Why You Shouldn't Grow Ume From Scratch

[@creperanch8968]

Cheers for the headsup, like so many others i fell in love with ume and started growing them. Here in Australia there's very little material around at all, so you are forced to start with younger propagated material. The idea of grafting onto a more interesting prunus trunk holds a lot of merit in my mind and is something i'll certainly keep an eye out for going forward as there's lots of feral plums on roadsides here. What would be your timing for doing a harder cut back on ume generally? Curious as i have 2 garden trees that may eventually become bonsai though will almost certainly be through grafting down the track.

[@bokujin.bonsai]

Fair point, but just because a home grown Ume won’t make it into the Kokufu shouldn’t be a reason not to grow them. I have a number of nursery stock Ume that I’m developing and I’m more than happy to appreciate and enjoy them as they are.

[@rakuyobonsai]

If you enjoy them that is all that matters, but there are several other prunus species that are much easier to work with if folks are going through the effort of growing. I should have explained that point better in the video

[@ThatGuy-cs3nb]

I plan on putting mine in the ground in a few years. I got two from Dylan F. And the white one is very vigorous and the pink isn’t so much. It was $85 for both so no big deal if I don’t get much from them. I have bald cypress, trident, Japanese maple, and many other things that will be the more easy option. I just want to challenge myself to get one moving. Even tho the pink one randomly flowered a few weeks ago. One of my favorites you have is the sweetgum you have and I’ve asked your dad about it a bit. If you could do a video it would be awesome. I love winged elm and sweetgum

[@ThatGuy-cs3nb]

Well I just bought two so I’m doing it

[@rakuyobonsai]

I'd be happy to be proven wrong! Wish you luck!

[@Joe-nj3bb]

What color are the flowers on the ume in the video? Are they fragrant? I'm guessing it blooms during late winter/early spring. Usually ume translates to "plum blossoms" in English, but from what I've seen it looks to be referred to as apricot bonsai in the hobby.

[@rakuyobonsai]

It's a single white flower, and yeah for this group of Prunus there isn't a good English word for it

[@gorkamorka]

Thanks for the video and your valuable insight! You mention "a roadmap is not there" multiple times, but you never explain what the limiting factors are. Is it the fact that growing a trunk of highest quality takes longer than a lifetime? Did you mean that it's simply a low chance for a trunk to end up being high quality? Also, you mention Kojo-no-mai cherry as a suitable prunus alternative. Do you happen to have an exemplar you could show us? Any chance of a kojo-no-mai video coming soon?

[@rakuyobonsai]

It's hard to artificially create the old gnarly trunks of Ume in Japan using young plants, age is just hard to fake. Even if you're a master carver and can make deadwood/shari that resembles the incredible old Ume deadwood, the bark takes a few decades. All for a tree that grows horribly in bonsai culture, which is why we regularly have to graft Ume. Yes, I need to do a follow-up video on this topic, should have focused more in better alternatives to Ume. Will follow up with Kojo-no-mai this spring when it's flowering.

[@gorkamorka]

@@rakuyobonsai looking forward to it! Recently bought a nice little kojo-no-mai from a nursery, excited to see what is possible with the species!

[@wreagin1]

Do you have any issues with peach borer? I’m growing black cherry (not advised) because I love them and I like growing trees but they been getting attacked by peach borer.

[@rakuyobonsai]

I don't personally, but Ume are pretty prone to disease and pests. I strongly recommend people use another form of prunus, like Kojo-no-mai cherry, which is much more forgiving and sustainable (and more productive in flowering as well!)

[@joshhavermahl454]

Are they not potentially a species of deciduous tree that would benefit from breaking the trunk by tearing as opposed to cutting it to a stump. I don't know much about the species but it seems like they are potentially very averse to external pathogens, while also being slow to move sap up and down the trunk. So may compartmentalise very efficiently down to root level where they store the most energy. Sorry I digress, you know this better than I do. My point is when I've dealt with species like that I've found it beneficial to of course make sure we have active buds below the cut and "snap" the trunk to "tear" at the cut and leave active cambium above the cut site so that the dieback it inclined to drop that active cambium above the eventual cut and move into that next bud that you want and to potentially do that cut in late spring (or early summer at the latest) right after new growth starts to harden off and as sugars are moving back towards the roots. This is, however, all based on species indigenous to my region and a technique that has worked for my climate, but maybe it might do the trick for a plant as stubborn as they ume sound to be. Sorry for the essay, thank you for reading my ted talk 😂, and I love your videos they have been a breath of fresh air on the KZbin bonsai scene

[@joshhavermahl454]

Also please keep in mind that the stone fruit-like species that I have access to tend to appreciate their foliage being balanced similarly to pines in my climatic region as well and I think that plays a huge role in everything I've learnt and said above

[@rakuyobonsai]

Thanks for the comments, and I don't disagree. I made the video because Ume is something that almost everyone wants, but if you talk to people who have had them for years most tell me they're not worth the effort. I think there are other prunus, like Kojo-no-mai cherry, that are much more rewarding and forgiving and pleasing to grow if you're going to spend the effort growing a bonsai from scratch

[@brianvandermey4223]

How many years in the field was the ume in the video?

[@rakuyobonsai]

15, and out of 30+ this is the only one that turned into something, the others died back to the soil and sprouted suckers

[@brianvandermey4223]

@@rakuyobonsai how much of that is the species and how much is the climate? I’ve got about 2 dozen in the ground in Wilmington, NC, in their first year.

[@TheMilkyWay123]

Unless your reason is to start something for the future generation!

[@rakuyobonsai]

My point was that Ume in Japan are basically Yamadori, are quite tricky if not impossible to produce in a container

[@davwww]

I loved all my apricot bonsai, while they were alive...

[@rakuyobonsai]

This is a common sentiment among many who try growing Ume, nobody I've talked to that has spent years growing them thinks they're easy or recommends them

[@lucadanna3425]

Same here