Why Suicide Squad Kill the Justice League Sucked

[@LateNightHalo]

Dude, we are at the point where I think more people are familiar with evil Superman than they are a good Superman 😂 I’m hoping the new Superman movie is able to really turn around Superman’s image in pop culture. So tired of the Snyder, desaturated, evil red eyes and veins around the eyes

[@ebindelgado9660]

Thank fucking good My Adventures with Superman exists to show us what a GOOD SUPERMAN looks like

[@justcallmekai1554]

​@@ebindelgado9660 I usually don't care for Superman but I watched that show and it's so good and a breathe of fresh air.

[@cloudshines812]

Same for Batman too. Like I get he’s supposed to be a dark and grim superhero, but ever since The Dark Knight trilogy… people just assume Batman is just a psychopathic edgelord. I’m glad the Matt Reeve’s Batman remembered that he’s not just a superhero but a detective as well

[@just_an_elli]

That's me, guilty as charged. I'm hoping Gunn's movie will get me interested in the real version of the character

[@DarthNinja65]

But if Superman isn't dark or evil how am I suppose to take him seriously?

[@panthekirb7561]

The game has no soul, has boring gameplay, constantly insults people who actually care about these characters.. and was too expensive to make considering how bad it is.

[@STARM-t9b]

A detail I hate about the recent takes on the suicide squad is the fact they keep reusing the same collection of famous Batman villains. The coolest part of the concept of the SS is using a mix of underused characters to pull off these big heists and schemes no hero or anti hero would willingly do. It’s why I’m excited for the creature commandos film and why polkadot man, rat catcher 2, and bloodsport have still stayed in my mind for the last few years. It also adds nice tension to any plot because, well, they’re the suicide squad. DC is much more willing to kill of minor unknown villan characters at any moment, so there’s real tension if anyone dies or if they’re gonna make it out. They won’t do that for this game, but that’s a huge grievance with this cast

[@Volvagia1927]

Kinda late, but: That's honestly more a mechanical format problem. Rocksteady and WB shallowly saw the Suicide Squad as a live-service looter shooter goldmine (even though they launched with less characters than the already failed Avengers live-service), as opposed to the "classic mode Fire Emblem or X-Com, but jobber super-villains" premise that's way more fitting.

[@Adam-xd9tr]

This is the second time I've seen someway say that a Suicide Squad game should have been a tactics game like XCOM, and I have to agree. Midnight Suns wasn't flawless, but it showed that a superhero strategy game could work and be a lot of fun. Having the playable characters be villains that don't always follow orders or get along with each other would be a unique spin, and deciding whether or not to kill a disobedient character to keep the rest of the team in line would be a refreshing shake up with permadeath, compared to Fire Emblem and XCOM's "Try to keep everyone alive" mentality.

[@skylex157]

I feel there is a bit of a double standard when it comes to lore You cannot handwave lore stuff when it comes to "it doesn't go with canon" things but say "all these super powers and inconsistencies that break these character's lore may point out at them being clones"

[@zon3236]

My thoughts exactly

[@mjc0961]

I thought this game would be the highest profile live service flop I'd ever see... Then Concord happened. This game still stinks though.

[@NotUrStupidName]

idk this game had one of the biggest modern IPs backing it up and had good character designs yet still flopped

[@bachilles3285]

I mean, besides the obvious needing an excuse to take the piss out of the WB for continuing to fall down the Alt-Right Pipeline along with the rest of Hollywood by disguising the blatant sexism that is making women look older than they're supposed to be as feminism, devs basically exhausted all they could from the looter shooter genre and the late Kevin Conroy's passing created tragic timing for Rocksteady, which is why they decided to kill of the Batman they created.​@@NotUrStupidName

[@matthewbraith0411]

At least DC is known, Concord is a nobody game :)

[@Alex-bw3jj]

Like you

[@Souls907]

ssktjl sold more but lost more money.

[@autobotproductions1244]

I personally can’t imagine why anyone would want to kill the Justice League instead of playing as them

[@rayvenkman2087]

@@autobotproductions1244 Except WB.

[@BaithNa]

That's because the people at WB didn't understand virtuous characters like Superman and they were desperate to push Harley as the "Fourth Pillar" of DC.

[@MoodKapProductions]

Like the video said WB just keeps trying to make the Suicide Squad a thing. It's not gonna be a thing.

[@krnatsu]

​@@BaithNa I've always found it very odd that they chose to do that. Don't get me wrong, I love Harley (well not in this game), however she's more of DCs Deadpool than the 4th leg the universe stands on. Frankly the Flash fits the definition of a fourth piller, given how much focus he and the Flash Family gets. But Harley is more of a fun street level character, who DC unfortunately forgets can have more serious moments as well. Which makes ones like her role and character in the Joker War storyline that much more fun to read. But as a Harley fan, I wish DC would use her character more spairingly, but also make her a character again, not an excuse to draw people in

[@rayvenkman2087]

@@BaithNa Flash or GL Hal deserves to be that Fourth Pillar.

[@LucasHopkins2006]

Still wish we lived in a world where we got Teen Titans: Save the Justice League (or even better, an Arkhamverse Superman or Justice League game!)

[@krnatsu]

Or Batman Beyond Arkham, there were so many cool and interesting ideas and stories they could have gone with, and they chose THIS

[@thechronicler803]

Maybe we'll get red hood kill the suicide squad lol

[@LucasHopkins2006]

@@thechronicler803 I’d play that 😆

[@leopoldmaximus145]

I also wish we got a Arkham Batman Beyond or Justice League game

[@JLMina64]

Pretty solid idea considering they already had assets for Two of the Robins

[@nightmarearcade2663]

This game kinda embodies Warner bros biggest issue and that's the fact they just don't understand the video game industry. They don't realize that no one wants games that are so heavily monetized to the point where they feel more like shopping websites than games. From what I understand they're still trying to go through with live service games despite the failure of suicide squad. And considering what's going on with multiversus, history is gonna repeat itself.

