipped Tyrs temple, which was stated to way 1,774,000 tons. Kratos also killed atlas, atlas held the entire COSMO and heaven on his back, heaven is an infinite realm and weighs to infinite amount. Making atlas strength infinite, Kratos was able to overpower atlas while atlas was full power. He defeated garm, garm chewed on the fabric of space and time and caused permanent space tear through the realms, as well as we know garm is immortal. And it’s much more.

[@Dee-sh1il]

@@Aesir947weak argument fam he isnt as fast as goku basically meaning he cant see or touch him… two completely different lvls..

[@Aesir947]

@@Dee-sh1il he has infinite speed with the boots of Hermes, assuming we’re scaling Kratos in general, then him having boots would make his speed infinite. You got discord? We can debate it. I’m not debating you in KZbin comments.

[@malkagha63]

@@Aesir947 ill debate you

[@StareachValcin]

I honestly think that Goku has the strength, skill, abilities, and enough experience to be able to defeat Kratos.

[@UnstableShortGuy]

same

[@serpany2044]

Goku hasn’t got anything close to kratos especially in experience since kratos has killed 20+ gods has been in two of mythologies greatest wars being a general in both plus kratos is older than goku

[@ramrin8293]

Kratos is quite literally older than goku millenias worth just an exageration but you get it

[@nldjunior]

@@serpany2044 Those Gods aren't the gods from dragon ball

[@serpany2044]

@@nldjunior they are far more powerful

[@onyx6774]

you didnt mention the Dimension Gogeta and Broly fough in, infinite Zamasu and maybe even the Zeno realm (I saw a Guide where it said that there was universes on top of Zenos pillars, and even in the anime Zeno treats the universes as chess pieces). I wonder why nobody talks about them...I maybe understand Zeno realm not being talked about, but still you should have at least mantioned them this is not even who won or whatever is just, ive nerver seen someone talk about them whatsoever, they should at least be mentioned.

[@omlandah]

Gogeta and broly movie dimension is a super dimension. And there are realms like unknown dimension under beerus's planet, the dimension goku black cut through, the angel realm, divine realm of all earth's guardian's spirit exist, realm where z fighters trained for the saiyans, kami's look out clock room where all the present, past and future events recorded which literally helped kid goku to time travel.

[@kuroto7773]

Problem is that Gogeta and Broly dimension has little to zero of information about it which making anything pointless

[@Josephcantor-v5p]

@@omlandah That isn't really a dimension. A dimension gogeta and broly fought in would be easily just a random void or shattered the fragments of reality. it isn't really self explainable or even make sense becasue gogeta and broly were suppose to transcend the place already or they shouldn't have came back. They just disappeared and came back. which is a phrase of rewriting reality with force

[@omlandah]

@@Josephcantor-v5p nope, in the light novel the chapter's name was "Battle in the Super dimension", you can check that. Each hit was destroying several space walls and literally crumbling the entire dimension.

[@Josephcantor-v5p]

@@omlandah It doesn't mean they transcended it. They just ascended to that dimension. they may be able to damage the dimension but they don't exist above it

[@evilCODrays]

Its actually more consistsent then most people think that goku has at the very least infinite speed imo. First he moved in hits pocket demention that stops time. Whether u wanna say oh the manga says hit cant effect stronger opponents as well, then u clearly misunderstood the sentence, obviously hit cant effect someone stronger, cause theyre stronger then hit... thats literally how it works. So first instance of infinite speed, second is him doing it again this time without kk×10. Third and quite frankly one that isnt really disputable, goku going back for zeno in trunks erased timeline. There was no space or time as to wipe infinite zamasu out, u had to wipe that out too. Which btw is infinite speed. Fourth if u really wanna dispute the infinite universe be my guest but if u agree then right there goku has infinite speed as beerus is shown to be capable of travelling it, so is a casual whis and later on too in the manga. So its actually far more consistent goku having infinite speed. Furthermore the afterlife within itwelf is stated to be a higher demention by how much, who knows but within that claims self, that means the afterlife is 4D, considering the universe is similar in size, should make the construct at least 5D. Then goku understandably scales above this later. Even too the point him powering up (and jiren flexing) can affect realm that has no space and time, like the world of void. Gokus scaling is seriously underrated, man is easily 5D at the least, likely 6D high balling/equating his power growths. This isnt to say goku wins, as i genuinely dont remember where kratos was put at, though goku isnt a pushover like most people think.

[@lordquastheonly]

You did a way better job of scaling goku in this video than toaster did he utterly downplayed the shit outta goku while wanking kratos to infinitely 5D

[@tankbeast8480]

Kratos fought the god of speed it's a bigger feat than infinite speed

[@evilCODrays]

@Tank Beast when was the point of what i said about goku vs kratos? I was directly talking about whether or not infinite speed is consistent for goku. I even state at the end "this isn't to say goku wins". Even then pretty sure its mentioned in the video that the god of speed has infinite speed and that kratos did infact struggle with him. So there's that somewhere in the vid.

[@Someone2828-t6w]

​@@tankbeast8480 Hermes is literally stated to have infinite speed in myth .

[@repeater6852]

Hit stores the time he stops to make the pocket dimension, via whis's statement, which debunks the first 2 points as its just skipping time. It looks like from the void, that Zeno didn't actually destroy the timeline, but everything in the timeline, which is why they could get back via time machine. Meaning time still existed. Also this would be incredible inconsistent as this would make Future Trunks the same speed as Goku. People need to learn what 5D actually is, multiple 4D universes in one area means its a low multiverse.

[@rdc6360]

