Why Traditional Gender Norms Are Back

Go to buyraycon.com/... for 15% off your order, plus get free domestic or flat fee international shipping. Brought to you by Raycon.
Are Trad Wives the New Hipsters?
Nostalgia for traditional values has been cropping up in weird ways, like TikTok trad wives or online outrage about sex scenes in movies. So why are so many people looking to the past to navigate the present? And does doing so prevent us from thinking meaningfully about the future? Let’s find out in this Wisecrack Edition: Can Nostalgia Be Toxic?
Support us on Patreon! ► / wisecrack
=== Watch More Episodes! ===
Men's Wellness: How It Exploits Your Insecurities ► • Men's Wellness: How It...
How To Manufacture A Moral Panic ► • How to Manufacture a M...
Peterson Misses The Point of Postmodernism ► • Peterson Misses The Po...
Written by Amanda Scherker
Researched by Michael Lodato
Hosted by Michael Burns
Directed by Michael Luxemburg
Edited by Andrew Nishimura
Produced by Olivia Redden
Music courtesy of Epidemic Sound
#TradWives #Manosphere #Wisecrack
© 2023 Wisecrack / Omnia Media, Inc. / Enthusiast Gaming

[@WisecrackEDU]

Go to buyraycon.com/wisecrack for 15% off your order, plus get free domestic or flat fee international shipping. Brought to you by Raycon.

[@dominickjasso5500]

You were really need to dig deeper on this on the live show with us, this is so freaking good by getting down to the existential behavior that's sucking the oxygen in are culture

[@SergioBocanegra]

traditional catholic values of get married young and divorce is a sin, kept my mom trapped in a Dysfunctional Marriage with my Insane Father. i went to a catholic Private School During my Teenage years where the Nuns Wanted to teach that sex should only be Done when married and that Abortion was a Sin therefore i answered that i wish my mom aborted me and that i didn't Believe in God, i brought a book east asian Philosophy one day and the kids Called me Heretic. all this happen in Colombia so there traditional gender Roles collided with my modern ideas wanting to Study Computer Science and i wanted Gender Equality mainly because i was always treated as the bad guy if i Disagreed with a girl even a little bit.

[@donnybarcenaslara6775]

Nostalgia is a double-edge blade. It takes us back to times when life seemed "simpler", and at the same time it makes us realize how cruel the world can be. On the other hand, nostalgia resorts on memories linked to artistic expressions such as movies, music, books, and also video-games. The hazard with this line of thinking is that, it makes us forget how capitalism paved its way to make life harder for the working class, precarizing lifestyle. You can feel nostalgic about 80's music, omiting that in the 80's, the US government made people double their consumption, and engage in credit debts. Reagan also supported dictatorships in Central America, Africa and Asia. In the 90s, you can feel nostalgic about grunge or Brit pop, but the USA invaded Irak, and the NATO carried out a genocide in Kosovo. Or in the 2000s you can remember Numetal or Pop punk, but George W Bush destroyed Irak and Afganisthan out of lies. All these ateocities converged in the 2008 debt crisis, from which most companies took advantage of to precarize the working class, and leading most of the people to mental illnessess such as depression, anxiety, anguish, etc. And I think people find nostalgia nowadays to escape this hammster-wheel we are trapped on.

[@ashroskell]

Slight side question here but, Did Liberty Macenea invent a new word? “Precarity,” was always, “precariousness,” in my dictionary. I’m interested because I’ve noticed that the rate at which new words and terms are entering the English lexicon seems to be increasing? And with speedier changes in language, comes speedier changes in thought and the very tools we use to communicate those changes: our words. This is very much your bailiwick, as the philosophical implications of our language changing at an increasing rate, to accommodate new ideas, new ways of thinking and expressing thoughts, songs, novels, scripts and ideas, is potentially profound. I just find that fascinating, because it is also reflected in the world wide reaction to gender fluidity, and this, “Trad-Wife,” thing seems like a, “conservative,” with a small, “c,” reaction to that. I think it’s an expression of fear at a world changing into a place we don’t recognise from our childhoods. Whether that’s a good or bad thing will depend on your politics to a large degree. So, it will be the exceptions that will be most interesting, culturally. But, I did have to laugh out loud, quite literally, at hearing all that stuff about the, “Catholic Aesthetic.” My gut reaction was, “Yeah, only the priests, cardinals and the pope are allowed to spend hours getting all dolled up, to impress the little kids, right?” Nevertheless, I am fascinated to see how this one pans out. It was news to me until I watched this video, but then, I’m older than god and twice as pissed off. But, I would be equally fascinated to hear a Wisecrack discussion on language, (with the implications of chat-bots and other influences) most of all with reflections on the rapid pace of change. Is that a real thing, or does it just seem that way?

[@ashroskell]

@@SergioBocanegra : Sounds like you went to hell and back? You have my sympathy. My comment was about language (above) but the Catholic tradition of controlling language is literally thousands of years old. Inherited by the pontiffs who predated them. Did you have a sense of the way the mysteries of the important services are all conducted in Latin, with full knowledge that the congregation does not speak it and is, therefore, reliant on these, “wizards,” to interpret it for them? The Catholics have been masters of using language as a control mechanism for countless generations. As to your actual experiences, I cannot relate to them directly, except in the sense of experiencing cruelty and hypocrisy at the hands of those entrusted with my care and education. So I feel deeply for you, knowing that these are experiences that can never be fully recovered from. Rather, they are ones that can be mastered and survived. Anyone who tells you that you cannot overcome them and find a good to come out of them, is wrong. That is a fact. Thanks for sharing what must be very painful memories, and entrusting this crowd with them. You obviously don’t lack courage. ✌️

[@barbiedesoto7054]

Like Dorothy on Golden Girls said to when Blanche she was wishing for “the days of chivalry”: “How far back do you want to go, Blanche? You want to be able to vote?”

[@thedevicebook]

Right, and yet Blanch being delightfully promiscuous (I enjoyed rooting for it actually) would have been even more attacked pre-women-can-vote than it is today. Except today a slew of internet trolls can threaten you with harm & tell everyone your address so it's also pretty awful to be attacked for such things in current times.

[@lonefire333]

I've seen too many women calling for their own suffrage to be removed. It's astonishing what reactionary ideology can do.

[@conservativesaresymps]

I adore that show, in spite of its dated flaws.

[@tompatterson1548]

@@thedevicebook Would it though? In medieval times it was kind of assumed.

[@thedevicebook]

@@tompatterson1548 unless one pinpoints the time period, and part of the world, one can't really be as generalized as my statement was. My bad. I actually love history so hearing a bit more which location & time period you meant could teach me something new.

[@mistyhaney5565]

It's far easier to be nostalgic for a past that one didn't actually live through.

[@ryanweible9090]

an old joke of mine is that nostalgia is a deep seated affection for a time that never happened. people look at sitcoms, which were basically censored and had to run through not offending southern ultraconservatives by having any black people on them. but the actual world of that time was not at all like that.

[@ComputersAndLife]

Yeah, another form of escapism and oversimplification of life in order to make it make sense and be easier to process. When in reality there is no shortcut to dealing with the hard things and working through them. Trying to do otherwise leads to more pain.

[@jonhinson5701]

Well said, Misty and very true.

[@lorenzomizushal3980]

What nonsense are you spouting, most people are nostalgic for their more energetic days those days where they can say they actually "lived"

[@mistyhaney5565]

@@lorenzomizushal3980 How many people do you know that lived in the 1950's who are nostalgic for that time?

[@RobGradyVO]

imo theres nothing wrong with wanting to be Trad, its a problem when you feel that EVERYONE needs to be Trad.

[@LuisSierra42]

Can't we all just get along?

[@RobGradyVO]

@@LuisSierra42 is what I'm sayin to people lmfaoooo. Like chill. It's not that serious who marries who and does what in the relationship

[@ДмитроДорофеєв]

@@RobGradyVO unless they directly harm others, are factually wrong or try to enforce their beliefs on everyone. Other than that, you're spot on

[@RobGradyVO]

@@ДмитроДорофеєв I mean yeah. I just hope that kinda stuff is like....Common Knowledge? But then Again everytime I turn on the news that gets put in doubt lmfao

[@alexl1178]

Exactly. Just let people live how they want to when its not harming anyone. Getting super opinionated, judgemental and imposing your beliefs on how people are living is super weird, esp when these people have nothing to do with you and who do not directly affect your life outside of conversations and metaphorical comment wars. There is never one correct way of life and way of living, not even in our individual lifetimes. We change and adjust our lives according to our own needs, contraints and opportunities.

[@equitesloricatus6035]

"I'm so traditional," she said, updating her Tiktok.

[@bas_ee]

Divorcing your husband after he beats you across the room? Thats not very traditional nou, is it. These woman just like the aspect of not working and the clothing lol. Put them in a time machine 60 years ago, and they come crying back lol

[@Rainbow_dash67.]

@@bas_eecan a Time Machine travel to the beginning of the universe or before the big bang

[@JP-ve7or]

I often think about a button/badge I once saw that read, "Why do we get nostalgic for things that sucked in the first place?" Yeah. I think about that a lot. I empathize with young women who are into the tradwife aesthetic and what they think it means. However, I'm old enough to remember how normal domestic abuse used to be. If these girls today got hit by their husbands, they could press charges. They could get divorced. They could--for now, to some extent, depending which state they live in--control their reproductive choices. Working women fought for that, and still do to protect our rights. We can't all retreat from harsh reality into a past we never had to live through.

[@kellharris2491]

This! While I don't look down on being a SAHM I see so many young girls trying to glamorize being a kept girlfriend and I am like what will happen when your bf gets tired of you? And so many SAHMs even now post about the control their husband has over all the money. The truth is so many modern guys don't respect SAHM wives at all.

[@annnee6818]

Exactly. How the police would find it normal to say "don't argue back next time" while you were sitting there, shaking, black and blue, while they reluctantly take his drunk ass to jail for the night. And you had NO.WHERE.TO.GO. I get men craving this. Small insecure men who don't have anything to offer that would make a woman stay willingly. Women however? Get outta here, ya pick me.

[@VanityDivined]

@@annnee6818it’s mostly liberal men who are creeps and abbuse women nowadays. It’s you who are the pick-me. But don’t worry, at least for me, I’ll live my happy traditional life and not tell anyone anything about it

[@vanessac8193]

​@@VanityDivined source?

[@geraltofriffia210]

@@VanityDivined Besides the entire internet just now?

[@BlinkSh0t]

Normalize bathing after a sex scene and not running out to work.

[@TheFirstTriplefife]

Normalize just being stinky after a sex scene with all the sexy bits that you just engaged with. >:D

[@WisecrackEDU]

true

[@burbahawa]

@@WisecrackEDU wtf🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@Eat_Your_Life]

Huh finally a comment I can get behind

[@johnblouch1544]

Agreeeed. Maybe even developing a relationship beforehand and actually falling asleep next to each other too.

[@anarchodolly]

This tradwife thing reminds me of Marie Antoinette playing at being a milkmaid. Maybe it can be fun when its not your actual life. I wonder how many of them actually have kids and the task of managing a family on just one wage. I'm betting none.

[@milcahreyes5287]

Shepherd Girl Marie Antoinette, anyone?

[@Aaron-kj8dv]

There's a pretty long history of elites cosplaying as everyday people. In the 1800s Russian intellectuals would write about the noble serf and take serf women as mistresses. Of course, they'd never dare to get their hands dirty in real life.

[@Layla12251]

They're playing dress up for attention. They have no context for living in that period beyond projecting back an image of propaganda.

[@emilyv1612]

​@@amazin7006 then find a woman who makes enough to support you as her stay at home dad. You'll have to support her and be the primary caregiver. It's possible they just have to value what you can give.

