Worker Heavies: The Nerf Dart Test You NEED TO SEE!

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

Worker Darts (AUS): www.foamwork.com.au/product/worker-gen-2-he-foam-dart/1 Worker Heavy Darts (USA): outofdarts.com/products/worker-short-darts-200-pack-he-heavyweight-1-2g?_pos=2&_sid=4ce374717&_ss=r&ref=RIa3bVI3vXYhUs Worker Standard Darts (USA): outofdarts.com/products/worker-short-darts-200-pack-gen3-improved-darts-2021?ref=RIa3bVI3vXYhUs Slynx Files: www.printables.com/@kimchipew_1517298 Kimchi on Instagram: instagram.com/kimchiluvs2pew/ Sabre Apex Prime (USA): outofdarts.com/products/sabre-apex-prime?ref=RIa3bVI3vXYhUs Sabre Apex Prime (AUS): www.foamwork.com.au/product/ApexPrime/23 Sabre BCAR (USA): outofdarts.com/products/sabre-metal-bcar?ref=RIa3bVI3vXYhUs Sabre BCAR (SG): springblasters.com/products/sabre-spiral-scar-1?_pos=1&_sid=7cd553819&_ss=r Sabre 16kg Spring (SG): springblasters.com/collections/all/products/3rd-party-springs

[@outofdarts]

You continue to be the 11/10 tester in the hobby. Why do we have to live on the other side of the planet!?

[@mobert0839]

This Channel is BY FAR THE best channel for the most ACCURATE Test´s , keep up the good work bradley phillips! :D

[@dirtbikemike2956]

the project farm of hobby level nerf

[@outofdarts]

This.

[@mobert0839]

@@outofdarts OMG Hi Luke

[@lexan2002]

i used heavy's during the back half at a game today and it was night and day. the heavy's went straighter, had less whirly's and weren't buffeted by the breeze as much. love them, new standard for me

[@nicholas920us]

I have been using the heavies with my super stock blasters at 200fps cap games and I couldn't believe the improvement in range and accuracy at first... I gladly took the fps drop because it was clear (without the science) these darts were better... and the yellow foam option is so high vis that tracking those shots is incredibly easy.

[@siviblakhawk]

Thanks for running this test. I've been saying this ever since I got back into the hobby. Light darts are not better long range, just short range. I used to play back in the late 90, and we would sometimes wrap our darts in duck tape for this reason. I had a SSII that ran Stefan darts, (As in, made by the eponymous Stefan) with old mega suction cups glued on and wrapped in duck tape. It didn't shoot fast compared to today, but it was accurate and didn't lose fps so the range was actually quite good.

[@greglaing3119]

Just noticed the Worker Heavies are available at Baster Tech - the key besides the weight is the green tip on the darts.

[@David_R._8108]

Nice!! Thank you for your thoughts on how to handle the heavy darts for FPS caps!

[@WaltzActual]

30 meter chrono was inspired measurement. Just found the channel your break downs are different and really interesting from other people I watch

[@flankmaster7505]

I also think the reason you got higher muzzle energy on the standards is your Sabre blaster is overbarreled (meaning the dart remains in the barrel past the peak of the plunger pressure wave); the heavies are spending more time in the barrel losing more energy to friction. In an underbarreled system you could expect the heavy darts to have a higher muzzle energy than the light ones (that's been the case on my custom Alchemist, which is an extremely underbarreled testbed, in my testing both heavy and standard darts went within 5 fps of each other)

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

After reading your comment I went and tested 1g vs 1.17g (standard and heavy) in the stock Nexus Pro X which is itself underbarreled, it gains fps when you attach it's included BCAR. With standard Workers it shot 2J and with Heavies it shot 1.9J. a much closer result than the Apex Prime, but still lower from the Heavies. It likely depends how underbarreled you are.

[@flankmaster7505]

Ok thanks for the additional data from the NPX, that is good to have. My Alchemist has a 10in barrel so definitely an extreme example. I like the concept you suggested in the video of establishing chrono limits with worker standard darts and then allowing players to select whatever dart they want, I've suggested it to our local club

[@frogsbutfrogs]

dang good to know, thats why my seagull shoots nails with the second heaviest worker spring

[@symmetricon1982]

​@@frogsbutfrogsShort or long barrel?