7:37 those are illusion affection kratos they arent real, when kratos realise that the illusions go away they affect their targets perception to see what there is nothing to see. Seeing a start in the background anything in it would also be an illusion and potential universal?, the shinsekai in the bottom of heavenly realm (gods temple in db), we see many actual stars in it, so by your logic is can also be potentialy universal, and unlike the furies example, we see their are actually real as the travel in space and wee se the stars very closely. 7:47 false, they are not the strongest, kratos beat them easly and struggle much more against zeus in gow 2. GOW ragnarok, kratos states they control life and time, they do not have direct fate manipulation. 9:43 fake scans, in the gow fanbase you will encounter many fakes scans like these. Can be sourced or verify when making the reasearch. The pillars destruction will only destroy what the greeks thinks is the world, so only their country. I will explain that below AFTER. 10:27 surprised atks, doesnt scale to baldur. The snake was occupied with kratos and atreus and wasnt prepare for this. 10:52 never stated to be a single blow, only the battle between the snake and thor did this. The world tree transcending time space, means its range is beyond that of the realms space time, thus transcending the space time range of the realms. The branches arent more complex to the other one, that was never stated nor showned. The branche tree is not infinite the sentence in the novel says strechning out to infinity, when you strech your arm towards the sky you do not reach it you are not beyond it. You are simply strenching towards that direction, thus the word "TO". Gow ragnarok debunks this notion, by saying the tree branches can be overgrown and fall. If you are infinite there is no more weight added that would make you fall from your infinite. Not to mention its affect by gravity. Also the overgrown, would mean there is a limit to witch it can grown, infinite doesnt have such. Herms doesnt have infinite speed, he was tagged by the speed of a catapult. He was also damaged from a statue falling into the ground. 11:40 needs scans of that. -Tartarus is not infinite, same with the underworld. Its stated in the gow ps2 manual that its inside of earth, which is finite (earth is stated to have an edge by the events of gow 2 were kratos needed to go the edge of earth to find the sisters of fate). The river styx in the both novels (gow 1 novel) and gow 2 strats guide book states its the physical limit to underworld. One thing about the cosmology, barlog, bruno and sophos made it clear that all the myths are in 1 singular universe seperated by geographie, one can easly walk from a pantheon to an other. This means that its just like real life. If all myths exist, and they all claim they made or did something, that would mean that specific myth from their point of view is true, just like in real life we have different myths that explains how the world was made. Since that is true, it would be the myths assumption that they created this or that. Therefor, it cannot be factual, whatever happends in greece for example, will only be country level. Sopho gow 3 game direction was even asked in vs battle with an other character who he knew what a solar system buster and he thinks that this is too much for kratos. That woulld also mean the "infinite, immeasurable statements"s for specific realm like the underworld, is false, since if you can physically walk from an entire pantheon you would also walk from that underworld for example as it only exist in the greek world. To conclude, the gow verse is a singular universe with all pantheons existing on the same planet separed by geographie. Because the separation to these pantheons is geography like countries, it would also mean that pantheon would also scale to that country. This kills the infinite, innacessible, immeasurable speed argument for kratos for the greek pantheon atleast. And since he his weaker then he his in greek, he therefor would scale from not being on those speed levels. Goku having feats better then kratos, would kill him with a single blast, that is ignorant the anti-feats he has by the way.

[@ToasterXD]

A big ol’ nothing burger. Toaster#9850

[@rdc6360]

@@ToasterXD Just like most of ur vid, DemonKingZeldris 8184

[@ToasterXD]

@@rdc6360 debate me on it then lil bro

[@rdc6360]

@@ToasterXD My tag is already above. And i am not ur little bro, you fodder.

[@ToasterXD]

I dropped my tag first lil bro. So either stop whining in my comment section or come settle the disagreement in a debate.

[@Seraphim653]

Base goku bunk The db verse is very based off of our world and mathematics (as stated by koyama) meaning it has set theory and jung theory. Set theory has a Cardinal graph Which has inaccessible Cardinals which are considered high outerversal And Mahlo Cardinals which are considered baseline boundless. Mahlo Cardinals are boundless because even subsets of alpeh encompasses r*n where n equals spital dimensions.. Aleph 1 is inaccessibly above aleph null making aleph 1 outerversal Inaccessible Cardinals are inaccessible to all alephs making them high outer Since jung theory is outer, Cardinal graph considering, that they have inaccessible Cardinals being above aleph null is strongly inaccessible in eligibility, And since Mahlo Cardinals are Metafictional via its legit being above the axiom hierarchy of hyper Cardinals. And cantor's theory> overall ZFC theory And absolute infinity is above that, which the cantor's theory states to be an unfathomable infinitive state, Meaning it's concentually ahove the tierina system, which goku transcends in base form now onto the cosmology The Mortal Realm has it's 3 dimensional plane, of which it's Space-Time Continuum transcends which makes it 4D There are Higher Dimensions above the Space-Time Continuum, and beyond time, which are then 5D The Afterlife is a Metaphysical land that transcends dimensionality, it's Metaphysical meaning it contains causality the concept of time and space and Mathematics, which is Outerversal The Macrocosm contains the Afterlife The Kaio-Shin Realm is located outside the Macrocosm used to watch over the Realms inside the Macrocosm Each Universe has a Macrocosm and a Kaio-Shin Realm There are 12-18 Universes per Multiverse There are Infinite Timelines because of the Many Worlds Interpretation, of which each timeline has a Multiverse, which would make the Infinite Timelines High Outerversal Infinite Zamasu was stated and implied to affect the Past, Present and Future which implies all Infinite timelines liren is then ctated to he ctronder than Infinite Zamasu, of which Goku negs Jiren Which means Goku is Nigh Infinite layers into High Outerversal with Irrelevant speed since he can move in the Afterlife which is a land unbound and where there is a lack of the Concept of Time, and he's also unbound by dimensionality which also means he automatically gets Irrelevant speed Conclusion: (Mid ball) Tier: High Outerversal+ (at the very least) Speed : Irrelevant 2nd scaling Dr. Slump views every book and every piece of media as fiction, making r›f transcendence present in the Dr. Slump verse. This includes Dragon Quest, a game that contains realms that transcend space, time, and form. Chaos in the verse actually transcends space-time, and of course being transcendent over space-time = transcendent over dimensionality = outerversal. So chaos in Dragon Quest transcends dimensionality. Dimensionality is a outerversal mathematic, so transcending order of dimensionality = outer - high outer depending on the conceptual level of transcendence, and what wiki you're using (Csap or Vsbw), in which case Dr. Slump has the highest level of conceptual transcendences. In fact, Arale proves this, because in the Dr Slumn manaa she finds a printer that can print an infinite loop of anything, including the manga itself, and actual panels in the manga, which would make Dr. Slump have infinite outerversal transcendences over Dragon Quest and all games infinitely. This would make Arale have inf layers of potent high outerversal energy, and since Arale lives in Dr. Slump's area (penguin village), and Penguin Village is canon within the DB world map, then that would indirectly make EVERY INDIVIDUAL HUMAN in DB to be inf layers with potent high outerversal energy. Credits : @middletrack, @JC3178 links and a guy named ife : m.kzbin.info fWWHFHibfsU m.kzbin.info/www/bejne/eYPYaIt_f61rmrc m.kzbin.info/www/bejne/eomYdGtum5uLZ5o Also btw, Arale literally outran Sonic the Hedgehog, and the inf loop of r>f transcendences I talked about are constantly lower than the Original Arale, (the one that viewed the second Arale as a piece of paper), thus making the original Arale have r>f transcendence over the second one. Toriyama himself states that when it comes to these stuff the other staffs know more and hence as long as he doesn't disapprove them it's canon Then kratos bunk Kratos bunk a fan asked Cory about a scan that was apparently deleted on the Facebook and if the world tree transcends space and time or abstract concepts and this is what Cory replied with: "Rich knows more about this stuff, but I'd say that's a valid interpretation. Freya was talking about the literal concepts of space and time there. And the realms being infinite in size due to them existing on the yggdrasl's strands.(which transcend the said concept of space and time)." Outer feat. And Gaia is someone without dimensions. And it's stated in the god of war 2 novel: "Huge face moved from the fog without *dimension* or color before him. Gaia is someone without dimensions and also omnipresent. And zeus one shotted Gaia in god of war 3. And kratos manged to defeat Zeus. he lifted tyrs temple which contains the world tree, and the world tree isnt a replica of the yggdrasil because when tyr first steps into the portal, his first word is 'yggdrasil' proving that tyr's temple contains Yggdrasil. And the Yggdrasil far surpasses transcendency, and by norse mythology, can be proven as the mythologies absolute infinity because it is where everything starts and ends, where everything is born, where every timeline was ever created where anything to nothing and everything was created. And tbh this is understating how powerful the yggdrasil really is. Also stated that kratos was banished from greece by the surviving greek gods, and he was forced to walk to norse kratos dodged helios's light, this light was able to light up hell, + hell was type 9 inf size since a mythology never ends, meaning that there will be more souls to be judged heaven or hell , which is why its type 9 inf. infinity itself surpasses universal laws, but infinite hierarchies of infinite aka type 12 infinity FAR surpasses cm. cm level beings are 6-11-dimensional characters. Even 6-dimensional characters can logically easily destroy a more than countably infinite number of 5-dimensional space-time continuums, and 7-dimensional characters exceed that scale a more than countably infinite number of times, and so onwards. Yggdrasil being absolute infinity means that it has infinite hierarchies of infinity. even if a character is a more than countably infinite number of times superior to an infinite-dimensional space, or similar, it would still usually only qualify for High 1-B, as long as the character does not transcend the concepts of time and space altogether. This is from the tierring website, it states that a countable amount of infinite are qualified for 1-B Basically, a being or an object which is outside and beyond all dimensions of time and space. This is something completely formless, abstract, metaphysical and transcendental. This is an extract from the qualifications of 'outerversal' the yggdrasil far qualifies for this easily, considering it is the norse version of absolute infinity. Kratos lifted this shit which could far qualify for outerversal+ perhaps layers into boundless. all, we see that kratos uses the boc, which he used to kill gods which had poh, gods with poh are outerversal at the least because poh is a platonic concept that surpasses hierarchies of infinity, the boc was able to kill many outerversal gods meaning the boc are outerversal, further on in GoW 4 Kratos is seen to rather use the leviathan axe than the boc, this essentially summarises it to outer gods < boc < leviathan axe brok and sindri are the ABSOLUTE best black smiths in the game, but in mythology sindri is canon, and he is the best blacksmith in the entire mythology. Anyway, both brok and sindri state numerous times that they created mjolnir, and brok has implied that the leviathan axe is worse than mjolnir with quotes such as 'that babies second only to one' or 'im glad she held her own out there' and 'kind of the point' Kind of the point is the best informational quote for us because it implied the axe was not made to best mjolnir, but to hold its own against it. And finally absolute infinity is something that literally cant be reached, like no matter what you put on it absolute infinity surpasses. The Poh is Platonic concept

