Why The Right Can't Debate

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#debate #benshapiro #politics

[@RaineAsteria]

Debating the right is like playing chess with a pigeon. No matter how professional you try to be, the pigeon's probably just going to hop onto the chess board and shit all over it.

[@dynamicworlds1]

”Never believe that [they] are completely unaware of the absurdity of their replies. They know that their remarks are frivolous, open to challenge. But they are amusing themselves, for it is their adversary who is obliged to use words responsibly, since he believes in words. [They] have the right to play. They even like to play with discourse for, by giving ridiculous reasons, they discredit the seriousness of their interlocutors. They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert. If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past.” -Jean-Paul Sartre (edited to try and keep KZbin from suspiciously censoring it)

[@justsomeguy6336]

What is a woman?

[@MiniatureMashUp]

@@justsomeguy6336 Anyone who identifies as a woman. It's not difficult.

[@rjswift6168]

​@@justsomeguy6336A socially constructed lable for certain people's Identity.

[@rhymerlegend2717]

@@MiniatureMashUpidentifies as WHAT? “A dog is anything that identifies as a dog.”

[@Mauricio_Magus]

I'm very proud of Matt for not debating that bigot, don't give them your time.

[@andrewslat7283]

Sadly, bigots see it very differently. Especially if they aren't very bright. 😔

[@bjornstahle4652]

@@andrewslat7283 Exactly.

[@theunholinesswithin70]

There was nothing to debate, Andrew said nothing that has anything to do with secular humanism.

[@toru_aruji]

@@nocucksinkekistan7321 So, gay and trans people are bigots? Please explain that.

[@AlmightyThagomizer]

@@nocucksinkekistan7321Your username is too blatant for this bait to be effective lol

[@kaiza6467]

This actually happened a few times, Modern Day Debates would invite Matt on, he would do a ton of prep work and arrive to debate the topic, then his opponent would just troll the whole time and not address the topic at all. I'm pretty sure Matt's straight up told James that he won't be debating on their channel anymore, because it's literally just a waste of time.

[@BraxtonMeyer]

yea if he's going to all that effort and it's ignored by the mod and other debater i see no reason for him to keep showing up.

[@CteCrassus]

Between the Flat Earther nutjob and BigPapaFascist, it became crystal clear that MDD has no standards anymore.

[@Chinesetakeout382]

That’s the big problem with the debate shows. It’s the reason I disliked the crucible and even hippy dippy in hindsight. There’s a lot of topic where it’s just not possible to have a rational opponent.

[@PhoenixXIII]

There was another time Matt left early (not in person debate though) against a guy who was arguing that rocks shaped like hearts were the actual hearts of animals that died during a global flood, amongst other conspiracy and numerology BS.

[@thebeavpercabethftw9604]

​@@PhoenixXIIIThe guy who brought up Dracula?

[@christianwhalen9263]

What right wing media personalities do isn’t “debating,” it’s arguing, and the fact a lot of people can’t tell the difference is a testament to how far they have successfully moved the goalposts of intelligent dialogue

[@gking407]

YES thank you for saying what must be said! Real debates are nothing like this BPF trash

[@davidfaustino4476]

Those goal posts have only moved for absolute morons.

[@dragon1130]

The same can also be said about right wing poiliticians. They don't debate so much as they argue.... then try to start a physical fight.

[@Jabootylolz]

Y’all always blow me away thinking it’s a 1 way street. Thinking the left or right have any of your interest in mind, and then defending either side makes you look like a moron.

[@lynnntropy]

​@@Jabootylolz Who is "the left" here? The Democratic Party? You've really misjudged the ideology of this channel and the people in this comment section if you think that when we talk about leftism, we're talking about like, unquestioningly stanning Joe Biden.

[@bobbybooshay5388]

There wasn't even a debate and it still feels like Matt won just because he simply acted more dignified and principled.

[@falkorornothing261]

The other dude opened with I'm not going to debate the topic I came to debate on. That is an automatic L

[@theunholinesswithin70]

Andrew is a psychopath.

[@Glass-Bowl]

I've followed Matt for a long time. He's always done these things out of a desire to educate and spread awareness. It really seems like he's trying to make people smarter for the betterment of humankind and has no ulterior motives. That having been said... He is more dignified and principled. xD

[@horusthehorse]

And he did- the problem is that debates are held to spread awareness, and if you read the comments, there's so many mentally stunted people who clearly think Andrew is the winner that it's disheartening. The know this tactic works to satisfy their crowds, which is why their political leaders are all skipping debates. Their debate is the WCW incarnation, and that's a huge L for everyone involved, I hate to say. It doesn't matter who won, it matters who people think won, and when your audience is populated with morons, we basically have real-life idiocracy in action (not to support Mike Judge and his brand of bigotry, just a pop culture reference point)

[@theunholinesswithin70]

Well, nobody wants to question them, only argue facts. Make them all get frustrated by constantly being questioned and discourage them from commenting.@@horusthehorse

[@Kaijutopia]

Andrew's entire argument hinged on Kindergarten Cop. Matt was wise to stop wasting his time.

