Worship Leaders Don't Lead People Into God's Presence

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Logan Walter teaching from Hebrews 10:19-25 at Austin Stone Worship Huddle.

[@jonbulack2247]

A good worship leader is one who seeks God to know what God wants to do and what songs He wants to use to do it. A good worship leader is in total submission to God and is looking to God each moment in order to flow with God and move according to what God is revealing. In this way a worship leader is creating an atmosphere that is conducive to the work that God wants to do in His people, and that worship leader shares what they believe God is wanting to communicate. We are nothing more than tools in His hands. But it is not accurate to say that we aren't used by God to help do the job of connecting people to the heart of God, and helping them experience His presence to a greater extent. It is accurate to say that God is using us to do it, but we aren't the author or origin of it. A great carpenter uses a hammer to drive nails into wood, but the hammer isn't the designer or author of the project. We are tools in His hands. We are part of the process but not the authors of it.

[@taylormihai]

You need to make the difference between “connected” people that already are in His presence through the blood of Jesus. You can only hellp them worship, but preaching the Gospel to “unconnected” people is a different call.

[@josephparungaoandchristine7362]

Very well said brother...☺️

[@pauljason4728]

thank you my friend. God bless you

[@corruptedCROWN]

Beautifully said. Im guilty of saying worship leaders and praise singers usher the spirit of the lord into the church but after seeing this it opened my eyes to a true understanding of what was happening. Then I was like well how do I explain it now? Lol and this fits perfectly with how God uses us!

[@ajiboyetimileyin601]

Worship is firstly unto god and not for ourselves. So we must be careful to meet god standard for us to worship him. We must also consider those we are leading and not focus on ourselves. Our skills are important but that's not the major focus of worship, personal interests come very very at last pick in worship. I have video related to learning worship leader, in which I will recommend for anybody anywhere. m.kzbin.info/www/bejne/d5LboaywdrKDhNU

[@carolynwhite9975]

This video is an answer to prayer. For years it has been engrained and instilled in me that as a Worship Lead that I am responsible for leading people into worship. I am be purged from this mindset. Thank you Lord Jesus

[@bleckybob]

whenever I've led worship, I've always tried to make it a point to remind my congregation that worship has NOTHING to do with me, the band, the music, the lyrics or anything in the service. The Lord says that He inhabits the praises of His people and when we sing and praise and come together to show our love, adoration and worship of Him together through music and community...it's a powerful thing. Praise music and bands are only there to facilitate and allow the people of God to sing together in a unified voice. it's a simple thing, but can be complicated. but it all boils down to heart. if you pursue Him, He will reveal Himself to you.

[@wemuk5170]

Sam N To facilitate... Amen! 🙏😊👍

[@janetm7693]

Thank you for this. Emotionalism is what many equate with God's presence. We already are in God's presence if we have the Holy Spirit in us.

[@NorthstarMusic]

I think that this is a much needed reminder that Scripture teaches us that it is not what we do that brings people to God, but it is who we are that brings people to God. It is not the song choice, or arrangement that connects people to God, as Logan is teaching here. However, Scripture is also clear that they will not know unless they are taught. How do these unholy people come to experience the presence of God unless they are led? Yes, Jesus leads them, but Old and New Testament alike teach that it is often through His chosen leaders that Jesus works and leads. It was through men like Moses, David, Isaiah, Peter, Paul and John that people came to hear and to know the power and presence of God. So while it's not what we do, there is a power that comes from God through a life lived in submission to God. We cannot imitate this power, or trick God into giving us this power, it is only through Godly character, humble spirits and willing hearts. It is an act of Grace, but it is Grace that is channeled through the obedient and willing life of a leader. As worship leaders then, our primary responsibility is not to prepare and deliver great music, but to prepare our hearts and deliver that. I think this is a great start to a really interesting idea, but I think it needs to be developed further. Thanks for making me think this morning.

[@fionaefua714]

Thank you so much for this exhortation, God bless u

[@delainnabatoon]

Jeff in Pratt wow. Amen!

[@user-yn4mr2ip1t]

Some pastor say’s..... Worship leader need those people bring into the Throne of God. Its that is true? That u must need to do this? What should worship leader do?

[@pauljason4728]

Thank you for your explaination, it helps me lot. God bless you

[@RUT812]

Northstar Music It is not us who bring people to God. It’s never about us. It’s the Holy Spirit who brings people to God.

[@janetm7693]

Thinking that one can lead people into God's presence is spiritual pride.

[@ninocrispatino9566]

What a genuine teaching. Praise God for such real hearts for I've been so burdened by this wrong ideology creaping into and crippling people.in the church.. Thank You Lord. God bless you all.

[@rojalutero9793]

Jesus is the one who brought us in His Presence not us (Worship Leaders/Worship Team)...we only help people to re align their mind emotion and heart into God so they can worship freely wholeheartedly .. like if we feel anxious, angry, and down ... most of us ..we listen to music ..why? because it helps us to calm and relax..it helps us to set our mood.. God said I am the way, the truth, and light no one comes to the Father except through me..John 14:6 Thank You Jesus..😇😇. All Glory to You alone Jesus.

[@lorijohnson3223]

I am humbled. Thank you for your corrections. I meant to encourage. If I am big enough to stand. I am big enough to stay kneeled. Thank for your understanding and patience.