[@youraveragebutler9423]

At this rate, I really wanna see how an approach to a hypothetical "canon" Ultimate Life Form Kars within DBZ would go. (Fyi this just means ULF Kar's lore fits w/ DB. So it'd just mean Kars would essentially just be a better, immortal Cell.)

[@Churd_]

nah life native to earth includes nothing other than human in cells makeup, cell is made of aliens

[@Kyuubey0406]

He’d just be a weaker cell with all abilities Mafuuba or any sealing technique would beat him And, obviously zen-oh erasure.

[@broom673]

Kars isn't literally immortal in the sense that he can't be killed through force. Kars had to think quickly to come up with a way to protect himself from the lava in the volcano because it was just going burn him to ashes. He basically just has Cell level regen, but he does not have "immortality" like Zamasu does, being able to survive their body being completely destroyed and erased. He just has an infinite lifespan like a typical vampire.

[@SapostropheAint]

I think it is unfair to quantify conceptual lore scaling to literal physical acts, but to each their own.

[@PyroniumZ]

Well you kinda have to with most game characters because in the game they are heavily nerfed so the gameplay is actually fun

[@lightmohamed5700]

It’s the absolute opposite but yeah whatever

[@g.masterlordoftheg-force4770]

The problem with your idea is that game characters are heavily limited. For example, Kratos has incredible strength, yet cannot get through a locked door. Locked doors is an obstacle for pretty much all game characters no matter what kind of power they have. Or what about random debris? Someone strong should not have any issues going right through wood or rocks, yet the player is forced to take other paths.

[@CS1TR7]

Kratos is limited by game physics, logic, and mechanics

[@bob74h67]

@@PyroniumZ ''Well you kinda have to with most game characters because in the game they are heavily nerfed so the gameplay is actually fun'' Nonsense on all levels Games can have high end feats like bayonetta and asura's wrath also nobody talks about gameplay, people talk of cutscenes and in such cutscenes no multiverse lv anything happens to kratos,dante,doomslayer or any other lore scaling character it's all just in fans heads ie headcanon

[@dantemeriere5890]

It's hilarious how a 13 minute video gets completely shut down with a single word: hakai.

[@_tmaa_]

Hakai is literally verbatim same as poseidon's lightning💀. Poseidon's lightning completely erases the body and soul. Kratos can tank it during poseidon's boss fight

[@dantemeriere5890]

@@_tmaa_ False. It's proven in his fight against Hades that Kratos is susceptible to attacks against his soul. To make matters worse, Kratos would have lost against Poseidon if not for Gaia. It was also Gaia tanking his lightning, which makes sense since the Earth is itself immune to lightning. Meanwhile, a small speck of destruction energy vaporizes entire planets. It's not even on the same realm of comparison. Read that again: a small speck of destruction energy is sufficient to erase Gaia, something Kratos couldn't even do properly. If Goku were going for the kill, Kratos would very literally cease to be.

[@_tmaa_]

​@@dantemeriere5890he resisted the soul pull💀

[@nykaimcneil6082]

@@dantemeriere5890no limits fallacy you can’t say goku imperfect hakai can one shot any being

[@_tmaa_]

@@dantemeriere5890 Also I forgot to mention Zeus power nulled him and res negged him before he faced Hades so that arg becomes invalid

[@qtindavis433]

question. didnt goku ssblue with kaioken outspeed almost a second attack from the future verses hit???

[@Someone2828-t6w]

Yes .

[@BigGoonie]

Yes and no depends on the interpretation

[@qtindavis433]

@@BigGoonie what's the other interpretation?? I just read the page again and whis confirms it

[@lordquastheonly]

Yes he downplayed goku heavily in this video

[@nykaimcneil6082]

Hit time powers are negated against a stronger opponent Goku beating hit is a power feat not a strength feat

[@apotheosis1660]

Kratos was capable of striking and killing Post-Death Athena, via the power of Hope. And it is constantly stated that she has reached a higher plane of existence. Meaning that both she and Kratos are 4th/5th-Dimensional.

[@tanialogan-lewis2032]

So who wins

[@kugelgoat]

​@tanialogan-lewis2032 afterlife is 5d so goku is 5d bare minimum, this fight is more closer than one might think

[@ahmedthelssj9428]

Kratos fans say he is 5d goku fans say he is 5d research

[@trollking6315]

This is wank. Power of Hope left him at the end of GOW 3 as did all of his prior weapons and power. It is even stated in the new games he is a fraction of is old power due to it being tied to the realm that was destroyed (greece)

[@_tmaa_]

​@@trollking6315it isnt wank it legit just scales POH Kratos💀.

[@aAaa-gj1lh]

12:20 thats a pretty valid argument, until you state the impossibility of goku's power scaling being that high, because an unnoficial source denied the validity of its own claims, thats like saying that Jiren is not planetary because someone not affiliated with the creation of the character would state it, and following the fact, deny that its statements are from being canon.

