WHY IS FORGE GUARD THE WORST CLASS IN LAST EPOCH - VOID SMITE STAT STACKER!

Last Epoch - Going over my Forge Guard run, and why it is likely the least useful class in Last Epoch!
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[@konter4323]

You can spawn the Forge weapons with Warpath. if you buff them with 3-2x voids cleaves, they put up to 400ignite + any shred effect you want on the target in no time. You just have to get a good two hander with your shred effect and maybe ignite chance. but there is way more you can do with this actually. because they act like a copy of your weapon, things can get very punk. (maybe even as a support class that just stacks 600 armor shred stacks on a boss?) There are a lot of builds for FG actually that work well until at least 300 CR (with somewhat bad gear). Gues I have to play more to find the actual limits for those builds.

[@BabblingBike]

My favorite node on Forge Guard is actually the damage over time DR. I like the concept of, 'hit me bro. HIT ME!', with a few of it's passives, but overall, most builds I play on Forge Guard are just Paladin builds. Needs some love. Manifest Armour is a decent build, but that's the only unique FG build I run.

[@missplay253]

Really loving these videos and seeing you branch out to other games than Battlegrounds that you just seem enthusiastic about. Hoping that you'll do a video about the Necromancer eventually ♥

[@mastermike8057]

Thank you for adding gameplay into the vid

[@ys4502]

Thanks I am struggling with this class and your video really helps

[@gamefuler]

3:42 idk if I have that problem at all but I also stacked attunement with a health regen affix on my belt and that "useless" node at the end of the tree that gives minions health and armor shield crafter). I use a 2 hander with attack speed and high base fire damage with armor shred suffix and use heated forge from the multistrike tree to keep 12 minions up perpetually. Once I have 12 minions I use void cleave's scorching path to buff them 3 times in a row with 3 charges (darkstride boots+nether charge node) and then they melt everything. I also use healing hands on melee hit to keep them topped off. I admit it is a little clunky and there arent that many nodes in the forge master tree that are really beneficial so I too have been using a lot of the life/healing effectiveness nodes from paladin. My biggest desire right now is julra's obession with 3 LP so I can prayde for armor shred+attack speed+flat life to give to my minions so that they are tankier and I can get to 999 armor shred on bosses but on trade it is... uh... a bit outside my budget. Last one I saw was for 500 milion gold which is slightly above what I can afford xD The only problem with this class is that it isn't ward based and I die a lot to damage over time effects or other non-hit damage like 20 stacks of poison which I'm currently trying to find a solution for. Think getting the experimental affix for gloves that reduce damage over time sources with 30% of your armor but im not sure if that will be enough. Open to thought-out suggestions from anyone though :)

[@AdamKellar]

Hey Krip, what if you added an Undisputed axe in the mainhand? Surprised you didn't mention that, considering all the ailments, bleed, etc. Not sure it would propel it to the levels of Paladin or VK, but still may take it to another level in damage.

[@_Pojedzony_]

I play Forge Guard with 2h mace and crit build with hight mana cost 50+ skill that regen me full mana after i use it and for me passives from the second part of the tree are very good. The biggest advantage of Fore Guard is his defences which allow You to focus more on DPS affixes in Your gear so i dont understand the problem. Maybe it is matter of the main DPS skill but try 2h mace with Mail Crusher from Sentinel tree then add Molded By Forge, Lethal Strikes, Duelist and Crushing Blows and Your hits will sky rocket...Stack HP armour and some other mechanics and You good to go. As for skills You can pick Crit Bleed Javelin with Stratergic Patience and Beast Ender for example or Focused Strike Scrap Metal Rive the synergys are so good there so i dont get it for real. Only matter is to play 2h mace with crit build rest You can pick.

[@Burag3]

There is a weird forge guard build with shield throw that is similar to runemasters chain lightning build. Essentially you make it so shield throw chains between enemies and animated armor. It apperantly very good against single target

[@guardian0740]

I have a 100 Forge Guard with that build, it does great single target... to a point. It falls off pretty fast.