[@frogsbutfrogs]

@@symmetricon1982 shortest on second heaviest spring

[@flankmaster7505]

Love your testing Brad, this info is much-needed to clear up confusion people are having about heavies. Have you observed a decline in consistency in worker dart foam recently? In the US we've gotten recent batches of workers with foam that is undersized and so inconsistent it leads to issues with accuracy and std dev of shot FPS. I've personally switched to Bamboo 2X darts despite their lighter weight for competitions due to the consistency over workers.

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

I find most dart manufacturers have inconsistencies. AF Pro's from Dart Zone for example are shocking for it. Bambooing a dart helps bring back some consistency which is why a lot of people use Worker Bamboos now.

[@nateswineford2150]

I’ve noticed that the standard worker darts are kinda crap. I love the worker bamboos as they are sooo much better but the darts heads don’t stay on very well. I find the worker standard darts to not have very good or consistent FPS, they are worst darts in my harrier. My go to dart lately has been the X Shot pro darts they have shown the same consistency and FPS as worker bamboos in my harrier and they are easy to get here in the US. I don’t know what’s up with my worker darts but non of the many I have bought Last more than one or two shots.

[@Midnight890]

@@BradleyPhillipsYTwould you say worker bamboos are a superior dart choice for a harrier shooting at 250 FPS?

[@kahwengliew7697]

Awesome video! Thx for running this test!

[@Muscon01]

Now you've got a more sniper-like ammo for all your sniping needs. Would be interesting to see if there is a lower fps limit where these heavies are less preferable to the normal worker darts.

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

I've tested them down to about 130fps so far and they go further than standard darts in maximum range there too, but perhaps with a stock Nerf blaster?

[@Rhino_Aus]

Have a few comment: - Your FPS data at range matches my simulations of 0.465 drag coefficient pretty closely - The range test as performed is a) flawed and b) not not especially relevant to games. Who is expecting to regularly take >70m shots and design their blaster around that? - Based on my simulated data, time to target for the 360ft/s 1.0g darts will be lower than equiv heavy out to about 55m. - Heavy + fast light resulting is less drop is a direct consequence of the lower time to target. - Accuracy comparison methodology really should be based on a statistical analysis of standard deviation from mean impact point, not "looks" - 300fps heavy > 300fps light is absolutely true due to lower time to target due to less reduction in velocity over distance. - Heavy vs light in the same blaster: Need to consider that the light dart will have a lower time to target out to ~55m, so "better" within that range - Heavy darts from the same blaster have higher impact energy past ~15m, - "Chrony light, use heavy" ignores the higher safety risk if operating with FPS caps based on minimum engagement ranges. No sane organiser should allow 360fps point blank shots. - The "Equal muzzle energy" method ignores the higher impact energy of heavy darts at range. - Impact energy (not muzzle) is the best metric for safety, and that is what should be used to determine whatever method of cap that a field implements. - Heavy darts must be restricted to lower FPS and muzzle energy for the same impact energy at anything other than point blank range. From my perspective, In order to safety use a variety of dart types, you need to determine a maximum allowable impact energy at whatever ranges your minimum engagement distances are, then ensure that the muzzle energy of the darts types allowed results in an impact energy at the MED range less than the allowable impact energy. A good example might be: "2.0J at a MED of 15m". A Light dart would be 335ft/s, and heavy 285ft/s. In this case, the light dart has a lower time to target below 50m (and so "better"), but both darts are under a safe level at the 15m min engagement range. If you have no MED, and just use a muzzle energy, then the heavy darts will always hit harder at any range and you should use those for determining you'r safe limits. From a gameplay perspective, for a 4.2J muzzle energy limit (300ft/s 1.0g dart), even though the light dart carries less energy, in has a lower time to target within 30m, so is the better choice when engaging within that range. And is safer. I need to stop here so it doesn't become more of an essay; it's already pretty rambling. Chat more on Discord if you want.

[@Flygonial]

Woah a wild Ryan appeared! On that point for standard deviation, it’s something I’ve wanted to log for a while, and the second I shot at splatter paper and then tried to measure distances with a ruler… yikes. I’ve been playing with OpenCV for a while instead, where I’ve been doing a perspective transform on a known target size (so I’ve just been deriving a scale factor between pixels & mm), use color detection for video-based plots, handle some edge cases for very close shots by blending them into multiple shots at the same point (their centroid), and then I just let Python do its thing and figure out a center point for each shot and derive a radial standard deviation for distances of each shot to that point. I was wondering if there were any obvious things I’m getting wrong (ie: methodology) or spending too much effort on? The main goal I have is accessibility, despite all the possible sources of error in my method, and I’m very much a novice at CV.