[@ThatOnePinkGorilla]

Even though I am a db fan and I don’t play or know anything about god of war, I think that yes Kratos would win against Goku because the facts can’t be suppressed. Also I thot it was funny that you said that Kratos would beat Goku up with Saitama’s limbs. I can just imagine Goku being done clap slap disrespecting Saitama’s dead teared apart body then Kratos coming beating the ever living $&@& out of Goku with said limbs.

[@lexkek5625]

The ability to kill gods that represent concepts, ideas, and objective truths of s world seems very ambiguous for any kind of power scaling. The games aren't accurate representations of strength either. Idk why people love to to use the games are hard evidence. It's kinda ridiculous to compare video game mechanics to anime and manga.

[@deusgamemaster2242]

Maaaan, I thought you would be higher than that, never expected Kratos meat riding from you. After Granola Arc Goku slams GoW mid difficulty.

[@Jesse_Tvrs]

fax

[@ReversedTrap]

Goku meat riders lol

[@PyroniumZ]

Goku meat riders when someone says that goku loses

[@ReversedTrap]

@@PyroniumZ fr

[@PyroniumZ]

@Vizzlex Lore Kratos beats Goku. Its just facts bro. Go read the lore or something instead of talking about a character you dont know about. And dont act that people arent angry because he said that goku would lose to anyone. Most goku fans either only put goku against weak characters or overwank him to beat others because they cant accept their favorite character losing. Its almost always about losing and not just kratos. Yall fr make saitama tards look good and they say that a multi galaxy level(with high ball) character is universal or above

[@the_midnight_noodle7614]

im liking this video because it comfirms my bias, very good video

[@justarandomcursedlego5972]

I never understood the reason people use feats and scaling to try and see who would win. Like sometimes when you simply just put them on a straight battlefield and look at their abilities to see who would win. Goku destroying a universe by punching wouldn't be valid because it requires a reasonably close power clash in which he is actually weaker than the opposing force. And could Kratos actually damage Goku seeing how he goes through the game. Instead of talking about scaling to other characters, are they actually strong when not comparing. Like to me I doesn't make since saying something like Character A beat Character B, and B was capable of destroying multiverses, so A must be whatever and stuff. Like what if A beat him using something that completely negates that fact like something specific like a weapon specifically meant for that villain.

[@Ultradude1]

No imagination

[@DirtyDev]

Goku is just massively faster and more powerful than Kratos, nothing in his arsenal will prevent him from being vaporized nor does he have feats supporting him being able to destroy celestial bodies whereas Goku has routinely overpowered foes who have been seen to destroy large celestial bodies. It’s just this simple.

[@ReversedTrap]

@@DirtyDev you saying goku wins but you show no proof at all

[@youngfish1370]

Beerus was matching Goku during their clash of Beerus used his full power Goku would’ve gotten 1 tapped. Mind you 1 punch from Goku could destroy the macrocosm and he absorbed that into his base. So even if you’re saying it took 2 people to do it then Goku only has to get twice as strong. With him absorbing that power in base and using Super Saiyan which is a 50x multiplier he would obviously be able to destroy the universe anyway. Yeah it makes sense that A can do what B can in some verses. Like Buuhan who is vastly stronger than Ssj2 Goku would definitely be able to do what Namek saga Frieza could power wise.

[@Superjoseph-vd3zc]

@@DirtyDevThis is…so unbelievably wrong.Kratos on the lowest of low balls is Low Complex Multiversal he was capable of destroying Large Celestial bodies since the installment of Ghost of Sparta

[@happyemoji598]

kinda funny how a guy who cant even destroy a continent can beat a guy who shaked the universe with a scream

[@fire3769]

If you’re gonna use the game mechanics then kratos is city level at best but the lore makes kratos high outversal

[@BigGoonie]

Oh you mean the guy who got hurt by a bullet is gonna beat the continental guy?

[@fire3769]

@@BigGoonie how is he continental when he is literally high outversal ?

[@BigGoonie]

@@fire3769 I was saying don't use low balled feats for Kratos because you can do the same for Goku.

[@happyemoji598]

@@fire3769 guy that is high outerversal got hurt by a wolf?

[@tvman250]

The amount of research you gotta put in for Kratos is wild. It’s worth it if you’re looking for wildly high scaling for him tho. If you include the ‘Battle Royale’ tournament, Kratos’ power can seem unbridled.

[@frenzyfrfr]

that orange piccolo and gamma 2 was hilarious 🤣

[@AnotherSWnerd]

Even if there weren't all these clear facts about dragon ball the visuals alone are convincing enough to cement its place in the hierarchy of power scaling. The shows make you believe they can perform such feats

[@Waashoe]

Visuals is not a way to scale feats, demon slayer is the prime example

[@cold485]

​​@@Waashoethey do though. Fighting so fast that Zeno can't see Everyone can see when Kratos runs. CLEARLY 😂, even the deer outro him, if he's so fast why not just catch them quick😂. Goku would It's never stated once that he's so that we can't see, let alone quick.

[@L1GHTF4N6]

​@@cold485ignore the game mechanics bro😂

[@j-dawg4774]

Your logic is if Kratos kills someone who is "transcended beyond time" even though this ability is never explained or used, he therefore gains the ability to be above time and space, which is the biggest load of bull I've seen, since Kratos can't stop time, or move faster than time itself or any of that bs. The way the Gods are in game are nowhere near the way they are in mythology, and that's the whole point, because they can be killed, and Norse Gods are somehow stronger than Greek Gods. Stop the cap.

[@TakezoMushashi]

Goku MUI is stronger all around than Kratos. Goku is low multiversal at the least, so where is Kratos lol? He loses to ice in canon. I want actual feats not just statements. And consistent ones at that.

[@Luh_Iphone]

nah

[@driddick7361]

It seems like people ignore the fact that magic is heavily used in God Of War. It terms of combat power, the deities of God of War are rarely at Dragon Ball Kami's level. Thor bended reality with the destruction of Yggdrasil, but it is literally the bridge between realms and a tangible object. Also considering the nine realms didn't collapse after Ragnarok, he didn't successfully destroy it entirely.

