The College Crisis: It's Not Just Debt

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Why Does College Suck Now?
In America, it’s a well-established fact that if you want to have a successful life and career, you need to have a college degree. But in an era when more and more students leave college with astronomical debt and struggle to find the types of stable jobs their parents had, is college worth it anymore? And how did we get here in the first place? We’ll explain in this Wisecrack Deep Dive on Higher Education: What Went Wrong?
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Written by Amanda Scherker, Michael Burns, and Amelia Buzzell
Hosted by Michael Burns (follow Michael on twitter @Michaeloburns)
Directed by Michael Luxemburg
Editing and Motion Graphics by Jackson Maher
Original Illustrations by JR Fleming
Produced by Olivia Redden and Griffin Davis
Music courtesy of Epidemic Sound
#College #StudentLoans #Wisecrack
© 2022 Wisecrack / Omnia Media, Inc. / Enthusiast Gaming

[@typemasters2871]

I remember hearing a quote that is along the lines of “The price for college was reasonable, until colleges realised that they could just have banks pay for the students, and the banks realise that they could just sell college loans to college students with interest”

[@WillmobilePlus]

Banks sure as $hit didnt do that. They were known to NOT give loans for people going into these stupid majors that many of you go into today. They were bashed for being too selective because they knew some rube with a C-Average in high school, going into philosophy, had no way of paying that back. The STATE is who opened up the spigots. That got the universities to crank up the prices, because people like you cant do math.

[@SlapstickGenius23]

We live in interesting times.

[@vinylninja00]

And this is why Wisecrack is one of the best on KZbin right now... Some of these videos are so well edited and informative, and it's not that people don't believe in the college system anymore, its that every generation after the next has a new way of doing things. There are some jobs in life that are so essential to our well being as HUMANS, such as doctors, dentists, plumbers, builders and so on. But what happens when we are all at peace, what happens when people truly know how to take care of themselves and put their well being first without the need of some of these super expensive amenities. Lol I think schools, and people going to schools, should know that, what the job really is, waiting for you is the one that older people are forgetting how to do or just gettin too aged to continue to do so. Thats what education really is. Even in higher paying jobs, you still have to figure out how to market yourself, sell yourself and services to others, and so forth. The job market is shitty, because you have to be more than human sometimes, you gotta be super human. Able to sense the changes in your environment, you gotta take care of your own personal ideas, while workin' for other people, and still be tryin to market yourself as an individual. Sometimes I think the world could use a " Reset " But unfortunately, history repeats itself on so many fronts. Its like tryin' to prevent something from happening, because you've seen it before, but then ultimately, you become the reason why it happens. Lol, We're all stuck in this circular way of thinking, trying to find meaning in the reasoning, for reasons that benefit some but not all... And Wisecrack... This is why I draw cartoons. Lol Holla at ya boy if you need some character designs that you can animate, with quick turn around rate, only 5 easy payments of 19.95 plus shipping and handling. LMFAO!!!

[@bobisconsumed520]

exactly the problem, college was equitable before banks. Now its pay a billion in student loans for maybe a chance of getting hired at Starbucks and even less of a chance of becoming a CEO's assistant.

[@Syger]

Yep. Greed fucks us all. :)

[@emilyemily9328]

I would just add: it used to be that many of the “practical” subjects of study were actually taught on the job, no degree required. Now we have a system where companies do little or no training of new employees (instead hiring only experienced workers) so it is even tougher to get a job, yet the debt collection machine never stops.

[@dukebanerjee4710]

It's like the military. Jobs back in the day were "for life", so it paid to train people who were expected to work at the same company for 20 years. Today it's more like hiring mercenaries, both for the employer and the employee, especially with "at will" employment. There's no loyalty on either side, and everyone is looking at profits. If you're a skilled mercenary, as an employee you can earn a lot more. If you're not. you have to take what you can get. The gig economy is going to make this worse.

[@wonder_platypus8337]

@@dukebanerjee4710 been on the job hunt scramble for a few weeks now. ... man this hits.

[@777SilverPhoenix777]

@@wonder_platypus8337 Even if you don't stay if you live in the US the postal service is always hiring. it pays well, so it can at least help you for a bit if you need cash. I work here as a mechanic (started as custodian) despite going to school for computer programming. I realized before I incurred a ton of debt that the market was flooded. Most job locations require 4 years college and 4 years' experience. so, I dropped at a 2-year degree and tried something else. At current I get $35 per hour to sit around waiting for machines to break with full benefits.

[@marnenotmarnie259]

@@wonder_platypus8337i hope you've found something (ideally something that you enjoys and pays well but yk)

[@GratitudeDay]

@@wonder_platypus8337wishing you the luck of having a job by now. I’m constantly freelancing and doing contracts. Horrible. Hope it’s better for you!

[@WikiSorcerer]

Ironically, I was introduced to Wisecrack by my Philosophy 101 class from a cheap, downtown community college. It was recommended to me by my mother that I go to a class just for recreational purposes and she thought that Philosophy would help me articulate my thoughts enough for social interactions. I didn't think very much about philosophy before. Now it colors a lot of my thinking and actions.

[@WisecrackEDU]

That's amazing! And yes, community colleges and city colleges are such a great educational resource.

[@internalizedhappyness9774]

I wish my mom had that aspect that your mom has!

[@bwackbeedows3629]

@@WisecrackEDU What are city colleges? I've never heard that term before.

[@WisecrackEDU]

@@bwackbeedows3629 in some parts of the states it's the name used for two-year public schools.

[@samhank]

we love you

[@chuckthurmond]

As a college freshman in August 1984, I paid $441 for tuition at a state university. It's now $9,200 at the same university. I did not major in mathematics or finance, but that seems to have outpaced the rate of inflation by a huge amount.

[@mandisaw]

A big piece of the puzzle, especially with public colleges, is that states pulled out much of their block funding to college systems. Instead, they get paid a per-head figure based on enrollment, which doesn't really cover the full costs - communal stuff like labs, dorms, building & campus maintenance, faculty & staff payroll aren't readily broken down to a per-student dollar amount. So the bulk of the costs are transferred over to the students' financial aid (as discussed), or whatever money the college can wring out of alumni and/or extras like off-campus property rentals, sports franchises, research grants/patents, etc. Basically that $441 was *highly subsidized* and now it's not. Taxpayers collectively decided - via their often-Republican State legislators - that they didn't want to be in the business of paying for Higher Ed at the State level. So we pay at the Federal and individual level 😅

[@peachypietro9980]

Hell, even inflation can't account for THAT big of a difference

[@zacks6118]

Yeah it has definitely outpaced inflation. For the $585 example in 1970 in the video it would be about $4500 now

[@iCarus_A]

@@mandisaw a general problem with the capitalist system, the rich that benefitted from the system is not properly incentivized to return the favor

[@mandisaw]

@@iCarus_A "Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and it never will." Still true ~150yrs later...

[@joshuaamoore]

Maybe I missed it, but I was a little disappointed that Reagan's education adviser from his 1970 reelection campaign, Roger Freeman, wasn't quoted: “We are in danger of producing an educated proletariat. … That’s dynamite! We have to be selective on who we allow [to go to college].” “If not we will have a large number of highly trained and unemployed people.”

[@WisecrackEDU]

True! I think we only avoided that direct quote as we put out a KZbin short a month or so ago that revolved around that one. But what a chilling thing to say.

[@joshuaamoore]

@@WisecrackEDU First of all thanks for replying, and thanks for all the work that you do. If you really want to be spooked read the portion of the Powell memo calling for increased participation of business in the workings of higher education against the nefarious influence of social sciences departments graduating "scores’ of bright young men … who despise the American political and economic system."

[@cybersiku6846]

A large number of highly educated people who are unemployed... hm why does that sound so familiar.

[@joshuaamoore]

@Andrew Hart The video makes the point though that universities didn't begin as a kind of vocational school for knowledge workers, they were a place where people were able to explore philosophy for its own sake. There's no reason you couldn't have tradesmen who are also philosophers, and in the past you often did. They were the ones fomenting change among workers, and what the Reaganites were afraid of.

[@JN-wr9he]

@Andrew Hart why should there be any ‘premium’, especially an artificially created one? that is called ‘privilege’, if one is honest. in any case, the real premium is in natural talent and character

[@vulcanhumor]

My grandmother went to college back in the 60's. She talks about working a summer job to pay for it. Just working summers. That's unthinkable to me. She's helping pay for my education now, because my parents can't and I can't.