[@Molly-jh4kz]

The movie?

[@zenbear9952]

@@Molly-jh4kz Yes he literally said "Even kids know the difference. If you don't believe me watch kindergarten cop" It's weird when they use fiction in their examples like this. Like the kids in that movie are literally given lines to say by the director for crying out loud. Someone please tell him that the main actor from that movie Arnold Schwarzenegger was a PREGNANT man in another movie. I can only imagine how that will mess with him considering how seriously he is taking fiction

[@theletterm1787]

​@@zenbear9952We never should have let society forget about Junior

[@xoxonaotchan_7902]

​@@theletterm1787I WILL NAME HIM JUNIYOR

[@Eudaletism]

@@zenbear9952People talk about movies as if they were simulations or historical examples, when the plot is the way it is because of entertainment.

[@Ronnie.Raymond]

The right wing debate playbook: 1. Deny person said thing 2. Blame “leftist media” 3. If there’s no way of playing devils advocate, just pivot and talk about someone on the left 4. If all else fails, just call them names or something 😂

[@5353Jumper]

Don't forget declaring the other side is ruining everything without any actual substance on how it is being ruined, and then claiming their side is the saviors without ever saying what they would do better.

[@IMelkor42]

You forgot 'Contrive some reason that the opposition are a hypocrite'

[@MerelvandenHurk]

Also 5. Say that you already auto-win every debate against a leftist because you "care" about truth, and since the left says trans women are women which (they say) is "objectively" false, everything the left says can be auto-rejected. It's basically the strategy that BPF pulled in that "debate". He didn't engage with humanism, he just said he'd already won because the left says trans women are women. He does that _every time_ and it's infuriating :') The debate wasn't even about trans people but he's so f*cking obsessed that he brings them up ALL THE TIME.

[@nahuelkid]

If all fails, be anti-semitic

[@byteresistor]

Don't forget projection.

[@SynesthesiaBoy]

I love Matt Dillahunty, him and the Athiest Experience got me out of my right-wing pipeline

[@bjornstahle4652]

I like Aron Ra too, He look like a freak but he knows his sh!t.

[@Jordan-kq3qw]

I feel like watching Atheism videos on youtube contributed to my progression into the rightwing pipeline.

[@kylegonewild]

@@bjornstahle4652 Looks like a normal dude to me. Has a little bit of a lazy eye I think but otherwise pretty average. He's definitely been a voice for reason for quite a while now though.

[@Kulascus]

Matt is on The Line now :) Line is awesome too

[@Kulascus]

​@@Jordan-kq3qwhow?

[@GeoGuy388]

It's kind of difficult when you're advocating for the incorrect position on basically everything.

[@supergluehotty]

They can't even do it when they have the right position. See Destiny's debate with no bs. It's so bad, and no bs was given a handhold easy position. Destiny gave him the world, and that idiot couldn't last past 1 minute.

[@William-Morey-Baker]

Matt has been dominating lately, love to see it...

[@craigstephenson7676]

Matt has always been dominating tbh

[@XueYlva]

@@craigstephenson7676 i had a peterson phase for like 3 years then saw Matt just crush the ever living fuck out of Peterson and remembered where i came from LOL

[@-el_bandito]

He got cucked by cult of dusty

[@bjornstahle4652]

@@craigstephenson7676 Him and Aron RA!

[@kewldude23xx]

Their mantra is "facts don't care about your feelings." Yet their so-called arguments are based on how they feel about any topic. In other words; that's just their OPINION

[@user-gk9lg5sp4y]

My retort is that right wing feelings don't alter facts.

[@ludovicusbathory1715]

Their whole ideology hinges on feeling's. An example. They feel that their version of god exists no logic or proof required. Yet its the left that is illogical....somehow.

[@ms.aelanwyr.ilaicos]

Fun fact: "Conservatism" is on the "See also" section of the Wikipedia page of a logical fallacy (Appeal to Tradition)

[@skwills1629]

THis is Why Wikipedia is Not a Credible Source.

[@anarchychicken69]

Matt did the right thing. This other guy just wants to yell whatever he wants. Right-wingers just want clout. I would leave too.

[@bluejava9397]

Clout from all the edgy 14 year olds watching.

[@johndiss]

They don't debate because their position is indefensible.

