Why Marx was Right: Alienation

[@mimief7969]

I drive a truck all day & only have my GED, I wouldn't have access to these kinds of discussions if it wasn't for the work people like you do, realistically. I find that it's really interesting and illuminates a lot of the world around me in a way that inspires me to live my best life, with a better understanding of things that can and do keep me down. Thank you.

[@mimief7969]

@ Yes, Marx & the video agree, it's now about alleviating the accompanying problems with things like general strikes etc., towards goals of workplace democracy and economic justice. Also "Identity is Character" is my favorite bottom-of-the-barrel white supremacist username ever. 😂👌

@@mimief7969 its funny you said "Identity is Character" is my favorite bottom-of-the-barrel white supremacist username ever. 😂👌" since it basically MLKs famous line reduced down. You dont know my race. You out yourself easily.

[@mimief7969]

@ I out myself as what? As white? As used to being bothered by white supremacists? Both are true.

[@mimief7969]

@ Oh, my bad, I assumed you meant that identity DETERMINED character, which is a position I've heard from white supremacists a lot. I am also a fool, and I suppose something of a racist, having been raised in an extremely racialized society, though I try and work on both quite a bit.

[@mttwmacneil]

Right on, mate. I have a background in philosophy and take for granted having stuff at my disposal. Our mate here does a great job. Although, Marx was not a humanist

[@LeonWagg]

Thank you for this video. I'm a master's student in philosophy, and Marx’s Economic and Philosophical Manuscripts of 1844 is still the most beautiful philosophical text I have ever read. His theory of alienation is still true more than ever. Here's my favorite quote from it. ”First, the fact that labor is external to the worker, i.e., it does not belong to his intrinsic nature; that in his work, therefore, he does not affirm himself but denies himself, does not feel content but unhappy, does not develop freely his physical and mental energy but mortifies his body and ruins his mind. The worker therefore only feels himself outside his work, and in his work feels outside himself. He feels at home when he is not working, and when he is working he does not feel at home. His labor is therefore not voluntary, but coerced; it is forced labor. It is therefore not the satisfaction of a need; it is merely a means to satisfy needs external to it. Its alien character emerges clearly in the fact that as soon as no physical or other compulsion exists, labor is shunned like the plague. External labor, labor in which man alienates himself, is a labor of self-sacrifice, of mortification. Lastly, the external character of labor for the worker appears in the fact that it is not his own, but someone else’s, that it does not belong to him, that in it he belongs, not to himself, but to another.”

[@joma5721]

Leon Wagner 910 this is one of my personal favorite bits from Marx, as well. The bit where he says the worker “only feels himself outside his work, and in his work feels outside himself.” is one of the greatest turns of phrase I’ve ever read, and stuck with me since my first reading of Marx at 16, despite the fact that i didn’t have a clue what he was actually saying at that point.

[@j.samuelwaters81]

It's hard to imagine that many jewelers, avionics technicians, or musicians would agree with this sentiment. Maybe it's worthwhile to find work you don't hate.

[@christiangeorge4258]

@@j.samuelwaters81 Musician checking in. Yeah, you still play crap gigs for crap pay and no challenge. There's a stratified market in the music industry too. The fact that it's a more creative labor doesn't change the extraction of value and alienation that results from selling it.

[@j.samuelwaters81]

@@christiangeorge4258 True. Sorry things aren't looking as good as you may have at one point hoped. Of course no job guarantees satisfaction, nothing can guarantee satisfaction, but something you have investment in, and/or which holds significance to you, should put a good bit out in front of the crushing effects alienation. Out of curiosity, what do you play? And, did you ever get it to the level of escaping that feel of the grind? Or, perhaps, it is still on its way? So then, if it's not where you want it to be, what can you do about that? More, importantly, what is it that you will do? I'm not exactly living it up with my employment, either. However, I do see the of doing work as serving another purpose, many others actually. Even the jobs which I felt totally sucked to perform had things to be extracted from it. This is a tad bit cheesey, but I think that approaching the work experience in as more multifaceted and integrated endeavor of improvement is a powerful, but not at all the only, bulwark against alienation - or modernity, as I and my ilk know it. If I were to dare get spiritual with it, I would even suggest that work is, or at least can be, an arena for the pursuit of a minor apotheosis of sorts. We have much different politics, but we're all still in this madness together. Which is why it pains, and at times infuriates me to see suffering people preferring to damn external forces, and swearing all the holy vengeances, rather than look for the alchemy to transmute pain into potential. There be fire, and into it we're hurled, though whether it is a furnace which consumptively immolates us, or a forge whose mighty swelter is a necessary condition to survive and accept being hammered into higher, better forms - that much is up to each individual to determine for themselves. At any rate, if alienation the be enemy, so be it then; fix your gaze, prepare your plans, and give that bastard some hell! But, getting too wrapped up in feeling victimized by it blinds one to the better options which are often close at hand. Worse still, it robs from people the agency, will, and creativity to actually be able to take a crack at whichever opportunities manage to present themselves. Our struggles likely have more common ground than we give genuine consideration to, and now I find myself wondering if we could be getting any good done by supporting each other in those areas - rather than continue to throw ideological rocks at and past each other 🤜🏿🤛🏻 Good luck out there. We're likely all going to need it ✊

[@LeonWagg]

Matthew Calise Yeah, I agree with you. The line: ”the worker therefore only feels himself outside his work, and in his work feels outside himself” is, for me, the most beautiful line in the history of philosophy. It has its dialectical beauty in it that every time I read, I always find myself in love with it. It's also crazy that Marx wrote that when he was just 26. Another crazy thing is that this was Marx’s own note, and he didn't intend it to be published, so you can clearly see that Hegelianism is so profoundly within him even when he wrote to himself.

[@buranflakes]

This really helped me gain a better understanding of why every single job I've had always turns into something that fills me with dread at some point

[@deadmeme8011]

@ What do you mean, we aren't in a true capitalist system? Please elaborate on that.

[@deadmeme8011]

@ Going by that ridiculous and utopian definition, real capitalism has never been tried. From the dawn of capitalism as a system, it's had the patronage of rulers who used the strong arm of the state to enforce corporate tyranny.

[@deadmeme8011]

@ Capitalism cannot exist without the armed enforcement of the state, and your supposed free market is an ahistorical hypothetical. From the dawn of capitalism, workers have organized into labor unions and militant parties to oppose the bosses who controlled their workplaces, and the government has stepped in to protect private property at every turn. Were it not for the police and the military, no one would ever consider letting a man pay them a fraction of their productivity to make him rich.

@@deadmeme8011 you couldnt be more wrong. capitalism has nothing inherently to do with exploitation. the fact that you bring up history while trying to claim capitalism is enforced by the military is such a joke considering the totalitarian military enfocement of every communist/socialist regime ever. its a big enough giveaway that your pic is a skull, go read some neitzche

[@deadmeme8011]

​@ Perhaps if you looked at more economic data and spent less time reading a philosopher who wouldn't recognize an economic trend if it mailed him a hundred bucks every quarter, you might actually understand the world around you. Your supposed "real capitalism" has never existed, and it never will. Additionally, capitalism is inherently dependent on exploitation to generate profit - if a worker produces $100 in value per day, you have to pay him less than that minus the cost of production to generate profit. Because of this, capitalists always have an incentive to pay their workers as little as they can get away with, and as a result, wages have stagnated for decades even as productivity explodes. www.wsj.com/articles/despite-tight-job-market-labor-forces-income-is-squeezed-11550930400 It's an unavoidable reality of the system we live in - your boss owns the materials and workplace you depend on to keep food on the table and a roof over your head, so they can get away with paying you just enough to make it to work the next day. This is the reality that most of our country faces, and if you removed the authoritarian structures that protect capitalists and companies for even a week, the masses would turn Wall Street into a river of blood.