[@TheBrazilRules]

I hope you chose a good STEM field major and not some liberal arts useless deegre

[@SinHurr]

Shit a Summer job doesn't even compensate for what I make the rest of the year working at a junior high (tech, not teacher).

[@neonfroot]

Most older adults are willfully ignorant of the economic prospects for younger generations.

[@alphacause]

In short, the college experience has devolved from one that originated to produce an enlightened class of people, who were free from debt, to a nightmare that produces useful workers bereft of enlightenment, who are further yoked with such an onerous debt that they will forever be beholden to their employers.

[@lydiaohlydia6635]

SO well-put.

[@Orsonfoe]

as my dad would put it. they want you smart enough to do your job but not smart enough to ask questions.

[@aozf05]

This is perfectly exemplified by the sadly common attitude that "college (and K-12 education too) forces you to take useless classes that you'll never need for your career." People just don't think of education as inherently valuable. They only care about its usefulness. I used to think like that too, and school was always a drag. But when I shifted my mindset and realized the real value of what I was learning beyond its direct usefulness, college stopped feeling like a waste of my time and money. I enjoyed my classes (except for language requirements. That one is kinda bullshit).

[@maddie9602]

I wonder why business elites, Christian fundamentalists, and jingoistic nationalists are so opposed to learning literature, philosophy, and other humanities. It's almost like all three of those groups benefit from a populace that doesn't think too much ...

[@blargithonify]

@@Orsonfoe more importantly not smart enough to ask the question “why do I need a job at all?”

[@maximeclermont6339]

"An adviser to both Nixon and Reagan, Roger Freeman, said the quiet part out loud when he told a newspaper, “We are in danger of producing an educated proletariat. That’s dynamite! We have to be selective on who we allow to go through higher education.”"

[@BoredBela]

As someone who works as a staff member at a major university, I have seen a massive amount of people leaving higher education for corporate jobs that offer higher wages and better working conditions. Many who have left stayed for years because they loved working with students. But it has become increasingly clear that our jobs are about making profit for the university.

[@julianadeau5797]

My dad was an associate professor at UNL until the school administrators cut his entire program (Industrial Education) to add 8000 new seats to the football stadium. Because of this, my parents lived apart for many years as my dad moved from state to state looking for work. I lost all interest in Husker football because of this and to this day, I find myself longing for a higher education system whose primary focus was education and human enlightenment. 😢

[@WisecrackEDU]

That's horrible 😟

[@shogunite1404]

As a young boi from a conservative town, with uninvolved parents, it's refreshing to get an all-encompassing perspective about WHY there's a wide-spread college crisis in the US. Thank you for these videos, they definitely help with my understanding about why some things in our country suck, and why they shouldn't.

[@DrCruel]

Just so you're aware that it's Leftist assholes like this guy who have helped make college into the radical Marxist ripoff it's become today. They don't care about you. They care about the maximum wealth and assets they can squeeze out of your work future and your uninvolved conservative parents.

[@shogunite1404]

@@DrCruel See, this how the concept of education has been distorted. Many years ago, it was all about broadening your horizons and exposing yourself to new material that challenged your beliefs and views. Now, it’s all about preparing you for a job, where people like you claim that it’s a scam because not every degree leads to gainful employment. This a fundamentally flawed and wrong way of thinking about education that was born out of the Reagan administration, and its views on economics and the role of education.

[@DrCruel]

@@shogunite1404 Originally it was about preparing you for a job in engineering or as an officer, like with West Point, or in advanced fields. Educated, literate parents would form Societies of Friends would build a school and hire a teacher to educate their children. Then the schools became more liberalized, arguing that children needed to learn about their country to become more patriotic citizens, and to learn how to think critically. Higher schools of learning included literature and philosophy as part of their curricula. Around the early 20th century, socialists began to attempt infiltration into the schools. They began with the colleges, forming the American Student Union (ASU). The argument these groups made was that a good college education was about broadening your horizons and exposing yourself to new material that challenged your beliefs and views. These challenges would invariably be socialist talking points, and later, pro-Bolshevik pacifism such as the Oxford Pledge. There was a terrible crisis in this regard in early 1940, as the anti-fascism of these groups became pro-fascism after the alliance between the Bolsheviks and National Socialists, and these pacifist groups expressed favor for the Bolshevik invasion of Finland. This caused support for the ASU and like groups to collapse for almost 20 years. Later these groups enjoyed a marked resurgence during the Vietnam War period, with some student groups even involved in violence, terrorism and assassination. During this period these socialist groups began to use schools of secondary education to infiltrate and monopolize control of teachers in the elementary and secondary public schools. Now colleges and universities are increasingly becoming institutions dedicated to Marxist indoctrination. Rhetoric about "broadening your horizons and exposing yourself to new material that challenged your beliefs and views" has been declared as fascist and a tool for white supremacists, as free speech or indeed any speech that diverges from socialist doctrine is suppressed in academic institutions and the Left itself becomes increasingly fascist in their own outlook. With the rise of the entitlements industry, socialism has become big business and many students take majors that are openly Left fascist and which prepare them for high paying low skill government jobs in the social services. This a fundamentally flawed and wrong way of thinking about education that was born out of the Johnson and Nixon administrations, and the views of radical socialist revolutionaries on economics and the role of education. It has since transformed into a massively corrupt system, where poor students, often minorities in schools segregated by teacher unions, learn Marxist racism and class hate but not simple mathematics or literacy. This is why, for example, at my alma mater the mathematics and computer science departments were reduced and moved in favor of new and expanded gender studies and race studies programs, and why space for the Interfaith club was assigned to a "Unity Center" that is a radical Marxist group and paid for by student activity fees.

[@gljames24]

@@DrCruel fuck off. That's not how college works.

[@TwoSoulsOneCup]

@@DrCruel define Marxist racism. Define only plz. There's a lot of implied fuckery to unpack here, not withstanding the need to use Marx as a pejorative as its slapped onto anything conservatives don't like.

[@leodelauso1592]

Recent Gen Z business school grad here. I started my first year as an English major but moved into marketing because it seemed more desirable in the job market. Despite hearing many people say that business degrees are versatile and offer more career opportunities than humanities, my experience and those of my friends who walked the stage with me, shows that it's not. If I were to do it over again, I would've pursued a course of study that I'm not only passionate in but can translate into personal growth and a better community. I spent my time away from class working part time at a bookstore, an amusement park, and writing for our school paper to help pay for tuition and after graduating and finding a job in my field of study, I realized that spending time writing and reading what I was passionate about had taught me more than figuring out Google Analytics and tracking KPIs ever could. Long story short: if you're still in college, don't change your major on the "promise" of better salaries and job prospects. I got my dream marketing job after graduation with great pay but left the position because I realized it wasn't as fulfilling as I thought it would be. Also if anyone here works in publishing, hit me up.

[@kamilareeder1493]

Yes ☝️😌 I majored in dance and people often have a difficult time understanding the concept of me picking a job based on love and a desire to improve the feild and continue the legacy of the dancers who came before me 🤷‍♂️☝️ honestly, I think if you really love something and devote your life to it, you will find some level of success. 👀😌 Some things are just more important than money 😅🙈 its more expensive to live than it was in 2014 when I made my choice, but I dont regret it. According to national data, 75% of working dancers in NYC are considering quitting the feild ☝️🙃🤷‍♂️ like neoliberalism and divestment could actually kill the heart of American dance in the next decade and thats dead sad.

[@joeking433]

The world would be a pretty boring place with everyone having a business degree.

[@ChibiDarksai]

Fellow business management grad here, and my degree is the ultimate cop-out degree. It's the dime a dozen of degrees. It's the "I had to pick something that'd help me get a real job" degree. It's the degree that no hiring manager actually gives a shit about seeing on a resume. Majoring in business management as an undergrad means you need to go to grad school and pick a more specified field to get anywhere. Thankfully I picked finance and lucked into a pretty great career...

[@eliashe1797]

Been suggesting the same to students for almost two decades now.

[@michaelsoares5908]

I’m applying into business. Any advice on what to do either now or for when I go to college?