[@JohnnyDelco]

Like biological men can get pregnant and have their periods? 🙄

[@FernandoBenitez-ht7uq]

@@JohnnyDelco Yeah because that would be a strawman as no one has ever said an AMAB person can get pregnant lol

[@_catboy_]

@@JohnnyDelco who said this lmao

[@JohnnyDelco]

@@FernandoBenitez-ht7uq lol that’s not a straw man at all 🤣

[@inasuma8180]

@@JohnnyDelco bye Felicia

[@OsefKincaid]

If you're on the left generally that means you have some concern for the real world. Not always true, but most of the time. So to you debate means that you want to get to a conclusion that matches reality, and arguments get you there. If you're on the right generally that means you have some concern for yourself. Not always true, but most of the time. So to you debate means that you want to get to assert dominance over the opponent, and what's important is that you are perceived to be winning, not that you're saying shit that makes sense.

[@FernandoBenitez-ht7uq]

And what better way for idiots to see you as a winner than laughing randomly like Andrew as if he's actually winning anything. He looks so happy, he must be correct, riiiight?

[@JohnnyDelco]

That’s the stupidest thing I’ve ever read 🤦🏽‍♂️

[@OsefKincaid]

@@JohnnyDelco No it isn't

[@gayasparagus]

The problem with this statement is that you will find it in right wing arenas as well.

[@OsefKincaid]

@@gayasparagus What do you mean?

[@LockandLoad79]

Matt should have started with "Why bother asking me to talk, when you don't want to listen at all?"

[@WhatWillYouFind]

A proper debate requires BOTH parties to come to the event with the intention of maintaining a certain level of decorum, charity, and boundaries which will allow an in depth discussion on the merits of the topic at hand. Conservatives, right leaning people NEVER come to the table in good faith and rarely ever give any charity to their debate opponent. This is why they can't debate, they never debate . . . they go to grand stand and nothing else matters but the theater they're selling.

[@skwills1629]

So Matt DIllahunty was Arguing in Good Faith and was being Charitable when He called Christians The Taliban and used the Unmentioned Until Dillahunty Said So American Speaker Of The House and Basically Depicted All Christians as Bigoted Monsters? None of you People seem to want to Admit this Fact but DIllahujty was Rude, Arrogant, Smug, and DIshnest, and Relied on Hurling Abusive Insults toward All Christians. Even Liberal or so-called "Moderate" Christians. So No, Dillahunty got what He Gave back to him and Ran Away. Dillahunty doens't even Really Understand Christianity. He says He does. His Fans Say He does. He doesn't.

[@thewrongsorcerer]

Andrew's clearly at a disadvantage here since he can't chain smoke 17 cigarettes over the course of the debate

[@georgecostanza712]

The lack of nicotine made him very testy.

[@than217]

Proof that shitshow debates aren't fun: Michael Tracey - Vaush. I've never felt more like I literally wasted hours of my life I can't get back than watching that. "Michael... Michael... Michael..." the only saving grace was the very end where Vaush asked him how much Russia was paying him.

[@user-gk9lg5sp4y]

I love asking right wing trolls, "How many rubles did you get for that comment komrade?"

[@thewoollyviking5928]

This is legitimately the same sort of debate tactics that I’ve seen Young Earth Creationists use time and time again when their beliefs are challenged. They’ll spend the entire time saying how the other guy thinks that a chimp gave birth to humans or that T.rex was turned into a chicken or whatever and hope to wear down their opponent to the point that they can’t put up a proper argument against the real meat of their debate.

[@DinosaurianDude]

Gish Gallop. That's the only tactic they have, because they know their points don't make sense.

[@thewoollyviking5928]

They either berate you for ignoring the bullshit they shotgun out or they simply laugh as you stop to dissect every point. It’s all to waste time.

[@NotASuspicousPerson]

What you have to remember is that religion and conspiracy theorists link hand-in-hand a lot of the times, and as right wingers tend to be more religious or fanatical, they would obviously have the kind of qualities that eat on conspiracy theories like anti-vax, flat earth or young earth. As a result you will see similar behaviours in all of them. It's also why any failures or sometimes those with criminal history, when they go clout chasing, they go for right wingers, since they eat up their BS that easily. Think about the infamous "Nigerian prince" scams, they deliberately make their messages full of mistakes to weed out any the smarter ones, then the rest are easy prey to control.

[@yingfortheking]

Rightwing: i shit on the desk, clean it up Leftwing: this is a debate... rightwing: so you admit you lost!

[@camelidnt]

Totally agree on shit-show debates being a mixed bag at best. Your BPF debate was so unbelievably difficult to get through and most of its entertainment was from seeing him get mad, while the Deep Fat Fried debate with (mostly) Paul was at least enlightening while still very much being a shit-show.

[@JassZoigel]

🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬🚬 debate over

[@hadronoftheseus8829]

BPF? Bullet Proof Fence? Bilateral Polka Federation? Bartholomew Pedro Fujikawa?