[@pmaughmer]

Speaking of toilets... I actually rather enjoy janitorial work honestly. It's a needed aspect of society to keep everyone clean and safe which should be more apparent now than ever. So uh hey don't worry about the toilets, I got 'em cover. We got a revolution to put into action.

[@williampan29]

That's what he said in the end. You cherish not the cleaning itself, but the positive effect it might bring should people use it. An artist like me admires both the artwork I produce and the happiness it could bring to my buyer/audience, while you usually don't admire a clean toilet.

[@bootstraphan6204]

@@williampan29 I for one admire a clean toilet! ...I have kids Boys.

[@Priscila98245]

@@bootstraphan6204 🤣🤣

[@laman012]

Class solidarity

[@IAmNumber4000]

Charlie? Is that you? kzbin.info/www/bejne/fIW4ZX-FhMqUrqc

[@Brickinasock]

I am one of those who have been criticising Marx without understanding. Thank you. I will endeavour to learn more.

[@aldoushuxley5953]

While we are on the subject of endeavour: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eWnTdnisgMubY8U

[@hedgehog3180]

Good on you for taking the time to actually understand it, few people do.

[@canteluna]

@@hedgehog3180 No. I think most people get the jist of it whether they have red the Communist Manifesto. Who cares what the theory claims? What matters is how it manistests in socieity and those examples tell anyone who pays attention all they need to know. Marxism is an igornat ideology whose concepts have produced among the worst societies in the world that no one - who is not a brain-washed cult member - wants to live under. You don't need to understand the theory of gravity to know that when an apple falls from the tree it lands on the ground, not in a cloud. Just looking at the results of Marxism should be enough to avoid it like the plague.

[@ryans1623]

No your just a loser who is envious of others success that is marxism in a nut shell ENVY.

[@Ed-hc5iz]

Just got this video recommended by KZbin. I'm glad the algorhythm did something good for once.

[@robertstan298]

Ditto.

If accepting Marxism is good...

[@IvyTeaRN]

The system is so contradictory it helps itself to the tools of its own demise

[@MGSVxBreakpoint]

@@IvyTeaRN not really. If we go by Debord, the dominant system recuperates by turning revoltionary sentiment into entertainment. Plus you watched this, alienating yourself from your own leisure time observing the spectacle which is capital accumulated to the point at which it becomes images. Soon it will be time to go back to work

[@jaredschreiber4455]

Why, are you a marxist?

[@monkeymox2544]

I wrote my masters thesis on the work ethic and the ways in which its an impediment to social justice - one very interesting social experiment I came across was one in which researchers paid subjects to assemble identical lego models, and they were paid for each one. The subjects were divided into two groups, or 'conditions' under which they worked; one group had the models placed in front of them upon completion, whereas the other group (working in what they aptly called the "Sisyphus condition") had their models immediately disassembled. Both groups were paid the same amount per completed model, but individuals in the first group consistently 'worked' for longer. The researchers directly linked their findings to alienation, concluding that participants who had their models destroyed felt alienated from their labour, just like workers on an assembly line whose labour vanishes into the rest of the machine as soon as they've added their own meagre contribution, never to be seen again. Members in the first group could see what they had produced in front of them, a solid representation of their work which they could relate to, and therefore felt motivated (or less de-motivated) to work for longer.

[@breno855]

Damn. Could you point me to this work?

[@monkeymox2544]

@@breno855 Sure, not sure how easy it'll be to find without access to an online journal library though: Ariely, D., Kamenica, E., and Plelec, D. (2008) Man's search for meaning: the case of Legos. Journal of Economic Behaviour & Organization. 67(3), pp.671-677.

[@breno855]

@@monkeymox2544 let's say that I have my ways. Thinking of going back to university so it could even be academically useful. Thanks.

[@monkeymox2544]

​@ I don't recall how many participants there were in each group, but you'd expect that any differences in speed would average out.

[@RoboticusMusic]

Marxists don't work, statistically speaking. Problem solved.

[@HypatiaMuse]

My dilemma is that I've finally found meaningful & socially important work that I actually enjoy- Care Work in assisted living- but I'd actually be making more as a Walmart clerk. Neither job pays a living wage. I am passionate about being an advocate for Care Workers- especially in lieu of my experience during COVID.

[@madmarx9539]

I wish people would respect and reward social care more. I admire your work ethic. I hope you've kept safe during the pandemic.

[@DarkAngelEU]

Workers in general deserve a fat bonus and a long-awaited raise, preferably today than when the pandemic ends. Who's been boxing, sorting, delivering all those packages? Who's been taking care of all the ill, even those who purposely don't get vaccinated because they distrust their government? Who's been keeping supermarkets open? We could go on and on, so many people have sacrificed alot to keep our infrastructures from collapsing and rarely is there any kind of reward - except for the rich who only get richer.

[@superbananas7792]

I know your comment is three years old but I'd recommend reading "Sick of it all, Injury and Struggle in the nhs". While it does obviously cover experiences and struggles in the nhs, it goes much much much further, discussing Health and Social care beyond Capitalism, death and how we see it currently, past pandemics and the history of anti-vaxers (Where it started and how it links to social class). I myself work in Healthcare as a Nursing Assistant in acute secondary care and working for the National Health Service in the UK and honestly it's such a good book. It was pulled together by various people with different backgrounds, a mixture of members of angry workers of the world (A Rebel union over here), Healthcare workers United (A Healthcare workers collective) and the Anarchist Communist Group.

[@croozerdog]

people who own companies in caretaking know for a fact that you do the job because it's meaningful and rewarding on its own, they can get away with paying you squat im studying eldercare too though, rather have meaning and be poor than to be lost in some endless production machine

[@zonetripperofficial8856]

I think the problem of necessary labor is solved when you look at tribal communities. No one feels forced or alienated by doing chores. It’s just part of life.

[@tocaboss6637]

That that note, why isn’t your job just a part of life?

[@hedgehog3180]

@@tocaboss6637 Do you actually see your job like that or do you do it because you need the money?

[@sirnick12]

Tbh I feel 100% the same about chores as I do about my job. Job can feel a little easier even, as I know that what I am doing will give me money to pursue doing stuff I am passionate about, or allow me to outsource my chores, so that I have more time for things I actually care about

[@pulidoggy]

​@@sirnick12 ​​​​​So, in the end, you seem to be precisely demonstrating the video's premises: you find your job bearable, although not belonging to (and taking time away from) the number of "things you actually care about", in anticipation of using the resulting money to enjoy your leisure time by consuming it to "pursue doing stuff you are passionate about" or else to exploit someone's else alienated work - and time - by "outsourcing your chores"

[@canteluna]

So, problem solved. Let's break up the existing nation states of 7.2 billion people and live in tribes of under a hundred (research shows that tribes any larger than that result in social dysfunction and more violence). But, like my position, you agree that work in itself does not have intrinsic meaning and so its satisfaction is based on other social conditions such as being aware that what you do is serving a communal goal that you directly benefit from. But since we can't go back to living in small tribes, the answer is not Communism - we've seen the level of death and suffering that causes - but to try to improve working conditions through politics - oh, wait, that's what we have been doing.