[@PalmieriLoria]

Paladin, with the Shield throw + Manifest armor from forge guard, smite holy aura from the pala, and volitail reversal from voidknight is a fun build :D And since you don't manually cast smite, have lunge in the skill bare for movement :) Then go Bardiche as weapon for bleed, and make sure your manifestarmor proc a swing every time you throw your shield onto it, and it will delete bosses with bleed :p

[@jamesneher7891]

FYI, I'm 90% sure that the base damage effectiveness of a skill does not impact the damage of any ailments it procs, only the damage modifiers from that skill's tree apply (assuming they aren't bonuses to hit damage only). I've tested this on sorc with fireball vs meteor and meteor does not do 9x damage per ignite.

[@turbanheadless]

i wonder if shattered lance set with a massive % damage increase could be good with forgeguard

[@vond5829]

I think it bounds to get a reworked next cycle

[@lethal3268]

when is the next cycle

[@thierryfaquet7405]

@@lethal3268when they are ready to launch it.

[@ldcold]

Considering that Forge Guard has less than 1% of the total number of guides on the lastepochtools website... It will definitely be remade. In the pre-release version of the game, there were more guides for Forge than for Warlock and Falconer. Therefore, the developers apparently did not immediately pay attention to the problem. But I like the idea that Sentinel has abilities that scale with Dexterity and Forge Guard is the only tree where Dexterity is applicable in talents. Perhaps there's some underrated Throw Forge build lurking here with a ton of armor.

[@ruinmaniac1411]

You "can" play a forgueguard based on minions in a bit higher corruption but it's pretty janky. Basically you spawn the minions, then buff them via Void Cleave to have a lot of extra flat damage on em, then aim to debuff the enemies at the same time. It's jank, it's high maintenance, but it works.

[@Youtube_Globetrotter]

You are the GOAT of talent tree build. I think I will respec my build into this.

[@vyktorzhuravlev8304]

What about the Forge Knight through throwing attacks with crits? Is it really bad?

[@piofernandes7715]

I'm doing 600 corruption and climbing with forge guard. And its pretty durable, 10k passive ward, crit around 30k-80k (at 600 corruption, keep in mind enemies have a lot of amor). Made a very nice build. EDIT: And you are forgeting a VERY IMPORTANT thing about forge guard's minions: Manifest Armor doesnt scale very well with minions support, it inherits everything on your gear the moment you summon it. So, basically... you need to have the stats you want in your minion in your chest, helmet, gloves, boots and weapon. Rings, amulet, belt and relic are the only that should have "minion dmg and minion hp". Btw, manifest armor inherits all the text you have in these itens. So... basically you can wear a lot of crit chance, crit dmg mult, flat dmg and boom.... your minion is a machine gun. After that, spec into shield throw and take the node that makes your minion AOE when your shield hits him. That's it. I have more lil "secrets" bout forge guard if you want.

[@piofernandes7715]

So basically most of people play Forge Guard Wrong. But yes, we are still a lil behind those classes that takes advanteges on bugs to be immortal. But that's it. Great class imho. I having a lot of fun. I also hope they don't rework this class cause it is amazing. Maybe some buffs here and there.

[@inorogNL]

give us a link to this build please!!!

[@piofernandes7715]

​@@inorogNL just make a set to use when summoning your minion (helm, chest, boots, gloves and weapon = dmg, crit chance, crit mult, hp and attunnement | jewels, belt and relic with minion dmg, minion health and minion crit and attunnement). Then, after summon your minion you'll change your build for a "low health/full ward" build, full of defensives, speed and ranged speed". Idols = full health and ALA, also make sure you have all resist cap 75%. Spec into: animated armor, throwing shield (make sure you take the talent that allows you to aim your minion with this skill, so he AOE when get hit), other skills are pretty opcional, i found more success with rebuke, volatile reverse and rush. Thats pretty much the essencial.

