Why No One Hires Junior Developers (And What To Do About It) | Junior Jobs

[@junior_jobs]

What are you doing about it?

[@erestorhalfelvan7676]

Great, so I need to be a Senior Dev as a Junior Dev.

[@roshdave8997]

Because at the price of a 1 entry level software developer in USA, companies can hire 2-3 experienced folks in India, China, Philippines, Vietnam. Entry level roles are outsourced to cheaper countries

[@junior_jobs]

Most companies see juniors as high risk, low reward, for sure. Why take on that risk if they don’t have to? Even as an advocate for entry/level developers, I understand that reasoning.

[@StringNullNaN]

The punishment for outsourcing is extreme now with Section 174.

[@drchamp1902]

@@StringNullNaN😂 it’s awesome that you believe in it

[@rc5016]

@@junior_jobs So why most companies take this high risk in CHEAPER country?

[@sunnychoudhary6041]

@@rc5016 we have same issue here . They take risk because they can go slow and just hire more people to get the job done well and still save money. It cost them 25 to 10 percent of what they need to pay in USA . So they can hire one high level and two medium level developers to replace two American medium level developers. So that gives them better results and still save them money . Around 50 % saving despite increase in productivity and QA

[@world-9644]

Dang, should have spawned in a senior engineer 😢. Bad life RNG

[@alegwartney1962]

Its called freaking TRAIN YOUR PEOPLE........

[@sarasara935]

I have not heard such nonsense for quite some time. Junior jobs are out there for people with 5 years of experience. No matter how an entry-level person brushes up their experiences, how many open resources are preset in their resume, or ten internships are included, they will receive close to zero chance of getting hired.

[@Zuranthus]

i don't think ramp-up time has anything to do with it, when in the history of work has an employee ever come into a new job already knowing how to do everything? even if you're going from warehouse to warehouse doing menial tasks you still have to learn how their particular work setup and systems opperate. i'd say the real problem is too many people, why pick you when they have thousands of people with real world work experience knocking down their doors for a job? industries that have a true skill shortage gap will pay you for the privilege of training you (hvac, trucking, eletrician etc) most people today looking to get into software development already know everything they need to know, they even know the specific tech stacks the industry is actually using, this isn't like 20 years ago when just knowing what html even was would be enough for someone to interview you. kids today are already coming in building entire websites/apps where's the skill gap exactly?

[@valknut9648]

Exactly. This video is literally "just become a senior/principal engineer, bro" before even considering to apply, ignoring the fact that there are many other roles / jobs in not only the ones you've mentioned but the IT industry itself. There are far too many people lining up to be just another web developer but no one wants to do the "boring" maintenance/infra/admin work. TL;DR it's generally a supply/demand issue not a skills issue. Especially with thousands of Indians applying for every single opening - globalism is to blame and not necessarily the talent pool of the average Westerner in his local job market.

[@junior_jobs]

@Zuranthus Thanks for sharing your perspective! You are correct that there are thousands of people competing for each entry-level job. You are correct that industries with true skill gaps will pay to train you. You are correct that 20 years ago it was much easier to get in This all begs the questions then of: Why are there not more entry-level jobs? Why are companies not willing to pay to fill those skill gaps? And why is not easy to get in, when new developers can build entire websites already? The crux of this episode is answering that question by understanding the mindset of the hiring manager. And that is, how expensive it is to bring a junior developer on! It takes, on average, 3-9 months for a junior developer to be confident in a large, legacy code base. And during that onboarding time, the new developer needs a lot of hand holding from a senior (so it takes away from THEIR time too) And if any mistake is made in that oversight, then BOOM, we have a production issue (which could cost the company big $$$) So most companies see it as more cost-effective to hire 1 Senior for $150k as, on average, the velocity of that 1 senior is probably greater than even 4 juniors at $75k each. Especially since building a small personal project can be very different from a large production system that supports millions of users and millions of dollars in transactions. And early on, developers don't realize this. They are in that, "I don't know know what I don't know state", so that's why we talk about ways to identify those gaps and shore them up so you are not perceived as big of a risk by a potential employer.

[@junior_jobs]

@@valknut9648 identifying other roles/jobs is a great approach too! We talk about that approach in several other episodes, so make sure to check those out if you're interested.

[@kevintsuyoi901]

No , this video just blames the person who is outside of the interview and doesnt even mention the fact businesses are ultimately 100% responsible for growing their own talent. You are another shovel salesman at the tail-end of a gold rush.

[@ultravioletiris6241]

@@junior_jobs Nothing you said in that long long comment response really negates the premise of what you were responding to. Even an EMT or a Firefighter has to train and become prepared for the realities of their job. But in this case it’s most often just money on the line and not lives at stake. Yet somehow its more difficult to train a junior dev than a firefighter or EMT? Why, other than the fact that Seniors think its beneath them?

[@rc5016]

Capitalism has achieved its goal: making a lot of people become developers to drive down wages.

