Wind Tunnel Secrets EXPOSED! Mark Cote Spills the Beans on Cycling's Future! | MGTV Interview

[@chrisridesbicycles]

So awesome to hear this conversation. I can 100% relate to this as an engineer. The „you have to make the boss think it was his idea“ and „ordering something just before the budget cuts“. Apart from being good at your on field of expertise, these are the key skills to „play on the instrument“ that is a big company.

[@m.ncycles]

First off, love Mark Cote. Second, the point on Fashion makes a ton of sense. I'm no longer in the camp of questioning UCI's sock height rule. It's actually guarding a sacred aspect of this sport, lol.

[@davidlilja9180]

Looking forward to Pts 2, 3, 4, ....& the 'one' on PhD theses too. Mark is a cool guy with lots of experience we'd all like to hear more of, and Josh, your animation so obviously increased, too! :) Can we have more MGTV episodes like this, where you chat with others, like Mark, who have moved on from industry roles and are happy to speak frankly? This added such insight to our evolving, yet traditional, yet understandably profit focused cycling industry. Track team development engineers come to mind, as their budgets can sometimes seem almost unlimited. Their profit motive is often just a gold medal. Josh, maybe a MGTV/podcast on 'thermals'; what's this about and where could it lead us, especially if it's related to auto radiator type needs vs effects on this ever warming planet. For now, I'm guessing that the better the aero position of a rider (eg helmet vents), the less heat transfer may be occurring, thus more overheating potential and ultimate power loss/limitation.

[@Darth_Firebolt]

Silca Velo Thesis review sounds incredible.

[@CatManDoSocial]

Excellent episode! Josh, you mentioned that you and Steve Hed didn't get along very well. I knew that you guys weren't best friends but I never knew why. If it's not to personal, I'd love to know. Was it just that you were tough competitors in the same space? Personality differences? Thanks!

[@EricAbbottTri]

Would LOVE to hear what ideas came from the Tuesday night Intern sessions.

[@paulsolon6229]

What is the fastest rear disc? Fastest front disc? Use these discs w what tire? At what width? At what tire pressure? Are tubulars still faster than clinchers?

[@hms350]

Super interesting, thank you. I was not super interested in the topic but when MIT was mentioned at the start I was "all in". Family member is attending the school and studying mechanical engineering and math. Being a cycling geek, whenever I am on campus I always take a photo in front of the wind tunnel building. Still trying to get the family member interested in cycling tech to possibly create some interesting stuff. Perhaps Mark has a suggestion on how to engage the family member.

[@casualguy393]

6:00 - 7:00 I am not an engineer, but I always knew that overcoming aerodynamics is monumental in increasing speed, yet even now when I am riding my "high racer" recumbent I meet DF (diamond framed) riders and show them my CdA right in front of their face to compare with theirs, and show them my power meter data during a ride it doesn't do squat. I love my DF bike. It is amazing. But just like there are classes in automobile or motorcycle racing, there are numerous classes of HPV (Human Powered Bicycles) bicycles and trikes that are much faster than even TT/Tri bikes. Get this, on a 2-wheel Streamliner, the World Record on a flat road with virtually zero wind is 89.5mph (144kph) at Battle Mountain for an HPV. The 1 hour record is about 55mph (90kph). Both of those are very purpose built bikes, but between DF and Streamliners is A LOT of wiggle room for a ton of fun. Velomobiles are in that area and making a surge. 8:30 "... find almost nothing..." Yep. When marketers have to put an asterisk next to a claim on watt savings or speed gains you know you are getting pantsed.

[@bpfastfeet25]

What is the ballpark penalty for those helmets that tried dimples on the leading surface, compared to a similar helmet with a smooth front surface? (assuming both helmets are generally a good fit for the rider's anatomy)

[@derekdudek925]

Cote is the MAN

[@johnhunt3076]

The only time I had a good ride at the Tour of the Gila Time Trial was on a crazy windy day and a Nimble Crosswind front wheel. Coincidence?

[@paulsolon6229]

What is fastest helmet? Most aero pedals? Are these new pedals worth it? What is fastest bb? Do you recommend ceramic speed? Best/fastest cranks?

[@robertchung4914]

I like this episode so much.

[@jacekkapela6754]

Chewbacca Scale. I love that one :)

[@TracKnGravelDeWd]

Out of curiosity, you spoke about the corima front wheel that was super aero. Was that the 3 or 4 spoke with that round surface area at the hub?

