Women in combat: Zoe Bedell at TEDxHarvardLawSchool

[@Hisoka107]

Female engagement teams aren't combat or special operations. Her service and that of her female marines is great but short patrols with 30+ gear is different from mounted patrols with 70+ pounds. Woman have a much higher injury rate. Women atrophy much faster than men and in combat many of my friends lost a ton and still had to operate with all the gear they have in school houses. Many of the women are passing with the minimum standard which at best they are competing against the bottom 40% of their male counter part. Even a British study found the same results the marine study had.

[@matthewcourt3795]

As soon as I heard the childish cheer of teenage girls after she was introduced, I knew this was not going to be genuine discussion. Rather a feminist bra burning.

[@azzym8794]

Me too.

[@Jeremy-ql1or]

All this talk about women in combat roles, all these feminists saying the men were scared because the all women spec-ops teams were going to end up being better, all these accusations of misogyny when people would point out physical differences between sexes... ...And then it comes out this week that, of the 220+ women to complete the Marine training program, the number of them that requested combat roles...was ZERO.

[@tdog652041]

Shh , enough with the facts.

[@occhamite]

This is a perfect example of why the debate should never have been started. Women demand something they are not entitled to, the evidence shows it, so women start obscuring the evidence by suing suing suing until they get what they want.

[@chrisminks9482]

I served 2003-2007 before all this stuff came up. I have buddies who worked with these FET teams and everyone of them said they were an absolute joke

[@ChamorruWarrior]

Dear Olympics... Are women physically equal to men in every way? No? Okay, thanks... That was close, people almost died over fighting that out...

[@mlk116]

First, thank you for your service. Second, it sounds like your role in the Marine Corps. was vital and helped accomplish the mission. Third, it's people like you who are going to get my son killed in a combat zone (he is a 2nd Lieutenant in the Corps.).I went to Quantico VA in November, 2017 to witness his graduation from OCS and saw the newly minted 2nd Lieutenants on their first day. In 10 weeks of OCS the drop out rate for the 3 male platoons was almost 25% vs. 50% for the 1 female platoon, even though their physical requirements for running and chin-ups are significantly lower. I have no problem with women in combat roles if they can meet the same standard. The fact is that 99% of them can’t, and by putting someone in combat that can’t meet the standard, you put everyone else in the fire team / squad / platoon, etc. at risk. Long-story short - women in combat will get our people killed.

[@Lobos222]

*One of the problems these Female advocates fail to respond to is that occupation is more like policing under harsher conditions than actual "same tech" warfare.* Once you get into conditions were large logistical systems starts to break down and you still need to continue fighting. Thats were its important for nations to have soldiers still be functional. Being on a front line where you out tech the opposition by 30 years, have air superiority and an equal or larger amount of troops compared to the enemy is NOT a standard one should expect in every war. I have no doubt a Female soldier in a urban environment can take cover from shots and return fire for an hour or more, but there is a big dif between that and climbing up Hamburger hill in Vietnam for example. Its usually not the "COD stuff", running and gunning in perfect conditions while being fresh both bodily and mentally with light gear _(combat gear without a pack)_, that is an issue, but the over time conditions that also deteriorate Men. When these conditions are present, uniform being unavoidable wet over time causing skin issues, less food and water, more strain on both the body and joints, less rest over time, the cold or other weather conditions, worsening hygiene conditions _(I dont mean lack of showers or dirty underwear, I mean people getting sick)_ etc. Its in those conditions soldiers as a whole should be considered. Bottom line is, Females will be a lesser choice compared to a Male in front line soldiering. So in the grand scheme of things it should be viewed as a "luxury" thing rather than a war winning oriented one. If having a smaller part of ones military front line forces Female is not a big deal strategically I really dont see an issue in having it. Most of the Allied Soviet AA forces in wwII was Female for example. Although here out of necessity because of the extreme Male front line losses. Even during the defense of Stalingrad some of these Female units were used with their anti air cannons as front line soldiers in an effort to impede advancing tanks. Unfortunately they were all wiped out by the Germans. Regressing, at the same time the size of the Female front line force should be balanced towards the amount of Women that want to join rather than how large that force can be before it starts affecting results. What I mean is, if that force can house 15% Female, but only 10% Female wants to join. The 10% wanting to join should dictate that the force should not be larger than ca 7% in order to make sure only competent Women gain access. They should also in my view be totally segregated. Female soldiers, Female squad leaders, Female officers and Female commanders. Until you reach the "roof" of that unit. Be it a company or a battalion or whatever. And they should be used in regards to their effectiveness. If they perform 2/3 of a Male equivalent force. That needs to be taken into account when they are used. One should also obviously never use the whole force because having your whole Female front line force wiped out would be bad for national moral. To take another wwII example again. The German Leibstandarte divisions, a force of 10 000 Men, was wiped out not once, but wiped out and rebuilt 3 times before the war ended.... Having Females in any role shouldnt be viewed as a "under no conditions" kinda of thing, but the strategic aspects of it should be taken into weight and as long as that is done. I dont really see an issues with having front line female soldiers.

