Why Was Hagrid Expelled Without A Trial? Why Wasn't Moaning Myrtle's Body Examined?

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[@LyleFrancisDelp]

I’ve long wondered about this. The wizarding world justice system isn’t very fair. They expelled Hagrid without a trial and snapped his wand, and also sent Sirius to Azkaban without a trial. I mean…WTF?!?!?!

[@dragondude9637]

Don't forget they were willing to let denentors eat Sirius's soul for a crime he never committed.

[@Sathrus04]

Probably isn't much fair for half giants, doub't they're looked on too kindly, and Sirius, well, they caught him at the scene, while I don't remember if it's stated he had a trial or not, assuming he didn't, put yourself in the shoes of the people who found sirius, surrounded by dead muggles, and only one finger left of the one who actually comitted the crime, which, they didn't know peter had done anything

[@PhilBagels]

Wizarding society in general does not seem to place much value on truth and justice. It's full of bigotry. Perhaps ironically, their justice system is reminiscent of the Salem Witch Trials. Muggles, not having access to magic, had to develop logic and science. Which they could then apply to areas like criminal investigation and forensics. Wizards, on the other hand, don't bother much with logic and science, and therefore, they are absolutely horrible at criminology and jurisprudence. Remember when the dark mark was conjured and Crouch immediately assumes that it was Harry's doing because he was nearby, even though he's probably the least likely person in the world to be a follower of Voldemort. And practically everyone at the Ministry is incompetent or corrupt. Notice how no one bothers investigating the tampering with Harry's broom in year 1, or with the bludger in year 2. None of the teachers do anything to try to find the Chamber of Secrets or to defeat the monster inside. The trial of Buckbeak. No one makes any attempt to investigate why Harry's name came out of the Goblet of Fire. Wizards in general are just awful people with very little morality.

[@da-vidcargill4975]

@@dragondude9637no his soul is fine

[@jaegordon25]

And MCUSA sent Tina and Newt to DEATH with no trial. You don't need to be a death eater to be a wizard Nazi. Just work for a wizarding government.

[@DoctorM934]

Anyone ever notice when someone is denied a trial it's usually a gryfindor? (Sirius and Hagrid)

[@jasondyrkacz8270]

Harry got a full blown criminal trial in the fifth book/movie.

[@peacefulinvasion684]

@Jason Dyrkacz Yes, but he's famous.

[@ramcochaam]

Fair point. And the comment about Harry isn't true. If Dumbledore never had said anything against Fudge, Harry would have been expelled without a trial. Because at first the trail would only be what they would do with him and not for expulsion and breaking the wand. Because Dumbledore meddled in the course of the trial had gone the other way around. So in perspective, Hagrid always defending him by keeping him as groundskeeper and later as teacher is total bs. If Dumbledore had asked for a trial maybe Hagrid never would have been expelled in the first place. At least, not for this one. Probably later😉

[@YellowBear-kx1ff]

Hagrid and Sirius Black have something in common. Both went to Azkaban for something they didn’t do (though in Hagrid‘s case, he was expelled first).

[@katholmes7112]

They also each deserved Azkaban though, although not for why they were sent. Hagrid did keep animals illegally and even bred them. Sirius didn't murder the muggles, but he did attempt to murder Snape. Neither man was guilty of what they were sent for, but neither man was innocent of serious crimes. And, no one can say Hagrid or Sirius were unaware what they were doing was illegal because they were. Hagrid wouldn't have been hiding Aragog in his room if he was unaware it was wrong.

[@sperreault]

@@katholmes7112 "Hagrid did keep animals illegally and even bred them" - I don't think this is terrible enough to go to Azkaban which seems akin to a maximum security prison. Sirius trying to get Snape killed is pretty close if not over the line.

[@katholmes7112]

Considering he kept doing it, yeah it was serious enough. So many kids ended up severely hurt by his projects. The screwts caused massive burns and bites. Plus, Dudley may have been a horrible bully, but in Harry's first year he was just an 11 year old boy. Hagrid was 62 and he used magic that he wasn't allowed to do to give Dudley a tail. Also, in that moment he was exactly like Fenrir Greyback. Fenrir attacked a 4 year old child because he was pissed off at Lupin's father. It looks different in the film, you think he's going after Dudley for eating Harry's cake. But he actually struck out at Dudley because Vernon insulted Dumbledore. People give Hagrid a lot of passes because he seems like a lovable oaf, but again, Dudley was 11 and he was 62. That was full on child abuse.

[@kimgrod]

Old story ... Prejudice, racism.

