William Buckley vs Christopher Hitchens (Part 2)

Undaunted by the Gandalf of conservatism, a young socialist from England called Christopher Hitchens steps forward in defense of liberalism. The third participant in this contest is R. Emmett Tyrrell, Jr. This is part 2.

[@royalzak2670]

I truly admire Hitchens wit, he has such a consistent flow and every response he makes is so perfectly articulated.

[@ddrose06]

Tyrell seems scared, and angry. He seems to know he's brought a hoola-hoop to a gunfight.

[@ultimatekotorfan]

I miss these conversations (minus Tyrell). I miss two men of differing opinions having an intelligent conversation.

[@DarthDefiler]

Wow! Hitch was even more witty and sharp when he wasnt drunk. Who knew?

[@shaunweston613]

8:47 "There's a very good book, with a title much similar to yours, a much better book..." burn of the century.

[@geniusofmozart]

I love how Buckley starts getting disgruntled after being astounded by the sheer intellect of young Hitchens.

[@vonteflon]

The whole minute following that moment was total ownership by Hitchens. Such a classy debater.

[@PhilWithCoffee]

I can't but feel bad for Tyrrell, he's so out-classed by Mr. Hitchens and Mr. Buckley. This is really fascinating to watch and listen to, thank you.

[@KevinCody1964]

imagine if we all had access to the education these men had...Tyrrell gotta look him up now thanks. For some reason he looks like Norm MacDonald to me..LOL

[@TheSlaughterhaus5]

hitchens never ceases to amaze me. Even when he became somewhat of an apologist for the Wolfowitz Doctrine and the Iraq War (which I didn't happen to agree with 100%) he still explained it with such eloquence and intellectual fortitude. I will always respect and admire him.

[@afaircomment]

"I know there's a joke there that I missed.." Too easy for him against that silly little turd.

[@BarrelShape]

This made me lol. Thank you, I needed that.

[@zorgzarg9849]

"I'm quite happy to grant that a woman would have to be happy-go-lucky to associate with you" .... haha.

[@vatoencabronado]

"I have not read his books"... thanks for confirming what I already knew :)

[@ValkyrieZiege]

; Thank! You! For Posting!

[@ThinkTank255]

"And that poverty is exacerbated by the decline in marriage, and the subsequent breakdown of family life,..." UTTER NONSENSE.

[@geniusofmozart]

From what I saw, Hitchens outclassed them all, and they were seemingly quite surprised at Hitchens' intellect, especially Buckley, who was out of his depth and was demolished intellectually by Hitchens. He could clearly see that Hitchens was a rising star.

[@Scias]

The host is either overdosed on poshness, or about to fall asleep ^^

[@LucisFerre1]

Thanks you.

[@amarmirza08]

It's fun to watch Hitchens beat the hell out of these two. Very impressive to dismiss Buckley so easily. Since this is so old, historical perspective makes Hitchens the clear victor.

[@TheSpoonwood]

thank god we've come as far as we have ... this is amazing . Fuck this is 30years ago..!!!

[@paradigmstudiosca]

Whereas I love the "Americanised" Hitchens (his positions clarified by age and further reading as he progessed), I can't deny the awe and inspiration I get from watching this early footage of him. Sheer brilliance!

[@Scrapheap71]

well, there's 2 intellectual titans going at it here, I enjoy the fireworks.

[@suffern63]

A time long gone,which,I fear,will not be coming back

[@markpmar0356]

In these days of even-lower-information conservatives encroaching on the nation's capital and in the media, I miss the erudition and measured responses of Buckley. I don't agree with him, but he was one of the best examples of thoughtful conservatism in his day. The loss of both Buckley and Hitchens is a blow to discourse everywhere.

[@Pughie20]

Its interesting to see Buckley's demeanor towards Hitchen's in this video you can see even though they have extremely different views, there is a mutual respect for each others intelligence and use of language.

[@Sandedoremi]

Buckley and Hitchens develop a dulcet-toned groove as they settle into a debating rhythm. Suddenly Tyrrell's jarring voice and almost non-sequitur responses come out of nowhere. I kept wanting to adjust Tyrrell's collar so it would sit properly.

[@crazyhead74]

Uploader, when was this originally broadcast? Thanks for posting

[@relarerfhjk]

You have the advantage of not needing to come up with any witticisms of your own (my apologies if you've already tried and I missed it...but so did everyone else), since every post and every sentence is unintentionally hilarious. You are a walking, talking comedy :) A natural, so to speak. Oh, I just presumed you were a granny because of the "kiddo" refrain, and the profile picture.