[@wfb.subtraktor311]

@@hadronoftheseus8829 The guy with the cap in the video calls himself Big Papa Fascist (BPF)

[@LeCharles07]

“Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.” ― Mark Twain

[@LizardOfMonaco-hf9vj]

Ironically he was stupid by saying that

[@PuppetsByPalmieri]

Andrew and his ilk basically just say ‘well if my particular interpretation of my particular sect of my particular religion isn’t true then how do you know anything’s true huh?’ And just try to drown the debates in epistemological super skepticism and never actually address the subject. It’s what him and all of his cronies do every single time.

[@nicholassullivan1239]

So... You're telling me that dancing around a topic and shouting over someone isn't debate?

[@aralornwolf3140]

"If I write 'Not Clueless' on the board, do I win?" - Professor Dave Explains in a "Debate" with Professor James Tour.

[@thefearandwonder]

They're bad at it because they don't give a shit about it. They do it because they have to keep up appearances.

[@margotpreston]

Exactly, it's nothing but a performance.

[@billhicks8]

No, not to keep up appearances. Fascism is directly against logic and rationality. It was historically constructed out of box to combat rationality with inanity and false myth-making, to the point of appropriating actual myth to make it a pastiche of bigoted nonsense. This isn't me getting annoyed and saying something against the far right for the sake of it: it's true. It is in written record that fascism arose from the idea that people are essentially emotionally-led creatures, and that this alone necessitates an authoritarian ruler. What you are seeing in this debate is another example of a dim-general understanding of this attitude being applied. Sadly, it is quite effective in a lot of cases.

[@angrybeluga1697]

This is why I agreed with Dr.Fauci not agreeing to debate on Joe Rogan’s podcast: there is little reason to expect a good faith debate.

[@KissMyConverseFool]

i think fauci should have taken that one, because joe is actually pretty smooth brained around people with actual expertise and probably would have left a convo with fauci solidly and openly pro-vax. the key with rogan is he basically really is that meme that says you're the average of the last 6 people you talked to or however it goes, he's just kind of a tabula rasa *when someone passes the first hurdle of convincing him they are an actual authority regarding the topic*

[@ActuallySatan]

You can pinpoint the part of the original video where Matt checks out while BPF is ranting about trans people (like Matt's partner) being subhuman.

[@MerelvandenHurk]

Yep, even when the debate isn't about trans people BPF is just too obsessed by trans people and can't help himself. And then he acts like us saying trans women are women means he's already auto-won the debate because we're supposedly "objectively incorrect".

[@Powersd451]

​@@MerelvandenHurkRight-wing people openly starting from the position "They think trans women are women, so we can discard anything they say." has become a trend. It doesn't matter whether anybody actually said it or it's relevant to the topic.

[@FelisImpurrator]

I had to look up who that was, but his partner is pretty cute. She also apparently does a trans-focused podcast with Nominal Naomi, who is all-around great. Rightoids really gotta be reaching far to "he/him" a pair of women who are prettier AND smarter than they are or will ever get to date.

[@PatrickWDunne]

Right-wingers really love pivoting to trans people when they don't have a real argument. When they're losing a debate, they'll just pull out the "there are only two genders" card or something else similar.

[@ahh_yes_mr_bax]

@@FelisImpurratorMATT’s GF is extremely beautiful. She occasionally will co-host the show The Line (i think) and other similar shows. She is logically sound in argumentation but wont take shit. I enjoy that she has less patience than Matt. She will flat out roast people who call the show to shittalk trans people

[@acetrainer5564]

What really blows me away is how intentional it all is. Like, it's one thing to come up with some ad-hoc lie as a cope, but what the right does is REALIZE THEYRE WRONG and then INTENTIONALLY LIE to push their side. It's just... I don't get it, why? If you know you're wrong, and you do because you have to to lie like that, why not just change your positions? It's wild, I don't get it.

[@deawinter]

Recently it’s honestly gotten kind of scary because it’s not like they think the left is right. They think no one is right. They think there is no objective knowledge and so their “facts”, which are based on what emotionally feels true to them, are as good as anyone else’s. It’s some deeply double-think-y shit

[@TheRationalPi]

Because they have motives outside of a desire to be objectively correct. What those motives are can vary from person to person, and the level of self-awareness can also vary wildly, but ultimately there is something other than "being correct" that motivates them. The most common one from conservative commentators with an audience and platform is a financial incentive to stick doggedly to their side (aka grifting). The most common from a terminally online right winger troll is that they take pleasure in the power to cause misery to others (aka owning the libs). For your run-of-the-mill conservatives it varies a lot more, with probably as many reasons as there are people.

