Why It’s Important To Lie - Lying is a Social Skill (that many autistic people hate!)

Many autistic people feel like we can’t lie. At a young age, we were taught that lying is wrong and we should always tell the truth. But, like the advice to 'be nice,' it's not that simple. In this video, I'll discuss how lying can be morally wrong, especially for the autistic community vulnerable to social manipulation. Yet, it can also protect private information and maintaining personal boundaries.
🎞️Timestamps:
0:00 Introduction
0:41 Is lying wrong?
2:06 The Simplification of the Truth vs Honesty
3:00 Lying as managing social information
5:32 The Ethics of Honesty
6:19 Knowledge is Power
7:05 The Autistic Community is vulnerable
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[@bakakafka4428]

I hate lying. When I first got my late-age diagnosis, my first therapist explained this to me as well, but when I asked "can you then teach me how to lie" she answered, 'no, that would not be ethical'. Says it all about normies. They learn instinctively how to cheat and lie, declare it unethical regardless, and find it absolutely not done to teach us how to be able to play on a level playing field. Gotta keep us in our place, don't they.

[@letitbe777]

Terrible 😞 🙏🏽

[@fleetwoodbeechbum]

I'm saving this comment for reference. - It would be unethical for me to teach you how I function normally, says the neurotypical. -

[@aural_supremacy]

You don’t need to learn how to lie, it is wrong, don’t bother trying to fit into a broken decadent society you are better off on the outside what is considered ’normal’ in the West particularly is not necessarily the right behaviour apparently Russians say what they mean and think, I have had no end of trouble with this but I have made my peace with it by restricting social interactions and the peace that comes from maintaining integrity and honesty is better than the confusion and shame that comes from lying just to be considered “normal” all you need to do is identify situations where the “need to lie’ might be considered ‘polite’ to be social and if you can’t speak the truth without ‘offence’ then say nothing, and if someone asks why you are quiet just say you don’t have the experience to offer a comment which is truth, if someone pushes you I would say “don’t ask questions to which you will not like the answer “. Japanese society has a rigid social structure that causes them to bend over backwards to ‘fit in, and not bring attention to themselves publicly’ which causes a whole bunch of serious problems from ignoring people in medical trouble in public to girls quietly enduring being sexually assaulted on trains (they even have a special word for it called Chikkan) and this behaviour is enforced during school that the girls are told to say nothing during or after because it would bring shame to themselves, I know it’s probably not what you want to hear but there is no faster way to identify people with whom you can have a true relationship with than speaking truth.

[@PetAllDogs]

I'd suggest crime movies. Just anything where people have to lie, also watch actors, in movies. Not their characters but try to think about the person playing the role. It's weird and hurts my brain sometimes but it helps me in various parts of understanding people's thought patterns.

[@KarnodAldhorn]

This might be not so consoling, but therapists in general don't necessarily teach people anything. They are trained to challenge your beliefs and mostly nothing more. Which sucks often. But it's not about Keeping US in line or smthn. Sensible Neurotypicals also don't want lies to exist. But they can't control anyone. But maybe a Coach might be willing to teach that

[@lucasfaircloth9557]

If you're bad at lying, just tell people "it's personal" or it's "none of your business." You don't owe anyone an explanation.

[@Devaneurodivergent]

@lucasfaircloth9557 I agree. Lying to protect private information is not even necessary. I don't now why people think playing these type of games is better. I tell the truth or if I think it is none of their business I say I won't answer it with out an explanation. In everyday general life, we don't have to justify what we choose to tell or not tell people.

[@b_onkus2493]

@@Devaneurodivergent​​⁠ Under most circumstances, I would agree with you. The only circumstance in which I don't is one in which the interrogator doesn't need a confirmation to get the information they need. Sometimes, with enough outside information, merely denying a request can tell someone all they needed to know, or at least make them think it did. This can be anywhere from greatly inconvenient to life-threatening, and I think that's it's a good skill to foresee and prevent such situations, if you can. I see it less as a game and more of a last resort. Definitely not an all-day tool though.

[@ZTRCTGuy]

It wholely depends on the situation.

[@Lightflames85]

@@Devaneurodivergent I would disagree with the not protecting personal information part. Not everyone needs to know your business its a right that you have to earn. Sometimes its just easier to lie then argue with someone about something you are never gonna tell them. Also you can lie to protect someone. I do think its best to be as honest you can be without hurting yourself.

[@ErikLiberty]

Telling someone that something is none of their business can come across as a little harsh. A nicer way to tell someone who is prying to back off is to say, "Why do you ask?" If they have no good reason they will sheepishly admit it and back off.

[@deborahseaman8470]

We are the healthy ones living in a sick society. So why are we labeled the sick people who have to adapt to a sicker society? I am the healthy one, now, you come and live in a good world ❤filled with love, honesty,kindness and compassion for all❤

[@ivanaamidzic]

🖤“It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.” ― J. Krishnamurti

[@flexico64]

Y E S

[@passinthru4646]

Wow- this is beautiful!

[@BadJ63]

“If the truth shall kill them, let them die.” ― Immanuel Kant Why should I be part of a social delusion and re-inforce it?

[@thebatiscosy]

Why? Because honestly can cause you your life. A stranger knocks at the door, a child answers and the stranger asks "Are you alone? Are your parents at home?". A young woman travels alone, or walks home alone in the evening, a stranger asks "Hey are you alone?". You hitch a ride and the driver asks "Is someone waiting for you?" ... In all of these scenarios your honesty that you're alone and nobody is waiting for you will get you killed. It's about survival. At work, honesty can cause you to lose your job. Having the moral high ground doesn't get your bills paid or save you from a predator. It's a sad reality but we can't assume we have plot armor just bc we don't like doing something.

[@ahobimo732]

I despise liars and lying. I'm referring to intentional misinformation, not merely "simplifying" the truth. If I have to regularly lie to someone in order to protect myself from them, I will do whatever I can to remove that person from my life. That's how I "manage information": by managing the people I exchange information with.

[@LiorVolf]

Sometimes that's just not possible or it takes a long time to remove the problematic person, so it will require skill just to survive that person.

[@longline]

In retrospect I became a furniture maker because lies and schmoozing could be immaterial to my success. Either I made the thing good, or I didn't.

[@RestorativeWaves123]

Respect. I like fellow defenders of the truth. Not to say that we have to enter "every battle" to speak up, but rather those who'd rather avoid lying and stick to truth that way.

[@guanxinated]

Same here. I became a translator for that very same reason. Don't get me wrong, my inability to negotiate has probably cost me tens of thousands of dollars in potential earnings I left on the table, but at least I work alone and am judged on the merit of my work. Plus, let's face it, it's an upward battle when my employer knows I'm here in Japan on a work visa and that permanent residency depends on one's ability not just to hold a job and earn an income, but also to STAY at the same job for 5+ years.

[@robscovell5951]

I work in data analysis for the same reason. I worked for drug company and then for a research unit. I couldn't stand being asked to remove outliers to improve p values so I quite that line of work.

[@guanxinated]

@@robscovell5951 They ask you point blank to manipulate p values? That's insane!

[@robscovell5951]

@@guanxinated Yes. I resigned. She "needed" me to skew results to favour her husband's research unit which was competing for funds.

[@ammasophia4663]

I find lying incredibly difficult. Mostly it is hard because it requires very devious thinking. I am very intelligent, but I have always felt the moral obligation to tell the truth and I thought all people felt that same obligation. I am 70, and I still find it difficult

[@Lightflames85]

You can avoid part of the truth then your not really lying but not telling it all either. I think the best lairs have some part of the truth in there.

[@a2sbestos768]

"Yes, sweetie, I really like that picture you've drawn for me" Such devious thinking

[@yeahokaycoolcool]

@@a2sbestos768 uh I genuinely like my childrens' drawings... So I wouldn't need to lie. Kind of sucks you have to lie to your kids.

[@a2sbestos768]

@@yeahokaycoolcool Wow, you completely missed the point and proceeded to brag about it. Such a splendid human being.

[@gravygraves5112]

What point, that you lie to kids about something they made.​@@a2sbestos768

[@djomegaminus]

If everyone else was cheating and it was the standard I still wouldn't do it because my morals mean more than fitting in.

[@Flopsi80]

Exactly. I am the same. And I never wanted to fit in this society, I want to change it.

[@jliller]

Human nature is selfish and tribal. Lie for your benefit and your group. Human nature is obsessed with survival. Lie if it will help you live longer. Human nature is something to be smashed with a hammer.

[@jliller]

@@eledeog Life. The game is called life.

[@FuegoJaguar]

Same. I just leave.

[@jimwilliams3816]

It feels like it is the standard more and more these days. But no way I want to join in. How does that saying go? “What does it profit a (person) if (they) gain the world but lose (their) soul?”

[@jeanieshank1433]

I never lied and then I got told I was so cruel for telling the truth and that my bluntness was wrong. I cried but learned to lie. Now I just don’t know when and how to lie. It’s so complicated.

[@MrKyuubiJesus]

I don't really lie that often. I refuse to speak a lot of time by saying "I can't give you the answer to that question". People follow up with "Why" and I repeat. If they don't stop I ask them to.

[@carlosdgutierrez6570]

Always lie or at the very least twist the truth and/or omit information on purpose, at least in social interactions. The only times when it pays off to be honest is with your medic and your mechanic, other than that… Remember that the most successful marriages are based on information omission and lies.