[@florarupinta7262]

The highest formof worship is obedience

[@lkngfr90]

AMen!!! Romans 12:1“Therefore, I urge you, brothers and sisters, in view of God's mercy, to offer your bodies as living sacrifices, holy and pleasing to God - this is your true and proper worship”

[@mikaellowenham2076]

I support what he says in many whays, but still I do think worshipleaders lead people to feel the presence of God. Is gods presence always here? Definitely! But if someone has a ruff morning and kids are in bad mood, it's not easy to worship through those circumstances. I believe God speaks to us and touch us when we have open hearts. The role of a worship leader is to create worship that makes people want to worship, even if they didn't won't to in the beginning. Then god can do his work. With that said I see worship leaders as people which leads others into feeling gods presence. As long as we praise Gods presence can come! Hope you understood my thoughts on it!

[@ahfcff]

Thank you . I appreciate that you shared this from personal view. I appreciate that you didn't point fingers at everyone else but that you share what God has shown you through His word. It is helpful to me and I plan to share on my FB page.

[@themexicancowboy602]

I agree that it's through Jesus and as a worship leader myself would never deny it. Jesus is my center of my worship and I worship because I'm grateful for what He did for me on the cross, for what he's done in my life. Not sure that I would agree that we don't lead worship because then what is our purpose to be up there? Are we there to entertain? We lead because again we are grateful and appreciate what He did and because we love Him.

[@torrefuerte008]

The correct question would be: Why do people come to the local church? to have a good time ... To resolve the condition of the Church at that moment, depends on one person ... the Holy Spirit who is the director of the true Church or Body of Christ. We all contribute some ingredients (including the worship team), but it is The Holy Spirit who by means of the gifts given to the Body of Christ is how we can minister to the local church.

[@Asemahle20]

Halleluya... wow brother I am happy to hear this its been in my spirit for a very long time. JESUS!!

[@JoshuaPosada6]

Thank you for this. I often struggle with those same thoughts that what I do as a worship leader effects how much the congregation worships or what they experience during the worship service. I leave feeling discouraged that I "didn't do my job" if I felt like they didn't worship God. This video reminds me that I'm not supposed to "lead them into His presence." Jesus is the bridge between God and His people. Thank you for this encouraging reminder.

[@douglasrugambwa3172]

+Joshua Posada Yes, and now you are set free and you can have peace of mind.

[@MultiLivingtestimony]

I know how u feel

[@carolynwhite9975]

Joshua Posada Amen, same for me. I too struggled with this mindset. It was instilled and engrained in me. The Lord led me to this video to purge my mind

[@priyajenu4349]

Are you an worship leader? I need help what to worship

[@tomt8691]

The 5:45 minutes that changed me. Thank you for posting this!

[@tukstvgwapito6537]

Wooooow. Praise God for the wisdom. I just realized rn. Glory be to God alone.

[@socalmsofly]

Bless you! What a revelation indeed! The same revelation applies to prayer time and every conversation with people. Ultimately it comes down to the question of "Do I trust man or God?" For I cannot serve two masters and Father tells us to trust no man, but to trust Him. And He gives us very good reasons to trust Him only. Since the beginning, Father has been Very Good. Btw, I believe God is ultimately accomplishing a greater good through all the evil that the devil brings about.

[@douglasrugambwa3172]

Thanks for this, I love it. It's so truthful. Also love "This Glorious Grace" album, it's sooo gud!

[@ekeneokpareke5656]

Thank you. I needed to hear that.

[@nathanfranckhauser]

He states at the very beginning "this passage corrects me..." It's important that we allow the Spirit of God to correct this young man who himself has clearly said that he made worship into a formula and believed that he led people into God's presence. As a teacher it's often hard to discern what God would use you to teach others versus what He is simply teaching you, for you.

[@torrefuerte008]

The only way to learn it is through the experience of prayer and personal adoration.

[@crispybiskit8371]

It’s not the job of the worship team to lead us into God’s presence; it’s their job to worship the Lord. It’s important for the congregation to come prepared to worship, not just by showing up, but by readying themselves in such a manner that when they get to church they are not worshiping from a soulish place. Our inner man is always in the presence of God because He lives in us. Therefore we need to worship from our inner man...in spirit and truth...because we cannot effectively worship from our soul. Our soul is affected by outer circumstances, but our spirit is not. Come into His presence before church and you will push the worship at church to a higher level.

[@angelicaziianne6518]

thank you for this .. because I am also a worship leader and I don't know what to do .. this video enlightened me that worship leader doesn't lead people to God .. I thank God .. for this.

[@kecha7381]

We are ambassadors of Christ. We are called to go and lead people into His kingdom. Yes with the power of Holy spirit. Similar with worship leaders. God uses them to lead people into His presence. Apply His word through His wisdom. Not just literally brag about His word.

[@Yeetmiester]

It is 1am and I’m watching this for school, rock on lol!

[@MrYomeokim]

Wow so good!!

[@ccpcmusic]

excellent!!!!! And well said. THANK YOU!

[@Chido02able]

Wow... i love this teaching! I have always questioned the term Worship Leader it is also not found in the bible maybe we should call ourselves Music Directors, Choir Director, Music ministers or Administrators. What we do is minister in music not worship. Worship is not music or a song, it's meaning is really much deeper and special than that, please music ministers, let's not be little Worship of Christ into a Sunday service set list... Please...