[@beanieguitarguy4070]

This is why I was never able to go further down into the alt-right pipeline back in the GamerGate days. I genuinely believed in my positions, so whenever I learned new information that was correct or even if it made intuitive sense, I slowly changed my positions over time and now I’m kind of a leftist lol

[@SamWeltzin]

@@beanieguitarguy4070 Yeah, I was down for the stated position of GamerGate, which was ethics in video game journalism (or just journalism in general). Hell, that's still a problem. But they didn't actually seem to care about ethics in journalism and just talked shit on feminism. Likewise, I was intrigued by the Men's Rights Movement for a good year or so until they started shifting their perspective toward right-wing nonsense and away from actually helping men be more visible and more able to empathize with. Realized feminism was doing a much better job at solving the problems the MRM was bringing up, so I'm much more down with feminism now.

[@unclescipio3136]

If they were good at thinking critically, they wouldn't be on the right.

[@rhymerlegend2717]

😂

[@rhymerlegend2717]

It’s the left that don’t think critically

[@deadmoney5580]

Thinking critically is believing that a man can give birth apparently .

[@PatrickWDunne]

@@rhymerlegend2717 lmao you're one to talk

[@abimelech3636]

Totally agree. There's so many dishonest actors like Hinkel and BPF that are just not worth engaging with. It doesn't even make interesting content imo.

[@ninjapants7688]

Hinkel is an ADHD Russian puppet now.

[@hadronoftheseus8829]

BPF? For god's sake people, everyone, for the love of god, for the sake of language and coherence and decency and wholesomeness and freedom and liberty and raindrops on roses and whiskers on kittens, and apple pie and chocolate cake and Kellogg's Frosted Flakes and all that is part of this complete breakfast, and rainbows after stormy whether and cute cuddly puppies and all that is moderately effective at treating migraines, indigestion and upset stomach and male pattern baldness and seasonal allergies and vaginal yeast infections, please, please, PLEASE, STOP USING RANDOM ABBREVIATIONS IN CASUAL CONVERSAION. Just don't do it. Please. Please...

[@MerelvandenHurk]

Yeah that's why I also don't watch debates with Hake anymore, because I just know it's going to be entirely unproductive. I don't mind watching debates between people with extremely polar opposite opinions, but Hake is just like a wall. He doesn't engage with the arguments his opponents make and only responds with stuff that's so batshit delusional that it's just left the realm of reality and has no bearing on the real world anymore, it's just pointless.

[@nondescriptcat5620]

@@hadronoftheseus8829 no. gfy.

[@zacheryeckard3051]

​@@hadronoftheseus8829His (Andrew's) handle is Big Papa Fascist. Calling him BPF is like calling Professor Flowers PF. Please, for the love of a complete breakfast and all the rest of that, do 10 seconds of research or consideration before flying off the handle (even tongue in cheek) over the least confusing use of an acronym possible.

[@Free-leftistaction]

andrew is possibly the worst person in the political KZbin sphere.

[@IamStrqngx]

And that's saying something

[@pluto545]

Also, their audience doesn’t demand much of them. Seriously, their positions are almost an “elevated” form of sh!t posting…anyone can do it, anything left of the alt-right demands a person be at least somewhat well-informed, studied, and be somewhat presentable in looks and debating.

[@GeteMachine]

They usually think their guy wins a debate if they get the left wing person to overreact first, and they somehow think that's a victory. It doesn't even matter what is said a lot of the time to them.

[@Mia-ep4zu]

Matt had the idea where he doesn't care WHO he debate, it's all about the subject so he doesn't bother to look into the person he's going to debate at all ... He changed that policy.

[@Pierre-Van-Gogh]

They are simply too emotional

[@justsomeguy6336]

Gr8 b8 m8

[@chromie6571]

Women ☕️

[@Ronnie.Raymond]

@@chromie6571 Bro I tell single dudes all the time that _women_ aren’t trash, _American_ women are trash. A long distance relationship could have saved me all the headache a long ass time ago 😂

[@margotpreston]

@@justsomeguy6336 Not bait when it's true.

[@GeteMachine]

This is exactly why I wouldn't want to debate Tim Pool, Crowder or Candace Owens. Right wingers like that who know they don't know anything, and just talk for the sake of talking to getting their audience to think they're debating. Performative debaters who don't care if they just make things up, because they care more about just telling you you're wrong with stupid accusations or claims. Tim and Candace are the most obvious cases of people who aggressively know they don't know what they're talking about on anything.

[@tonywords6713]

All incredibly annoying too

[@dustymitchell70]

He wasn't there to debate, he was just there to be "alpha"

[@thejackal007]

I didn't know Andrew actually ever left his house.

[@thejackal007]

Also, your editors are really helpful, but when you reference past debates, if a picture of the video or a link could be provided, I'm sure that will be helpful.