[@nathanalbanese1472]

@@carlosdgutierrez6570 ok that doesn’t sound right

[@chrisj4288]

​@@carlosdgutierrez6570who hurt you

[@Lightflames85]

You should omit the truth if it will hurt them very much or say it in a nice way. Also if its gonna hurt you.

[@paxhumana2015]

F u c k lying because I would rather d i e honest than lie. Moreover, as one Thomas Paine said, "If you are afraid to offend, then you are also afraid to be honest", and, given the fact that I have been around liars all of my life, I take that to heart.

[@rebecca_rh]

I agree

[@erikavaleries]

Whoa!!! It’s sad in this world we need to be wily, deceptive, and strategic because there are so many shady characters in our lives. I never wanted to judge anyone that way until I got so burned by being trusting and honest. Now I know most people are not like us.

[@kingmasterlord]

'need', my ass. set a better example. being surrounded by the morally corrupt does not make it appropriate to be amoral.

[@letitbe777]

Sad but true

[@stillnotstill]

​@@kingmasterlordnot anyone's job to teach others not to lie or to put themselves in unsafe situations in circumstances where the truth would lead other people to take harmful actions

[@aural_supremacy]

@@stillnotstillcan’t read the comment that you replied to and the following is a copy and paste of my main comment, as for lying to stop someone from making a harmful action the correct course for that would be to say nothing, unless you have a job where you are trying to talk a person down from the roof of a building it’s not remotely applicable, I didn’t watch the video so please excuse me if the title about Why You Need To Lie is sarcasm but I suspect it isn’t, You don’t need to learn how to lie, it is wrong, don’t bother trying to fit into a broken decadent society you are better off on the outside what is considered ’normal’ in the West particularly, is not necessarily the right behaviour, apparently Russians say what they mean and think, I have had no end of trouble with this but I have made my peace with it by restricting social interactions and the peace that comes from maintaining integrity and honesty is better than the confusion and shame that comes from lying just to be considered “normal” all you need to do is identify situations where the “need to lie’ might be considered ‘polite’ to be social and if you can’t speak the truth without ‘offence’ then say nothing, and if someone asks why you are quiet just say you don’t have the experience to offer a comment which is truth, if someone pushes you I would say “don’t ask questions to which you will not like the answer “, I would also add that if you have nothing good to say in a social situation then say nothing, if you want to make a negative comment on KZbin turn off your notifications more about that at the end of this comment which by the way means I will never see, nor search for any replies to this comment. Japanese society has a rigid social structure that causes them to bend over backwards to ‘fit in, and not bring attention to themselves publicly’ which causes a whole bunch of serious problems from ignoring people in medical trouble in public to girls quietly enduring being sexually assaulted on trains (they even have a special word for it called Chikkan) and this behaviour is enforced during school that the girls are told to say nothing during or after because it would bring shame to themselves, I know it’s probably not what you want to hear but there is no faster way to identify people with whom you can have a true relationship with than speaking truth, and also the only therapist whoever helped me and I am talking from psychologists to psychiatrists was the one who gave me the test for Asperger’s which allowed me to access specific financial support these “professionals” have no idea what they are doing, and lying is the worst advice you can give anyone, it’s little wonder our society is so broken and divided and trust me, it doesn’t matter how much you ‘lie’ to try and fit in you still won’t, been there, done that, have the T-shirt and I have come back out of the dark tunnel minus a wife who couldn’t tell the truth about much at all and a lot of pain but also intense shame that I was put in a position to compromise my integrity and I won’t do it again it’s not worth the consequences and by the way anyone who has a habit of commenting on KZbin videos but gets stressed out by replies to their comments, here is a tip, turn all the notifications off, both in KZbin and on your device and don’t read replies I don’t ever, so much better, anything you want to keep track of new uploads for example search for it manually.

[@aural_supremacy]

I didn’t watch the video so please excuse me if the title about Why You Need To Lie is sarcasm but I suspect it isn’t, You don’t need to learn how to lie, it is wrong, don’t bother trying to fit into a broken decadent society you are better off on the outside what is considered ’normal’ in the West particularly, is not necessarily the right behaviour, apparently Russians say what they mean and think, I have had no end of trouble with this but I have made my peace with it by restricting social interactions and the peace that comes from maintaining integrity and honesty is better than the confusion and shame that comes from lying just to be considered “normal” all you need to do is identify situations where the “need to lie’ might be considered ‘polite’ to be social and if you can’t speak the truth without ‘offence’ then say nothing, and if someone asks why you are quiet just say you don’t have the experience to offer a comment which is truth, if someone pushes you I would say “don’t ask questions to which you will not like the answer “, I would also add that if you have nothing good to say in a social situation then say nothing, if you want to make a negative comment on KZbin turn off your notifications more about that at the end of this comment which by the way means I will never see, nor search for any replies to this comment. Japanese society has a rigid social structure that causes them to bend over backwards to ‘fit in, and not bring attention to themselves publicly’ which causes a whole bunch of serious problems from ignoring people in medical trouble in public to girls quietly enduring being sexually assaulted on trains (they even have a special word for it called Chikkan) and this behaviour is enforced during school that the girls are told to say nothing during or after because it would bring shame to themselves, I know it’s probably not what you want to hear but there is no faster way to identify people with whom you can have a true relationship with than speaking truth, and also the only therapist whoever helped me and I am talking from psychologists to psychiatrists was the one who gave me the test for Asperger’s which allowed me to access specific financial support these “professionals” have no idea what they are doing, and lying is the worst advice you can give anyone, it’s little wonder our society is so broken and divided and trust me, it doesn’t matter how much you ‘lie’ to try and fit in you still won’t, been there, done that, have the T-shirt and I have come back out of the dark tunnel minus a wife who couldn’t tell the truth about much at all and a lot of pain but also intense shame that I was put in a position to compromise my integrity and I won’t do it again it’s not worth the consequences and by the way anyone who has a habit of commenting on KZbin videos but gets stressed out by replies to their comments, here is a tip, turn all the notifications off, both in KZbin and on your device and don’t read replies I don’t ever, so much better, anything you want to keep track of new uploads for example search for it manually.

[@Xacris]

I hate lying, even by withholding information. That being said, I have had to get good at lying. It would be incredibly difficult to exist in this world without being able to lie. I'm able to maintain my moral stance on it by recognizing that different situations call for different rules- like you said, if it's lying to protect information or people, it's suddenly much easier. My internal rules for it are more like... don't betray/abuse the trust someone has for you. Because I lie so rarely, people have a lot of trust in me

[@stillnotstill]

Nice to see some nuance in the comments 😄 (not sarcasm)

[@petelee2477]

​@@stillnotstillthere is no nuance. Lying is either wrong and should be avoided in all scenarios or lying is not wrong and should be done in any scenario that benefits you. I stopped seeing lies as wrong and will make sure to tell lies in any situation where lying benefits me.

[@stillnotstill]

@@petelee2477 i mean, there is nuance, you just don't see it.

[@Nobddy]

@@petelee2477I think you might be taking away the wrong message lol

[@_You_Are_Not_Him_]

​@petelee2477 you're lying to yourself right now 💀

[@ZhovtoBlakytniy]

I'm bad at telling them, maybe worse at catching when others tell them. So, I research a lot. "I'll get back to you on that" is my go-to

[@TERFStomper]

For me, it's less a moral issue than one of energy expenditure. It takes more energy to lie. First, you have to concoct the lie, then deliver it convincingly. It's so much easier to just tell the truth. Of course, sometimes lying is necessary, as in your classroom scenario. And sometimes there are multiple truths and we have to pick the best one. The latter took me a long time to learn.

[@ars6187]

There’s a 💩 ton of note taking as well!! One must remember the tales spun later, too! Forget it. Who’s got time for all that?

[@Lightflames85]

the energy thing your talking about really depends on is it faster to tell them a lie or keep going on forever with something they want to know but you don't want to tell them. If you say i don't want to tell you then you have to argue with them about it.

[@swissarmyknight4306]

I can lie; I can't figure out when I'm supposed to lie. I mostly don't, because why would I, and keeping track of the truth is plenty hard enough for me; keeping track of lies seems like living life on hard mode for no reason. But NT's lie all the time, instinctually, don't consider it wrong, consider it "polite" even, and will still say "its wrong to lie".

[@thinecuprunnethoverwithblood]

Living in an abusive home filled with religious guilt, shame, and fear, I learned how to lie quickly to protect my own physical and emotional safety. I lied like a fox gnawing it's own leg out of a trap, but I knew I'd be harmed less if I lied to my parents about almost everything. It feels awful, physically tears me up inside, but this lying has kept me alive and in "good graces" with my parents since I was a child. 22 years later, it's a skill I hate to use, but still absolutely need to when interacting with my parents of almost 60 years old. The worst part? They're both neurodivergent, but so heavily indoctrinated by fundamentalist christianity that their views no longer encompass humanism or ethics.

[@ladytakarazuka]

Sending you thoughts of love (even though we are complete strangers to each other), that was so sad to read. It's very understandable that you learnt to lie.

[@anyascelticcreations]

Like the comment above mine I also am sending you gentle love. I agree that what you did was essential. And I wouldn't for a moment call that wrong. But I know what you mean about it tearing you up to do it. I feel that way as well. Even though I know that in circumstances lying is the only reasonable choice. Anyway, I'm sending love.

[@kezia8027]

YUP! I'm unfortunately a great liar, my ND partner not so. They lament not having the ability. I tell them I'm glad they didn't have to learn.