[@sofiamds23]

I'm watching this while on my corporate job for Amazon. I think I'm gonna sit down and cry.

[@liz-sy2lj]

thanks....love your channel. just discovered it as i'm new to socialism/marxism/communism. i feel like i'm just waking up after a long-ass propaganda filled slumber. and the waking up process is not entirely comforting, but i will continue to educate myself. thanks again.

[@nsalegit9482]

Its never easy, but it can arm you with knowledge.

[@lynnixvarjo9150]

Also include Anarchism in that List. It is the Libertarian Wing of the Socialist Movement. Thinkers like Chomsky and Kropotkin have very important things to say.

[@jaredschreiber4455]

Totally, love how you’re trying to brainwash people into becoming marxists. Keep spreading stupidity.

[@GulperEEL]

It's pretty obvious from all your comments here that you're the brainwashed one homie. As this video implies, most people today who think they're complaining about Marxism haven't read a word of what he wrote and have often been purposely misinformed by members of the owner class who continue to benefit from the ignorance of reactionaries. It isn't really your fault though, Capitalism has been continually presented as the only system that makes sense, and most people accept that worldview by default. No worries, you'll either get there or you won't.

[@jaredschreiber4455]

@@GulperEEL Why exactly do you think communism is good?

[@juliancarlson1992]

The nearly self-evident reality of alienation for many people should, on its own, be a refutation of capitalism. It is the kind of suffering that needs little argument; it is with people every day, it is unmistakable.

[@noahbrasmonteirozino8703]

I love your practical examples of theoretical concepts, really makes you stand out from anyone else talking about theory

[@monkeymox2544]

"Maybe that would never work, except for all the times that it did" :'D I'm using that one!

[@mayssaamri1039]

This channel got me hooked up

[@ItsTheBrovahkiin]

I honestly don't understand how your channel isn't the biggest philosophy channel on KZbin. You 100% deserve it with the production quality and content. Who else is doing stuff like this?

[@PlasticPills]

@epochphilosophy has some good new vids on Zizek with all the graphical fixins

[@canteluna]

Maybe because it's full of Marxist propaganda and not "real philosphy".

[@msaggregated3036]

I completely agree.

[@Yet.Another.Rapper.KiG.V2]

I've been feeling so alienated from everyone that isn't me or sometimes my girlfriend/mom/one friend. Can't finish rn bcuz work but look forward to finishing. Thank you for making approachable content to introduce me to more Marx concepts 😎

[@maxpotiontcg]

This video sounds a lot like the Revolutionary Left Radio segment “Estranged Labor: Karl Marx on Alienation,” or it’s source: the Red Menace podcast episode “'Economic and Philosophic Manuscripts of 1844' by Karl Marx.”

[@OmegaLaser-xy4ip]

lol maybe the original souce is in an famous old book

[@lorenzoblanco9069]

This was a great video. I'm glad I'm back at the channel.

[@billpeel4408]

Joe fucking Rogan saying that no one understands Marxism almost led to me overdosing on irony

[@emilylouise9705]

Thank you for making this video. One of the best explanations of Marxism that I think I've ever come across - precisely because you make it REALLY clear why anyone who works for a living should, in fact, give a fuck about Marxism. Alienation has enormous implications for every aspect of our lives. I've been in a job in which I felt so detached that it made my work feel utterly meaningless. I worked in exports administration, so I was basically booking shipping containers which I never even saw (they were loaded elsewhere) for products which I never even saw (they were packed before they reached our warehouse) to go to customers who I never met, in countries and cities that I had never been to. My job felt completely unreal. Some days it honestly felt like, if someone came into the office and said 'Hey guys, this has all been a set-up. This business is fake and we've just been laundering money', I would have believed it. And guess what? It made me miserable! I felt like a zombie. I had no energy or drive to do anything in my personal time other than play games. When I was at work, I felt like my personality had been, not even swapped, but drained - like it just wasn't me anymore. It wasn't depression, because as soon as I left that job and started training to be a teacher, I felt like my old self - suddenly I had my energy and enthusiasm back. It was the job and how sterile and alienating it was that made me feel, honestly, like I didn't want to be living the life I was living.

[@dieselphiend]

Alienation of labor created the entirety of the modern world. You would have to live a subsistence lifestyle in order to be completely connected to your labor. You would have to grow your own cotton, and then figure out how to turn it into clothing without any modern conveniences. Everything you used would have to be created by you.

[@fastemil123]

@@dieselphiend A worker co-op where his position and democratic involvement with the workplace was more apparent could already help reduce this feeling of alienation

[@dieselphiend]

@@fastemil123 How so? We need higher wages. Ownership doesn't guarantee that. Co-ops... do not guarantee one remains connected to the things they use. How would you have batteries, televisions, GTX 4090's for artificial intelligence? How could we possible have hundreds of thousands of products without alienation of labor? How could we possibly have so many jobs? It is our perversion of consumerism that creates so many jobs to begin with. We're chasing some sort of dragon, my friend, and we're going to destroy the world just trying to find it. That's why communism always fails in practice. It relies on duality, and absolutism, as its founding principles, and they are wrong by default. Look, I want to live in a world in which there is more meaning, and people are more connected to one another but I know beyond the shadow of a doubt that communist ideas will never deliver that. It's an impossibility because you'll never get so many people, Americans especially, to give up their autodetermination as individuals. You'd have to genocide well over half of the population, and isn't it interesting how the propaganda to make that possible is already in play? Just ask anyone what they think of "straight white men". Many of them will straight up tell you that "they should die".

[@dieselphiend]

@@fastemil123 How so? We need higher wages. Ownership doesn't guarantee that. Co-ops... do not guarantee one remains connected to the things they use. How would you have batteries, televisions, GTX 4090's for artificial intelligence? How could we possible have hundreds of thousands of products without alienation of labor? How could we possibly have so many jobs? It is our perversion of consumerism that creates so many jobs to begin with.

[@dieselphiend]

@@fastemil123 We're chasing some sort of dragon, my friend, and we're going to destroy the world just trying to find it. That's why communism always fails in practice. It relies on duality, and absolutism, as its founding principles, and they are wrong by default. Look, I want to live in a world in which there is more meaning, and people are more connected to one another but I know beyond the shadow of a doubt that communist ideas will never deliver that. It's an impossibility because you'll never get so many people, Americans especially, to give up their autodetermination as individuals.

[@quantumpanic]

fucking loved that part where you made a 30-second summary loaded up with visual stimulation to help our obliterated attention spans. I genuinely laughed at how it worked so effectively for my tired synaptic relays.

[@julesdudes853]

really respect what you do, you keep concepts fresh in my head that have been in there since my teenage years. i'm serious, work like that is invaluable, more even when my day to day life feels like it's constantly making my sense of self unravel and dissipate. thank you.

