Wildcamping Disaster in the Scarp 1...What went Wrong

[@PaulMessner]

Hey Tony. Well done sharing your experience with us. A great learning experience for us all. Not just about the pitfalls of wild camping, but how you’ve reflected on the experience with brutal honesty is very nice to see. There’s no one reason for the failure of the tent. Lots of different circumstances. Not all of them in your control. I think the livestream is a great idea especially if Henry joins. Clarity how to use the gear is vital. The manufacturer are learning just as much as the end user. Take the cross pole loop as an example. My model doesn’t have this and it’s only after user experience that tarptent make changes to their design. Hope you get your new fly pretty sharpish. 👍🏻

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks Paul, yeah I think it was a combination of "unfortunate" events did for me...any one of which I might of got away with. Henry has confirmed for next Tuesday, should make for an interesting conversation - A new fly is on the way - Thanks for watching - T

[@Bikepacking]

Can’t wait for live show what time

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

@@Bikepacking 8.30pm...the Internet gods allowing!

[@Bikepacking]

@@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble uk time USA time

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

8.30pm UK time...👍👍

[@davids9549]

I think you are right, and credit to you for admitting Pilot Error rather than blaming the product. Essentially the mistake was to treat an (unreinforced) pull-out point as a full guying point - but we all make mistakes, as the hedgehog said when he climbed off the hairbrush. I have 2 Tarptents (this one and a Notch), and I find they are fine as long as the instructions are followed - they're made in such a way that there's little if any room for error, but that's typical of a lot of lightweight gear. I use those pull-out points to run a guyline upwards to trekking poles like Tarptent illustrates, but I also incorporate a loop of bungee cord at the tie-out to soften any shocks caused by wind gusts.

[@_Mountain_Dave]

Actually saw this on your mates video who was in the other tent but not been back in network and online since - Its this simple - i would suggest the Scarp tent is being miss sold as a four season tent - it is certainly not fit for UK mountain use that is for sure. This is not the first one i have seen fail at exactly the same point, ive also seen one stuffed into a bin on the side of an alpine hut literally a few weeks ago that i suspect had suffered a similar fate after a harsh night. They are just too flimsy the material use and the stress points are badly placed/reinforced. The product needs a V3 with more focus on the design and anchor points and dropping to a 3 season rating. I have done expeditions in all different tents, across 4 different continents and constantly use/review gear over the last 20 years and i actually made a point of looking at this, after a few pulls here and there, and feel of the fabric - its not Kerlon for sure or one that i would consider suitable for winter and has got even lighter for the 2022 season all in the everquest of lightness. I would not blame yourself too harshly, and the reason i say this is the fact you will have pegged the tent out better than most will (even using delta pegs). DO NOT BE DISTRACTED by the nonsense about the trekking pole guy out point which ive seen used , just to hold that centre panel out more in windy conditions without crosssovers. If still held securly to the ground the the guy wrapped around still will exert the same force on that point on the fly, and it will fail - again i just say its not fit for purpose. I would love to see fluctuating rapid gusts in professional wind tunnel tests of these tents - have youseen any, doubtful?! The tent is sold as "Strong, wind stable setup with four season protection" and "Whether you’re pitching the Scarp 1 on Mt. Rainier or biking across the Scottish Highlands, you’ll sleep warm, dry, and secure". I'll be honest the conditions in this video are not even Harsh for UK mountain use so to sell this tent as a "Strong, wind stable setup with four season protection" is in my opinion dangerous given the materials used. Any 4 season tent that doesnt seal down to the ground, once that spindrift gets going your not going to "sleep warm, dry and secure" for long especially with a inner mesh that can't be zipped over. It has so many design flaws and these are just two - i could make a long list! My honest advice, DO NOT PAY again for a substandard product, that has failed in lighter conditions for what it is sold for - this is a defect - hold your ground. Get a new one FOC, and either keep it for 2/3 season light use or sell and put the money towards something else, there are cheaper tents that will perform better in the mountains than these. There are also expensive alternatives that will last you years in the harshest of conditions with the correct setup. But yea if the owner is saying its down to how its been pegged out - its bull - a guy line point there and a walking pole then secured will make sweet FA difference on that stress point (note they dont specify any angles either lol). As painfully priced as they now are, in these conditions the Atko re lightweight i guess is what your going for will not fail like this. But yea whatever you do, do not pay the guy for a failure of design, not use. If he claims otherwise then just question their pedigree, a good sign is if you want to use a tent in UK winter mountains, especially high or scottish, is it a trusted brand with a proven expedition pedigree, with mountaineers that don't endorse them but happy to use them etc. If you can't answer yes to this question, dont go camping in it in the hills in UK winter where the conditions can kill you if you get it wrong, or not without a solid back up plan. One last thing for your viewers ALWAYS carry a bivi bag- when movement is not possible or more dangerous to do so, even the cheap £5 orange plastic ones will potentially save your life if it had come in really bad for 12 hours, even be it your on a daywalk (accidents and becoming immobile happen) on the tops or winter camping - hyperthermia is a killer, and fast. MRT prefer to collect live ones rather than body retrieval.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks David...a lot to mull over in there - I think you're right.. I'll treat the Scarp as 3 season and use the soulo when it's looking a bit tasty outside 👍👍 - Cheers! T🙂

[@euansmith5885]

Great video Tony. I'm the owner of a Scarp 1 and until I saw your video, didn't appreciate the engineering involved in designing a tent and the importance of following the set up instructions. Like many others, I probably didn't follow these to the letter. I definitely will now. Appreciate your integrity and honesty in accepting things could have been done differently and your gesture to Henry to pay for repair.