[@omarmilton1521]

I know I'm 7 years late but I agree 100%!!!

[@FHIPrincePeter]

Surely they should campaign for equality in Sports instead of gender specific sports. Why have Women Tennis or Men's athletic's . Once we have that then start about combat. The problem is the "Little War's we have had do not bring the true effect of Women in Combat. If I am going to war with a Patrol, I do not want any women coming along to Fight if it's going to be Hand to Hand Combat period. That's why society thinks it's unacceptable for a Man to hit a woman.

[@mikebrown4340]

She spins the tales of her experience to make it seem as if she's conducting missions the same as any ground combat unit. She says that "her" marines were shot at, but really she was not the one in combat. Her job was to be ESCORTED by an infantry unit, so that she can talk to other females. There were no offensive operations that she was involved with and she essentially walked to a town surrounded by a bunch of marines and walked back. That's her real combat perspective.

[@DB.KOOPER]

Women in combat: There's no bigger joke on earth.

[@Blakwall]

It's funny because FET are often heavily escorted. Why? Because they're less combat effective. This is stupid...

[@TeganGriffith]

I am so proud of you and so thankful that you are a leader in our community. Thank you Zoe.

[@horizonchaser6030]

Fortunately I served in the Corps years ago before this was even a problem. Yes I said Problem.

[@mjhegar6779]

Excellent articulation of a complicated subject. Bravo Zoe!

[@kylemartin7727]

MJ Hegar the strongest physically fit female you know wouldn’t last a week in war just stop 😑

[@bobbyrobby3600]

This woman is giving us her one-sided slanted experience she claimed she had, trust me, she was not fighting in the front lines with other Marines she was near them and had a weapon, so what.

[@samjz4906]

Yawn. Why don't she start a lawsuit against the International Olympic Committee and the various professional sports organisations around the world (rugby, football, American football, basketball, boxing, MMA etc) that either separate men and women in sport, or don't sign female athletes? Maybe because common sense tells her that no woman, even the fittest and fastest, cannot go toe to toe against a high level male athlete in his prime, so why does she think women stand an ice cream's chance in hell of of surviving a close quarters combat encounter with the enemy, let's say for arguments sake a 6' 2" 200lb 18-35 year old Russian Army paratrooper, in his physical prime and full of aggression? And that's if he doesn't overpower and rape her first before killing her (a reality of war).. The Infantry and ground combat is a man's world and it should stay that way.

[@ErikMovesMagnets]

Sam Jz At least leave the slot open, even if its perceptibly unattainable. At this point, its going to happen. The fight now should be about killing quotas and keeping the physical standards high so as not to degrade the quality of our fighting forces.