[@antoniskaloterakis7996]

They are lying too , its just unconcious.

[@MCE851]

I just made my comment saying the exact same thing. But I don't hate lying, lying is a valuable tool to protect you from bad people. The morality on lying is usually espoused by abusers to guilt trip victims who are trying to survive their abuse. I have no more illusions about it. Now that I'm an adult, I don't need to lie as often. But I will if it protects me or someone I care about.

[@marilynlucero9363]

When I was thought 'Lying was wrong' thing I saw lying and telling the truth as two very separate things. Up to this day, I refuse to lie, but I also refuse to just give up any information that was (or could have been) given to me confidentially. When someone asks me about something I think could be confidential regardless whether I know something or not I will always vocally 'attack' the person back for even trying to get any form of answer out of me to begin with, if it is something THEY want to know about someone else other than ME, they should NOT go to me, but to THEM, not go behind people's backs. And it is because of the fact that I bite back this way regardless whether I know or not that they will end up clueless at the end. Remember everyone, you are not required to say everything to everyone and sometimes it is better to question the ethics of those who go behind other's backs to try to pry out information out of you.

[@roadrunnercrazy]

This^^ I also see lying and withholding information as two different things. I don't have to tell an untruth in order to not give people the information they are looking for. I can change the subject. I can leave. I can ignore them. I can tell them that the topic is none of their business. Or that the information is not mine to comment on. I have prepared a list of options so that I'm not caught off guard. I don't believe lying is usually the answer.

[@Lightflames85]

@@roadrunnercrazy well if those things don't work then i don't see the harm in shutting it down with a lie.

[@transponderings]

Interesting perspective, and yet it seems to come with the preconception that lying is another ‘social skill’ that we’re bad at, rather than us just having a different communication style from allistics. I hate lying, and find it extremely difficult. I also hate it when other people think I’m lying when I’m not. Trying to play power games with knowledge feels like an added layer of complexity I don’t have the capacity for.

[@jimwilliams3816]

Ouch, you made a strong case there! It reminded me of what I hate about socially oriented societal structures...every element in life (in this case knowledge) is viewed in terms of how it can be used as a tool for social advancement. Lots of things have intrinsic values other than that. I can understand how presentation matters...yes, if I make someone feel like an idiot, it’s unlikely I will persuade them to consider what I am saying. But that’s not lying. And I can kind of grasp the idea that some things might be better left unsaid, though I’m insanely bad at not saying everything. But the idea of outright lying in order to achieve an arguably better aim sounds like icky slippery slope stiff to me.

[@rebecca_rh]

Yeah why tf should we adapt to a sick society, it’s neurotypical that should be better. I’m not autistic but I’ve always been allergic to societal norms that don’t make sense and are profoundly broken. I feel being autistic just makes you more immune to their brainwashing

[@ameliajones7292]

I understand everything you're telling me but my gut still shouts back 'lying is wrong!'

[@ivanaamidzic]

I have been often accused that I was lying when I wasn't and that I had ulterior motives when I didn't. This injustice hurts my heart so badly. People would think I want something from them or attempting gaining something through them when I was only genuinely interested to get to know them or hear their opinions. I am also at times being accused of and being dismissed based on being 'too literal'. I am actually interested in world around me - people, animals, plants and nature, I don't play stupid mind games with others, and I want to know how world looks like from their point of view, and somehow twisted society I live in thinks that's not cool, while all kinds of shady hurtful things are cool. I think that the thing you are talking about at the beginning is actually the difference between precision and exactitude (there is important difference between the two in statistics). Also, I think these kinds of pressures are very culturally conditioned - there are cultures that are more passive aggressive and fear based (I live in one!) that have lots of unspoken (very stupid if I may add) rules for things they just expect you to not talk about (like how you really feel or the elephant in the room), etc. So it helps living in a more blunt or direct culture. I lived in both and it's easier amongst people whose cultures are more direct by default. On a wider note I am very fed up with 'social skills' and people with Autism and other struggles constantly being forced to jump through hoops, so they can have better 'social skills'. There are so many skills and qualities, knowledge and beauty in people who are bad at social skills, bad at communicating, bad at public speaking and giving darn power point presentations (because we all know more power point presentations will save the world, right?). They are quiet, observant, thoughtful, analytical, knowledgeable, interesting, can problem solve and see things others can't, they have kind hearts and we should take all of that away in order to funnel them through hoops so they can be like everyone else? I don't think so.

[@robscovell5951]

I'm guessing from your name that you are a female who lived in a South Slavic country who now lives in a country like England or somewhere in S E Asia where passive aggressiveness is the norm? I grew up in England. With my autism I never fitted in. When I was 18 I went to Poland where people are much more blunt and I felt much more at home. I generally feel much more at home among people from Slavic cultures. I really hate this whole "Social Skills" nonsense. It's more that there's a whole layer of interaction that we have no instinct for, and why should we! That layer of interaction is annoying -- why should we be forced to "learn" it? I hate how NTs obsessively try to "normalise" us. I saw a Netflix about an autist who loves doing the Rubik Cube. His mother was obsessed with his "social skills" despite the fact that he was quite happy and able to hang out with the other autists who go to Rubik Cubing competitions. She got on my nerves so much!

[@ivanaamidzic]

@@robscovell5951 Hi there. I am of mixed heritage and I have lived all over the place, East and West, I am partly of South/Balkan Slavic background and have resided in The Balkans for some time. Most people in the Balkans are mix of many heritages, including Indigenous people from there, and they differ from Eastern Slavic group. Among other things I am also Canadian where I currently reside. I do have quite a few friends and former colleagues and even house mates from both England and Poland. Do you live in England now? I really feel for you and your experiences. I am not sure I ever feel really at home anywhere, as mostly my only home is only in my head and truth be told I am from another Galaxy all together. 😊 I agree with what you said here: "It's more that there's a whole layer of interaction that we have no instinct for, and why should we!' It could also be due to corporate culture mentality where people are constantly being groomed to tailor their entire lives in order to be 'productive' and 'be professional' and 'present well', like in a circus. Instead of just being allowed to be as they are as that is what creates true diversity and plurality. I know so many people who have 'social skills' who are fake and surface level and have nothing to say actually, while I know so many of those with Autism or alike, who are so much more interesting and knowledgeable and with softer hearts. I don't watch Netflix, so I don't know about this character you were describing. I do have Rubik Cube though. And I play chess and do lots of other stuff that are super fun, way more fun than 'social skills'.

[@robscovell5951]

@@ivanaamidzic I have lived all over the place too, East and West. I can't settle in one place. I currently live in an area of Phuket that is largely Russian. Being neither Thai nor Russian, I am a double outsider/double foreigner. I never wanted anything to do with corporate culture. When I was at university we were being groomed to be "Proactive self-starters and team-players" and I just viscerally hated and rejected all that BS. Softer hearts: yes! I don't know why NTs think we have no empathy. I can't stand seeing anyone or any creature in pain. I am vegetarian because I can't stand to think of animals suffering for my plate. I work as a freelance data analysis specialist as a kind of digital nomad. It pays the bills and I don't have to endure office life. Data analysis is way more interesting and fun than "social skills".

[@ivanaamidzic]

@@robscovell5951 I have friends from Phuket (they are Thai, not Russian) who I met years ago via student exchange at one of my universities in Europe, while they were taking a year abroad. And data analysis is part of my daily job, too. My job includes lots of statistics and data, which is one of areas of special interest for me. It is hard to survive office, so I envy you for not having to go to one. Totally agree with you on "proactive self-starters and team-players" nonsense. Just reading that hurts my brain, but it's also hilarious when you think about it. People have many misconceptions about Autism, including empathy piece, since they are very badly informed and ever worse researched. Old school psychiatry is also to be blamed as when you go back and read how people with Autism were described in 'medical' texts and articles back in the day, it makes you wanna die. Paul has a video or a few on the topic of empathy. I feel so much empathy and compassion for people, nature, animals, plants, everything.

[@thinecuprunnethoverwithblood]

I completely relate to the absolute betrayal and pain it causes when being accused of having ulterior motives or hidden intentions when it's almost always the exact opposite. I am always honest unless I have to hide something to protect my life or the life of another (but I am also gentle and empathetic when sharing the truth in every other moment) so it breaks my heart to face questioning of my character or intentions. I have lived an extremely rough life which softened my heart to a detrimental degree, so it feels like a punch to the gut having people I wish the best for be completely convinced I'm manipulating them. My whole life I've been told I "have an attitude" or am "clearly hiding something because of the way I speak", but I don't understand what any of that is referring to because I'm just speaking. I often say "My words are just my words, nothing else. The meaning doesn't change based off the pitch or sound, they're the exact same words" because I don't know how else to explain to people that I say exactly what I mean. If I say "I love the pasta" I mean that I love the pasta. If I say "Maybe we shouldn't try to fix the stove without an expert" I'm not implying anything, I am just saying we should get an expert. I wish someone could tell me what neurotypicals think I'm trying to hide from them when I talk because it drives me absolutely crazy.

[@wizrad2099]

As a child, reconciling the rules about lying with the reality of how often people lie, that was rough. For years I didn't get it. As I got older, I learned how to lie, but more importantly when to lie. My older brother is a pathological liar, so people don't believe him even when he's telling the truth. By contrast, I'm bluntly honest and tell the truth even when it's not a good thing, but in doing so I've created a buffer so that when I REALLY need to lie, people trust me enough that even if the lie isn't perfect they're inclined to believe it. I still have to be careful and work on the art of lying, but it helps to consider it less like lying and more like working fictional writing into reality. Edit: There's another reason I don't lie unless I absolutely have to, and more over hate being lied to. Lying is inherently insulting, no matter the nature of your lie, you are either hoping or insinuating that you believe that the target is dumb enough to believe the lie. If someone is lying to you, they don't think very highly of your intelligence or deductive reasoning.