[@vmcatfisher5688]

Andrew is the worst debater I have ever seen.

[@DinosaurianDude]

Yup, I agree. And I've seen some bad ones in my days.

[@LimeyLassen]

There's so much meme language in his intro it makes me want to purify my brain by reading a library book

[@Earzentail]

Matt Dillahunty is precious and shouldn't waste his time on literal waste of human life like Andrew.

[@philyburkhill1]

ultimately they don't believe what they're saying deep down

[@hypatia4754]

They lack manners and respect. End of story.

[@jownadel1526]

I've never really loved Matt's (archetype? I don't know), but wow Huge respect boost for him.

[@djixi98]

Matt is truly one of the best people who still debates on atheism and humanism. His demeanor in debates and on, say, Atheism Experience is completely different, in a way mirroring how Vaush's demeanour is different when he debates with some random dumba*s on his channel Vs his debate with Kirk on Tim Pool's show. All in all, Matt is truly one of the most good faith debaters I've seen and I think you should give him a chance

[@PossumBuddy420]

"Smart Fascist" is an oxymoron

[@bobbun9630]

I don't disagree that there's no way for those on the right to logically defend their positions, but with that said I don't think that's why so much of the time they're disinterested in even making the attempt. The audience of the political right wants to see a troll on their side. The right wing audience sees someone reasonable and thinks that person is a weak loser. In that context it should hardly be surprising that everyone in the limelight on the political right is doing their best to divorce themselves from reason and outdo MTG's antics.

[@eoinc9511]

“It’s like all debate online went through a centrifuge and got spat out on one side or the other ……” This full quote at 6 mins was a fantastic comment on the reality on the phenomenon.

[@ThorneinSide]

Bro is the type of guy that gets people to block him and thinks that means he is right.

[@Micha-qv5uf]

Yea I feel like conservatives and liberals aren't really sufficient terminologies anymore. I don't really like doing it but I feel like the world is forcing me to categorize people into stupid and not stupid. And yes I know the transition is very blury but you know what I mean.

[@LeCharles07]

Some of these people aren't stupid though. Some of them are intelligent but completely morally bankrupt. Josh Hawley and Ted Cruz are two good examples of smart people engaging in this bs.

[@ChosenOne6666]

Name calling and insults are classic signs of dementia.

[@TheRedneckBudha]

There are so many peope in these comments that seems to think gender and sex are the same thing. Normal people call them conservatives i call them stupid...

[@bjornstahle4652]

You are correct. Gender is a social construct. the easiest example to understand is if I said male trolls in this comment sections were acting like crying little girls. (I just gendered them.)

[@TheRedneckBudha]

@@bjornstahle4652 ooo be careful man you're gunna hurt their fee fees

[@aralornwolf3140]

@@bjornstahle4652, That's correct sir, ma'am, other!

[@Deadpool3E]

I remember back in the day of reactionary debate bro circuits where the very idea of leaving a debate was seen as cowardice and ammunition for ire. Of course, since Conservatives have began throwing away the pretense of debate and are only meeting for the sake of dishonesty and delusional hugboxes, it only makes sense for Dillahunty to leave.

[@aralornwolf3140]

"Thank you Ben Shapiro for showing us that Anger has no place in American Politics." - Not a Debate

[@theunholinesswithin70]

They don't debate, they just make assertions, and then insult and call names when people dissent or question. Unless they just tell you that you'll never understand, or something to that effect.

[@unclebobboomergames]

Matt is legit too professional to be wasting time with andrew. Like does professional/traditional debates. I actually feel bad that he didnt know how andrew was

[@SmilingIbis]

It is generally assumed that arguing with an idiot is a big waste of time.

[@vdub2014]

I'm so happy you reviewed this. I couldn't believe the comments.

[@russellh9894]

I'm so glad you're going over this video. It would be great to see you and Matt have a convo

[@ahh_yes_mr_bax]

Ever since i found Vaush i was thinking the same. Ive been a Matt D fan since 2011. Ive only known of Vooch for a couple years.

[@kaziem]

This was basically if Matt worked at McDonalds instead of being a professional interlocutor and BPF comes in and drops a deuce in the fryer while screaming "tough shit" over and over.

[@ofanichan]

Matt’s girlfriend is hot and based and therefore he wins every debate that he is in

[@thewrongsorcerer]

Debating a guy like Andrew is like playing chess with a pigeon. If you agree to a chess match with a pigeon, then get indignant that the pigeon is acting like an animal, you're the one who comes off looking foolish, not the pigeon.

[@lukemccann8930]

I guess that guy follows the "dilbert guy" school of persuasion: yell empty slogans loudly, refuse to acknowledge anything you don't agree with, insist words mean whatever you personally decide they mean and then when your opponent decides you're an idiot and this is a waste of time....declare victory.