[@jaegordon25]

@@katholmes7112 with the kind of prison Azkaban is, NO ONE deserves to go for petty crimes. Azkaban should literally be reserved for actual criminals that harm people.

[@YellowBear-kx1ff]

RIP Robbie Coltrane

[@vortega472]

What bugged me is how both times Hagrid was railroaded by the ministry - the first expulsion - then prison. And there was no big apology or even "Hey we made a mistake here's your wand back." He seemed like a convenient scapegoat. Despite being wizards and witches - they are first quite human. Thus for them to admit fault - and it was to cover up previous mistakes rather than recognizing they were wrong. Remember - the state is never wrong - especially and even when they are wrong.

[@jasondyrkacz8270]

Cornelius Fudge: Hold my pint.

[@schris3]

The ministry fully knows about his status as half giant, (just ask Umbridge) so that makes him a good scapegoat, and as seen, Hagrid's deep love for dangerous creatures made it even easier to be made an scapegoat.

[@da-vidcargill4975]

well he had his wand, the broken tip of his wand was transfigured into an umbrella

[@peacefulinvasion684]

Nah who needs apologies when you can execute a beloved pet the following year. 😀 (or at least make an attempt) Dumbledore literally had to explain to fudge that Hagrid couldn't have helped buck beak escape. He was with the group the whole time.

[@bonecanoe86]

I'm just amazed Hagrid made it through to the end of the series. Every time a new book would come out I'd be nervous that this would be the one where Hagrid dies but he always survived, and if I'm not mistaken, is even mentioned in the Epilogue so he lived well after the series ended as well.

[@HuggiMa]

yet Robbie Coltrane died. :-(

[@fishandjam5383]

Yeah, Harry told Albus that Hagrid had invited him for tea (I think) in his hut.

[@Joreel]

@@HuggiMa True, but he also lives on as Hagrid and that's something that will never change.

[@amara887]

I've always asked myself these questions and never found an answer!! How could Hagrid be expelled when it's obvious that Myrtle did not die because of a spider's bite? So excited to watch this video and finally get some answers! 👏

[@Reverb154]

I believe that Hagrid was expelled not to ruin him, but to SAVE Hagrid from prison. Keep in mind that spiders kill with a bite, a pretty clear sign of a spider. Murtle was killed by an UNKNOWN means, which clears the spider. BUT, keeping a dangerous spider as a pet (that could have escaped and attacked someone easy) WAS a big deal, one that could have led to many killings. And given that he kept gathered many other dangerous creatures, well...

[@amara887]

@@Reverb154 interesting thought 🤔

[@connie40star]

My question is, why wasn't the current Headmaster of Hogwarts not question residing ghost the chose to live out the rest of their stay? As Dumbledore held Hagrid in the highest of regards, why wouldn't he question Murtels death and how it came about? That is my question, please all weigh in with your theories.

[@ginantsfan5]

" There comes a time when we must chouse between what is right and what is easy."

[@sifilore9462]

The ministry simply just getting the job done now instead of right, it's no wonder they were week before Fudge was appointed in office. The people in charge then wanted things done NOW, not later even if its RIGHT, *NOW*. Since the wizarding world relies on magic, their community has no autopsy or figure print matching. Hagrid should've at least been given a new wand, since the bottom half is in his umbrella. When he was exonerated. Maybe the best kind Olivander can make that's expansive, but paid by the ministry as further apologies.

[@mr.aleximer]

Check memories, last wand spells, truth serum, Myrtles wounds....

[@danielgoodrich264]

I always thought it was because wizards were prejudiced against him for being a half giant.

[@realjoemavro]

I wonder what Dumbledore's explanation to get Hagrid released from Azkaban was. Obviously, Fudge would think he was either mad or lying if he told him that it was Tom Riddle/Voldemort.

[@richiefranklin76]

Well it obviously wasn't Hagrid since the events of the Chamber of Secrets kept happening after he went to Azkaban. Fudge really had no choice.

[@peacefulinvasion684]

Well, it was proven that Voldemort did it. Fudge probably was like, "Woopsies, we punished the wrong guy. We probably should let him out." Most likely, Fudge didn't even appologize to Hagrid or offer any form of compensation for how the ministry wronged him.

[@desireelaird7513]

I can't understand why they didn't just ask Myrtle what killed her. She could have told them about the big, yellow eyes. Definitely NOT something found on a spider!

[@Joreel]

Because they didn't care. They just wanted a suspect and Hagrid being a half giant was perfect as the fall guy.

[@ray101892]

I don't see how the basilisk grew so big. What was it eating since slytherin's time? Why didn't it run amok and get spotted in a thousand years when it can come and go through the pipes as it pleases?