[@twinkletoes7095]

Fantastic petspective. As ever. The 'lying to protecting' reframe is a beautiful adjustment. I feel physically sick if I am forced to lie. I've learnt how to undershare, be mysterious, Be enigmatic. My integrity is more important to me than trusting these people to respect my magic.

[@heavenishere416]

💖✨️

[@kingmasterlord]

i refuse. i deal in the truth, so im always either right, or misinformed. the second i get called out in the latter case i instantly _become_ right, once i learn the truth. i find it repugnant how easy it is to manipulate people by lying and reject the notion entirely. i respect free will.

[@stillnotstill]

For you does that then translate to action, eg do you mask bc of covid information. Or is it more a strictly information based thing? If you don't mind answering of course

[@RestorativeWaves123]

same here. If I don't want to get into the truth I just say nothing, some cause say that's lying by omission, but morally if I think something does NEED to be said, no matter how uncomfortable, then I'll push myself to say it. Otherwise, I find only the truth respectable.

[@kingmasterlord]

@@stillnotstill not sure I understand the question. I don't mask, I don't believe corrupt institutions as a matter of course and research what I'm unsure about, as well as opposing views to what I hold. don't really see how that's relevant.

[@ladytakarazuka]

Hello :-) so let's imagine that you are that teacher who is being asked by the shooter where the children are (example from the video), as you reject the notion of "lying" entirely, you tell them that they are in the cupboards ? To be clear, I am not judging, I am trying to understand wether you really reject entirely that notion or not.

[@djomegaminus]

IT IS NO MEASURE OF HEALTH TO BE WELL ADJUSTED TO A PROFOUNDLY SICK SOCIETY!!!!

[@Aiken47]

Way back as a teenager, before I knew I was aspie, I used the George Kostanza - Seinfeld theory of lying. It’s not a lie if you believe it. (In that moment) it’s helped me be a convincing liar when confronted by an objectionable person. I hate lying and as I’ve learnt to unmask I’ve gotten worse at it. My face now gives me away. I definitely feel lack of accuracy is very lie like.

[@stillnotstill]

Yup I'll figure out a piece of truth, or use specific wording that's technically true but quite misleading

[@Aiken47]

@@stillnotstill good idea

[@kezia8027]

@@stillnotstill or the no answer answer with a redirect - "oh yeah haha you know! how about you?" bam

[@stillnotstill]

@@kezia8027 well when it comes to people asking me how I'm doing I just say hanging in there or whatever personally because I'm never doing fine haha But yeah a good redirect helps in a lot of situations!

[@stillnotstill]

By which I mean yeah I understand that for a lot of people a redirect in this particular situation is good too!

[@debbie8168]

Omg this has got me into so many unhealthy situations by not lying. It's like nails on a chalkboard to lie. I always get caught out if I do lie, because my brain can't think fast enough TO lie. One white lie is fine, but if someone asks me to expand on the lie, my brain can't process a story quick enough 😂 I'm like joey out of friends lying about the raccoon 😂

[@aural_supremacy]

I didn’t watch the video so please excuse me if the title about Why You Need To Lie is sarcasm but I suspect it isn’t, You don’t need to learn how to lie, it is wrong, don’t bother trying to fit into a broken decadent society you are better off on the outside what is considered ’normal’ in the West particularly, is not necessarily the right behaviour, apparently Russians say what they mean and think, I have had no end of trouble with this but I have made my peace with it by restricting social interactions and the peace that comes from maintaining integrity and honesty is better than the confusion and shame that comes from lying just to be considered “normal” all you need to do is identify situations where the “need to lie’ might be considered ‘polite’ to be social and if you can’t speak the truth without ‘offence’ then say nothing, and if someone asks why you are quiet just say you don’t have the experience to offer a comment which is truth, if someone pushes you I would say “don’t ask questions to which you will not like the answer “, I would also add that if you have nothing good to say in a social situation then say nothing, if you want to make a negative comment on KZbin turn off your notifications more about that at the end of this comment which by the way means I will never see, nor search for any replies to this comment. Japanese society has a rigid social structure that causes them to bend over backwards to ‘fit in, and not bring attention to themselves publicly’ which causes a whole bunch of serious problems from ignoring people in medical trouble in public to girls quietly enduring being sexually assaulted on trains (they even have a special word for it called Chikkan) and this behaviour is enforced during school that the girls are told to say nothing during or after because it would bring shame to themselves, I know it’s probably not what you want to hear but there is no faster way to identify people with whom you can have a true relationship with than speaking truth, and also the only therapist whoever helped me and I am talking from psychologists to psychiatrists was the one who gave me the test for Asperger’s which allowed me to access specific financial support these “professionals” have no idea what they are doing, and lying is the worst advice you can give anyone, it’s little wonder our society is so broken and divided and trust me, it doesn’t matter how much you ‘lie’ to try and fit in you still won’t, been there, done that, have the T-shirt and I have come back out of the dark tunnel minus a wife who couldn’t tell the truth about much at all and a lot of pain but also intense shame that I was put in a position to compromise my integrity and I won’t do it again it’s not worth the consequences and by the way anyone who has a habit of commenting on KZbin videos but gets stressed out by replies to their comments, here is a tip, turn all the notifications off, both in KZbin and on your device and don’t read replies I don’t ever, so much better, anything you want to keep track of new uploads for example search for it manually.

[@anteshell]

I got it the exact opposite. When I was a kid, I was very lawful good in RPG terms. I never did any of the stupid stuff kids apparently normally do. However, my sister was a monster. But she always blamed me and when confronted my my mother and telling the truth that I didn't do anything, I was always smiling like a most guilty person with worst poker face would do. And subsequently I always had to carry the blame. At some point I learnt it was much easier to lie and come up with some stupid excuse to shift the blame from me, that just be upfront about it and tell the full truth, even when the end message was the same; I didn't do it. Nowadays I haven't changed much except I'm more neutral good than lawful but luckily I've also learnt ways to mitigate and excuse my grin. Still bad poker face but found a couple of go-to phrases to explain it and not appear as though I'm lying when telling the truth.

[@honourgardiner902]

@debbie8168 Same here! It's just way easier not to lie!😂

[@wonniek.3536]

This is literally my exact experience.

[@SootyPhoenix]

I hate lying too, but somehow people almost always believe me when I do lie.

[@PeteLewisWoodwork]

Lying has always been very difficult for me, especially when someone asks me to lie, if even for a good reason (and I accept that there are acceptable good reasons). However, even for a 'good' reason, I hate finding out that I've been lied to. I often know when I am being 'kept in the dark' and that makes me feel that people regard me as being unworthy and unimportant enough to be included.

[@christopherross8358]

Remember, just for personal survival... Nobody plays by the rules anymore, not even the people that made them up 🤕

[@jliller]

"Nobody plays by the rules anymore, not even the people that made them up" In that case the human race deserves extinction.

[@ms.terrious]

People never played by the rules! The best way to survive and thrive in society is to do the opposite of what you were taught as a child. Parents and teachers impose those rules on children for 2 reasons. 1. Benevolent reason: to be able to help the child in any situation (example: they teach you to always tell the truth, so you can tell them that someone mistreated you, or you have a health problem, or need help with homework) 2. Malevolent reason: they want to execute their power over you, to abuse you, because it gives them pleasure (example: they tell you to be completely honest, so that they can have a power trip by punishing you and scaring/beating you into submission. So, you learn that the truth will get you in big trouble, but you should be honest nontheless,) Good parents teach rules for benevolent reasons, bad parents just love their power trips. However, once you are in your mid-teens, childhood rules become obsolete. You're on your own now, and are expected to either learn to break the childhood rules, or to fall through the crack of society due to still clinging to childhood morals and rules as an adult.

[@marocat4749]

Its less about that, but about the rules that arent said out loud. Extreme examples,maciavellis prince has probably several reasons includibg satire, suckng up to the borgias, But most importantly talk about the invisible rulesof politics and power that happen usually, that evencanbe open secrets but rarely described. Or a more modern to frankly tell how that works the " handbook for dictators" about power politics and that and the rules there and reasons. While a " handbook for allistics" might sell pretty well and could be done with humor for everyone, seriously. I mean that invisible rules that are kept that rule how things really work but one one spells them out usually? I just think politics and how you have to know a bit of context to know that works might be similar?! Or the game rhe forgotten city that is entirely sbout truth," the rules" and how its really no just " the rules" as easyaspeople just say "the rule" there is entire complicated context in what it does, consequences and how it even came to be.