[@piofernandes7715]

@@inorogNL i don't know if it sounds disrespectful to link a video on comments, i'm not an youtuber. I just made a channel and a video explaining my build just cause some ppl are asking me: kzbin.info/www/bejne/qn7CaKyancididU. Not intending to take any viewers from @Kripparian EDIT: Im currently on 1060 corruption with a build i called "Phasing Guard".

[@MitchellWinning]

Interaction! Thanks for the content crippy, love to support it and you.

[@moosecat00]

I heard Smelter's Wrath has a minion count node that says it gives up 150% more damage, but it's actually uncapped. So if you ever wanted to add 1500% more damage to Smelters Wrath, you could.

[@konter4323]

the node is that it deals more dmg per ignite. up to 150% or 15 stacks the uncappe thing comes with the set pieces for forge guard

[@Diehardgamer2001]

Haven't messed around with minions, but if there's anything that can proc off of minion death, maybe that could be a good use of the forged minions since they die anyways lol

[@Chris-zg7ty]

Kripp is BLASTIN' LE! Love to see it.

[@drogonr9318]

Great vid. I hope the devs see this, altho at this point I'm sure they know the issues and that the poor forge guard needs some extra forging.

[@uffschnittow]

A sad experience but i had to tried it by myself and agree... I like the forge guard but its a hard work to play lower corruptions. Love your vidz! Always good infos nobody has ever to doublecheck ❤

[@joejojo5966]

theres a unique 1h axe that increases bleed type stats. maybe if you get one with good lp thatd be good?

[@mirageowl]

Forge Guard was my first Sentinel, and yeah I did realize I started speccing into Paladin as I go more into the end game

[@greenliion6390]

Omg and go right on the forge strike tree and i use rive with a 2h mace with stun its great man. I have 12 swords and some axes up all most all the time. Really i have tried 4 classes already and they have all been great.

[@pimaker1]

I'm playing rive FG using scrap metal to convert forged weapons into a stacking buff. I got to 500 corruption with it and it feels tanky with good damage.

[@scientist784]

How about shield throw tho? It is on forge guard and seems not this bad?

[@jerrodartis5733]

Isnt Forge Guard best when using sword and board though?

[@Leikjarinn]

Do a Falconer build

[@MorbidAnimosity]

One of the biggest problems really is theyre ALL over the place the second half of the forgeguard passives. things that can be good in isolation for some specific builds - the crit multi things either throwing or melee - nothing to laugh at, 6 points but 60% multi is a BIG increase, (think like the runemaster passive that gives 72% crit multi with a wand with 6 points) the minion centric stuff is really good - 3 points for 150% minion health AND armor - throw in a bit of minion regen and the swords actually last a decent bit - id have times im having the screen constantly flooded with my forged weapons. the 2 handed passive thing at the top is also strong, but you're going through a.. lot of things that arent the best for a 2 handed build to get to it. the dodge - armor conversion thing WOULD be really solid - but the dodge increases do not multiply with armor% increase only itself, and you have like zero passives that would give dodge% so that doesnt end up any bit useful, etc..

[@PhazonDude]

Appreciated.

[@WhatIfTheories]

Forge weapons should be like the Falcon and untargetable. They should compliment your actual class and that would give it some fantasy to build around with a passive rework and mastery change. The mastery instead of Armor should give you + damage based on your Armor. Now you got synergy where you can take armor nodes in other trees to buff Forge Guard.

[@kaly8329]

I'm liking that idea of Forge weapons being untargetable.

[@HairyCherry.]

Good work, thank you. Я хотел сделать классического воина в доспехах и с двуручным оружием, но тоже вижу, что он вообще не имеет урона

[@zaooza34]

The sword outright tells you it casts smite on bosses and rare enemies only

[@RamzaBehoulve]

When the worst class is still incredible fun to play, you know how much love the devs put into the game though!

[@XonixDerps]

Though I def see sum hating paladin more lol

[@destnardanderion1150]

Its like gladiator in poe. You can. But everything is better in any mechanic and more fun.

[@TheAluvisify]

I mean, for now sure. When they start adding pinnacle bosses and more endgame, I'm sure this sentiment will change.