[@kaimagnus5760]

Maybe they don't have to eat but every few hundred years? And it could have remained in hibernation the rest of the time. We actually know very little about them when you think about it.

[@JesusChristDenton_7]

"When due process fails us, we really do live in a world of terror." -Deus Ex

[@jonbilgutay2]

Although Hagrid didn't open the chamber of kill Myrtle, I still think his expulsion was warranted. He still kept a dangerous animal as a secret pet; that sounds like an expulsion-able offense to me.

[@HarryPotterFolklore]

very good point. Newt was expelled for something similar i believe.

[@desireelaird7513]

I really hate to agree with you, but you're right.

[@da-vidcargill4975]

i call BS on that, they cant do that without giving warning to the students

[@jonbilgutay2]

@@da-vidcargill4975 If diary-riddle was telling the truth, Hagrid was already teetering on expulsion. This was just the final nail in the ⚰️

[@Georgie94]

​@@da-vidcargill4975 he kept a XXXXX classification beast "These creatures were known wizard killers, and were impossible to train or domesticate." I wouldn't want him to be expelled but the risk of it killing someone is high. It did try and kill Harry and Ron

[@shadykitty7493]

the wizarding world needs better lawyers

[@kaimagnus5760]

Shit, ANY lawyers. Clearly they don't have them considering Hagrid and Sirius were both convicted without trial and Harry's trial had political motives.

[@darthseverus89]

R.i.p. Robbie Coltrane,gone but NEVER forgotten

[@ThoraxetheImpaile100]

There's no Hogwarts without him 😢

[@abhinavnama3187]

would have caused plot change on whole another level

[@macwelch8599]

Tragic for Hagrid

[@dynastywarriorlord07]

Probably because of racism and discrimination against giants. Also Voldemort even admitted that it was his word against Hagrids. Tom Riddle at the time was a model student who scored in the top of his class while Hagrid was seen as a brute who would routinely get into trouble and break school rules. It's kind of the same reason why when black people are convicted of a crime, they get a harsher punishment than a white person who committed the same crime

[@YellowBear-kx1ff]

Yeah, and there’s also the fact that blacks get shot by the police all the time.

[@skincare_swiftie_13]

If myrtle was dead, why couldn’t her ghost tell them Edit: Thank you everyone who has replied it has been very helpful and I think I understand now.

[@YellowBear-kx1ff]

Maybe she was too traumatised to talk about it at first.

[@skincare_swiftie_13]

@@YellowBear-kx1ff ok yeah that makes sense

[@kaimagnus5760]

It's possible that Ghosts don't form instantly. For all we know Myrtle's Ghost didn't appear until several years after her death. Which, considering the kangaroo court that convicted Hagrid, would have been far to late to effect anything.

[@kyleethekelt]

If memory serves, Myrtle didn't actually know how she died. In the books the boys tried to ask her about it once they found out she could help them. Here's what she had to say about it. "It happened right in here. I died in this very cubicle. I remember it so well. I'd hidden because Olive Hornby was teasing me about my glasses. The door was locked, and I was crying, and then I heard somebody come in. They said something funny. A different language, I think it must have been. Anyway, what really got me was that it was a boy speaking. So I unlocked the door, to tell him to go and use his own toilet, and then" Myrtle swelled importantly, her face shining, "I died." "How?" said Harry. "No idea," said Myrtle in hushed tones. "I just remember seeing a pair of great big yellow eyes. My whole body sort of seized up, and then I was floating away ..." She looked dreamily at Harry. "And then I came back again. I was determined to haunt Olive Hornby, you see. Oh, she was sorry she'd ever laughed at my glasses." From this we can deduce that she wouldn't have been of much help in any inquiry, and that she probably came back ASAP so she could haunt Olive Hornby to the max.

[@kaimagnus5760]

@@kyleethekelt So, other than "A pair of Big Yellow Eyes" ruling out an acromantula, her testimony wouldn't have helped Hagrid in the slightest. Cause if he already had One hidden Class 5 Dangerous Beast in the Castle then the investigation could have easily claimed it was a different beast than the one Tom found and still pined the blame on Hagrid.

[@MitchMitchellStories]

For clarification, the basilisk didn't have to bite to kill; one look would do it, and Myrtle was in the bathroom when it came up the tunnel. Also, because I saw someone question how they knew it was related to the Chamber of Secrets, it's because messages started showing up on the walls all over the school like it did in Harry's 2nd year. As for being convicted without a trial, we've seen times when the Ministry flaunted the legal rules for their own reasons; otherwise, Umbridge would have been in Askaban much earlier.

