Will your Sony FX camera record RAW internally?

Is internal RAW on your Sony FX camera real or fake?
If you edit on DaVinci Resolve you may have noticed the 'Sony RAW' tab on the colour page. Is this marketing BS or really useful. I must admit I was shocked!
ProRes RAW to CinemaDNG converter - www.rawconvertor.com
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[@feederbrian9457]

Nikon’s acquisition of RED may be game changing. I don’t think they’ll open up the patent for general use, but I hope they’ll allow affordable licensing to unlock the format on cameras in the next generation.

[@Shuttterbugg]

Best we can hope for

[@rogrdotnet]

I believe the patent expires in 2028 anyway

[@marinrealestatephotography]

Extrashot is BAAACCCKKKK!!!! Really don't care WHAT you are talking about, just as long as you are talking to us!!! 😀 😀 😀

[@danielgoncalves3143]

Só true!

[@PhilHover]

Great video. We always appreciate your insight and knowledge. The new raw panel is just an improvement to already existing tools in DR. It’s not “raw” but it’s easier for people to understand the controls for log footage pre-LUT and pre-color. In any editor, whatever your do to the log footage pre-LUT will have more control than post LUT. DR correction tools have significantly improved over time and are superior to FCP & PP.

[@extrashot]

Thank you... I found DR to be a steep learning curve, but totally worth it. Can't help but think Sony and Blackmagic must be working together on this.

[@MagicTapioka]

Thanks for making this video! I learned a ton! 💖

[@bryankim1]

Thanks Paul for this precious information.👍

[@markfischerFPV]

Good stuff, and thanks for sharing your insights as usual. And also news to me. But I’m not using Resolve much these days.

[@arieljgd]

I've been using the hdr panel also and getting very good results in resolve. Maybe worth comparing with that too.

[@datamedicpr]

i just started using this Sony Raw last week im blow away how quick I'm able to work color !🤙 thanks for all this information

[@haxstir]

Good one. Thanks

[@jaswingrove]

mate awesome video as ALWAYS. only just coming around to testing this out myself. which flavour of XAVC did you shoot with?

[@limelightmuskoka]

Thoroughly Wonderful I am simply Gobsmacked this is great news. Hello Davinci I think we have some editing to do.

[@wenjun_n]

With such nice controls, I think it might be worth to pressure Sony to give us users the chance to up that bit rate in the internal xavc recording. I remember another person shared his testing on KZbin about the compression artefacts showing up in certain situations, that is even for XAVC SI, I’m not sure if the fx6 will suffer from the same issue as it uses mxf as its codec. That kind of artefacts will be problematic if you want to get a clean key, otherwise normal circumstances you won’t actually notice the issue without looking real hard.

[@christykail3314]

I think this is a really good demonstration of how little "raw" actually means. "Raw" controls are all just manipulating digital values in the same was as your grading controls, it's just the order of operations under the hood is different. BRAW and ZRAW are at least in some part pre-debayered, so is there really a fundamental difference between them and Sony's high bitrate XAVC? I think it's debatable. There's clearly a benefit here to changing colour temp pre-debayer, and that makes a lot of sense as the debayer algorithm will be influenced by the relative levels of the R, G, and B filtered photocites. The debayer has to interpolate the red and green values for blue filtered photocites, the red and blue for the green, etc., so I'm not surprised that having those relative levels closer to what you want before doing the interpolation yields better results. For luminance though, I think this demonstrates quite nicely that it doesn't hugely matter which side of the debayer process we do it on.

[@extrashot]

I think you're spot on... to be honest I didn't realise how marginal the results would be 👍

[@Ed-davies]

This was a fascinating insight, I wasn’t aware this existed.

[@extrashot]

Nor was I... they didn't publicise this much?

[@foreverdrift]

Thanks, I'm migrating from Premiere to DaVinci, so this is good to know!

[@extrashot]

I found it a steep learning curve at first, but totally worth it !