[@j.fkamaldeen]

This is the best advice I have ever heard on KZbin... thanks alot

[@junior_jobs]

Glad it was helpful!

[@j.fkamaldeen]

@@junior_jobs yes, pls keep giving us the best. Thanks ❤

[@manw3bttcks]

No one hires experienced devs either, I'm a 30 year developer in both military and space projects. All I get now is ghosting, someone calls that talks to me about how impressive my background is but nothing of substance happens.

[@MiddleEarthGeek95]

Similar situation here. I have 3 years of experience, 2 as a freelance developer and then Data Science, AI and Data Engineering. They all say that I have good resume for being a junior but I'm never picked up. I recently talked to a HR recruiter about my situation and she said that in my case, they might be afraid of me job-hopping, so why waste all of that time educating me when they could hire a senior with kids that craves that stability?

[@alegwartney1962]

"ramp up" Is the most bull shit thing. You cant expect any one I dont care how much experince you have. To just go yep I know everything.........

[@manw3bttcks]

The premise of this video doesn't make sense, entry level devs have always had the cost of training and ramp up time. So why is it all the sudden a deal breaker in 2024 but companies accepted it five or ten years back?

[@Websitedr]

I started my career in 2005 fresh out of college, got laid off in 2009 and only had 4 years experience going out trying to find a job in a terrible market going against senior level people willing to take lower level jobs in order to have a job. It took me over a year to get another job again. This mess being created in 2023/24 with the level of college grads and new people coming into this field they're not going to have 3-5 years experience for an entry level job.

[@questcore636]

the industry is moving too fast is why, they need senior devs 3 years ago, not tomorrow, the industry needs to slow down and realize you're standing still waiting on senior devs that you're shutting out over 12 years

[@mohibquadri4053]

How to mention 5 years of career gap due to family reasons- parental care in resume and is it necessary to inform the recruiters before interview to avoid confusion..

[@junior_jobs]

How recent was the 5 year gap?

[@mohibquadri4053]

@@junior_jobs Still it continues from 2019 now next month I'll be free from family duties to look for job search and networking..

[@junior_jobs]

Personally I’d find something else to put there or else your skills will sound outdated. For example, if you’ve done certifications during that time put that, or if you did any freelancing, put that. With the market right now it’s going to be even more tough for you as your skills won’t appear as up-to-date as most other candidates.

[@mohibquadri4053]

@@junior_jobs No bcoz in my field of AEC construction i as hvac engineer had done internship after doing course which is still relevant like software's and theoretical knowledge so how can it act against me if i can properly do the projects work .. yes some 1 or 2 new software's have arrived advanced but old one's are still preferred by many..

[@mohibquadri4053]

@@junior_jobs Can i mention watching webinars and KZbin lectures about my field and reading books etc if other things aren't there to showcase..

[@angelg3642]

2:30 No, the problem isn't skill gaps. The problem is work and experience gaps. You acquire said skill when you work in a real time work environment. YOU YOURSELF GOT TO THAT POINTS THANKS TO THAT. New hires are equally if not more qualified than you were when you started as a junior.

[@ImStephhhh]

I understand that several bootcamps do have great intentions, curriculum, teachers etc but the structure of a bootcamp is not a productive learning environment for most.

[@junior_jobs]

It's the problem with the education system in general tbh. Too much "follow the tutorial" type teaching, when it needs to be much more explorative and self-driven for things to really solidify. I've met too many graduates of bootcamps (and colleges) who still can't actually code for this reason Which is another reason why juniors are considered expensive/risky. It's unclear upfront how much hand-holding they will really need.

[@ImStephhhh]

@@junior_jobs I think it's way too much information in a very short period of time. People don't learn effectively this way. It's cognitive overload.

[@nreed7718]

Some of these "skill gaps" are surprisingly basic. Maybe take the time to run tests and ensure that your code compiles before submitting a PR? Conscientiousness is a basic skill that even many experienced developers lack.

[@magiclover9346]

5:16 Too many tools that abstract the complexity of the solution is a big problem. Junior devs have more abstracted away by frameworks, tools and libraries than ever before so they aren't massaging those low-level skills the experienced developers have. A simple one like connect to a SQL database and run a query is lost on them. This adds to companies pushing for container solutions to get the juniors on the team productive much sooner. That leads to overhead that the senior engineers now need to manage etc. This will only become more pronounced as engineers suppliment their work with AI. If someone asks me which frameworks to learn I always recommend an opinionated framework. You'll pick up on patterns a lot faster in those frameworks than non opinionated.

[@angelg3642]

Pretty sure most juniors know the fundamentals AND most/some of the new technologies.

[@Ribyum]

I've been debating changing fields entirely, with 4 months in unemployment welfare now because of this crap.

[@freaklore]

Even Senior level developers scour the internet for answers, maybe they are more proficient at it than a Junior would be. Obviously with AI, it is another tool to help out anyone nowadays. A lot of things are libraries, recycled code snippets that are perhaps altered ever so slightly to do the same exact thing. It isn't the old west like before. Technology is moving at an insane rate and will continue to do so.

