The Crossroads of Religion & Politics-Part 2

[@tamibonestudio]

This is one of the most outstanding conversations I’ve ever listened to, if not THE most. I’m a Protestant, but am growing every day in my understanding and love for Catholicism, in large part due to Bishop Barron and ministries such as WOF.

[@benjammin6692]

You don’t have to be catholic to learn a lot from Bishop Barron. Protestant here. 👋🏼

[@cameronshorkey843]

Same here

[@benjammin6692]

@@cameronshorkey843 Hello, Mr Cameron. 👋🏼 Glad we share a love for Bishop Barron! I think he gets at some pretty important topics with a deep scriptural understanding in utilizing tactics from the deep well of Catholic teachings such as ‘sola scriptura’ but not exclusively so. 🩶🩵🖤

[@DonnyShine]

Bwahahaha, you wish you're gonna take over my government with your Project 2025 fascism

[@jenniferwinston7842]

This is incredible. Bishop Barron nails it. God help us.

[@tamibonestudio]

I agree! I found Bishop Barron on the Hallow app after realizing that he was leading the rosary that I listen to each morning. He has a great ability to deliver the full depth of his understanding of theology and Christianity. I'm thrilled to know about him.

[@meganneale2074]

I thoroughly enjoyed this two part discussion. Bishop Barron's point on the purpose of separating church and state being more about the importance of keeping the state out of religion ... and not the other way around, is a salient point for understanding how we've got to the strange place we find ourselves in today. I think this misunderstanding explains much about our current 'do whatever you want all the time' culture, and it would be worthwhile unpacking this more. I like St Basil's 'discerning bumblebees' analogy, too, Dr Worner. Thank you both, very much.

[@susanparker767]

✨🙏🏼✨

[@tamibonestudio]

This point of "separating church and state being more about the importance of keeping the state out of religion" jumped out at me in a big way, too. I've never heard it expressed in this way, but as you've said, it has everything to do with where we are today.

[@ZacharyOrlov]

Fabulous! Clarity, Clarity of thoughts, good thinking and a call to action!

[@ceciliadreger6319]

I pray for againts fake identity.

[@tranhien3482]

This is one of the most outstanding conversations I’ve ever listened to, if not THE most. Bishop Barron's "no" at 2:00 just hit so hard it would put all contemporary political scientist to shame.

[@MartinMartin-mu2qj]

"I have seen the Lord and he said this." Blessed are the souls who persevere in the Truth and Justice of the incarnate Word, who keep and proclaim His message, in the face of the infamy that dwells in this trial and seeks to silence it.

[@susanparker767]

Thank you Bishop Barron ✨🙏🏼✨

[@anneturner2759]

Arguing is a good thing, dealing with liar who taunts constantly is a disgrace.

[@carloscarpizo5845]

A series on the friendship of Justices Antonin Scalia and Ruth Bader Ginsburg is what this country needs.

[@larryulery3729]

Very good. Bishop Barron talks to us I can't wait until he becomes a Cardinal.

[@LorettaShields-tj7kp]

Me either! I am hoping he becomes pope!!!

[@benjammin6692]

@@LorettaShields-tj7kpVery intellectual Catholic theologian and philosopher reminiscent of Aquinas. I think he belongs in that category.

[@LorettaShields-tj7kp]

@@benjammin6692 Yes!! Have you read his Word On Fire Gospels, or Word on Fire Acts,& The letters of Paul? Most excellent, I recommend it highly.

[@susanparker767]

✨🙏🏼✨

[@nicadavelife]

Such an awesome discussion!

[@miken3260]

We live on a time when most people believe that happiness is a bucket list of pleasures and experiences.

[@alicemcpherson7961]

It is so sad.

[@alicemcpherson7961]

Thank you both. I have thoroughly enjoyed your conversation ❤️🙏

[@ofcourse7357]

I loved this conversation. Thanks.

[@jesuslovesaves2682]

Overall good discussion. Thanks!

[@jeanlanz2344]

Great discussion. Re today's lack of civility, beside the general "coarsening" of the culture re dress and speech, since 1970, the lines are drawn on life/death issue of abortion and the meaning of sex. These are life and death issues and people are not going afterward to the bar together to laugh it off. Re voting, there is a hierarchy of values, and the right to life is needed for all the others. This should have been brought up.