[@sinnsage]

well here’s my story - i grew up in an academic family of teachers, going 2 generations back. i’m an elder millennial, and college wasn’t a question for me, it was an expectation. i got accepted to a cal state university, but opted not to go at the time, partly for some social reasons but mainly because didn’t know what ELSE i wanted to do with my life (as a 17 year old fuckin child), aside from being a stripper - which i definitely knew i wanted. cut to 20 years later and with no formal university education, as a producer/director/sex worker, my small business COMPANY pulls in several times what teachers make (and this is NOT a good thing). when i go to the grocery store i don’t look at prices, i’ll put it that way. i had to purchase my own health care (which fucking sucks but here we are), and i opened my own 401 K and Roth IRA accounts. this career was a CHOICE i made and i’m extremely happy with my life, but it almost feels like i was seeing the writing on the wall with the whole college thing. contrast this story with my absolutely brilliant brother (a younger millennial), who is doing important work in psychology after getting a phD, but having just gotten it is over $200K in debt (and is barely making enough to cover rent on a 1 bedroom apartment in orange county) and drives a hand me down pontiac that is falling apart. this shit is broken, and maybe if young people stopped buying into this rigged ass system the colleges would be forced to change something!

[@paladinplays5886]

I think the only reason this isn't higher, is because this isn't a verified account (Or people are scared to upvote this). I think your story should be higher, because I know this is more common than ever.

[@Bustermachine]

@@paladinplays5886 I don't think anyone is denying that this is a real problem. The problem is that you then get a parade of people who claim the very concept of higher education is a sham.

[@joeking433]

You're a sex worker? You destroy society and drag men to hell with you. Isn't that special!

[@cryptbeast3222]

@@Bustermachine It's also very situational. A lot of entertainment industry jobs can make you far greater money, as can many trade jobs, but this isn't a set in stone thing. A lot of people scrape by doing those jobs as well.

[@kingofpigs6630]

Can I ask why you wanted to be a stripper?

[@kinglowtier]

Great watch! I worked in Higher Ed (State and Federal) for about 10 years and saw all of this first hand. Seeing how top heavy they all are and how sports is the main fund dump for many, I agree with SO much of this video. I think the entire system is pretty much beyond saving at this point. That's not even addressing the continued push from corporate America for "educated candidates" where they constantly share job postings looking for Master's level minimum candidates starting at salaries of $35-$40k per year.

[@RedIria]

Corporations that look for Masters level minimum candidates are looking strictly for students on F-1 visa who are working on their masters in the US as a method of bypassing the H1-B lottery. They can pay them less and they can use them to displace American workers with the added argument that their American counterpart is unlikely to have a masters.

[@joshuaamoore]

We need highly subsidized public universities and trade schools to provide a cheap alternative to for-profit schools and drive down their tuition. Not likely to happen in the current political environment but it would solve the problem.

[@mandisaw]

Agreed that the problem is too systemic and entrenched for any tugging on the margins to solve it. That said, since I [still] work in higher ed, I'd say the first step is obvious - we need to get taxpayers more directly invested in State/local education. Funneling the money through the Federal gov't & banks was a decent idea, but it transformed segregation rather than reformed it (i.e. economic vs racial), and shifted way too much of the burden onto individual students/families, who lack the experience or expertise to make an informed decision. As for employers, I'd say what we're seeing is degree-inflation - a lot of graduating undergrads flinched at either the '08 or '20 job market and ducked back in for a Masters, regardless of academic interest or even career ROI. Employers know they can get away with underpaying new-grads, regardless of what their credentials are, and so we get "entry-level" positions asking for Bachelors+4 or Masters+1. That's a different clusterf*ck though...

[@sinnsage]

and people BEG them for the opportunity to get paid poverty wages after accumulating massive amounts of debt!!!

[@stephenjarvis534]

I would have nearly have sold my soul to the Devil to get those kinds of wages, and I have a Master's Degree.

[@danielharrison2383]

I went to grad school to become a therapist. Shortly after my class finished, the school ended the program but kept their business programs. This has got to be related.

[@solarmoth4628]

This is sad to me when we need more therapist than ever. There’s simply not enough therapists to serve the current population.

[@asianamericanadvice6016]

Counseling programs have proliferated, and so has the number of therapists. Also programs like Creative Writing have increased tremendously. All as a result of the availability of massive student loan amounts.

[@MiraBoo]

@@solarmoth4628 The problem is, therapists either (1) serve the community, end up in poverty, and are forced to change careers, or (2) open a private practice and compete for the few elite clients who can actually afford to pay the salary you need make a living and keep the practice running. I want to be a therapist, but I can't afford to actually help the clientele that needs it, so I have to find a career that I won't go destitute pursuing.

[@davionwilliams4011]

If I could go back in time, I'd really just tell myself to skip college and go straight into a trade or something. Even during, I had questions like "is this right?" Thousands of dollars to be taught off PowerPoint slides and put into an assembly line. It just felt....disingenuous

[@WisecrackEDU]

Definitely, the problem seems to be that so many students in America aren't told that there are plenty of trades where you can learn a lot and make a really good living without going into debt. Hopefully that is starting to change.

[@davionwilliams4011]

@@WisecrackEDU because as always, money talks. the more "lucrative" path is to lead them into loans and debt and let them (the students) worry about the collateral damage in their pockets. i too hope the consensus is starting to change but as long as there's money to be made from students being led astray so to speak, its going to be a slow shift.

[@cfri9332]

@@davionwilliams4011 Plus a lot of those people that stand to make that money have a survival of the fittest philosophy. They believe it they are in position to exploit a people that "allow" themselves to be exploited, then doing that is the moral thing to do. Manifest Destiny essentially. As awful as it sounds, if you ask this to them right to their faces, they may pause... but ultimately they would agree that that's how they unashamedly feel.

[@SilterisAurora]

I relate to this so much. I went into massive debt chasing a degree in IT that ended up in complete due to issues with funding. I was angry as all Hell finding out that a couple of certifications and the right network would get me further than the nearly 4 years i spent chasing that piece of paper. I really wish i would have avoided it. Im going to be paying that debt until I die and it didnt even do anything for me.

[@jdoggsoxfan33]

I’m a huge sports fan and I will be the first to point out a big problem is athletics. Universities are throwing millions of dollars at coaches, and raising tuition prices to justify it. People are literally being kept out of schools because State wants a AAA defensive coordinator for its football program

[@ceulgai2817]

I luckily didn't have to pay tuition, but wow if this isn't true. I went to a school where we had NO hopes of ever having major success, yet we kept throwing money into our sports programs and fields- that the majority of students just ignored.

[@paquio100]

Yeap, my school pays the coach a million a year and the team sucks ASS

[@aaronlittle5478]

I like a quote I heard recently about athletics funding. Universities are an athletics institution with an education side hustle. When I attended the University of Arizona, my mom got a job in the finance department there. She got to see some of their expenses. The basketball coach, Lute Olsen, was a legend but the thousands spent for even his office chair is gross to think about now.

[@borkbork4124]

I am an athlete, but not a college athlete. My school, and region, never offered my sport as a school sanctioned sport. Btw it is ice hockey. So, I played on local youth competitive leagues and once I turned 18 all I had were recreational leagues. It sickens me how new and pristine these school fields and courts are for football and basketball (generally speaking the sports that make the school money), and yet other school sports struggle to get a player a jersey. Then, there are ppl like me who play sports that are not even school sanctioned. Meaning, if I ever wanted to play competitively in an organization that wasnt a part of my school, I would have to drop out of school bc the schedules would not work and my school would not accommodate. There is some truth behind every joke, and so when ppl joke that the star football players’ professors pass them in their classes……it makes you think how broken this all is The one nice thing I think benefits students greatly is student athlete advocacy and compensation. These athletes do a lot and can do a lot of harm to themselves mentally and physically. Especially in football with concussions, and all they get is their tuition covered at best and can go to bed hungry? If you are going to make them your performers for a few years they need more!

[@derricksteen403]

The only problem with this assessment is athletic programs aren't funded by the school. They have independent athletic funds that pay the coaches and support the facilities. You can argue that people shouldn't donate to those athletic programs and should instead donate to the school, but that is the individuals choice. There are people that only follow schools for their sports teams and wouldn't give any money if they couldn't give it to the sports program. I'm not saying that there aren't issues with college athletics because there are, but to say the university is choosing a basketball coach over staff isn't true, because that money can't be used for anything other than athletics.

[@maddie9602]

My inorganic chemistry textbook cost $410 at the bookstore. I instead bought the exact same book with some extra u's in it from the UK for $40. Even with $20 in shipping, I saved hundreds on it. I often took advantage of it, but it was always infuriating to see how much the books cost without the ridiculous markups they're sold for in US markets.

[@solarmoth4628]

I’ve done the same thing befor the textbook was like $120 so I bought it used from overseas for half the price.

[@maddie9602]

@@anonymousnarwhal4323 ah, Sci-Hub. Even now, I couldn't do my job without Sci-Hub (mostly because management at the company I work for don't see the "value" in their researchers having access to literature and refuses to pay for us accessing articles legitimately, but still)

[@KeyDash753]

I'm a professor, and I can confidently say that professors in general are sick of textbook prices. My department has almost entirely switched over to free open-source materials.

