How to ORDER EXERCISES for the BEST GAINS!

[@dariofg]

Thank you! This topic is not mentioned often. As someone who designs his own workouts (and for friends) that clarifies many questions I've had for ages!

[@WolfCoaching]

I’m glad I could help! -Milo

[@MrAmadeus1998]

I like to superset compound movements with isolations of antagonistic or complimentary muscle groups. My one session looks like this: Chin Up > French Press Cable Row > DB Shoulder Press Bicep Curl > Side Raise Chest Dips > Watch KZbin

[@LeftistMuslimGynocracy]

Found your channel through your comment on a recent House of Hypertrophy video. As someone who only started lifting as of a few months ago, I really appreciate your more thorough and academic approach to fitness. It's been a huge help in answering a lot of the questions I've had around lifting and cutting through all the bro science advice you find on KZbin! To give some unsolicited advice, I often end up finding smaller KZbin channels when they do review videos on bigger KZbinrs. They get watched by a handful of people interested in those KZbinrs, the algorithm recognises that all these people originated from a small group of communities, picks up the video and then serves it to a bigger chunk of those communities. Could be worth considering, but don't let it compromise your vision for the channel. I hope you stick with this KZbin thing and power through on days when you feel demotivated - you will make it big in time. Your ability to translate what you learned during your doctorate into high-quality accessible KZbin videos is what makes you unique and you're filling a niche which is underserved on KZbin. Keep at it mate.

[@WolfCoaching]

Thank you so much for the kind words! They’re very much appreciated! I’m glad you’re enjoying the current content! I’ll definitely consider implementing your idea, as it seems a good one! Thanks for tuning in - if you have any specific requests/recommendations for videos moving forwards, don’t hesitate to drop them in the comments! -Milo

[@therogueserafim271]

​@@WolfCoachinganother sure fire way to get more views is doing collabs with other channels, like the ones you do with RP. Could be good to try to get Mike to appear on some of your videos. Also, great stuff on your channel! Love it!

[@KeithQuinn-w4e]

I like to keep the order of my exercises so I can track progress in my main lifts. Great information as usual Doc

[@anasbendahou7722]

For the third point you mentioned I agree to do a warm up with light weight of all the muscles you will workout in the session Light weight slow eccentric explosive concentric after warmin up your articulation a good sets to feel your muscle and prepare your nervous system to give all the stimulus necessary

[@gerym341]

Another great video! Some conclusions are quite surprising. Thank you!

[@WolfCoaching]

Thanks for the positive feedback! I’m glad you enjoyed it! -Milo

[@Yupppi]

I do calf raises before squats as a habit left over from weightlifting. Also doing lat pulldowns before bench pressing, both things as warmups. But leaving the rest of the isolations at the end when power and strength is over and it's just hypertrophy set. Mostly because I don't care about their results as much and if I start running out of time, it doesn't bum me out to drop the bicep curls from the end of the session, unlike it would to leave deadlifts out.

[@SH789-x2f]

My goal is/was to focus on my arms so I made a PPL programm with biceps first on pushdays and triceps first on pull days with the same thoughts: what goes first gets priority. Mo - Biceps + Pushday (without triceps) Tu - Triceps + Pullday (without biceps) We - Legs Th - Fr - Biceps + Pushday (without triceps) Sa - Triceps + Pullday (without biceps) Su - So I noticed that I felt my biceps (from the day before) during Pull days + my triceps (from saturday) on monday Pushdays. I'm eating in a surplus consistently and sleeping very good with other factors also dialed in so I know the problem lies somewhere in the programming. My arms are not really progressing the way it should on a proper bulk and I'm already doing pretty low volume (6 sets for biceps and 6 sets for triceps a week) for arm recovery purposes and any lower volume i would say wouldn't be that optimal for growth anymore... Would you say these push and pull days are interfering with my arm growth/recovery? And would you advise to switch to a normal PPL so the arms would have more rest and not be involved on the subsequent days in any push or pull exercises. Also considering the fact that exercises order (your first point) doesn't really matter.

[@WolfCoaching]

I would just stay consistent if I were you. Consider adding a little volume for your arms when you do train them and stay the course! It sounds like you're doing things right.

[@SH789-x2f]

@@WolfCoaching Thanks for answering!