[@jmedlin81]

Well said.

[@relarerfhjk]

I heard the response, which didn't even get close to answering the point. In the first sentence of Hitchens response, he concedes that "your argument is much more challenging for my position", which was a hilarious understatement. By"challenging" he meant "devastating" lol. When he said "behave yourselves" he was paraphrasing Hitchens own claim that even radical feminists would ultimately return to the family values they so despised, once they were sufficiently "emancipated".

[@keyvet]

Buckley is like : wow, unlike the other guests this young man is a serious debater with a range of vocabulary larger than mine

[@H1TMANactual]

"...is what happens when people fall prey to others interpretations" No I actually told you I have read plenty of his works, just not his books. So again your criticism is the FORMAT I read his work. This, boys and girls is what happens when semi-literate Chomsky cultists don't actually read or hear what's being said, only what they want to hear.

[@navigator3744]

Re: Assertion that the woman's movement resulted in an increase in the abandonment of families by women. The fact is that prior to the movement, many women felt forced to stay in unhappy marriages due to social pressures and stereotypes promoted by men in order to control women. The "movement" simply freed many women to do what they always wanted to do.

[@selinakyle4054]

I think I just fell in luv with Christopher Hitchens here.

[@LJY08]

He was arrogant towards what he perceived to be closed mindedness. The interviews that get published with Hitch are the interviews where he's combative. However, he was capable of real charm and warmth with people he was comfortable with and who he felt were reasonably intelligent and capable of intelligent debate or conversation. Hitch was all about unconditional love and compassion and despised anyone who wasn't; a gorgeous man.

[@LucisFerre1]

One really can't blame the common man for falling short of Buckley and Hitchens, who where both preeminent pugilistic pontificators in polemics. Whilst Tyrrel is completely frustrated with Hitchens, Buckley is enjoying himself immensely dealing with the man who can't be cornered on any issue.

[@relarerfhjk]

No, I'm saying we should get rid of the 1960's divorce reforms that made marrriages so easy to break up and deterred so many men from marrying (fearing they could lose property, money children etc to a divorce lawyer) and then restore the priveleges in the tax and legal system which marriage deserves, as a path to restoring its rightful status as the most desirable family structure in society.

[@NeuroDeviant421]

is the 'metrazol' thing supposed to be subliminal?

[@sidDkid87]

Naturally - Hitch didn't have many equals in this regard - I miss him - thank goodness we have tools like KZbin to preserve Hitch's rapier wit

[@Nicene325ad]

I noticed that, too.

[@BarrelShape]

Yup. Now what you get is Bill O'Reilly and Phil Donahue shouting over each other.

[@LJY08]

Oh, more respect to him. He looks like he's having a good time!

[@ReediculousB]

I love Hitchens. And I love how in every video I watch of him, he looks hungover. I'm hungover right now. It's 10pm here.

[@johnsinger302]

I completely agree with PhilWithCoffee - R. Emmett Tyrrell is left hopelessly in the dust, compared to the intellectual prowess of Buckley and, especially, Hitchens. Tyrell is akin to bringing a jug of corn liquor to a champagne party. And his "American Spectator" is the worst sophomoric polemicist rag you could hope to find.

[@Cyberdactyl]

One of the early corpses in the long history of debate with the Hitch.

[@AtheistCitizen]

@relarfhik: maudlin nostalgia. One always raises one's family as best one can in the ever evolving societal environment, always in context, responsive to current social pressures, advocating values influenced by one's upbringing and experience.. The family is fine. The family is not a static concept.

[@relarerfhjk]

That phrase is rather different to your earlier contemptuous description of it as a "document" that's "sprinkled" with religion (whatever that means) in the context of dismissing it as unnecessary. I wasn't referring to state's rights, but rather the fact that support for marriage is fundamental to conservative philosophy since marriage is a buttress of private life & liberty, the means by which self-sufficient families support themselves and pass morals, traditions etc onto their kids

[@ProjectBlackBox_TM]

Young Hitch was a pretty good lookin' fellow!

[@Sandedoremi]

CORRECTION: Tyrrell's suit collar jacket so it would sit properly.

[@relarerfhjk]

It does not "do little more than split property" it is (or was, until liberal divorce reforms) a lifelong binding public promise that provides children with security and stability and an example in their lives of adults making and keeping promises, and safeguards liberty and private life, by enabling parents to support and provide for their own children and pass on their morals and traditions to them. Marriage is the building block of a stable successful society.