[@SILCAVelo]

It was a Mavic 3G

[@paulsolon6229]

Why are tri bikes faster than Tour de France tt bikes?

[@robdogracing]

That was awesome!

[@RadCJ33]

Did you see the DT Swiss patent for aero tires? It sounds like what you are describing. But I still struggle to see how that can work without a huge increase in rolling resistance.

[@RadCJ33]

By the way, I bought a set of Mavic 3G for 450 USD and sold them for 550 a few years later... still regret I sold them.

[@paulsolon6229]

Wd not that pinwheel wheel work on the track indoor? No cross wind in that environment….

[@stevoc123]

Great chat. I’d be interested to hear if either of you have ever investigated the subject of fenders/ mudguards, and if they could make the bike more aero.

[@MITaerobike]

We did some Win Tunnel testing on the Sirrus and Turbo e-bikes for how wind, wheel spin affects spray w various fenders - was a cool test with a slip n' slide and a pool, but we weren't measuring drag. With regards to reducing drag utilizing fenders, I never did this specifically for reducing drag but "assume" (which means it needs to be tested!) that frontal area and shape would negatively affect drag. I'd expect, unless designed as a fairing, that production ready mud guards would likely increase drag. There's always a chance that a butt/backsaver off of the saddle/seatpost could be good, but I wouldn't expect the benefits to be huge if so.

[@veganpotterthevegan]

There are aero fenders. A friend of mine tested them for jollies. They had poor fitment with his bike and tires and I can't remember the numbers he found but the gains were significant

[@stevoc123]

What brand were they @@veganpotterthevegan

[@veganpotterthevegan]

@@stevoc123 Null Winds

[@julianallen515]

What a fascinating and entertaining 'pod and maxed out with the cobble gobbler anecdote! LoL. What did you mean by pinwheeling for the Nimble crosswinds? I had a pair which I completed five IMs on either as a pair or front and rear Renn disc. At 155lb I didn't have any handling problems with them and always yearned of 3rd party aero data.

[@MITaerobike]

Think of a pinwheel or a windmill - if the wind blows head on or even at an angle to the blades, the blades spin. The same is true of some wheel shapes. If you cut a Nimble Crosswind in half, it kind of looks like a pinwheel. So if the apparent wind is coming from the side of the bike (crosswind), it will actually create a rotation torque that will spin the wheel. What Josh was mentioning that depending upon the frame, rear wheel, rider, the Nimble Crosswinds OR other wide carbon spoked wheels in this type of movement could create some weird pressure imbalances around the fork axis making holding down that front wheel with constant steering feel near impossible. This is the concept - not necessarily saying one wheel or another will exhibit this behavior. Everyone's experience will be a bit unique!

[@julianallen515]

@@MITaerobike Thanks Mark, for the clear explanation. I had to google Pinwheel, I see it's what N America calls a child's handheld windmill! Despite living in Vancouver BC for 15 years I'd not heard that one before. It was great to have your knowledge as well as funny and informative anecdotes. Hope to hear more of you on AJA.

[@MITaerobike]

@@julianallen515 sorry was speaking American and barely even English! Thanks Julian

[@julianallen515]

@@MITaerobike LOL!

[@julianallen515]

@@MITaerobike You know what George Bernard Shaw said? "Two nations separated by a common language!"

[@stevoc123]

Awesome 🤩

[@m.talley1660]

Fashion vs the old school way of pros and belief in their own brute force to overcome unseen advantages. Still a problem today but less-so is amusing.

[@paulsolon6229]

Does Mr Cote have access to any wind tunnel now?

[@paulsolon6229]

Is diamondback andean fastest tri bike in world? Why do no top triathletes use this bike in Hawaii?

[@craigmccall7450]

Optics vs results. A careful balance. 😅

[@larryt.atcycleitalia5786]

I hoped you would discuss these "aero bras" (for lack of a better name) as in the practice of stuffing something down the front of the suit. WTF this and that "chin-fairing" thing are allowed is beyond me! Obvious attempts to do nothing other than improve the drag situation like this should be banned!

[@paulsolon6229]

Not really interesting to athletes. To min 25…. An engineer tho wd appreciate

[@bradleybabel4814]

Cobble gobler… 😝