[@pc5647]

Never thought of that before. Thanks for the insight.

[@riabari3816]

It's a good a teaching for worship leader like me...Thx

[@loversinparisfreak]

so good.

[@chosen1063]

Let me quote Jesus Christ and tell me if I am right or wrong " God is sprit and they that worship him must have a worship leader in order to worship him in spirit and in truth " NOT " they that worship him must worship him in spirit and truth " let the spirit of God be your worship leader just as the word says that you don't need any man to teach you but the anointing within you..... not saying we don't need pastors or teachers but it's the Holy Spirit that uses men and women and the spirit of God bears witness with our spirit ....... " not by power nor by might but by my spirit says the lord ......Oh how we need Gods spirit those who are led by the spirit of God are sons of God

[@HandmaidenOfDistinction66854]

jesse thomas Yes and amen!!! Not to offend but to speak the truth. The other comments are from those that have something to gain. We must check our hearts and examine ourselves daily. We no longer need a mediator. Many that refer to themselves WL, do so as a form of entertainment or they're trying to make a living by it. Come boldy beloved brethren.

[@fernandoorozco7282]

A agree ...We lead people into songs ..not the presence ..Holy spirit is already in us ...we need him to rise from us ...i think people bealive think worship ushers in your presence because things happen during that time ..but its because people are vulnerable to God and they surrender themselves and chain are broken people are set free and the people allow God to move in them ...repentence will allow God work in you !!

[@aidanmccoy5964]

So good! God is always with us, so we can't lead people TO him. BUT we can lead them into a relationship with Christ! Many people seem to disagree with his point. And ultimately it may come from a different opinion on what God's presence really is, rather than the idea he presents. God's presence is the Holy Spirit, and as explained in Acts, and throughout Scripture, the Holy Spirit dwells in those who put their faith in him. Thus worship leaders won't lead people into his presence rather, they will lead people to be present in worship. Which means that they are open to the work of the Holy Spirit.

[@ShAy1757]

I agree with the entirety of this study. Like the brother was saying, and yes worship is important, but if it's pretty much the focus of the service and the leaders are up there for hours compared to the person bringing the sermon (not saying a sermon needs to be 3 hrs or something!) They get "big head" if their hearts arnt in the right place, if the type of compliments he gave as examples are continually given to them and it's not corrected (through Scripture) we solemy enter that Holy place through the blood of the Lamb! Worship though, helps us to connect with the Lord for sure. But Jesus is the only One worthy enough to lead us face-to-face with the Father!

[@jasonb5645]

A worship leader "leads" or serves as a "facilitator" during the worship gathering; directing people to the Savior with an awareness of the Spirit may want to do.

[@davidochieng9721]

Reading what the scriptures say is one thing but understanding them and giving them the right interpretation is another thing and this is where we normally go wrong as we sometimes base such on our different religious beliefs. We should not forget therefore that some of these titles were seen in one person. Take a look at David. Through his leadership as a musician being part of what he was, he played for King Saul a song through his God given skills in musical instruments leading to his healing. I 100% agree with you on the issue of humility to all people setting an atmosphere for others to enter the presence of God whether worship leaders or not after all it is our personal relationship with God through Jesus Christ that will initiate us into the presence of God, not man's effort.

[@nuggetoftruth-ericking7489]

Nugget of Truth for even more Truth

[@matthewrobotham3144]

This is so profound ..... thank you for this, i really needed this message

[@thebeginningofsorrows7500]

What bothers me about worship leaders and musicians, is that the heart of man is desperately wicked, and i see a lot of pride in these young people on the stage. A bit like pop star wannabes. How do i know?, ive been there, for years i played on a stage in church. It was sometimes like a rock concert on a sunday night at the youth meetings. Even Sunday morning meetings too. I spoke to people sometimes about it and a lot of the parishioners were aware that there was showing off going on, but nothing was ever done about it. That is WRONG. If people can see it then surely the pastors could see it? But i left that church because of the false demonic teaching that started there. Once i was away from it and i opened my eyes, i said "Never again". Im not against bands, but there should be no stage - its not a concert?? No spotlights, no darkening of the auditorium while the "rock band" shows off, no excessive volume, and no driving rock beats or guitar solos etc. I dont need a band to worship God. I often noticed how people were singing but they were watching the "show", not concentrating on what they were singing about. It's garbage, really it is and God says He will oppose the proud. That means you're the opposition. That means, you're not on Gods side? Ouch. Do music properly, and do all of the above conditions and, maybe, just maybe when you pray for the dying they will live?

[@user-mf8gb6bd8v]

U r exactly right...

[@madampopabwoli4620]

Great teaching but I think the Bible says God dwells in the praises of His people. Just as we need a preacher to share the word, God uses worship leaders to raise the praise that God inhabits. All else you have said is true but it is a given that Christ is the ultimate bridge. We are just vessels who create praise...showing His people the right way. The Old Testament had priests and musicians too. Why?