[@equitesloricatus6035]

This is a good comment. Whoever you are out there, top marks.

[@PaulaDanielaJ]

Andrew Tate is not “Romania’s” sex trafficker. He just settled here. We don’t want him! Please take him back!!! 😭😭😭

[@WisecrackEDU]

We pray they kick his ass out of your lovely country ASAP.

[@hogndog2339]

I would say send him to the ocean, but the fish don’t deserve that

[@jaggerra7]

@@hogndog2339 Hey, meat is meat. The best thing about fish is that they can't get morality based indigestion and heartburn. Give him unto the ocean so that he can have some positive use in this life.

[@isuckatusernames4297]

too late the guards already took his ass in prison

[@Ultrajamz]

Do we even know he is guilty yet?

[@justinwilliams1127]

There's a great play called "Mr. Burns" that shows how problematic nostalgia can be. It tells of a group of people in the post-apocalypse trying to remember an episode of The Simpsons in an effort to hold on to the past from before the world ended. The recollection of the episode becomes a play and then a cult, in a warning to all that nostalgia is a drug that can affect our present and future.

[@zotdead08]

Damn that's really creative.

[@nevskislake]

I need to see this play now. I love the concept.

[@NWPaul72]

I think if we must recreate society and include religion, we've done worse than the Simpsons lots of times.

[@trevorjonathan4405]

Nostalgia for a time where the standard of living was much higher for the average adult… Only sounds dangerous to the 0.1-1%

[@nevskislake]

@@trevorjonathan4405- The standard of living may have been higher for the average family because the cost of living was still relatively cheap, but also remember that the upper middle class and rich paid a higher rate in taxes than they do today. Just a decade later, in the late 60's, we would slowly begin to see manufacturing plants close and ship their operations overseas and early, clunky implementations of automation.

[@Oh_ELCapitan]

Nostalgic at a certain degree feels like an emotional trap.

[@MysteryGeek2006]

It can be, it can surely be

[@Touhou20246]

In my opinion you are somewhere between 50% and 90% correct in my opinion oh and I hope that mellenials won’t becoming super religious in the sense of becoming homophobic and being conservative nut jobs like in the same way as trump and his loyal cultist/followers. P.s this is just a worry of mine for my home country of the USA becoming even more conservative then what we have at the moment plus it also doesn’t help that the only way to end the toxic nostalgia is to just try to convince everyone to not be nostalgic for anything.

[@walrusArmageddon]

​@@Touhou20246 that's gonna be tough to not be nostalgic for 2016, aside from trump that summer was pretty kick ass. Its also a culture thing, canada was pretty neat at the time

[@Touhou20246]

@@walrusArmageddon I ment nostalgia in the sense of political, philosophical and economic nostalgia not food themed nostalgia or video game themed nostalgia.😅😑

[@walrusArmageddon]

​@@Touhou20246 i wasn't talkin about video games or food

[@akis9252]

Nostalgia is coming from Greek word Νοσταλγία. It's synthesized by two words Nostos and algos. Nostos is the desire of return to family home, past and algos is the pain. So it is the pain from the desire of return on your past like family or home but you know it's impossible. Nostalgia is bittersweet, only populist politicians, entertainment media like Hollywood need it. Also mediums such games need it to sell again past ideas and products. Odysseus had Nostalgia for his home.

[@weclock]

Hey, video games are making bank on nostalgia too.

[@conjunctivitis420]

Well written

[@mrmeseeks2655]

Odysseus returned home tho. So his nostalgia occurred when he was stuck on that island with that nympho goddess right? If I remember correctly he never gave up his quest to return. Doesn't it mean that it's against huge odds that we quench our nostalgic desires rather than impossible to achieve?

[@Cramhead43]

Well stated! 20 Years flinging himself around Troy through pain, but perhaps he used the past as a shield/remembrance of what he was fighting for? I’ll admit it’s been a while since I’ve brushed up on my Homer lol.

[@austinluther5825]

Wow. That adds even more layers to an already complex word. I love it.

[@johndortheknight4802]

How fun is it that us kids from 2000 on were taught from birth to fight for the planet and to try to make things better for every single person on it and then the second we started trying to we got a backlash so hard that it literally reverted some people 50 years back in time

[@Oxyleya]

2/10 I'd say

[@rev4449]

70+ years. 50 years ago gender norms were already changing

[@kellharris2491]

It's really depressing actually.Honestly those women in the video's seem like stepford wives. Like look at me !

[@sweatt4237]

You guys might want to pass a middle school biology class first before you go trying to save the earth.

[@malcolmpalmer535]

The problem with you kids from the 2000's is that you want to change everything without understanding what you are changing or whether the change is for the best and will result in a positive outcome.

[@MelodicQuest]

There's a subplot in the Star Wars show 'Andor' where a tradwife movement is happening amongst young women. Mon Mothma's daughter joins this movement because she believes her mother doesn't spend enough time at home. She hopes return to traditional values will force women out of the workplace and allow them to focus solely on the needs of the family.

[@WisecrackEDU]

Good call - should've shouted that out in this video! That was such a weird and interesting subplot in the show.

[@Sarah-re7cg]

All this can be avoided if people would just go to therapy 😭🥲

[@littleman6950]

​@@Sarah-re7cg "Therapy" is a cheeky buzzword anymore. Care to share that free time and money needed to make that a reasonable suggestion?

[@IconoclastX]

@@Sarah-re7cg It can be avoided if mothers raise their kids. Children want mom at home and so does the husband. We need to stop downplaying this important role. It is as essential as brick layers and the U.S. military.

[@IconoclastX]

@@WisecrackEDU Yeah, it's so weird how people want their parents to raise them. Straight bizzare.

[@t-money1984]

As a gay man post Club Q, I can’t help but remember that the worst of the folks who insist on traditionalism will enforce it with violence if they feel it’s necessary. Stay safe friends.

[@Stinkoman87]

Yeah, I don't mind the idea of tradwives, but throughout those video I was constantly reminded that obsession with tradition and strict gender roles are two of the points towards facism.

[@Aaron-kj8dv]

Isn't that the slippery slope fallacy? I can't see someone going from "I love being a stay at home mom" to "let's imprison gays just for being gay". It's kind of bizarre how people can't separate it.

[@awbeans982]

@@Aaron-kj8dv the wild thing is that a number of states are pushing towards that very thing with trans people. Trad wives and the like may not personally hold any ill will towards queer folks but the conservative style of life they promote is often fetishized by people who do

[@trybunt]

​@@Aaron-kj8dv no, pointing out that the extreme of a certain ideology perform extreme actions is not slippery slope fallacy. I'm someone who dresses in very traditional fashions with what many people would call my trad wife, but I also hold the same concerns that some people take "being traditional" too far and think that other people living different ways are harmful to society, and they use violence to "fight back". This doesn't mean there's any slippery slope happening, it just means that some harmful beliefs can be spread amongst people who enjoy living a traditional way, so we need to be vigilant and spread acceptance of others.

[@FranciT98]

​@@Aaron-kj8dv Plenty if stay at home moms haven't and don't need to embrace traditional aesthetics. The "slippery slope" is the fetishization of the traditional, which is a key pillar of fascism. That's not to say that dressing like a 50s houswife leads to fascism, but there's some degree of caution necessary when people start pushing for a return to the traditional.

[@pyrho1]

IMO, There's nothing wrong with a woman practicing traditional female roles. It doesn't mean they cannot support women's rights or the freedom for other women to live their life as they want to. You do you, as long as you're not hurting anyone.

[@stephennootens916]

From my view it seems a good deal of these women are just sick of the misery of work which ever most people are and are able to do the stay at home because their partner makes enough to make it possible. They are not out there down by the river cleaning clothes or some shit nor do many of the once I have heard about seem to have kids running around shitting and pissing their pants to deal with. Plus they have a thousand other better forms of help that the 50s housewives who just had addictive pills.

[@SnowSNS11]

​@@stephennootens916 and be so dependent on their spouse, that their spouse can control their lives and it's hard for them to leave and do anything about it. I guess love is a shield, but you can't trust it nowadays, or most times in history, it's always good to have have a plan b and c.

[@stephennootens916]

@@SnowSNS11 You understand that just because they are a stay at housewife or Husband (in this day an age is just as likely) doesn't mean they have no legal rights. They can divorce and get spousal support. A summing that they are not working from home which some house wives and husbands do.

[@dontmisunderstand6041]

There's nothing wrong with a person choosing to live the life they want to live. However, the reasoning behind that choice is the actual important part. As long as the reasoning is sound and genuinely achieves the actual goal the person wants that choice to fulfil, it's fine.

[@robbieskids9159]

​@@dontmisunderstand6041but as the video demonstrated, most are only choosing this way of life because the thought of having a career and a happy healthy home life is impossible.

[@pyrho1]

I've never heard of the term "tradwife" before this video. Thank God I don't pay attention to society.

[@qwertyuiopaaaaaaa7]

Not society, just the internet. Ignore the internet, be a supportive member of your real, local community!

[@billyalarie929]

@@qwertyuiopaaaaaaa7 this is overrated and pretentious, not to mention disingenuous. Plainly put, goofball shit.

[@veronicamaine3813]

If they were real trad wife’s they would never dream of being that public or doing something as crass as social media. They’re a fraud as all attempts to relieve a time that never really existed are.

[@connorsullivan1855]

@@qwertyuiopaaaaaaa7 Yeah I literally never heard someone in real life say the term trad wife. Normal people say house wife. Trad wife includes dressing like its the 50s and acting super smug that you are doing something a decent chunk of women are already doing or would do if they had the financial means to.

[@DrumWild]

Oddly enough, the tradwife thing is a god thing. It's basically Christian garbage.

[@sethsmith8638]

I feel like you're missing a giant point. In Akron, Ohio, Sojourner Truth delivered the "Ain't I a woman" speech. This spoke to the fact that "traditional" is only meant for a specific group.

[@sierraalice8072]

That part, because as a black woman. Being a housewife feels like progress to me 😂

[@drowsy7921]

@@sierraalice8072 Then do what you believe will progress your own life. Don't sacrifice your individual wants and needs for what others think will be good.

[@seanmaddex4104]

We need to stop obsessing over what people want do with their lives. If you want to be a trad wife go for it. Just don’t impose your beliefs on others

[@Jp808]

That movement can't exist long term without imposing though.

[@BlueinRhapsody]

​@@Jp808Why?

[@MOTO_DOSE]

​@@Jp808 says who? Who even says it's a movement? It's a lifestyle. Not a movement.

[@saliferousstudios]

​@Supermonsters I agree. The problem with the trad wife movement is they go on social media and smile in perfect makeup and say how much better their life is than yours. It's propaganda.

[@MOTO_DOSE]

@@saliferousstudios are you worried their going to change you into a trad wife? Are you worried that their message is so compelling, and that other people are so weak minded that it will change others into trad? Does their lifestyle offend you?

[@deadfr0g]

A person who experiences zero nostalgia feels like there’s nothing good in their past, and that’s a tragedy. A person who is completely transfixed by nostalgia feels like there’s nothing good in their future, and that’s a lTRAVESTY.

[@sampeacaml9307]

Food for thought.

[@lucasballestin9085]

you can enjoy fond memories without being nostalgic :)

[@sampeacaml9307]

@@lucasballestin9085 I suppose. I don't know how.

[@lucasballestin9085]

@@sampeacaml9307 I guess enjoying things for what they were without trying to return?

[@sampeacaml9307]

@@lucasballestin9085 I guess I could try. But it's hard with all that intrusive wokism. Some of its ideas are okay, but they can get so ''hollier-than-thou''.

[@demikus]

I don't think there is anything inherently wrong about trying to embrace "simpler times" especially if you do so through rose tinted glasses, cherry pick the good stuff and get rid of the bad to make modern life more comfortable. BUT it becomes a problem when you try to force those choices on others, or shame others for trying to embrace ideals such as ignoring "gender norms" Live your own life, don't make things worse for others around you that want no part of it.