[@adhhxgxhhg]

Seizing the means of production is what Marx and Engles meant, as in owning the tools, resources, and abilities that make things, not the actual product. Workers need collective control of the toothbrush factory, not collective control of your personal toothbrush.

[@mglanzer666]

Of course that lack of trust in other humans is also just the aforementioned alienation showing... which is to be expected, since you can't just remove yourself from that dynamic (usually what's meant when the term "petit bourgeois individualism" gets thrown around).

[@luddity]

Which is why most Americans don't object to Made in the USA labels being sewn onto their clothing by prison laborers who make pennies a day.

[@DonalUiNeill]

Man. This is sweet. Respect from Ireland

[@sawtoothiandi]

hello don! comrade

[@aoife219]

sme

[@VinsLeMans]

Thank you for letting people know how things stand once more

[@r.c.roberts1413]

This was a fantastic video. I actually, very recently, was discussing the idea of alienation with a friend of mine. A timely topic, for me anyways.

[@whowereweagain]

Ah yes-- alienation, I was just discussing with my friend about discussing alienation with my friend. A timely, insightful and truly brave comment my friend Charles

[@Yet.Another.Rapper.KiG.V2]

@@whowereweagain Are you insinuating that he doesn't feel alienation because he has one friend? I am also fortunate enough to have one friend, even though he lives 1000+ miles away, I also have an awesome mom and an awesome girlfriend period that doesn't mean that I don't feel crippling alienation from the 99.9% of complete imbecilic lumpenproles that take up the vast majority of my day-to-day life. I'm sorry if you are struggling with having a friendship, but don't bash someone just because they are fortunate to meet someone.

[@whowereweagain]

@@Yet.Another.Rapper.KiG.V2 ah yes-- alienation. I too seek refuge from alienation in my friends. Speak of the devil I was speaking to my friend the other day about speaking about alienation and my friend pointed out that they feels less alienated when they speak with me about alienation. A timely and prescient response my friend Kig V2, let's intellectuate about alienation again sometime.

[@Yet.Another.Rapper.KiG.V2]

@@whowereweagain Ok I'll give. I'm not following at all what point you're trying to make. Can you just put it straight?

[@whowereweagain]

@@Yet.Another.Rapper.KiG.V2 how pertinent to our discourse concerning alienation, it's seems you have been alienated from the point I am making about alienation! Ah yes-- I think this demonstrates my point about alienation succinctly: alienation. Thanks pal.

[@MuhammadKhan-vn4qo]

So well done!! I have sent this to my friends too, much better than I can ever explain

[@IAmNumber4000]

I've watched this video many times and it never ceases to blow my mind.

[@raptorrr930]

Loving the content coming out of this channel, the ideas are presented very well, in reasonable depth and with very well done visual aid. I can absolutely see this channel blowing up soon, keep up the good content bro!

[@brandonmiles8174]

Fuck yeah. I got the notification as soon as it hit. Thank you for this. Best channel currently on KZbin, with the passing of Michael Brooks.

[@ujean56]

Jordan Peterson would say, "...well how about no?" or "when you battle the dragon of chaos and save the virgin but she turns out to be a bloody Marxist". You can't argue with that kind of deep thinking can you? No, didn't think so Bucko, I mean Sunshine. Amazing video again. Thanks!

[@canteluna]

Not a Peterson fan but I can debunk any Marxist platitude you care to put forward.

[@Damesanglante]

@@canteluna No you can't. You can only lie like any capitalist potato. 🤡

[@msaggregated3036]

How is this channel not bigger? This is the best explanation video I've seen so far.

[@III-vg4dp]

I think this is one of the better and more complete explanations I have come across on the internet also given its conciseness. Well done.

[@edgyintellect177]

I just binge-watched your videos after discovering your channel for the first time. You are doing really outstanding work (also totally not alienating, at least to me).

[@venceremosallende422]

You know, you should dive deeper into marxism, alienation is a very interesting topic and you did a great job, but there is much more to explore. Have fun and gain knowledge so that we together can hopefully overcome capitalism within our lifetime

[@adhhxgxhhg]

Word. 💯

[@КошакКошаков-я6з]

Три раза слышал про другой путь и предположение, что его никто не может предложить... Отвечу словами Ленина: "Есть такая партия!"

[@nathantroisi]

Legitimately the best video about Marxism on this platform. Congrats! And thank you.

[@distortiontildeafness]

Did you see kapitalisms101 playlist on value?

[@nathantroisi]

@@distortiontildeafness no I'll check it out now

[@tamarshalev7737]

im still currently watching the video but i just have to comment on the epic background music you have in all your videos, so damn good!

[@daltonsantanalima93]

Making a video about Marx wearing a red shirt. Smooth. Discovered your channel this week and I'm in love with it. Awesome content with excellent didactics. Respect from Brazil!

[@h.hickenanaduk8622]

Thank you for recognizing my depleted attention span. I might add that I find your ability to get to the point and stick to it quite refreshing in a world full of Pepsi commercials and Pro-Football games. Anyone this respectful of people's time shines a good deed in a weary world. Also, kudos on the correct usage of Idealism. No, I haven't read Marx, but I will if you continue to go through it with us.

[@quinnmcrae6297]

Great video! It deserves the algorithm boost.

[@jeff__w]

Marx was absolutely right about what he called “alienation” but he lacked the behavioral language to describe it accurately. As B.F. Skinner said “To say that the Industrial Revolution in England improved the material condition of the working classes but ‘destroyed craftsmanship and the intelligent joy of man in his daily work’ by alienating (separating) him from the end product of his labor seems more profound than to say it destroyed the naturally reinforcing consequences of making things, for which the contrived reinforcers of wages were a poor substitute.” In essence, Marx’s observations on alienation, indeed, a lot of his critique of capitalism is about how capitalism substitutes money as a *contrived reinforcer* in the form of wages, profits, and as a general mode of exchange for the *naturally reinforcing consequences* that would otherwise elicit behavior. So we have things like health care and housing (in the US, at least) provided based on the ability to _pay_ (that is to say, _commoditized,_ where money, as a contrived reinforcer, is used), rather than based on _need_ (the naturally reinforcing consequences or, really here, the lack of them). The alienation Marx described-from labor, from others, from nature, from self-all derives from this substitution of money for the naturally reinforcing consequences one might experience from carrying out one's own labor, interacting with one’s family and community, experiencing nature, and finding out and doing what one _really_ wants to do. Describing what Marx observed in these terms removes a lot of the mystification surrounding what he was saying and makes it, more or less, irrefutable.

That is to assume these things don't happen in a capitalist system. None of those things are inherently denied by a free market. It's ridiculous that critics of capitalism seem to find the solution in government regulation when the initial monopolies of the west were funded by socialist style governors in order to sabotage the free market that was bringing people out of poverty like nothing had ever done before.

[@Sazi_de_Afrikan]

@ Ahistorical nonsense

[@deadmeme8011]

@ The initial monopolies in the west were charter companies given writ to enslave and murder for profit by kings and queens, you dolt. Read an actual history book sometime.