[@marcelsgroot]

Yes and what she told Harry about her dead clearly state that it was because of a basilisk look

[@MAGICCOFFEY]

Imagine the pain Hagrid feels whenever he sees her ghost.

[@jaysmith6013]

He should take some comfort to know he had nothing to do with her murder. Innocent people may feel hurt, but they’ll never feel guilt

[@fredpritchard1384]

I would be worried how they ever met as she doesn't leave tbe girls bathroom....Hagrid would stick out like a sore thumb in there

[@MAGICCOFFEY]

@@fredpritchard1384 maybe he did a few shifts as a cleaner at Hogwarts.

[@fredpritchard1384]

@@MAGICCOFFEY Yep fair point

[@Joreel]

But don't forget, she knows Hagrid didn't kill her so she would hold it against him even if they did see each other.

[@jessicamarsh9779]

9:47 I envision Hagrid being able to use magic again bc Shacklebolt “officially” cleared him, publicly explained what happened, issued an official apology to Hagrid on behalf of the Ministry of Magic, ordered reinstatement of magical abilities immediately to him, Hagrid got his wand back (bc Dumbledore would have fixed Hagrid’s wand after Chamber of Secrets secretly) or he was able to get a new wand at Olivanders, then Headmistress Mcgonagall, Professor Flitwick & Professor Slughorn gave Hagrid private tutoring lessons in charms, transfiguration & potions. I don’t think Hagrid ever became “wizard” of wizards but I think he got good enough to where he could easily get by…. Lol I think I read somewhere where he able to do magic again… I like to think Hagrid got to live the rest of his life as a wizard & had a happily ever after life after the 2nd Wizarding War. Hagrid had a hard life in the beginning & a lot of injustice happen to him. So he needs a happily ever after.

[@jacobholly2096]

I love the accurate looking young hagrid concept art very well done.

[@stephenhowe3919]

This has bugged me for years but couldn’t they have just asked moaning myrtle? Or why didn’t she go to someone? Wouldn’t she want her killer be identified? Or did I miss something in the books.

[@fishandjam5383]

Would she have been a ghost immediately after her death?

[@wadwiswell]

@@fishandjam5383 the books are unclear on that, but they do say that Ghost happen because someone Died "Wrong" so it is likely she would have been.

[@kryptonianpowers]

Wizarding Britain is extremely prejudiced and bigoted against any wizards and witches that do not have full-blooded magical ancestry, and Hagrid was one of such due to him being half-giant. And of course, the Ministry of Magic was pretty much dictated by such people who viewed any wizards and witches with muggle and/or creature ancestry to be completely inferior to them because ever since the British Ministry's inception, the whole magical government is shown to be broken because it was founded on dishonest principles, including its law enforcement system based on how it has been dictated by corrupt, crooked, and dishonest politicians who believe it is their birthright to play God with whomever they choose. Many wizards and witches suspected Hagrid's blood status, but nobody had any proof about it, so instead of a thorough investigation, he was wrongfully scapegoated in his expulsion for the crimes of which a teenaged Voldemort was responsible for, which everybody would believe to be ludicrous based on Riddle's lies. And that's why Hagrid wasn't given a trial about his expulsion and 99.9% of Hogwarts and even politicians in the British Ministry were all charmed by Voldemort's poison and lies about anything and everything, especially about Hagrid despite the lack of evidence.

[@datix]

everytime i remember that the ministry expells a student and forbids them from using magic, and since the obscurius creations by JK in Fantastic beast, I start thinking that....does the ministry knows that doing that can create more obscurius and doesn't care? or, the more obvious answer, JK haven't come with the idea of a obscurius and create a plothole. but the fact that dumbledore "saved" hagrid and "allows" him to use magic with his "broken wand"(my theory is that dumbledore fix the wand with the elder wand) transfigured into a pink umbrella, prevent hagrid from turning into one, kind of negates that plothole having dumbledore experience with obscurius

[@plotholedetective4166]

There are multiple times Hogwarts is at risk of being shut down, but what would that mean for the young wizards in training? Where would they be sent to learn if the primary national institution is closed? Seems like there would be a lot more safe guards in place with such a critical facility.

[@lynnevetter]

I always thought Hagrid's punishment was "light" (considering), and that there was no huge fanfair about it because Dumbledore did what he could to shove what he could under the rug. I think he thought there was a chance that Hagrid could be in BIG trouble for having the spider hanging out, considering who he was (the first of his kind at Hogwarts). The ministry has always seemed to be a bit off, so who knows that they would have done if Dumbledore wasn't there.