[@RainmanCT]

well said sir

[@FrankSlade1983]

How do you figure that?

[@ThinkTank255]

"You are wrong-the US Census Bureau compared unmarried mothers to married mothers-and rates of poverty and extreme poverty were four times higher." YOU are wrong. "But poverty statistics date only to 1959, and the poverty rate for single mothers - which is a better indicator than the total number - is still relatively low, despite a recent rise. It was 31.6 percent in 2010, the 37th highest rate in 52 years. The highest rate was 42.9 percent in 1962." - FactCheck

[@unfad1ng]

where is the part 3?

[@markphc99]

Is there a part 3?

[@donluchitti]

in the first Video, Buckley and Hitchens try to out snark each other. Their face after each diatribe confirms it.

[@lewars1912]

02:20 People are free to call a thing whatever they wish.

[@rpoofus]

Heavy on innuendo, light on facts... Are you the angry red-headed guy in the debate who didn't get to talk? You certainly sound like him.

[@navigator3744]

RE: WFB's calling America's withdrawal from Viet Nam an "abandonment," history has shown that America's withdrawal was the right thing to do and that Mr. Buckley's characterization was wrong. The "domino theory" has been proven to be false. Viet Nam was unified, has acted responsibly as a country and has not tried to impose "communism" on its neighbors. Untold numbers of lives were saved, social upheavals in the U.S. ended, and America was widely considered to have done the right thing.

[@Livinghighandwise]

Lol - Great observation.

[@relarerfhjk]

Hitchens was very articulate and intelligent. But the funny thing is that, decades on, we can now see it was Buckley and Tyrell who turned out to be right, and Hitchens who was laughably wrong in everything he said The family hasn't been repaired, as Hitchens thought it would be,its disintegrated. Single women and fatherless families are the fastest-growing demographics in America, while entitlement spending keeps rising through the roof as the state replaces the father as provider.

[@Kekuahiwi]

I'll go even further with one of your premises; Tyrell is completely outclassed and outwitted by Hitchens. The poor man is simply flummoxed by Hitchens at every turn. His vacuous and effete attempts to best Hitchens, and slight success to enroll Buckley in buttressing his poor showing simply reveal the man for the little he truly represented at the time, and I'd venture to say, that he does today. Who, of late ever hears reference to Tyrell, or even the utterance of his name?

[@WORLD8NSH5KNIGHT1]

The title implies there is only two people debating here; a bit unfair on the third guy....

[@noahgentry9256]

"With the exception of the thirty-odd per cent of the population who live one paycheck away from financial ruin and homelessness (not to mention the fifteen per cent or so of the REAL unemployed), this is a rich country." "With the exception of the invasions of Iraq, repeated drone strikes on innocent civilians in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Yemen, the invasion of Panama, the invasion of Grenada (I feel I'm leaving a few out) this is a country with a just foreign policiy." American exceptionalism.

[@MizQue]

University of Indiana vs. Oxford University. No contest. WFB really did speak as if he had lock-jaw.

[@kevieboi]

Hitchens in 2010 - "I still think like a Marxist in many ways. I think the materialist conception of history is valid. I consider myself a very conservative Marxist".

[@jimmbo13]

Could we simply have had only Buckley and Hitchens on this panel?

[@relarerfhjk]

They've already debated in public. Needless to say, Buckley annihilated Hitchens.

[@ThinkTank255]

"And do you think more, or less people are "poor and dependent on Government" now that far LESS mothers have a husband to support them?" FAR less people are poor and dependent on government today than in the past IN PROPORTION to the population. Furthermore, as the population grow it becomes INCREASINGLY difficult to provide high quality resources to ALL citizens. Inevitably power and money will concentrate. So, considering all this, we are doing AMAZINGLY well as far as poverty.

[@dstreamerII]

Christopher's position is much more decent. He understands that if women of the U.S. have been oppressed by the Christian industrial wage-slave system, that they will have to burst out. You don't creep by on the tips of your toes. You must have a moment to stand in the sun. He says that the negative consequences associated with the liberation, were indeed caused by the initial suppression and are thus unavoidable, and are unattributable to those that have sought deliverance from oppression.

[@relarerfhjk]

Oh it's certainly happened-in the 60's the feminists used to call marriage a "concentration camp"-the liberal divorce laws etc were enacted with specific purpose of weakening it.