[@d.w.stratton4078]

Ah yes, but they also flip the er to an re in words. Indecipherable! Lol

[@jdonvance]

Isn't this how Amazon rose to power? Another thing to blame this crisis on.

[@boonelockyer630]

The egregious textbook costs are why I and my peers formed the Student Library where we collect physical and PDF copies of every text book used in our majors so we can provide them to the underclassmen. Freesources are a blessing to these freshman looking down the gun of, I kid you not, some $800 textbooks...

[@solarmoth4628]

There’s nothing that could justify an $800 dollar textbook, that’s insane

[@mide2476]

@@solarmoth4628 Yay, I'm speechless 😶 just thinking 🤔 about it.

[@minieyke]

Grandad bootlegged beer, so we could bootleg books with marginal differences from the cheap 20 year old edition

[@SerifSansSerif]

Honestly, I feel like I repeat myself all too often. The problem isn't college but the monetization and commodification of all things. College as a place for the things that make you a better person, if not a richer one is incredibly important, just as it is for student in high school to have more access to the fine arts and philosophical realms of thought, as it is for our libraries to have the funding and do the things they do, as also mentioned them glossed over so quickly here, just to have leisure time to work on self improvement and enjoyment and to have the breathing room to create those random whimsical things that become the next internet, the next apple computer (back when they were kids in a garage not the quintessential megacorp only recently out-1984ed by Amazon)... What we have is a world run by made up numbers and a false scarcity supporting and supported by those made up numbers and the desire to be the person with the biggest number, regardless of what that number represents... Then again, that's the take of a millennial philosophy major drop out who left after his first year when he felt unmotivated because most classes were high school on repeat.. (which is why he attended every philosophy class he could because, they were the only thing engaging and not like high school). Now if you don't mind, after saving for 20 years by not paying student loans, I'm hoping I can put a down payment on a used barrel from a local winery to live in....

[@rafaeluttempergher6915]

As many of us, anxious GenZ adults in a rush, I'll probably have to watch this in 2 or 3 parts. Weaker attention span or busy schedule, you know the drill. But man, I love how Wisecrack doesn't compromise the quality of their content in sake of shorter and simplistic texts. Promoting the the best discussion forward no matter what. I feel complimented. Thanks!! Here in Brasil, public college is being undermined for years. Eventually, we'll succumb to the same crippling student debt problem that is inherent to private higher education. Or at least this is what I think is going to happen to me and other middle class members. Rich families will always have enough cash to support our agro-frat-boys to become doctors and stuff.

[@WisecrackEDU]

Thanks for taking the time to watch it, no worries if you break it into a few parts! Sorry to hear about what's happening in Brasil. Sadly, in Europe it's similar, where many countries that used to have strong public university systems are leaning towards an American model to pretty devastating effects in terms of educational quality for students, and working conditions for professors.

[@ezmodey1105]

Nah dawg, you gotta watch it while you're supposed to be working like us lazy, self-centered, and sheltered Millenials.

[@jdepaul87]

@@ezmodey1105 Hooray for working all day and not being able to afford a studio apartment, amiright?

[@TranshumanistBCI]

I'm an Indian and I study at IIT, best university available in my country. And my fees for semester and hostel is 200 Dollar for the whole YEAR (i.e. 100 dollar each semester) zero scholarship . And I just realized how expensive the education is abroad. Hence every parent in India wants their kid to study in the premiere government institutions. And I've come to realisation why government hospitals and education institutions are necessary for middle class and lower class people.

[@loturzelrestaurant]

@@ezmodey1105 KZbinr Some More News and Second-Thought both explore Debt and where its coming from. Their whole Channel is specialized on intereting Video-Essays!

[@AlexanderNecheff]

I think my calc textbook was almost $400. Fortunately, the math faculty got together and agreed to teach from the same book so you could do calc 1, 2, and 3 even with different professors and spread that cost out over 3 semesters.

[@kamilareeder1493]

Okay thats not bad 🙂☝️ especially for a book like that which you might actually consult again 🤷‍♂️👀

[@JasonX909]

I wonder how many students missed the memo and rented it though. It's something I would've probably done haha

[@williamdelaporte2341]

Wait, people actually buy textbooks? I bought one for my first semester of physics, didn't use it even once, then never bought another textbook again

[@avemnevoiesideiarba]

We just xeroxed copied everything, job done

[@Bustermachine]

@@kamilareeder1493 Except there's no reason for that book to cost even 50 dollars.

[@calvinmiller3044]

Hey Michael! I hope you're okay. I've been noticing that the Wisecrack videos you've been posting have been presented with an underlying sense of depression. Love your content, but I hope you're taking care of yourself as you tackle complicated and hard topics in our society. Wouldn't want to lose you. Much love!

[@WisecrackEDU]

Thanks Calvin, Michael here! I promise I'm taking care of myself, but you're right that sometimes it's hard not to get a bit depressed when thinking about this stuff so much. Really appreciate you looking out and for all your support!

[@krkrkrkog]

I was going to say the same, hope you’re okay man!

[@mariaelenamartinez2477]

Lol I don't think the video is depressing or the host is depressed. Just saying, good informative video, thanks!

[@JoseGarnelo]

That's a very nice touch Calvin, cheers 🍻

[@Clewnkaart]

This is a beautiful comment! There are no words to express my gratitude towards the whole of Wisecrack and you as host! I may life across the ocean, but that does not mean that the topics discussed here aren't worldwide and bring more enlightenment than any college degree. Your worth as an "investment" might not be obvious at times, but you all have enriched my life and for that I'm ever grateful!

[@lifotheparty6195]

College for me in particular was a good investment however I majored in a marketable skill that is in high demand (accounting). Specialized in auditing and forensic accounting specifically. I served in the army to pay for my college while at the same time the financial crisis hit people hard. Came home on leave to see teachers I once had were now working at the local factory. I’m honestly passionate about auditing and fraud investigations. I absolutely love calling bullshit on financial paperwork and doing my best to safeguard people from shit. The system is fucked and I feel like one guy trying to empty the ocean with a tin bucket…but honesty I wouldn’t live any other way. One must imagine Sisyphus happy, after all.

[@Blodhelm]

Or Tantalus, given the water XD

[@bwackbeedows3629]

Sisyphus pushed that boulder for the promise of eternal life. Never stop asking this world for more; please keep on fighting.

[@Dong_Harvey]

Be wary, as soon as they can, every executive/politician will quickly computerize your job away

[@danielavillacorta_from_lvm]

Probably the most hopeful comment I’ve read so far. Thank you for protecting ppl financially much appreciated 😊👍

[@benqurayza7872]

You are fortunate to have had the aptitude for and interest in accounting, a readily employable skill.

[@CornOnDeCobb]

At the doctorate level - graduate school is a meat grinder. Foreign students are the primary import in exchange for the prospect of visas. Threatened by their advisors for not handing over their entire lives. Higher education is in total free fall in terms of credibility.

[@itisred100]

One of my law school textbooks this year was going to be $560. Fortunately, a classmate sold me his pristine copy for $30. It's an older edition, so he couldn't get anyone else to buy it, but so far I haven't found any differences other than with page numbers.

[@marieodu3149]

That’s literally how we survived universities 😑 and sometimes we were lucky enough to get a heads up WHEN meaning which semester the new book edition would be used.

[@itisred100]

@Pushiswin yeah, my favorite part is that my professor wrote the textbook

[@mandisaw]

@@itisred100 In undergrad we had a mix of actual published textbooks, instructor-penned notes & lab manuals printed by & bought from the college, and all the many smaller humanities books. There were a lot of resources that we got through the school though, that many of the college students nowadays seem not to know about or use. Like the libraries had to maintain reserve copies of course textbooks, had all the journal subscriptions you'd ever need, and could request items for you via ILL. Now you can also get book rentals via the Financial Aid office, if you qualify. Even when I had to go live in the desert for field camp (Geochemistry! Rocks in their natural habitat :), much of my equipment was loaner gear from the department. It was a stretch for my family to afford my hiking boots & sleeping bag, no way could I have afforded the $$$$ that full-prep required.

[@AwkwardConverse-ation]

Z-Library is also a great source for free books

[@Bustermachine]

@Pushiswin Education isn't a ponzi scheme. The attached parasites are who have made themselves gatekeepers to an education are.