[@AndyWardle]

Tony don’t beat yourself up. I set my soulo red label up without pegging it properly. Guess what happened. Snapped pole in high wind. We’ve all done it. Anyone says they haven’t is telling porkies. It’s part and parcel. Let’s get it fixed and “back out” mate. Thumbs up for your honesty 👍 👍

[@BulldogBadger]

The exact same thing happened to me mate

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks Andy, I agree - I think most people drop the odd "clanger" in stressy situations...it just comes down to luck if you get away with it or not...Good to meet you mate - T

[@AndyWardle]

@@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble you too mate. Hopefully get a camp sorted soon. 👍

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Sorted!!

[@johnpeterson3386]

Actually, let me put this another way. The implied question of this video is something like "is the Scarp good enough to withstand these mighty winds?" And that's entirely the wrong question. The question should be: "Am I skilled enough to use this Ultralight tent in mighty winds and make it work?" Because that's what Ultralight camping is about...what is the minimum amount of (weight/gear/support) that I need to utilize in order to survive at some arbitrary level of comfort in some or another set of conditions. You achieve this through innovative design and materials, but ultimately you are replacing Kilos with Knowledge and experience in many cases.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

You are spot on...knowledge is power...- hopefully this experience will have helped out someone in the future 🤞...onwards on upwards! Thanks for watching and taking the time to comment, it really is much appreciated 👍👍- Cheers T🙂

[@LostInIce4]

Just got a sub from me. Honesty and integrity is something rare these days. Having lived in Iceland and camping in extremely severe weather, Hilleberg BL is my only choice. My life is dependent on my equipment not failing. Thanks for sharing!

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thank you!! You live and learn, I'll not be making the same mistakes again and hopefully someone else will benefit from my experience too...thanks again for watching and taking the time to comment 👍👍 Cheers! T🙂

[@R6PhilOutdoorEnthusiast]

Nice one Tony, it takes a big person to own up to their mistakes and be honest, I’m sure this video will help others out in the future and prevent similar failures. We’ll done mate 👍

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Cheers mate...hopefully somebody will learn something...if only never to go camping with Tony Noble! See you soon - T

[@scottishscribe2293]

This could have happened to anyone with this tent, a bit of bad luck for sure. And it certainly answers my concerns regarding the material Tarpent are using for their flys, it’s simply too flimsy for what we consider 4 season in the UK. Also keep in mind 4 Season refers more to temperatures than it does wind speed vulnerability. I would argue we need a whole new universal metric for gauging a tent’s strength in high wind scenarios. I think Tarpent need to consider doing 2 versions of all their 4 season tents, akin to Hilleberg’s Red/Black label options. With the option to double your poles being a must. A heavier duty version of the Scarp 1 would definitely be in order for winter altitude camping in the UK, and here’s why. I’ve been saying for many years that camping in the UK - particularly at any altitude - is a much more serious proposition than most realise. The fact is we tend to assume because our mountains are small in comparison to others elsewhere, that brand name tents should certainly be able to handle our weather. To which I say nope. If you look at camping videos from around the world, campers very often have the option of sheltering their tents under the cover of trees as a wind break. For instance in Washington State with weather similar to ours for most of the year, they have trees growing to the altitude of our tallest mountain Ben Nevis. In Colorado their treeline maximum altitude is nearly 3 times the height of Nevis. Imagine the luxury of that tree cover in the UK? Except our hills are pretty much barren when it comes to finding cover, in fact I would argue the valleys and glens of the UK are little more than a series of wind tunnels waiting to test hikers and their gear to the limit. I really do think we underestimate the conditions we’re faced with in this country. Put it this way, that Scarp 1 would have survived at 8000 feet elsewhere with some tree cover. In the UK it can be wiped out at 500 feet with identical wind strength due to lack of that same cover. I really do think the UK is one of the worst places for camping, especially at altitude, but we tend to just get on with it because it’s what we’re used to. I’ll bet Tarpent - if honest - would not recommend the Scarp 1 for exposed camping on our hills in gale force winds. Gear the rest of the world takes for granted often comes up short in the UK due to our relatively humid climate and exposure to water on all sides. I’ve lost count of the times I’ve seen Hilleberg tents fail on KZbin, usually due to wind driven rain. What works in colder climates doesn’t always transfer well to our washing machine climate. And don’t get me started on Gore-Tex. The only tents I’ve felt secure in at altitude are the old fashioned double A frame with a cross pole connecting them. Bombproof for sure, but they usually weigh about the same as WWII bomb to boot. I guess what I’m saying is, instead of debating what gear works better than other gear, perhaps we should have a conversation about what gear we actually need for our unique UK conditions? I would argue a lot of what would work best for us doesn’t really exist yet. Just a thought.

[@colinme2672]

I have used my tarp Scarpa 1 for many years in the Munro's and had conditions every bit as bad as this. Never used the cross-poles I bought. Never had a problem. I believe it is the tension on that extra guideline that caused the problem.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

I think I agree...it was my use of the cross poles and extra guy that did me...I think! T

[@rayhallam]

Cracking comment, I could not agree more. I like to head out, often alone, in hard conditions and test all of my tents out in the biggest hoolies I can find. My thinking is that, in order to sleep well, I need to trust my shelter fully before I need to deploy in it anger and the only way to gain that trust is by testing it in relatively savage conditions. Thus, I have destroyed many tents. Have spent over two decades trying to find a usable one person tent that is truly capable of withstanding Cumbrian and Highland conditions. After many hours talking to manufacturers, testing and discussing things and I believe you are entirely correct, most manufacturers just do not appreciate U.K. conditions. The problem isn’t rain, I could name sub £200 tents that will hold up just fine in torrential rain. Same with snow. Wind is more of a problem, but our combination of both is the killer. 80MPH winds with horizontal rain will kill even the top spec tents. Having ripped through three Voyagers (sustained 80MPH winds will destroy one of these in minutes regardless of how well pegged our they are), I’m working my way through Hillebergs. Hilleberg are experts and their tents have the best build quality I have ever known. Put their Jannu up against a Voyager and there is absolutely no competition, but I don’t think even Hilleberg fully appreciate British conditions. The Jannu will take 80MPH winds (I’ve tested this), but add hard rain and it will ride up the fly, push under the top vent cap and pour into the top vent. With hard wind pressing on the fly, you get a constant spray inside the inner. In sub -10C conditions, a down sleeping bag wetting out can quickly turn camping into survival. I’m still seeking the perfect one man four British season tent which is exactly why I’m here watching this video; I have always wondered about the Tarptent. Having watched this video though, I think you’re right, I think the fly is too flimsy (Hilleberg Kerlon would not have torn here). For now I take a TN Quasar (old version, 4.2KG) for serious conditions if I’m out in a storm with the dog (he loves storms), the Soulo if out alone. I have tested the Soulo in big winds, but not in truly horizontal rain and I’m concerned the same will happen as with the Jannu. Will put this to the test asap.