[@DennisSchmitz]

So is it possible to completely disable NR on the FX3 now, like on the FX6, 9, Burano and Venice? Would be great.

[@justadudeontheinternet650]

Excelent investigation.

[@DavidBattistella]

That is how to do a proper test. Front end back end. For the raw has a more natural and granular feel. Color and DR as well. But exposure is king. Nailing exposure is actually the key. Raw or not.

[@lukefoxwell]

So annoying that Davinci Resolve doesn't support Prores RAW and that the Atomos ninja doesn't give an option to record in CinemaDNG. Tbh this is the reason I haven't bought a Atomos ninja, I wasn't going to start converting my footage this isn't 2005. Sony All-intra is Netflix approved so good enough for me, great to see it holds up in your video.

[@DennisSchmitz]

Still the same video processing and H265/H264 codecs still. Although the FX3 and especially FX30 have great internal processing, even bypassing newer Panasonic cameras. The old S series was as good though.

[@tomdchi12]

In one part of my brain, I know that based on the math (which I can't actually do) with 10, 12 bit per channel and beyond, not so lossy compression, good color space and good tools, it should theoretically be possible to work with a non-raw image in almost the same way as raw in terms of color temp, exposure correction etc. But another part of my brain has built up the bias "once the image is fully debayered and compressed, there's not a ton you can do with it." I guess this is proving that more analytical first part true - between the compression in the camera, the quality of the transforms and the expansive working space within Davinci, we're getting to that theoretical near-ideal that you can get almost as much out of a compressed file as you can from a true raw file. That said, it would be nice if Nikon licensed out in-camera compressed RAW to everyone, not that RED should have been granted such an absurdly overly-broad patent in the first place.

[@extrashot]

So true!

[@Valleedbrume]

Great video

[@OctavianDunare]

Nikon buys Red. Salvation or "Under new management" patent trolling?

[@yawningmarmot]

I really wish DaVinci would offer this offer for Panasonic V-Log as well. It would be a huge help :)

[@schwarzhelmut]

Just curious - I have Davinci 18.6 studio and use Sony FX30 with XAVC S-I 4K codec, S-Log 3. However after importing and going to the color page the RAW controls are grayed out - so how did you activate them?

[@murohazzard]

He's using a different XACV Intra. You can do the same by converting your footage in Catalyst Browse: Here's how you do it. kzbin.info/www/bejne/i4StqKWAg7mMq68

[@denizahmet2299]

The firmware update for Sony A1 is said to be introducing XAVC H-I SQ 8k/30p 800 Mbps. I will be very interested to try this out with the observed workflow. Sounds like interesting times. (but yes the Nikon and RED move is strategically smart)

[@Humcrush]

I'm hoping this rumor is true, but not holding my breath. Sony's lack of firmware support for the A1, as I watched the Canon R5 and Nikon Z9 get update after update, makes it pretty likely my next camera won't be a Sony.

[@mr.shutterz5348]

Where did you hear this from? Publicly, Sony haven’t communicated that as part of their next firmware roadmap, it was very centred around the focus breathing comp etc.

[@Humcrush]

@@mr.shutterz5348 SonyRumors. Not a reliable source.

[@shawn3d]

@@mr.shutterz5348it’s a pretty solid rumor. Its most likely happening as it came from an excellent source

[@extrashot]

I hadn't heard that... but it would be useful.

[@BizarroTR]

Actually you can do it same thing already with sony catalyst prepare.

[@motionblurgamer]

I also think it is strange that Blackmagic doesn’t support ProRes RAW. It seems they generally have a good relationship with Apple. However someone pointed out to me that the reason may be a deal between Atomos and Apple. I don’t remember the details but it seems Atomos is not a fan of BM, and the deal with Apple may have included some sort of exclusion of BM at least for a couple of years. Atomos helped Apple launch ProRes RAW, and Atomos devices are still the main way to capture ProRes RAW. Hopefully that deal between Apple and Atomos was limited in duration, and that we may soon see inclusion in DaVinci Resolve. Maybe in Resolve 19 this year? XAVC is good in terms of dynamic range. The main benefit of RAW and 2 more bits per channel is in white balance. One reason the RAW you test here isn’t as good, it probably because DaVinci Resolve color science isn’t properly attuned to the footage. You have done your best, but I think Resolve would do a better job it if natively supported the files and could appropriately apply a Sony RAW profile. Regarding external RAW recording. I also hope Sony soon will allow external Blackmagic RAW like many other camera manufacturers.