[@misspatvandriverlady7555]

I don’t think they ever did. The idea is to take some people out of the race by convincing us “the rules” are actually the rules. We’re just suckers as far as they’re concerned; anything that reduces the competition is fair game for them! 🫠

[@aaloha2902]

It’s a complex issue, I understand lying to simplify time etc, and to protect privacy, but there’s more to it in life. Growing up with narcissistic abuse and currently with an enormous increase of narcissistic behavior & gaslighting in society you’re vulnerable when you’re sincere and when autism feels like a ‘truth serum’. I have been punished a lot for being who I am and telling it like I see it, including with severe abuse, even by saying ‘no’ to inappropriate behavior. I personally need kind straightforwardness to save energy and function on a basic level, which doesn’t even include a ‘normal’ job. The insincere communication styles cost me way too much energy bc I need to double process information. I have issues with language processing as it is and then I have to convert the message on top of that, both on the receiving end as well as how I respond. I’ve taught myself scripts, but the way people lie to themselves and expect me to say comforting things back makes it impossible to socialize on a ‘normal’ level. Especially since ppl keep asking for the same insincere confirmation over & over & over again. It’s far too mentally exhausting for me and I prefer a daily quality of life🙏🏼🌺

[@fochti]

I agree that lying per se is not amoral! It's about the intent behind it. Withholding or warping the truth can be done to maliciously deceive, but also, for example, to not hurt somebody else's feelings, or like you said, to protect someone else's privacy and information they entrusted you with - which is a good thing. I feel like many autistic people (myself included) hear "Lying is bad!" when they're young and treat it as a strong rule that mustn't be broken under any circumstances. If I had an autistic kid I would teach them something like "Lying is bad - if you do it for selfish purposes and use it as a tool to exploit or hurt other people" to make it clear that the problem isn't the act of lying itself, but rather how you use it and what you're trying to accomplish by lying

[@ladytakarazuka]

I completely agree with you. Since we often lack flexibility, it's difficult for us to learn to bend something that we consider as a "rule". I wish most people would teach their children what you wrote here instead " "Lying is bad - if you do it for selfish purposes and use it as a tool to exploit or hurt other people".

[@er6730]

Honestly, I don't see it as lying. I see it as selective truth telling. (Allistic here) So often there are many options of true things to say, and why not choose one of the kind true things? Or word it in a gentler way. I just a few moments ago tried to coach my autistic 8yo how to kindly word something in a letter to her pen pal. She asked if my son liked the present she got him. My teen son is embarrassed by the fact that this 10yo girl gave him a present and so when my daughter asked him if he likes it muttered "I haven't even touched it". Now, I don't want this sweet girl to be hurt by his rudeness, so I suggested that my daughter write "he hasn't used it yet" as it's a kinder way to say that. Hopefully she'll be tactful. 😬

[@fochti]

@@er6730 Speaking as an autistic person, the thing that was very difficult for me to understand when I was younger was that questions in a lot of social situations aren't asked with the goal of acquiring the most precise and correct objectively true information possible, but instead to inquire how the other person FEELS about a certain thing. I wish someone had told me this (instead I had to figure it out by myself), so I'd recommend teaching your kid this very important concept! :)

[@Natural_Don]

i disagree that intent is much of a saving grace, to me you are still robbing someone of autonomy by providing them false information, this might not be applicable to every example but a lot

[@stillnotstill]

​@@Natural_Donso a person needs autonomy to be able to kill me cause I'm queer? No lol If I know coming out to someone is unsafe and I prioritize my safety, I won't give a shit about how they feel

[@peterdalton200]

I often lie, ‘to keep the peace’ in my own family.

[@catherinemartina6469]

I absolutely Hate Lying...It's a real thing for me.

[@fernandosimao9997]

In my life, I find that those lies are, by a loong shot, not the most common ones. I've been mostly surrounded by good-intentioned people or people who didn't have the power to hurt me. The most common reason people lie is not to hurt feelings. And that, I take issue with. A common example is "where are you?" "I'm on my way", when in fact you're just out of the shower. People say that not to make the other upset, but in reality they just waste the other's time. And that's where I think everyone should be more "autistic", in that they tell the truth regardless of people's feelings.

[@marocat4749]

True ,at least you can be semi honrst in that everyday situations. And care about feelings .

[@lilykatmoon4508]

I’m horrible at lying. Everything I think and feel shows on my face. I’ve gotten into trouble at work and in many life situations because I can’t fake attitudes , etc.

[@misspatvandriverlady7555]

One of the thing on my “I think I’m autistic” list for whenever they finally get around to assessing me (I’m on a waiting list) is: I have gotten in trouble for poor eye contact, staring, smiling, “chuckling” (nervous laughter) and eye-rolling! I swear, the slightest twitch indicating actual (or perceived “wrong”) emotion and the game is over! 😵‍💫

[@heavenishere416]

It's very hard for me to lie. It's like touching a really dry fabric. My brain gets zapped or something and I am forced to tell the truth. It's like impossible not to. I can't count the number of times I've said something to someone and it was a little off from exactly the truth and I say out loud "Nope, I'm lying. I meant blah blah blah blah". I don't understand why we all don't tell the truth anyway. This is not something I want to change about myself though. I'd rather tell the truth.

[@heavenishere416]

After watching the video, yes of course I would lie when it's life or death/harm. Kind of overrides everything lol

[@bosstowndynamics5488]

​@@heavenishere416That's an extreme example but the reason Paul brought that up is because there's lots of situations where lying is borderline essential, driven by the fact that society is incredibly complex and each person has their own goals that are not always aligned

[@lucyj8204]

Fascinating and challenging video for me, thanks! I'm the parent who says "it's just after three o'clock" so I can tell my children I never lie to them (I still never have). I am great at keeping secrets though - which can be the benefit of a flat affect. My internal framing is that I maintain a difference between honesty, candour, frankness, etc. These are all types of truth but with different power. I can ensure that everything I ever say is true without needing to vocalise every thought I ever have or disclosing everything I know. In court witnesses swear to tell "the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth", and I think that reflects the concept that there's layers.

[@AsetRa-ki9ni]

I hate lying, I can’t do it at all but I have learned to withhold info from people, because people can’t be trusted & I learned that the hard way 🙄

[@NoOne-dj1ou]

I find it's much easier if I keep secrets without lying. I can just say "I'd rather not talk about that" or something along those lines so no one is deceived but the secret is still kept. I also refuse to confirm the absence of certain sensitive secrets (i.e. refusing to answer questions in cases where if the truthful answer were different I would be revealing a secret) so that I don't inadvertently reveal a secret by refusing to talk about it. For example, if someone asks me if one of my friends is gay, I will tell them that it's not my job to answer that question regardless of whether someone is gay or straight. There are unfortunately cases where I can't use this strategy but it works for most people.

[@nordmannenfrank6066]

As i was diagnosed at the age of 14, i had the ability to lie sometimes, like when i covered my tracks completely buying sweets to eat or staying up late in secret watching youtube. Just minor lies but i have trouble lying over bigger stuff. It just feels wrong and everybody has a better service getting the truth is my perspective on it.

[@don-eb3fj]

Too much effort to be around people you have to lie to or try to figure out if they're lying or not. I can be polite, but I don't want people in my life I can't be honest with; the level to which I can be honest and expect honesty determines how close I get as a first qualifier (there are others). It makes my social calendar MUCH easier to manage.

[@SymphoniasStories]

I don't want to teach my kids to lie. Selectively filter, maybe - but no lying. But I do want them to learn how to tell if someone is lying to them.

[@briank8839]

For those situations where a shooter is not asking where his targets are hiding, you can have the mindset: "I am not at liberty to share that information." And just be quiet. Good points on the power of knowledge and who do you empower with yours.

[@lykanbluepaws]

I despise lying especially to me, because it's a waste of my brain power to have to figure out if someone is lying, and i shouldn't have to waste it on things like that. But also because i don't want to have to remember more than one version of reality.

[@Avendesora]

Curious if this will touch on lies to save face. A few days ago a friend of mine lied about whether she was on her way to pick me up and I ended up waiting outside in miserable weather for over half an hour because of it. I believed her when she said that it was traffic, but I found out from her roommate that she'd just slept through her alarm. This is far from the first time a neurotypical has played this particular game of "I look good and you have to deal with the consequences" game, and no one but me ever seems to be upset about it.

[@RestorativeWaves123]

People who lie to save face really aggravate me. Like your image of self is not THAT important, please be truthful with me!

[@HeadsFullOfEyeballs]

There's two social functions to that lie, I'd say? One of them kindasorta malicious/selfish, the other not. Firstly it's to save face, of course. But secondly, it's to spare your feelings. If she told you that she slept through her alarm, you might think that she doesn't value you enough to be disciplined for your benefit (which may or may not be the case). Or you might conclude that she's telling a _smaller_ lie -- that in reality she just couldn't be arsed to get out of bed for you, alarm or no alarm. Either way it would hurt your feelings without improving the material situation.

[@marocat4749]

​@@HeadsFullOfEyeballsBut wouldnt she know he doesnt care if she overslept? Like doesnt sound very trusting to at least he honest or semi honest.

[@eleanorwillow9671]

I've been burned by scammers and hard sales enough that I've learned that sometimes you need lies to help you make a strategic exit. Mall vendor too pushy about their lotion they want me to try? I have sensitive skin. Someone stops me as I'm exiting store asking for loose change or food? I don't have cash, just my card, this is for my kids at home, etc. (sometimes I'm not in a position to give, or maybe I don't feel safe in that setting). Romance scammer asking me for money for food? Oh no, I'm broke and hungry, too. Someone offers you food that you think is gross? Oh man, you're just so full! The really hard part is detecting when you're being lied to or scammed. I would love to see you make a video from that angle. For me, any of the stuff we're taught directly while growing up (stranger danger, creepy vans, finding lost puppies), or anything where a website/company forewarns you about possible scams, I can detect and counter. Or scams that involve things I know about the world-- like when romance scammer asks for money for hospital bills because he was wounded while serving in the military.... ummmm no, they take care of their own. Or, obviously you can't use Google Play gift cards to pay back-taxes. More subtle scams? Lies where you think the other person is doing a good deed? those are harder to detect. Once I'm burned, I remember and I do better, but it would be nice to be able to detect a lie without just assuming that everyone is lying.

