Will the mordhau kill you in armor?

Today we have some thoughts on how striking someone in armor with the pommel of a sword is an effective thing to do. We started thinking about this after watching an interesting video by the HEMA fight breakdown guys: • Testing the Mordhau vs...
In this video we take a look at three original gauntlets from the Oakeshott Institute collection (oakeshott.org), try hitting some armor with the mordschlage, and discuss the similarities between the sword as an impact weapon and the way that dedicated impact weapons work.
As always, our swords are entirely made by us at our shop in Minneapolis, MN out of 6150 carbon steel, hardened and tempered to 50-52 Rockwell. Our swords and other weapons are made to look, feel, and function just like the historical originals on which they are based.
Check out our website here: www.arms-n-arm...
Nathan Clough, Ph.D. is Vice President of Arms and Armor and a member of the governing board of The Oakeshott Institute. He is a historical martial artist and a former university professor of cultural geography. He has given presentations on historical arms at events including Longpoint and Combatcon, and presented scholarly papers at, among others, The International Congress on Medieval Studies.
Craig Johnson is the Production Manager of Arms and Armor and Secretary of The Oakeshott Institute. He has taught and published on the history of arms, armor and western martial arts for over 30 years. He has lectured at several schools and Universities, WMAW, HEMAC, 4W, and ICMS at Kalamazoo. His experiences include iron smelting, jousting, theatrical combat instruction and choreography, historical research, European martial arts and crafting weapons and armor since 1985

[@HobieH3]

I kept expecting Matt Easton to jump out every time you said "context".

[@bencoomer2000]

He sneezed each time it was said...

[@MrBottlecapBill]

This is why Fiore wants you to have a pointed cross guard. It just adds that little bit extra.

[@sinisterswordsman25]

I used to work demolition. Sheets of steel are pretty hard (impossible really) to break if you just hit them in them really hard. But if you pry them apart at the weak points that makes it much easier to shear them open. Haha my boss kept getting mad at me when I first started working there, he would tell me to "start" breaking something and come find him. I took "to long." Eventually he told me he was sorry for saying that because I did everything so cleanly and surgically. After a few jobs I got better at spotting weak points in things. I remember one job was an office building, the other guys were smashing up the walls with sledgehammers. I took down all the walls on a whole floor in a couple hours by pushing the walls from behind and popping out the screws. And instead of shoveling up rubble for hours, we just broke down the sheets of drywall with some box cutters, and in the garbage cart, they went. I did something similar to a industrial refrigerator. His mind was blown, lol

[@MrBottlecapBill]

Work smarter not harder.

[@lefthandedhemawithlordrami8220]

As I am the one who posted the original video onto the group, Thank you for taking the time to produce this response.

[@armsarmorinc.4153]

Our pleasure!

[@HEMA_Fight_Breakdowns]

HEY

[@jewishswordsman9199]

Regarding gauntlets: at a BOTN a fellas finger tip got cut off when one of the his finger scales got driven down and severed things at the joint.

[@armsarmorinc.4153]

Gross and interesting! The best combo 😊

[@jewishswordsman9199]

@@armsarmorinc.4153 have you read The Medical Realities Of Historic Wounds as in Spada 2?

[@gorbalsboy]

This was great, amazing who difficult it is to defeat armour,add the confusion of battle(imprecise blows,being jostled, slipping)and even light armour increases the chance of survival enourmlesly 😊

[@armsarmorinc.4153]

Thanks! Armor def helps you not die

[@AlitaGunm99]

@@armsarmorinc.4153 Not dying is usually good.

[@whyjay9959]

Broken connections, interesting... I tended to overlook them in my thinking.

[@armsarmorinc.4153]

Totally, it was one of the things we learned from breaking nice armor with accurate weapons!

[@PJDAltamirus0425]

You don’t have to kill them to be usefull. If the guy gets so jarred than he kneels over then js makes halfswording a gap or daggering a gap easier. If he drops his weapon , the fight gets a lot easier

[@armsarmorinc.4153]

For sure

[@henninghesse9910]

Though modern buhurt mentality isn’t useless it doesn't seem to reflect medieval risk assessment at all.