[@sunnymorning228]

you explained this so perfectly

[@NicetoNice05]

Well said Lord bless even if people walk up to you and thanked you for leading the worship or what ever we must make sure that we don't take God's glory and boast about it but always stay humple with a 100% mindset that we are just a vessel for God's Kingdom and it's only God alone take credit not us as worship leaders and what ever Lord bless my friends

[@chosen1063]

Madam Pop Abwoli how many worship leaders did Paul the apostle have and how many did Peter have ? and who led Daniel into the lords presence . there is nowhere where a worship leaders leads anyone into Gods presence but as a worshipper you enter into his presence , we worship individually and we worship corporately and I enter in his presence by the blood of Jesus

[@NicetoNice05]

jesse thomas well yes individually i take your side on that because Holy Spirit will lead us into the presence of God but what im saying is God uses people for a purpose, in saying that we are His tool for his Kingdom we reach out to the Lost souls and lead them to a prayer of Salvation if he's willing but leading him closer to the presence of God, now that is not a man can do only the Spirit of God can but in the we don't take credit off of Gods Glory we are just a vessel for His Kingdom

[@dancing523]

Thank you. People will say just about anything in the pulpit and sounds very convincing too but it does not mean he is correct. When I think of someone else leading me into worship, it’s about setting up an atmosphere. He went to deep.

[@TP.111]

Sometimes we overthink things.

[@daniapowell180]

Hallelujah 🙌🙏👏

[@timeplan82]

Is there a way to get the full message?

[@focm888]

Yes. The way into GOD'S Presence is JESUS & the HOLY SPIRIT leads us into it

[@gregstickler3798]

Amen for forty yrs I was involved in music teams If you look at the early church they didn't even have a music team NT talks about coming together as a church with a psalm or prophecy or a word of knowledge In fact if we were to go back to the early church we would be coming together and then waiting on Holy Spirit to guide the service But we have drifted so far away from what the church is

[@nickantonio9670]

Anyone know hat book n verse he pulls that first bit from?

[@kittusahai]

Brother we all are unholy people, if we are holy that is only through the blood of Christ!! It's not only the worship leader but all the people who worship in truth builds a throne of praise for God n God's presence is there!! Yes spirit touches only those who open their hearts but rest of the people at least learns the way of worshipping!! Regards

[@TheLighthouseUK]

It's always been in the scripture that it's by the blood of Jesus. Well done for pointing to Gods word on the matter. The next thing of course to deal with is the idea of a worship leader in the New testement. When you find that one let me know.

[@kletusbobby7029]

Sadly, the thing you warn us about is already very common in the Pentecostal church.

[@SarahNdosi]

where can I get a series of this teaching

[@tonyasmith7388]

truly he need under standing. worship is not for sinners psalm 150 says Let everything that has breath praise the LORD. however JESUS said in John 4:4 they that worship me must worship in spirit and in truth. Jesus is the truth.the unsaved don't know truth. read many strategic leading of how God lead the people many times He sent the singers and musicians before them in battle. this is a spiritual war fare, stop debating unnecessary issues and get understanding be bless

[@HandmaidenOfDistinction66854]

You said it all!!!

[@Sunshine-hx6hq]

That was Old Testament .. New Testament Jesus went in Himself to the Most Holy Place.. we dont need folk to lead us into worship and worship anyway is not about singing . Worshiping God is all about obedience to Him but to sing and dance can be the expression of us worshiping Him..

[@kingdomsongwriting7825]

I immediately clicked on this video. 👍

[@dedehodo8890]

Worship leaders minister to God, and in turn invoke his presence so that he can manifest himself to the heart of man.

[@lovereignschannel9117]

Amen... He simply saying that you cannot come to the presence of God if you don't know what God has done. Because Coming to the presence of God is Believing in Christ did on the Cross... Verse Hebrew 10:22 and Hebrew 4:16.... It is not the praise and worship that lead the people to the presence of God.... It is the Preacher who preach the Gospel about what God has done for us. That we may worship God in Spirit and in Truth John 4:22-23...

[@BrianHartlenBrianMetatron93]

Oh brother bro bro bro...I am a worship leader and this is hard for me....lol I guess I have to put aside my ideas and listen.

[@deegassaway6854]

"Depending of JESUS" ❤

[@crushdrummer3577]

worship leaders are still suppose to help the congregation to understand what it is to praise and worship! They are suppose to get the congregation involved in singing praise and worship to Jesus for what He did for us!!! I get what he is saying though and there is nothing wrong with what he said but I believe a worship leader is called a worship leader with a purpose and that is to lead Gods people into singing, clapping, lifting up of hands and so forth otherwise the congregation will not sing, clap, worship and so forth because I see it all the time! Babies in Christ must be trained and taught!

[@lkngfr90]

Amen!! Just don't take the credit is what he means if God uses us in any ministry!!!

[@crushdrummer3577]

@@lkngfr90 amen! Jesus is worthy of it all!

[@zapl7076]

Whould you mind to share your book for me?

[@skuxxfam]

Agreed. I think people have been using the word ‘lead’ to label their thoughts. I think the correct word is ‘show’ people to the cross which isn’t essentially leading them INTO it per se. It’s undeniable that worship leaders do have a Holy Spirited anointing to unshackle and loosen people from spiritual bonding, just as the preacher has Holy Spirited anointing to deliver the Word of God in undiscovered or neglected areas in our hearts. God uses worship leaders to unshackle and set free, but it is also the Holy Spirit who will draw the sinner or backsliding Christian to the cross.