[@JadoBouhzam]

Yeah goku scales to 5d bareminum via since the afterlife is stated to transcend dimension and even without that the fight between gogeta and broly was superdimensional stated in the novel of dragon ball super broly so goku scales above that broly by the time of superhero arc so 5d scaling bare minimum putting him in even planefield with kratos the only difference is goku is 5d in base and can multiply is power billion of times over with his transformations and can negate most kratos hax via raw power as in dragon ball the stronger u than ur opponent u negate most of therr hax

[@Dantes_therapist.494]

There is no possible way that Kratos is defeating Goku I have played all of the gow games and tbe dbz games Kratos is at least High planetary level while goku in the manga is threat lvl multiversal as gokus mui in the T.O.P power lvl was 12 septillion and in the manga it was 25 septillion and yes Goku does have unmeasurable speed up 5 quadrillion times the speed of light Goku has punches strong enough to destroy planets or even universes in his base form. You forgot the fact that Goku observed all of that God of power in his base form power lvl of 100 trillion Goku speed is a 5 quadrillion times the speed of light he was able to travel across Hell in a week and hell is way bigger then the Multiverse and the speed of light can even cross a portion of a Multiverse you cannot exactly scale something in a video game. If you play the God of War 5 and when you are lifting the Giant Temple which has a weight of 500 million tons, you could have purposely fail it and say that Kratos wasn't able to lift the giant Temple. But yes lifting a 500 million ton Temple is a impressive feat. However Goku in the manga lifted a 2 billion ton weights in base form if you do not know the Super Saiyan multipliers to go to hear they are *ssj = 50x* *Ssj2 =100x* *ssj3 =400x* *ssj god = 2 quadrillionx *ssjb=50x boast to ssj god* *ui sigh=1k times boost* *mui=12k times boost* Kratos will not be able to beat Goku he will have to live at least 10,000 years also if you didn't know kratos's and mortal and can infinitely grow stronger the longer he ages the only way Kratos could possibly beat goku is if he changed Goku's fate the power of Hope won't be a option here

[@santiagosolis3918]

Where are you getting this numbers from? They seem fake as fck

[@ewanschirripa08]

What am gonna say is.. damn this was long and very good to read even dedicated and yes, I believe Goku win

[@landonaron4103]

You played all the Gow games and claim Kratos' planetary huh? Kratos overpowering thor who splintered the world tree, a single branch stretches on for infinity as stated in chapter 51 of the Gow novel? Kratos lifting the spear of hyperion which holds the cosmos? Kratos fighting the Valkyries who travel between realms almost instantly with these realms being there own universe sized pocket dimensions? Kratos killing Cronos who's the embodiment of space and time making him above them concepts while also the primordials were having full on wars before them concepts even existed yet also proving that point further, that alone makes him have beyond infinite speed, I can go on and on about how Kratos only being planetary is complete bs

[@drainershuttalz09]

people don’t realize how fast he is tho, bro would just speed blitz him

[@goofyahhprod]

​@@landonaron4103 If the World Tree is really infinite, how does it make sense for Ratotskr to say the Tree was overgrowing its roots and also had to be cut by stags. Also Ratotskr never brings up Thor and Jormangandr shaking it but does say Surtr shaked it. So either Ratotskr is lying or that's a direct contradiction to the tree being infinite.

[@Goofy_ahh_lobter]

We also have the feat from gogeta vs broly where they broke reality like 9 times just off of a clashing of fists

[@tankbeast8480]

Doesn’t matter can kill outer-verse brings you lose

[@Goofy_ahh_lobter]

@@tankbeast8480 ok but i can whoop kratos ass

[@Bungeez]

​@@Goofy_ahh_lobter Kratos would make you his son 💀

[@ROCKYPLAYA]

@@Goofy_ahh_lobter More like Goofy A$$ Loser.

[@KiSTekken]

But what if they didn't fight? What if they had to team up to fight a common threat 😎.

[@cheesefinder111]

Bro, the fact you called out the Outerversal wankers made me respect you alot, earned a sub from me

[@bobbobbos32]

I’m sure it will be even goku would shatter his limits

[@datboy038]

No goku would shatter his spine. Bitches be talking about him shattering his limits like in the tournament of power where the only reason he lived was because killing wasn’t allowed 😂

[@mr_samuraix]

Kratos is tree level 😂 That tree solos all.

[@Iceo09]

The tree is higher than god level thats why

[@thalastianjorus]

I love reading comments on these videos. People invariably make the exact same fallacious arguments in support of their favorite character - the best example is Goku vs Superman. _(you will see the exact same arguments made in countless comments under this video)_ They try to relate the movie Superman to Manga Goku, and other such things. The problem with almost all of these things, Superman, Kratos, and others, is that I have noticed that fans of Dragonball will bring in the Manga, movies, comments made by the creator in interviews and tweets, comments made by animators, voice actors, assessments made by anime only publications, etc etc etc... Then they get upset when people do the same for the opponents they are so certain that Goku should be able to beat. The endless tirade of comments such as "Well yeah, if you bring in all the stupid feats from the comics, sure, Superman is like a god, but that is stupid because..." on all of these videos. As a fan of multiple universes and characters I guess it is easier for me to notice the sheer scale of hypocrisy inherent in many arguments made by people in the "Goku Can Kill Everyone community."

[@_kenz_o]

yo thanks for the good explanation

[@ramyadam5380]

Using a wanked varient of kratos should be mathed with wanked varient of goku (dragon ball heroes)

[@expresserpin7730]

Wanked dbh goku is beyond the tiering system he solos fiction.

[@nicholasaugello2534]

A wanked version of Goku is high 7D to low 8D

[@datboy038]

This is nowhere near the wanked version of Kratos lmao

[@jhevgainz2307]

He didn’t wank kratos though.

[@TruePoseidon]

@@nicholasaugello2534 Did you even watch or read the SDBH manga?

[@TraxMaster_99]

kratos is not weakened in the new games, he nerfes himself, this is the equivalent of goku only fighting in base form without kaoiken or other transformations

[@Iz_z]

This was the one of the strangest vs video I’ve ever watched. I feel like you just lowballed goku and high balled kratos kinda. I think it would’ve been cool if there was both a low and high ball given for each character, seeing as many things can be interpreted differently. Or like how Goku would fair against Kratos from each of the gow separately. I also don’t see how kratos his handling mui Goku when kratos was struggling with heimdall.

[@cold485]

They are going to say "he was holding back" As if goku always fights at full power

[@_tmaa_]

Pretty simple Kratos would just outlast MUI I mean that shit barely runs for like what 2 minutes? Then just badly haxstomp him hell MUI doesn't do shit when ur opp is faster or more skilled.

[@tomchuur6431]

Heimdall would toy with Goku also. UI is different to Bifrost sense, too. They work far differently.

[@ZakuraTao]

Yay another video

[@simohayha4152]

Thor can literally hit so hard that the World Serpent got knocked back in time 💀and Kratos was taking shots from him while not trying to kill him I love Dragon Ball more than GOW but at most, you can highball DBZ top tiers to like 5D meanwhile Kratos casually should be in that realm of power

[@bob74h67]

And jiren broke hit's time dimension and was said as surpassing time Sending jourmandr back in the past by splintering the world tree is by comparison pretty trash

[@youngfish1370]

You don’t need to highball at the lowest db characters are 5D. Jiren is above time

[@_tmaa_]

​@@youngfish1370time is a temporal dimension not a spatial one. Transcending it isn't the same as transcending a spatial dimension.

[@merkingsavage6045]

​@@bob74h67Sending a godzilla sized snake back in time is trash? Your hella lowballing and being disingenuous

[@bob74h67]

@@merkingsavage6045 ''ending a godzilla sized snake back in time is trash?'' key word in my comment was by comparison yea by comparison to breaking hit's time dimension, thor's feat if you wanna call it that is kinda trash

[@StaySoju]

i can’t believe this is even a debate 😭😭😭😭

[@durhamelijah942]

which side you on? 🤨

[@ewanschirripa08]

​@@durhamelijah942goku

[@StaySoju]

@@durhamelijah942 goku

[@pisky5067]

For real, Goku does not have immeasurable strength nor infinite speed, he has zero chance of winning

[@Thomasapple123A]

@@pisky5067 the real arguement is average dragon ball fan vs average kratos fan in a fist fight.