[@albe8479]

arrives to a debate: instantly proceed to a insult tirade, derailing theme to trans stuff and further insults, keeps interrupting first responses. The only other choice beside leaving, was throwing hands

[@BaronVonQuiply]

Short version: when you build your entire identity around being an asshole and kissing the ass of bigger assholes, you have no time left for facts to work their way in.

[@rosssettles7025]

Thank you for covering this.

[@Mark73]

It's because there is no defense for the ideas they're pushing.

[@williamhenry8914]

tbh much as I like Vaush's takes and find it entertaining to watch, none of these debate channels do any actual debating, they just do arguing with extra steps. It's sort of like saying one WWE wrestler or another is 'bad at wrestling'. The whole thing is a farce anyway so the claim is meaningless.

[@romankvapil9184]

Andrew has never come into any conversations with good intentions. That, and he has a really creepy fixation on Matt’s girlfriend. Dude is a huge weirdo.

[@brendantoungate8287]

Having met Matt IRL, I'm glad to see him tell Andrew to walk off a short pier.

[@robertherlihy917]

The actual debater leaving was his goal.

[@babotond]

when vaush started talking about how a good faith person would react to their debate partner leaving I immediately thought of alex o'connorwhen christopher hitchens walked out on him. 100% edit: I meant peter hitchens, sry

[@jcleaverchamberlinjr]

It was Peter Hitchens actually. Christopher Hitchens has been dead for 12 years

[@babotond]

@@jcleaverchamberlinjr aw fukk, yes, thanks, that's who I meant!

[@jcleaverchamberlinjr]

@@babotond Not at all

[@TheBigJConYouTube]

So glad Andrew bailed on the debate he and I were supposed to have. What a freak lol

[@kingwokester7324]

I would’ve caught a charge if I was in Matt’s position. I’m surprised that Andrew’s smugness never got him smacked.

[@anothercub6958]

Yeah, moderated debates suck so much potential good you could generate for your position when often times deeply factually untrue opinions and flawed reasoning gets dignified and almost elevated to the same level of validity as a position actually based on facts It also doesn't help that as a third party, moderators hinder the discussion because they can cut off people for "getting off topic" or any other reason they don't like, or any position/argument they don't fully understand.

[@enriqueesparza2501]

I found Vaush through atheist experience. I'm a huge fan of Matt's, and I was curious whether there were more channels or streamers that use logic as the foundation of their content. Eventually, I landed on Vaush's channel. I think I'll binge some Dillahunty debates tonight. 🤔

[@KissMyConverseFool]

are you familiar with ben burgess? He wrote a pretty good book (give them an argument) regarding the actual application of logic to debate. Like, it's an accessible book that still draws on the rudiments of formal logic, which isn't really what people think (being dispassionate/cold/acting like a vulcan/always being utilitarian/consequentialist) but an actual system of making sure things make sense before you say them out loud or read them into the record.

[@PatrickWDunne]

He's a good 1:1 debater, though I think Forrest Valkai is much more pleasant to listen to. He's got a background in biology and doesn't explode at callers as much as Matt does.

[@codyhuseby257]

Conservatives counter facts and logic with shouting you down and walking out if you don't back down and stoop down to there level

[@IndustrialBonecraft]

I love how ridiculously arrogant he is, despite being wildly wrong and that same arrogance being completely unearned. It's comical. The moderator on debates doesn't just need a 'mic off' button, they need a volume button, so when this kind of gutter scum drag itself up onto the stage and starts yelling over the other guy, you can just turn the one off and the other up.

[@ahh_yes_mr_bax]

I suspect a DJ would make a better debate moderator. Or just a sound tech from most industries.

[@willzimmermann2511]

I cannot imagine how miserable it is inside a brain like Andrew’s

[@desocialistcat]

It’s hard to debate when you’re wrong

[@rogerrock12games]

The answer to the title of your video is that they all argue in bad faith. None of them actually believe anything they're saying and if they do, they don't know what they believe.

[@philosophical.dishwasher]

A great example of what it looks like to debate in good faith can be demonstrated by CosmicSkeptic (Alex O'Conner). He brought on Peter Hitchens for an interview/conversation about drug decriminalisation and a number of other topics, and because Peter was growing increasingly frustrated with Alex's salient points, he up and left. Alex's reaction/response to that is genuinely commendable.

[@orionmycosinth5424]

I'd love to debate you, but I agree with you on everything so there's nothing to debate.

[@shawnsheffield4766]

Not true. Some of his media takes are rough.

[@ThorneinSide]

Never saw anyone win a debate by leaving the debate.

[@ahh_yes_mr_bax]

Well you have now 😆

[@brandenhylton8272]

​@ahh_yes_mr_bax No, we technically haven't.