[@LouisSerieusement]

really really good video, super useful thanks ! As always I enjoy your sientist honesty 👌

[@elvisincali]

Overall, it's good advice... and I don't really see it conflicting with the following... The great and immortal natural bodybuilder,, Steve Reeves... recommended starting with the top, and working your way down, because gravity is already pulling the blood flow into the legs... it's better to start with your shoulders, then chest, then back, then triceps, then biceps and finally legs and calves...👍💪😉

[@angelojumped]

The cat ending was gold. Had me spitting my drink from laughing 😂

[@chalbran1569]

Excellent video! I really appreciate all the information you are sharing!

[@WolfCoaching]

Thank you! I’m glad you’re enjoying it! Feel free to shoot any video requests into the comments section! -Milo

[@anasbendahou7722]

Easy to say while training better to train 2 muscle groups in one session to split exercice for exemple Bench press ( chest) then OHP ( shoulders) then Incline bench press (chest) lateral raises ( shoulders) overhead triceps extension then a chest fly then triceps push down Better than Bench press incline press fly then shoulders OHP lateral raises then triceps overhead and push down Leg day Squat RDL Hack squat seated leg curl leg extension Better than squat hack squat leg extension leg curl not even doing RDL And so on If you goes hard enough into your sets on first exercice and a good pump that’s all take a break and train another muscle then go back to the first muscle you trained ….

[@hanshelfer2799]

Thank you for putting this out!! What's your take on specialization phases? are they a waste of time? Thanks!

[@WolfCoaching]

My pleasure! Specialisation phases have their time and place; however that’s likely going to be for more advanced trainees, or for those with very specific goals(think competition categories with judging criteria that favours certain muscle groups > others) Certainly not a waste of time by any means. However, they should be used in the appropriate circumstances. -Milo

[@lukeamartins]

This is a bit of a tangent but you seemed to be suggesting that a potential benefit of spacing muscle groups, i.e. alternating non-agonist lifts, might be that the additonal rest time improves the overall hypertrophic stimulus per muscle via increased volume-load (total work) over the course of a session. Are you sure this is the right way to look at it? In my understanding it is disproportionately, though not exclusively, the amount of work done within a given proximity to failure and not the total work per se that is the main cause of hypertrophy. In other words, it's not a case of "more reps = more growth" so much as it is more close-to-failure ("effective") reps = more growth. If my interpretation is right, spacing agonist lifts just makes the session less efficient because more total reps are required to reach sufficient proximity to failure in each set. If simple geometric volume-load (sets x reps x weight) predicted hypertrophy, wouldn't we expect proximity to failure to produce net worse outcomes due to less total work vs just adding more sets at lower relative intensity?

[@WolfCoaching]

To touch on whether I am *sure* this is the right way; no, I am not. With that being said, the rest time literature (check my video on this) does suggest that volume load itself plays a role for hypertrophy, as a proxy for total volume of tension induced. In fact, I think spacing out exercises across a session does most closely resemble rest times between sets (as far as a similar construct goes). So, if we're going to draw on any body of literature, this would be the one. Importantly, if all that mattered were "effective reps close to failure" (I have a video coming on this), short and long- rest intervals would be equivalent for hypertrophy, as, provided the same number of sets is performed, both approaches lead the same number of "effective reps". However, this doesn't pan out in the research. It is likely a combination of both; (1) reps closer to failure ARE slightly more stimulative AND (2) volume load is predictive of growth. -Milo

[@lukeamartins]

@@WolfCoaching great, thanks for clarifying that Milo and good luck with the channel. Enjoying the punchy science-driven content thus far.

[@vitkucera1116]

Hi Wolf, can you please make video on frequency when trying to improve muscle hypertrophy? Is it better 1x per week / 2x / 3x / 4x / 5x / 6x / 7x?

[@zdenek3010]

You can get good program with 3-6 days per week. What you choose in this range should be mainly dictated by other things than optimalization of muscle growth unless being in a gym is your profession.

[@kneewizard6246]

I think the main arguments for consolidation are 1.) not forgetting your technique from the last, similar exercise 2.) SFR, the theoretical benefit of reducing central fatigue accumulation over the course of the workout and training block, while only being slightly less stimulative on a set-per-set basis. I dont buy it myself, i look at it this way, would i grow more from 225 lb for 6 reps at true 1 RIR, or 225 lb for 8 reps at 1 RIR but limited centrally so its actually 4 RIR locally. I would think higher volume load wins out even if RIR is lower (RSM>SFR). Ive always spread out my exercises instead of consolidating, and my CNS hasnt exploded.