[@ladytakarazuka]

That was a very interesting topic, thank you very much for that video. "Lying" is such a wide topic that it's difficult to summarize what I think about it. Whenever I can be honest without harming anyone or without being put in a vulnerable state, I am. My first orientation as a child and teenager was to always tell the truth, just like you. I learned later that being honest can make many social situations way worse, not only with untrustworthy people, also with people who were seeking emotional support (not the truth) at a specific moment and were hurt by said truth. You explained very well how lying can save lives. As with many things, it depends on the situations during which we choose to lie or to tell the truth and the purposes that we held behind lying or telling the truth at that time.

[@jimwilliams3816]

The “using power” way of looking at it doesn’t quite work for me, because I’m not comfortable with having power, the whole egalitarian thing. I can see treating knowledge as something you have to use respectfully, and I have some capacity to exercise this perspective: I can treat personal information someone else gives me with some discretion. I’m terrible with my own information; things I’ve learned I want to share, and I have a tendency to say what comes into my head, a trait I’ve thought of as ADHD, but I have heard this described as an autistic behavior as well. I’m also not comfortable not disclosing things: I’ve always said that my wife can be absolutely sure I have never had an affair, because I couldn’t possibly not disclose it, even if I understand doing so might not be the kindest thing. And yes, it’s hard for me to sense how that might be, not so much because of concern with honesty - I do feel that, but I can visualize how telling her might be the selfish thing. It’s more a compulsive feeling that sharing information is always best, and the more information the better. Which is why, although I get the simplification concept, and do try to practice it, doing so takes ferocious concentration. Partly again, ADHD: the first hint I had about having ADHD was being told that ADHDers can have trouble sorting relevant information from irrelevant. I am totally that way. I also have to suppress that compulsive desire to say everything. Some of the compulsion is OCD-like: I have the idea that if I lay everything in detail, I am less likely to be misunderstood, so it’s fear based in a sense. Yes, I am absolutely aware that it doesn’t work. And the last part is very much what I hear other autistic people report: some of the time, I get tired of trying so hard and feel like hey, being blunt and unfiltered is not so awful. Days like yesterday feel like unmasking to me. Maybe that’s not what it is, but as with standing up for yourself at the expense of being nice, maybe some unmasking is not always exactly nice either. You’d never guess from this post that I can’t filter, would you? (Sarcasm)

[@angeldude101]

"the first hint I had about having ADHD was being told that ADHDers can have trouble sorting relevant information from irrelevant." Huh. So that's why I hated having to mark the key points of a text, summarize, or take notes. I would always just copy notes down verbatim, and when asked to highlight important parts, my instinct was to highlight the entire block of text.

[@jimwilliams3816]

@angeldude101 yeah. In my case, I noted in Jr. High School that I could not write a book report outline because every idea was connected to every other idea. This was close to 50 years before diagnosis.

[@angeldude101]

@@jimwilliams3816 That seems to intersect with the autistic tendency to find connections where neurotypicals would see none.

[@jimwilliams3816]

@angeldude101 I think so too. I’d say pattern matching is my favorite thing to do in the whole world, and I feel it’s a real personal strength which has produced the works of which I am most proud. It frustrates me that I can’t sort and prioritize the patterns that well. I have the idea that many people that are autistic but don’t have ADHD can do this better, but I don’t know for sure. I know many autistic people are better at researching a topic than I am; I am into it at the start, but I think my ADHD gets bored and wants to start thinking about the data way before I have enough. So I pattern match with a spotty data set. I can’t take notes either. To process and retain information, I have to think about it while I’m taking it in. I can often do those two things at once (as long as I don’t try for eye contact), but adding note writing is one thing too many.

[@nio804]

One thing I've come to realize that in social situations, "truth" is often not as simple as in logic. Often the context is so complicated that we are *forced* to make simplifying assumptions, leading to multiple valid perspectives that one could assume, and "truth" depends on your choice of perspective.

[@Stormbrise]

If I lie, I blurt out the truth within a few seconds or minutes, my moral compass hates lying.

[@katheriney8318]

Thank you, Paul! It was challenging for me as a teacher to be "deceptive" in order to protect my students' privacy, and I seem to have learned to manage that in a similar way to your explanation on this video.

[@simonohara9617]

I can lie, but what I can't handle is the feeling of guilt that comes after. I have a compulsion to tell the truth. My default setting is that truth is absolute - and everyone should be or is acting honestly. I don't know when manipulating the truth might be expected or beneficial - flirting, job interviews, asked opinions. It is my experience that lying or stretching the truth is needed and expected for social situations to flow smoothly. And that's why many of my interactions didn't.

[@user-lx6pk9os2d]

Interesting one this - as a kid I really struggled with the whole lying / secrets thing - particularly the secret keeping. Just didn't see why I wasn't supposed to say what I knew. Took a number of bad episodes where I caused chaos before I learned that it was sometimes better to filter information for the greater good of not upsetting people. I now work on a "simplified truth" basis as I realised that just giving the basics is all that's needed and doesn't upset people - although I sometimes still get accused of having no filter! Ironically, I've ended up working in sales and have done really well because I actually tell clients the truth instead of lyiing to get a sale!

[@Discrete1998]

For the most part, I CANNOT lie. I feel so averse to it, I just shut down and say nothing at all. I have often been told that I am honest to a fault. This is why I hate flirting in dating. I often need time to build feelings, and people want to me tell them positive feelings before I have them. I also don’t tell people I love them or want to marry them unless I am sure I could actually see a future with them. It hurts to hear others throw those things around casually, because I feel like I can’t trust their fickle affection. Thank you for this. I haven’t considered the possibility I might be autistic, because I don’t want to jump on the bandwagon but things like this make me realize I might be.

[@Lightflames85]

try omitting the truth instead then your not really lying. Also the truth is subjective from person to person.

[@itisdevonly]

I don't like lying, but I suppose I learned that skill somewhat in childhood out of necessity. When I was really little, I was a terrible liar, but I lied compulsively anyway, as a way of evading being shamed for my misbehavior. It was to protect my ego, not to get away with anything. But when I realized that my habitual lying meant no one believed me when I told the truth, I stopped lying and became totally honest instead. I couldn't stand not being believed. The only time I lied was to my dad (who was a shitty person who did not have my best interest at heart) when I knew I could get away with it, and like you said, it was about managing information. I lied to protect my privacy, autonomy, and safety. But even then, I was careful and preferred "true lies" - statements which are technically true, but misleading. That way if I was ever caught in my lie, I could get off on a technicality. Though I was never caught. Learning to mask made me good at lying when I actually wanted to. I'm bad at wanting to lie, but if I want to do it, I can do it convincingly. I basically only lie as a form of protection, either protecting privacy or safety, or because it's what fits a given social script. Like, if someone asks how I'm doing, I might say "fine" even if I'm not. Although, even then, I still prefer evasive answers over outright false ones, like "I'm alive." I'm extremely uncomfortable making objectively false statements and much prefer softer lies which are evasive more than untruthful. Like if they ask if I like their outfit and I don't, I could answer something like "it suits you." That way I'm not claiming I like something I don't actually like, but I'm also not hurting anyone's feelings. But I still have a tendency to feel like I have to be precise about details, instead of simplifying, if simplifying feels like a lie (which it often does). It's just really hard to overcome the compulsion to honesty. I definitely feel like I'm vulnerable in that respect, and probably more honest and forthcoming than I should be.

[@dang1099]

Im fairly good at it from practicing as a kid, but i hate doing it. You get a lot of practice when your parent is abusive. Might as well lie and at the very least delay getting punished or potentially hit, or in the best scenario potentially getting out of it. Its sad, but its a learned behavior from trying to protect myself.

[@MCE851]

Im autistic and love lying. I had extremely abusive and punishing military style parents. I lied to create a double life in order to have some semblance of safety and a life free from my parent's scrutiny, so I could individuate and be my own person. I still feel the need to live a secret and private life, so instead I just tell people very little, now l dont need to lie much these days. But when I was stuck with my parents, it was essential for my survival.

[@t3hsis324]

Honestly, this is a difficult subject... And I'm sure given the situation of my nuclear family, it just compounds the situation. One of my favorite videos of yours, as this is definitely a conversation I wish I had years ago...

[@leokot7228]

Oh this 'lie' thing is soo true! I've hated lying and been unable to do that for my whole life, still don't see the reason to do that (apart from the extreme safety reasons though). But I'm an introvert, so talking to people and interacting is not my best hobby, that's why I usually don't care. Not saying something if I don't want to say it? - I try not to do that, I just say "I can't/(don't wish to) say this", which from my point of view isn't lying.

[@ryn2844]

When I was about five years old my friend asked me how many pet rabbits I had, and I told her I had four. That day when I got home, my mom had gotten us a new pet rabbit. I felt so guilty for 'lying' to my friend.

[@nonya.bizness]

i have enough trouble just navigating regular smalltalk! i'm a pretty smart cookie, but to me, lying is levels above any coursework i've ever breezed through. many moons ago, my life-of-the-party husband used to lovingly say that i "lacked tact" but he adored my never-fail blunt, insightful honesty. so i sort of find it hilarious now to realize... autism 😊.