[@HenshinHead]

Speaking a someone who had to walk away from college because I could no longer afford it (and that was at public universities with grants and loans), I've personally felt that even traditional public schools are turning more and more into massive rip-offs. I never felt I had any real support from the faculty while I was attending the "real" university full-time, there were dozens of rules in place designed to stifle or take away grants and scholarships over the slightest screwups (with only narrow paths to earning them back), and honestly most of what I learned wasn't applicable to any real-world job places, and I was an Engineering major who had switched to a programming degree! (Well, programming degree disguised as a game design degree, not to make it any more obvious which camp I fall in). If a kid like me who graduated fourth in his class in high school with honors and AP credit could still be put over a barrel by the modern American higher education system just because he came from a poor family, then what's the point? At the end of the day, all this system is doing is draining the talent pool of eligible students to the point where we can't fill vital skilled labor positions. Not to mention the constant naked attempts at putting profits over quality of student experience has just slowly eroded any public trust people have in higher education, despite how "vital" that higher education has become for participating in the modern economy. It's a slow death by a comedy of errors, and it would be so laughable if not for how tragic it truly was.

[@Angelhaswings555]

My friend I really feel your struggle, I can’t say I’m in the same boat, but a very similar one …

[@bluephoenix8470]

Excellent comment.

[@javiersaenz1040]

I am glad I recently graduated college debt free.

[@WisecrackEDU]

Congratulations, that's amazing!

[@Not_Sal]

I’m on pace to do the same

[@kaylynn4750]

I did too, but man it’s hard and I was incredibly lucky to have family willing to support me.

[@Devibaba]

"... imagine how we feel after researching, writing, and filming it ..." 🤣 Thank you for your sacrifice ... and for sharing. 😝

[@iancompton6494]

I work as a field guide for a paleontology company. I take about 100 people a summer to dig dinosaurs and participate in research. I haven't gone to college. People also ask what I am studying in college. I tell them the price is not worth it. I have a dream job only because I put in the work and did it my own way. I'd love to go to college and properly study the field I work in but it's so damn expensive. The catch 22 is that if I go to college I may not be able to do my job due to my financial situation 🙃

[@recon441]

I love how personal this video is

[@WisecrackEDU]

Thank you!

[@dexteradao4186]

I am not American but I watch a lot of American movies and because of that I always thought American students are drowning in debt because they use their money and loans on booze and smoke and partying every night lol.. I learned quite a bit on this video because the topic of students loans is fascinating to me since we don't have that in my country.

[@KD-ou2np]

I can't think of a single american college movie that is accurate to my experience as an american college atudent today.

[@wolfworks7339]

Understandable. Coincidentaly those movies are made that way on purpose to trick american kids into thinking college will be the time of their lives. That way they sink into more debt, and faster.

[@friedrice4015]

Partying every night lol I wish. More like doing 8+ hours of work every single day, including weekends.

[@dexteradao4186]

@@friedrice4015 So that's why I find the culture really weird. In my country, it does not make sense to be partying at all while in college because it is too expensive and very tough to get through. Only a quarter of graduates passes the board exam where they get the license to practice their degree/trade. The last thing any of them want to do is burn through their parents saving and produce nothing in the end.

[@kukachoo42]

hsgjdkfkfk if the rates of college debt matched our purchse and consumption rates of substances, wed all be dead. it wouldnt even mathematically be possible for that to be the case. i realize that conclusion you came to is not a reflection of how poorly you view americans, but more of how it is nearly impossible for you to be able to comprehend just how massive the college debt rate is.

[@fdfischer]

I kinda wish we could all afford to go to college for the old reason of personal improvement, not just getting a better job

[@charlese.maddox1447]

In undergrad at the University of Texas at Austin (spring 2008), my friends and I took an Intro to Public Policy course. Our semester project for our group was to research the rising tuition costs at UT. Our hypothesis was because it funded the Athletics Department. After research, we discovered UT-Austin is one of the few public institutions where Athletics is self-sustaining, and actually gives back to Academics. What we did discover is that UT-Austin had approximately three (3) to four (4) times as many administrators (i.e. Associate Vice-Presidents) than other flagship public universities (we compared to UC-Berkeley, Ohio State, and UF-Gainsville). Again, this was just an undergraduate project so we never developed it further. But from our perspective, at least at UT-Austin, our revised hypothesis turned towards the increase in administrators/non-academic positions and subsequently, their salaries.

[@WisecrackEDU]

That's amazing, Charles. And it makes perfect sense, administrator salaries have jumped up in recent years where faculty salaries have stayed pretty flat, and like you all found out, many universities seem to be adding more and more administrators while getting rid of full time faculty.

[@teenkitsune]

My father's response: "so, what's the problem?" Seriously, my father thinks all this is right and how it's supposed to be!

[@joshuaijaola2145]

People could imagine the end of the world before the end of capitalism

[@teenkitsune]

@@joshuaijaola2145 With my father it's not a matter of can't, it's a matter of he doesn't want capitalism to end, he drank the kool aid and refuses to even consider alternatives.

[@connorpeppermint8635]

I find appealing to anti elitism helps break through to conservatives. I'm a lefty and explaining the incestuous relationship between corporations and government in more detail helped them see things from my perspective. Yes the government sucks and can't do anything right but that stems from prioritizing lobbyists (e.g. Private prisons) to the detriment of everyone else (e.g. The drug war decimating inner cities)

[@connorpeppermint8635]

My stubborn evangelical mom is no longer on the "weed=heroin" train

[@joeanthony7759]

Sorry to hear that. A lot of people refuse to see it for what it is.

[@TheMatthew001]

I recently graduated with an engineering degree, and i don't regret it there are aspects of my field of study i find interesting and what to have a job in, but the huge limitation the expense and the fact credits expire prevented me from adding courses i would have really enjoyed learning. like a second language, video game programming, drawing, fictional story telling, every single one of these was additional debt, not able to fit into my schedule, not admitable due to the fact i was in the Stem field and not the arts, or risked making me stay too long at the university resulting in required credits expiring. i didn't go to university to learn something i was passionate about or even interested in, i found a degree i had a passing interest in so that i could get a well paying job.

[@cadmean-reader]

A lamentable compromise of becoming "a unit of investment" becoming more and more solidified and day-to-day actual lives and living. We are all "human resources"

[@onyourleft5648]

I came to college partially to be a student athlete, and partially being forced by my parents. I hated learning as I had been told I was only good at my sport not thinking. I slumped really hard and was awkward due to said fixation on my sport. That time went to school, and I learned to like it but hated writing and English courses seeing the courses as below me due to formulaicness of every writing prompt reading or non-math or multiple choice question I got. Fast forward to late sophomore year, and my philosophy professor explains that everything you have been told about philosophy is a lie, that the first western book on love is about gay sex, that we are balls, etc. He delivers the book and socrates style of discourse to me and my reluctance turned to curiosity, it didn’t seem boring. I read and reread the readings I loved every second of that course, and signed up for every philosophy adjacent course I could as a business major next semester. The passion I had couldn’t be stopped and my business major seemed less and less attractive by early junior year, although my sport was not successful, my awkwardness had melted as I now had interesting things to say, I knew things and interpreted reality so different that although unique I was never boring. By the end of that first semester I was considering swapping majors to philosophy. The professor, a nice man who had been the first to properly teach me deontology, Adorno, and nietzsche, told me after me asking me about this. “Are you prepared to live out of your care, move 1000 miles, or let your parents support you? If yes do it, you have potential. If not, it’s probably better to add it as a minor.” Dejected, I forgot about it for months, seeing a minor as a failure, and until talking to my on again off again girl at that time, she just told me to see if it’s possible to do a minor. I loved every minute of it, and only wish it was financially possible to continue to a higher level. Our education system, failed me in the sense of promoting intellectual growth, and was resistant at every level for me to push anywhere but to be a cog in the machine. Pushing me into business despite creativity and philosophy being such a clear passion as soon as I heard a single second of it. By the time I graduated KZbin had popularized philosophy as a much more fun career, and I can only wish I was born 5 years later without the indentured servitude that is the burden of student loans. TLDR: Boo Reagan and corporations

[@peterjvo9629]

I didn't even realize this was a 45 minute video until Michael mentioned it. Thanks for hard work, Wisecrack!

[@starwarsROXmy]

I graduated college in 2019, my 5th year at Syracuse because I liked to party. In hindsight, my degree, which is in history, may not have been the best option but I chose what I am passionate about rather than what will make me money. At this rate, paying off my debt seems impossible and it bums me out.

[@deathlytree434]

In a world without money there is no debt and there is no more blockers to you learning my community friend stay strong!