[@goransekulic3671]

Exactly. If Corruption mech didn't exist, this whole argument wouldn't exist as well. Otherwise, FG is awesome fun.

[@divinityai]

it's not worst, it's just less powerful.. after playing 6 classes, gear matters alot and when people complain about bad class, I just look at their build and it's bad build with bad gear xD And 300 corruption is kinda the point where most roll new build anyway. Pushing 1.5-2k corruption and spend a week or two climbing 200-300 corr per day isn't fun for most people

[@realVertiqo]

Keep the LE content coming, i like it.

[@Psycorde]

I had no idea ailments scaled with skill's added damage effectiveness, thanks

[@SynicalSyn]

its specific multipliers and stat scaling so "smite hits do x%" won't work but "smite deals x%" does work and scaling of the attribute also works.

[@Yakovik-si8ut]

It doesnt, it scales with generic multipliers on tree that do not mention things like "more damage on hit", but definitely not with the base added damage effectiveness of the skill

[@Psycorde]

@@Yakovik-si8utWell, I'm just more confused now

[@CowPimp]

​@@PsycordeI'm fairly confident Kripp is wrong about this, or misspoke. Ailments applied by a skill are affected by modifiers on the tree, and attribute scaling for the skill, but the added damage effectiveness value only refers to flat melee/throwing/spell damage (whichever is relevant for that skill).

[@qdlaty23]

Kripp discovering Last Epoch, how cute.

[@Zikkar]

They have said a few times Forge Guard is one of the first getting a pass upcoming along with Shaman

[@Vulgaels]

Forged weapons are pretty crazy, you can create some crazy minions with your 2 handed.For forged weapons, you need multi strike to spam smite and holy hand with a 2hand, then you spam every 2-3 hits forge strike for your minions ans buff em woth void cleave. You and your minions are prettt immortal. Build 2 is shield throw with manifested armoe, build 3 is str and int stacking manifest armor smite and smelter breath. These i have pushed quite high and dont see any issues with. Probably above 500 corrupt you wont make it but till than enjoy a tanky summoner.

[@nickkowak9628]

any chance to see Shield Throw build?

[@CubanBeastt]

Shield throw has 2 good builds. Bleed shield throw that proc off your little minion or Shield Throw casting smite with the smite on throwing attack idols

[@johnnyv9024]

They said Forge Guard would be getting a revamp sometime after release. I'm really looking forward to that, they nerfed the number of swords that could be summoned a while back and haven't returned to it. FG was my first class during the beta, and it hasn't received any love in a while :'(

[@DerFreiegedanke]

Sad thing shield throw does not scale with shield stats...

[@Dreddy99]

Lol you made the same class as me with all the same skills and DoT idea hahah

[@Kuzmorgo]

Just wanted to say, I did manage to keep my weapons alive, by having a weapon with life leech. Until they run into some boss AOE of course, where they die :). And because its single target, you can't really resummon them efficiently either. I can easily clear an echo super fast with my forged weapons, but on bosses with aoe skills, its a nightmare. Extra good if you have armor shread on your weapon btw, I could reach 200 stacks of armor shred :)

[@Jenkkimie]

It says a lot about forgeguard that it's the only mastery where most builds take points as much or more from other trees than the mastery itself and it's the only mastery that only now received it's first unique for one of its skills. All other masteries have uniques for most skills and some, like Javelin or Cinder Strike have multiple uniques. Cherry on top not even the devs almost ever touch the mastery in the weekly livestream. It needs rework the most.

[@Masterrogue123]

Wait I thought Forge Guard was to be a tank class not a DPS class.

[@RamzaBehoulve]

Also, forgot to mention, but there is a pure FG build using the sword pets which can oneshot corr 200+ shades. I'm still trying to figure out what's happening in the clip. kzbin.info/www/bejne/jWXYqZ9jbbOAo6s

[@Swiftskice]

thats using a bug

[@armandskupcs5770]

Thats just a smelters wrath build, you can get huge damage effectiveness on it by scaling area, but the drawback is you gotta stay stationary and channel it. He uses the sword minions to apply ignites

[@juniisenpai3777]

I tried it, and give up around lvl 80. I like the idea of it but it is really dissapointing to play.