[@Rhino_Aus]

@@Flygonial Hey mate, didn't get any sort of notification for this reply. I've been thinking about how to do this for a while, but also do it in a way that can be easily duplicated by the community. Had a few ideas but never had the time to test them: - Carbon copy paper with a steel backing plate and a very thin layer of rubber to mark hits. Feel like it could be made to work. - Applying stamp ink to the tip of the darts, paper target backed by steel plate. This is my current thought on the best method. - Accelerometer to detect the impact with a steel plate linked to the trigger of a camera. Would need a zoom lens with the camera roughly positioned normal to and centered on the plate. - Camera as above but shooting highish speed video with sensor as above linked to a synchronize impact times. I've previously made a little CV tool in MATLAB for analysing photos of targets from my rifle target shooting result that did basically exactly what you're talking about. But it was much cleaner data with a scanned sheet of paper with clear, high contrast holes in it than a video recording or whatever. It's probably quicker and more accurate to record the data in a way that is easier to hand label the data. Doesn't take that long to label the impact points by hand if you prep the data nicely. Hell, MS paint gives you an XY pixel position, log it all in Excel, extract all the data you want: mean distance from aim point, radial SD from mean, CEP50/80 radius, etc. Once you're got good clean data for hand labelling, making a CV based method for automatically marking the data should be easy.

[@c3nty2]

From our club's testing, the yellow heavy darts are slightly smaller diameter and do not seal as well as the worker 3 HE's (standard reds). They are loose enough that they can even fall out of the barrel. This is across many different blasters and barrel types. It's a major problem, and we'd all basically need to switch to tighter barrels to take advantage of the heavier dart gains.

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

The foam isn't what gives the dart its weight though, it's the green tip. So if your yellow darts are too small foam, try the black or red ones instead.

[@sepiarain]

I love this man. You're doing the sweet science we all need. Imagine if these stats were included on the box of blasters?! I'm interested in how they added the weight to the dart, like is it in the tip or distributed evenly over the projectile through the fibrosity of the foam... I'd love to know at what point adding weight to the dart takes away from the shot. I imagine you could double the average dart's weight and with proper rifling it's just going to shoot beams.

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

The added weight is all in the tip, they use a more dense material for it

[@sepiarain]

@@BradleyPhillipsYT I guess there's a point where too much weight in the nose would cause the tail to spin... I know foam dart design is all about keeping it cheep cheerful and playful, but imagine if a Spiral design was added to the trunk and a distribution of weight was released from tip to tail on an even curve... you could easily create a very accurate dart.

[@RAYRICHTHERAPPER]

I wonder if there is an advantage to using heavy darts in flywheeler blasters

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

I believe there's even more of an advantage compared to using standard darts in flywheels. The exit velocity is apparently much more similar which gives heavies an edge in those.

[@jgcayton]

Love to see your test of heavy worker darts in flywheels that shoot from 130-200 fps with standard darts. Great content!

[@jonmandelbaum5395]

Idk how but if you’re able to get it past customs, I’d love to see you review the guardian lynx

[@maximedboisvert]

What about the heavy darts in a 150-200 fps blaster such as the Unicorn? Would the heavier weight of the heavies still get advantages over regular darts?

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

I'll try them in my Nexus Pro X video next week

[@thelonewolf22386]

Any chance you could grab diameters on the heavies and standards you used? I know worker’s diameters have been pretty inconsistent as of late, and in discussions about heavies a few people have brought up the airsoft concept of joule creep, which would imply the opposite of what was seen here. I’m wondering if differing diameters might have something to do with the joule discrepancy displayed here. Regardless, what an excellent video! It’s awesome to finally see a real test of heavies vs standards! Edit: (I see I also missed someone mentioning joule creep in the comments, interesting to see those results in the underbarreled setup!)

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

Both measure 12.7mm on the outer diameter

[@thelonewolf22386]

@@BradleyPhillipsYT quite interesting, thank you!

[@Always_crusin]

Hey Bradley, I would love to build a slynx however I just have concerns with the durability of the 3d printing. Have you heard of anyone making an injection molded slynx? (If not maybe you could talk to worker about it:)

[@E85_STI]

I don’t play with these but I do enjoy the videos but I wonder at the end of a game do you go back and get the darts you are able to find or do you just get a new box of darts?