[@ruffethereal1904]

Your freedom to enjoy stops when you keep others from doing the same.

[@chriscortez2036]

Every era has problems, but as kids we’re usually blissfully ignorant of said problems. There’s really no such thing as “simpler times”, it’s just that now in modern day info travels incredibly fast & politcal/social/economic issues are harder to ignore.

[@ruffethereal1904]

@@chriscortez2036 Mmm. A lot of people want to go back to "good times" when all the consequences of systematic problems weren't rearing their heads and they could live in comfortable ignorance about how broken the world was and still is.

[@chriscortez2036]

@@ruffethereal1904 Indeed. Even the periods many “trad-wives” seem to idolize- The 1940s/1960s- had to deal with WW2 and it’s fallout, the Civil Rights movement, the Cold War, etc. To be clear, there’s nothing wrong with liking the aesthetics of an era or missing your childhood, but actively advocating to return to the past can be… problematic to say the least.

[@Aaron-kj8dv]

@@chriscortez2036 Do you actually believe they're advocating for that? Like a full return to the past or maybe just some things that they like?

[@tkpease]

I would also argue that some people embraced more traditional gender roles during the pandemic because they finally could. I love wearing dresses, but not when it's 60 degrees in this freezing-ass office! I love make-up but it's hard to squeeze it in before a hour and a half commute! I like getting dolled up, but it's real awkward when you're working in a building full of tech-bros dressed in last week's unwashed t-shirt and jeans!

[@catsmom129]

Interesting. I went the opposite route. I only dressed up for work because I had to. At home I wear anything and nothing, whatever feels comfortable.

[@IconoclastX]

@@catsmom129 your username explains everything

[@catsmom129]

@@IconoclastX meaning?

[@Salvothegamer]

@@catsmom129 dude is a moron, do not waste your time.

[@trawrtster6097]

I think there’s a big difference between doing the aesthetics of the 1950s tradwife and actually being a tradwife.

[@helenab2520]

It’s really hard to be nostalgic for a time where many people would die of basic things.

[@Blodhelm]

So a time just like today then, but maybe a little worse.

[@Maya_Ruinz]

Nostalgic for a time when black people weren’t yet considered human or when gay people kept their … stuff to themselves. That is what I hear anytime these people start longing to be a “trad wife”.

[@SerifSansSerif]

except that's now...

[@mikelis1988]

hmmmm, people DO die of basic things these dayz, sorry to ruin it for you

[@DrumWild]

@@Blodhelm Not like today at all. Modern medicine was in its infancy in the mid-1940s, so it wasn't very far along by the 1950s. It was a time when doctors recommended smoking cigarettes for breathing problems. The problem is that people take our modern conveniences for granted, to the point that they believe it has always existed, or even that a "god" made it this way. Generally, humans aren't good at thinking or remembering.

[@bazil_b4567]

I dunno, I'm all for letting people do whatever the f**k they want. The only time it becomes an issue is when they try force their perspective on you or they are affecting others. If someone finds happiness in trad masculinity or femininity. Great! Or if someone finds gender fluidity a great way to express themselves. That's great too! It is not up to me to decide how someone else wants to live their life.

[@trillionbones89]

No one is saying they shouldn't live their life as they feel like they should. People are reacting to them glorifying a past that was terrible in many regards. No one is seriously harassing housewives over being housewives. They are criticizing influencers (that pretend to be like a 1950s housewife) who think an aesthetic is what determines an era while actively ignoring all the problems that have been overcome. They are propaganda.

[@bannedmann4469]

​​@@trillionbones89 They're implying it.. there is harassment, you're wrong. That's the motivation behind this video. There are tons of Tik tok trends, why do you think they chose this? They don't want it. This video is propaganda.

[@IconoclastX]

@@bannedmann4469 They hate trad wives because their own wives are empowered feminists who don't cook or care for them. So they are extremely angry and doubtful that a woman so beautiful and loving can exist.

[@tompatierno5606]

​@@bannedmann4469 the first vibe I got out the gates was 'cis het bad, traditions must be broken, you must transgress every norm or you're a FASCIST RACIST.'

[@darryljack6612]

Nostalgia really is a whole can of worms in regard to toxicity, but i feel "Trad people" are a much different issue than simply nostalgia alone.

[@michalis75]

As a poc, definitely agree 😅😒

[@darryljack6612]

@@michalis75 As a poc myself, same. But oddly enough there are (for some mind puzzling reason) some poc communities with their own version of this as well.

[@denimchicken6549]

Somehow conservatives have been convinced that if they're loud and proud about being conservative, it's a really edgy and punk rock thing to do. To be fair, look at the reaction they're pulling online doing so. If they were so traditional, they wouldn't be on social media... They're just weird narcissists.

[@nicosyoutubelife8968]

@@darryljack6612 whats the issue?

[@darryljack6612]

@@nicosyoutubelife8968 Nothing inherently, but its about the reasoning among (visibly) a lot of them. If someone wants to live their life a certain way with out hurting or attacking anyone else, then more power to them. But with a lot of trad people on social media, they present this idea that not only do they want themselves to be like this. But that society is missing out from not being as they are, or that people of their identity are not on the right path by being different to how they are. It's almost like if they truly had the power they would turn back the clock, and that is the issue.

[@nevskislake]

The odd thing about Trad Wives is that they miss the point that because of progressive policies they have a choice to regress. Their grandmothers or great grandmothers likely would not have had that choice. It was just expected for them to become wives and mothers. Women going into the work force at that time were often treated with hostility, and they had to endure sexism just to get a paycheck. The far-right embraces cherry-picked bits of history be it, the Spartans, the Vikings, the Byzantines, the Wild West, and the 50's without fully understanding the positives and negatives of those societies and eras, because there are always negatives. One of the reasons that young men in the 60's began to rebel and join the hippie movement is because they saw their fathers working themselves into the ground for some soulless corporation and thought, "Damn, if I am going to do that." In turn, many young women embraced the sexual revolution because they realized how direly unhappy their mothers were. That said, you do you, Trads. I just hope that they teach their children that they don't have to embrace rigid gender roles, but I doubt it. Thank you, as always, for this video, Wisecrack team!

[@skylinefever]

Exactly, the good old days were only good for some people.

[@dontmisunderstand6041]

Were? You speak as if women don't still have to endure sexism just to get a paycheck. To be fair, men do too, but to a lesser degree (largely because of the weird power dynamic between men and women due to societal interpretations of gender roles, and to a lesser extent average biological differences in the cases where both parties represent a more stereotypical physicality for their sex). There's also some irony in the far-right's fetishization of history they don't understand. Spartan views of women fall much more in line with left-wing ideals than "traditional" gender roles. In general the entire far-right understanding of Roman civilization ranges from woefully misguided to malicious disinformation.

[@nevskislake]

@@dontmisunderstand6041 - I never said that sexism is a thing of the past. Sadly, it is not, and it negatively affects all genders in different ways. But it is nice to know that we agree on other things. Yea, the far-right's version of history is interesting and quite telling and always seems to boil down "this society is our symbol of might makes right and white supremacy" for the moment.

[@lorrygoth]

Nostalgia is mythologizing the past, ignoring the negative and liveing in that fantasy because our Capitalist hellscape fails to meet expectations. Accepting an idealized, personal fantasy instead of trying to improve the world we all share.

[@ccc3]

How did capitalism get to be a part of this?

[@lorrygoth]

@@ccc3 By requiring exploitation and commodifying everything so that you cannot live below a certain income threshold.

[@ccc3]

@@lorrygoth Perhaps, but what does have to do with the subject of the video: returning to a traditional conservative past? The narrator speaks about gender roles being challenged as the main reason for this. What does capitalism have to do with it?

[@lorrygoth]

@@ccc3 Because how is that Nostalgia expressed except through consumption? Unless you inheriting, create for yourself or rescue cultureal signifiers from the past then the only method of engaging in nostalgia is if someone is selling it. Capital directing what you are allowed to express. I have gotten very off topic at this point though. But intersectionality is important given how pervasive some systems like Capitalism are.

[@moboticusmaximus7320]

​@@ccc3 Did you actually watch the video? It specifically details how capitalism is a part of this.

[@CrazyMama75]

In my early twenties I was very deeply focused on religion to explain my role as a women in a world I felt unsafe in and I was hyper "tradwife"esk, heck in college I actually wrote an essay on the importance of maintaining gender roles. I found a husband and threw myself into the role and to start off I was happy, I felt safe and protected and able to just focus on the small part of the world that was my domain. But then my now ex showed his true colours putting my kids at risk and I realised that I what I said I wanted was not what I wanted for my son or daughter and I wanted them to be free to be whoever they wanted. My focus on traditional roles was based on fear and childhood trauma not based on what was benefitial for me or my family. Now as a stressed out single mum I'm happier then ive ever been cos I'm honest to myself and my children.

[@IconoclastX]

All feminists are just women who've been hurt by men and have a lack of trust. Your situation is all to real. My dad did the exact same thing. But you shouldn't base your worldview on one bad man.

[@MilwaukeeWoman]

If your ex husband had been a good year husband do you think you would have had a different outcome?

[@DimaRakesah]

I feel like this is similar to whag my mom experienced. She wanted to be the religious trad housewife, but my father became an alcoholic. Eventually I think she had to admit to herself that divorce served a good purpose to protect women and children and that being a sjngle mkm wasn't shameful if you are doing the right thing for the safety of yourself and your kids.

[@moxmox8058]

The allure of the picturesque stay-at-home, dress nicely, put your energy into building relationships and a family of your own instead of a corporate conglomerate is strong. If people can do it successfully more power to them. But after watching so many generations of women in my family chase that only to be stuck in various cycles of abuse after placing their trust in this promise, it feels like as much of a fantasy as any superhero movie. I know better than to gamble everything in that direction from watching them. You have to be smart and hedge your bets or you will be exploited, sadly.

[@dDoodle788]

​@@MilwaukeeWoman with the way she describes her character back then, she would have probably never found a good husband, insecurity attracts horrible people like moths to a flame. Then again in that hypothetical scenario,the good husband would have probably helped her grow out of her insecurities, so she would at least have realised that she doesn't need to push her opinion on others and that not everyone has to be an housewife, even if she herself might have still been one.

[@mr.markofski4267]

Every person or family is likely going to have their own strengths and needs. It’s perfectly possible to utilize both modernity and tradition in your relationships depending on who you are and what you need. Some people are simply better off in a more traditional relationship while at the same time, some people are better off in no relationship at all. As long as the lifestyle is healthy and doesn’t hurt anyone, there is nothing wrong with it, just make sure your reasons make sense.

[@elmoisred616]

I'm a bigger conduit for nostalgia than I ever been before at this point in my life in my mid-thirties. I love retro gaming, I collect VHS and vinyl, and I fetishize synthwave and throwback music. It's enjoyable to embrace these types of media and entertainment, however I worry that I'm purposely trying to lock myself away from the modern world

[@Nick_CF]

It also sadly has had a terrible effect on growing culture and art. We have stagnated so badly I find it quite embarrassing.

[@FINNSTIGAT0R]

​@@Nick_CF Nothing has stagnated, it's just that the mainstream of commercialised art has been broken by the internet and what there is left of the mainstream is playing things extremely safe, so not promoting much new things, or things with unsure potential. Note that the commercialised culture, meaning "the mainstream" is what people are nostalgic about, those things that were mass entertainment/phenomena at their times. That's what has been stagnated, art and culture below that is going on as it always has.

[@GaryOPostle]

@@Nick_CF I agree, this is how I feel when I think about Jurassic World 3

[@walrusArmageddon]

​@@GaryOPostle I didn't mind jurassic park 3, it's nothing to write home about but the spinosaurus was kinda fun

[@lolshark99b49]

ye you sound pretty pathetic.