[@normanclature9819]

If worship leaders don't lead people to the presence of God then neither do pastors, evangelist, teachers, apostles or Prophets.

[@JesusforCologne]

sounds good but that's hair splitting. Of course it is Jesus who is the bridge to God. who denies that? And if an unholy person cannot lead another unholy person to a holy person then whats about the pastors. they are also unholy but through them we hear God's word. For me as a worship leader it is God himself through the holy spirit who uses the worship team to lead the congregation into gods presence!

[@madampopabwoli4620]

True. There is a place for everything. That is why God appointed priests and musicians to praise Him in the beauty of His holiness...so Jesus can inhabit that beautiful praise in our midst.

[@viagothica]

Of course Jesus has made the way; I don't think you'd find any responsible worship leader who would deny that, or equate musical offerings with the sacrificial offering of Jesus Christ. Yet, even from the verses he quotes, it is clear that it is up to us to respond by choosing to draw near and enter in - cf. Heb 10:22. Furthermore, in Psalm 100, we learn that God has ordained joyful music and thankful songs as a vehicle by which His people are to enter into his presence. Combine the witness from the Old and New Testaments, and I find it difficult to affirm Logan's thesis.

[@madampopabwoli4620]

I hear you. We are quite missing the point... :(

[@simonharris3709]

Interesting. I was part of a fellowship in the '80s and '90s and it was our habit to wait on God until He moved us. He would always come corporately and always in power; contrast modern worship habits of starting strong and gradually 'leading' people into His Presence. Many people simply end up singing songs without any engagement. But our habit of hosting His Presence both publicly and privately during the week, meant that even if we were in the busiest and most cacophonous worldly environment, any of us could easily find and engage with Him; it was never contingent on worship - though worship would always come out of the encounter. The usual modern method is like religion; it's from the outside in. But true worship is always from the inside out; from the encounter, not for it. Great post Zach - thank you.

[@EnHymn]

Zachary Cooper PREACH!

[@viagothica]

Simon Harris thank you for sharing! I lead and serve on teams in a variety of worship contexts. From a modern evangelical structure on Sunday playing to a click track to prayer room sets where singing scripture & prophetic spontaneous choruses are encouraged. What I have learned is people, by and large, need (and even want) to be led. Many times it takes strong leadership from someone who has their own "secret place" life to encourage others to enter into a place with God (in the presence, under the anointing, whatever the case) where they wouldn't otherwise go.

[@YeslieSolis]

I think this offers an interesting way of basically saying that worship is essentially not about us, yet it’s about God.

[@drns2007]

It's a misleading title. We don't change people's heart - true. We don't act as mediators(using our songs to draw God to the people=wrong). But we do lead them by being a worshipper and a good example, by directing them away from worldly worries and to the God.. When we help them praise God(words, scripture, songs, etc).. we're changing the atmosphere for God's presence to work in them(Because God inhabits the praises of His people) Leading=helping. As worship leaders we just makeourselves available for the Holy Spirit to help His people worship in spirit and in truth.

[@nicolepillay679]

i see your point but bare in mind worship LEADERS are exactly what the title says (LEADERS) Their duty is to lead by the direction of the holy spirit the people of god to god. god will not force himself on anyone READ revelation 3:20 . People are assigned to be WORSHIP LEADERS this is through the gifts of speaking motivating and singing . not just anyone has these gifts. ill give you a simple example : god didnt need moses to lead the isrealites out of bondage after all moses could not speak well god could have set them free himself but thats was not to be god needed moses and moses did a good job as we all know

[@wemuk5170]

Nicole Pillay There is no such thing as a Worship Leader in the Bible. In Chronicles 15:22 Kenaniah, the Levite, is referred to in various bible translations as the choir director, the music director or the one in charge of, or the one who instructs in the, music/song as he was gifted/skilful in it. Elsewhere in Hebrews 2:12, Jesus is quoted as the one calling us his brothers and singing with us in praise of God in the assembly. In other words, according to the Bible, it is Jesus who is our SOLE worship leader. All the singers cum musicians king David commissioned were SONG/MUSIC Leaders/Instructors/Directors. Not Worship Leaders/Directors. This is not nitpicking or hair splitting. This is what the Bible says. We need to call things as what they truly are & humbly rely and submit to God’s own Word.

[@arindun9274]

What bible's passage was it?

[@marieamore8299]

who knows where you can get the whole message?

[@BrendaDanso]

I respectfully disagree, as a worship leader we are lead by THE SPIRT it’s never about us and how we put our lists together, just like a pastor prepares for his sermons so do we. We are not the bridge to God we are vessels being used by God to communicate with His people. It’s not by our power, so if any leader thinks it’s his/her own doing that’s shifting the atmosphere with his music or anything of that sort he/she is prideful and doesn’t need to be doing the work.

[@lkngfr90]

Please emphasize more,,,I don't get you

[@Hannahdebonham]

We can’t just take scriptures and applied to what we think ...

[@jerryyyyyy]

Think you made a point here. But I think what people mean when they say worship leaders “lead them into the presence of God“ is not that the worship leader would free them of their sins in order to reconnect themselves with God, but that the worship leaders helped them using the connection to God created by God's mercy. In that case being led into the presence of God means focusing on God and letting everything else and distracting go and being reminded of who you are standing before. I think very few people actually are victims of the misconception you relate to. Most people just use that common phrase to describe a very intense worship experience, and I don't think no worship leader is arrogant enough to think he would be capable of creating a missing connection between God and humans.