[@JustMe_OhWell]

Lying is the number one thing that makes me so angry.

[@LaVerite-Gaming]

I‘m incredibly good at lying and pretending to be someone that I‘m not, I do it instinctively. But I‘ve long since chosen not to do it anymore, because all it will do in the end is make you forget who you really are in the first place. There’s nothing a lie can do for you that honesty can’t. Apart from extreme situations like that shooting analogy given in the video.

[@nonifuji1566]

I needed to watch this video, because I overcorrrect people and it makes me look like I'm trying to make people look dumb about trivial things. The protection of private information and simplification method sounds like it will go a long way. Thanks Paul

[@krakhedd]

I think everything boils down to power and how it's being used; intentions matter

[@Pumpkinshire]

Lying used to just be a sin. I miss that.

[@trinnyj1451]

It still is! It's one of the 10 commandments🌴

[@jessicaharris1608]

Yep, that's how I was taught. That's why I've had to be very creative in how much I say and don't say so I can be truthful and not lie but also not tell people things that aren't any of their business. Like if there's multiple true reasons for something, I will choose to share the reason that is likely to cause the least trouble, hurt feelings or arguments.

[@winterross3519]

I gave up trying to lie because it showed on my face (not my nose growing, but people could always tell) I had an EX- husband who used to say, "I didn't lie to you, I told you what you wanted to hear the way you wanted to hear it". Your comment on people taking advantage of us really applied also. I can remember some cruel games people played with me just to see how far they could go.

[@nofocus9329]

This is why now that I'm older and know I'm on spectrum I pretty much hang with ND folks. I was an incredibly adept liar, beyond the little social things mentioned, although rarely did it. I was a highly masking female who knew zero about ASD & observed the hell out of folks to learn survival. Now, I am done spending more time, energy, and effort into more 'masking skills' and amazingly actually have some energyb to function and even pick up hobbies. Exhausting to always be accommodating my behavior for NTs. Little backwards.

[@ariboehm115]

I don't trust anyone until I have reasonable proof that they are. Save for my few friends, I like to keep personal interactions to a minimum, and when I have to, I divulge nothing about myself. Mistrust has benefits. I also justify witholding information with the monologue "most people are idiots."

[@flyygurl18]

Managing social information is a practical and reasonable perspective: this is so useful for identifying and discarding inaccurate angst over information shared and also unnecessary information shared 🖖

[@Nicnaqsh]

Just shone a whole lot of light on they type of difficulties with the whole truth thinking. Thank you

[@LifeHackerMax]

Your video was awesome! Didn’t know about this perspective. I also hate lying but I also hate that I can’t lie 🤭.

[@galespressos]

Seeing this title, I got upset and couldn’t watch it but I will later. It has been a major issue as I have noticed it is expected and people even want lies. I feel vert angry about that. After thirty years I have finally complied with that, but those people have lost my respect. I think it is better to teach people how to say things that will be accepted even if not agreed on or unwelcome. My grandfather was an expert on saying unpleasant things truthfully and diplomatically. People didn’t believe I could count on my hand any untruths I had said before adult hood; and I am even including a stretch such as saying a meal was okay. Now Ive noticed people want lies. It is extremely upsetting and disappointing. I feel annoyed (worse) to be asked by society to do that. It is pointless and stupid, especially if everyone does it. However in such a climate of stupidity and meanness, I get the need. Too upsetting to completely watch this to end, at the moment. Thanks for videos and for covering this topic.

[@er6730]

What do you mean by saying that it's expected and people want it? I think it's more likely that people want to be spoken kindly to, or even coddled. Can you give an example? (One that isn't "the answer to the first "hi how are you" is always"not bad, you?" because that's not a lie, that's just a greeting)

[@MRi2thesky]

I work fuel quality assurance and supervise ground operations in private aviation. It has been a good fit for me until recent years. I’m expeditious in ensuring safety, training and meticulous with my record keeping. Seems like recently my higher ups have wanted someone who will lie and look the other way. That’s not me and never will be. Got blacklisted in a major aviation center for refusing to violate regulations and turn a blind eye to the continued degradation of standards. I’ve been easily replaced by people who go with the status quo. Not fun at all

[@amygregoire2666]

i'm 40...this information is a game changer! i wish i had seen this as a much younger woman, it would have saved me so much grief. I've always joked that i'm an over sharer, and absolutely terrible at lying in any capacity.

[@phoebe543]

I really relate to your journey with this. I remember as a teenager my sister told me something very important and told me not to tell our mom. Unfortunately my mom suspected it and asked me if this thing was true. I panicked, I could not lie but could not tell her but my reaction told her everything she needed to know. I've gotten better with it. Mostly because my husband experiences a lot of anxiety and self doubt and sometimes just needs me to tell him everything is going to be fine even if there's no way I could possibly know that. It took a while in out relationship before I understood this.

[@AurielArts]

You do not have to lie when you learn boundaries. And use humor to bridge the gap of “social norms”. For instance, if someone asks you how much money you make and you do not want to lie but do not want to tell them: do not lie or tell them. Chuckle and say: well aren’t you miss or mister nosey? Smile, say it’s your little secret. You can have secrets, privacy, and still be kind and blunt. If you are around people who do not respect your truth and fight or argue, you can learn and find others or write down things, talk to therapists. Redirect your energy towards those that are safe to speak to. You feel lying is wrong, not only because it was told to you, but because your intuition or gut knows that it is unhealthy.

[@stillnotstill]

Right but sometimes you actually just are in an unsafe situation even though you didn't want to be, where the truth is going to lead to harm

[@HeadsFullOfEyeballs]

What if refusing to tell them lets them infer the truth, though? You know, because there are only so many plausible scenarios, and if the truth wasn't in some way shameful or disadvantageous, you'd just tell them. "Wow, that's awful, how'd your mum end up with severe liver cirrhosis?" "Well aren't you mister nosey." "Oh, she's an alcoholic, got it." I'd argue that in many cases, effectively managing information is more important than your personal sense of moral integrity.

[@nessy9022]

@@HeadsFullOfEyeballs This is covered, i.e. if someone assumes and passively aggressively speculates "Oh, she's an alcoholic, got it" then go to "If you are around people who do not respect your truth and fight or argue, you can learn and find others or write down things, talk to therapists". i.e. "when you learn boundaries" (first sentence). Noting that in this case you're discussing someone who is: 1. Asking invasive medical questions about a third person. 2. Rather than asking the patient themselves they independently jump to the conclusion as to the cause of their medical condition. 3. Possessing the insensitivity to voice their unverified findings in a way that insinuates that mother's offspring actually told them this ("got it"), potentially implicating them if they go on to spread their speculation. Grey rocking or going no contact with entitled toxic people like that is arguably the most healthy response because it's unlikely it's a one off.

[@RickLeeofAtlanta]

None of these are reasons why it's necessary to lie. For the 3 o'clock example the addition of qualifiers keeps the statement from being a lie, while allowing for the same simplification. "It's about 3 o'clock" would not be a lie because of the qualifier "about". As far as withholding information goes, it's very simple to tell part of the truth without telling all of it. This also is not a lie. But when necessary it's also possible to tell someone, "I don't want to talk about that" or "I'm not at liberty to share that information". If you are confident in yourself and expect people to respect your privacy they will get the message and do so. As for the teacher, you are right in saying that it is an extreme example, but it also isn't necessary for the teacher to engage in the dialogue of the killer at all. She could simply stay silent. Or she could create her own dialogue by asking him why he is doing what he's doing, or telling the man it isn't to late to turn from what he is doing. Again this takes courage and confidence, but sometimes doing the right thing is it. It may be easier to lie, but that doesn't make it a good thing to do. And it certainly isn't necessary. I realize not everyone will share my beliefs, but for anyone interested in what the bible says about lying the most direct verse can be found in Proverbs 6:16 "There are six things the LORD hates, seven that are detestable to him: haughty eyes, a lying tongue, hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that devises wicked schemes, feet that are quick to rush into evil, a false witness who pours out lies and a man who stirs up dissension among brothers." While it's true that none of us are perfect and God forgives, it's worth noting that he wouldn't expect something from us that couldn't be done. Any time there is an opportunity to lie, there is also an opportunity not to that good can come from. Even if it's just gaining confidence in yourself in your own convictions.

[@stillnotstill]

Create her own dialogue? WITH A GUN IN HER FACE WHAT

[@HeadsFullOfEyeballs]

_"But when necessary it's also possible to tell someone, "I don't want to talk about that" or "I'm not at liberty to share that information"_ The problem is that in many cases, a refusal to divulge information lets people infer what you're refusing to share. You know, because there are only so many plausible scenarios and if the truth was benign, you'd just tell them instead of creating social friction by refusing their request. I'd argue that in many cases, protecting sensitive information (especially other people's) is more important than your personal sense of moral integrity. That's when you ought to lie.

[@knrdvmmlbkkn]

@@HeadsFullOfEyeballs"I'd argue that (...) ought to lie." When, for instance?