[@petergilbert72]

@@rayhallamI believe Hilleberg consider their BL double poled tunnels to be their absolute strongest. Their vents are more rain proof too.

[@philjones3335]

Be interesting to hear everyone's point of view next Tuesday. I too had my scarp1 totally destroyed in Peak District on 28th December. It was pitched correctly but the winds were so strong that the clips that hold the cross poles to the tent constantly loosened themselves, and I presume it was on one of these occasions that a particularly strong gust came and snapped the main pole and flattened the tent so much that the two corner poles which were into the wind ripped right through the fly. The main pole that snapped then shredded the fly. I was not using g the other guy out point which some people are saying is for trekking poles only, personally, I really don't know, but I wasn't using those. I think my problem was that the tensioners on the cross pole clips just could not stay tensioned due to the high winds. I don't have anything g to measure wind speed so can't say how strong it was but I could not stand up in it. Luckily I had my sleeping bag in my bivvy so I got my border collie in with me and stayed flat to ground till, first light. I couldn't take the remains of the tent down as it would have taken me over the edge, I had to leave it.I went back 3 days later and every last peg had gone, somebody took everything, but there you go, I was just glad to get out with my dog safely

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Wowsers...now that sounds rough! Be interesting to discuss this nest week. Thanks for watching - T

[@AndrewParkOutdoors]

Hi Tony, I think looking at this both yourself and Henry have been very considered over the solution. From a previous Scarp owner perspective I think the conditions just exceeded the build quality. I reckon it tore at the central guy patch and having the velcro fixed on the corners may not have made any difference. Not convinced angling up to a walking pole would have made a huge difference either. Much as i love Henry Shires gear I do think it's a bit lightweight and cottage industry construction in some parts and ultimately I sold my Scarp over concerns on some of the finishing. For example the velcro corners would release from the poles in gusts ( that's a model from few years ago now ). So I think the tent was used beyond its weather envelope and both of you have been fair in reaching an agreement. That was conditions where your Hilleberg becomes the shelter best suited? Happy camping. A

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks Andrew...I suppose its only really experience that teaches...there's definitely a lesson there for me! Very interested in your comments, I'll bring them to the table next week. Thanks for watching, T

[@Frogboxer]

Still should not have failed....clearly the tie-off point is a weak point that should have been reinforced better. Trekking pole is merely to lift the fabric for more space and tension...so may have made things worse. Possibly adding length of bungy cord to guy-lines would give the necessary flex in gusty weather.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

I'm definitely up the the bungie cord...and I'm probably leaving that central guy well alone in future too! Thanks for watching - T

[@TonyHobbs]

Hi Tony I'll watch this with great interest and your opening statement I'd very very nice to see. That is honest and open. I'll carry on watching.

[@markrowan1433]

The trouble with tarp tent in my opinion is that they have guy out points attached at the weakest points ie center of a panel other tent have guy out points in seems or at poles.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

It's on the list to discuss on next Tuesday's livestream...Thanks for watching mate - T

[@AlanMETALMAN]

Nobody's perfect Tony and good to watch a video where every does not go right for a change, which was refreshing to be honest. I hope you get it sorted out with the tent, especially for the cost of it, take care, cheers Alan

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Cheers Alan, The tents all sorted now 👍👍 - thanks as always mate! T🙂

[@2E0RCS]

Thanks for sharing Tony , I did fancy a Scarp but after seeing this im going back to my idea of a Hilleburg. Im sure theres others now thinking the same as me.

[@peterevans8194]

First, I don't think that wind seemed too excessive. I think that the other tents dealt with it fine supports that idea. Looking at the design of the tent, I don't think not attaching those velcro ties was the problem, but rather than central guy...To me, the way the guy secures to the tent looked weak...if that guy was not intended to be used in heavy winds, that should be made clear in the blurb that came with the tent. If it should have been pitched with a bungee, it should have been supplied or again at least mentioned in the blurb...As one or two others have said, the materials are just too light and the design not brilliant... I truth even when the tent is repaired or a new fly is obtained, I would not trust in bad weather...

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks Peter...I'll be raising all those points with Tarptent on the livestream...although I do agree, it was my use of the central guy that did for me..😬😬 ahh well! Thanks again for watching👍👍- T🙂

[@Pauls2025]

Absolute respect for your openness and honesty Tony... Onwards!