[@IkAAris521]

It really depends on game and person. As a general rule we try to pick up as many darts as possible to prevent litter and recover what ammo we can. However, many players especially at high levels try to use fresh darts at every event that matters to maintain consistency

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

Depends on where you are. Public venues always pick up your darts so you don't leave a mess behind. Private venues you don't need to be as meticulous.

[@vmorning3506]

6:16 Dude turned American for a sec

[@tk5800thesecond]

we have been doing a few open chrony at 20 meter testing. what we saw was a good match up of MED's to fps. in that by the time the dart travelling 300 fps reaches 20 meters its travelling under 200fps. heavy darts ruin this system though

[@hand644]

I know you tested dart zone bamboo 2.0 darts but they made a bamboo 2x dart which i think is a normal weight and might perform better than the 2.0 s

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

Those weigh .85g, while an improvement from .75g, still too light weight in my opinion.

[@danielleinad6019]

Looks like you've got a printed magwell thing on your Apex. Is it to reduce the massive magazine wiggle? Is there a file to download and print?

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

It's just a flared magwell to help insert the mags. Might be able to find a file on Foamwork Adelaide's sell page for it.

[@Mtonk895]

Why are you not using the worker Harrier?

[@obviouslycasualpanda9406]

Are the different colors of foam different types of foam? If so, do they make a difference in the performance?

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

I haven't noticed any real difference between the foam types.

[@obviouslycasualpanda9406]

@@BradleyPhillipsYT Good to know, thanks!

[@frogsbutfrogs]

@@obviouslycasualpanda9406 although through me and my communities findings, black foam darts are ever so slightly denser and more consistent

[@eldwitch]

@@BradleyPhillipsYT Having heard about differences between Worker and red and black foam, I used them (bamboos) fairly extensively in a variety of springers/AEBs, and, like all other reports I've heard from others here in Singapore, blacks consistently and significantly outperform reds by 10-20 fps.

[@RoxyBricks]

What about with blasters like 150 or 130?

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

Heavies still go further. Up close, standards will make it to the enemy slightly faster though just like here.

[@DEADMANSFOAM-DirtyD]

Great I have to buy more darts!! Thanks!!

[@FelixstoweFoamForge]

In the uk, anything with an "at muzzle" KE of 1 joule or over is legally an air-weapon, and so restricted by law to private land only. Fo public games we use 130fps as a cap, but it is problematical with different weight projectiles. I mean, a .50 foam ball goes way faster than a 1g nerf dart, but has less KE because of the weight difference. Question: should we move from FPS to Kinetic energy, like the airsoft lads use? Would that be fairer? Too difficult to work out?

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

It would be more difficult to work out but in your situation it's probably the best idea. Measure each individual user based on the ammo they're using.

[@ShadowDaPk]

Yes, light darts won't go as far, but if you're at close quarters they still have a use in being harder to dodge because they'll be flying faster.

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

This is true, you will not have to lead your target as much if they're running and give someone less time to dodge if you're using a higher velocity dart.

[@CRNerf]

Awesome data. Thank you

[@breakice1986]

what a professional test 😂

[@ThomasBS-o8v]

Nones gonna talk about how outrageously expensive the apex prime is? It’s about $650 and its predecessor the m20 is around $1000 Good lord The apex prime is crazy powerful and very accurate and the fact that you can use a firearm grade scope on it is incredible

[@JapanLovers]

Interesting how ballistic coefficient the heaver rounds are no matter what gun/rifle

[@Legobabygrogu]

Please use the worker seagull in a video again

[@dancarthen3634]

Seems to me the Dart to use are the Worker Green Tip Bamboos aka Worker Heavy Bamboos. Yes they weigh 1.2 grams and you get thay bamboo effect so they have similar velocities to standard darts but with extra distance. Green tips: 1.2 gram Orange tip: 1 gram Purple tip: .08 gram

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

I've found in bamboo vs standard comparisons that bamboos don't really give you any advantage over standard darts aside from smoother feeding in AEBs for example. They can help a bit if the foam is inconsistent in size though.

[@h0b0j04]

​@BradleyPhillipsYT AaronPlinks did a video about a month ago showing an average 20fps boost and tighter groupings from the bamboo heavy vs the regular heavy. I've been waiting to see you put the bamboo heavy darts through your paces, though.