[@professorlogos5459]

In Latino culture wearing religious Catholic items is very common. We do it that a lot

[@tsuki_ryuu]

Sometimes people end up nostalgic for and bringing back something that wasn’t even real. I had listened to an audio book not that long ago, “The Way We Never Were”. A really interesting insight to how people end up cherry picking things from every era and thinking it was “the good ole days”.

[@catsmom129]

Oh, I love that book!

[@catdogmousecheese]

I haven't read that book, but I completely agree. I've heard people say so many times "things weren't always like this" or "this country/world was better was I was a kid."

[@IconoclastX]

@@catdogmousecheese You can actually look at statistical data to show that the suicide rate for women was lower back in the day. People were also more productive and lead more social and communal lives. So no, It wasn't just a "myth". You can pretend it was to cope about how insanely horrible our current society is; but that doesn't change the truth.

[@wheresmyeyebrow1608]

@@IconoclastX People are still picking and choosing lol. They're dressing up and doing house chores while not getting beat by their husbands and addicted to medication.

[@MilwaukeeWoman]

​@@wheresmyeyebrow1608So we have a better version of the good old days? I'm failing to see the problem here. Why not keep the good parts of yesteryear. That being said, I'm not ever going to start canning my own produce. It's so tedious.

[@RuslanKD]

OR the research is right and 56% of working women would have preferred to stay home and raise their kids HAD they been giving the option too.

[@matthewgiroux9590]

Source?

[@Bass.sick.b1tch]

One cannot help but remember those halcyon days when men smoked a pipe after a long day at work and their little woman was where she belonged, in front of a camera creating videos for mass consumption at a profit ❤❤❤

[@Aaron-kj8dv]

Sorry but this is very "You call yourself socialist, yet you own an Iphone. Interesting"

[@samanjj]

Exactly. I wrote something related to this sentiment to another comment. Seems sus to me that they overly evangelise this “lifestyle”

[@veronicamaine3813]

@@Aaron-kj8dv What a tradwife with a social media account is missing of the full trad experience is the loneliness of that existence. Also it’s hard to believe that any real world trad husbands would be okay with their trad wife debasing herself for views and performing for money. Back then a woman who was public was pretty much seen as a whore who emasculated her husband by her forwardness. So from the get go the tradwife is a fraud. So whether you read that as Marxist or simply that fact of living in a capitalist society, is totally up to you - but it’s totally possible to critique neo liberalism without being communist.

[@MLBlue30]

Not gonna lie, you had me in the first half. Hooray for Onlyfans!

[@IndustrialParrot2816]

​@@Aaron-kj8dv I always hated that phrase because it doesn't work but people think it does

[@DThron]

We are obsessed with making all groups outside of ourselves conform to what we think of as correct, regardless of left or right, because angrily denying someone else's validity is the easiest way to feel confident in our own, and giving ourselves a bad guy makes us feel righteous about it. But in reality it just makes us see others as cartoons, and creates a bubble reality that makes us feel ever less safe - and so we seek to make those outside our bubble to conform even more strenuously. I do it, and if you are reading this, you do it to. It's part of our brain's reliance on its 'fundamental attribution error' as a danger-sorting device. So if you hate a group of people, and think of them as some sort of mindless horde - whether its a political party, sexuality, gender, or anything else - you are likely making things worse for yourself, and it's helpful to practice treating people as human beings, even when you hate them - this is the actual way to change things and lower anxiety.

[@Astro2024]

"I do it so you do too" is such a logically fallacy. Not everyone is a shitty bigot like you. Hard to believe right?

[@IconoclastX]

Tell that to the people crying about housewives and making fourteen minute videos to compare being a traditional loving wife to being an astrologist punk kid. Lol

[@mlabossi]

As someone who teaches the history of philosophy, the return to traditions "movement" is fascinating. After all, there are thousands of years of traditions with thousands of sets of traditional values. So how does one pick the tradition to adopt? I suppose if it is a method of self-medication, you pick the one that is easiest to do and seems to ease the pain of now the most.

[@ethanstump]

This right here. As an anarchist, I can follow traditions and be traditional to anarchism but that's not what people mean by being trad. It always falls into "hey, remember the time that the entire world had to follow our specific and contradictory brand of ideology, where grand narratives made everything one dimensional? Yeah, I want to live like that again. It's pining for the chains. The children yearn for the mines! /$

[@ethanstump]

@@Lux_Aeterna I'm ancestrally pioneer Mormon from both sides, and still live in Ogden, Utah. in the 2050's, there will be as many nonbeliever's as there are believers. the conflation of "missing a point" and rejecting it for greater strength, never seems to penetrate for apologists.

[@manvslife271]

Nostalgia towards the early 2000's has slowly begun on the internet, which made me realize how old i was getting. Every decade we get nostalgic about the new "two decades ago" don't we? In the 2000's it was the 80's, in 2010's it was the 90's...

[@darryljack6612]

Begun? That sh*t has been around even back in the 2010s

[@manvslife271]

@@darryljack6612 Yeah maybe "begun" was the wrong word, but it's becoming more and more prevalent

[@goosewithagibus]

People have been getting nostalgic for times they weren't born into, which is quite odd. See: Stranger Things

[@USSAnimeNCC-]

Kist focus on the here and now that what matter more the pass is the pass let's it go

[@royconestoga7326]

So Good Charlotte is going to be everywhere? Unfortunate.

[@YeTism]

We just all miss the simpler times, being a kid was fun and easy. No social media or stress.

[@denimchicken6549]

You are aware, though, @@AzathothsAlarmClock, that it still exists beyond your being on it? If only TheTizmo had said, "No Ryan Miller on social media or stress."

[@billyLego4855]

Interacting people is hard anyway. And people have kids or married. Their prioritys are with the kid and their circle. I do wish in mh 20s I could for those moments have that special someone becouse responsibility kicks into people. It's exactly what i fear they became. Only I missed out and they only infulnce me to what I should do. These people have no idea.

[@AndersWatches]

@@AzathothsAlarmClock you have at least one social media because you left this comment 🤔

[@LuisSierra42]

@@AndersWatches BURNED!

[@timmceown7646]

​@@AzathothsAlarmClock The effects of social media reach far beyond the platforms.

[@NichePlays]

I would totally love to see an entire series on the effect nostalgia is having on people. Nostalgia is so interesting in communities like the retro gaming one because you'd think it would be a pretty open and shut case of people just liking old games from their childhood, when in reality theres a lot more infighting than there needs to be. For example, the largest hub for retro gaming outside of KZbin (r/retrogamers) doesn't consider any consoles that came out after 2000 as retro. And that's just weird because they're literally gatekeeping their own community from growing to include younger people who have nostalgia for stuff that's now over 20 years old lol

[@tehKap0w]

mmm, 'memberberries

[@NichePlays]

@@tehKap0w deadass

[@tehKap0w]

@@NichePlays peperidge farms remembers

[@RockoEstalon]

That's something I hate about how "nostalgia" is working in general, even though I love pre-2000's games. Almost 35 years have passed since the 80's ended and we're not even close into entering on the 90's nostalgia territory, "80's pop culture porn" is still the main thing.

[@NichePlays]

@@RockoEstalon yep. It’s fascinating to see people try to explain that. The subreddit I mentioned got made in 2009 iirc, 9 years after their cutoff. Even if you didn’t call something like the PS2 retro by then, the hardware is now much older than some of the consoles they DID call retro back then

[@vavakxnonexus]

Gods, I feel that bit around 10:37 about seeking an aesthetic space you can safely experiment/participate in & reaching for Christian imagery. It's hard to find an aesthetic that is both appealing and fair game, and those cathedrals do be pretty.

[@FirestormX9]

They do indeed

[@wabisabi7755]

"This random KZbin music from 1899 is much better than the 97.98% of music released today. Trust me, I've listened to all the music in the world to calculate this exact percentage."

[@cheeseheadflipper]

It doesn't matter if some one chooses to follow a "traditionally" roll or not. If it works for them and makes them happy they can do either one.

[@GlennRRB]

Looks like you just solved all our subjective problems with two phrases. Now we can stop thinking and be happy. Joke aside, its important for us to think about society and culture. No one wants to say that they cant do what they want, but its really important to understand why they are doing it

[@cheeseheadflipper]

@@GlennRRB Why should we care why they are doing it? It is their choice not ours.

[@GlennRRB]

@@cheeseheadflipper We should care because we need to understand society. Thats why we have a brain. To use it.

[@cheeseheadflipper]

@@GlennRRB I do not care why some one has their sexual preferences, I do not care why they have their religious views, I do not care why they have their political views, I do not care if they want to have a "traditional" roll or not. Its their choice and no business of mine or yours.

[@markd1252]

​@@cheeseheadflipperand what's the issue with the people that do care. Because the traditional role people is not sending the message isolated. They mainly judge people who are not comfortable with gender roles...and at a certain point they are indoctrinating people...by sharing others..so its a matter. Maybe not for you but for a lot of people who's been ashamed for not agreeing with this trend

[@skakried7673]

Nostalgia is such an easy trap to fall into, I don't blame anyone who does. I mean we all do from time to time. I consider myself a very progressive person but I also find myself sometimes yearning for the "Simpler" times of the early 2000s when I would hang out with my friends in town on the weekends, go skateboarding, listen to silly pop-punk anthems, get drunk and hang around on the park.We laughed in the face of authority and didn't give a fuck what people thought. It was a fun time but life moves forward not backwards and I must keep reminding myself of that.

[@venicec3310]

Well said

[@samsaalfeld4273]

Agreed.

[@Bustermachine]

I think nostalgia is also more nuanced than just 'old thing == good' because of our fond memories of a simpler time. I've been disappointed by many older games and movies when I come back to them with fresh eyes. While some have certainly stood the test of time. I've become incredibly fond of Columbo recently, despite the fact that I wasn't even born when Peter Falk's cigar chomping detective busted most of his cases. But the calm sedate structure of the show, and Columbo's general mellowness as a character is very appealing to me and stands so much in contrast to the modern tv structure. Funnily, I do think a lot about the injustices that were going on at that time that were happening in parallel with the show's run. But the same could be said of a show today. And at the same time - My grandpa was an LA county sheriff's deputy. While cleaning out a legal box, I found a commendation from his Captain. One day, a mentally unstable man, armed, was discovered prowling a neighborhood. He had fired several rounds into a house. My grandfather organized the search, recognized that the man was unstable, and managed to talk him down and take him into custody with no loss of life. Think about that. The 60s and 70s were rife with racism, and sexism, and injustice, that is all true and none of it should be excused, and at the same time, bringing in a perp peacefully, who was armed and dangerous, but equally a danger to themselves, was viewed as the height of heroism. Maybe it wouldn't have been as heroic if the man was black instead. But there's no way to really tell, now. It's not that simple. It's never been that simple. The danger of nostalgia is not that it makes us love the past. It's that it makes us think the past is simpler than it was.

[@brendaluv2017]

If it helps think about the pros and cons of the 2000’s that how I move forward

[@rouskeycarpel1436]

The early 2000s aren’t really traditional and many of the activities you listed aren’t really seen as “conservative”.

[@DeathTheKid6778]

Reminds me of something my father said. "Those looking to the past for a better future will repeat the things most likely to get them hurt or get them broke."

[@bannedmann4469]

Ironic, Wisecraxk would probably disagree. Progressives are just socialists who are lying. And that's very old.

[@dokidelta1175]

I'm not looking to the past, I'm just looking to the good that was forgotten. Family and faith.

[@MilwaukeeWoman]

Sounds like your dad was a pessimist who can't imagine a culture that is able to choose the good things to keep and the bad things to be rid of.