[@jo45]

A broader definition of honesty os great! Personally, It helped me alot to be more honest to safe people, and tell myself, that unsafe people aren’t entitled to my truth. Honesty with safe people can also look like: “I don’t feel comfortable revealing this to you/right now”, or for birthdays: “don’t look at x spot, I am keeping secrets there”. Respect is vital

[@anyascelticcreations]

I appreciate this video so much. And it's here exactly when I need it. I need help processing the fact that somebody I care deeply about is lying to me. So, I'm very open to the idea that my upbringing may not be 100% correct. I have always thought of lying as being very black and white morally and ethically wrong. Except under circumstances like life or death or other serious harm, lying was very wrong to me. Yet I can look at each of the lies that this person has told me and I see that he is doing what he believes is necessary in order to avoid pushing me away before he gets the chance to show me that he is worth staying for. He is choosing to keep that information hidden/altered as a way of protecting me and us. He is lying to me because he loves me. And when I realize that I feel that maybe his lying to me isn't actually wrong. Maybe it is actually the most right thing he could do. This has really been troubling me a lot. Because of the way I was raised. And because I tend to think of things very black and white. Thank you for pointing out that good people can still present gray. And that sometimes it becomes important to question something that we were taught as a child.

[@mbmbmbmb353]

This is so helpful, I can relate 100%

[@vall545]

One of favorite quotes I heard in a movie was “I always tell the truth, even when I lie!” Is classic. 😂

[@linden5165]

I can be discrete, and diplomatic in how I share thoughts, particularly for matters of privacy and protecting others from harm, but I can not lie outright. It's hopeless if I play games based on bluffing, I don't feel comfortable even lying then when it's expected and has no impact on boundaries. It took me a while to learn discretion and now I often need people to tell me explicitly what is OK to share as I am not good at intuiting that. There are benefits - those in my life know they can trust my word and that I will be upfront with them. The interesting thing I learned recently - is that I can interpret people not keeping their word as lying when actually NTs will be quite loose in saying they are going to do something and then they simply forget to do it. Meanwhile I've remembered in detail what they said and planned on it happening. That's frustrating.

[@Spacekixng]

Something I struggle with..

[@ElAlphaChad]

I can't get a job and one of the main reasons is that it is an absolute necessity to lie to get one.

[@stillnotstill]

If I ever have to interview for a job again I'm probably just going to act like I'm an undercover agent or some kind of actor or something and just try to really embody what I'm saying as part of a role

[@Nakia11798]

I feel your pain. It's so hard to get a job when you can't lie in an interview

[@HeadCanonGames]

I was tested for Autism and told I was Neuro-typical or extremely high functioning. But, when I saw your video cross my stream, I knew I needed to watch it. I have routinely gone through life being betrayed and taken advantage of by keeping secrets and choosing to avoid telling me hard truths. I've always seen lying exactly as you described at the beginning of your video - it's a morally reprehensible thing to do, so I don't do it, and I expect my friends and family to treat me the same way. But they practically never do. And I end up having my entire life torn apart by it time and time again. I can see some validity to what you propose about it being a social construct, especially when you frame it within the bounds of Doctor / Patient Confidentiality. What I need to sort out for myself though, and probably talk to my therapist about is the guilt I internally associate with the act of doing it myself, and how not to judge others based on their dishonesty, especially since those who routinely lie do so to get away with things they shouldn't be able to. I have some extreme trauma surrounding lying as a child, and the punishments that were doled out in response. There was definitely abuse there. But this video has given me a lot to think about and process. Thank you for making it.

[@InstantDesign]

Very helpful. Lying is probably the thing I struggle with most.

[@biaberg3448]

Lying is bad. But it’s not necessary to say what you think all the time.

[@RestorativeWaves123]

Lying is wrong yes. Kind of like inflicting force to cause harm is wrong. The only time it's not wrong is when it's done in self defence. Otherwise it is good to be truthful and honest...

[@motas91]

The closest I can get to lying is telling a half-truth, but even that's a struggle! My lying is far too obvious and people can see it in my face straight away. It's the worst when people "want my opinion" on something but are expecting a compliment, and I don't give said compliment.

[@pikmin4743]

I always loved Red Dwarf's take on lying and its vital importance to psychological defense... "Kryten, I'm gonna teach you how to lie and cheat if it's the last thing I do. I want you to be unpleasant, cruel, and sarcastic; it's the only way to break your programming, man -- make you independent!" "Lyin's a vital part of your psychological defence system; you're naked without it. If you can't lie, then you can't conceal your true intentions from other people; sometimes that's essential.

[@erikwdavis]

This is good. I think it could be usefully extended into a more explicit and longer discussion about "lying" in relationships of unequal power, such as when your boss lies to your face, or when you might want to "be confidential" about things to your boss.

[@doomsdaycupcake8659]

Very good video. This thought process happened to me when (after several supportive conversations with my girlfriend about issues I was having a work) and she said, "Some people have proven that they don't deserve the truth." And that hit home. My mind was blown at the truth of that. It has helped me ever since.

[@FlamesofRebirth3836]

That’s kind of how I see it too. I don’t like lying but if I’m in a situation where I get punished for telling the truth, lying gets a lot easier.

[@twinkletoes7095]

Awesome perspective. Thank you. These are quite stoic in principle.

[@fariesz6786]

i have to say i did get the idea of using a lie to get out of an obviously dangerous situation as a kid, but i still figured that was a rare occurence and it took me a long time to understand that people will use lies (and i mean deliberate attempts at desinformation, not simplification) on a regular basis in order to safeguard minute advantages in social standing - sometimes it seems in reaction to perceiving some of my oversharing as a lie, or in expectation of me playing along with it (i.e. with a subtext "i know you know i am now telling you a lie but i also know you won't call me out and this way i can safe face, not that it really matter because it's not like my social standing is under actual threat but i care even for this tiny amount of prestige so much that it will play this game") anyway, it was hard to understand the vastly different scope other people seemed to employ lies under. my recommendation in respect to simplification is: remember that the other person still _may_ ask for a more precise information; simplification just allows them process part of the information you want to convey before they get back to you. it can be frustrating if you know you're dealing with a topic that requires nuance and is easy to misunderstand, of course. most people just aren't able to process too precise information in one go. i tend to have that problem with doctors. i want to elaborate on every nuance i have noticed with an issue i have, especially when i _know from repeated exposure_ that a certain question will come. i also want to explain why something is an issue to begin with and why i didn't just deal with it myself (i have some chronic conditions, those of you who have some will empathize.. you're always either worrying too much or too little, and i really want to give my reasoning as to why i'm seeing the doc now - but the doc doesn't care about that, or if they do, they'll bring it up later) the thing is if you serve too much of the nuance right with the main chunk of information people get somewhat suspicious (if they aren't overwhelmed as mentioned above) - they think the additional information is distraction, or is trying to make you look smart, or that you must be in a state of confusion and/or distress (which you might as well be but not for the reason and with the implications they think of) therefore: make a rough sketch of what you want to say and only clarify when you get questions. as for your example of telling the time.. i can, with a sigh, accept "3 o'clock" when it's 3:02 (though i'm wondering why people wouldn't say "just past 3 o'clock" which is like ambiguous but at least by design). what reeeeeally grinds my gears though is when people go out of their way to say "exactly 3 o'clock" when it's already like "3:04" - especially when there's a reasonable chance i need the time so i know if i'll be able to catch some bus or train or something like that.

[@TempoTronica]

Lying has always been stressful for me. But as someone who was abused as a kid, I had to learn it as a survival mechanism. I only lie when talking about how I've been treated. Cause it's safer to say they treat me well than it is to tell them what I remember.

[@MachFiveFalcon]

I haven't been diagnosed with autism, but I have been diagnosed with OCD which can present similarly. I grew up as an only child in a household governed by religious fundamentalism. I struggled with lying like the autistic people you describe, but it was out of EXTREME religious shame that would crush my conscience like a vise before and after the lie. I also didn't understand why others didn't feel as much pain from lying as I did and assumed they'd want to be as truthful as I strove to be.

[@foodpuppie]

This is a brilliant way to reframe sharing information in a way that helps people maintain the essence of integrity and trustworthiness while not being hamstrung by technicalities. Extremely well done.

[@lyongarith]

I feel like there's a distinction between withholding information and lying that needs to be clarified. I realized pretty early on that there's a lot of factual information about every event at all times (time, temperature, lat/long, clothes worn, etc.), so there's no such thing as "telling the whole truth". As a teenager, I tended to answer questions with questions and annoy people into leaving me alone when there was something I didn't want to share. later, I would tell a partial truth but avoid the question, and then walk away before they noticed. Now, I'm more comfortable saying things like "I signed an NDA" (true, but probably not relevant) or "not now", or just put on my headphones and crank up the volume.

[@rainbowstarks]

this is such a good way to put it. I was initially resistant to the title of this video, but what you said is kind of what i've been trying to articulate in my own mind, that there are different "levels" of the truth, and usually simpler is best, and that lying is okay to protect information or from being hurt. I wrecked a 20 year friendship by telling the complicated truth rather than the simple truth, so that was a hard lesson learnt.

[@colinwright3290]

Please keep up this great work that you are doing, because thousands of us will keep listening, that`s a promise.

[@lisareid7043]

Thank you for the extreme example of when and how lying is actually a good thing to do instead of seeing it as black and white how we were taught. Now to just somehow be believable!

[@mariongray6678]

Thanks, Paul. This touches on something that has always been a massive problem for me. Still haven't found my way through it. Lots of food for thought here.

[@Seraphus87]

I absolutely hate lying and I have been quite gullible throughout my life. When I studied medicine, I got the hang of the confidentiality approach pretty quickly: denying information is not the same as providing false or misleading information for the purpose of manipulation. I have also become a lot less trusting in general, though the odd instance of manipulation still happens to me from time to time. (I am not sure whether I am actually autistic, had a continuous phase of high stress for a couple of months, which made me suspicious of that possibility)