[@zeroblade6599]

I heard the heads are denser on the heavies than on the normals, could that add to the pain factor when getting shot with them? I have kids in my wars and am trying too find the best dart while not hurting them. We need a way to measure pain. Joules on impact is only comparable if the dart heads act the same

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

Pain is a tough metric to measure for sure. The heads would have to be a more dense rubber material than standard heads in order to have a heavier weight to them. So while the standard dart has higher energy, perhaps they would both hurt similarly point blank.

[@ChrisFaustmann]

great imformative video👍

[@jolemaire6629]

So unless you are a target plinker it's a big fuss for nothing. Very insightful. From what FPS blaster is heavy darts a better dart to use? I recon above 200 fps.

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

Not sure how you came to that conclusion. Did you actually watch this video?

[@jolemaire6629]

Yes i did, but the heavy darts don't work well in a standard 150 fps blaster. I haven't had the time yet to use them in my high fps blasters.@@BradleyPhillipsYT

[@frogsbutfrogs]

@@jolemaire6629 i standardly use them in 150fps cap games and they work far better than standard darts

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

​@@jolemaire6629they worked better in my Aeon Pro X which shoots around 150fps

[@wistralis7387]

offtrack: dang the yellow heavies look nice, I got reds by mistake but sheesh

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

The yellows show up very well on camera

[@TheSocialProfile]

So your saying insert 1g into the dart (tip biased)? Should save a few bucks.

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

These are .17g heavier than standard darts. Keep in mind though that modifying Nerf darts is generally frowned upon or not allowed at events.

[@mainstay.]

The price per dart isn't bad either. OOD is selling heavies for the same as the lighter darts, so that's a plus.

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

Yeah I think most sellers price Worker darts the same despite the weight unless they're bamboos which cost more due to labor.

[@backyardfoam]

Great video!!

[@keegs666]

How were you able to put a standard butt-stock on the Apex Prime? I tried an M4 buffer tube from a paintball gun but it doesn't fit. I'm only new to the hobby and clueless to thread sizes etc. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Cheers.

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

Requires a milspec buffer tube, not an Airsoft one

[@melikesdonuts]

have you tested the bamboo heavies

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

I've used them before, they don't come in yellow yet though. Similar performance to these.

[@mhebert350]

I wonder if there will be bamboo heavies in the near future

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

There are, just not yellow ones currently.

[@mhebert350]

@@BradleyPhillipsYT yeah I went to order some and saw them red and green bamboos, but they look odd, also jesus fucking christ have the shipping rate gone mad!!!! 50 USD shipping on 4 boxes at OOD, I'll sadly buy them from workermod instead

[@FieryWings01]

Why no more gelsoft reviews mate?

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

There was a gelsoft review the other week. You probably didn't see it because gelsoft isn't very popular on KZbin.

[@FieryWings01]

@BradleyPhillipsYT its more niche i think is the problem as most of countries use airsoft so its not that common to look for gelsoft reviews but it certainly helps the Aussie audience. Keep up the good work mate 🍻

[@samdavidson6483]

Is the weight in the tip or the foam in the heavy yellow darts ?

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

Tip

[@mattorama]

Why do we measure velocity in feet per second, but spring power in kilograms? Can't we just use all metric, or all imperial?

[@BradleyPhillipsYT]

Using kg for spring weights is a poor measure in and of itself

[@frogsbutfrogs]

@@BradleyPhillipsYT yeah, thats why ood had made that blog post explaining how they are going massively overhaul theirm spring listings, worker already switched and so did xyl so we know we gotta do it

[@mattorama]

@@BradleyPhillipsYT When I tried to go straight to a spring supplier instead of just buying the "7kg" or the "9kg" i saw how many variables there are concerning the strength of a spring and it was way above my pay grade.

[@dolandcheung1475]

Great confirmation of what airsoft has said, tested and proven for quite awhile now.

[@Antmac75]

Ive been using the heavy bamboos since they came out. I wont be using anything else

[@kapler8550]

ELR nerf competitions when.

[@GucciBodyBags]

These are the only darts to use when out door shooting over 170fps

[@TheSocialProfile]

Your talking like you’ve had them for years 😂

[@GucciBodyBags]

@@TheSocialProfile its not hard to go through thousands of rounds and see a difference. Gave my thoughts on them last November. Good observation tho *head pat*

[@bradsuosaari1206]

Without further ado, NOT without further adieu. You’re welcome! The Grammar Police

[@Kiborg.UA112]

Just got a box of this from monkee mods, looking forward to see how it works)