[@ahh_yes_mr_bax]

@@brandenhylton8272 Well kinda. It wasnt a debate. When only one side addresses the debate topic and the other doesnt, it is a win to just step away as the goal for the one not interested in the topic is to waste time. By not wasting your time, you beat the one trying to waste your time. Thus by walking away from the fake debate, you win the debate

[@brandenhylton8272]

@ahh_yes_mr_bax thats a lot of extra crap to reaso when theres "was no debate in the first place" as many are saying. If there was no debate or a fake debate, theres nothing to win other than taking back your time, nothing was "debated".....

[@ahh_yes_mr_bax]

@@brandenhylton8272 i already explained it to you in detail. You just hand waving it away with “thats a lot of extra crap to reason…” seriously its getting embarrassing, just stop

[@princequestly2218]

It’s almost like he annoys people on purpose so he doesn’t have to debate them.

[@CielBlanche]

Because if they had the capacity to reason they wouldn't be right wing to begin with

[@nidodson]

When your worldview is based on your emotions and baseless options, instead of facts and reasons...

[@azpont7275]

It’s just hard to debate when you are objectively wrong. (Or evil and you know it)

[@lukemccann8930]

I fully agree with the idea that this shouldn't even be dignified with a response. I actually think that secular humanism and progressive Christianity (I'm sure other progressive sects of religions too but as a Christian I'm not qualified to speak on them) can have very productive good faith debates.

[@LizardOfMonaco-hf9vj]

progressive Christian. What's next. Gay Muslim 😂😂😂😂or maybe Jewish nazi .

[@GreyCrowe]

You cant reason someone out of a position they didnt reason themselves into. Especially when their position is taken in bad faith to begin with.

[@keyboardoracle1044]

Repeating the same line over and over getting louder each time is debating yeah?

[@vitXras]

Loving the respect for matt dillahunty

[@ahh_yes_mr_bax]

I would walk out to. Matt did right. There was no debate here. It was a serious debater vs a 12 yo edge-lord who holds self hatred for their attraction to trans women. Watching this was WILD. Matt was prepared and gave thoughtful arguments directly on topic and void of any personal attacks or criticism of his opponent. Andrew was an oozing mess of long debunked far right rhetoric, narrativizing, and personal attacks at Matt.

[@Puyax01]

Matt just got tired of the modern day debate for not doing their job in lock-in serious people who actually want to debate. This guy Andrew is a joke, I applaud Matt for leaving

[@Alienshade]

Matt Dillahunty and Ian Kochinski(Vaush) really good people. The two persons that always delivers and I follows them the most right now. Even if I don't know them personally I will probably mourn them more than my parents if they die before me....

[@earthboundman5]

Therapy?

[@LimeyLassen]

It's hard to imagine an online left without Vaush even though he's only been here for a few years.

[@FunnyByDefault]

hey wait I saw this live!

[@FortuitousOwl]

It takes a strong person to see the bullshit, know it's below your time and energy, and just leave instead of it. BPF sucks so bad.

[@Hakasedess]

"How do you even debate " You don't. You never should, it is never the right choice. You have lost the very moment you decide to pretend there's merit to anything they say, because there never is AND they themselves know it.

[@derrickbelanger]

I think Vaush gives MDD too much credit. I think James deliberately finds these lunatics because it drives up the drama. I think this kind of platforming is highly irresponsible on James part.

[@AximVidya]

been saying this for a while, just look at the comments or chat replay on any of his videos. James may be a centrist liberal but the community he fosters is very unambiguously far-right.

[@hardlyworking_]

is this a different guy than the one who hosts The Crucible or whatever? cause they sound identical to me

[@Nihil847]

It’s him

[@SicariusVG]

Same guy. I swear since he has been getting more airtime he has gotten so much worse/bad faith.

[@abimelech3636]

It's the same guy.

[@JassZoigel]

​@SicariusVG it plays well for his audience, which is an incentive to do it more. Plus he was suffering withdrawal

[@thechief043]

BPF is so insufferable

[@michaeltorris5675]

Conservatives suck at debate simply because their positions are indefensible. That’s why they all play the same exact move. When all their points are proven wrong, they simply counter the fact that they’re wrong by saying, “What about this study (not peer reviewed and done by a conservative think tank) that concluded x, y, or z (and they completely misrepresent the study)?” Because they know you don’t have time to dig up that study and read it right then. And if you did, it would fall apart when you just read the abstract and figured out the study wasn’t even about what they said it was.

[@LizardOfMonaco-hf9vj]

We rather ues science you rather worship the scientists. That's the difference. also this harping on scientists is stupid. Remember when scientists uesd to say that black people are naturally more stupid than white people? scientists studies is what you cowards hide behind.

[@LivinVivid99]

POPP OFFFF