[@samjz4906]

I just believe it's unrealistic to expect full discipline and unit cohesion in war conditions (out on long patrols, no privacy, etc) in a mixed unit. Nearly every man, including most NCOs/officers in an infantry, cavalry, armor, recon, SOF, etc unit is a young, fit, virile 18-34 year old. Private Jane will naturally get more favorable treatment from her peers and superiors than Private James, including the less shitty assignments, on account of having a pussy - and she'll undoubtedly be a minority with few to no female superiors, and every man in the unit will not see her as a sister, but someone they want to fuck, many of these men have wives, who would undoubtedly be unhappy. The problem with leaving the 'slots' open is that it wastes money trying to train women who will have a high or total washout rate, when those slots could go to qualified men. 19 women were given months of special preparation for Army Ranger School, and only 2 passed, and I and many in the military strongly suspect it was a PR stunt and standards were altered where convenient. 66% of women failed the basic Marine enlisted infantry course (ITB) out of 350 0/29 women passed the Marines Infantry Officer School, only 4 made it passed the first day. Then of course there's the issue of how much of a return of service you will get from a female 'grunt'. She might make the grade initially, but how quickly will she wear and tear, and burn out? Would she last even a year in an Active Duty Army or Marine grunt unit, let alone SOF? Women suffer substantially disproportionate injuries in training, especially training with men, mainly things like stress fractures, as women have less bone density and muscle mass than men. I agree, I know it's going to happen, but it astonishes me how the US government has ignored the mountains of evidence against it and personal objections of grunts, and done the PC thing. It's just an all round bad idea. It's not remotely comparable to allowing in blacks in white units, or gays or letting women fly combat aircraft. There are better options if manpower is ever an issue, like raising the maximum age limit, current cut off age for Army Infantry is 35, men a good 10 years older than that are still stronger and faster than 18-25 year old women.

[@lockandloadlikehell]

@@ErikMovesMagnets Looool A little late for that tiger Like 30 years

[@janecondon1]

Well done! An impressive young woman. A thoughtful discussion of a current issue. Marines should be proud of her!

[@alexmason113]

***** as someone who is going to go to marine corp boot camp this first of june, it sucks to hear it because its true, i respect all marines regardless of gender, but with the blatant lowering of standards to accomodate female marines, it almost makes one feel that there title was not properly earned/ is worthless. give a girl a rifle and call her a marine, but when the bullets start flying, will she be both mentally and physically strong enough to meet the demands of a real battlefield?

[@martthesling]

Jane Condon They will lower the physical standards and then Marines will die. Thank you narcissism.

[@tomaszstarling]

Having a female as a unit member in combat brings about strong emotions in most men, the same emotion a woman would feel seeing a very young child with a gun fighting. This brings about a unnecessary distraction from the life or death objective. And is a bad strategy on our side. God Bless America.

[@kevinrice1085]

let them go. just don't have separate criteria. that means 6 min mile, 50 push up, chun up, and sit up. if they can do it let them in.

[@TheKittygomeowmeow]

Kevin Rice Have you ever served?

[@mt655]

They’d never pass.

[@georgearvan8045]

So we're supposed to make a decision based of emotional opinions and feel good stories. Way to go Ted talks this speech presented absolutely no facts or evidence to support her claim, and apparently facts don't matter only opinions and criticisms really? I propose a scenario where a platoon of all women with the same combat training, physical fitness and weapons versus a platoon of all men with equal physical fitness training, training and weapons... In your opinion who do you think would survive?

[@samuelepicurus8456]

What if it is not that women are incapable of serving in these positions? What if it is that there is not the same risk? Unless we are going to war with France, UK, Japan or Australia as a woman your chances of being raped if captured are 100%. Do women get that? If captured especially by the Islamic extremist that we are currently fighting. You will be raped, possibly to death and likely sold into slavery. That should be discussed. Apart from that if a woman passes the exact same qualifications as a man and is taking some form of birth control when she is in a FOB or a FOB like setting (why should we spend huge sums of money to fly women out of hot zones because she got pregnant and that will happen) I am not oppose to it. But as a medic I can tell you that no matter how strong the lady is... women get a lot of vagina sicknesses UTIs are common. Exactly who is supposed to be checking out their vaginas in a FOB? I imagine baby wipe showers will increase the rate of UTIs/bacterial vaginosis/yeast infections as well. Even if they drop off the proper exam table for me am I supposed to check out my battle buddies vagina? Who will assist me?