[@DeathTheKid6778]

@@MilwaukeeWoman Well, being a black immigrant partially raised in Texas in the 60s does some of that. Though, who determines what's bad and how "to be rid of," things is thin line of authoritarianism and genocide. Since the"bad things," you really want gone are people just living their lives their way and you would have to force them not to in a country that calls itself land of the free.

[@dontmisunderstand6041]

By definition, society can NEVER improve by doing things by sticking to (or returning to) tradition. It can only ever be worse or the same. Can't get ahead by following in someone else's footsteps. You HAVE to forge your own path, otherwise you'll never get anywhere new.

[@hypnokitten6450]

I think a part of nostalgia for a lot of folk is also that our entire economic system (8-hour / 5-day workweek) is built around there being someone home. When both people at home are losing 40 hours there's not much energy left (even sharing chores you can't fully make up for 40-hours of home care) to keep up a home w/o constant utter exhaustion. Which is where most fams I know are at now - constant exhaustion. So.. yea, there's nostalgia for when the home was kept up with and comfortable, emergency chores were getting handled, whomever was working could come home and actually rest instead of simply switching to the new job until crashing from exhaustion, etc. I 110% believed and believe in equality, both me and my wife work, we share chores at home.. and damn, I'm not sure that's actually turned out to be the right solution. And the more corporations 'optimize use of human resources', the higher the bills go without any improved quality of life, the more things fall by the way-side 'cause ain't nobody got time for that, the less and less time we have for any kind of date-night other then 'we Really need to get some new workshirts so lets go to the mall', the less all this seems like it was a good idea. Soooooo unless we're willing to open up and support poly marriages, or reduce work weeks to 4-days or less hours per day (and reduce bills to scale for that), or provide a stipend so normal folk can all hire housekeepers... I don't know how much longer this can all hold together.

[@juicemofo]

Every decade had it's own unique cultural identity, until the last couple. In this vacuum, nostalgia became our substitute for new cultural identity. We've rehashed the ideas and fashions of the 60's and 80's so many times now and worn them out. It was inevitable that someone would eventually say, "Why not recreate the 50's?". Ironically, it's the closest anyone can get to doing something "new" or "different" when Society has basically nuked every other option.

[@catsmom129]

In the 2050s, someone will be nostalgic for the 2020s. It has its own cultural identity; it’s just hard to see while we’re in the midst of it.

[@MilwaukeeWoman]

The cultural identity of the 2020s is gender surgery, pronoun pins, and neon hair. The 2010s was gender surgery, too, but it wasn't to switch genders, it was to exaggerate your sex at birth.

[@internetopinion3043]

Agreed. I was watching a documentary on KZbin, where they were interviewing people on the street who lived at that time, and just couldn't figure out when this documentary was filmed. I had to look it up. I was sure it wasn't from the 1990s, but it didn't seem recent either. Turns out it was circa 2005. I thought I was just getting old...but maybe our culture has just stagnated and people are just not making new, bold choices in fashion anymore. Nobody wants to be internet famous like that I guess XD

[@Raspil]

Staying stuck in the past isn't the answer. It makes no sense for someone born in 1983 to want to "go back" to a time they never lived through and know nothing about. It's a coping mechanism. The world and future isn't that scary.

[@josiahdublin7816]

People are cowards. Too pathetic to look forward

[@catsmom129]

I think it makes a lot of sense-psychologically speaking. It’s easier to mythologize an era you don’t remember. You can just enjoy the pop culture image and not worry about the reality. All the swing dancing and zoot suits without the war.

[@kolonarulez5222]

A lot of times someone finds out I enjoy sewing and know basic cooking I hear along the lines of "making a good wife" and my skin crawls. How about these are practical skills everyone should know?!

[@darlalathan6143]

Especially cosplayers and gourmets!

[@dontmisunderstand6041]

Yeah, if you can't cook you don't deserve to eat. Plain and simple. It's not a gender role, it's a basic life skill that you WILL die if you don't have, unless someone graciously saves your worthless life. I feel the same about basic home maintenance, generalist knowledge that solves life's most common problems, and generally any skill a tradesmen has. One of the major reasons schools exist is to specifically give everyone the tools they need to not simply die the moment other people don't provide them everything they need to keep life going.

[@beleden1215]

As a woman, I have a STEM degree, and I worked that 50 to 60 hour week. I had no time to do anything. I had medical issues happen where I couldn't work, so I've done a lot more traditional housewife stuff. My stress has gone down significantly. There were times that I would feel a panic attack coming on just thinking about working 6 days a week again Working 4 is fine. But I also don't feel good about giving our government tax money just so they can keep propagating war

[@nadezhdamartynova5614]

Well, you lived the life that lots of men live. Except men (because of social expectations) can't just back off and rely on their wifes, if they got tired and burned out.

[@shoyuramenoff]

Doesn't mean it shouldn't be possible for men to depend on their wives when they're stressed.

[@Crazael]

Personally, I think tradwife, or the male version of it, are more about people realizing that they like these traditional roles and embracing them rather than people rejecting the ideas behind the more modern views on gender roles. That the trend is actually a success of the modern emphasis on self expression and not actually a regression. Such a lifestyle should always be an option. But it should always be that, an option. Not something that is forced upon someone. And, IMO, that goes both ways. You shouldn't try to force someone to not be a tradwife/tradhusband.

[@bdg404]

I would say that people are noticing that the modern emphasis on self expression has led to a lack of social cohesion and brought confusion. No one knows what they are supposed do, and they are reaching for a time when things were more clearly defined and orderly.

[@troubadour723]

@@bdg404 Defined by whom?

[@pisceanbeauty2503]

But they don’t really know if they like those roles, just the idea of them, which is an incredibly idealized notion of the “traditional” dynamic.

[@Lawrence330]

@@troubadour723 It doesn't matter to some people and it's irrelevant to the previous poster's remark. I don't know who wrote the rules to Sorry!, or Monopoly, or D&D, but plenty of people appreciate that those games have a base structure and rules, and plenty will 'bend' or change rules that don't work for them. Like a tradwife who owns her car (a luxury in the 50s).

[@tomio8072]

​@@troubadour723 defined by perception of the past I guess

[@dvklaveren]

I think that the reason why people feel attracted to trad could actually be much simpler. In religious studies, Émile Durkheim described certain religious feelings as collective effervescence that can be seen in things like rituals. Ritual participants, practitioners, and audience members feel a bond on a physiological level that can be measured. I would argue that the appeal of trad is that there already exist ritual practices around the idea of a traditional housewife. Fashion becomes ritual in that way. Rituals have been observed to be important across the past three millennia or so in Chinese philosophy. Viewed through a modern lens, the content of the ritual may not matter exactly. One of the insights of queer theory is that these kinds of ritual gender roles can be broken in provocative ways that can liberate modern society. So, rather than rejecting trad, we can evolve it with new rituals for people to bond over.

[@ethanstump]

Call the interest that you follow now sacred, and tomorrow you will be its slave. -Max stirner I reject trad, not because it has the wrong rituals, but because ritual itself is devoid of change, of allowing adaption, of self expression. Your sense of bonding is weak, if it depends on necessarily rote ritual.

[@bas_ee]

Do these woman also allow their husband to smack them? Because that is how it was right? To me it just seems they would like to not work, and dress cool

[@ethanstump]

@@bas_ee i come from a very traditional mormon family, so when i say it's less desirable than a lot of people "play" at it think it is, i know what i'm talking about. kind of like those girls who do doctor asmr, versus what an actual doctor has to go through. it's fun to play one, terrible to be one.

[@the120cxx]

I think about this kind of stuff as a teen and made me realize something way back in the late 2000s: every generation, every age group has some junk they gotta put up with an idealize the benefits of the group they aren't in. The old miss their youth, the young yearn for more freedom, but both don't think about the down sides of each other's position like how getting older means your body can't bounce back as easily from struggles and that more freedom comes with more responsibility, oppression is harder to fight back against when you're still a child and that you're not taken as seriously when you're not as experienced as your elders. There's always a give and take, pros and cons. With this cultural stuff in particular I'm kinda surprised some go as far back as the 1950s trad wife aesthetic since most people who aren't literally 80+ weren't around for that era to begin with, but maybe that the power of media showing an idealized version of what was before us at times. Heck, even today people be making idealized versions of 80s & 90s stuff to a degree with some stuff I like kinda enjoy now harkening back to the early 2000s aesthetics I've been missing lately (lethal league, hi-fi rush, that Kickstarter I watched this morning). It's nice to bring back the best parts of the past I guess, just be a double edged sword of it goes overboard and you forget about the present. Personally, I just hated how society turned out from the mid to late 2010s and all the culture war nonsense that been going on and while I know I can't just go back to the past, I can see the appeal of just wanting to go back to when people weren't as volatile and tribalistic in my eyes. If anything I rather just smack people in the head and tell them to stop acting a fool and work together for once. I never had a positive opinion of the whole two parties thing before all this culture war stuff started in the first place. Just looked like a bunch of irresponsible adults letting the people's lives get worse instead of fixing the countries problems like they're supposed to be. Needless to say, it spreading to all my entertainment has left me a bit... Miffed to say the least. It's is too stress inducing, people getting anxiety and depression left and right online now and don't even question why when on social media 24/7 surrounded by stressful stuff. Of course you're gonna be anxious when you get bad news all the time, That was why I stopped watching the news and stuck to just the weather channel back in the late 2000s. Constantly hearing about shootings, murders, thefts, and missing people every day before school when I just wanted to know if I needed my umbrella was just wearing me down mentally as I already had a parents divorce to deal with as is. Now that is literally what Twitter, Facebook, TikTok, etc. is for zoomers & millennials everywhere. I saw where it would lead me back when it was just the news channel on my TV, now it's peoples whole lives because internet is an integral part of it and now there's no escape even if you shut off the screen because any one screw up you make can be recorded by someone else desperate for media attention and immortalized forever as a part of who you are no matter what you do. ... I'm not sure how we can fix this, I don't think women reverting to trad wife lifestyle will. But it's not like many are happy constantly grinding to be the next ceo of [insert cooperation who don't care about your problems here] either. But maybe there's something about family and a sense of community feels kinda lost over the years we might need back. Too many of us feel so lonely now and it's pretty concerning. Like, actually felt a bit happier when I was talking to my neighbors and stuff y'know? Know who I'm actually around, share stuff, that might a good step towards fixing the mess we're in I guess. It's easier to bear with life's hardships when you're around people who grow to care about you, even if it's just a little, blood relation or not. But that's just my feelings on it.

[@RynoZ]

I 100% support women's agency over their choice of lifestyle without shame or guilt for their justification, so long as it's legal and harms no one. If a woman decides to value being a tradwife and she is supported, not subjected to abuse, and their family thrives, what's the problem? What, influence? Slippery slope? To what?! Women are perfectly capable of rationalizing what lifestyle suits them, so to tell them they're reaching for nostalgia in troubling times or telling them its regressive when they're opting to live how they choose to suit their happiness, i'd say we don't have a problem! I support my wife but so many things fall to her as our child demands her more than me on most matters. She works full-time and we hire cleaners because housework and parenting can be relentless, not to mention a potential new addition to our family. If she requested or decided scaling back her work hours or leaving work altogether was something she wished to do, I would support her the best I can. I'm not a traditionalist, and would support men opting the same. We can't measure our options based on political idealisms. A team is a team, so you do as you must to maintain your mental health and support of one another! That's not naive, that's life!

[@rafresendenrafresenden.1644]

is just the typical pendulum swing, we are going more conservative these generation is just how this stuff roles. Nobody can stop this.

[@Aaron-kj8dv]

Which is ironic about everyone being so upset in the comments because they defined reactionary as someone who can't cope with changing times. Of course people are going conservative because the adults are like loony liberals and the conservatives will get older and strong arm younger generations and they'll swing to liberal and it will go on forever.