[@gugurupurasudaikirai7620]

I'm not even sure it's specified in the books whether he got a trial or not. However, it was really a decision up to Armando Dippet rather than the Ministry of Magic anyway when it came to his expulsion

[@AnnelisR]

The book series shows that the Ministry steps in whenever it wants.

[@jasondyrkacz8270]

@@AnnelisR Case in point: The one most of us hate more than Voldemort.

[@gugurupurasudaikirai7620]

@@AnnelisR True to a point. Fudge let Harry completely get away with a flagrant violation of the Secrecy act without punishment in POA. But later in OOTP he went after him despite Harry having a solid defense of self defense because he was now afraid of Harry saying You-Know-Who was back. When it came to Hagrid though, the result really wasn't surprising, especially with what we knew of the Ministry. Hagrid literally may have been better off with Fudge as Minister depending on the politics of the time (and it was so long ago Fudge definitely wasn't minister at the time). The attitude of the Minister of Magic at the time actually mattered a lot in this case

[@AnnelisR]

@@gugurupurasudaikirai7620 by “when it wants”, I meant “when it feels like it”. You proved my point. If students were scared and parents were complaining, the Ministry probably got involved fast and Hagrid was an easy target.

[@JanbluTheDerg]

Well you know... It was really easy for them since Hagrid isn't only a half-breed but he's a half-giant. It was just a convenient excuse for them.

[@SimonaShine]

I always wondered why did nobody ask Mirtle how she died and who was responsible for her death. Hagrid could have been free immediately

[@Longshanks1690]

The plot, and especially the mystery, of Chamber really doesn’t make sense when you actually think about it. The biggest issue for me is that there’s 0 reason for anyone to connect Myrtle’s death to the Chamber at all. And if people thought it was the legendary monster from the Chamber, then why was Hagrid let off with something as light as an expulsion when he was Slytherin’s heir - apparently - when he could have led everyone to the greatest magical archaeological discovery of the millennium? More to the point, why wasn’t his mind probed with the pensive to discover the truth of the matter? There’s 0 reason for people to even suspect him when Tom Riddle destroyed the evidence so how could he prove it was Hagrid beyond gossip and speculation that of course Hagrid would bring in a dangerous creature like he did with werewolf pups - which also contradicts the lore behind werewolves in this world from later books but that’s a separate issue altogether. It really is just a mess and although I love COS overall, it could absolutely have done with another redraft or two

[@YellowBear-kx1ff]

With the Pensieve, memories can be tampered with, we see this in HBP, with Slughorn’s memory.

[@Longshanks1690]

@@YellowBear-kx1ff Slughorn was an experienced and practised wizard who had years to perfect that art, same with Snape’s occlumency. Somehow I doubt a 12 year old Hagrid was going to be able to achieve that too.

[@katholmes7112]

Why was Sirius convicted without a trial? Why did Dumbledore never ask Myrtle how she died and discover where the entrance to the Chamber was? He knew she was the victim 50 years before yet only Harry thought to ask her how she died? Lot of plot holes. Don't get me wrong. Hagrid was in the wrong for harboring an illegal man eating spider and later bringing it a mate. He was a total menace. But it wouldn't have been hard to prove who, or at least what, really killed Myrtle.

[@stephenmartinez1]

Two inaccuracies to point out: The spider killing spell was never in the book, and hagrid was never “assistant” gamekeeper. Never once was the word assistant used, or the supposed master gamekeeper named.

[@marcelsgroot]

I am glad to see you have your joy back in making HP vids. Your voice sounds for a lack of better word happy again. I hope all is going well in your life and your channel will grow

[@neuralwarp]

And of course, not only does Riddle find a scapegoat for the death of Myrtle, he also gets rid of the natural enemy of his basilisk. And as a bonus, he gets rid of a half-blood from the school, Hagrid.

[@andrewweber9930]

Pisses me off

[@crystalfajman3732]

You don't go though a trail to be expelled from a school. To go to jail(or get your wand broken) you should. Then again, Sirius didn't get a trail either.

[@adriane8565]

Acromantula venom doesn't immediately kill so Hagrid could have theoretically come in found Myrtle bloodied and unconscious, but instead of taking her to the hospital he instead healed her then placed her in the bathroom to avoid suspicion. The ministry, under pressure of the public to find the culprit, would have seen that as an open and shut case without need of further investigation once the acromantula was confirmed to be present during the incident.

[@YellowBear-kx1ff]

8:00 That should be a topic for a future video: Can half-breeds be Sorted into Slytherin?

[@vermiciousknid2456]

When Harry found the Half Blood Prince's book Ron thought he could be a Death Eater and Harry didn't think they'd allow a half blood to become a Death Eater then Hermione said, "They can't all be pure bloods there aren't enough left." So it's probably the same with Slytherin.