[@joshhobs9257]

Remember buu has magic which in universe is pretty op and that mixed with Gohan's imeense ki potential makes him able to do a lot even at a lower level

[@oryxryox5687]

Ss3 characters tearing wholes in space

[@joshhobs9257]

@@oryxryox5687 I don't remember seeing that anywhere in the buu saga ╰⁠( ´⁠꒳⁠`)⁠╯(also side note: rarely does anyone use buu in scaling likely due to the fact he's mystic and that's always on a whole other level also Gohan was mystic form so that added to it along with the power level which usually has no actual baring on the magic and/or magical ability)

[@Neuvillete4.6]

​@@joshhobs9257 Gotenks screaming to tear out of the infinite dimension of time and space

[@tionaus]

​@@joshhobs9257 gotenks in ssj3 screamed and make a connection between the living realm and the room of spirit and time after the door was destroyed by Piccolo to trap him, gotenks and Super Buu to prevent the destruction of the earth

[@joshhobs9257]

@@tionaus wasn't buu the one who screamed a hole to escape,also you're dipping into fusion territory which is kinda similar to buu because it's on a whole other level because in most cases if not all the fusion can do things neither of the ones participating people can,buu turned vegito into candy and he was still beating him up,super blue gogeta broke reality while fighting broly,and not to point out a non canon thing using canon logic,ssj4 gogeta literally made confetti pop from his hands.

[@Yes-lb2ni]

Great video, i absolutely agree with this

[@jussaiyanz6275]

Swear this dude by far the best scaler in terms of power debates glad i found bro channel👏💪💪

[@adamamersid2701]

he ignored the dimensional scale of the kai realm being a 5d realm and the supreme kai realm which is higher dimensionaly

[@Troypal_._]

hes not

[@jacksparrow-os3iw]

@@adamamersid2701 if he did include it goku still loses

[@adamamersid2701]

@@jacksparrow-os3iw tell me what tier dimensionaly is kratos?

[@adamamersid2701]

@@Troypal_._ he's not what?

[@X-ray39]

Plz make sonic vs medaka

[@TheDoomSlayer-BFG]

i still think Goku wins because of his hax and abilities like the spirit bomb, kamehameha and the pew pew ki blasts :)

[@jhevgainz2307]

Kratos hax are far more potent than goku. Such as probability manip, soul manipulating and absorption, durability negation, various ways to manipulate time and many more

[@ΚωνσταντινοςΝικολοπουλος-χ4γ]

Goku needed to BE revived by the dragon balls Kratos just straight up came back to life like it didn't even matter

[@BigGoonie]

That shit doesn't help against someone infinitely stronger and faster than you.

[@TheDoomSlayer-BFG]

haters :)

[@TheDoomSlayer-BFG]

stay mad, my opinion is my opinion :)

[@Wallmart5]

I liked this video and made it 7k. Good video

[@LoneMyth]

Forget strength, fighting ability. The real question is can goku beat a concept of hope what kratos is.

[@_tmaa_]

Goku doesn't have CM type 1 so no he isn't separating hope from Kratos

[@boingyboing2]

Why goku vs archie sonic isnt close

[@kdospapaj]

Thats deluded

[@xXNaniPTXx]

5months ago you did a video about goku vs kratos, asura and doom slayer and made goku the winner and now your saying the complete opposite

[@BigGoonie]

Opinions change

[@PyroniumZ]

To be fair that was xeno goku not canon goku, but you could still debate that they could beat him depending on how you scale them

[@myusername3689]

Bro is tryna say Xeno Goku is the same as DBS Goku lmao

[@BigGoonie]

@@myusername3689 lol

[@bobica100]

Bet the next video will be „why door vs window isn't close“

[@joelott]

The thing you seem to not understand is. God of war is a game Dragonball is an actuall series with powerscaling If Kratos would be able to easialy beat Mui goku why is he moving slow as shit in the games why cant he fly why did he have so many struggles i mean i see why you say kratos wins since all the "evidence" is there but just think about it for more than 10 seconds and you see how goku wipes the floor with him it isnt fair to compare a game character to an character in a fighting show.

[@Iz_z]

I been thinking the same thing, like wtf didn’t anybody say this😭

[@Drunkgg775]

Where goku can fly like zeus can fly ik

[@riverman_lord]

Fr he’s high balling kratos

[@_tmaa_]

because they can't show the accurate representation of Kratos in the games? Devs have stated this numerous times lmao

[@lunarnightcore8416]

I don't think Fighting someone with immeasurable speed doesn't put you at immeasurable imo. It would mean your combat and reaction speeds are immeasurable not travel speed. but I could be wrong.

[@callmelou5397]

how are you supposed to dodge immeasurable speed attacks if you dont have immeasurable speed yourself?

[@lunarnightcore8416]

@@callmelou5397 your reaction speed and travel speed can be different. A lot of youtubers or scalers try and mash the both of them together. Take wonder woman for one. Her reaction speed is without a doubt light speed as she reacted and blocked supermans and doomsday heat vision. But she couldn't keep up with superman and the flash, in fact she was literally completely still when the flash and superman where fighting. Reaction and travel speed can be different

[@tomchuur6431]

@@callmelou5397 Because you can fight fast and/or travel fast. There's a slight difference.

[@callmelou5397]

@@tomchuur6431 i dont think you understand what immeasurable speed means distance and time no longer exists those attack are instant meaning the moment you throw the attack it lands at that exact same moment so in order to be able to dodge an attack of that speed you need to have at least that same speed or somewhere around at that speed speed

[@tomchuur6431]

@@callmelou5397 you don't know what immeasurable means. What you just said does not define immeasurable. Immeasurable is faster than that

[@theendgame2978]

I do not understand how can every word you just said make kratos stronger "Hermes traveled through an infinite place" he was nerfed and travle doesn't mean speed and just because you killed James bond that doesn't make you james bond "he is fifth dimensional " well that means nothing because he didn't receive a fifth dimensional attack like goku with the hakai You rambled on random stuff and said kratos wins

[@rayqwonjackson3474]

Kratos literally caught up to him though

[@theendgame2978]

@@rayqwonjackson3474 he didn't he outsmarted a dumpass and my problem is we are talking about video game kratos and he was running at regular human speed in god of war 3

[@rayqwonjackson3474]

@@theendgame2978 The creators said the game would be boring if they made the gameplay lore accurate. So they said follow the lore for feats instead of what you see on screen

[@theendgame2978]

@@rayqwonjackson3474 the fuck you mean how is faster and stronger is boring you either lying ot they are lying this makes zero sense

[@theendgame2978]

@@rayqwonjackson3474 and kratos couldn't move thors hammer besides what is kratos greatest feat? (If you say that temple im gonna be in your walls because i remember freya said it takes you to the tree it's not inside the temple)

[@productivestruggle9489]

5:40 I wouldn't be surprised if the writers simply forgot about a ss3 vegito bring possible

[@troysgaming529]

I think the heaven and hell version of dbz will makes kratos op because death is kinda broken there you would actually have to reset the world without kratos being in it like how black goku repeated and taken over

[@zgreatgamer306]

Bro hit stops time and goku went through and moved because speed is equal to distance divided by time to measure this you need time which there is none because hit stoped time also i would like to mention you are no counting the manga and anime polt armor is better than game plot armor because themc in a game can die at the end or die while anime mc will never die unless it's supposed to happen

[@franegrancic7679]

Kratos defeated mid level, those gods he defeated are shenror level, not even close to goku.