[@SmelOdies]

More Hitchens on Firing line!

[@f0xygem]

Thank you. I was wondering whom that dweeb was.

[@SuperPunchout3]

3:19 XD

[@USERNAMEfieldempty]

Has Buckley had a stroke?

[@OneBigRetard]

But Hitch's response is that of a master wit.

[@relarerfhjk]

The problems certainly do not originate from the Republicans-both parties have presided over the destruction of marriage that began in the 1960's.

[@WORLD8NSH5KNIGHT1]

Hitchens looks a bit like Richard Madeley from the side

[@VenomOXP]

To watch Hitchens beat Tyrrell over the head with his own anti-feminist words was equal parts impressive and delicious.

[@CameSawConquered47]

Haha, spot on!

[@pbmdh]

Pretty sure in the first video of this he declares himself a socialist, so I'm not sure where you got that.

[@ProjectBlackBox_TM]

I thought he was until I saw his face.

[@DomVeit]

Good stuff... I eagerly await the remaining parts. Funny thing, I think this is really supposed to be Hitchens vs the other douchebag, but this is not even a contest. Buckley is 'moderating'. I think Buckley and Hitchens spar better, and I would even give Hitchens the edge.

[@loggats]

it's... cute.... that you think those are "big" words (fairly obvious the poster was going for a little alliterative humour) ;)

[@inxiti]

Was listening in the background, and I tabbed over to pause it only to discover the old rude woman was a dude with short curly hair... I 100% would've bet money on him being a woman, oh my god...

[@relarerfhjk]

Tyrell was hopeless-whereas Buckley, a true conservative, demolished Hitchens arguments-particularly at 11:59 to 13:59

[@Connatiah1]

It is sorta like comparing apples to oranges. First, we have NAFTA and GATA. Second, we are facing peak oil. Third, we are facing larger numbers of workers, and workers that are educated. Fourth, we are facing the worst Congress in history lead by Republican obstructionalist. Fifth, look at the two unfunded wars by GW and their true cost and debt upon the nation. GW knew we were in trouble way back in 2003. To correct the problem we must put money into the hands of the populus, not the banks.

[@shawnomancy]

When even Buckley calls a conservative on his BS (01:48), said conservative needs to go home and stop making the Right look even worse.

[@Appocratesthegreat]

I'm so glad I'm not the only one that noticed that load of bullshit

[@BarrelShape]

I wonder if Chris Hitchens' right-wing brother has ever debated William F. Buckley's left-wing son?

[@amarmirza08]

One, what is you measure of an "economy being stronger"? While we may have been dominating those countries, we were certainly not the most powerful nation in the world. That occurred after World War II. As for the tie in with the banks, I would like to learn more about that stuff. I have looked into it a bit, but most of what I see are conspiracy theories. I love to learn though. :)

[@bhvanoffelen]

US GDP Q1 2009 = $13.92 trillion per year; Q3 2012 = $15.78 trillion per year (nominal, seasonally adjusted). Any person who understands numbers would call that growth. Technically, more than a tenth of a percent too.

[@Syntagama]

Funny there is not more Buckley versus Hitchens. Could it be that Buckley was afraid of Hitchens?

[@ThinkTank255]

I work mainly in biotech research, but everywhere I go I see research being done on "security" and "tracking". These are BY FAR some of the most popular fields to study. Frankly, it sickens me. But I don't think the Left has anything to do with that. If anything, here in the United States, the nanny state is tied to the Right than anything else, of course, starting with Bush.

[@MYPOSTINGCAREERcom]

lmao at hitchens humorlessly attacking tyrrell's mockery of feminists

[@dariancounts7008]

he always remained true to his principles.

[@kevieboi]

All developed economies are mixed economies comprised of both socialist and market economic theory. Norway being the most developed country (HDI), has encompassed more socialist values relative to other developed countries.

[@thesethreekings]

Anybody reading this will appreciate that the idea of Christopher Hitchens considering himself a "Jew" after spending a decade trying to bring down organised religion is beyond ridiculous, and saying he was "pleased to find out" where is mother comes from, still does not make him a Jew, any more than it makes him a fish for having evolved from one. He had too many right and left sensibilities to consider himself one of the other, i'm not going to quote for you again, do your own research.

[@thesethreekings]

Also, i don't think that your original comment that he was a lefty Jew was intended to be ironic, unless i'm wrong. But again i can't see the irony in just saying that alone.