[@mohibquadri4053]

How can freshers earn more

[@junior_jobs]

Honestly, as long as the salary isn't unsustainably low, I say the answer is "yes" to that first offer. Once you have some experience, then you have some leverage

[@mohibquadri4053]

@@junior_jobs Yes but some experience means how much 1 or 2 yrs or more than that.. also can innovative mindset and creativity at new workplace help in some ways ..

[@junior_jobs]

Realistically creativity DOES help, but that’s not what people are hiring for. The first filter remains years of experience and skill overlap. Once you meet THOSE then soft skills like the one you mentioned come into play

[@mohibquadri4053]

@@junior_jobs Could you recommend some top books to read for around this topic which can be crucial..

[@junior_jobs]

Around soft skills specifically? Or around the interview and hiring process?

[@matthewmcivor6827]

Great video! Just fyi: links 3 and 5 are broken.

[@junior_jobs]

Oh thanks! I'll look into it!

[@junior_jobs]

Should be fixed now 😅

[@angelg3642]

​@@junior_jobs Funny. Yall do mistakes but Junior people are supposed to be perfect 🤔

[@stes5429]

Total BS, they are seling another useless product... Teaching you to take udemy courses and to look youtube vids 😂😂😂

[@DigitalDetourBand]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/pZixi5yYaNqqfck

[@rosendom3042]

Doing > Learning

[@tonyd6853]

Hiring manager comfort

[@realitydesigners]

Great advice here

[@junior_jobs]

Thanks!

[@jwoods9659]

Tax change nothing to do with AI.

[@junior_jobs]

Can you expand on that? What tax change are you referring to?

[@jwoods9659]

@@junior_jobs Trump, changed the tax code to disrupt the tech companies. Now tech companies can't not write off what they used to do if they just break even. They get massive tax bills anyway. One reason so many devs could be hired was because it could be written off. As cost so until the government changes it back. Don't expect many new small tech companies and bigger companies will lay off. Also it's not AI, whom owns the code? It's all going into public silo..you have so many legalize to deal with no company is going to entrust their R&D, code base and IP to a AI platform. Unless it's their own. And since it cost millions to run a AI thas is not happening.

[@MBMulligan27]

@@junior_jobs He is talking about section 174. Here is a excerpt that explains a little of the background. TLDR, the tax law has made it more expensive for companies to hire developers and spend money on R&D for new software projects. Section 174 of the IRS tax code governs how companies can deduct qualified research and development (R&D) expenses on their tax returns. Before 2022, Section 174 allowed businesses to fully deduct R&D expenses in the year they were incurred, which helped tech startups grow quickly. However, the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act of 2017 (TCJA) amended Section 174 in 2022, requiring businesses to amortize R&D costs over five years. If the R&D is conducted internationally, the company must amortize it over 15 years. This change has negatively impacted startups in several ways, including: Unsustainable tax bills: Some startups are facing unsustainable tax bills. Bootstrapped companies: Bootstrapped companies are feeling the most impact. Venture-backed startups: Some venture-backed startups have slowed down hiring. Engineering jobs: Engineering jobs have been lost through layoffs or frozen hiring, especially if it's done abroad. R&D spending: R&D spending has decreased. This video explains it pretty well kzbin.info/www/bejne/mYrYf32KmcR9ha8

[@MBMulligan27]

@@junior_jobs Section 174. I think it took effect in 2022, but it changes how companies can depreciate software developer salaries. Basically, it causes software startups to have to pay more taxes for developers, especially in the short term. This video covers it pretty well. kzbin.info/www/bejne/mYrYf32KmcR9ha8

[@Jason-pb2vo]

Do you think if it's worth to learn less popular frameworks/languages? Like I'm interested in Blazor, but React is more popular, job seeking wise, is it a disadvantage of knowing a less popular framework than someone that knows React?

[@junior_jobs]

Good question. I'd first look at the # of jobs in your local area and base your decision off of that. But honestly, for most front-end positions I've helped hire for, we don't care too much about React vs Angular vs Vue vs. whatever-new-framework-is-coming-out-on-a-given-day. At the HIRING MANAGER level we see those as all the same (Now, at the RECRUITER level that's not always the case, unfortunately 😅)

[@jidec3165]

Learn the more popular on-demand framework first. Master it then make spare time to gradually learn anything else you are interested in. Getting paid helps you comfortably plan your next move.

[@rosendom3042]

Thats what I was thinking. Is there too many people going into JS-related dev roles? Should I switch from JS to C++/C, or some other language? The youtuber "Internet Of Bugs" said that JS being to crowded is why he never tried to get into to it. I've gotten pretty far into JS. I know React, NodeJS, ExpressJS, MochaJS, Debuging NodeJS code, and so much more, but still I'm thinking of switching to a different language.