[@KamusariHR]

Indont thing its just bcus of that it mostly has something to donwith the story 😂

[@ShinobiPXO]

My favourite rage-qutting moment is when King Shark uses the Green Lantern Ring by simply putting it on. Because the rings do *not* work that way. They choose their own users. Otherwise any moron could use one.

[@zaneheaston8254]

That was your rage quit moment, & not the repetitive gameplay

[@ShinobiPXO]

@@zaneheaston8254 It was my *favourite* rage-quitting moment. This game has a lot of those actually.

[@364wii]

​@sharpester7277 interesting so Daffy Duck is Worth? Cause he put on the ring and it worked for him.

[@mcpics4448]

@@364wiiI mean daffy is willful that fight off the animator for messing with him. Granted it’s more delusion than true confined but still

[@markmagician2471]

Explain the Batman then in the green lantern episode Penguin was able to use it

[@Jam-og1km]

I agree the Arkham Canon is weird, but I think the main arguement is that the game's existence kinda undoes Arkham Knight's ending by having back so easily and then killing him off after we've spent 4 games with him. I think a lot of people would have liked the premise if it wasn't connected to the Arkham games, which is ironic because said connection was probabily just to make the game more appealing. Gotham Knights I'm pretty sure was also meant to be in Arkham originally, and a story of Batman's sidekicks continuing after his death makes a lot more sense in the universe.

[@jeveritt8398]

The only justice league member who actually dies is wonder woman the rest are clones. I do agree having batman join the justice league post arkham knight is a bit weird though

[@CorruptEngieJR]

I agree. I think J missed the point there cause just because the canon is wonky doesn’t mean those games disrespect each other. The Suicide Squad game is just so out of left field compared to what people were hoping for with another in-universe Arkham game that of course it feels disrespectful, especially since it probably wouldn’t have gotten as much attention if it wasn’t in the Arkham-verse. They marketed this game with the Arkham universe attached and paid for it.

[@masummirza3033]

my genuine question is, who the fuck wanted this? fans had been begging rocksteady for a superman game after the success of the arkham series, and now i gotta play as a C list villain as Captain Boomerang, a character i had no idea existed if it wasn’t for the assault on arkham movie, like superman was RIGHT THERE but nooo i gotta play as harley quinn with the most fucking annoying ass raspy voice killing the hero’s i WANT to play as whilst killing them

[@theimpersonator7086]

Imagine having so many DC villains at your disposal, and then choosing the Suicide Squad lmao. It's like if Insomniac decided to make a Spiderman villain game about Hydro Man

[@FriendlyBatDoom]

I'm so tired of DC/WB pushing Harley Quinn on us.

[@rayvenkman2087]

@FriendlyBatDoom I think that's a common consensus. They keep trying to make her a Deadpool knockoff or a main player and it's just not working because the more interesting parts of her are ignored since they're associated with the "problematic" jester incarnation. The version of Harley we fell in love with by Paul Dini.

[@saltiresamurai9215]

⁠@@rayvenkman2087The thing that really annoys me about that is she could have been a main good guy in the bat family. I’ve been watching retrospectives and analysis of BTAS and she was definitely redeemable and could have worked. But all Harley Quinn stuff now makes her a nutter on par with the Joker but still tries to make her an anti hero or just a straight up hero. It just doesn’t work.

[@MoodKapProductions]

I ask myself that at least once a week. It'd be like making Condiment King the animated series directly after Batman TAS. But the twist is that the Condiment King is not allowed to use condiments.

[@DinoDave150]

Never before have I felt the biggest case of schadenfreude seeing this game flop. A game like this does NOT deserve to make any money whatsoever. In regards to Batman's treatment, I'll say that while it didn't disrespect Kevin Conroy, it did crap all over Arkham Batman as a character. After everything he's been through, THIS is how his story ends? Give me a break. As for the Flash finger, Green Lantern ring thing, I have two things to say. For the former, I just chalk that up to them forgetting to change the model as Flash has a cybernetic thumb in one of the trailers and when he returns in the Mrs. Freeze Expansion, he still has all ten digits. For the latter, I just chalk that up to the writers not having a clue how Green Lantern rings work. Let's not forget, according to the Jason Schreier article, Sefton Hill would rip out massive chunks of the script on the fly, so that didn't help with people not knowing if the League are supposed to be brainwashed or clones. Also, GOD I cannot stand Tara Strong as Harley Quinn. She is SO annoying. Get Hynden Walch back. Please!

[@merchantziro4285]

That part with it being a dishonor to the legacy of Arkham Batman rather than the voice itself, that I 100% agree with. At the very least it could have been handled more respectfully to give Batman a more fitting end.

[@AlexPrimeH]

They did confirm they were clones. In the second dlc they rescue flash. So yeah, the theories were right, not that it really matters anymore.

[@ultron_sigma]

It didn't clarify that they were "clones". Because the ship picked up their bodies

[@corekidfrom9700]

Isn't that just a cope out tho? A bit like a quick redcon after they saw the reaction of the fans?

[@medafan53]

​@@corekidfrom9700 As was mentioned, it's likely that the voice work was done years ago, so it was always the way it was gonna go. The only thing that might be changed is that whatever they had planned for Clark might get folded into season 4 with Bruce because I think it's safe to say, with the reception the game has gotten, that they're gonna drop the 4 seasons promised and then pull the plug.

[@diamondinthesky4771]

@@medafan53 In short, "Too little, too late"

[@medafan53]

@@diamondinthesky4771 Yes, the badwill was already there, by the time they got to the "Oh the league aren't really dead" reveal there were not enough people around and it wasn't gonna get anyone back.

[@kahboom76]

I don’t think those retcons in the Arkham series are comparable to the ones Suicide Squad. It’s one thing to have a mismanaged timeline, but to redesign an established character like Deadshot and claim he’s the real one despite the other having a clear history with Batman seems like lazy writing and an excuse for the redesigning him

[@petrenicolae3282]

The other dosent really have that much of a history with Batman.The City Deadshot and Assault on Arkham Deadshot are already too different in personality,which Kill the Justice League Deadshot being more alike with City Deadshot in personality.Origins is also completely different because how good of a marksman compared to city Deadshot,Origins Deadshot Is.