[@armsarmorinc.4153]

Yeah, I think it's similar to medieval tournament fighting where you are making a spectacle of prowess, but trying not to kill people ( but sometimes they died).

[@evanmorris1178]

Well said! A really good analysis. I bet you were really fun to have as a teacher/professor ( sorry, not sure ) !

[@armsarmorinc.4153]

Thank you 😊

[@richstone2627]

Very interesting. Thank you for sharing your time and knowledge.

[@armsarmorinc.4153]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@smokerxluffy]

World of armor, Armorsmith (Ukrainian buhurt smith, weird name tho lol) has an interesting video on the topic, too. But it's pretty long so I'll just link the juiciest bit (turn on captions for translation): kzbin.info/www/bejne/pqC5amCebMuZq6csi=pdKuku1ZWQ6YoB7s&t=723

[@armsarmorinc.4153]

That was interesting, thanks for sharing!

[@stefthorman8548]

also, an knight is surrounded by his footmen(houseguards), so if an knight is too badly injured, his entourage would drag him to safety, so disabling him or using him as hostage is preferable to get more men out of the battle

[@stefthorman8548]

btw, i'm BSing

[@Eulemunin]

Yay.

[@sfasdhga]

nice sword and interesting video. thanks.

[@armsarmorinc.4153]

Glad you enjoyed it

[@HEMA_Fight_Breakdowns]

You mean I didn't have to get hit in the head?!

[@armsarmorinc.4153]

All in the service of science 😊

[@TheVanguardFighter]

Do you do full contact sparring in armor ? Something I find compelling about hema fight breakdowns is he puts up footage of hims and other practicing techniques

[@armsarmorinc.4153]

Not full contact bohurt style, we try to apply the historical techniques for killing people in armor carefully so we don't run out of friends 😊

[@TheVanguardFighter]

@@armsarmorinc.4153 I meant do you practice things like throws and takedowns with full resistance? I come from a grappling background . But i rarely see any throws in Bohurt or hema videos despite them being shown in historical manuscripts

[@nevisysbryd7450]

​@@TheVanguardFighter They are often unsafe for a sport context. Floors and perimeters have to be _very_ carefully constructed and selected for throws to not present a risk of serious injury if throws and grapples are involved, and the dangers of falling on the weapons themselves are unavoidable. A much wider range of venues are viable if grappling is disallowed. While other factors are involved (the general athleticism and martial training outside of the individual weapon tends to be relatively low in the majority of HEMA practitioners), it is fundamentally difficult to make it safe in full-contact sparring.

[@TheVanguardFighter]

@@nevisysbryd7450 i find that very ironic given wrestling and other grappling styles is a a youth sport in my area

[@nevisysbryd7450]

@@TheVanguardFighter They absolutely are youth sports. They are bigger sports than HEMA, though, and with relatively uniform equipment and safety concerns whereas HEMA varies wildly from one group to the next, nor risk falling on a quillion, side-ring, nagel, etc.

[@frankknox9127]

Could you Mordhau with a Claymore Sword?

[@armsarmorinc.4153]

Sure!

[@FiliiMartis]

Nice! Now go find the Oakeshott fellow that is late with publications, or the apprentice that was late from the coffee break, and put them in the armour. That's allowed, right? 😇Sorry for the people that are waiting for their orders, productions will de delayed a bit, for science!😅 But seriously, I am so amazed to see the quillons taking the punishment. I know they are supposed to. But knowing something and seeing something is different. And since I can't repair them myself, I am not going to that with my own swords. Man, I wish I would be able to build my own swords! 😑

[@armsarmorinc.4153]

😊

[@PhuzzPhactor]

Bump

[@Eulemunin]

Obligatory out of context ahistorical comment.

[@dawnbreakerii204]

Uses a sword with the worst guard possible for mordhau strikes: a curved guard....

[@gorbalsboy]

No,your thinking of pinpoint force(direct violence)as opposed to blunt force(indirect violence)with equal force both will cause damage,simple physics sir😊

[@jewishswordsman9199]

​@@gorbalsboy a curved guard will direct the force away from the impact.