[@ErikMovesMagnets]

Samuel Epicurus +Lobos222 easy solution would be to have female specific units "If they perform 2/3 of a Male equivalent force. That needs to be taken into account when they are used."

[@samuelepicurus8456]

Handcactus Fappington That would take a lot of the issues out sure... do we have the numbers to support that? Also would it be accepted? In theory I think it makes more sense though. It would also help with the problem of women not being able to carry a 300lb male in body armor. The only thing I might worry about is the added danger if the enemy knew they were female. But that is on the person though that should be talked about if they want to go out to a female only FOB.

[@ErikMovesMagnets]

This is very true, and should be taken into account. I think thats the real problem, the recruit pool just isn't there. Still, imagine how a conservative traditional country like Russia would react if they lost a battle to a female infantry unit.

[@samuelepicurus8456]

Handcactus Fappington ISIS is terrified of fighting the YPJ the all female component of the Communist Kurdish force fighting in Syria. They think it means they won't go to heaven if they get killed by a woman lol

[@ErikMovesMagnets]

Samuel Epicurus haha didn't think of that

[@ledfarmer100]

It would be much more of a hazard to all men and women to allow women in combat. The fact that she acts oblivious to the blatantly obvious reasons why women aren’t allowed in combat after serving in the marines is astounding.

[@crazyboii3236]

Women in combat is a stupid idea.

[@Ace1000ks]

+CrazyBoii They don't have the upper body strength. They can't carry 90 lbs of gear for a long period of time.

[@Gooseman2k2]

The day this broad is able to fight a 200 pound grizzled male insurgent... is the day I endorse her for front-line combat...

[@mt655]

That would never happen . She’s drop to her knees to try and save herself.

[@mikeforest9730]

Being in combat is about winning and being able to complete a mission no matter the circumstance. Men have the physical and mental advantage. I find it Disgusting and unacceptable to put women in hand to hand combat. 99% of men can pass physical require 40% of women complete. I find that unacceptable if A women can't do 3 pull ups how in the hell is she going to be able to Carry a wounded man over her shoulder let alone pull her self over a wall or complete a simple task. War is war the best vs the best It's not about being equal to women's rights if that ever happeneds our country will weaken and soon lead to destruction. Imagine a 100 pound women vs a 300 pound man in a football drill head on head hit drill. Wake the fuck up these are lunatic fringes feminist!

[@ErikMovesMagnets]

Mike Forest Ive seen women get 1st class pfts, its not THAT hard if you spend enough time training

[@indianacitizen]

Can some one explain the comment: "You don't need to listen to the guy with the facts."

[@Given5-v7y]

"The guy with the fax" (Ref, earlier mention to a hate letter sent by fax).

[@jackhasanewass]

2 islamist butchered a marine in the streets of usa who served in afghanistan this woman does not stand a chance

[@CBUCK1994]

the delusion of women in combat is baffling to me.

[@fringeelements]

lol no, institutional gender discrimination exists in every aspect of government.

[@arianagrande8221]

I see she toned down the makeup for her speech. Very convincing!

[@CBUCK1994]

think of it this way..if you have a female squad led by a male then you have a major inefficiency because he could be leading males

[@Trid3nt861]

Look at the grusome reality. Out in the field the enemy will not care about the feelings of a woman. She will have to carry 120lbs of gear on her, and if one of her male counterparts gets shot or fragged by an IED or explosive device, she will then have to carry around near 300lbs of man with equipment and weapon to safety. If she is captured, the enemy will not give a care and may do very sick things to her...... Bullets do not discriminate, bombs and explosives do not discriminate. The enemy does not discriminate. War is brutal and non-caring. Male platoons will suffer a morale decline, there will be male's in the barracks that will try to sleep with the women grunts, alot of times there will be women who will get pregnant to get out of service.... which will affect the squad/platoon and lower morale. No matter which way you put it this will end up ruining the American military combat field. While the US military is becoming more emasculated, the Chinese military is pushing for more and more masculinity in its armies........

[@chrisminks9482]

Also the problem here is there is no opposite point of view presented here its just her and these people who have never been in the military have no other argument presented to them so they form their opinion based on hearing only one side. Her argument and facts are flawed and skewed in a way to serve her own personal beliefs.