[@starwarsROXmy]

I think to a certain degree, it’s normal to have nostalgia. I grew up in the 90s and 00s, and I have nostalgia for certain things like the PS1/Ps2, the Attitude Era, old NFL games from that era etc. Same with my dad and him watching old games from the 80s. But I think any normal person can recognize that things we enjoyed or had good memories of does not equal that time being any better or worse than today. Nostalgia is like anything, in moderate doses, it’s okay to appreciate things you enjoyed or liked about that time period. But once you romanticize and ignore the bad, and start to go all RETVRN about it, that’s when it gets bad. Just my two cents.

[@archer1949]

Due to a variety of illnesses, I spent the majority of my childhood in and out of hospitals, basically struggling to survive. As a result, I have no longing for the “good ol’ days” and have developed a pretty good radar for the stench of toxic nostalgia.

[@Bridge2110]

"I used to be ill, therefore how society used to be is bad". Your comment is nonsense.

[@godofnothing428]

@@Bridge2110 you’re arguing with yourself here. It’s embarrassing

[@haileycandeza-solano]

@@Bridge2110 I agree haha. It's seems @Lew Archer 1949 thinks that the world revolves around him and his childhood sickness. LOL

[@archer1949]

@@haileycandeza-solano No. Quite the opposite. My illnesses gave me perspective. The real self centered people are those 30 something, Ben Shapiro worshiping rancid Neckbeards crying gravy tears and sending death threats to actors and producers because they hired a woman or black guy to lead the new iteration of a childhood franchise.

[@catsmom129]

I have a complicated relationship with nostalgia. My childhood in the 1980s sucked, but I used pop culture to cope with it. So I’ll get nostalgia for the music and movies, but I have no delusions that it was a better time. And I’ve realized some of those movies were super problematic. (Even at the time, there were scenes I found uncomfortable, but I’d push those thoughts away because I just wanted to escape reality.)

[@ExiILe00]

Asbestos levels of nostalgia.

[@spacemansabs]

Asbestos is a coward. That's why it's always hiding in the attic.

[@MildMisanthropeMaybeMassive]

I am being serious here. Asbestos has been unfairly demonized. It’s bad because a lot of the asbestos used would flake off, disperse everywhere in the air, and the microscopic fibers were sharp, would be breathed in and stay in lungs forever, constantly causing irritation, abrasions and eventually cancer. But not all asbestos is flaky or have sharp fibers, and some are actually very dense. Asbestos is still used in many products such as car bumpers and brake shocks because there aren’t light fire resistant materials that compare.

[@1massboy]

I wouldn’t call this Nostalgia. This is more people reimagining the past to what they think would be ideal.

[@djgroopz4952]

For some it's taking what they like about the past. Nothing wrong with that. I actually think that's how we should treat the past. For me I'd like to go back (take from) the past when most African Americans were born in wedlock as opposed to today. That's just an example of what you can take from the past that's better than the present.

[@skylinefever]

Yes, they have an idealized version of the past. I always joke that such a past was full of people addicted to nicotine and alcohol to cope.

[@sman14GTA]

​@@skylinefever Zero change compared to today then lol

[@bas_ee]

@@djgroopz4952 Wait what? Is what you said incredibly racist or weird, or do i just not understand? You want african americans to be wedlocked from when they are born?

[@djgroopz4952]

@@bas_ee 😄😄😄, of course not. "Born in wedlock" meaning they were born into a two parent household or their parents were married.

[@weebcrit]

I think another part of the trad wife trend might be in part due to the time housewives often spend alone. housewives of the past used pills to add meaning or feeling to their typical housewife work - now women are generating that meaning through performativity. i imagine many of these women already held traditional views, it wasn't something that they just picked up as a trend. but then when it became a trend, they found meaning and community in a digital space that is typically positioned as unwelcoming to them

[@reneerodriguez7368]

Yeah people who advocate for tradwives conveniently leave out the whole "Mommy's little helper" prozac pill-popping they used to do.

[@IconoclastX]

Opioid use is through the roof in modern times and very popular with women. Also, women are more depressed and anxious now than before, this is verifiable through data. Your comment is propoganda and false. Nice try though

[@IconoclastX]

@@reneerodriguez7368 People advocating working women to death in corporate cubicles conveniently leave out the whole "opioid" and skyrocketting depression problem which is statistically higher than in the past[look it up, more women are depressed now than in the past. Depression diagnosis has increased dramatically]

[@reneerodriguez7368]

@@IconoclastX maybe that has more to do with the cost of living and how you often actually need two incomes to get by nowadays. Men and women are working themselves to death out there, which I don't advocate for. As a woman I like working and earning alongside my husband. We should have the option to work as men have options. We make up half of the damn society, we should be able to participate in it. Depression is skyrocketing in men too, does that have to do with them working? Both sexes are working themselves to death just to scrape by in this world, and the depression is coming from all of us slowly becoming aware of that fact.

[@IconoclastX]

@@reneerodriguez7368 Yeah the increasing rates of depression is coming from the unholy pursuit of consumerism over the pursuit of family and God. So men are depressed because the women go to work and so are the children. People were less depressed when family was incentivized through housewives, eating together, etc.; All things made much harder through our current system. So sure, you can work but it isn't beneficial for anybody involved to pursue money over family and God; including yourself. :P

[@marlonbryanmunoznunez3179]

Those trends almost certainly are class based and being embraced and promoted by burgeois people, the usual suspects from the professional-managerial class. Since is you know, impossible to keep a home economically afloat with just the man's wage if you're from any other social extraction. And I bet this same people would get conniptions if anyone around them suggested a basic income, raising the minimum wage or an expansion of welfare benefits.

[@theprecipiceofreason]

This video makes me so sick of people who seek additional authoritarian validation. Basically humans making themselves pets.

[@laurabergman6674]

It's often missed that those traditional 50s wives were drugged out of their minds. Amphetamines in the mornings, martinins in the evenings and valium for a bedtime knock out

[@bas_ee]

And husbands beating wives was the norm. The cops would just say "listen to your husband next time!". Im 110% these people only like the not-working and the clothes of "traditional".

[@NJGuy1973]

And today everyone's either vaping, toking, or popping SSRIs.

[@Ahzpayne]

Marx was wrong. It is nostalgia that is the opiate of the masses. And it is every bit as pathetic as those who cling to it. I come to your videos to learn more about how people think. And I leave understanding (and liking) them even less.

[@angreed66]

Religion and nostalgia go hand in hand. Only someone who desires the simple past can accept the absolutist framing of religion.

[@Mkeyvillarreal]

I think the explanation for this "backlash" is simpler: Millenials are growing up and having kids now.

[@D_Andrew_G]

I don’t really care much for the tradwife stuff, but it’s unfortunate that you immediately look for negative readings of this phenomenon simply because, in my opinion, you think it’s only on the side of conservatives. Like: “oh look what conservatives and religious people are doing, let’s reference every reading that negatively depicts it to affirm my world view.”

[@lostcat9lives322]

Tragedy isn't created by the "evil" person. It's created by the all too common coward. Cowardice is the true plague of our time.

[@BubblesXBoomerLover]

The reason I even seemed interested in the Trad wives thing is to figure out how to turn my house into a home. I love to cook, I love to clean, and I love to pamper my hubby when he comes home. The problem is....I work all day, same hours, same stress.The work/life juggle is harsh for sure. Thankfully, my hubby and I split the chores... but I sometimes wish I could just stay home all the time and keep the house clean, cook nice meals, and raise a family. Doesn't give me a paycheck, though 😅

[@karaokeandrandomclips]

Even if you don't get a paycheck, if you were a housewife, you can help by freeing up your husband's time by doing more of the chores, and save money by cooking meals from home, etc.

[@luigidisanpietro3720]

Put worth into your cooking, cleaning, tutoring the kids, washing and ironing the clothes etc.... Imagine, you are a teacher, chef, housekeeper, and mechanic ~ that's a lot of money. 👌

[@kingflumph5968]

I'm always a bit skeptical of the people who say they want the world to be "more like" N past period (you can put anything in for N and my idea is the same). When pressed, I find many of them tend to 1) assume that they could recreate only the things they like about that period without any accompanying things they would dislike, and 2) sometimes they haven't even considered that they might dislike such a period because survivor bias means that we only pay attention to successful parts of the past. And also 3) they assume they would be one of the ones in control of the cultural zeitgeist. I don't think I'd be one of the controlling group, given that I'm not particularly religious, and though I can often pass for white, it's not a guarantee. Maybe I could fake it well enough to get the social capital, but I also chafe under the idea of having to perform a certain type of gender role. What makes any of us think that embracing a traditional gender role will always be a choice? Sooner or later the role will demand something that you'd rather do without, but you can't really refuse those and still accept the role, can you?

[@Ford_prefect_42]

Live your life the way you want, don't force me to live life the way you want. I find this trad wife thing horrifying, but if it makes you happy, I won't force you out of the kitchen.

[@aririn3]

Here's where it gets dangerous. When those people use their voting power to restrict everyone else's rights.

[@chuckidalucki1967]

I, however, will ask you to make me a sandwich

[@heronimousbrapson863]

I suspect that those who yearn to live by "traditional values" have a romanticised view of what they might have been, with no actual experience of what that might entail. If the way of life of the 1950's was so great, why did so many people, particularly women, work so hard to change it starting in the 1960's?

[@cancerino666]

Loved the video, but you mostly only focused on how the gender norms affected women throughout the decades. You should have also talked about how the gender norms affected men. It would be much easier to fight sexism if people were more aware it harms both women and men, the later sometimes even fatally (ex: conscription).

[@dontmisunderstand6041]

There's also the expectation of aggressive escalation in conflicts with men, to the point that communication with men is actively discouraged, both by women and less physically imposing men. Sexism hurts EVERYONE.

[@notthething9531]

Men don’t have problems, they are a problem you misogynist incel manbaby. That has always been feminism’s attitude

[@iBeSupicious]

I think my main issue with a lot of these nostalgic values is the way people who believe in them carry themselves. Gay folks, for example. Just want you to let them be gay in peace, their happiness and peace doesn't rely on you also becoming gay. You can be hetero, leave them the hell alone, and they'll still be happy as shit about it. But people with more "traditional" values, such as Catholics, and Trad-Wives. Not only want you to accept them and allow them to believe in and live these lives. They want you to also believe in, and live that life. They want you to be a catholic, they want you to be hetero, they want you to be or have a trad wife.

[@gradientO]

You can't speak about nostalgia without mentioning the intense nostalgia for older games in Need for Speed community, so much so it feels like circlejrking

[@YeTism]

Underground 2 is a banger though

[@TheDarkbluerock]

I may not be so passionate about it, but for me personally Underground 2, Most Wanted and Carbon have a special place in my heart. I understand that it is circumstantial, those were the games I grew up with and I still like them to this day. I'm just not that much into racing games anymore. I must say though the recent ones look good, maybe enough to at least try it out. And yeah you always have annoying people acting like that one specific game was made out of gold...

[@Obiwancolenobi]

That's INCREDIBLY niche, not really required mentioning

[@ebubechiibegbula5968]

Need for speed most wanted , remains the best game of the franchise , simply because your car doesn't get damaged.... And you can have fun running through police cars.... People play games to escape reality safely .... Why the hell did they have to make car crashes have consequences for the player....

[@JamesDecker7]

@@YeTism It has a huge place in my heart after almost ruining my grades in the second year of college!