[@FriendlyBatDoom]

DC/WB is trying so hard to make Harley Quinn a badass instead of giving us a Superman game. Batman is awesome good focus on him. Wonder Woman is getting her game (hopefully, it won't suck or be preachy), so why can't Superman or Martian Manhunter or Green Lantern? I could be wrong about this but I look at The Flash as too hard to make a game for.

[@rayvenkman2087]

@FriendlyBatDoom With the Flash, I would look at the Sonic Adventure games, Unleashed or Frontiers on how to do a good Flash game. Might as well ape his gameplay style.

[@BaithNa]

It's because DC has viewed Harley as their "Fourth Pillar" for about 15 years now so this is how they give her the spotlight. Thank God James Gunn is running things now or we'd be inundated with Suicide Squad garbage for another decade.

[@FriendlyBatDoom]

@@BaithNa 🙏Hopefully

[@Calmoose415]

They keep trying to turn her into Deadpool and it never works.

[@ultron_sigma]

The only harley quinn I like is the animated show but everything else is just terrible especially suicide squad

[@JCDenton205]

ah yes the worst game to come out of rocksteady and the game that basically killed the studio

[@MrIAMNOTANOOB]

For me, it was wasting Batman's character arc. Everything he went through, all his struggles, and the things he sacrificed were all for nothing. They just flat out killed him stone cold like. No emotional goodbye or anything. This is a Batman we've been following almost as long as DCAU's Batman and this is how it ends.

[@ash-n-joker]

I understand what you’re trying to say but it’s not actually the end. Regardless what you or I think, the basic fact of the matter is that the League we killed where clones and the real League are being hidden by Brainiac throughout the multiverse-and in the next few seasons we’re bringing them all back. So it’s not actually the end for Bats-in fact quite a lot of people agree that it could allow a future Arkham game with Batman or the League to happen (with Roger Craig Smith voicing instead of Kevin tho)

[@MrIAMNOTANOOB]

@@ash-n-joker There's a possibility all this might get shelved due to the game's low sales and poor reception.

[@ash-n-joker]

@@MrIAMNOTANOOB maybe. I’m just correcting you that in actuality the JL isn’t dead, and all of them are alive albeit in different multiverses (Flash has been saved tho) and we’re going to save them (they have to release the last 2 seasons because it’s what they owe contractually-it was in the report and everything) so we’ll at least get to see Batman again

[@ultron_sigma]

​@@MrIAMNOTANOOBI mean there's barely enough players playing the game so. The remaining rocksteady employees that are still working on it probably thought its a waste of time if their not getting anything out of it

[@nobalkain624]

​ @MrIAMNOTANOOB Big "Twists" like this dont matter if people dislike it so much they give up on it before you have the chance to reveal them. Until the clumsy reveal in Season 2, this entire "Clone" thing was just a Theory, because the only real Clue was Fans trying to excuse the HORRIBLE Writing. Before this there was also Theories they were Multiversal Versions of them. To me the Calendar Man Easter Egg does not count, because its just an Easter Egg. Many Easter Eggs are just for fun and dont actually go anywhere, so I never count them as "Proof". Just Creators having some fun and leaving Hints at what they MAY like to do if it was up to them. In the end I feel they left it Vague enough that they could just Write up any reason to undo it if they got enough Backlash, or leave them dead if people enjoyed it. For me either way it was Bad Writing. They did not have the Skill to pull off what they were going for. It either required them to Ignore DC Cannon, or they just didnt know it well enough to understand what they got wrong.

[@kzilla8864]

This game should have never been canon to the Arkham Games. What were Rocksteady and WB thinking!

[@erikbihari3625]

"Nothing, absolutely nothing"!

[@boredhoodie3852]

The DEI people invaded and said it's Morbin Time.

[@EalainEP]

​@@boredhoodie3852 if you honestly believe that I'm sorry you're just incredibly dumb

[@MalzraAirwynn]

It was probably the executives wanting to capitalize on the Arkham brand name to get more sales. Rather than what Rocksteady wanted to do.

[@kzilla8864]

@MalzraAirwynn Still, it was a stupid decision anyways.

[@kaijionline]

I’m not sure why they thought anyone would want this game

[@LucasHopkins2006]

Easy answer, WB are idiots

[@rayvenkman2087]

The SS just aren't the Justice League and WB are the only people who don't get it. The best comic run was decades ago no less.

[@shajita]

I wasn't there, but I don't think the game they released were the game they started out with. Like, a co-op mobility shooter where you play as distinct characters with your friends against superheroes as bosses. That's not a bad pitch! Then came the execution, the lootgrind, the story, the live service. It probably got pulled in so many directions for so many years that they tore it apart.

[@rustyschackleford4762]

Who was happy when watching cartoons or reading comics to see the heroes get defeated, let alone killed? It’s always cool when they make a comeback, level the playing field, turn the table, over come the odds; but killing them off doesn’t lead to anything. Maybe a Lazarus pit in this case? Idk

[@kingofgreed1992]

​@@rayvenkman2087they don't seem to grasp the point of SS is they are supposed to die thus the name

[@Raincloud5137]

The problem isn't really that batman's death disrespects Conroy, but that it disrespects Arkham Batman, they could have brought a Batman from a different universe like they did with Deadshot, but the fact that they chose a Batman that we played with for DECADES and gave him this ending was really sad. Most people would be fine with that game if it just wasn't in the Arkham universe.