[@s2260]

My man the plastic philosopher . Thanks as always man ! And I fucking loved your Deleuze podcasts keep on the good work man . ❤️

[@nathanswann1198]

dude, you really harshed my circular thinking buzz

[@Syllogyzym]

ranch me up brotendo

[@afbf6522]

What do you mean

[@abataaoigami6715]

@@Syllogyzym wut is even happening here? XD

[@Syllogyzym]

@@abataaoigami6715 DADDY NEEDS HIS JUICE

[@adhhxgxhhg]

I really need this Sprite sponsorship.

[@stefansankaramarx105]

One of the best videos I've seen on the topic, well scripted and executed good Sir

[@kilimanjaro88]

I just found this video. Very clear and honest. It calls to take responsability for our own alienation. There’s so many narratives about oneself being the special and different, and someone else is the problem. I like you bring light to our own power.

[@canteluna]

Clear but not honest. Honesty would require an actually understanding of the human condition which Marx either hasn't got or he is cynical and pontificates about alienation anyway, knowing better. Either way, best to avoid Marx or read his critics who can elucidate why what might sound ideal and honest isn't.

[@jan_kisan]

that's a pretty damn good video, comrade. thank you! i'm really curious as to how folks might possibly misinterpret it.

[@grand1nquisitor]

Just found your channel- you got a new subscriber. Solidarity

[@DaveE99]

This is spot on what I really needed to hear to build out the intrapsychic culture in my head.

[@michaelwu7678]

Great video! I think it would also be useful to talk about Marx’s views on feudalism and pre-capitalist systems. Most people only seem to understand alienation via the limited capitalism vs communism dichotomy. But in talking about alienation, we could also use the medieval village artisan as an example of a different possible relationship to production, and this could help those who are ignorant better understand Marx’s views of communism.

[@NA-ck6cz]

I just tell people on the internet to google historical materialism

[@michaelwu7678]

Identity is character not group What? That’s not at all what Marx wrote about. Marx was all about stripping away illusions and superstitions, especially commodity fetishism in capitalism. Your comment makes no sense

[@michaelwu7678]

kzbin.info/aero/PLUVllNXk1GCpkzSmJHCSXqJE9JGIfS1dU

[@michaelwu7678]

Identity is character not group I don’t think that’s quite accurate. Maybe from your community or psychological perspective that’s true. But in the context of the bigger picture, Marx’s critiques of capitalism have been a very serious topic discussed by society’s most mature members for over 150 years. Your developmental psychological reduction of the matter is way too simplistic, and does not factor in any of the sociological, philosophical, or historical analyses that Marx provides. If you’ve studied Das Kapital already, I would recommend Frederic Jameson, Louis Althusser, or the Frankfurt School to see how Marx’s critiques of capitalism still apply to us today. TL,DR There’s no way that this serious of an intellectual tradition, built on continuous social analysis, could have been upheld for over 150 years by a bunch of psychological man-children.

@@michaelwu7678 That's funny since it was the teachings of the Frankfurt school and their derivatives that led me to study Marxism in the first place, but rather than adopting his way of seeing I scrutinized it.

[@herbertnorman617]

Great video, even though I think you are missing the implications of how this more fundamentally relates to the commodity form and generalised exchange. Even if you get your money from Patreon, even if you are independent and not forced to work for someone else, even in a worker cooperative, the very essence of the commodity form means all labour (and more and more all human activity) is alienated. You still have to make videos thinking about how they enable you to amass exchange value first and foremost and are rewarded and penalised on that grounds, even if you enjoy support by patrons. Your video is still, at it's core, a commodity where the use value (education, fun making it) is secondary to it's value in exchange (promoting channel, promoting idealised image of your person, promoting Patreon, pleasing the KZbin algorithm, etc.) This extends more and more to every kind of activity in the age of social media influencers, whose whole life activity is coordinated by that alienation. Socialism/communism is above all about realising this activity as a social process most and foremost, actually coordinating distribution and production according to value of labour, within that system, alienation is overcome because productive labour for human needs is realised as this social activity, freeing up your time and the necessity to produce for exchange. I think at the core of Marx lies exactly the contradiction within the commodity of exchange/use value, the contradictions of socially necessary labour time and prices, and this video, while getting some stuff very right, is still missing that aspect, which is absolutely fundamental to understanding Marx and why he proposed what he did propose in especially the Gotha Critique (e.g. labour vouchers) and how it relates to Capital and the Grundrisse.

[@Alexandra-jx4ov]

Well said, comrade

[@gregsimmons3323]

Yes, well said. This video is at best a decent "liberal light" introduction to Marx.

[@nephewheshh]

yessirrrrrrr new plasticpills video

[@ChezBing]

one of the few youtubers worth subbing to!

[@azureknight777]

Ludonarrative resonance here. Such a personal and friendly vibe. I get a strong "cool teacher" vibe watching this. It's so easy to listen and understand, even through discussion of very nuanced ideas. Wonderful.

[@ipadbossbaby4558]

You don't get nearly the amount of subs you deserve. Incredibly well researched and produced videos.

[@david23627]

ikd man your videos are so good i dont mind consuming them in my little leisure time

[@auroraorha]

PlasticPills you are way underrated !

[@Dom_Tunes]

Excellent video-essay... a very quality production. Not only good research, but also somewhat original thought. Thank you dearly

[@brian-beeler]

First off: great video. Marx's thoughts on alienation are critical to understanding the world in which we live and this video has done a great job of bringing those thoughts to many people. _"3. Self-image or alienation from self. Being a cog here or seeing yourself as an appendage of the burger, shoe or movie factories doesn't just affect your view of your boss and the customers it also affects your view of yourself because for eight hours a day you aren't a human you're just an output machine from which products are expected..."_ When your entire identity and self worth comes from your employment and you lose that employment it's crippling. Émile Durkheim wrote about this in his 1897 book "Suicide: A Study in Sociology." Capitalism requires that not everyone be employed so labor costs can be contained. The downside of course is the misery that ensues for those that are left unemployed. The answer is as Voltaire said "we must cultivate our own garden." We must cultivate interests outside of our employment to remind us we are greater than what we can produce that's measured by dollars and cents. Software development has been my occupation for a long time but I'm also a novelist. Long after I'm gone no one will remember any bit of my software but my novels will last forever. Ernest Becker in "The Denial of Death" called this our “immortality projects.” Being a novelist rarely puts food on the table but as with any artistic pursuit feeds the soul. I'd just like to add that if you are a creative person you should license your work under a Creative Common license and add it to the Internet Archive so the world may see what you've made. My rule is to release my writings under a CC license one year after publication as a way to balance the need to make a little money and to share my work with all.

[@NoFlu]

I'm not sure if there are studies into this but I'd like to see something on, if this has become more prevelant in the recent years with the death of hobbies and the rise of pure entertainment. When I talk to my parents, their friends and older family members they always did have some kind of hobby that develop some skill, even if it was something small or not really important. While most of my friends (early 20s) don't really have any that develop skills (besides maybe doing sports).

[@hedgehog3180]

@@NoFlu I think this is also partially due to depression, anxiety and other mental illnesses becoming more common among young people. A lot of people do feel they're in basic survival mode and as such don't have the energy to aspire to do creative things, a large part of this is the feeling that you always have to be "productive" ie. producing wealth for capitalists. It's kind of a contradiction when you think about it since like there is in fact no lack of the basic humans needs for survival but because life has become such a race currently existing has become so mentally taxing that we are forced into a survival mode.