[@starwarsROXmy]

@@Anonymoose66G I'm not sure to be honest. I currently work for a historical museum in my city, and I absolutely love it, pays decently and above minimum wage, but it's not exactly helping my debt.

[@jordijimenez2634]

Should have avoided college then man, Only reason I’m college atm is for data science I wouldn’t really go unless it’s stem or finance ngl

[@starwarsROXmy]

@@jordijimenez2634 bruh what a totally ignorant thing to say lol

[@mandisaw]

@@Anonymoose66G It's more that History - like most humanities - is not Bachelors-terminal. If you want a career in academia, you'll need to go for the doctorate. Even most good K-12 systems will want a double Masters - subject + Education. As for specialties, there are certainly professions like Library Science, Museum Studies, Conservation, etc, but again, you'll need more schooling, and often a dual-focus program or double-degree. I think the biggest flaw in the Humanities - for decades now - is that the careers are becoming economic class-locked. You have to already know what the opportunities are, and be able to afford a PhD (or double-Masters), and ideally have the sort of social & professional network that gets you in the door at places like the Symphony, major museums, etc. The career guidance is sorely lacking.

[@chrisludden395]

I'm generally annoyed by discussions surrounding higher ed and student loans in the US. Everyone simplifies the issue so they have a bad guy to score points on. Your video does a great job explaining how convoluted and multifaceted the problem is. Great job.

[@brandonyohn]

Love this explainer of why I'm never going to financially recover from getting a psychology degree

[@deadinside8781]

*me thinking of going back to school and switching to psychology* 😬

[@joshuafrancis4637]

I really wanted to study philosophy in college, but it felt irresponsible so I went with physics then electrical engineering. Now I work in tech for the money and watch Wisecrack videos for my philosophy fix.

[@dylanhart4778]

I currently attend Academy of Art University, a for-profit campus, since 2015 and I only afford to attend one class per semester. That class alone costs around $3,000.00 in tuition. There are times where I stressed to drop out but my parents convinced me to keep going until I graduate. I look for ward to having my own apartment but I have to wait a few years for that to happen. I realize too late what the costs of attending a school like AAU are

[@Window4503]

Art schools are near scams. A lot of the information you learn can be acquired via online classes. There are tons of art teachers in various industries who are willing to not only teach you how but also the tricks of the trade itself. The upside of attending an art school is easier networking, in-person learning, and a community of artists, but if you're looking for a way out without giving up on your dream, you might want to look elsewhere and save your funds for your future.

[@luluthesiren6222]

@@Window4503 this is true, what's really harsh for some arts careers is that a degree is almost needed to get into the industry, and that alone is almost like a dream you have to throw away cause you can't afford it. I go to fashion school, which is like really helps you get into the industry that is very tight knit because of the superficial etlism in the industry. Even I find it annoying but I love studying something I've been admiring for years.

[@sherlockwho5714]

I was an adjunct but after the pandemic I found out I wasn't eligible for unemployment. I made about 30 bucks a credit hour. I left because I was tired of needing food stamps. I now make a salary that I might be able to live on when I retire at 80 lol

[@OLD.GREASE]

Also I never had a TEXTBOOK cost $585, but since my courses seemed to cost about $380-400+, plus $20-80 per book... yeah that's damn wild that I'd pay that much two or three times a semester instead of once a year.

[@kbanks5754]

My brother is currently enrolled in a school that lets the students work a certain amount (during school breaks) per semester and it completely covers their tuition. The students can express their job preferences/ existing skills and work with their fellow students to do IT support, landscaping, cooking/kitchen work, etc. It seems similar to Japanese schools where the students handle a lot of the janitorial or lunch-serving responsibilities. He's doing great scholastically, he's gotten work experience in several different fields (don't do landscaping if you discover you have allergies, please don't try to tough it out 😆), balancing learning and work (there's a life skill for anybody), and he'll graduate debt-free with a degree he's passionate about. I didn't mean to write a novel. Just wanted to throw out one college outlier (mine was much more like others are expressing in the comments-- wish I had known about this school, but oh well) and I'm just really, really proud of him.

[@WisecrackEDU]

That's really cool, and seems like a good model to help keep students out of debt.

[@StaticArt]

What’s this school called?

[@Timkellypsk]

Back in 2011 and 2012 I had to buy a German book with an online workbook it was like $800. But it was justified because you have 1 book for 3 semester and the code works for 3 semesters. Only to have the company "updated" it the next semester not grandfathering anyone's online codes and requiring the university to use use new books.

[@solarmoth4628]

Couldn’t the school pick a more affordable book? surely there are good german books that don’t cost $800.

[@deadinside8781]

FUUUUUUUCK!

[@andyc9902]

Despicable

[@skymart9609]

Thank you guys for all the videos you've been making lately. These kinds of topics are too heavily politicized today. Beautifully based 💛

[@WisecrackEDU]

Thanks so much! We're just trying our best to make some sense of what's going on in the culture these days. Thanks for sticking with us.

[@chesterwilberforce9832]

One analysis I read stated that the whole nature of college has changed. 60 years ago you got a degree to improve yourself educationally. With the white middle class, it was a means of ascertaining your cultural status. Over time it has simply transformed into a means to get a job, so money got involved on the for profit side. I remember clearly writing checks for 200 dollars for a semester in 1972 at a state university. We have also continuously lowered the bar for graduation in order to maintain this business. In the 18th century, the equivalent to a bachelors degree required you to stand in front of a panel and defend your thesis in ether Greek or Latin. Today, an illiterate football player can get a degree by simply showing up for class every once in a while.

[@farrahaliceblack7453]

At my university in the UK I was student union president for the last two years, and whilst the senior leadership essentially scrapped the entire arts and humanities departments but left the business school mysteriously untouched because of exactly what you described as their measurements of success: which departments had the highest earning graduated a year after leaving? Totally refusing to acknowledge that no one (myself included, drama studies grad) studies arts and humanities because they think it will get them rich. No one studies arts and humanities because they care about being rich. They study for the love of it, and will follow that on into the world outside of uni whether it pays bills or not.

[@WisecrackEDU]

Farrah, that's horrible to hear. Similar stuff was happening at the UK university I was teaching at. It's like these people don't get that if they enjoy reading books and watching plays and movies and things of that nature, then they need to provide courses in the humanities.

[@jonathantrautman]

Hey, I should have said for a while now, I love you guys! Thank you for your humanist, philosophical, and historic perspectives. They are more crucial now more than they've ever been, as we are the most deeply propagandized people in Earth's history.

[@shivasive]

I appreciate this man's dry delivery of cheeky commentary in relation to more serious topics. It s the fact that it makes me question whether or not I take things too seriously or not serious enough.

[@Sk8rToon]

I have my loans paid off (thankfully a grandparent remembered me in a will). But I’ve still put off life milestones because I still can’t afford a house, etc. I can’t imagine how it would be if I still had my loans! I just can afford to eat out more.

[@deadinside8781]

I wish it was possible to sue the U.S. government for forcing people into this position, because what else are you going to do? -this, if anything, should start a serious conversation not bashing. Seriously. Too many have suffered and some are looking to suicide.

[@ImTHECarlos98]

I’m definitely finding more and more people entering STEM, simply because of better job prospects. Makes it harder for people like me who always wanted to go into STEM, as my field (Software Engineering) is getting vastly oversaturated.

[@kamilareeder1493]

I feel you lol. I work in an unrelated feild (dance) but I get how you feel. I think that the people who aren't really about it end up filtering out over time 😌☝️ Your true passion for your work will stand out

[@manninco]

I remember in my 3rd year of an advertising program, a teacher started a lecture by saying that she'd be trying to teach us something we'd likely never learned before at any level, the ability to think critically, and creatively within limitations. The point was to make us more valuable to ad agencies, but that, and my highschool politics class (we were forced to debate from both sides of various topics regularly) helped me develop as a person in ways that I'm grateful for. The sad part to me is that my experience seems to be a unique one, even within those classes/programs

[@erincobb4637]

I paid $400 for my biology textbook last semester. Wasn't even bound- it was the loose-leaf version you have to put in a binder. The real slap in the face was when we were all sitting in class and someone asked a question about a chapter in it, and the professor said, "Oh I don't know. I haven't looked at the textbook." How can you ask people to pay $400 for a book you haven't even looked at?!?! On the bright side, some teachers have started using "equal access" textbooks- basically free versions of textbooks you access online.

[@theletterw3875]

I graduated debt free to plunge into it for unfinished grad school.

[@dom19945]

You have to go for an assistantship or it’s rarely ever worth it.