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Cheers mate! T

[@petergilbert72]

As a weight comparison Tarptent’s silnylon weighs 35g a metre; Hilleberg’s YL 40g, RL 49g, BL 55g.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

👍👍

[@lomino6478]

A very open and honest response Tony. It's a terrible shame that your tent was so badly damaged, whatever the cause. I hope you get a good deal on the new flysheet 😉 All the best Tony, look forward to some less challenging trips 👍⛺⛰️

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks mate - a new fly is on the way...back out this weekend! - T

[@simonclarke3271]

Massive respect Mr. N. This was a great ‘hindsight’ video that all can learn from. We all make mistakes and can, in the heat of the moment, jump to conclusions. Our outdoors community do help to point out our errors that hopefully we all learn from. However, what you did here is not the norm and very welcomed, along with a great demonstration of your moral values. Great work.🍺

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Cheers Simon...I've definitely learnt a lesson or two...hopefully others will get something out of this and not make the same mistakes as me...thanks again mate 👍👍 - T🙂

[@joehusband8479]

Honesty and integrity are great traits and you’ve got them both. Well done Tony, top man!👌Hope they do a good deal mate.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks Joe, yes ,I'm pleased to say the new fly is on the way! - T

[@joehusband8479]

@@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble nice one mate 👍

[@grahamscothern4319]

Well done Tony. Totally understandable to be Angry who wouldn’t. I think you are a very honest and top bloke for sharing all this And I hope Henry also is a good guy and gives the fly to you free of charge. Cheers Graham

[@kanaalvanNI]

If you need a PHD to set up the tent to withstand a big gust there is something wrong. Don't appologise because some fanboys pressure you. You tested the tent on a trip with a bailout option and it failed pretty quickly. If you pitch this tent in a (winter)storm the tent will be blown to pieces before you can adjust the guidelines, there is no use taking it to exposed area's unless you are certain of the conditions ahead or if you have bailout options,.. This is a 3 or 3,5 season tent: same wind and snowresistance as a 3 season tent, maybe a bit warmer but not suited for exposed campsites. You should compare it to the msr hubba, big agnes UL,... not to 4 season tents that are the bailout,...

[@ChrisJB]

As a Scarp owner I've followed this saga with a great deal of interest. Fair play to you for recognising any oversights on your part and being so transparent about them. I'll be honest, I'm a bit of a 'corner cutter' on wild camps but I've been lucky and not had any major mishaps....yet. Though I'm sure it will only be a matter of time before I seriously get bitten on the arse. If anything, your story will perhaps act as a bit of a prompt to be a bit more thorough in my approach. Best wishes, Chris

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Yeah, that's the lesson I'm trying to take from this..an extra 30 seconds thinking about what you are doing can make all the difference. Thanks for watching! T

[@jens-kristiantofthansen9376]

We all muck up now and then. Nine times out of ten, there's little consequence and then there's that tenth time where a few things just come together to make it a problem. All credit for addressing it in this way.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thank you...Yeah, just one of those things, another day and I'd have got away with it...ah well!! appreciate you watching and taking the time the comment - Cheers - T🙂

[@trickofthetrail]

Sorry you had that experience Tony. Thanks for sharing the experience and for being so honest and open about it all. It's easy for others to be critical, but as we all know, when we're out in the elements, things don't always go right. I hope you get it all sorted. Look forward to the live stream. 👍

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks mate! I've just edited chalked it all down to experience...fingers crossed the next time won't be as expensive! T🙂

[@gsuh6841]

Easy. every tailor can tell you that it is a very bad idea to put the stress on one small area of the cloth. Watch how Hilleberg does it to make it work. There should have been a continous reinforced seam from the topp to the bottom, the guy lines attached on multiple point on this reinforced seam. Also: A tent that rips when you pull a guy line too tight is, sorry to say, crap. Plus a good tent should be able to handle small pitching errors.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

👍👍

[@WalkWithWallace]

An easy mistake to make Tony, you obviously wanted to batten down the hatches knowing you were in for a rough night. However pegging down the mid point was incorrect and that Delta Ground Anchor peg holding down the mid point tie out done the damage! As soon as the wind ripped out the corners held down with the Eastons, it was always going to tear. You can't blame Henry for thinking someone may have tripped over the guyline as it would cause a similar tear. I hope MCM is big enough to offer a full apology to his viewers for misleading them! This was poor form imho.

[@WalkWithWallace]

@@etztz123 but it wasn't used correctly, there was no need to use it as the crossover poles were in place. Those mid point tie outs are there to be used in conjunction with a trekking pole only to lift the flysheet up. That's quite clear on the Tarptent website. If he left that out then there would have been a very good chance the tent wouldn't have ripped.

[@WalkWithWallace]

@@etztz123 I reckon the wind tore out the whole end but couldn't budge the Delta Ground Anchor resulting in the material ripping at that tie out point. Its an unfortunate mistake and no one would have predicted the wind uprooting the 9" Easton stakes. I don't know if the ground was a bit soft being near the water. 🤷🏻‍♂️

[@WalkWithWallace]

@@etztz123 exactly mate.

[@TonyHobbs]

I agree if the mid point had not been tied it may have survived the night. If you watch my video 1vs2 then you'll see the lines slip which isn't good. Ron uses thicker lines on his line locks although maybe I'm odd one out as most seem not to have this issue.

[@WalkWithWallace]

@@etztz123 I know what you mean, but at the end of the day it's a secondary point which is optional and meant to be used with a trekking pole. Just an unfortunate event. I personally don't think it's a true 4 season tent, I wouldn't want to use mine in excess of 50mph winds.

[@TrevsOutdoorsandWellbeing]

Tony really enjoyed this you have saved a lot of people heart ache with this experience chin up mate you sound gutted but it will all work out mate al the best

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks Trev, It's all good...its only "stuff" ... nobdy to came to any harm and hopefully it will stop somebody else make the same mistake - cheers mate - T

[@dancew77]

hats off to you, Tony, and respect for doing this video👍

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks Dan!

[@MancOutdoors]

A incredibly honest genuine video ,we are all learning every time we wild camp I hope you get it sorted To y 👍🙌

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thank you! It's all sorted now..👍👍 - thanks again for watching- T🙂

[@thecampingastronomer8554]

I have been watching this unfold on KZbin and Facebook this week. This is a very open and honest video Tony, which I am sure will be very helpful to others. I hope you get a good deal on a new flysheet.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks John! Luckily I don't mind looking like an idiot...which is lucky, as it seems to happen quite frequently! Nice pants by the way!! T

[@thecampingastronomer8554]

@@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble 👍

[@TonyHobbs]

You know one thing those velcro loops are not very good. On mine an old version from 2012 the velcro is very short. It does hold the Poles but it's possible the velcro lost its grip. You probably didn't use as velcro losing grip unlikely but it's a weak point where longer velcro would hold better.