[@kathleengleason8589]

Key point about the role of mediating institutions (even at the level of the individual). When they fall apart the danger is totalitarianism.

[@ceciliadreger6319]

You didn't give anything to Father and you are not welcome here, too. You are fake as well. Bye😢

[@kathleengleason8589]

Our struggle - moral chaos; people cannot have a conversation without devolving into vitriol; public argumentation is a lost art; we hear but do not listen; we look but do not see; we think and reason but do not reflect or consider. Solution - education Self-invention is self-defeating and unsatisfying.

[@ceciliadreger6319]

If you want to help with a donation for charity, humanitarian aid, or expressing your gratitude do not give through a priest like Father Mike Schmitz is prejudiced and chooses to reject religion for those faithful devotees. Just give it to the firefighter or police to help their family and wife.

[@ceciliadreger6319]

You are right. Father Mike Schmitz thinks that evangelization is a competition for every catholic. He's so ignorant leading the youth and the parishioners astray. I hope next time he avoids blaming others.

[@declancooney1029]

God bless Bsp Barron

[@AndrewKendall71]

The Federalist Papers would be excellent material for history/gov't work by middle-school aged students. And, it provides all kinds of rhetoric opportunities for high school discussion. Never mind, they show quite a lot of gov't philosophy in a way that is profound. Also, the Firing Line hour-long format would be difficult for some because of the rate of media/info delivery, especially for the young. The issue there is also likely educational. But it begs for parental help and church framing.

[@bertpowers7064]

The search for common ground has been put on hold.

[@susanparker767]

Amen 🙏🏼

[@itinerantpatriot1196]

I have to take exception with the notion that most people want solutions. Most people these days want the show. It's reality TV as politics, Plato's Allegory of the Cave in real time. If we were serious citizens we wouldn't have the type of candidates we currently have. People of substance who want to discuss issues are seen as dull and pushed aside. People who are good at playing shirts and skins and engaging in name calling and grandstanding are all the rage. In a democratic republic you get the government you ask for. The American voter has empowered shallow people and accepted the gaslighting and all the rest that go along with that. The other side used to be viewed as well-meaning people with bad ideas. Now they are bad people with evil intentions. Sadly, we have shown them we prefer that to the nuts and bolts of responsible governance. And when the waitress shows up with the check, and everyone's cards get declined, whose going to end up washing dishes to settle the bill? I'm telling ya, what's coming around the bend will make everyone long for the good-old days of COVID. When your savings are wiped out and austerity measures are put in place that actually sting, whose going to take the blame? Whose going to deserve it? When drastic steps are taken to restore order in the streets, when liberty is suspended in the name of order; whose going to stand up and say enough is enough? That requires character, and character requires courage and virtue. Why do you think our founders put such a heavy emphasis on those two traits? And it starts and ends with adherence to a system of laws and morality that transcend human fears, desires, and ideology. When you walk away from that. When you tell God; "I've got this, I don't need you," God's response is predictable: "And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God handed them over to their undiscerning mind to do what is improper.” ― Romans 1

[@kevmc21]

I keep praying that real leaders ( people of substance) will again rise to the call of serving in government. The choices in columns A and B are underwhelming- where is column C?

[@serviceisstrength3696]

This is probably going to sound kind of weird, but the main reason I support democracy is because I believe that human frailty is like stock performance in Modern Portfolio Theory; the more different kinds you can aggregate, the better the outcome due to their imperfect correlation. For example, I might be completely clueless on foreign policy while my neighbor is less informed on economic matters, but by bringing us together democracy manages to play our frailties off against each other, potentially bringing about a better outcome than if either they or I were left out of the governing process. The problem with aristocratic government is that the best human is still human, still flawed and fallible. The difference between the best aristocrat and Churchill's voter is one of degree, not kind.

[@josiahgonz2024]

I thoroughly enjoyed your talk at NEC, you and Jonathan’s talks are head to head right now in views.

[@papisoros1506]

How insignificant we are, even worse when we do not even understand that we are before the Very Body and Blood of our Redeemer, King of Holy Kings, Anointed in Triumphal Resurrection, the Son of the Eternal God. May our brothers improve, and guide us blind and deaf that our Pride as human creatures, the Holy Regina, the eve demonstrated Perfect in Her test, guides us towards the path of the Just Lamb of God, You, who remove sin from our souls, have mercy on us, in spite of us, insignificant, arrogant and foolish creatures, hunted by the infamy of dead creatures.