[@recon441]

Same 😕 I'm looking at grad school now even though I'm just about to finish paying for undergrad

[@theletterw3875]

@@recon441 my best advice is figure out whatever your academic interest is and figure out how to channel it into a nonprofit or startup without the university credentials. Nonprofits/startups are where the money and job opportunities are, you don't need university credentials anymore and it's really the only way to use an education these days, rather than get paid to endorse someone else's point of view because you have the credentials for endorsement.

[@recon441]

@@theletterw3875 interesting, I've never heard this advice before, thanks 👍

[@theletterw3875]

@@recon441 yeah everyone wants to be the marine biologist in the documentary, no one seems to grasp how much grant and donor money is available to the organization making the content.

[@ResseBrown]

I went to college and received a BA in education because all the influential people in my life were teachers - I hated it now I realize I love to organize, I love Manila folders and word documents and analytics - I'm now going back for my paralegal degree and hoping to work in corporate law or criminal law. I'm not 100% sure I want to be a lawyer but I know the field is massive and I have better opportunities with the skills I've learned. If I could go back I would of went str8 to a paralegal or business degree in w.marketing and psychology.

[@elainealibrandi6364]

The world's first university was the University of Al-Karaouine, founded in 859 by Fatima al-Fihri in Fes, Morocco.

[@say2135]

As someone who doesn't live in the USA, this sounds like fiction to me. I genuinely don't understand how education and healthcare can be gatekept like this, for prices to be this ridiculously high, and for it to just be accepted as 'the way things are'. It is outrageous. In my home university I pay 1246$ for a year's tuition, they almost never require us to buy textbooks (instead, the professors provide everything), and if we do have to buy a textbook, it has to be widely available at a reasonable price (the most I've paid for a book is around 25$). The government provides scholarships to students from low income or large families. Public universities must be accessible. We cannot accept otherwise.

[@jinxeffect27]

There's also the issue of businesses simply refusing to acknowledge a person's higher education even if it's relevant to their job. I work for a pharmaceutical company and the pharmacy techs who actually earned the academic certification,that cost thousands of dollars, don't receive any further compensation. I've been thinking about going back to school part time because my work offers a reimbursement program however only for relevant programs so unless I can figure out something that I can still transition out with it may not be worth it.

[@Soca_Jay]

As a recent graduate that majored in philosophy, this video hit home. I chose philosophy because I loved my first class n knew that I would love the rest of my classes. Correctly, I’m getting my MBA because I know that’s my way into the business world, but the perception & reality that I needed to do that is the problem. Philosophy helped me hone in on my critical and analytical thinking skills, and I have to market these skills every time. I hope people see the value in these majors, because what’s the point of majoring in something STEM/quantitative-based if you can’t think qualitatively about the data/information in my opinion.

[@jasono.1629]

Philosophy is a good major you have to be smart and good at very abstract thinking to get a degree in that. My friend who majored in that says law schools think highly of that major from potential students. It’s a good major to have I think. Maybe not as good as STEM fields, but still very good.

[@khaldounsamman9128]

This is an excellent video, with much research and excellent analysis, visuals, and editing.

[@CaraMarie13]

Am glad i graduated college and got my degree, period. Like too many people don't finish their degrees but still have the debt. College for me was a great investment that's has already paid itself many times over since i graduated.

[@emid7373]

What did you major in and what's your job?

[@CaraMarie13]

@@emid7373 i major in psychology for undergrad and social work for my masters. We were poor so undergrad was free and my tuition for grad school was around $28k for the two years. Surprisingly, some parts of social work pay very well and i was able to find the jobs that pay more very early on.

[@rumfordc]

@@CaraMarie13 you should probably include the details of that last comment in your OP, to clarify that yours is not a typical situation.

[@theStarker]

I love the look people give me when I tell them I’m getting a Literary and Culture Studies MA at Carnegie Mellon University right now. It was a strategic choice on my part given the state of education. I firmly believe there will be a huge influx of remedial educational needs (we’re already seeing it with freshman post Covid home school). Community colleges might be the best shot the humanities have at reestablishing critical thinking skills as a normal part of higher ed.

[@AnimusPrime87]

“The guy who invented gravity”… … Nice… … … Nice. 😂

[@nyashes]

Hello! just butting in from France's perspective, paid-for degrees tend to have a lower value than public degrees in most fields due to being seen as less meritocratic. The places in colleges are limited and who gets in vs who doesn't is based on academic merit(usually through a standardized entrance test), unless the institution is for profit, in which case, price is the main factor deciding who gets the right to study there (cue spoiled rich kid that couldn't get selected for a "normal" school and had to have his dad pay for his diploma instead). This trend is completely reversed in business schools for some reason (paid-for degrees are seen as more prestigious than free ones). Honestly, that stinks of some form of either nepotism or manipulation but that's my opinion. Teachers are also chronically underpaid in both types of schools, but that's a general theme at this point.

[@ayior]

Same in Germany, Private Schools are seen as lower quality for taking anyone

[@varimkadas6068]

This video was awesome. I actually learned some things about the college debt situation I didn't really think about till now. I can tell this one was personal for you all.

[@TheRealE.B.]

I work in STEM. College doesn't even do a good job of preparing students for a career. But students pay for it themselves, so employers like it. Poor job training for free vs. good job training at the employer's expense is A-OK according to short-termist principles.

[@jayamihan6534]

I clicked the like button for your tenure review. Hope this helps. Love you Wisecrack!

[@Dug252]

How many things did Regan actually F up at this point, I’m losing track

[@mandisaw]

So many... Several of the ones here were from his time as CA governor, which often doesn't get as much flack

[@no-ds7ro]

the americanisation of colleges across the global south has become a worrying trend, earlier here almost all colleges were funded by the government and were available for everyone but now it's turned into a massive rat race with kids studying 12+ hours a day, students literally unaliving them and parents drowning in debt because "education is the only way for social progress" sigh

[@WhomGodGiveth]

This was highly educational! My journey for a bachelor has led me to one more year as a 39 year old man , two kids and house and two cars. I went straight to college as soon as I was done with HS but after realizing I didn’t have the drive to get all this debt and kill myself in a career I wasn’t passionate about, I stopped and just worked different jobs. In the end I figure the best thing I can do now with an established job that gives great educational benefits is to use them. By next year lord willing, I’ll be done with my BSCS and have zero debt.

[@CozieGhosty]

That Education Connection clip threw me right back to middle school. Was not expecting that.

[@joesjoeys]

$168 dollars for a 2.5 inch thick "required" textbook that we used small parts of only two chapters for (the rest was printouts from the Prof.)

[@WisecrackEDU]

very wild

[@mandisaw]

Never buy the textbook until you see the syllabus. Always ask if a prior edition is fine / check the changes. Find a study-buddy in class and split the textbook. Borrow the course text from the college library, or even from the professor. Nowadays Financial Aid will even rent you textbooks via Amazon, which isn't as known/used as it should be. I used to cross-campus every week to hit the Poli Sci library textbook reserve collection, and my Geochem advisors saved me on some of our $300 texts. Hitting other college's bookstores out-of-sync to your own semester also helped occasionally. Older students, parents/relatives, etc used to tell freshmen this stuff before they walked in the door :(

[@ElizondoAbelardo]

After watching this sad, but brilliant video, I can only say, in a time where universities are becoming less and less intellectual, thank you channels like Wisecrack for lighting a candle of hope in the name of critical thinking.

[@thefishking7582]

I don't really understand why colleges are necessary. I never needed it. I learned everything a college could teach me from the internet. I'm not interested in making a lot of money. I grew up in poverty so just making enough money to keep a roof over my head and food in my belly is enough for me. I at 38 years old I make about $48000/year as a corporate auditor, a job I have for being intelligent, no degree required. I still live the same lifestyle I had when I was making $20000/year 18 years ago. The rest of my income is sitting in my bank and stock accounts because I have no interest in spending it. Never saw the point.

[@Isaac-se4cx]

What an important video to watch! This deserves so much more exposure than it's getting.

[@Blkangerzero99]

Wisecrack, why after all these years do I still remember all of the lyrics to the education connection jingle?

[@garybobst9107]

Turning college into Kindergarten 2.0 was probably a bad idea.

[@braxtongilbert]

Thank you for the time you put into your videos. My perspective widens!

[@joemacy2776]

I usually have a hard time sitting through a 45 minute video, but this video surprisingly wasn't that hard to sit through. It was very informative and kept me entertained. Good job!

[@sekcaJ]

Wise balding man yet again with a banger in depth video. Love it!