[@jasondyrkacz8270]

Snape and Voldemort were half breeds sorted into Slytherin.

[@u140550]

I think he still could learn his spells later in life, I could maybe see Harry teaching him.

[@jonwashburn7999]

Thank you. I always felt this was very unjust.

[@hollywebster6844]

I thought Hagrid's unfair treatment was due to prejudice against giants. As a half-giant, Hagrid was thought to be dangerous. Plus, it was easy for those in authority to believe "perfect" Tom Riddle over Hagrid. Who knows how much Riddle was able to influence the headmaster and others?

[@Noreb]

i also found it odd that they never cleared hagrid of all charges after the chamber was opened, and the basilisk discovered and killed. like there are multiple instances in which he should have probably had his rights as a wizard reinstated or at least his charges cleared

[@gLobbZ]

With Hagrid repressing his magical powers or in this case being forced to stop, wouldn't that cause the formation of an obscurial?

[@YellowBear-kx1ff]

Dumbledore let him stay as Gamekeeper, so no need to repress his magic.

[@marcelsgroot]

Magic can be done without a wand. A wand just makes it easier and more stronger. And he still did magic he even told harry not to tell anyone in book 1

[@j.p.giambalvo1123]

@@marcelsgroot Right, he told Harry not to tell anyone because he wasn't allowed to do it. That makes sense. But what doesn't make sense is that the Ministry of Magic put him in a catch 22, in which if he were to follow the rules, he would have formed an obscurial. Even if we accept that the Ministry of Magic is corrupt and unfair, uncaring about the safety of Hagrid, one would expect them not to want to be directly responsible for creating a danger to the people around Hagrid, right?

[@SimonaShine]

He did continue to use his magic though. Remember the pink umbrella?

[@marcelsgroot]

@@j.p.giambalvo1123 I agree and Rowling should have thought about this befor introducing the obscura in FB. The whole concept does go against Hagrid and others who had their wand broken and not allowed to do magic

[@stephenmartinez1]

One question I have, is why Hagrid would willingly have anything at all to do with fudge, considering all he put hagrid through. I’m referring to the third book when hagrid is at the bar discussing sirius black at the table with fudge and a few teachers. And he’s talking with fudge as if they are friends.

[@nitotech]

I wonder why they didn't blame Voldemort? Dumbledore knew he could talk to snakes. The killing were his fault for being too nice.

[@jacobholly2096]

This is what I find stupid 1. Only the heir of Slytherin is suppose to open the chamber of secrets and suppose to be a Slytherin hagrid is neither, 2. Shouldn't everyone who knows and talks to hagrid know that he loves magical creatures. 3. It also sucks that he's getting the same somewhat punishment that newt Scamander had with the magical creatures situation. The ministry was dumb enough to not have any actual evidence of hagrid doing anything ,all they have is the word of one student , and it's unfair that maybe they think that just because of his size they think he could hurt someone even though he wouldn't hurt a fly because you know magical creature's. It's really unfair.

[@robertmartin4449]

So if you get expelled you can’t have a wand? What if you just don’t graduate? Does that mean if hogwarts did close, those students that couldn’t go to a different school couldn’t do magic?

[@sethjohnson3650]

Can you make a theory video of how hagrid’s mom and dad met and how a wizard and giant could conceive a child?

[@LyleFrancisDelp]

The Wizard Justice System is rubbish.

[@neuralwarp]

One of the most important inventions of the British justice system is the modern barrister (advocate). They have revolutionised the law by forcing the courts to behave fairly.

[@jaredquinney204]

I was always curious about this

[@peacefulinvasion684]

The thing is, Hagrid is half giant and, as such, is subject to discrimination. This probably played a role in both his expulsion and his arrest. With the fact that there was no evidence that led anyone to believe a spider killed myrtle, it was literally Tom Riddle's word against Hagrid's. What's even worse, the ministry probably did nothing to make up for the mistake despite how they've wronged Hagrid twice at that point. Instead, they decided to execute a beloved pet the following year. It just shows how corrupt they were from the start.

[@DanTheYoutubeAddict]

There is a very simple reason Hagrid was expelled without trial; xenophobic racism was (and is) prevalent among the leaders of the wizarding world, especially among those in the Ministry of Magic.

[@RestingBitchface7]

Lead Dumbledore to conclude, not concur.

[@Steve-sl8rc]

How did Tom riddle use myrtles death for a horcrux if he didn’t technically kill her

[@lisah7729]

In the book (not the movie) when Tom Riddle was interviewed by Dumbledore at the orphanage, Riddle says "I can make things happen to people that ANNOY me" Not ....when they HURT me, as is said in the movie. The Movie makes Riddle sound like a victim, which he was not. I suspect he was ANNOYED by Myrtle's excessive crying and that is what made him decide to kill her.