[@Manuelbacon40]

It disrespects everything the way that batman died lol the voice actor everything how would arkham batman lose to these idiots hahahahahah

[@SadistHatred]

I am so Glad i don’t Spent my Money on Stupid Childish Games or Collectors Editions like most nerds. I prefer only just buying and playing good Games and then move on. Here are some from my Collection Sekiro, The Arkham Trilogy, Far cry 3 and 4, Last of Us remastered, Resident Evil 2, 4 and 7. Uncharted, God of War Bloodborne, Wolfenstein Assasins Creed Unity, Syndicate Sillent Hill 2 Remake. Dead Space Call Of Duty Black Ops 6 And even Naruto Storm 4 These are pretty good Games And These are just a Little of my Collection. I have more good Games.

[@Necro-xy5ej]

Personally my problem with the Batman death on this had nothing to do with Kevin or the Arkham legacy or whatever For me it was that Batman was brainwashed to begin with when in multiple instances, in various types of media, he has shown the ability to resist mental manipulation, even in arkham Just feels really weird, not saying it's impossible or anything like that but eh

[@leithaziz2716]

I think a reasonable answer is to exclaim that many find "Evil Batman" or "Evil Superman" boring concepts, including myself. When you remove the aspects that make those characters human, they lose much of their appeal. J himself even brought up how much Evil Supes has been overused in media that many are clamoring for his more optimistic portrayal to return. I agree that the "Batgod" characterisation that makes Bruce seem perfect can also be frustrating (it helps ground his character when we're reminded Bruce is still human. This is why I found Batman Arkham Origins the most interesting characterisation of him in the Arkham series), but I personally don't find much appeal in brainwashed Bruce. At least not with this game's execution. The appeal of heroes, wether they are relatable or not, is that they inspire us.

[@jaxxpool9630]

I’m sorry, but there are some pretty bad takes in this video. For one, your point on the Arkham canon being a mess feels like cherry picking on small details. Like it could be possible Harley was an Arkham Asylum psychiatrist called over to Blackgate. Also, this story is not just okay and it’s no way better than Gotham Knights. I’m making a critique ripping apart the game’s story to prove that. The one thing I agree on is that people shouldn’t use Kevin Conroy’s death as a weapon against the game.

[@cedbanani]

The problem with your suggestion about Harley being called over to Blackgate is that the first three audio tapes for Harley from the first game place her meeting with the Joker at Arkham Asylum, not Blackgate.

[@jaxxpool9630]

@@cedbanani You could just say Joker was transferred to Arkham Asylum sometime after Arkham Origins and Harley interviewed him there to learn more about him.

[@cedbanani]

@@jaxxpool9630 J's Reviews is referring to Harley meeting the Joker for the FIRST time. Asylum and Origins contradict each other on where this meeting took place. Your latest comment has nothing to do with Harley and Joker's first meeting.

[@jaxxpool9630]

@@cedbanani But how do the audio tapes in Asylum themselves imply that it’s Harley meeting Joker for the first time?

[@cedbanani]

@@jaxxpool9630 In the second tape, The Joker says to Harley "So, I'm your first, am I, toots? You know what they say, you never forget your first time." This indicates that this is their first meeting. The first tape is Harley's employee orientation at Arkham, which is also on the same day as the second tape. In other words, Harley started interviewing the Joker on her first day at Arkham.

[@ultimatehope549]

There are things in this game that prove Rocksteady could’ve made a fantastic Superman or Justice League game if they wanted to. WHY DIDN’T THEY WANT TO?!

[@MalzraAirwynn]

I do recommend the James Gunn movie. It's a lot better than Assault on Arkham and the first live action movie. (Though it's hard NOT to be better than the first live action one.) Though it feels like EVERY adaptation of them refuses to stick to the idea of them being villains sent on black ops missions and wants them to be saving the world, or at least a city, by the end. Except for that one episode of Justice League where Task Force X infiltrated the Watchtower. And maybe the animated movies after the first, I've only seen the Arkham one.

[@Adam-xd9tr]

There was an animated Suicide Squad movie called "Hell to Pay" if I remember correctly. There are a few clips of it on KZbin that are pretty good.

[@CyberBolt21]

I'm confused, how can you on the one hand say "Fuck Canon" at 19:14 but then at 19:56 say you don't like how this game changed Harley Quinn's character from being a more straight up evil version of the character, to now having to be more "likeable" because she is a playable character/protaganist?

[@felixdaniels37]

Because he was talking out of his ass for the sake of being contrarian. He was more concerned with "owning the discourse" over consistent, coherent opinions on the game.

[@xtrwombat4876]

​@@felixdaniels37Yeah, im a little disappointed with this one.

[@hunterfogleman7443]

I agree that canonicity is a bitch, but I think everyone has their own preferences on how a character should be portrayed. I think that’s just him expressing that. Also, I think if you’re going to play around with the Arkhamverse, there should be at least some consistency with the characters.

[@MaximumPayine]

Because one "canon" has to do with consistency and likeable has to do with his preferences.

[@havonoVT]

Batman's death was just the icing on this rotten cake

[@thatguyfromA6915]

This is why you wacht the video before leaving a comment

[@MTC-hy6ig]

be quiet

[@BaronSterling]

​@@thatguyfromA6915Nothing in the video contradicts this comment.

[@thatguyfromA6915]

@@BaronSterling 11:17

[@BaronSterling]

@thatguyfromA6915 Congrats, you've correctly identified a moment where J talks about Batman's death through simple word association. Now explain how it contradicts the original comment whatsoever. The death not being disrespectful to the actor or the canon (though I disagree with him on the last part) does not stop it from being a poorly-executed death of a long beloved character. Thus, icing on the rotten cake.

[@TevyaSmolka]

This game was doomed to fail from the start and personally for me all I wanted a justice league game not a suicide squad game which didn’t sound interesting but so boring in my opinion.

[@CyberAnko]

When it was revealed that this was going to be a live service game, any interest I had in this game evaporated.