[@VivaLaPol]

I say let them go. In fact, insist that every feminist does go to these middle east conflicts in their own special feminist divisions. Should thin out the numbers nicely.

[@jimmierustler4887]

The troops should always be of the quality to be able to handle the worst case scenario. In a shooting war with an enemy that isn't stuck in the bronze age, do you think air superiority and artillery support will be a given? Technology might be a moot point if a future enemy has good emp weapons. Women just are not able to meet the same physical standards as men. Hell, I was in the Navy and the pt standards were way different. I could have power walked the women's 1.5 mile run. The women who want to be in the combat arms will want seperate standards but still be considered equal. It shouldn't work that way but with the leftist panderer in chief, any progressive bullshit is possible.

[@hornet6969]

Simple Biology. Men have more muscle mass than women. Vastly more upper body strenght. HTF are u going to assign someone who looks like her to a frontline infantry unit?

[@kalmykdude]

Knock knock? Who is it. Reality!

[@lockandloadlikehell]

So is the NBA treating an unathletic 5'7" 165 pound man as a "second class citizen" when they laugh when he tries out (if that were possible)? Or are they just dealing with reality

[@Wildbot34]

Women pay tax, have voting privileges - I say let them fight

[@jonathansmall4573]

It's not about taxes. It's about qualifications. If a woman passes the EXACT SAME physical standards as men in infantry, then by all means she must be allowed to fight. But is that really the case most of time? It is not. First of all the bars are lowered. Men take 71 push ups while women take only 41. And most women fail the 3 Pull Up test which is an essential combat readiness measure. I am not saying all women cannot pass the exact standards as men. There are many women who do. However, the number of women who cannot outnumber the ones who can. So training women who don't pass the same standards as men increases the training cost and as former marine officer Capt. Katie Petronio put it, the cost outweighs the benefits.

[@Wildbot34]

Jonathan Small Men are physically stronger than women in general, we know this. But are you really able to do your job better if you can do 71 push ups vs 41 push ups? That seems arbitrary to me, and there is a good argument about reviewing the entire physical exam requirements. Personally, I think if the US was ever in a really serious war where the actual sovereignty was at risk, both men and women would feel more secure sending only men to the front lines. But in these silly oil wars, we should send women to the front line as well just to be fair.

[@jonathansmall4573]

CherryArmada Nobody is saying women shouldn't go to frontlines. What I am saying is that women should pass the EXACT SAME qualifications as men. Currently that is not the case. Physical tests are not arbitrary. They have been designed by seeing combats over centuries. The rigors of combat have been observed by experts who designed those tests. Now if you are suggesting to review the entire physical exam process just so you can have more women in frontlines, that is silly. Oil wars or water wars. Doesn't matter. War is war. People die in it.

[@squidney8517]

+Jonathan Small that's what she's fighting for if you watched the video, they want to make a single standard for women and men and those who meet the standards can join up not every woman can join and not every man can join, but those who can should be able to

[@lockandloadlikehell]

"Let me bring it back down to reality" Bahaha Come bounce for me and we'll talk reality l il girl

[@gideondavid30]

more about culture than anything.

[@hermanngoerring2779]

women are wonderful and amazing....Until the shrapnel is flying and the tracers light up the night..Not to mention no change of clothes twice a day..LOL

[@ErikMovesMagnets]

Hermann Goerring goddammit i told you to stop using you're real name online. CIAs gonna find out and you'll be fucked

[@ashutoshrai8791]

She has a perfect figure

[@christopherdobney2927]

No, you're NOT marines.

[@HannahLeche]

Christopher Dobney she earned the title. She’s a Marine. Learn some respect.

[@martthesling]

@@HannahLeche 😂

[@heemaleemreallyheem]

how many confirmed K's she got

[@a.t6066]

None. Literally 0 Maybe 1 if you count the camel spider she probably accidentally stepped on

[@heemaleemreallyheem]

@@a.t6066 That part 😂😂

[@ahmedelkhatib8367]

nice job zoe