[@ceciliadreger6319]

Go, red and green.

[@josephcaristo]

Debate and arguing civilly and without name calling and noise are lost today. Toleration of another's view is now a lost art. My opinion is the right one and no one can tell me different. The facts are immaterial and either hidden or ignored. Even videos of crimes are interpreted wrongly and downplayed sometimes to fit the view of defendant.

[@suesspeechstreamsully5085]

Ohhhh SO GOOD. Thanks for informed, wide-ranging, anchored intellectual FUN! THE THINKING of it all. We SO need theological/ philosophical colleges for the ordinary person... in every diocese. We NEED the teaching.. lots of it. Our Catholic people need intellectual debate, information, learning. WHERE are the colleges to bring us all up to speed. Not universities. But colleges for people at work in the day, looking after kids at home during the days. Courses, degrees, debates, LEARNING.... we need it please!!! To stand up in this world today. Our love for the eucharist, our devotion to Jesus still leaves us needing the training, thoughts and learning of all the great minds relevant to our faith. Come Bishop Barron. Start a world wide college to provide knowledge to the humble person at home/ work. And don't forget New Zealand in that spread. :-) Sue

[@susanparker767]

✨🙏🏼✨

[@cathyphillips9120]

Our media today encourages the tribalism amongst us.

[@alphacharlietango969]

Tench Coxe says to keep the Federal Government out of local issues.

[@victoriaholmes675]

13:53 i think bishop Barron should give kids these days more credit. A lot of popular podcasts are science and educational podcasts that are longer than an hour. It’s usually TV that chooses shorter formats because “attention spans are shorter” i just don’t believe that

[@jenniferwinston7842]

@victoriaholmes675 I don't think the bishop says things arbitrarily. Ask any behavioral scientist. Technology is rewiring the brain, especially children, who psychologists state that the memory/attention span of most has been reduced to 6 seconds. Don't shoot the messenger.

[@victoriaholmes675]

@@jenniferwinston7842 i thought those studies have been debunked? I know technology is leading to lonlillness and social isolation, but I would pause on assuming kids can’t keep up with attention. Especially when podcasts data shows differently. Plus, who’s responsibility is it to keep these devices away from the kids so they can focus on other stuff? The parents

[@LorettaShields-tj7kp]

​@@victoriaholmes675 And the educational system.

[@reginaclaire4680]

❤

[@benhills1340]

Thank God there is no part three

[@ceciliadreger6319]

"Loving God, at the beginning of creation, you calmed the chaos of the world. Be present now to those whose lives are suddenly filled with chaos. Grant them the grace of calm in the midst of confusion. We pray to the Lord. Lord, hear our prayer. You have always shown us the way from darkness into the light. For those struggling now to see the light, we ask that you shine it a bit brighter in our world. Grant us all the grace to see a way forward through the present darkness. We pray to the Lord. Lord, hear our prayer." St. Ignatius of Loyola pray, for us. St. Michael, pray for us. St. Joseph, pray for us. St. Cynthia, pray for us.

[@papisoros1506]

Salvador, I am unworthy for you to love me, but let me seek Merit, so that perhaps it will be like this Once, we held a Just Monarch, who did not appear for the world, but defeated it and freed us from primeval slavery. Many of us search, but few do to find Him, we admire the Just, and perhaps something of Them sticks to us.

[@tookie36]

See you at tha crossroads, crossroads, crossroads So you won't be lonely See you at tha crossroads, crossroads, crossroads….

[@jesuslovesaves2682]

7:30. The best and brightest, most educated often turn out to be the worst for society. Often it takes a Carpenter and some fisherman to turn it around. The intellectuals like St Paul often to need to meet Jesus to turn it around. Bishops Barron should read (he probably has) Thomas Sowell and Paul Johnson books on intellectuals or more importantly the Scriptures. There are plenty of examples of this not turning out well. I personally know many of these best and brightest even Jesuit trained and they are moral Democrats. They think educations point is to save them from poverty to live the best life now. They think people who believe much of the Bible are ignorant or worse bigots. They support the pride movement wherever it leads, full abortion with no or little limits, deny God speaks to anyone along with any modern miracles, think prophecy is for fools, etc. I have a real hard time agreeing on this one. Why cannot we instead find saints or better yet hold Jesus Christ as our guiding light for society?