[@y4hiko543]

Cope

[@UltraEpicVids]

This is why scaling video game characters are dumb. Kratos can die from a normal human if you don't play him right, but that doesn't mean he's weak

[@Agent-57]

I don't scale Kratos anywhere above Country level. The lore is shit filled with Hyperboles, the cutscenes and dialogue directly contradict the lore, same goes with the mission structures.

[@candytime-_-]

game mechanics is a thing you know OT; he's tree level

[@argy7526]

@@candytime-_- even in the cut scenes he is shown as fodder

[@BigGoonie]

It's because he is a video game character but if something is stated as fact by the creators than that's what it is a fact.

[@candytime-_-]

@@BigGoonie exactly they even have literal guides that explains the GOW verse's lore

[@Agent-57]

@@candytime-_- Guides which contradict primary canon

[@dastone6582]

Let's bring out cc goku and see who solos

[@AJotasticGamer]

A One Above All victim

[@kamixakadio2441]

@@AJotasticGamer CC Goku stomps not just One Above All, but the Overvoid as well, including Milkman and Co.

[@jayari7674]

@@kamixakadio2441 a SpongeBob victim

[@godslayer8894]

@@kamixakadio2441 💀💀💀

[@brandonholder2483]

@@kamixakadio2441 The one above all is literally omnipotent.

[@Fixtioniq]

i personally love dragonball but this is completely correct.

[@Voodoostyle88]

Super Archie Sonic vs base goku?

[@sheepeatsdogs4]

Kratos is mountain level

[@humanity-m5l]

bruh, he is high complex multiversal+infinite immesurable passive speed Cry cry cry no one is going to comfort you

[@thronosstudios]

The thing about Kratos is that all we see is some angry viking fighting like just that... a viking flinging around axes and whatnot, versus Goku flying across expanses, warping, zipping about at insane speeds, crumbling the universe by clashing fists with a god, etc. so it's no wonder the average person would assume Goku would clap Kratos. His feats look human, versus Goku's which look superhuman.

[@Absolemsays]

I agree but Kratos is Greek.

[@thronosstudios]

@@Absolemsays I'm not saying he's a viking. I'm saying the way they portray him in action (his fighting style) is very viking-like.

[@tankbeast8480]

Goku is losing regardless of these meat riders opinions Kratos is stronger fighting beings with infinite strength breaking unbreakable things and lifting realms vs shaking realms lifting is a bigger feat Goku is getting stumped Winner kratos low diff

[@DirtyDev]

Delusional

[@_tmaa_]

​@@DirtyDevKratos slammed Zeus who shook 5 universes with a mere scream💀

[@tankbeast8480]

@@DirtyDev how’s that your man’s still losing to “gods” fake ones at that

[@speedbeyondlogic]

Base goku without ui was able to see and keep up with gas and granola the 2 strongest in the universe at the time having an IT battle. Goku was also able to follow and react to granola's IT and granola was stronger and faster than him. Then there's goku moving in stopped time and in skipped time. And in his base form with no ui him moving and talking in a white void after zeno erased trunks timeline. So can react to IT. In his base form follow and keep up with people who were leagues faster than him having an IT battle, and also in his base form was able to move and talk in a white void. Also not sure how kratos could handle techniques like god bind, IT, and hakai, kienzan or how he'd handle ui goku. Goku's also the better and more skilled fighter. Goku can also amp himself up with rage boosts. And his ui has an evolution aspect to it too. Goku could just IT + hakai kratos. Or god bind followed by a kienzan. Goku can also put up a barrier around himself and others then use telekinesis on it. Goku can also make clones. Other things goku has going for him are ki sensing, being able to sense malice. Locate someone by feeling vibrations in the air. Against beerus his body retreated on its own because if goku hadn't at that moment beerus would've killed him. Has some form of precognition too. Even without ui I don't see kratos touching even base goku.

[@fire3769]

All of this text just for kratos to solo the whole midball verse

[@BigGoonie]

Give me one feat from Goku comparable to destroying the world tree

[@speedbeyondlogic]

@@fire3769 kratos doesn't solo. He gets erased. He's been killed multiple times. Hakai ends him. Or he gets bisected with a destructo disc.

[@speedbeyondlogic]

@@BigGoonie give me a feat of kratos surviving being erased or regenerating from getting his head taken off. Thor ended him with a smack from his hammer. His piercing resistance is poor too. He's not surviving hakai or a destructo disc. He gets tele blitzed all day.

[@speedbeyondlogic]

When thor slapped kratos with his hammer and took him out kratos didn't regenerate from that. Thor had to bring him back to life. If a physical blow ended kratos he's not surviving a distructo disc. And hakai would end him. couldn't regenerate from being hit by thor

[@Monarch_118]

Finally I can prove to anyone that Kratos is stronger then Goku

[@nikonikolov7636]

BECAUSE MY FITNESS CARD WASNT READY YET .

[@kingdave7996]

Kratos definitely gets speed. He’s just way more consultant with infinite scaling. If Yggdrasil is infinitely sized then Valkyries who take souls cross realms would have to travel infinite distance (in fact the whole part where two realms are next to each other is theoretically impossible unless realms are also infinitely sized which then goes off Ragnarok scaling who destroyed a realm and was held back by a much weaker god than Kratos being Freyr though that scaling is extremely shaky as GoW devs might just not have thought of that) you can also get Kratos to immeasurable with pretty valid scaling. It was said Hermes could dodge Helios light point blank and Helios’s light was stated to be able to light up an infinitely sized plane of existence instantly. Even if this means Helios’s is infinite to dodge it point blank Hermes would need immeasurable speed. While it’s the only immeasurable scaling it doesn’t go far from realism for Kratos. I mean Kratos was universal from one of the first games having defeated a primordial and only proceeded to get stronger. The devs even stated he kept a part of the power of hope after rebuilding Greece which would give him an infinite power booster to fit what opponent he faces. Now of course he faced off against someone like comics superman he’ll lose too fast for Hope to activate, but in this fight it just makes Goku lose even more.

[@itsrakonax]

When you're up against a dude that can outspeed a forward time skip, this entire thing is wrong.