[@aledzack82]

Well done on being honest about the mistake and coming to an amicable agreement with Henry. Top stuff.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Cheers mate -all good... thanks for watching - T

[@sticks333richards5]

Very honest reflection to be fair. Wind rips trees out of the ground tears roofs from houses and people say their tents are bombproof. Bit of a cult following from these KZbin creators. The tent is too light weight in my opinion for these conditions. Cracking summer tent tho. atb

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks mate - tbh I really like the Scarp, it's my go-to tent...maybe it'll be the Soulo the next time i find myself in similar conditions. Thanks for watching - T

[@yetiibob8407]

Nice vid Tony you are only human after all mate. I've had a similar experience many years back but turned out it was manufacturing defect. The wind can be savage at times and am surprised if anything can withstand some of these gusts. Keep getting out there mate.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thank mate...you live and learn!! back out this weekend - T

[@mrt7936]

well i maybe talking out of my back side here, but you got to ask yourself why are the cross over poles sold separate? why is it classed as 4 season with just the one pole set? I think you are taking too much of the blame here. No peg out points right on the corners, you got small cords coming off them which would allow for lift. look at the peg out points on your hilleburg they attached close to the tent body, possible to stop the tent from lifting? As for the scarp tent those loops don't look large enough for pole and guy line, why wasn't there a double loop there? it would make it clearer that pole goes through one and guy on the other one. As for the middle tie out point, that in my eyes is a design fault, there can be no reasonable doubt as to that what it is, a tie out point. yes i can see that you may choose to use a trekking pole to give it lift if you wanted, but you knew it would be windy and like with all 4 season tents, these points are made to be used to hold the tent down not lift it up. i bet if you looked at your friends tents all there guy out points were pulling down, hence i think its a major design fault. I think the company should have a good long hard look at this, as it seems to me they designed the tent which from what i have seen was a good product, then they had an idea to add the cross over poles to try to make it 4 season without giving it much thought. lastly yes you had a big hole in your fly but look at how the tent was lifting, if the pegs had been in the corners attached to the tent and fly you wouldn't have had that lift which your video clearly showed.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thank you for taking the time to watch and comment...I tend to agreed and I've come to the conclusion that whilst the Scarp is my go-to for most trips, if the forecast is a bit grim it's staying at home and I'll take the Soulo instead - better safe than sorry - Thanks again - T

[@mrt7936]

@@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble No thank you for a great video, I first saw this on your friends video, and just like you I was gutted like you were especially as it was well planned. It is not like you were using that tent for the very first time. But please keep posting, your outings are fantastic, as well as Educational.

[@DemiGod..]

This makes me glad I got an akto rather than a scarp 1. Can't imagine an akto ripping by overtightening a guyline, the connection points not a weakness. Somebody did manage to split the flysheet of an enan though, that had the earlier 600 rather than 1000 flysheet by overtightening the ends. Overtightening guylines is a common mistake, they should only be tightened enough to take up the slack. Tents need to give a little in the wind to absorb a big gust.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

You live and learn...not be making the same mistake again..hopefully! Thanks for watching and taking the time to comment 👍👍 - T🙂

[@johninman1354]

Not to sure what it was but i think it was colonel mustard in the drawing-room with the lead pipe if that helps.....

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

🤣🤣!! cheers mate - T

[@AndyWardle]

I think it was Chris. In the tarn. With his Stanley knife.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Don't think it hasn't crossed my mind. .🤪🤪

[@AndyWardle]

@@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble kind of thing he would do like. Shifty. I’ve seen him.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

🤪🤪🤪!!

[@wildaboutwalking2079]

Just came across this video as it came up on the trek-lite forum, and the Scarp was a tent that I was at one time interested in. Refreshingly honest. Glad that I didn't go for a Scarp though, looks overcomplicated, and that tie out point is a trap for the unwary, not being reinforced enough for non perpendicular tension.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Cheers! Tbh the Scarp is fabulous, it's just me that's a bit dim! I've now removed the offending central guys lines to ensure I don't use them again in the future...thanks for watching 👍👍 - T🙂

[@BiznessWizard]

Honest video, Tony. You are a good man! Everyone can learn from this video. Please let us know the time when the live stream will air next Tuesday. I may be 5 hours behind you guys in the UK, but plan on catching it.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Cheers Denis...not firmed up the time yet..I'm guessing itll be around 8pm UK time. Hope to see you there - T

[@BiznessWizard]

@@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble Thank you. Enjoy your weekend.

[@paulmortal7611]

Well presented. It’s always a risk playing the game you do. I’m sorry for your loss.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks Paul, tbh I'm not a big risk taker..I just got well and truly bitten on the arse - Thanks for watching - T

[@paulmortal7611]

@@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble Ah we've all been there. I remember getting vac packed into a terra Nova Solar in the early noughties, not far from where you were. Tent written off but all good experience. Go steady Tony.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Cheers mate!

[@TonyHobbs]

Oooh ouch the look on your face when it went. Bad luck. You say Hilleberg but maybe it would have survived... still watching... I do like your honesty

[@johnpeterson3386]

Just came across this and read through many of the comments, and I think about this much differently than most folks here. The Scarp is an Ultralight tent. The purpose of Ultralight equipment is to experience what some folks call "minimalism." It's not just "oh I can shave a full Kilo or more off this tent and there's no consequence!" Using Ultralight gear assumes and often requires a deeper knowledge of how the gear actually works, so that you can use 100% of it's capability. This is in contrast to "bombproof" gear that assumes a user *might not* use the gear to it's full capability and builds in some margin for error. That costs weight, but yeah, makes failure modes more difficult to create. Using a tent like the Scarp (which I have, in winds of 65+ MPH, which is 100+ KPH) is quite an adventure...but is also quite feasible. IF you understand how to maximize the ability of the tent to withstand wind. I looked at that setup and I knew IMMEDIATELY where it was going to fail. In my opinion, anyone using Ultralight tents in harsh weather should not step foot out the door without understanding how and where that tent pitch was going to fail. Tents are made to be supported along certain tension lines. The center panel guy line does not, will not, and should never be used to provide structural support. It's is purely to help combat deflection of that panel. And (imo) it should be totally obvious that the tension on that point needs to be perpendicular, and not terribly taut. It may perhaps be a fault of Ultralight tent manufacturers that clear communication of how to set a particular tent for storm conditions is not often explicitly made...there's an assumption that if you bring a 1 Kilo tent to a windstorm, you know what you're doing. But many folks, even experienced folks, somewhat surprisingly, do not actually understand how their tents work. Lesson learned here, I guess? And props for owning up to some user error here. Good luck!