[@userMB1]

Being a Trad wife is very privileged. Who the hell can afford to stay home all day and have kids too?! Another thing for the rise of tradwives i think is the succes of feminism; women can really be themselves and don't have to fight for (almost) anything anymore. I also think that for many women we don't need to overthink it; they just like being a tradwife. It's really not that complicated 💟

[@zzamorano1717]

Exactly what I thought, this "trad wife" nonsense is just another social media trend being shoved down people's throats by vapid and passive aggressive influencers, all for the sole reason to please their sponsors (corporate overlords). Wait about 4 to 5 years (I'm being generous) and this shit will eventually die off when the money for this starts to dry up and the corporate sponsors start to walk away. Nowadays, social and cultural movements like "this" are can't have any sway from the public due to the ever-changing taste and desires of people, social media has basically accelerated this. In addition, a lot of these "movements" are simply just passive-aggressive advertisements from companies run by out-of-touch, shallow, emotionally detached, and outright miserable middle-aged men who constantly trying to figure out what "kids are into these days", so there's no authenticity with them and never bring any "revolution" that people keep spewing. The very existence of this "influencers" prove this; I mean look at these people, they are lazy, desperate, unhinge, pathetic, unimaginative, vapid con-men. Actually no, that's an insult to actual con-men because at least even the most idiotic can make a sell as long as they have some charisma. These influencers are talent fact hacks couldn't make it into a traditional showbiz so they decided to become walking, talking, billboards instead.

[@trillionbones89]

But answering the question what motivation drives this trend is a valuable study. They are not driving to become housewives because they like chores, kids, etc. They are interested in becoming tradwives. Something that goes further and comes not from the same source as just housewifing*

[@zzamorano1717]

@@trillionbones89 I no doubt that this is simply just another escapist fad pushed by vapid no-talent influencers, because let's be real these people who try to push this shit are no way in hell the real thing, there are obviously either middle-class or upper class bimbo's get along their funding for this idiotic and potentially dangerous fed from desperate and/or deeply cynical and immoral corporations and/or their extended rich well-to-do families including their husbands. In the end they should be only recognized as what they are, spoiled,entitled, opportunistic, self-absorbed, arrogant, emotionally desperate, out-of-touch, and possibly narcissistic con artists, nothing more nothing less. The only kind of attention should ever receive is scorned, mockery, scrutiny and/or utter ambivalence.

[@Bellinasaur2643]

Lol I don’t really think women can just be anything. Legally yes, but societies expectations towards women are extremely constraining

[@lostcat9lives322]

Take the vote away from the "trad" women and find how much they love "trad".

[@OliverNorth-b5q]

They may like it.

[@kseniaverlaine]

It’s not about nostalgia, it’s about wanting to be the best version of yourself in relationship. From my personal experience I am the best version of myself as a woman with a traditional man. It’s a great energy exchange and a harmony. It makes me softer, calmer and more feminine.

[@JustsomeSteve]

You do what makes you happy. It's weird that in America people seem to always want to tell other people how they should live their lives. Here in Germany we don't really care what you do in your private life. It's your life, and we just hope that you are happy but really don't want to know more, because we don't really care, lol..

[@dontmisunderstand6041]

And do you imagine that this brings about the best in your partner? Or is it simply enabling your partner to be the worst version of themselves? Or is this simply a self-centered obsession with no regard for your partner? Not trying to judge or persuade. I'm simply curious about your answers to (what should be) the most important questions a person asks themselves about their role in a relationship.

[@robbieskids9159]

Traditional man? As in someone who works 60 hours a week and is so tired when they get home they can't help out. Someone who misses all their kids little league games and dance recitals because they're too busy working. Lol sounds awesome.

[@ThisUserPassedAway]

@@robbieskids9159yeah both parents could be working and it still happens lmaooo yet it’s just that no one’s never at home. You’re no better than these so called trad wives gtfo with your hypocrisy and judgmental ass

[@biegebythesea6775]

Mate, some whole countries are nostalgic. I'm from the UK. Nostalgia is what we do.

[@manicpepsicola3431]

Yall still have a monarchy it tracks

[@denimchicken6549]

Arguably, of late, so are some no-longer-existent Republics.

[@Nick_CF]

Yeah it shows 😂

[@svc335]

I’d like a more conversational version of this video. I think the reason I get frustrated watching them recently is that I know how much more needs to be said on the topic, and the time limit restricts what can be said. For example, during the renaissance, considered one of the most culturally important moments in western history, was crazy nostalgia for Ancient Rome. I don’t think nostalgia is breaking culture at all, we’ve been fed nostalgia for the past since the 1960’s. The Overton window has moved so far that just being a boring Catholic in a traditional way makes you some sort of reactionary ? Just because being a hyper-individualistic hedonistic consumer has become the norm, doesn’t mean people searching for an alternative is literally being a Nazi. I’m saying this as a Socialist, who thinks the issues brought up in the video are mostly because of neoliberalism. I love philosophy, I love this channel, but I want more perspectives than the usual Foucault and Derrida, deconstruction etc.

[@mickael486]

Someone told me years ago that feeling nostalgic was a mild form of depression. I think she was right.

[@MLBlue30]

Then change would beneficial be therapy. Nothing should stay the same forever.

[@lukeharrop4620]

It is, and it isn't. Some can be uplifting. But too much can be damaging. I'm going through it right now

[@ethanstump]

As someone who has bipolar, it comes from a dissatisfaction of the present moment. Nostalgia only appeals to those who are aware of the present moments failure. It's why it's hard for a child to be nostalgic, not only because they don't have happy memories of the past, but because the present isn't as insufficient for them as it is adults. It's also why nostalgia most often is nostalgia for childhood, a time where we didn't have to focus on tedious bills, and instead of night classes learning the boring parts of human anatomy, we remember that Cool nature doc that our science teacher played in class with our friends. That being said, even capitalism is increasingly moving toward nostalgia, not even on the right with bringing back child labor, but on the left trying to bring back mass transit.

[@mickael486]

@@ethanstump I can get behind public mass transit though. nostalgia aside that's just a Good thing. Child labor being reinstated by the right, is just pure corporate evil via the Republicans per usual.

[@ak-ub1ym]

If u are saying this as a American then absolutely yes. American culture is heavily based off on advertising and consumerism . American/western society And it's culture has barely existed for 500/600 yrs & most of that history has been rife with conflicts or revolution and even at a time of peace , ppl were preparing for wars so western culture has been a volatile culture with not backbone that takes the shape of ppl living in it when compared to eastern cultures which have around 6000-7000 yrs of local culture that is passed down from generation to generation so there is a strong backbone to that culture and not volatile like the western one is ( this does create problem of archaic traditions but that is another matter) The american/western culture was at its peak in the 80's / 90's when the efforts of foreign immigrants economic/social changes finally bore fruit & civil unrest within the country subsided so that is when the american culture was finally finding it's backbone but after the 90's is when crap hit the fan with america becoming more and more a military complex instead of normal democracy/republic(whichever u prefer) intensified by coldwar sentiments and back into the hellhole again with military capitalism and whatever cultural backbone it has developed was lost after 00's. In america , there is a major disconnect with their actual history and the history taught in schools as a kid so what do u think happens when these kids grow up? The bubble of ignorance pops , and when somebody faces their true history that is unsanitized or cleaned up , they want to run back to the older days when things were simple which happens to be the 90's nostalgia so yes nostalgia is ruining american culture.

[@ak-ub1ym]

Thank you for whoever took the time to read this comment and give a like , appreciate it.

[@abelrrant]

Because I could not be present in my life and was anxious of the future, for some reason I looked to the 60s. Particular the art scene and counter culture at the time, I had a romanticized vision of the 60s, I read Patti smith, because of the lack of knowledge I had of it, later on I learned more about it and confronted its history from art to politics, social norms, the fantasy fell off. I realized I was afraid of the present, I could not replicate the actions of the past because those times, places and people are not there any more. But despite looking back I gained a far nuanced of history and complexity of current world and what led to it. I got into leftist politics, and intersectionality, it has slowly chipped away all capitalist ideology and ideals, I'm still learning, history is all around me and that gives me meaning, but I lack autonomy of my current circumstances. The flocking to 90s culture and vaporwave. Is to relive the past, yearning for ideal times. Our present will be future nostalgia, I wish as people lived in the present.

[@1wayroad935]

Like most things in life, it's fine as long as you don't go overboard with it.

[@julio.dealmeidabranconeto5831]

people will ALWAYS go overboard with it, because is always easy to just defaut to extremes.

[@FirestormX9]

​@@julio.dealmeidabranconeto5831 that's genuinely intriguing, because that actually always happens, isn't it? Why is balance so difficult?!

[@jakethunderbird8735]

@@FirestormX9 because humans.

[@Aaron-kj8dv]

I like the Mark Twain quote "everything in moderation, even moderation"

[@MisterCynic18]

​@@FirestormX9 movement tends to want to keep going in one direction unless acted upon by an opposing force. Balance is constant opposition of equal strength, which requires much more effort to achieve and maintain.

[@serephita]

I feel like some of the "tradwife" movement (much like the one in the video that you first posted as a clip) is it has roots in not just conservatism but yt nationalism. Segregation, McCarthyism - all of that. That is what those people are nostalgic for. I enjoy watching people who recreate fashions from those times (and earlier) as a more sustainable clothing alternative but that is "fashion not values".

[@TheGrimStride]

From what gathered from this video (never heard of tradwife until now) tradwife is not a bad or toxic thing. It seems like someone who wants to be a housewife and not dress sexually. If their partner is ok supporting both of them, then I don’t see the problem.

[@serephita]

@@TheGrimStride the first person (the blond) that was shown in the video is the yt nationalist style tradwife, who thinks feminism is a disease and is destroying "traditional values". Many of the tradwife influencers on social media are similar to her.

[@hankhillsnrrwurethra]

Valium was invented because 'tradwife'. JFC

[@Aaron-kj8dv]

Damn, this says a lot more about you than it does them. I don't think many people have nefarious secret plans or motivations.

[@catsmom129]

@@Aaron-kj8dv it depends what part of it they’re drawn to. Do they just want to stay-at-home and wear vintage clothes? Or do they want to roll back the whole society, including the overt racism? Wanting a tradlife for yourself is fine; that’s not what worries people. I don’t know much about the community, but I’ve heard there’s a deeply reactionary segment.

[@grkpektis]

That POS movie Ghostbusters Afterlife was torture to get through because most of that movie is just shoving nostalgia crap down your throat so morons in the audience can go "hehe I remember that from my childhood hehe". Not as bad as 206 though

[@joenathan8059]

First off being traditional isn't just far right,this idea funny enough only strengthens them because average joes don't like being paired with Nazis. Second the bible veres about marriage also says that the man must also submit to their wives,only in spiritual matters is he the head of the house. Finally i think this return to tradition comes from the fact that liberalism isn't working and theres already a system that has been working for years. Now that doesn't mean i want to go back or not understand why these were put in place. Couples should be equal,we shouldn't oppress lgbt people or be misogynists,avoid racism and facism etc. What do you guys think?

[@godofnothing428]

In what ways is there a return to traditionalism? Not these tik tok performative bs.

[@joenathan8059]

@@godofnothing428 people are becoming more conservative in their thinking and who they support politically. Leftism for alot of ppl has been seen as deranged or misguided at best. and whether or not its just the media putting misinformation and their own actions being caught on camera like riots or how the left engages with ppl online, i think its making ppl tired with them.

[@lancegibson2708]

Cringe astroturfing by conservative think tanks

[@skylinefever]

What I find funny is that conservative think tanks were also for letting investment firms do whatever they want. That included buying all the affordable houses and making them unaffordable. 1950s wage to house prices are never coming back, and that is partially to blame. Any argument against is as considered Mao's war against landlaords. At one time, the entire political spectrum treated houses as places to live, not vehicles for investment firms to turn into financial gimmicks.

[@hankhillsnrrwurethra]

@@skylinefever I live in a new California neighborhood that this town did right. Dense, walkable, livable, really nice. All we need is a train station. Don't mind the guy who shot three people including a cop in the park down the street yesterday. That is also California.