[@mangokin9506]

The forge guard is either the passive tree or the skill tree which is against itself everywhere. Any creative build is hard to run smoothly. You have to spend tons of time getting the 10/10 groll items to fix the problem to get an average result. You cannot find a second class such as inflexible in Last Epoch, I doubt if any Diabolo 4 guy designed this class? it is the same taste!

[@Salz1usTox1cus]

The goof void knight stuff is here ( Many passive skills). The good Paladin stuff is here (Many passive skills). The good forge knight stuff is here ( 1 passive skill) KEKW

[@runek12]

I feel like any class without ward is just unplayable, hope they balance that in s2

[@AndreyThePal]

meanwhile top1 ranked sentinel on arena is FG

[@Lovyxia]

I was hoping Forge Guard would be good at throwing which felt terrible on my other Sentinels so far. I think Lich is the other class that desperately needs reworking because while the passives are decent and the 2 abilities are good, it has the least identity in the entire game due to Warlock having arguably more support for the low health playstyle Lich is supposed to be themed around and one of the 2 lich abilities completely removes ward from being a mechanic you care about as well so you end up with a class completely centered around 1-2 cooldown abilities based on if you want to use ward which all but 1 low health items in the game are based around and if you do you're just a worse Warlock with a cool transform.

[@bilbobaggins7095]

Kripp please put pressure on the devs to fix

[@patricksheehan43]

This is how we know that the issue with forge guard is the passive tree. Even kripp has more passive points into paladin than forge guard. FG is just to defensively focused and has a lot of nodes that just feel like if you get all of them then it’s a waste because you just don’t realistically need that much armor. The skills are cool and could use some buffs too, but the real problem is the passive tree.

[@DehNyle]

Great video but sad to see another person who doesnt understand FG, Theres a few builds that push 800+ corruption, Shield Rush Ignite/Bleed and the Warpath/Ring of Shields/Shield Throw Ignite, Not counting the Rive+HH that every sent can do, you should try a firestarter torch in the main hand, getting a 3LP one is simple

[@greenliion6390]

Man reading the comments there are so many builds that work and none of them are mine!! Haha mine FG is freaking awesome and no void or pally skills. This game is great.

[@sawyerthesir8455]

Enjoy the video, everyone!

[@inorogNL]

I went with 2 hander axe and fire damage / chance to ignite on everything I can get for my forge weapons. Fun to play and works well for now (lvl 70 pushing monolits)

[@inorogNL]

Just to give an uodate, lvl 75now doing lvl 90 monolit, my fire build works well, mobs get destroyed by forge weapons easily and end boss went down in like a min or so with no issues.

[@pietervanderzwaan4295]

Next to forgeguard being not really the best i think for the mage the sorcerer and runemaster are almost feeling the same, could be me though.

[@ericmorneau8819]

I,ve made two builds that are meh with the forge guard, physical crit javelin and shield throw with Stigeon's Reprisal (up to 90% block chance). They need to do a rework of every passive tree except Runemaster, Warlock and Falconer.

[@StarKech6010]

Forge Guard is a great class , I got every class multiple times to 90+ and honestly FG is a great starter.Much better than Shaman totem or Shaman spells or All 3 Mages...Rogue well like 3/4 of the classes. You are missing the 500% boost at Forge Guard added damage , not just 100%. 500% is HUGE. You just need 400 mana to spam it. Summon minions. Safe game , immortal. Yes very very slow game , but much safer. Can do easy Shield Throw too. 2 builds extra slow and extra safe

[@Hezarald]

You are talking about crushing blows passive node for the +500% boost ?

[@StarKech6010]

No , mate you put cursor at Forge Guard skill , press ALT and you will see " added mele damage apply at 500% effectivenes" not just 100 or 150% etc. @@Hezarald

[@Athamos]

You get it wrong krip.... You pick singularity as a forge guard which premise is CRITICAL lol You can get additional critical chance and 60% crit multiplier (its a lot) You can't blame a crit spec by playing it without critical. Yes, spec is weak, but NOT THAT weak. I'm doing fine on arena with a two handed crit build

[@guardian0740]

Forge Guard has needed a rework for a couple years now at the very least, it's viable, but not too fun or great for pushing.