[@deeneydeeney7219]

In the same way as Myrtle speaks to Harry about how she died, why couldn’t Dumbledore ask Myrtle how she died? How long does it take to become a ghost?

[@hagerty268]

Let's explore. 1) if Hagrid was actually guilty why did they let him out? 2) how long was Hagrid in prison? 3) since Dumbledore had the memory showing that Hagrid was not in fact guilty of harming or killing myrtle, why was he not pardoned, had his record cleared, and got his wand back legally? All of these things seem to be in the hands of good old Dumbledor, who of course did nothing. Another real thing to make us fans crazy is the ability for authorities to make a wand regurgitate the last spells cast in order. If the wand can tell the authorities what spells have been cast, why not check that first to see if the wizard or witch cast the offending spells ???? P.S. Dumbledore was the most inept headmaster ever. I agree Dumbledore was a great, if not the greatest wizard of the age, but he seemed totally obtuse as to what was happening at his school.

[@zacharywheeler6605]

Follow up question. Why wasn’t Hagrid allowed to use magic after Harry’s second year when it was proven the one who killed myrtle was tom riddle?

[@davidaltman8831]

having an illeagal creature (aragog) didnt help him. how do we know the baselisk didnt bite myrtle ? and aragog wasnt tame, he may not have attacked hagrid but he did attack others, i.e harry and ron. (of course with help from his offspring who also tirned on hagrid after aragog died)

[@mr.m4297]

Nice I was always wondering this myself

[@fredpritchard1384]

Another great video 👍 I always wonder if/why he wasn't allowed to get another wand or just use his umbrella and use in public

[@TheHappyPotatoe]

How come hagrid wasn't invited to return to his studies and allowed a wand again after Harry got him cleared of all charges?

[@irasoso32]

Students generally don't get actual trials before being expelled .... expulsions are part of the school's disciplinary system, not part of the criminal justice system. That Myrtle's murder was taken as something properly handled by Hogwarts instead of by law enforcement is more troubling than merely Hagrid's expulsion. After all, if Hagrid was really guilty, wouldn't expulsion be too mild (as opposed to Azkaban).

[@kreitzerova2371]

I think he deserved to be expelled. He kept a creauture known to kill humans and deemed impossible to train in a school full of children. And time and again he's shown he doesn't think much about the consequences of his actions.

[@maikemorgenstern5358]

I know, that my opinion will be unpopular. But I can't help thinking, that keeping a dangerous spider as a pet in secret in a castle full of kids could be enough reason to expell a student. Hagrid was the only human, Aragog would not attac.

[@steventaylor4798]

Spider escaped so that helped to make less investigation, that caused Hagrid to get expelled and corrupt ministry allows this to help them please public.

[@attitudeproblem6462]

You know, Tom really did kinda shoot himself in the foot w/ this scheme. When Hagrid became gamekeeper, Hogwarts becomes his permanent home. Who still has to go back to the orphanage during summer???😏

[@dillonlehane7134]

On the Ministry's part, I think people like Umbridge were more common back then, so it was easier for part-humans like Hagrid to be legally ostracized. Clearly they were still common by the 90s, but it's hard to gauge without any other examples of how the Wizengamot or the school governors treat half-giants apart from Hagrid. In short: I think the Ministry was just being racist af. Also, I agree that Myrtle should have been examined. She would have had massive bites even from a baby acromantula, and being a web-spinner he probably would wrapped her up as well and stuck her to a bathroom stall or something. Regarding extracting anybody's memory, that hadn't yet been established as a possibility in the books or the movies. There's a difference between not being used and not being mentioned at all. For example: apparition wasn't given a name until the 2nd book, and animagi weren't named until the 3rd, but both had been shown by that point. Extracting memories, however, weren't mentioned ✨or✨ shown until book 4, the only possible exception being Riddle's diary, which as we now know was a horcrux pretending to be a memory. I can't criticize Rowling for not using an element in her story that she hadn't invented yet, but I've got no problem criticizing the elements she ✨had✨ created when they're not used or poorly explained

[@unicornhorse1632]

But he used magic though...in the first part especially, to give Dadly the tail, lighten the cake, open the door to the diagon alley

[@erikagholston6610]

Thanks for breaking it down. Hagrid deserved to be treated better than he was.

[@Reverb154]

Personally, I believe that Dumbles DID expel Hagrid, but to SAVE him.