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

🙂

[@Treefrogging]

Yes good explanation and highlights the dangers of ultralight gear , thanks

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thank you! 🙂

[@Phil.Oakley]

You were very calm 7 minutes in when it happened. I'd be crying! You've been honest and not hidden anything at all. We all take risks in tents. I've had my then 6 year old slice my £1200 Outwell with a groundhog stake 🤬 I've pulled zips apart or ripped bathtubs from over tightening the pole pull tabs. It happens and you don't know til it does. People saying it's not designed for that misunderstand a 4 season rated tent is wind rated too. We all learn lessons along the way and luckily you had back up options and bonus of a good pub grub after with friends 🙂

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Cheers Phil..I've been there mate!! 😜😜 All's well that ends...in the pub! Thanks for watching mate - T

[@joannecostigan4244]

Interesting about that setup. I would suggest that the guy line on that unsupported guy point was overly tensioned. Guy-out points on a reinforced seam provide actual structural support to a tent. That guy point, located as it was in the middle of the panel, is simply there to provide some additional support to prevent flapping of the large expanse of the fly panel. Overtightening it, as was apparently the case in this instance, adds no structural support to the tent and just risks damage to the fly, as we saw. Also - and this is intended as constructive feedback about your presentation style, not criticism - you may be unaware that you are constantly lip-smacking, which is very distracting.

[@carlrichards5250]

It seems to me that we want ever lighter tents, but are then taking them to exposed places, cranking them down and expecting them to be able to handle more extreme conditions thank we would have normally camped in before?

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

I suppose as technology improves we are expecting more and more...maybe sometimes we expect a bit too much...Thanks for watching - T

[@bobh4981]

It happens to us all. Main thing is you are ok. I think the main issue could be the single direction pull from the centre guy out. Using a trekking pole to lift the point of contact evens that out, thats how I pitch mine. I have noted on another forum that some use an elastic shock cord at the guy out point to soften the sudden pulling force. I will be amending my guy out point with this.

[@DavidDoyleOutdoors]

I'm sure that was the point of failure, when guyed down like that, the fly will try to fold down over itself when the guyline pulls on it with each gust, this will create a stress point on one side of the attachment point causing it to rip, when guyed over a trekking pole it is more even. I will add shock cord and maybe silicon a patch of non-rip nylon on the underside too as reinforcement

[@DavidDoyleOutdoors]

@@etztz123 I've had my scarp 1 for 4+ years in some extreme conditions and have travelled around the world with it, recently trekking 10 days in Balkans Accursed Mountains in storm force winds, I've always used the trekking poles when using the mid roof support attachment points, never ripped. It will make a difference being pulled down as the fly will try to fold over itself or twist downward causing high stress on one side of the attachment point, when its pulled upward the strain around the attachment point is more even. Even the scarp 1 manual shows to use these attachment points with trekking poles. Just google, scarp 1 manual, it's on the last page of the manual. I haven't seen anyone else's Scarp 1 tear at point, which proves guying it down like that will make it tear in strong winds.

[@DavidDoyleOutdoors]

@@etztz123 hi Paul thanks for your reply, yes seems there were a number of errors made. Cheers

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

We are all good...no harm done! I definitely up for the bungie cords,...👍👍 Thanks for watching mate - T

[@proffessorclueless]

Well done for backtracking in the light of new evidence. An extreme rarity in the UK nowadays. I think your reaction to their initial response was entirely justified.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thank you...Its bad enough looking in the mirror as it is..the last thing I can afford to to lose any sense of self respect! T

[@TonyHobbs]

One additional note on that central tie and to everyone saying it should not tear. Every MLD mid that has a mid tie out uses or should use (they say to) bungee cord on it to allow flexibility to silnylon. Ok this one for snow loads but you get my point.

[@noh2489]

As tent mods go mate your extra ventilation one does not appeal! Big up to you mate for doing this video. Still find it hard to believe that two Velcro straps makes the tent more prone to ripping, if this is the case then Velcro might not be the best material to use at these structural points as in buffeting winds it can easy come undone? Be interesting to see what is said on Tuesday. Its good that the manufacturer can see your video and work out what's gone on, they can use it as a means to refine the design maybe. These tents are sold as 4 season which means that they should be able to be put up in some of the worst weather, when you have that tent flapping about in minus temp's do you really want to take off glove to fiddle with Velcro??