[@Dawnl0rd]

I think the Forge Guard can do some cool stuff but the other classes are so much better that it seems lacking. Then Kripp seals the deal telling us that it's not viable in the endgame. Yes, I think it will be buffed.

[@johnchen6714]

🎉🎉🎉

[@audiogarden21]

I wholeheartedly disagree with your assessment on Forge Guard, Kripp. So far it's my favorite Sentinel build to play using Forge Strike, Multistrike, Ring of Shields, Shield Bash, and Lunge. It focuses on minion damage rather than personal damage. I always have max minions. Always. I do agree that some things could use another look, however.

[@PeriqculosusCZ]

Forge Guard is very good and fun if you just decide to be the cheerleader for your minions

[@Sastank08]

The answer is because it's not a falconer.

[@kippakeppa1731]

The worst class in terms of numbers is my favorite in concept. Feels badge...

[@prodbydarke]

LOGIN

[@bilbobaggins7095]

It's really sad when an entire class is bad. Also weird that all the builds are based on smite for void paladin and forge...forge should be worried about getting armor and weapons out there and doing cool things. I really don't like the cross play between the classes or the useless leveling to 20 base class for all of them

[@nathanevans98]

This isn't even close to the best Forge Guard build. Kripp is on crack.

[@christiansigl1]

Number 1 sentinel in the leaderboard is Forgeguard. Just sayn.

[@MPHaddock]

Forge guard and primalist suck for years now. They released 1.0 without buffing them...

[@ddartx]

FG is the worst yet FG arena pushers are doing 700 waves and pushing higher corruption than Spellblade yeah FG is the worst alright

[@Syphirioth]

its the worst class because all good FG have no FG identity pretty much XD

[@Ficcator]

Forge Guard minioni build has second highest single target damage after Wraith lord.

[@goransekulic3671]

No, it is not. But let's hear arguments. Besides, why do even have to rank classes? Let's just state what works and what does not and move from there. Ok, I agree, this is my complaint as well(Forge Weapon duration / durability + passive tree). While he does have some nice things above, what is it, 25 or 30, it is just not enough. Folded Steel, Shield Maker and +% Crit Power(if going Smelter's). Smelter's is actually quite good. Those auto crits are ungodly. And the entire Corruption mech is just too toxic. Those who can't see it, won't see it(and the other way around). But yeah, rework the tree, I agree. And don't get hooked on HH, that thing is most likely getting nerfed into ground(alongside Ward). Powerful is powerful, but these are too powerful.

[@squidgyxombie]

"Minions are terrible, you can't really buff them." ...final Forge Guard passive giving 150% minion health and armor for 3 points. Forge Guard is obviously the weakest of the three, but saying their later passives are awful is disingenuous. Better crit passives if you aren't using one of the 2 lightning skills. Potion passives for 30% less DoT taken and 100% increased armor, basically mandatory if you're up there. One point for melee damage added to the class buff when hit passive.

[@Wholesome_Fries]

Forge guard and shaman sucks

[@krzysztofs3t532]

Forge Guard and Marksman are the weakest classess in the game.

[@Jektastic]

Oi. The detonating arrow mine marksman is pretty bonkers! But I dont know if a marksman that doesn't really have to put point into their tree count.

[@krzysztofs3t532]

@@Jektastic yea, it desn't, and also I mean a bow character.

[@seeess925]

Last Epoch does not look good at all. It's bad enough Pathe of Exile flushes down pretty great design by having only one difficulty setting easy circus mode. Where you obliterate everything on the screen by putting a blind fold on Users want actual action if playing arpg. Where every level you have to actually do something more than take a nap while clicking anywhere on the screen to autowin. That's why I uninstalled poe after playing a week up to a high act. Last Epoch. Not any better. No good at all.