[@WolfCoaching]

Agreed. While those are *theoretically* benefits, I don't think they matter much.

[@kneewizard6246]

@@WolfCoaching Yep! On a related point, if you lose enough rep strength from consolidating exercises, sure your target muscle has still achieved an approach to failure, but synergists may suffer, ie your glutes may be disproportionately far from failure relative to your quads during your 8th set of hack squats. Granted, this is nitpicking. The meta analysis suggests order doesnt matter much anyway.

[@vitkucera1116]

Make video on -> frequency for hypertrophy and CAN YOU TRAIN TO RIR 0 EVERY SINGLE TRAINING WHEN TRYING TO IMPROVE HYPERTROPHY? Or it is better do do first week rir 2 second week rir 1 and the last week rir 0? and repeat?!!

[@ChouChouDer]

11:39 Will doing lateral raises first interfere my incline barbell bench press? Thanks for great video!

[@WolfCoaching]

Probably a little bit. Easy tip: try it and see how performance goes! If you can get your usual numbers, go right ahead.

[@oldnatty61]

Work biggest to smallest. Squat, dead, pull, push.

[@ozanselcuk1055]

Great video but I am curious about one thing about spreading. In a common push session for example, we could sequence fly then cable push downs then incline press and dips as you suggest rather that chest and triceps as you suggested but wouldn't this approach pre exhaust the triceps making the incline press hard for both muscles? I think we could work out about the nuances but what are your general recommendations to prevent this because I am recently trying do flys first to preexhaust the chest because I have shitty chest genetics and it is really working well currently but I also want to try your recommendations.

[@WolfCoaching]

Eh, the general principle of “compounds first” and “heavier work first” is a good idea. Honestly, benching first -> dumbbell flies and then tricep work may be your best shot for great chest growth but ALSO great overall growth. Starting with dumbbell flies might grow your chest a tiny bit more, but at the expense of your other muscle groups (e.g. triceps/front delts) -Milo

[@ozanselcuk1055]

Thanks soon to be Dr. Milo

[@WolfCoaching]

Glad I could help! -Milo

[@douglasauruss]

Is pump also something to consider regarding consolidation vs spreading out exercises for the same muscle group? Or would that get trumped by the greater overall quality possible per exercise?

[@WolfCoaching]

The overall quality would play a much more significant role! -Milo

[@CrazyCookie95]

What’s a good order for bent rows, pull ups and rack/chin pulls

[@bulcsutoth3584]

Using the knowledge from the video, I wouldn't do two lat or trap/mid back excercises in a row, so my recommendarion is to do an excercise that targets the part of your back you're prioritising (for example lats) and the follow it up with something mid back focused. So for you it's pull ups, then bent rows, then chin pulls. Hope that helps

[@peterferland7988]

Please edify me: what does basically the same growth mean? Say I do a leg day: 2 sets leg press, 2 sets deficit bulgarian split squats, 2 sets leg extensions, all rpe 10. (which i never do anymore btw, i'm on just 4 sets of quads on my main leg day now) Say I have a supplementary leg day of just 2 sets leg extensions whereby I take 2 sets of them to an rpe of 10. This study is saying those two sets of leg extensions are essentially the same or they are the same? And are the same are they the same in the sense that the stimulation that's weakened my quadricep output as the 3rd exercise doesn't change the overall stimulus like doing biceps at the end of a pull day? Because I can understand this because the stimulation has to go somewhere it can't just disappear into the void (up until a junk volume level of course). Because when I do leg extensions first I do the whole stack for too many reps. If I do it third, I do less than half the stack. So I never bother doing it 3rd and just have a supplementary 2 sets on a pull / back day.

[@WolfCoaching]

Provided frequency, volume and intensity are all matched, exercise order doesn’t seem to matter. That’s how these studies are ran/designed. If you were to change certain exercises to different days, my hunch is that - if you increase frequency - you’d see better growth. Google “strongerbyscience muscle hypertrophy frequency” for more details!