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks mate...I think that's were I went wrong..rushing to get under cover without fully engaging brain! Tuesday should be interesting, lots of things to discuss - hope to see you there! T

[@shabingly]

Bigups on this video. I agree with your comments about the fly end panel guys and using/not using trekking poles. It appears to me in my uneducated opinion that a gust has come in and shifted that entire end of the tent towards the other end until that panel guy point is taking all the force. But again, I'm not gonna say I'm an expert.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Cheers Andy...I really don't know what happened...hopefully Henry will have a better idea next week. Thanls again for watching - T

[@jackalker6384]

Great video! Tents need to flex in high winds, when they cant flex they collapse. You're not at fault because tarptent dont their customers to not set the tent up so stiff in tougher conditions. It seems counter intuitive but it's true. The material just had too much tension and when the gust hit from that side it couldnt flex anymore so it split, i dont think velcroing the crosspoles would have changed anything and i dont think you pitched it wrong really, if it was me, i probably wouldn't have used that guyline at all, theres plenty of support from everything else, it isnt going anywhere if you dont use those guylines. I think the real failure is down to the spot you were camped at, westerly winds but you're on the east side which sounds like a good idea, but the spot you were in had higher gusts because of the mountain creating massive amounts of turbulence so its pushing all that air over the mountain and slamming it down on top of you. In high winds you're better off behind a bunch of big boulders like woolpacks wheras here you're in a fairly open space with essentially a windslide behind you. All the cheaper tents survived simply because they had a lot of flex. I took a eurohike festival tent which was £20 new up to red tarn in a horrendous storm and the gusts were biblical. It survived perfectly because the tent was able to bend all over the place. Scarps fail when people set them up too stiff.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thank you...I think you are spot on...I believe it was a series of "unfortunate" events that conspired against me...any one of which I may have gotten away with...cumulatively I was was done for...anyway, its all sorted now and the Scarp is hitting the hills on the next trip out - thanks again for watching and taking the time to comment...cheers! 👍👍- T🙂

[@jackalker6384]

@The Outdoors with Tony Noble i hope our scarps meet one day 😂

[@BulldogBadger]

Ah gutted for you mate, I know how it feels to kill a spendy tent after snapping a pole on my soulo through my own fault but we live and learn.. they’re only gear and we buy them to be used, hopefully you can get it repaired and back out soon 👍

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Cheers mate...I agree, gears there to be used and enjoyed - A new fly is on the way! Hope to see you back soon - T

[@BulldogBadger]

@@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble Me to mate, Im going away again Sunday for 5 weeks and then hopefully I will be home a little more for a while at least! I am well overdue a camp been working 18 hour days this week 🤮🤮🤮

[@lizkent2624]

What an awful experience, thank goodness it was still light and you were able to get down safely. I'm not sure I would have been thinking logically if it happened to me. I don't have any experience of tarptents but I'll be interested to hear what Henry Shires says on Tuesday.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

That was my thought too...Tuesday should be interesting, hope to see you there - T

[@whenigotothemountains1203]

Caused a fair stramash tony but you handled this video very well. Well done. Looking forward to the next video! Atb gordon

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks Gordon...yeah, I feel a bit bad about that...I chat with Henry about that on the Livesteam - Cheers, T

[@whenigotothemountains1203]

@@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble think you’ve handled this well tho tony. Will be interesting to see this live stream thing.

[@trytheoutdoors]

Well done, bud. I've always found Henry Shires to be polite and helpful. This is a really helpful video for all us Scarp 1 owners. Thankyou.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Cheers Imran..hopefully it might save someone from the same outcome... thanks for watching - T

[@chrismonk]

Your not an idiot dude. Things happen. Well done for holding your hands up and I hope the makers of the tent can help you and not just fob you off.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Cheers Chris...tell Mrs N that! the tents all sorted now, thanks mate - T

[@mboutdoors_uk]

Good vid mate. A very honest version of what happened. I’m not totally convinced it was your fault tbh 🤔 If that central guy point is only for a trekking pole then it’s got to be made clearer surely. The Velcro straps being left off shouldn’t mean a catastrophic failure imo. Hopefully you get it all sorted either way pal. Just ordering my OEX now 🤪🤪

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

I think they might be sold out!!...who knows...either way, I'll be making damn sure I've checked it all next time...there's only so much I can hide from Mrs N! 😬😬 Cheers mate👍👍 - T🙂

[@Rlea67]

Good vid mate, I read that their initial view was that somebody had potentially tripped on the line and that cudve caused it, that would have infuriated me too as there was no basis for them to have assumed that had happened, still, it’s good that you’ve reviewed what happened and remain pragmatic about it. Next Tuesday should be interesting, looking forward to it👍

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks Rob...Tuesday should be interesting, plenty to discuss. Thanks again for watching - T

[@tedwiley8215]

Mother nature can sometimes be a real #@#%.....glad you guys are okay 👍

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Absolutely! We're all good..looking forward to the next one - T

[@cathoutdoors523]

Hi Tony what a shame about your tent. So glad your okay. 👍😊

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks Cath...only my pride was hurt! - T

[@mjpni2000]

Fair play to you Tony , dont beat yourself up mate .... we all learn lessons in life

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Cheers! Its all good...onwards and upwards! T

[@TonyHobbs]

Nice saw to end Hope all gets sorted

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks Tony, Yeah, its all sorted now...a new fly is on the way - Cheers for watching - T

[@ThePreparedNorseman]

Mid panel guy points can’t be tight, especially in high wind. MLD (as Tony Hobbs probably has said) is very adamant on them being loose and with a bungee if in use, and also that they are not supposed to give any structural strength to the shelter. Personally I’d not even use them in high wind. Also a mid shelter will not collapse like a bent pole tent, they simply can’t collapse as the pole is rigid. The failure will be pegs pulling and everything going to 💩… 😅 With the tent collapsing the movement away from the static pegged guy will be significant.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Cheers.. I tend to agree.. I'll not be going anywhere near that central guy in future! Thanks again 👍👍- T🙂

[@TonyHobbs]

Henry from your email post said you tripped that unlikely it's interesting he not mentioned mid tie. Yup too tight. You're correct. And not needed to use mid point. But in hindsight so easy to say ... in that wind too easy to think let's tie it tight lol

[@xjessukx]

It will be interesting to find out what Harry shares has to say about that middle guy out point

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Hi Shawn, yeah, there'll be plenty to discuss ... T

[@benny_mc]

Looking forward to the live stream 👍

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Cheers mate..hope you are all OK, still trying to find that Ton..whatisname,,,beer! Tuesday should be good - T

[@benny_mc]

@@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble Tonkoko mate 😜 It's in Morrisons. See you Tuesday 👍

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

On it!!