[@BEYONDTHESPIDERFILMS]

Huh... says f**k cannon then says Arkham Harley is too out of character and SSKTJL hand waves her lore. I thought cannon didn't matter to you dude, you can't have it both ways. Your vacuum argument doesn't really work now if the very next thing is on Harley's continuity

[@marqusmedina5983]

Suicide squad would've worked if they hadn't put them against the justice league

[@nobalkain624]

Thats the entire issue with this Concept and should have been scrapped from the start. The idea that some D List Villians (most with NO Powers) can take down a Team of Heroes that Defeat Universal Threats is a Joke. Then to top it off they beat them with GUNS! They even make fun of this whole idea at the Beginning with Flash stopping Deadshot from doing just that, and he IS their Marksman. If this had them going around the World taking out Target they COULD stop, then this idea could have worked. Could even end it with them stopping a Villain like Luther in the end. Maybe even tease them needing to Stop Batman in a DLC, or another Game, but NOT the JL.

[@petrenicolae3282]

You never heard about the story of David and the Goliath?You don't know about underdogs?

[@nobalkain624]

​ @petrenicolae3282 This isnt a Story about David Vs Goliath, its a Story about Ants Vs a Flood. All they could hope for is to Survive.

[@petrenicolae3282]

@@nobalkain624 Except your wrong.The league aren't the flood.Sure,they are Powerfull monsters,sure, but like the Goliath,they have big exploitable weaknesses.The League aren't natural disasters,they are just very powerful glass cannons,easy to beat if you have the necessary stuff to beat them. And the Squad being ants by your logic makes them able to survive "the flood" very easily. Again,my logic is right(The league are more Goliath than the flood) and yours is wrong(ants can survive underwater for as long as 24 hours).Next time when you want to say someting on the internet, verify what your about to send, because you could be very off mark with your opinions.

[@nobalkain624]

​ @petrenicolae3282 Clearly your just to dumb to understand. Every Member of the JL could have killed them Solo, let alone as a Team. Plus you add in the Fact they no longer cared about trying to NOT kill them. Also clearly you never spent your Childhood Drowning Ant Colonies like I did. All they could do was try and Survive, and I was just a Kid with a Squirt Gun and a Pail. I am not a Man God who could Zap them from Orbit who could also fly around the Planet before they could run down the Street.

[@lucienkage3229]

This isn't about Kevin Conroy's death, it was about the gross execution of a character that so many people have grown up with. We never get to see Batman actually work with the justice league at all. They just give us a shallow museum photos and audio logs. So we got cheated out of that. Superman convincing Bruce Wayne to just join the Justice League no questions asked and they make it look like Batman just said "OK!", so yeah how exactly was Superman able to convince Batman who he never knew and a man who has never known him to just up and work with not only him but several other people Bruce Wayne doesn't know the first thing about? Does this sound like Batman to you? And the fact that Batman accompanied the justice league to brainiac knowing it's a trap and even says out loud to the justice league that is a trap. That makes no sense at all, so there is no sensible reason he ever went to brainiac and he was never confirmed to have agreed to go in the first place.

[@CommenjouerFr-gplus]

For what I've seen, it can sums up as the followed: - Too much info on the screen that is for those suffering from ADHD (which is not a good sign) - OK gameplay but nothing special compared to all characters - Awful script thanks to a certain consultation group - the fact that it is set in the Arkham universe is a complete dissapointment (not only Batman but look what happened to Poison Ivy) - Being a AAA game, it has season + battlepass to milk as much money as possible. - no offline option Glad I skipped this game and stick with the original Arkham trilogy.

[@AVGJ3859]

I genuinely thought you wouldn't cover the SSKTJL. Considering how bad the game is that most people would leave it dead to the dust. Good video.

[@lssjgaming1599]

Im so sick of live service everything, so its no wonder this game flopped. The market is so oversaturated with these kinda games

[@Exidel]

Fun fact: This isn't even the first time Kevin Conroy played an evil batman willing to take lives, only to lose and die. In the Arrowverse's Crisis on Infinite Earths, he played the Bruce Wayne of Earth-99 in live action, an aging Bruce who killed his universe's Superman, and couldn't stop killing his villains. In the end, he died after attempting to kill Earth-38's Supergirl, only to be taken down by Earth-1's Batwoman.

[@pyrolee17]

This concept could have popped harder as a game similar to Midnight Suns. Control Rick Flag, recruit other villains, get to know them and maybe fight waller as a secret true ending boss

[@authurstretchygreenthing8464]

I am getting so tired of these half-assed Brainiac plots...

[@empty_melodies]

I just made a connection that two very divisive games have: Last of Us Part II and Suicide Squad, both previously in games had you play a character that was super beloved that the player grows with to then switch it up on you in these games and have you play as a character that kills that very character.

[@Sharpester-m4o]

At least with Last of Us 2. Troy Baker is still ok, and you get time to grieve over Joel's death. With there being a section where you go through his old house for a bit.

[@autistic-dan455]

While I do agree with some points in this video, I would advise serious caution on a stance like "fuck canon." It's somewhat applicable to the Arkham-Verse due to how broken it has become, but shouldn't be a standard defense. After all, "what is canon" is the very foundation of a story and disregarding that means potentially losing all investment. One thing you didn't touch upon in regards to Kevin Conroy is his dedication at the end of the game. Knowing that this game wasn't Kevin Conroy's last as Batman was a relief but the game still did something which bothered me slightly. When the voice over finishes and the screen goes black after his dedication, the game will move on to show you what you'd unlocked for completing the game. That felt a little icky to me personally. I would've preferred if the game restarted or showed a Press Start screen, then show what you've unlocked. That way, his dedication is separated from the games content and allowed to breath before going back to gameplay. I don't know how other people feel about that part, but this is just how I feel...

[@Dragular]

I honestly disagree with Tara Strong as Harley. I actually like her performances, personally. Though, I think she was at her best in Arkham City. It was way more nuanced there.