[@jesuslovesaves2682]

I agree with localism or Subsidiarity and resources being distributed well can lead to good things. At times some people are better with more resources than others for the benefit of all at Thomas Sowell as pointed out. The balance is very hard to control hence he thinks it's best for the market to via human choice to decide. His book Knowledge and Decisions expresses much of his thoughts on the topic. The local intuitions you mentioned can be well but my experience in the has not produced a lot of discussion but has a lot of work/tasks as mentioned in the reply to my other comment. But some of these intuitions have little power/control because a higher entity has taken it. The local schools for example are no longer local in many cases the State or Federal over rules the desires of the local people. In my area in IL the teachers' union has taken control of the local school boards and there is little hope of that ever changing. I had read of people what happens to people who oppose the teachers' union in my area. They try to destroy your life. Further, they have the election system down and know how to work in a way is highly unlikely the board isn't full of people in some way connected to the teachers' union. I tried getting involved with it. It is very hard to get anyone information about the candidates. When I have spent the many many hours to research them out all of them that ever got elected where connected to the teachers' union in some way. No candidate I support ever had a chance. Even if you could gain control of the board the State and Federal governments would overrule much of any change you may like via laws/lawsuits or funding.

[@MartinMartin-mu2qj]

whoever likes to measure the facts, let him measure them how to live deciding like a pagan/atheist, and how to live deciding like a Christian, or the closest thing to a Christian Since four years ago, very little has improved, but I am surprised by my new discipline, the truth is, I didn't expect it. Blessed Christian discipline The answer to why and why we are here is exact and precise, in my opinion, so that we can decide freely as Saints, or as unfortunates. We are a small spirit housed in a perishable body. For me, it is no longer about believing, but about knowing, and from what I see and live, I already know (and be careful, it implies greater rigor in my Judgment, even I know it), I would just like to share it.

[@ceciliadreger6319]

Ask to forgive your sins, and You'll receive your mercy; God has faith in your healing grace to get rid of the rejection of your suffering because of the false accusations and demeaning actions of another. Jesus, I trust in You!!!

[@ceciliadreger6319]

Try one more time. LORD God Almighty will open unto me divine doors, doors of breakthrough, doors of greatness, doors of favor.👁

[@bertpowers7064]

Freedom from or to religion.

[@ceciliadreger6319]

Take responsibility for the consequences of your actions.

[@j.g.6085]

8:00

[@Paul9443]

3:15 I started to think that too.

[@usenwill]

John 12:37 Although he had performed so many signs in their presence they did not believe him, in order that the word with Isiah the prophet spoke might be fulfilled: Lord, who has believed our preaching , to whom has the might of the Lord been revealed? For this reason, they could not believe, because again Isiah said: He blinded their eyes and hardened their heart so that they might not see with their eyes and understand with their heart and be converted, and I would heal them So Jesus knew that many people would not be converted and follow him. If it was true then, it is true now as well. I'm a Catholic, in large part because of Word on Fire ministries. But I question how you create a government that works for ALL people by legislating Christianity when even God knew that a significant portion of the population would/does not believe in him. Non-Christians get very angry when they feel that religious people are forcing their beliefs on them. How does this foster a healthy community consisting of both Christians and non-Christians? To me, as a Catholic, it seems like a more productive strategy would be to avoid overly legislating Christian theology so that people can make their own decision--of their own free will--to adhere to Catholic doctrine. Then evangelize, evangelize, evangelize. This is how it was meant to be from the beginning.