[@danielhady3021]

I make more money doing a trade than my degrees ever offered. I ended up pursuing a union apprenticeship and then became a journeyman. Shortly after I went and took a job at a power plant. I can't complain about my pay now that's for sure. I do not regret my college education, double majored in Econ and Poli Sci, because I found them interesting. Makes it easier to sift through the bs in news and reading papers.

[@joseescobar9751]

Just did the conversion of the 585 per year number in 1970 to 2022 and the average price of a college education would’ve been 4,405.05 USD. That’s waaaaaaaay less than a semester at a four year.

[@ajsim]

Awesome video! Thanks for doing all that research and producing this video!

[@aestheticswim3397]

I’m a college dropout and im not ashamed, it was sapping my energy and I wasn’t learning anything there,so I dropped it made me miserable

[@paulweyer4339]

way better than "making it" to a degree only to realize the degree isn't right for you! I know more than a handful of grads who wish they had your foresight

[@aestheticswim3397]

@@paulweyer4339 like I wasn’t learning anything groundbreaking or new and I wasn’t making money or learning to make money which is what I want, to make money so I can enjoy life and survive here College just wasn’t teaching me that

[@pheonixfireblazer]

This all makes me so glad I live in the UK. Here, every year of an undergraduate degree costs about nine thousand pounds. You get a loan from the government which covers this as well as a maintenance loan which is based on your parents' income. That second part isn't perfect but it does help to relieve financial stress and the need to work during your degree. You don't start paying your loan back until you're earning 25 grand a year if I remember correctly and it's written off after 30 years. Chances are I'll never actually pay my student loans off, especially given that I took out an additional almost twelve thousand pounds for a postgraduate degree. From what I hear, the amount you pay back a month isn't a lot. You basically pay a small additional tax because you went to university. If it actually worked like that they'd save a lot of steps. As for the most expensive textbook I've ever bought? Honestly, not a lot. Maybe £10 or so? I studied philosophy so any ancient greek texts cost little to nothing. The university library had access to a lot of digital texts and my course was new so it was still small, meaning I rarely competed for textbooks. Helped that I was always on the ball and got started early so I reckon a few of my coursemates had to wait for me to finish with books. I only ever had to buy a small handful of books. I bought more for my postgraduate degree which was in creative writing. Overall I definitely spent more on textbooks but I don't think many were all that expensive. But I know loads of people with an opposite experience. One of my old flatmates spent about £70 on textbooks before she'd even had a single lecture. Fun fact: if you're looking for a pdf of a paper, just e-mail the person who wrote it. I never ended up needing to do this but I have a few friends who saved a small fortune by doing this. Most academics don't make a lot from their papers despite the amount journals charge for them so they're often happy to send you a copy if you're a student.

[@deadinside8781]

I had to buy some books, some of which ended up going unused and there was no way to get a refund. Most expensive book was a Spanish textbook that wasn't completely used and it was to satisfy an extracurricular credit. I'm of Hispanic descent. I DIDN'T NEED THAT SHIT! Especially not for my degree.

[@pheonixfireblazer]

@@deadinside8781 If you graduated recently you could always try selling them to current students. Wouldn't get all your money back but you could recoup at least some of the costs and help somebody else save a bit of money.

[@laurachristianson1688]

My eldest son (good student actually got a scholarship for his first couple of years of college), got a bachelor’s in biochemistry, then an MBA. He’s still working at the same job I got for him at 15 with the country club I works in as a horticulturist. He is still a groundskeeper at that same place years after I left. He is now 38 years old and despite having all that education he’s now been a groundskeeper for 23 years.

[@cramsa]

In other developed countries, students go from high school straight into professional schools like LAW, MEDICAL SCHOOL etc… in America it was once like that several generations ago but now 99% of these professional schools require a college degree before you can enter… that an extra 4 years of your life and 1/2 of those 4 years aren’t even focused on your major…. It’s as if they are trying to squeeze as much time and money out of these people as possible… then after college education and after the professional schooling is completed, these people carry SUBSTANTIALLY MORE DEBT than their cohorts in Europe and Asia.

[@philcollins5457]

The most expensive book I bought was a stats book for about $250. I got super lucky most years and managed to get secondhand or international editions before that dude got sued into oblivion. I think I only paid for a new book in my senior year.

[@mandisaw]

I have a lot of thoughts, particularly since I work in Higher Ed, and education is the "family business" so to speak. I think there's an entire parallel Live ep in here focusing on the impact of these policies on women & Black people - Sputnik is the reason why the Feds finally really pushed for desegregation & Title IX. And that expansion of education and expectations is probably why we've seen such a hardline pushback from the modern evangelical-Republican Right. I'll save my panel presentation for another day though LOL - y'all finally got me to add your Patreon.

[@WisecrackEDU]

Thanks for the comment, and I think this week we'll dig into some of this further on the Wisecrack Live stream. And thank you so much for joining the patreon! Can't say how much that means to us, and it really is the best way to directly support what we're doing.

[@mandisaw]

@@WisecrackEDU Looking forward to it! And yeah, it's sort of nuts that we're coming back full-circle to directly supporting academics & artists via patronage. New society, same as the old society 🙃

[@willnill7946]

Well if you think desegregation and title ix had anything to do with spudnick it’s scary that you teach. You comment seems to imply you have some prejudice

[@mandisaw]

@@willnill7946 1- Not a teacher. 2- It's Sputnik. 3- During the Cold War, the US looked to exploit *every* possible resource/avenue to beat the Soviets - militarily, economically, even culturally. That included giving safe-haven to post-WWII ex-Nazi scientists, which yielded things like jet propulsion and later spaceflight. But it also included pushing public resources into education, sports, and arts/cultural activities like chess & ballet. Over time, we massively expanded who got access to those resources, just to increase the talent pool, and find the best of the best. Didn't matter if you were poor, or a woman, or Black, or lived in Appalachia - so long as the best in the world was an American, that "proved" that we were better than the Russians, capitalist Western Democracy reigns supreme, blah blah. It's all pretty recent history - there are plenty alive now who lived through it, and it was well-documented in speeches and policy, even movies & news. (Go watch The Right Stuff, or Silk Stockings with Fred Astaire, or Searching for Bobby Fischer / The Queen's Gambit, or any Winter Olympics coverage during the entire Cold War era, esp in figure skating.) If anything, it was a period where the Feds were actively working to reduce prejudice - or at least within the context of achievement on the world stage.

[@jessynachobusiness8619]

Thank you for your comments. I am quite literally a poor, black female teacher living in Appalachia. College was presented as the only chance I had at a stable, decent paying, legally and socially acceptable job for me. I majored the way I did and picked this career with the idea that I would make enough to pay back my loans and possibly have some loan forgiveness as a public servant. I now feel like a pawn in a game I was never meant to understand. 🫠

[@corgi42069]

13:56 "what do I know? I've never been in the national guard" I have. Those soldiers were disgraces to humanity, much less the guard.

[@topshelfmike]

Great video. Good Info and we’ll put together.

[@natedogg890]

It took me 9 years to pay off my 55k student debt, but if I'm honest with myself, I didn't really try until the last year. I spent 8 years paying the minimum and pretending it didn't exist. Don't make the same mistake, it felt amazing to get that weight off my shoulders and I wished I focused on it sooner. Also, if you are making a good salary thanks to your schooling, try not to be too negative about your debt... I had a realization that I was finally making 6 figures, partially thanks to my education, and that's what motivated me to just pay it off so I could focus on the future

[@Ursa_Polaris]

Education doesn't happen in colleges, only accreditation does. Today critical thinking is nearly exclusive learned on the internet. A terrifying reality indeed.

[@Lucas_Simoni]

As someone that started using the internet 10 years ago, I can't possibly think that I'd learn critical thinking from an organized institution.

[@teaguebates5807]

Arguably the most important and informed video I have seen on this channel

[@ryanjackson1340]

I don’t remember the name of the book but year 1 culinary school (2013) 400$ cook book, 200$ baking. Not to mention all the cutlery we had to go out and buy.

[@ryanjackson1340]

Side note, I now work in marketing and sales for Coca-Cola 😅

[@borkbork4124]

I did culinary School too. It costed way too much for it being such a short program, and I graduated in 2020, so I was unemployed for over a year so I got my 2 yr at community college and transferred to a four-year university. Haven’t used it at all after graduation.

[@cramsa]

It has become a literal cult… I have relatives that actually believe a college degree is required to become an electrician or a plumber… seriously.

[@wintermint7]

41:37 lol, I made that decision as a Millenial. Philosophy is my passion, but software engineering pays my bills.

[@WisecrackEDU]

Smart!