[@immyl4621]

I think you were mistaking when you said the public. I think they wanted to keep it as quiet a s possible. just the council I think knew about it in the ministry everything else was hush-hush.

[@immyl4621]

Also, I think some people knew he was half giant, so there you go.

[@indedgames4359]

Becaus they wantet to swep it under the Rug. Its simply the coruption again. Riddle gave them the perfect excuse. Thats why he knew it would work Wth the Spider beeing sayed to be the Monster they simply would Not lock into it.

[@eldenlion5850]

Imagine all the lives they could’ve saved if they had bothered to investigate

[@gullinvarg]

I wonder if Hagrid was also the victim of prejudice due to him being half giant.

[@Ghostmanoftheapocalypse]

Hagrid wouldn't need to go back to school if your logical about it he never lost his wand because its in the umbrella thanks dumbledore plus he's worked at the school for 52 years so he's been around so many different teachers and hundreds if not a few thousand training witches and wizards In that time all getting there own education and he would of clearly of learnt spells just by watching the others while In and around hogwarts so for we know even he's a pretty powerful wizard we just never get to see it because he's not ment to have a wand around others

[@topcat2015]

lets not for get that the ministry and the wizarding world has a fair amount of prejudice against non human magicfolk.

[@lydiapinnell1124]

Love being early ❤️

[@Chris47629]

Even if his spider killed her he would have taken responsibility not deny it

[@Samurai_XIII]

Wouldn't he just go to the school for adults wizard training like what Mr. Finch keeps applying for?

[@stewartbugler]

That mentioning of what are the chances that the half breed Gryffindor could be seen as the heir of Slytherin except that applies to both Harry and Hagrid... It gets me thinking. If Slitherin was to reincarnate like he said he would... Did he actually choose Harry himself. I mean the there wasn't much evidence by the second book when it was proposed but then never tracked upon but he does actually fit the bill for Salavars successor.

[@howtogoogle8031]

what if harry potter was a reincarnation adn one of the descendants of salAzarslytherin from is mothers side

[@stewartbugler]

@@howtogoogle8031 thats a strange misconception about reincarnation isn't it? Why would there be a genetic relation between the 2 if its reincarnation if that was the case most principles of the concept would make 0 sense... like be good in this life or you come back as a creature that reflects the life you lived. Your previous life is the only factor that connects you to the next life surely.

[@outsidethebox1222]

It seems that, at least, when it comes to the governments of the wizard in world, the concept of justice is extremely malleable. Often times it seems that the guilty either are never punished or receive very little punishment, while the innocent seem to often times become scapegoats for the guilty. It seems that this is the rule instead of the exception. I mean, we have cases like this in the real world, but it seems that this is the normal way of doing things for the wizard and world. I honestly wonder if this wasn’t J. K. Rowling‘s attempt at satire. It almost seems to poke fun at injustices that sometimes occur in the real world. It’s so over the top. Have you ever bothered to sit down with the Harry Potter books and look at just how many miscarriages of justice there are throughout the series? It’s shocking

[@maxwell9211]

Without watching I’m guessing it has something to do with systematic racism in the wizard of world against non human magical beings Edit: If you’re going to reply to this comment with something along the lines of “don’t make a kids book political” just remember that Umbridge’s whole mo within the ministry is to write racist laws

[@charlottehardy822]

This has always bothered me but left me with the same conclusions as you.

[@MOOONismm]

Was Hagrid in Hufflepuff house?

[@10countboxing46]

Why did they never ask moaning myrtle what happened?

[@GrouchyKraut]

The magical world is terrible at investigating things.

[@KnobleSloth]

Because then the books couldn't happen. The end

[@steakdriven]

You know, I would say that that level of police incompetence is unrealistic... But I listen to a lot of True Crime and can safely say that I have seen worse. Especially in certain United Kingdom cases that I can think of

[@rlaquaticsgaming5506]

That's why I don't like the ministry of magic. No justice at all with them.

[@MeekMallard]

Probably some kind of racism as he was half giant

[@Sasuke81a]

Sadly Hagrid was a victim of Politics.

[@brocklytodd5317]

Hagrid was placed in Slytherin.

[@jeanettecarnell8933]

I always thought he would have been a huffelpuff,he never go5 to finish "people think that Huffelpuffs are a bunch of duffers,but...."

[@brocklytodd5317]

@@jeanettecarnell8933 I was joking

[@jeanettecarnell8933]

Lol,truth be toldmI thoughtvthat at first,being he was in the basement, Slytherin area,but I guess he was just hiding. If it was his room,they treated him poorly.

[@brocklytodd5317]

@@jeanettecarnell8933 sure.