[@Aaron-kj8dv]

This is actually conspiracy thinking

[@stayanddrown]

"It isn't an illusion of the human mind, as some historians have suggested, to believe that older is better. It is in fact an authentic memory of the last sane moment that we ever knew". Terrance McKenna

[@veronicamaine3813]

You get that memory is perhaps the most mailable part of the human experience. Eye witness reports a usually horribly inaccurate and that’s for things that happened recently. Memory is the last thing that sanity should be depending on.

[@joshv.1490]

Sorry Terrance, that's exactly the kind of fiction fascists love to peddle. The glorification of yesterday. It's a trap to those who are ignorant of history and unable to extract themselves from the innocence of childhood.

[@stayanddrown]

Neither of you idiots get it. You both take yourselves too seriously. And only look through a single lens. It must be painful having those sticks up your asses.

[@Wavyso]

​@@joshv.1490clearly what's happening today isn't working

[@joshv.1490]

@@Wavyso are you implying that yesterday things were?

[@jackroyaltea5034]

This whole video is legit stupid. I respect you guys. But there is absolutely nothing wrong with grown adults choosing a way of life that leads to raising, well adapted healthy children. A support system. My wife is my equal. Not in all things. There are areas where she easily passes me up and vice versa. This idea that we are exactly the same.

[@Lyoko920]

I’m like 11 minutes in and all I have to say is god I hope I never end up like this 😬 Edit: I think this also applies to adults (mainly millennials and Gen Z?) retreating into childhood with childish aesthetics or avoiding accountability. There’s an article I can’t remember the title of that touches on this. Basically younger adults don’t have as many of the traditional markers of adulthood (house, stable job, marriage, children), and a number choose to embrace childhood or extended adolescence rather than redefine adulthood (say, emotional maturity, being accountable, etc.). Rather than mature and find what power is available, infantilize and deny oneself agency (often using out of context science like brains aren’t fully developed til 25). All in all, looks like it’s best to rise to the challenges of the times.

[@Lyoko920]

P.S. I’m not arguing that it’s bad to enjoy some childhood favorites or dress “childishly”! I’m more focused on attitudes and behaviors. Hopefully we can all act as responsible and compassionate folks who dare to grow and change.

[@Nick_CF]

I find it infinitely frustrating watching my generation fail on every aspect of being a well adjusted human being. Too many grown ass adults thinking like infantile children.

[@skylinefever]

How the hell are we supposed to, when back in the trad days, guys with an HS diploma could get a decent job and buy a car and house with it.

[@FirestormX9]

​@@skylinefever probably indicates we need to step up the education system and the employment system alongwith it.

[@alexisrobinson9180]

I completely agree with the attitudes thing but with the traditional markers of adult hood such as marriage, children, house, stable job… buying a house is way more difficult for us than when our parents were young, even renting out places. im gen z with my own place and my rent has jumped 4 times since I moved in two years ago. And it’s supposed to be affordable. my moms first place was literally fraction rent. Like 1/3. Alot of people are only getting by, by getting roommates and splitting rents. And this is a wide spread change. Another thing is about children and marriage. A lot of women in our generation are questioning if or not those things are even for them. There’s also the fact of changes in dating, we’re a lot more anxious and not as confident as previous generations. A lot of more people are single. Things like owning cars aren’t seen as important as they were in previous generations because of ride sharing apps like Uber and Lyft. Younger generations are also at least trying to reject capitalism with movements like “I don’t dream of labor.” And what’s being talked about in this video. Though I agree we aren’t as motivated in that area. It very complex but some of these are simply differences in political and economic changes rather than failures of the younger generations to adhere to “traditional markers.”

[@Matty002]

this nostalgia has always been the territory of the mid and upper class cis het whites. the times they romanticize are always worse for the poor and non cis/het/whites. whats extra annoying is theyve been doing this forever. nothings new

[@The.Foolosopher]

I think it's good. I know a lot of women who, all their lives, have wanted to be stay at home moms and raise kids. They had to pretend to want careers in high school or risk being ostracized. Speaking as a high school teacher, I have not seen any school tell kids that it's ok to want a traditional life or to be a stay at home mother/father. We tell the kids they have to work, that is empowering, but all the while each generation is growing up without ANY parents to help guide them through life. Kids do WAY better when they have one of their parents at home. And I think if you look at the progressive degeneration and dumbing down of each generation into mindless consumers over the past 70 years, I think a lot of it can be tied to the fact that people are being parented less by their actual parents, and more by media and corporations who are actively profiting from our children's suffering. And I think if there's any commotion about this trad wives trend, it's because the media who profits off the BS they feed our kids (and us!) see people actually being around to parent their children as a threat to their stranglehold on our society. I really hope this channel has not become a pawn of those bad faith actors.

[@stephennootens916]

Stay at home dad's have been on the rise in part duo to the pandemic which force many to work from home. The reason why both parents work has nothing to do with want an has everything to do with need. Many families just get by with two incomes thanks to how the system works.

[@Rithmy]

"And I think if you look at the progressive degeneration and dumbing down of each generation into mindless consumers over the past 70 years, I think a lot of it can be tied to the fact that people are being parented less by their actual parents" - I disagree on that explaination. Our economic system has a much bigger impact.

[@GuttamindAnimation]

Great points. After the pandemic a lot of women left the workforce in exchange for the benefits they saw of being at home for their spouse and kids. I'm surprised he wasn't more nuanced about that because it was their informed decision. They weren't "Running away from modern problems". The video has an undertone of modernism being always right and never wrong. Sometimes progression can get us off track as well. All I know is that a lot of women are tired soooo 🤷🏽‍♂️

[@mikhailg4667]

Yes, So well articulated. It's the corporations that are the issue. It's difficult when so many are good-intentioned, but might get wrong idea. Like instead of trying to understand why people gravitate to tradwives, they're "shamed" and ostracized. It just furthers polarization. Thank you for your sharing your comment.

[@billyLego4855]

I only became nostalgic becouse there was nothing on the table familer in the present and disappoints by respected people ghat look like voids of what? You going feed me something that sees me from heart and soul? Or I go back and see there was some meaning there, that like a time machine, it's like I could go back there imginatining that people wouldn't disappoint me and accept me for who I was. A better prospect l. Or see reality as its harshness and nothing you feels matters and people that interprete you as being, nothing but utility for their wellbeing accepted lives, as I have listen to those people, who are, tell me what I am? You ever find who I am or bugger off if your not interested. That's my thing. Look our current state is toxic, minimalist and ridden without meaning.

[@billyLego4855]

But the video your saying of 50s housewife and stuff, no I grew up with people.

[@billyLego4855]

Sure I would live a meaningful relationship, but that's unlikely. I just go back and go with simliers. I miss people in their universities. Smiling, happy, cosplays, games. E3. Music. I had my friend and he made it nice for me. And my family. I just wish I lisa saw me for who I was, not British or some generalised propaganda circling the internet, but just me. So, I just play mgs ground zeroes. I seem to get comfor for those things.

[@rus.t]

I don't think this is nostalgia, it's more reactionary to the other side.

[@WisecrackEDU]

True - like a reactionary nostalgia.

[@Aaron-kj8dv]

I think people embrace nostalgia because it's easy to remember fondly and romanticize , and people understand a lot of modernity looks like a path to turning us into worker drones. Even girl-boss feminism is "just focus on making money for the billionaire, you don't need a family". Even if people don't think about it that way, deep down they know it.

[@TheFirstTriplefife]

So true. The fact that you see many women who have bought into the feminist narrative come to the conclusion only after hitting the wall and realizing they have nothing to show for it except cats and wine really does show many women just want to buy into the fantasy more than the reality of things. Its really the same for most of these types of people in general. Can't look past the utopia they are dreaming of to see its ran by slaves in the background.

[@mikhailg4667]

THIS! it's why it's hard for me to appreciate Disney Star Wars or Disney Marvel. It feels so corporately-calculated to maximize marketing, masquerading as modernity and inclusivity, but comes across so inauthentic. Combined with rushing productions to make quick buck, the product is absolute shite and why so many people end up yearning for that nostalgic thing the corporation just frankensteined back to life.

[@butterflymoon6368]

It's fine to not want family, though but I wouldn't consider girl-boss feminism to be a thing. Feminism is about choice not saying 'you must be a business woman' or 'you must be a parent'.

[@pisceanbeauty2503]

Those same sentiments existed even more so in the part. The Labor Movement existed for a reason.

[@dontmisunderstand6041]

People see modernity turning us into worker drones only because they fail to realize the past has been doing that for hundreds of years, due to their nostalgia blinding them from seeing the past as it actually was.

[@Dragon_With_Matches]

I think there’s plenty of room in our society to both grow and move forward while allowing people to emulate things from the past that they think are valuable (as long as those things aren’t actively harmful to society like racism, etc.)

[@IconoclastX]

No their isn't. That's why housewives are so hated in our culture because only one view can win out. The reason housewives are hated is because they represent something that everyone wants but can't have. Every man and child wants a housewife. They bring infinite value to a home through meals, love, etc.

[@ilovemesomme]

Our culture is stuck, has been since 2007-2008.

[@Aaron-kj8dv]

100% even the movies are just live action remakes of past movies and I can't think of any major advancements in music. Nothing interesting is happening in culture so people are just turning it up to 11.

[@ilovemesomme]

@@Aaron-kj8dv Yep, even the iPhone isn't all that much different today than it was when it came out design wise.

[@seanburrell7571]

I wish

[@TheDarkbluerock]

Thank us? No, thank you for making theses videos! Great work!

[@garyjohnson8327]

Are "social justicers" constantly pretending like it's 1962 performing toxic nostalgia?

[@djgroopz4952]

Yo!!! That's a great thought. I think most people pretend it's 1950 in one way or the other.

[@TheGrimStride]

Being a Tradperson doesn’t sound like a toxic thing. It just people living their own life. Just cause you don’t want that life, it doesn’t make it toxic

[@ronthebrawn2232]

I think they wanted an example of Toxic nostalgia but didn’t want to go to the manosphere again 🤷‍♂️ Maybe Wisecrack just assumed tradwives are toxic or far right bc of the aesthetic

[@stephennootens916]

There is a question how traditional are this people anyways. Even the classic sitcoms parents June and Ward Cleaver were not truly traditional when it comes to their family. June was a collage educated woman and the two often talked over what to do when Beaver or his brother got into trouble. They followed a lot of the modern thinking at the time about parenting.

[@maei7287]

Living a life is great, I myself enjoyed few years my husband let me stay home and do my stuff, I did the same for him when he needed to finish his studies. But if you are an independent female creator who earns money/self-actualizes on the internet by saying that woman should devote themselves to their husbands and that all woman's rights movement of last 70 years is trash(some of them strongly imply that..) it is fine to get called out.

[@FirestormX9]

​@@maei7287 it is fine indeed

[@brendonnorton5322]

I think there is another take which could be had on the emergence of a return to traditional aesthetics and morals. We tend to believe in progress, which, in a gross oversimplification, views the present and its attendant changes as better than that which proceeded it. However, it may simply be that for some millennials and zoomers, they do not find that what has transpired culturally over the last 60 years is better in every respect. I think when it comes to sexuality, you are seeing a major backlash to hook-up culture and pornography in works like Christine Emba's Rethinking Sex: A Provocation and Louise Perry's Against the Sexual Revolution. Their basic premise is that something like the sexual revolution has a number of deleterious effects, but the response of culture is simply to become more sex positive and less tethered to any type of norm. They contend, without completely dismissing the sexual revolution, that there are older norms which were there for a reason. Perhaps we should give trad-folk the benefit of the doubt and try to see if there is substance to some of their views rather than explaining them away as reactionary.