[@mattbettcher7439]

Arkham Batman is probably the most powerful version of Batman out there, and we went down to the fucking suicide squad? Nah that’s disrespectful as shit nothing will change my mind on that! For me it’s not so much Kevin because he has played many versions of Batman, it’s the fact that we have literally seen this character take down the squad before, what happened here? I feel like you don’t understand why it’s so egregious

[@shawty1564]

so off topic, but i’m sick and tired of her iterations of Joker being so ugly. like why do they make him look like that 😭

[@Peace-i7w]

When green lantern said "Braniac wondered how he got off the ship" at the beginning of the game and flash said "speedster secret" so when batman captured flash braniac kept him locked up in some pod where he can extraxt his DNA to make clones and flash prob used his speed to faze through the object he was kept in ans used the speed force and later ended up in miss freeez iced world where the squad later found him i think that's my theory

[@greytakerrev7147]

I want to correct you on your take that WB wanted Rocksteady to make this game and they paid the price for it. That is not what happened, the article by Jason Schrieher concludes that RS were the ones who wanted to make it live service. That means that the dumb decisions and the backlash they faced is because of their own actions.

[@GodChaos333]

The exact moment I heard it was live service. My hype went from 100 to 0. And i do not regret never playing it. We all knew how a live service arkham game would be vastly worse then a normal arkham game. Any of them

[@Sharpester-m4o]

I find it rather hilarious how two of the enemies in the game, the tank and helicopter, are essentially the two worst bosses in Devil May Cry 2.

[@AtlasPrimeV]

The flash is confirmed Alive in season 2 of the Live service. Defacto confirms the clone theory.

[@ultron_sigma]

It doesn't clarify that their clones

[@AtlasPrimeV]

@ultron_sigma maybe... but answer this... who did we kill...? and I doubt they are multiverse variants

[@Dsaberz]

The one dialogue with Green lantern and dead shot was my breaking point. I never ever wanted to touch this game again.

[@EricLing64]

The fact that they had to rewrite Deadshot and Harley should have been an indication that they should not have even used the Arkham canon, just make it an original timeline, then no one would care, and they wouldn't have to write in all the ridiculous nonsense. But it sounds like they just had bad writing overall. Well, to be honest the Suicide Squad in general should not be a superhero franchise. They should only be a wetwork group for mercenary type jobs, not fighting superheroes they are not in that weight class unless you give them contrived powerups that everyone will hate. The same criticism was made of the movie, but since this is a game now you have to add in all the mechanics of... games. How does this band of idiots harm superman? Shoot him with guns. Why? Because screw you.

[@Mr_Movie_Fan]

It's crazy how we got a Suicide Squad game before a proper video game about the Flash or Wonder Woman

[@KiddRyzeDaGawd]

From what I heard, I got more disrespect towards Batman himself, than Kevin Conroy. Like how tf does Arkham Batman of all incarnations get killed by a bunch of B-tier villains. Preceding that is Harley giving Batman some speech trying to insinuate that he was some sort of hypocrite.

[@benji777tm]

That was THIS year?!!!

[@Dante...]

Wait, so you say f the canon, but you then say Harley is hard to empathize with because of her dark history in the Arkahm games. So does canon matter or not?

[@raishijtenobles3103]

Huh, I knew people were talking out of their ass about Kevin Conroy, but I never seen the after credits scene. That just makes such statements way more disrespectful. But i do wish SSKTJL was better, I really wanted to play Harley. The live service bubble is very clearly popping, so we'll hopefully get less games like SSKTJL and Concord, but the game industry doesn't like to learn lessons, so 🤷🏾‍♂️

[@nicholasblenden8985]

This was kind of a miss for me. You spent more time talking about and kind of crapping on the Arkham storyline.

[@KenofLyoko4]

He wasn’t crapping on the Arkham storyline. He was countering the discourse people had with the game breaking Arkham canon by showing that the games canon wasn’t clear cut all the way through. He’s right and clearly said it did not make them bad and that he loves the series. Pointing out flaws isn’t crapping.

[@C.R.Cole331]

Is anyone else still confused why Rocksteady didn't make a Justice League game instead?

[@joefawley9264]

That writing is atrocious 🤮🤮🤮

[@Anakin_TheChosenOne1]

The problem wasn't that Batman died, it was how he died. Just like The Flash and Superman, Batman's death was the most ridiculous. Have you ever wondered why the hell he would be in front of the 4 members of Task Force X? Unless his strategy was to get shot, what he did was really stupid. Anyone who played Batman Arkham and knows him knows that in a scenario like this, he would have taken out each of them separately. Not to mention that he could have finished off all the members at once, with Bat smoke, explosive gel and so many other gadgets. It was shown at the beginning of the game that he could kill any of them, so why didn't he? Brainiac's plan wasn't to mess around. So, yes, his death was very disrespectful. I know that all the members of the JL are clones, but it will take much more than that to fix this whole mess, since more than 90% of the population of Metropolis is dead.

[@Unquestionable]

As someone who has been a long time Suicide Squad fan, mostly the 1987-1993 run, this was bungled in so many possible ways. The premise alone was iffy but I think they did the best they could with it but the concept of the Squad is most interesting when they're clearly doing straight forward good only in a very sketchy way. An early arc in the 1987 run had an excellent moment where the Squad was sent in to deal with an issue in Soviet Russia only for the Justice League to intervene just a bit later (before they're aware Task Force X/the US government is involved) leading to an excellently written confrontation. That aside yeah Live Service being such a difficult thing to pull off well coupled with coming off as not playing to the strengths of the cast by making it a third person shooter. I'll be honest I was moderately interested until I found that out and game play looks fun enough but not what I would have went with for a game about such a diverse group that has so much potential for fun and varied game play. I'm still thrilled how great he Arkham games were so I look at this as just something I might check out when it's free/cheap again.

[@ThatSpiderGuy94]

Is it just me, or does J reviews sound like he doesn't want to review this game?

[@xtrwombat4876]

Idk i can't tell if his opinions for this game are just different or if it seems like he sold out

[@the13thjoker]

​@@xtrwombat4876why he sold out for game that already death ?!? MIHOYO is that one company who shamelessly buy voice from bunch of youtuber.

[@Adam-xd9tr]

​Hard to sell out for a game he only played because it went free to play.