[@damianhill6704]

Honesty. Well done. Crossing poles were not set up correctly. My cycle buddy has a scarp 1 and always fits the cross over poles (weight isn't an issue on the bicycle) they are painted so they are easier to identify compared to the centre pole. Gutted for you as her scarp 1 coped with some mega beatings in the Shetlands and Outer Hebrides where my terra nova duolite tourer didn't (stupidly swapped my double pole akto as it didn't have as much space, as it was September/October so longer hours in the tents due to less daylight) She doesn't use the central guy outs like you, bit only because they seem to be trip hazards as they stick out so far. I think they would help as the fly does sag quite a bit.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks Damian...you live and learn! I'm sure the Scarp would have coped if I'd have just taken a little more time to check...thanks again for watching 👍👍 - T🙂

[@andycoombes161]

Could it have been UV damagecfrom exposure to lots of sunlight?

[@BurtReynoldstash]

Lol, you clearly don’t live in England lol. It’s always raining here.

[@AndyWardle]

It’s only about a year old. It takes longer for uv to affect tents that way. Like 10 years or so.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Hi Andy, No, the tents less than 12 months old...it was just me - nice try though! T

[@luiscypher9657]

Oex bobcat 2 scarp tent-nil point 😢

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

👍👍

[@petemcgowan2828]

Fair play Tony, got a new sub 👍

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks Pere, appreciate that - T

[@garryandrews]

Gutted for you Tony! I hope you get a decent resolution.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks Gary, All sorted now... cheers mate - T

[@DavidDoyleOutdoors]

Hats off to you for being upfront and admitting the errors. About the use of trekking poles, the Scarp 1 manual does show to use trekking poles for the additional canopy support, check out the last page of the manual on their website I've had my scarp 1 for 4+ years and it has been hit by some really bad gusts, but no damage, I always use the trekking poles when using the additional canopy (roof) support. I don't know why people keep saying its a 4 season tent, the specs on the Tarptent website clearly says it's a 3-4 season tent. PS I tried adding links to the manual and specs, but my comments got auto removed

[@AndyWardle]

I may be missing something here. I don’t have a scarp so forgive my ignorance. But if it’s not a 4 season tent why do they say it’s a 3-4 season tent?? Why not say it’s a 3 season tent?? If there’s a 4. Then it’s a 4 season tent. In my mind at least.

[@DavidDoyleOutdoors]

@@AndyWardle I think because it’s better than a 3 season but not quite a 4 season. I see it more like 3.5 season, for me the only thing that doesn’t make it 4 season is the fly as it doesn’t go right down to the ground to keep snow out

[@AndyWardle]

@@DavidDoyleOutdoors yeah. Therefore. It’s a 3 season. They need to remove the 4…

[@DavidDoyleOutdoors]

@@AndyWardle sure. btw enjoy your videos

[@AndyWardle]

@@DavidDoyleOutdoors in me 4 season tent 😂 😂 I’m just splitting hairs here. But you know 😉

[@boolay75]

Broke my GoPro after 3rd use, my error shit happens:

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Yeap...Id get a DJI next...

[@davidjackson8829]

Well done for owning up. However I can’t help thinking you should have resolved this before jumping onto social media. You three KZbinrs have a lot of followers. Lots of people will now steer clear of Tarptent irrespective of you eating humble pie. This is unfortunate. Damage is done to reputation.

[@TonyHobbs]

Sadly the world is that way now. Let's all complain to the world this is a piece of.... because of an accident however caused. Esp as the main channel on this has 17k subs. That is a lot of people turning away when it's a great shelter. It's Chris Townsends second favourite and I'm sure he still would think so. Obviously his first is the same as my favourite ;)

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks David...although to be honest at no point have I criticized the tent, not even in the immediate aftermath of the incident...It was the response from customer services that irked me...

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Hi Tony, to to reiterate, it wasn't the tent....

[@patrickruane1544]

Gutted for you mate no matter how it’s happened.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Cheers Patrick...you live and learn! T

[@williamshepherd2543]

No doubt the Hilleberg was and still is in one piece.

[@RootsLion]

he should be st8 up replacing that tent skin free of charge 4 a new one end a story

[@aledzack82]

If you crashed your Golf would you expect VW to replace it?

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Its all sorted now...🙂🙂

[@Wild.cat.adventures]

That's excellent Tony, I can't wait to ask Henry Shires a couple of questions. I think your considered response will hopefully pave the way for you to establish a good working relationship with them. Good on you for your honesty! See you on the live stream. ATB Cat

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Thanks Cat, yeah, looking forward to next Tuesday, should be interesting - Thanks again - T

[@Bikepacking]

It good you can admit you set it up wrong which i knew when i first watched your friends video../ but for sure that pole guy line c enter is shown for snow load on there setup documents

[@TonyHobbs]

An unfortunate case of over tieing something out. A natural thought. But loses all flexibility. Its good to see an honest open appraisal so few and far between on KZbin these days with people just thinking they right without stopping and thinking.

[@Bikepacking]

@@TonyHobbs yeah when all three of them said it a perfect pitch ..there just weekend warriors not old school at all … very rare to find old school KZbinrs

[@TonyHobbs]

@Bikepacking I can think of one who's been around on KZbin over ten years playing with his little tarps lol and just says everything how it is without elaboration or exaggeration lol 😆 but he's mad and very few watch so probably not worth his thoughts lol the only ones with experience are those with a million views 😉 😆 In all seriousness at least this guy being honest and pretty much apologising. I hope others can do the same.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

Cheers mate - I'll be chatting with Henry about the central guy next Tuesday...Thanks again for watching - T

[@Bonnyladdadventures]

So ya got a piece of whot me and the other two chris.s got up griesdale.

[@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble]

I did...luckily though I didn't end up in a pool of piss!

[@Bonnyladdadventures]

@@TheOutdoorswithTonyNoble 🤣