[@canteluna]

The Marxist concept of alienation is nothing but ignorant platitudes. I have done a debunking of it here with actual facts.

[@adhhxgxhhg]

You are spot on with the Durkheim reference. I'm trying to find my way in life, I am struggling with that. Thanks to people like you and the great thinkers that came before us, I am asking myself what I want to do with my life and my time based on my own curated and changing values and beliefs. It is easy to just fall in line and live on autopilot and blame every failing around you on yourself if you don't see the full picture. People have inherent value, but they are not treated that way. I am finding my peace one moment at a time even if it is only understanding what is happening instead of controlling what is happening.

[@prismbrandingrealestatebra6301]

Top notch content and excellent videography. Underrated channel.

[@gindphace]

As a typeface designer I found @5:10 extra special.

[@caiorlb]

Wow, KZbin deleted the comment I made... Let's try it again: "Thank you for your work! It remains me of a beautiful assembly of words by Carlos Drummond de Andrade in 'Elegia 1938'" I'd put a link here but apparently KZbin doesn't like it when we leave the platform..

[@andrewabballe26]

I just read Erich Fromm's To Have or To Be? which is a great book exploring this notion of alienation

[@reibangchakma]

Good to see well designed summarization of complex information I would've otherwise not read in 20 years because of my fried up attention span

[@Geophaser]

This is the best explanation of Alienation I've seen. Honestly a great refresher, and covers all the main points Marx makes about alienation really clearly. Good job!

[@cosmanvalentin3467]

You make my day better. I am writing my dissertation (architecture) and your explanations have made me understand some things much easier. Have a nice day ^_^

[@TheAlmightyMat]

Great video! Digging the graphical content and appreciative of your effort in keeping up with our synaptic impatience! Started reading Marx and been finding myself coming to very similar conclusions. How do you see the role of private property playing out in maintaining alienation? Do we really need to think of all property as communal in order to dispel all alienation? Or would an unalienated society be respectful of inequality if it was fully attributable to labor input?

[@adhhxgxhhg]

@TheAlmightyMat Seizing the means of production is what Marx and Engles meant, as in owning the tools, resources, and abilities that make things, not the actual product. Workers need collective control of the toothbrush factory, not collective control of your personal toothbrush.

[@hypehypehype]

I've really struggled with understanding alienation...until now, thank you

[@matth464]

I take a couple uppers, I down a couple downers But nothing compares to these blue and yellow PLASTICpills I've been to mushroom mountain, once or twice but who's countin'? But nothing compares to these blue and yellow PLASTICpills unfortunately I'm old enough to remember this song

[@johnnyscifi]

Marx is my numero uno. Has been since I was 17, and that was 23 years ago. Probably won't change

[@socialswine3656]

damn dude you deserve more subs this is the best video i have seen on this

[@sawtoothiandi]

this is excellent. many thanks. your video editing skills are improving with each video i watch

[@justinwatson1510]

What if we had a draft to do unpleasant labor? When people turn 18, they commit to spending some number of years rotating through whatever tasks need to be completed in the community.

[@tomio8072]

That’s a cool idea

[@surajchaudhary613]

Great work! Keep going my friend

[@O.G.Rose.Michelle.and.Daniel]

That was a tremendous video, and I appreciate your work to clarify that Marx was far more concerned with meaning than equality. Sure, he wasn’t against equality, but if everyone found meaning in their work, the “sting” of inequality would be far less. Yes, we can’t pursue meaning if we lack running water, so basic needs certainly need to be addressed, but this only means we need “equality of basic needs”-for the rest, there should be more focus on meaning. I also like your work to clarify what Marx’s thinks about “labor value”-I think that is misunderstood. I think the biggest argument against Marxism is what you brought up: getting people to do “dirty jobs” (which Hayek discusses). I like the metaphor of the family. Like a family regarding their home, if we take Marx seriously and make sure everyone finds meaning in their work, won’t they “willingly” take care of the dirty jobs? This sounds plausible, and I don’t deny that when an enterprise is owned by a couple who finds the enterprise “meaningful” that the “dirty jobs” are taken care of. But I think there’s a problem: families are usually a collection of two adults, while jobs are a collection of multiple adults (perhaps hundreds). In a family, especially when the children are younger, pretty much all of the dirty jobs are done by the parents (especially those requiring specialty knowledge), and even between the couple, determining who does what can be a source of stress (just ask marriage counselors). Though both adults find their house and family meaningful, it doesn’t necessarily translate into a quick desire to clean the toilets. After all, why can’t my husband do that? In a business of ten adult, all who found the business meaningful, the drama and problems of negotiation we see in couples could expand radically (and not be so readily contained). Yes, because everyone finds the job meaningful, they may all want the dirty work to be done, but that doesn’t mean they will be quick to do it (someone else could, right?). And why should I do it and not them? And so the negotiations start, and with it, the possibilities of drama and conflict. Yes, I might be intrinsically motivated to run a florist, but that will not readily translate into an intrinsic motivation to clean the toilets, especially if there are ten other adults around who could do it too. If it’s just me and my wife, things could be different. Lastly, I think the metaphor breaks down because “cleaning a bathroom” is a linear simple task that doesn’t require much skill, and so it is theoretically possible to break the responsibility down across ten random people without much trouble. But if the “dirty job” requires more specialty knowledge, it is unlikely all ten people will have this knowledge to do the job well, and instead the task will fall into the lap of the one person who possess the specialty knowledge (and so that person can feel punished for being so knowledgeable). And this unveils an advantage of Capitalism: the majority of a society entails “specialty dirty jobs,” not “simple dirty jobs.” Running heavy equipment, repairing parts in a car, fixing electrical wires, detonating old buildings-the list is endless, and what cannot be overemphasized is how many of these “dirty jobs” require specialty knowledge. They cannot be readily shared: getting them done will come down to a few individuals being willing to suffer the work. The solution to this problem could be to have everyone learn all specialty knowledge, but this is of course impossible and radically impractical. Perhaps only the people who had the specialty knowledge and who felt intrinsic motivation should have to do the work? Maybe, but considering how many dirty jobs there are, this doesn’t seem like we’d have enough people. Maybe then we don’t need repairs done to our cars, electrical wires fixed, old buildings detonated…? Well, maybe…but would the quality of life be that much better? Hard to say. Socialism entails many fair critiques of Capitalism, and Capitalists should take many of these critiques seriously, but until Socialism can solve “the problem of specialist dirty jobs,” I’m not sure it proves to be a viable system. Sure, Capitalism could benefit from entailing “Socialist elements,” but that’s different from saying Socialism should replace Capitalism entirely. Also, there’s no doubt that Capitalism today is primarily a mixed market mess of Corporatism and Banktocracy and needs to be critiqued desperately. That said, I’m still of the opinion that the Liberal Richard Rorty was correct: the great challenge of Socialists is replacing price mechanisms with something that produces the same efficiency and increase in quality of life. I do a lot of work trying to defend Marx’s critiques of Capitalism in “The Creative Concord,” but I am yet to hear a good response to the critique I made above (which are inspired by the work of Fredrich Hayek). If that critique can be deconstructed, that would be a huge step in the direction of a world free from Capitalism. o-g-rose-writing.medium.com/ Thank you again for your fantastic work.