[@RogueOriginFilms]

Its more like BM isn't a fan of Atomos. Some of the BM guys left BM to form atomos and apparently took some info they shouldn't have with them, or so its said, either way, the users are the ones who are suffering from it.

[@extrashot]

I didn't know about BM and Atomos falling out... makes more sense. Not sure about BRAW on Sony... thing is they already have XOCN on the cinema line, and that's brilliant?

[@MCplayer94]

Be more clear and tell which sony fx you used... Because fx3 and fx30 you need to convert in catalyst software to be able to see those settings unless we now can without conversion so please be clear and tell us what camera you used

[@skymakai]

It's the FX6 or FX9, because he stated early on in the video he's working with MXF files.

[@florisliesker]

Would this work on A7SIII footage as well?

[@extrashot]

I think it only works with imported MXF files... so in order for it to work with the A7Siii you'd need to transcode using Catalyst Browse. Then it should work fine. 👍

[@MechaUsagi]

@@extrashot Maybe it's possible by changing the metadata in the sidecar xml file from and A7Siii to report the footage as coming from an FX3. Does anyone have a clip + sidecar file (mp4 + xml) from an FX3 (or FX30) they can send me to test with?

[@CLIFFLIX]

Are we calling deBayered, H.264 compression "raw" now? Was this the FX6 using XAVC-I?

[@extrashot]

Sony seem to be... yes the FX6 was XAVC-I. What we need is a higher bit rate version!

[@skymakai]

I've done similar tests and always found Sony's internal S-Log3 to be extremely robust and easy to correct, even from drastic white balance mistakes. I can't imagine that the raw controls in Resolve are doing anything other than what can be done with the other color grading tools in Resolve. I'd like to test that, but I sold my FX6 for the FX3 and can't make MXF files anymore.

[@adalbertnetzer445]

There is a program with that you can merge both files of the FX3 (mp4 and meta data) so that davinci takes it like MXF file from FX6, but cannot remember the name…

[@skymakai]

@@adalbertnetzer445 Great... thanks?

[@Christharp]

blackmagic hating atomos must have something to do with prores raw

[@extrashot]

I didn't know about that... I need to do more research!

[@EndangeredMrmot]

​@@extrashotthe guy worked for black magic, he made an excel sheet to test what would happen to the market share if he made a competitor company, the excel sheet showed a victory. He then left black magic and made Atomos, the rest is history as they say.

[@willvazquez3218]

I still find shooting raw to give you a more organic look to the footage. The XAVC is a little softer and I think where you see it most is in motion. The motion cadence is more Alexa like if you shoot in raw than in XAVC.

[@GreatCassian]

You can do it since Davinci 18.5. But no it is not "RAW".

[@Mionwang]

ProRes raw is a totally useless format as it stands. With most cameras and recorders, it's only a 2 bit increase but it's way heavier. It doesn't store ISO or Gain as metadata. On top of all that it's not supported natively in Resolve. I don't know why people use it.

[@ReachAndTouch]

Just one question. WTF can one possibly be shooting to ever require RAW? Dune Part 3, perhaps? Can't imagine anything else that existing 'prosumer' codecs can't deal with. If someone's filming a TV commercial in RAW, they are probably doing it wrong.

[@atomka2433]

As a colorist, I truly love when I got raw footage.

[@extrashot]

I think that's the same thoughts I had!

[@mattdownn]

We shoot commercials in RAW all the time on the RED's. Commercials require quite intense grading and colours so RAW is necessary. Anything to make our lives easier 👍