[@Philippians2verse3-4]

I get what he's trying to say, but I disagree. When someone has the gift of singing/worship, they most certainly do usher you into the presence of God. I as many have felt downtrodden, not knowing how to pray, or disconnected to God. We played a worship song, went to church where worship was being sung, or joined a group of people listening to worship, & it has countless times ushered us into His presence. There's a difference between a talent & a gift... God bless.

[@tomyoung4913]

Almost without exception these so-called worship leaders think it is somehow their turn to seize control of a service until they are through performing (displaying their gift.) Hard to stomach; I will sometimes just get up and leave, especially when when they go on…and on…and on…and on…

[@samdrums1822]

I kindly disagree, what I have experience in the past through a worship leader it's an explicable I firmly believe that God uses people that he choose to prepare the atmosphere for his spirit/anointing . Ultimately leading them to his presence in a way. So yeah.

[@tonys4986]

I agree with you that we are in control of setting the stage and providing the right conditions for worshiping God as a body, but that's where our role ends. We do not ultimately or otherwise bring anyone into the presence of God...We cannot take credit for what only the Holy Spirit can do. But, it doesn't matter...why would we want the credit?

[@user-yn4mr2ip1t]

I have many questions about leading in Worship. Our pastor said that we need to bring people in the throne of God. It is true that P & W leaders job is to bring people in the Thrones of God? I’m so confusing.

[@user-yn4mr2ip1t]

Jeremy Gonzalez Thank you to encouraged me about leading. It’s been many years I’m confusing about leading. P & W . Sometimes it’s really hard to received the Presence of God throughs Praised and Worship service.

[@JesusisKing913]

what he preaches is truth; goes to say, if you cant worship God without your "go-to" specific way of music, then it is not worship at all. Can you worship God even with out music?

[@lkngfr90]

Yes!!!“Therefore, I urge you, brothers and sisters, in view of God's mercy, to offer your bodies as living sacrifices, holy and pleasing to God - this is your true and proper worship” (12:1).

[@JesusisKing913]

@@lkngfr90 wow, thanks for replying. I gotta say, its been 2 years now, and exactly what you quoted, God has shown me through countless lessons and experience. But I have never came across this verse except for John 4:23-24 (something similar). Thanks again

[@lesliecarpede-keysvocals_s6299]

Because of the mixed views of this teaching,I’ve even heard other noted music ministers use the term “Lead Worshiper “ instead.Why not stick to biblical references of whom we refer to as worship leaders OR lead worshipers and use music director or levite or chief musician? Just a suggestive question and open for your critic.If worship leaders are not leading God’s people,let’s change the title then

[@wemuk5170]

LFC.South Africa Totally agree! Let’s change the title to follow God’s Word! Why? Because... There is no such thing as a Worship Leader in the Bible. In Chronicles 15:22 Kenaniah, the Levite, is referred to in various bible translations as the choir director, the music director or the one in charge of, or the one who instructs in the, music/song as he was gifted/skilful in it. Elsewhere in Hebrews 2:12, Jesus is quoted as the one calling us his brothers and singing with us in praise of God in the assembly. In other words, according to the Bible, it is Jesus who is our worship leader. All the singers cum musicians king David commissioned were SONG/MUSIC Leaders/Instructors/Directors. Not Worship Leaders/Directors. This is not nitpicking or hair splitting. This is what the Bible says. We need to call things as what they truly are & humbly rely and submit to God’s own Word.

[@dus22345]

My brother, I have to respectfully disagree with you. Seems like this verse/passage is cherry picking a bit… And I don’t mean that in a hateful way I am telling you this in a very loving spirit. Now, no, we as human beings cannot lead people to the heart of worship on our own. It’s impossible. But there is something that we can do, and let me just put it this way, so as the seed it’s self cannot be planted without help from another source, neither can the worship leader or praise team lead someone into the heart of worship. Now, what we can do, is allow God to use us as a tool. God doesn’t call somebody to be a worship leader to just stand up there. Sometimes the intonation of someone’s voice, or the sound of the electric guitar, or the drums etc. can attract people to want to hear it. God uses things like that to open hearts. As our hearts are opened the Holy Spirit can move And use whoever God wants to use to minister to people.

[@Elohimists]

Please don't remove yourself from the equation. You lead the people in worship and God inhabits the praises of His people. It absolutely matters what songs you choose and write. Worship does not have to be slow but you are correct in saying that it is not a guarantee. In between songs there should be a moment of praising God in their own words. I have to go to work or I would look up the scriptures I referenced. May God bless you in the name of Jesus our Lord and Christ Amen.

[@verzosa]

I commend the clarification that we can't be the mediator between God and man, Jesus is! but I don't think there's anything faulty with the perspective of leading people to the presence of God. The truth is that God has sent out an invitation for "whoever" to come; Jesus has, through His sacrifice, torn the veil of separation and imputed upon those who receive by faith, righteousness, which makes this communion possible; The Holy Spirit echoes the invitation of the Father as well as brings revelation to the truth of what Jesus has done on the cross. You may call it leadership, which is really serving, but worship leaders are gifted for this service; to usher people into those truths, and yes! hopefully they will be stirred to respond to the faithful beckoning of the Holy Spirit & draw near to God.