[@peanuttasty247]

Thank you for this excellent comment! While this is certainly a complex problem, and I'm not an expert by any means, I hope I can summarize a few of the points I've seen so far in my exploration of this topic! In a early market socialist system there would still be specialists, with the primary differences being in the structure of the workplace, compensation and de-stigmitization. The workers would cooperatively own the business and have democratic decisions for the operation of it. They would receive direct compensation for their labour, which would (hopefully) always be enough to live with dignity. Jobs that are difficult, demanding or disgusting would be compensated for this, and would become highly respected and honoured in their communities, rather than being seen as an underclass. The goal would be that reasonable hours and compensation combined with increased motivation for the collective good (as well as being highly respected in the community and jobs being less alienating) would continue to drive people into fields that are 'shitty' in these ways. People would still make different amounts of money under this system, allowing for additional motivation. The difference would be that all income would be directly from making/doing things of value to society, rather than simply owning things/Marxian exploitation (owning the factory, the business, etc.) as is the case with the bourgeoise class, as Marx puts it. Essentially, the margin between the richer and poorer people would not be as astronomical. The evolution of the system, and of people's mindsets would be gradual and take time, once the means of production have been seized. Whether or not that initial seizure can come democratically is debated among socialists. Side note: the mechanisms and theories of value are going to need to be worked out. Perhaps there can be some elements from both Hayek's subjective and Marx's Labour theory? At the very least more than just the quantity of labour would need to be considered at this stage. This includes market dynamics for payment of workers. If not enough people are going into these fields the payment can be adjusted (within thresholds) to increase motivation, as well as other factors. If a society chooses to progress towards communism, it will take time and innovation. Computation and A.I have come a long way, and are certain to shape this process. Even today, automation and A.I face a serious threat to almost every sphere of work, including those often not associated with these processes ("Humans need not apply" by CGP Grey is a great video on this). Of course this is only a 'threat' in a world where one must have profitable labour in order to survive. In a socialist system, with a UBI or similar system implemented, automation would eventually free up much of the population to shift towards other things, in addition to having more time and freedom outside of their job to innovate and pursue their passions. People would do other things such as education, community work, art or hobbies, research etc. Automation would serve all of humanity, rather than primarily serving a few shareholders and bank executives. That's the long term of course, but these technologies are already having massive impacts. In many ways, this kind of market socialism really isn't so far off from what we currently have, and some of these policies may be implemented into capitalism in one way or another. The crucial difference between this kind of capitalism and a market socialism would be that the means of production would be collectivized. (And the wealth of the extremely rich would likely be redistributed more drastically than through taxation, all of which depends on the society and the conditions of the transition from Cap to Soc.) I hope you'll excuse me if you already knew some or all of this. I'm very open to continuing to learn and question these ideas! These are certainly the ideals, and there are always going to be complications and difficulties. This is assuming that a society manages to defend itself from others, avoids becoming highly authoritarian and more. That's a whole different topic though. Anyways, thank you if you read all of this haha. It wasn't very well written, so let me know if there's any confusion. I hope you're well in these times, and I wish you all the best.

[@O.G.Rose.Michelle.and.Daniel]

@@peanuttasty247 Thank you, Jonathan, for the extensive comment and your generous civility: I appreciate that a lot. I am no fan of modern Capitalism/Corporatism/Banktocracy, but I also don’t want to be someone who uncritically accepts Marxists critiques, for if we do that, we risk any proposed reform failing. I think there are strong arguments to establish “horizontal” business structures versus “vertical” ones like you describe, and I think we’ll see more of those moving into the future. I also appreciate the angle of expanding ownership to everyone versus try to erase private ownership altogether-without going into detail, I think there are strong arguments favoring private ownership, but there are also strong problems with “limited private ownership” (mass inequality being one of them as a result of assets gaining value while savings lose spending power). I think stock options for employees is closer to a horizontal model, but it doesn’t seem to be enough. There is a risk of “the tragedy of the commons,” but I think this could be avoided if a “horizontal business model” entailed a lower number of employees-the ToC seems to emerge more as a result of size versus collective ownership as such. I’m a fan of Leopold Kohn, and think today we need to cease thinking only in terms of “Right vs Left” and also think in terms of “Up and Down” (regarding size). I expand on that here: o-g-rose-writing.medium.com/political-packages-and-ultimatums-483fee4b3a83 I think rethinking ownership is a good angle; I’m also a fan of expanding what I call the artifex in Marx to increase average capacity to create new means of production. I think that can help with the problem of alienation Marx discusses the “material dialectic.” I think it’s a combination of both. If you’re interested, here’s “The Creative Concord”: o-g-rose-writing.medium.com/the-creative-concord-c81e804817b8 I’ve been hearing a lot about AI playing a role in this discussion, and the possibility of overcoming the problems of “price mechanisms” as laid out by Hayek. I just finished the Gregy video, and it was an outstanding review of what Ford talks about in his book, Rise of the Robots. I completely agree that this is a massive problem, and I think about it constantly. In a socialist system, with a UBI or similar system implemented, automation would eventually free up much of the population to shift towards other things, in addition to having more time and freedom outside of their job to innovate and pursue their passions.” - I think something like this is going to prove necessary. The counter argument is that when people have their time freed up, they tend to get into trouble. That’s a negative view of the human race, and it’s probably not true for the majority, but what if it was for 10%? That would be 32 million people in America, which would be a problem. I think this suggests that we need to learn how to teach people to be “creative” and “intrinsically motivated”…and it’s not really clear how to do that…It’s needed research, I think. Perhaps people would take care of themselves? I hope so, but it’s a fair concern. “The crucial difference between this kind of capitalism and a market socialism would be that the means of production would be collectivized.” - I think something like this is probably necessary with AI, especially General AI. The question is what it will look like. I need to write a paper… Please don’t apologize: this is wonderful! I really appreciate the response and I think you brought extremely valid concerns. Thank you!

[@peanuttasty247]

@@O.G.Rose.Michelle.and.Daniel Thank you so much! I can't wait to read the writings you've done. These issues are extremely complex, and I definitely have a lot to learn. What I was describing was somewhat based on what professor Richard Wolff advocates for, essentially using cooperatives to shift the focus of the economy over time. I think any serious change would require the working class to see that coops/democratic workplaces can provide them better quality of life. This could be an in-between step, or perhaps not, depending on the material conditions of the society. Either way, I personally see this kind of organization as greatly preferable for the vast majority of people to our current prevailing organizational structure. The technicalities of cooperatives have been explored in much more depth by others, both theoretically and in practice. Any economic shift such as this would necessitate a cultural shift in many ways, and it wouldn't be able to be truly successful without that in my opinion. As you mentioned, shifting suddenly from needing to work to survive to work being optional in many ways will have negative effects. Education, inclusion, and more are absolutely vital to that process, and it would take time to undergo such a shift (perhaps a gradual implementation of a UBI, from an aid up until it's enough to survive on). I agree that a major problem would be a lack of purpose and motivation. If we can combine providing people with better conditions with social outreach, I believe that crime and apathy would be able to be greatly reduced. Crime is almost always a result of desperation and a lack of connection with society. We need to expand mental health services greatly as well, no matter how our system advances (or doesn't). These policies would all need massive shifts in our current way of being, including our way of consumption. With climate change looming, we will need to find a way to live and produce that is not in discord with nature. I don't think a dramatic shift (or collapse) is out of the question based on our current trajectory of inaction, and so the imperative is that we use the tools at our disposal to create new solutions and change aspects of our economy to this end. That's my hope at least! Anyways, I just want to thank you again. It's really refreshing to have a dialogue like this in a KZbin comment section of all places! Thank you for deepening my understanding as well.