[@BenG-rd5wg]

Interesting topic! What do you think of doing dumbell flies before bench press/weighted dips to increase mobility for hypertrophy/should you do it the other way around to increase strength or just cut out a lot of isolation moves? And if I did a Push-Pull-Leg split, how would you spread out the exercises if I did e. g. lateral Raises, weighted ring pushups (unfortunately I don't have the opportunity to do bench presses at home), dips and Overhead Presses?

[@WolfCoaching]

I think it may increase chest hypertrophy at the expense of triceps/front delt growth. But, probably not a big effect.

[@BenG-rd5wg]

So a PPL split isn't inherently bad because exercises that target similar muscles can't be spread out? If I want to powerbuild, should I keep the isolation exercises to a minimum in order not to have an excessive workload or could I still do e. g. overhead triceps extensions after the other exercises? @@WolfCoaching

[@bloopbloop2703]

Oh wow, I really thought exercise order mattered for hypertrophy. Do you think order in the microcycle matters? Like getting more hypertrophy by training a body part earlier in the week?

[@WolfCoaching]

Eh, not really. Maybe if you’re SUPER fatigued later in the week from prior sessions, but some fatigue is likely fine for hypertrophy. Aiming to always be perfectly recovered is likely overkill and misplaces priorities! -Milo

[@mattc4266]

Hit that like to the maxxx!

[@MrCashy84]

I’ve just started your 5 day muscle growth program and on day 3 you’ve got squat, single leg exercise and then leg curl. This is in direct contradiction to the advise you provide here in the video. Further fatigue contamination is mentioned where doing isolation exercises is beneficial to doing first before squat etc…the templates don’t do this. Have you changed your mind, since structuring the templates, about exercise order?

[@WolfCoaching]

I think you can go either way there. For single leg exercises, you don’t need to brace and can breathe pretty freely, so they’re more manageable than you might suspect back-to-back. -Milo

[@WolfCoaching]

In this case you can absolutely do leg curl first! -Milo

[@MrCashy84]

Thanks. So the templates are still pretty much in line with what you think is optimal for muscle gain? Must say I have enjoyed your full body split after doing push/pull/legs for so long.

[@WolfCoaching]

Awesome! Glad to hear it! And yes. The order selected in the program is basically optimal, especially for time efficiency. -Milo

[@nygeek6471]

Me doing squats and pull-ups back to back wondering why I’m dying

[@ikrambou6651]

Very beneficial video thank you

[@WolfCoaching]

Glad you found it useful! -Milo

[@taibro3868]

Hi Sanjana

[@WolfCoaching]

Hello sir! -Milo

[@vitkucera1116]

best youtube channel on exercise -- WOLF COACHING > SQUAT UNIVERSITY

[@vitkucera1116]

imagine watching squat university or athlean x xdddddddddddd

[@utubebrowseupload]

Didnt you mean two locally fatiguing exercises when you said systemically fatuiging?

[@WolfCoaching]

Both, actually! I think sequencing two locally (in the same muscle) OR systemically fatiguing exercises directly after one another usually isn’t ideal, as described in the vid. -Milo

[@ufojeo]

🔥 🔥 🔥 🔥 🔥

[@WolfCoaching]

Thank you! Appreciate the support. -Milo

[@jzdavis9799]

disappointed you didnt mention the @trainedbyjp theory of doing short position exercises before the lengthen ones to exhaust the short position first

[@WolfCoaching]

Could definitely cover this theory - and why I think it doesn’t hold much merit for hypertrophy. -Milo

[@rockyevans1584]

Why would you exhaust the weaker position first?

[@jzdavis9799]

​@@rockyevans1584 once the short position fails you'll always be able to continue do more work in the lengthen, also this will result in lower fatigue to focus

[@rockyevans1584]

@@jzdavis9799 sorry, lower fatigue to focus? I'm not sure what you mean by that

[@Ask-Ali]

LESSS GOOO

[@WolfCoaching]

We move! -Milo

[@dodgingrain3695]

lol, never ever do calf raises right before squats. The chance of your calf cramping in the middle of squats is much higher and that would be .... bad if the squat weight was significant. I allso call nonsense on lat raises after squats. I use this all the time for small muscles to fit in sets and train things like side delts every workout day since they recover quickly, only I do them between sets of deadlifts, not squats.

[@jujoijo]

Algorithmmmm

[@WolfCoaching]

Yeah buddy! -Milo