[@mjpraiseworship1613]

Brother , correction - worship leaders leading people to God’s presence doesn’t mean they alone can lead people to God , it simply means they are the people who can orchestrate people in lifting up their voices in worship.. it’s nowhere said in the Bible that worship leaders leading to God’s presence .. don’t know why you are addressing, I guess u hv a problem with some worship leaders hence u are talking this from pulpit preaching on something which Bible doesn’t say. There are so many important things to preach plz do those . All these simple things you can teach at the bible studies or cell groups . Hope this helps.

[@torrefuerte008]

Supported by the Scripture of Hebrews, where it says that we have access to the holy place by the blood of Jesus, that implies that entrance, as salvation, is personal and only through Jesus. The Bible mentions that there is only one mediator between God and men, Jesus Christ man. In addition, FAITH comes by hearing ... and people will approach God by listening to the Word of God and not by listening to the words of the LEADER. The Catholic Church uses the concept of intermediaries to at least approach the priest, great error. Let's try not to fall into the pride and vanity that as leaders we are the ones who bring the people before God. If we knew in what condition people come to church our attitude would be different.

[@arnoldtweets4638]

If that is so then lets remove the word leader in it. Dont be so technical..leaders leads us in the presence of God thru the Holy Spirit.

[@iboro-kun84]

03:56 - That's all.

[@sirtreebeard8106]

No worship leader is the reason people enter into God's presence but a worship leader is a lead worshiper in that they encourage people to enter into God's presence. Im a Christian and these types of arguments drive me nuts because they feel like semantics. All in how you interpret something.

[@Tededison]

Great thought. You said we can’t connect a sinful person to a sinless God? Worship is not for unbelievers (sinners) only a believer can worship though believers may sin our nature is no longer sinful because of the blood. Worship leaders has the priestly duties of unification and exhortation which causes Gods presence to be enthroned. A worship leaders job isn’t to connect a sinful person to a sinless God. Just my opinion

[@mikeanderson1316]

Hmm! were 2 or more are gathered together in my name . There i am in the midst of them.Jesus.He who supplys the Spirit to you and works Miricles among you how does He do it? through the hearing of Faith! Gal 3:5 Faith comes by Hearing and Hearing By the Word of God! rom10:17 if therefore the whole Church come together and if all Prophesy (the testamony of Jesus is the Spirit of Prophesy rev19:10) and a there come in one that believe not that is a unlearned one, he is convinced of all, he is judged of all: and the secrets of his heart are made manifest ; and so falling down on his face he will worship God , and report that God is in you of a truth . How is it then Brothern? when you come together , every one of you has a Psalm , has a Teaching, has a Tongue, Has a Revelation, has a interpretation, Let all things Be Done Unto EDIFYING..1cor14:24-26 To the Glory Of God so be it!

[@beloved3244]

Hi brother in Christ I’m Darryl. Just wanted to also share some thoughts. I believe your heart is in the right place but you have the wrong understanding. What does a leader do? They lead likewise GOD will use people to lead his people into a place whether it be spiritual or natural. The scripture you read is referring to your personal relationship with Christ aka your walk with GOD but as it pertains to corporate oneness assembling ourselves together in unity, GOD always uses leaders. Whether you call them minstrels, musician’s, singers or even Pastors. GOD will anoint humble person(s) to be some what of a blue print to access things they already had a right to but Need LEADING. Hence, worship leader. 30 years ago they were even called that but the anointing of The HolySpirit was still doing it then and now. Here’s another interesting fact brother, all talented singers and musicians AREN’T called to be worship leaders or leading people in worship. You could very well be a college professor or high school teacher and it is very likely your not called to teach The WORD of GOD ... The callings and gifts of GOD are yea and amen, many are called and few chosen. So the issue isn’t worship leaders, the issue is true worship has been hi-jacked by non-anointed emotional over confident talented folks instead broken spirited humble called anointed vessels

[@robertgabuna355]

Illuminating lecture...

[@Notradaya]

As a worship team member for many years, and never as a leader, this is an incredible perspective. There are many talented singers and musicians I've had the honour of worshipping with, and while it's clear their gifts are from God, they've never been "chosen" to be worship leaders, nor have I. Unfortunately I've seen offence and hurt take over in people's hearts when they've been "passed over" if a newer member of the team becomes a worship leader and they've not been asked to do so. Longevity, seniority and even pure talent are not the things that make one a worship leader, I thank you for this perspective as it humbles my own heart which has sometimes wondered if I was missing something to be able to lead. I believe for now, I am, and I'm not actually upset about that revelation at all. It's a calling and an honour, and not one that will be bestowed on every talented musician in a team.

[@HandmaidenOfDistinction66854]

John 4:24...

[@HandmaidenOfDistinction66854]

Man always tries to lift himself up over God and self (selah). Always trying to be something or someone of importance (instead of seeking to know who we are in Christ). Self aggrandizing. Nobody needs a WL to bring them into the presence of God. How high minded. Many of them have not been nor do they know what the presence of God is. All of this is public display. Check your heart motives, examine yourself.