[@O.G.Rose.Michelle.and.Daniel]

@@peanuttasty247 It’s wonderful to hear from you again, and I like Richard Wolff a lot: he’s a strong thinker. I really like your thoughts and think you’ve laid out what needs to be done well. “I think any serious change would require the working class to see that coops/democratic workplaces can provide them better quality of life.” - I think this is exactly right, and a concern I have right now is that people are looking over at Wall Street and feeling like they are being punished because they aren’t day-trading and speculating. When this happens and people conclude they would be better off speculating than working, the system will be in huge trouble. It’s something I call “market legitimization”: o-g-rose-writing.medium.com/market-legitimization-bdc8fe617324 (Forgive me for throwing all these papers at you-they're just places I already have more thoughts written down.) “Either way, I personally see this kind of organization as greatly preferable for the vast majority of people to our current prevailing organizational structure.” - We certainly need more structural diversity. If competition is good as Capitalists argue, then the lack of structural diversity means there is a structural monopoly, and that’s a problem. “Any economic shift such as this would necessitate a cultural shift in many ways, and it wouldn't be able to be truly successful without that in my opinion.” - I agree, and that’s where for me the question of if “intrinsic motivation” can be taught or not is a big one. I hope so. It’s wonderful to know KZbin comment sections can be redeemed! I’ve enjoyed this discussion myself, and please feel free to contact me anytime from the below website. I’ve enjoyed it. www.ogrose.com

[@peanuttasty247]

@@O.G.Rose.Michelle.and.Daniel Thanks again! I wish all the best to you, especially in times like these.

[@IAmNumber4000]

As for the toilet cleaning, just have Charlie do it. Charlie loves Charlie Work.

[@koekjestrommol]

excellent video, thanks for making my day better :)

[@tobiassteinborn1749]

Good video, especially coming from a US-american. In Germany we have a discussion about introducing a benefit for every person independent from their work. So everyone would get 500 or 1000€ and so wouldn't be forced into work. Statistics show that most people would do the same job, but with a little less time. Prices would stay the same since the best offer would still be the best offer. Companies had to make the unpleasent jobs more worth it. Being in management position is what everyone wants so it wouldn't be valued so high. On the other side nobody would be forced into cleaning toilets. So if you want clean toilets you built another system like you suggested or you offer a lot of money so you might find someone who does it for you. The allocation of worth would be so much fairer and people would see more sense in what they do. This is freedom

[@SoundSelector]

Fight Club. The whole is about the same topic. Still people love the movie for the wrong resons.

[@IAmNumber4000]

That movie’s more fascistic in its solutions to alienation though. “Fight one another and blow everything up” isn’t really conducive to building a better world, that’s just a way of expressing your unconscious frustration and trying to compensate for one’s shattered masculinity (being forced into subservience by a boss whom you hate) in destructive ways the same way a KKK member might.

[@SK-le1gm]

This was amazing. Now do Weber

[@lorenzoblanco9069]

Great video. Please keep up the good work. My only regret is not having learned more about Marx before writing about him. Thanks for deepening my understanding of Marx.

[@user-ub8eg1ld5g]

this is a great video! have you ever read Bataille? he seems to fit into all your videos (french post-marxist, influenced post-structuralists, etc), you should do a video on him! he argues alienation comes from expenditure as opposed to production, and writes about sacrifice being more 'intimate'. capitalism reduces the intimate into utility, so non-productive only comes out during war

[@woah3108]

second this. Please make a Bataille video!! 😊

[@CynicalBastard]

Thirded. *slips on monocle*

[@WorkingMan234]

Absolutely brilliant! Thank you very much!

[@Shimansaji]

This is a demonstration of an understanding of Marx. Excellent work!

[@666Metalbassist]

Yay! You are back!

[@MsJeffreyF]

Too bad families (and households in general) are often hugely dysfunctional.

[@pajalskacrassivi1279]

nice that someone understands marx despite his wrong prophecies about capitalism and how much his philosophy (which is controversial in some parts, i know) has been changed by following marxisms. did you face Hegel? even more misunderstood and maybe even more crucial as a critic of capitalism. if not, do it. very well done job, clear. maybe i wold have just said that goods are not just human activity or labour, but they are also social relationship, and of course not equal. but it was understandable through the whole video

[@quintinjepson566]

I love your videos.

[@veejaytsunamix]

I've gotten in the best situation where I trade my time in kind with my dole benefactor which in turn allows me to practice my various art forms practically fulltime.

[@ВячеславОвсянников-м9х]

Грэйт видео, комрад! Велком фром Раша!

[@Hephaestikon]

Your comments on the labour that produces our everyday objects, those that completely surround us, made me think of a potential Marxist phenomenology, a framework wherein our mundane consciousness is analyzed through the alienation prism. One could argue this is essentially psychoanalysis, but I digress.

[@affordablecareactof]

Ok this is Pog

[@bravovince3070]

Absolutely fucking adore your videos. Hope you grow big.

[@alexanderlee0001]

In watching this it strikes me that Marx's concept of alienation twists capitalist assumptions about ownership on its head. The reason why Marx is considered Hegelian has to do with that twist. The synthesis of that twist leads to the absolute system of communism. The claim that Marx is Hegelian is analogous. Class consciousness is the recognition of each of us in our self-realization. In Hegels's "Philosophy of the Right" that realization is through the transcendence of "Spirit" under the suprasensible Christian God. Marx has the same arrangement under the suprasensible labor pool of a complete and whole humanism. In that sense, alienation is central to the Marxist view of human relations.

[@danielalmeida589]

Feeling the violence Wouldn't bend the worker One day the boss tried Fold it in various ways. Luckily it took him At the top of the building And in a moment of time Showed you the whole region And pointing it at the worker He made this statement to him: - I'll give you all that power and your satisfaction Because it was given to me And I give it to whoever wants it. I give you leisure time I give you woman time. So everything you see It will be yours if you adore me And even more so if you leave What makes you say no. He said, and looked at the worker Who looked and who reflected But what did the worker see The boss would never see. The worker saw the houses And within the structures He saw things, objects Products, manufactures. He saw everything he did Your boss's profit And in everything he saw mysteriously there was His handprint. And the worker said: No! - Craziness! - shouted the boss Can't you see what I give you? - Lie! - said the worker You cannot give me what is mine. Excerpt taken from the poem The Worker in Construction by Vinicius de Moraes

[@michaelherscheid9709]

Great content. You have a new subscriber

[@vicpicksinvesting5380]

This is good bro.. I'm currently a crypto anarchists but this makes me wonder

[@gindphace]

looking good!