[@MaximumPayine]

@@xtrwombat4876 I don't see how he'd be "selling out". The game is old and no amount pf marketing will help its case. Most of the time, I find he speaks from the heart so I think this is merely his opinion. In any case, his review only matters as much as the value you personally give it.

[@franciscor390]

Debra Wilson seem to be in 1/5 of every triple A game nowadays.

[@joeker5208]

Why doesn’t Wonder Woman have DNA? Haven’t played the game (and most likely never will) so I don’t know if there’s some statement in the story that says she has no DNA, so please somebody if that happens I do know that this game opts for the New 52 origin, that being that she’s the biological daughter of Zeus & Hippolyta. So unless Greek Gods are just very different in this continuity, I’d expect her to have DNA

[@Evets_03]

Anyone else thought the game looked too slow? Like watch the game footage at 1.25x speed and it looks more fun

[@Rc44]

Fucking thank you for showing more than just the "main 3" arkham games:Asylum, city and knight, and showing not only origins but Arkham origins blackgate and arkham Vr and im glad that arkahm shadow is now apart of that, all of these games are amazing ans im glad you showed arkham origins blackgate and arkham vr that little bit of respect

[@pixelreaper7449]

Regardless of the fact that IGN did a good review on this game, you can't actually trust them for full information regarding the recent... actions, they have taken

[@fable23]

I mean, you can nitpick the Arkham verse all you want if that little stuff matters to you, though at that point, you might as well do that to all of Batman canon. That's just comics, man. Inconsistency and retcons have always been part of the tale, for better or worse. But the point people are trying to make is that the Arkham verse had a good ending for Batman and this game feels like it undoes that. I don't have that much of a problem with that aspect personally. My problem is that it feels like Bruce had a whole weird downfall arc offscreen that we just never get to see, so when Harley tells him off before she shoots him, it means nothing to us. We didn't actually see a non-brainwashed Bruce give into his worst impulses. It's a moment that is supposed to be some kind of payoff, but there's no setup. It's just hollow and unsatisfying no matter how you slice it.

[@cloudsombrero]

Youre not missing out on much with gunns suicide squad. Hes obviously never read a comic

[@sonnybui9398]

Batman Arkham Asylum: Fake crash Suicide Squad Kill The Justice League: *actually crashes after Batman fight* okkkk lol

[@ladyaceina]

for me i love harleys new voice from her own series Kaley Cuoco does a great job voicing harley

[@merchantziro4285]

Honestly I kinda understand the Kevin Conroy argument but I think it would be better to say it's a slap to the legacy of Arkham Batman as a character rather than the voice behind the Bat, killing the original focus of the Arkham-verse the way it was handled. The scene itself was merely a victim of unfortunate timing regarding Kevin's passing, but beyond that context I feel it could have improved to give a more satisfying ending to Arkham Batman upon his demise instead of just Harley simply shooting him in the head.

[@ToonyTails]

Yeah, this entire situation feels like the “Nickelodeon is disrespecting Stephen Hillenburg’s legacy” thing all over again where people are using the words of a dead man (who they probably wouldn’t even talk about that much if he wasn’t dead) as a way of bashing a piece of media they simply don’t like.

[@mayday2237]

The comics suicide squad and Gunn's movie and series are REALLY good, but this game does NOT do them justice

[@dragonlord6484]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Live service only works for fighting games like Street Fighter, Mortal Kombat, Injustice, and others like those.

[@sambridgers9543]

Why fighting games in particular?

[@dragonlord6484]

@@sambridgers9543 look at Street Fighter 5. That game went from literal shit to one of the best fighting games of all time thanks to its live service! Meanwhile Fortnite makes you pay for literally just costumes that play exactly the same as every other character in the game or Suicide Squad which gives us a bad and unfinished story

[@mikeythompson]

​@dragonlord6484 well fortinte has to do that

[@dragonlord6484]

@mikeythompson Fortnite is literal trash

[@Mepphy99]

the title already makes me thing we are gonna talk about Twitter bullshit lol

[@nobalkain624]

Just because YOU dont care about the Story does not mean others dont. You also gloss over how they messed up/ignored other issues with DC Lore such as the GL Ring, Speed Force, and Kryptonite. Instead of just admitting this is Bad Writing due to Writers who have no CLUE or Care for it, you try and excuse it, or is it that you only care about the parts of the Lore YOU care about (like with Harley). Again YOUR free to ignore all this, but trying to claim others who DO care are not allowed to is not cool J.

[@petrenicolae3282]

@@nobalkain624the Speedforce is always inconsistent and can get stupid sometimes. There were always cracks in the GL ring rules like Sinestro,Doomsday,Mongul, Cyborg Superman,The Penguin,Lord Maldovo.So yeah,the rules can be bended. In the case of the Kryptonite: Until we found out that the League we killed were clones(which would make the GL ring issue and Speedforce issue non valid since their artificialy made by Brainiac rather than the original ones) we knew that Brainiac captured, brainwashed and modified the bodies of the League.Is it wrong to say that Brainiac could had modified Superman's body to be immune to regular Kryptonite,but not to gold Kryptonite(who's much much much stronger than regular Kryptonite)?

[@nobalkain624]

​ @petrenicolae3282 You can Defend this all you want you Shill, but it doesnt make this Horrible Story and better. Corpo Defenders like yourself are just sad. Also stop giving yourself a Thumbs Up, it just makes you look even more pathetic.

[@Demonicangelgaming2]

Played for 3 hrs today and uninstalled it’s literally a torture same repetitive gameplay😅😅 and literally playing with some c grade villians let Atleast give lex luthor or some joker level villain

[@ppo1502]

Micro transactions🤮

[@austinb2177]

Excellent point about Kevin Conroy. It’s not like he knew he was gonna die, so how did this game “ruin” his legacy? Batman’s lines and the overall story would still be the same if he was alive.