[@MartinMartin-mu2qj]

He who receives, accepts and decides according to the Word, gives an Example to others and likewise In deciding according to the Commandments of God the Creator, there is the Sonship of Sonships; In the observance of the Beatitudes of the Good Shepherd, there is Liberation from the death of the soul; and in the admiration and fulfillment of the Jurisprudence of the Holy Brothers, Vessels of Paraclete, is found the Life of souls. Christian discipline is admirable, confronted in total hostility to the filth that tempts us in every decision

[@markbirmingham6011]

Comment for traction

[@jesuslovesaves2682]

The is a reason why politicians and maybe more importantly the average person could be on such friendly terms with their political adversaries. At that time the power of the federal government was not nearly as much as it is today. The federal government has been taking more and more power and control away from the local government thus making it harder for people to live together peacefully. It used to be well no big deal I will go to my area over here and we can live the way we want to. There were also politically neutral areas of life people shared like sports and to some degree entertainment. Now politics in embedded into EVERYTHING: education, sports, entertainment, news, libraries, parks, etc. So, it is a different nation than it was back then. We cannot just go watch football without political slogans all over. We cannot send out kids to school without pride or other left think being pushed on our kids or worse. We cannot go to the library without pride and other left think being pushed, we have whole months dedicated to left think politics with nonstop pushing, on and on it goes. The federal election now determines what is allowed and taught in our schools, what flags are raised on local buildings, what sports and entertainment push on us. There is no escape of the other sides politics any longer or very little. Subsidiarity is dead or dying in the US. Maybe globally?

[@jesuslovesaves2682]

I do agree people need to be more friendly in their disagreements btw. My point is that the costs are a lot more personal when losing in politics/power seats today because of the government and other places of powers have direct affects over so much of our lives today. I also think a lot of views are a lot easier to see both sides on many topics via the internet. Many topics have been discussed and debated to the point that on various topics those who want to know the other side can find out without even speaking with the other side. At some point you have to just accept people aren't going to agree, they are divided on many topics. Christians cannot ever agree on many topics, not ever Catholics can. Further, many of those debates don't happen in person any longer and have gone onto social media. Community has broken down in the real world in many areas of life and has turned to the internet. You cannot ever go into Mass and expect someone to shake your hand any longer. If that isn't a symbol of community break down, then I do not know what it. I do not know many Catholics in the two parishes I attend regularly that will really have a serious discussion with you very often. Friendships have become more task oriented in Church. Weekly attendance has not resulted in any close friendships for me or my family. That is why I started posting on social media at all after spending decades avoiding it. I am starting to wonder if this is even worth it at all. It is rare that anything good conversations are coming from it.

[@gariochsionnach2608]

... if Im not wrong, the Jesuit Matteo Ricci (1552-1610) discovered in ancient China a highly moral culture without organized religion or concept of God / supreme being.

[@ALavin-en1kr]

There was religion in China in the Shang Dynasty which was (1600-1046) BCE.

[@ALavin-en1kr]

Bishop Barron makes a lot of sense in what he says.

[@reginak7696]

Nice discussion but wholly unrealistic in today's political scenario. Unless God intervenes, we are doomed.😢

[@ceciliadreger6319]

You can pursue education, career opportunities, or volunteer in your community. Short-term

[@craigbleckley3537]

Let Him intervene then. Per Mother Teresa.

[@reginak7696]

There is only one choice anymore. We must elect Republicans to accomplish anything in following God's will. ​@@ceciliadreger6319

[@reginak7696]

​@@craigbleckley3537 H e will if we pray for it.

[@ceciliadreger6319]

​@@craigbleckley3537Show evidence of your strengths.

[@shanesandoval4791]

Bishop do you understand you are part of the problem?

[@nguyentrinh793]

*****

[@papisoros1506]

the puppet tyrants of the dead beasts are the greatest captives among our brothers. Being persecuted by the pride of the proud is an unequivocal symptom of being on the Good Path. Those of us who do not Believe yet, are still ten Rosaries prayed with respect away from seeing some indication of the Reality in which we find ourselves. hell is the nightmare without waking up

[@ceciliadreger6319]

God is the creator of the universe, and is present in it in a hands-on way or even behind the seen.

[@James-dv6gi]

It's giving Plato's cave vibes like stop scaring people with this rubbish

[@ceciliadreger6319]

You need good spiritual teaching. You are fat.

[@billywills4391]

Each time a priest talks politics I don't see a priest. I see a politician and my respect for that priest is diminished, because he has fallen victim to the temptation that Jesus did not...political power.

[@ceciliadreger6319]

Lord, in Your precious name, we lift our volunteers’ families to You. Bless them for their sacrifice and support. Provide them with the strength and understanding they need as their loved ones give of themselves to serve others.🪜

[@petercarroll1195]

This conversation is more about the philosophy of American culture and politics, and what is wrong with it today. One side or another is not endorsed.