[@kingdave7996]

@@itsrakonax Ok let’s assume that the one time Goku shows immeasurable speeds (despite the fact Whis is faster than him and has been proven to not even be infinite) is how true speed. I could also argue this isn’t even immeasurable as immeasurable implies Goku himself can travel in time which he doesn’t show in the fight. Instead Goku shows he’s just way faster than Hit being able to outspeed him when Hit uses his time ability. Even if I discount that and say Goku is immeasurable it is the only time he shows immeasurable scaling. This means we have to highball Kratos as well and Kratos highball is immeasurable. Kratos matched the infinite speed Valkyries with 10% of his power. This was stated by devs. This would imply that full power old Kratos is much faster and much stronger. So once again ignoring shaky immeasurable Goku scaling Kratos is still implied to be immeasurable at full power. Hermes also dodged Helios light point blank which implies immeasurable speeds since Helios light is infinite and emits in a 360 degree radius around him meaning it’s impossible to dodge without immeasurable speeds. Kratos proceeded to show relativity to Hermes’s speed. I also don’t want arguments like Hermes getting caught by the catapult. This would be dodged even by mythological Hermes who is said to be as fast as the fastest birds. This implies he would be traveling about 300 MPH which is fast enough to dodge a catapult. Not to mention we then have direct info which shows game Hermes is much faster than myth Hermes. Then if we want to continue the highballing Kratos is Outerversal. Thor splintered Yggdrasil and each strand of Yggdrasil is it’s own space and time. This is either interpreted as infinite amounts of 3d strands or you can go the highball way which you clearly want to and say each strand is of ascending dimensions implying Outerversal AP for destroying infinite Hyperversal dimensions since there are infinite strands. Even if we say infinite 3d dimensions people agree this still puts Kratos at 5-9d when you consider he’s at 10% power. This is much higher than Goku so Goku can’t even really hurt him. For reference Goku is around Low Multiversal meaning he can destroy small multiverse comprised of separate space time continuums. I’d argue this is a highball as well since the best feat we have is God Goku fighting with Beerus and possible destroying the universe. Then we have to unquantifiably scale above this with Blue and Kaio Ken (excuse me if I spelled that wrong). Goku definitely isn’t comparable in AP though. This just makes the speed stay meaningless as Kratos could essentially one shot Goku while Goku can’t even dent Kratos.

[@itsrakonax]

@@kingdave7996 you ain't convincing me with that. Goku would absolutely body Kratos with low effort. And Hit basically does travel forward in time. Goku is just that fast that he also begins doing it. Let's not talk about how much force that speed could generate or how little Kratos could do abt it but let's bring manga Goku into this. I'm sure you've heard of the 'hakai' technique. Wich is basically a one shot kill on everything and anything that exists. It can even erase the dead. Goku is known to possess this technique. So all he has to do is that and erase Kratos from existence and he wouldn't even be able to come back

[@kingdave7996]

@@itsrakonax Alr firstly manga DBZ isn't even canon to the original so if you really want to go there we can go there. Young Kratos all weapons. Firstly the Blade of olympia one shot every titan who upscale from primordials who are universal. There are thousand of Titans and this is just what the weapon can do. The Blade of olympia also bypasses immortality and the only known survivor is Zeus who literally just turned into a soul after. WIthe the Blade of Olympia out of the way let's move on to hax. Kratos has fate manip after he beat the sisters of fate. He also has concept denial since fate is a concept which he denied. His fate manip actaully comes form access to the strings of fate not just his battle with the sisters. This means he can deny conceptual erasure which is essentially what Hakai is. Even if you argue against all this Kratos still has the Power of Hope. Hope is just broken. Its been stated to be able to give Kratos all the power needed to overcome any foe. When Kratos gave hope to Greece it literally took the place of all the gods controlling the broken nature after the gods were killed. The only weapon capable of countering PoH is the Blade of Olympia which is in Kratos's hands. This already means Kratos wins, but I can go further. Kratos has infinite strength. He held back Atlas who holds up the infinite greek world and he did so with relative ease. This is also a pretty weak Kratos compared to later versions. As for the cosmology comparison it's not even close. DBZ cosmology is really iffy. At best you have all the universes in the multiverse being infinitely sized which as far as I have seen is never confirmed nor can it be proven in some way. Each universe is likely just the size of our observable universe maybe bigger. I bring this up because we then compare it to GoW. GoW cosmology comprises of every religion. The amount of infinitely sized realms and universes contained in every religion is unknow to me so let's stick to Greece and Norse. The Greek Mythology comprises of 5 infinitely sized realms. Add on Yggdrasil being infinitely sized and even being Complex Multiversal and suddenly Dragon Ball doesn't even compare. Add in the fact 11 of the universe in Dragon Ball got wiped. Gow cosmology wins out making Kratos's feats even more impressive. Then we go back to the issue if you really want to play Highballs Kratos is Outerversal and Goku is like 4d max. Add on Kratos should have the ability to not get erased by Hakai (again hakai is essentially conceptual erasure, but Kratos denied the concept of fate putting him above concepts essentially meaning his can't be erased since he isn't bound by the concepts of the universe) and Goku literally can not dent Kratos. Once again this is including Manga Goku who isn't canon. I mean literally you can't use Hakai if you went down the path of UI in the canon if I'm not wrong. All in all you really need to get this idea out of your head. I kinda stopped doing conceptual levels of power scaling a while ago so the fact you forced my hand here is annoying. Seriously though what's next Goku beats comics Superman because Hakai exists even though DC comics cosmology makes DB look like an ant of a verse essentially meaning Supe's immeasurable scaling for speed is multiplied by millions of times in DB verse.

[@Nitro.Z74]

​@@kingdave7996stop the cap

[@lucionjones8685]

To me kratos is outerversal high outer is a bit of a high ball for him but he might be in high outer i would say its only if its high ball And dbs Goku is high multiversal low complex multiversenal I didnt know about the outer Goku stuff But I do know ppl been wanking him to low hyper versal

[@warsin8641]

13:38 save yourself the kratos meat riding and goku slander hear his conclusion

[@BautistaRuiz-im2rj]

Midku is shit trahs overrated

[@ronitlal.i3258]

Yea but both ways is insane

[@johnfrancois8570]

Well in theory since Wukong is basically Goku in that way goku might win but that’s only if you think goku can become wukong lol

[@akaza4962]

Most Toxic anime fandom vs Most toxic game fandom this fight finna be Legendary

[@godslayer8894]

I wouldn't say it's the most toxic maybe right after Naruto as their fandom is out for blood if you disagree with something

[@argy7526]

mha fandom: let me introduce myself

[@jamesrobinson5553]

OPM fanboys look at the kids fighting by the way saitama solos🤓

[@BautistaRuiz-im2rj]

Foddder anime victim of goten

[@ReversedTrap]

Gow fandom is not bad

[@SuperiorArtist]

I agree with the outcome but goku fans not going to like this 😬

[@Telarius]

I'm a goku fan and this q is inderstandable I only get mad when its really dumb and dishonest chars like daitama

[@SuperiorArtist]

@@Telarius Dont get me wrong I watched dragon ball on toonami but It makes dbz fans look bad when they say things like goku solos fiction, or can beat anybody.

[@Telarius]

@@SuperiorArtist ye I get u. I mostly only see other Fandom saying their char solos goku since goku is a milestone for many. Kratos def beats goku maybe xeno goku could keep up just my opinion.

[@SuperiorArtist]

@@Telarius You may be right, but most people downplay kratos because in game he dies easily but feat wise hes pretty strong.

[@BautistaRuiz-im2rj]

​@Vizzlex all charactaer beat kratos but midku no never 😂