[@KingsNJenssons]

The 5-year thing is funny because that's literally what happened with new 52

[@richardsphd]

I don't think Arkham City ever outright states this is the first time Batman meets Hugo Strange. From their short interactions, the vibe I got was that they had encountered each other before. I'm not saying Arkham City has no inconsistencies, though. Hush IS treated like Arkham City is his first appearance, and Batman has never heard of Azrael, even though Knightfall was at that point heavily implied to have happened.

[@chandlerburse]

Knightfall wasnt implied to have happened just Bane breaking Batmans back that couldve happened without Azrael Also michael lane azrael isn’t the same as Jean Paul Valley Azrael who was Azbats

[@richardsphd]

@chandlerburse I'm not saying it's a continuity error, I'm saying it's clearly a retcon. They intended for Arkham Asylum to be in line with the main comics, including references to past iconic storylines. Bane mentioning the fact he "broke the Bat" isn't supposed to be world-building, it's supposed to be a reference to Knightfall. When Arkham City shifts the implications of Bane's lines from references of what we were assuming, to instead an unknown event in this world's history, yeah, that's not a plot hole or anything, but it was a shift in storytelling.

[@joeslickback]

Joker is not in this game. That's the Jonkler

[@MoodKapProductions]

Nah that's a separate character. The guy in this game is just The Joke

[@sonofhades57]

As a committed fan of Good Superman and Arkham Batman, it was insanely gratifying to watch this game flop into the toilet.

[@erikbihari3625]

Indie cinema,indie video games,indie animation. What's next, indie restaurants,indie textile,indie nuclear physicist,indie neuro surgeon? Honestly, with prices climbing each year, may need these!

[@5witchy676]

Indie restaurants have been a very real thing for literal centuries

[@erikbihari3625]

@@5witchy676. Didn't know, and that was the point. You know?

[@MTC-hy6ig]

@@erikbihari3625 dont tell me you've never seen a small business before

[@erikbihari3625]

@@MTC-hy6ig. Well, probably gonna, with the rate hungary going!

[@editmanrgg2844]

I doubt J would bother reading the comments on his confusion of cannon but my dude you need to avoid your hypocrisy talk like in 19:14 you say screw cannon but 19:56 you didn't like Harley's character? My dude check your script you haven't improved on your critcal thinking on your critiques man i think you've gotten worse. Just a harsh constructive criticism my guy.

[@AltairEgoX]

How is Hugo strange's first on-screen in game appearance a retcon to what came before when he was clearly working in the background during the first game when Batman was running around and the warden was already being manipulated mentally by Jervis tetch and Hugo strange by proxy

[@jackofalltrades417]

I honestly thought the game was gonna play like Sunset Overdrive. Now, I'd rather just go back to that.

[@mysticmind4563]

One thing is that, people have had an intrest in playing as even ONE of these league members (aside from Batman due to being almost perfected in the Arkham games). Rocksteady has shown an amazing design of Metropolis and have proven to master single player games. Having a Superman game made by a studio with good rep would have a higher chance of not only showing they could do more than one hero correctly, but also give the other iconic DC hero a proper solo game. Heaven knows Superman fans have been starving for one.

[@Furluge]

3:17 - You know it's gonna crap when Amanda Waller isn't fat. XD

[@Rabbitlord108]

BTW the ONLY time Captain Boomerang used a gun in the comics was (I think) in Identity Crisis where he killed Tim Drake's father Jack.

[@androidoficeandfire9667]

In a plan to make people stick around for 5 years they… Made the worst impression possible and hoped people would come back after puking and shitting on their legacy by potentially cleaning some of it up (if it continued it would be revealed the real Justice League are still alive) It’s unfortunate because I played the beta which went up to the best part of the game (the Batman Arkham tribute) which was done well and the gameplay can be enjoyable in a vacuum but it’s in a live service model that people are tired of with borderline insulting storyline, and Kevin Conroy death while op not their fault certainly didn’t wash well with how they killed Batman, even though the real Batman is alive but we will likely never see that because of the poor impression they made

[@devonwilliams5738]

If you're one of the eight people that played through the DLC, they explicitly confirm that the Justice League you fought in the base game were all clones, and you rescue The Flash at the end of Season 2. It seems like the main story arc for the remaining seasons is going to be rescuing the remaining Justice League members.

[@CarbonRollerCaco]

REALLY misleading thumbnail there: the WB logo stands out more than bloody Batman next to the text, making it look like you meant "WB had nothing to do with this" and not "It had nothing to do with Batman getting killed". Just a heads up.

[@diegovargasdiego]

The James Gunn movie rocks!

[@austinmorrison6953]

They couldn’t have Braniac call in other variants of the justice league from the multiverse in the final battle? They really thought it was good to just have him turn into the Flash?

[@TreyH.006]

I like how every Arkham character looks completely different in every game except for two face

[@PhillipOnTakos]

It's just a game that would have done better with focusing on indoor area's/semi outdoor area's that allow for multiple playstyles. Since the game is open world every character has to be able to traverse that world and like Gotham Knights to an even worse extent. The characters end up feeling the same. King Shark should be a melee/tank monster. Deadshot should be a sniper with wrist guns for some CQC. Harley being an agile melee threat and the bridge for classic Arkham melee combat. Then Captain Boomerang should be like a gadget/stealth character for the predator style Arkham gameplay. Ideas I thought of off the top of my head. Instead the main difference is how they move across the map. Not to mention every playable character isn't even super human aside from King Shark makes them killing the justice league hard to buy into.

[@zephyr8072]

"And if it has to end, at least I go out like this. Being Batman!" _I'm not crying, you're crying._

[@Triforce9426]

If they just made this a big epic single-player campaign in the same vein as Batman Arkham and Marvel's Spider-Man starring the Suicide Squad I'm positive it would have faired much much better.

[@minuteworld7027]

I love how you never touched on the politics. wow, you're so brave 🙄

[@ppo1502]

What’s up with the politics ?

[@chrisville004]

The game had potential a 4 player co-op game with the classic Arkham combat system would been fire regardless of the character

[@edalrivers1998]

This was released this year....Feels like it was 5 years ago