[@mrstrypes]

Man, I hope this doesn't come across wrong. We're brothers, after all, and I don't want to hurt my brother. But it seems like this message is simply an argument over semantics. After all, I'm sure that you're not really telling leaders "get out of the way, there is no point in preparing, practicing, or pretending like you have anything to do with the corporate worship experience." So, if you're not saying that, then this seems like a very trivial point to be harping on. As a worship leader for 25 years and now a pastor, this message didn't inspire me. You have people's rapt attention while you are teaching. Wouldn't your time be more effectively spent inspiring people to do great things to advance the Kingdom? Blessings and love, family in Christ. Note: If this message is simply an attempt to keep music directors humble, I can appreciate the intent.

[@ericjonpo]

I share your point brother on semantics, Steve. But I did get that the intent is solely to keep us worship leaders and ushers humbling ourselves before the Jesus, and staying humble before God speaks highly of the Spirit's presence in us. A lot of worship leaders these days exalt themselves highly as if they are the ones to thank for the worship, but in fact, all is by the blood of Jesus indeed. Peace and love, brethren.

[@jeremiahmalsack4718]

Both valid points, as a worship leader, ive dealt with criticism by others who were so focused on what what worship team looked like on stage (can't do much with a stage that wobbles), or if our eyes were opened or closed. They were so worried about if we were in fact worshipoing that they themselves forgot to worship. This message is also an exhortation to church members that worship is a daily act between you and God, and our time together as a singing congregation has other functions (teaching and admonishimg one another through word and song), any personal or intimate connection between an individual and the Lord is up to them, as they have already been given direct access to his presence through Jesus.

[@robertgabuna355]

Steve, if you are going to deliver the lecture on the subject, how and what are you going to say?

[@mrstrypes]

@@robertgabuna355 I don't really recall this message; probably because I watched it 2 years ago and it didn't move me. Just from reading what I wrote two years ago, it seems that my point was that arguing over trivial matters (such as how we phrase things) is not the best usage of our time. There is a whole world crying out for answers. Meanwhile, Christians know the Answer. He is the Truth! He is Jesus! Let's share Him instead of picking on each other over debatable matters (Romans 14:1).

[@tochilazarus7415]

I don't think he's right, there's songs that carry the presence of God that don't mention the blood of Jesus "You are God Alone" by Phillips Craig and Dean.

[@mannylundy6294]

Comment section looking like a scholarly article

[@risiateb]

What was even the point of this message? Every worship leader needs to be led by the Spirit and it is the Holy Spirit that stirs up another individuals spirit. No one else can do that but God. It is however the responsibility of the worship leader or team to at least remain annointed and set the tone or climate in the room for worship.

[@chesz11]

Here are what you are missing: First, are you even a pastor? You are held accountable to whatever you will say on the pulpit. Second, you are JUST promoting a book. Third, it is undeniable that Jesus is the ONLY bridge towards God, whoever claims that it is through worship leaders are false teacher. Fourth, personal worship is different from congregational worship. What you are saying is about personal worship but you are generalizing it as a whole. Even worship leaders have their personal worship to God. So, you are twisting the entire Bible. What are the role of the high priests, ushers, levites, prophets or in modern day terms, pastors, ministry leaders, deacons, worship leaders etc. then? What is the purpose of each ministry? Fifth, real worship leaders never credits themselves. Instead they will always lead you to the cross. A sermon should be based in the bible not from someone's book. Is the author a god? Even in sermons and exhortations, it should and must be God's revelation not your own interpretation. You need to check your heart and ask God's wisdom. Or you will be just like a wolf in sheep's clothing. And you will devour God's people. God bless you

[@markpoole6192]

Chesz Capua thank you, thank you, thank you!

[@wemuk5170]

There is no such thing as a Worship Leader in the Bible. In Chronicles 15:22 Kenaniah, the Levite, is referred to in various bible translations as the choir director, the music director or the one in charge of, or the one who instructs in the, music/song as he was gifted/skilful in it. Elsewhere in Hebrews 2:12, Jesus is quoted as the one calling us his brothers and singing with us in praise of God in the assembly. In other words, according to the Bible, it is Jesus who is our worship leader. All the singers cum musicians king David commissioned were SONG/MUSIC Leaders/Instructors/Directors. Not Worship Leaders/Directors. This is not nitpicking or hair splitting. This is what the Bible says. We need to call things as what they truly are & humbly rely and submit to God’s own Word.

[@chesz11]

@@wemuk5170 I am fully aware that there is no "Worship Leader" in the Bible. It has been a terminology in most Christian churches .

[@wemuk5170]

Chesz Capua You are right but why do we need to cling on so tightly to a term that makes no biblical sense? I don’t get it? I genuinely don’t get why we need a mistaken term - if we happen to know that it is (most likely) a mistake? It’s a bit like the common term that used to confuse me when I was young: you must be “baptised in the spirit” to speak in tongues before you can be sure you are saved for heaven? Well, neither Jesus nor the thief crucified on the cross with Him were baptised in the spirit, then. Therefore, we do not use that common term any more, not even in my local charismatic church because we do not need to cling ON to common terms that make no sense. Why, not? Well, just in case, just in case, we might mislead some people into thinking or believing the wrong thing? In this case, that, it is worship leader/team (musicians like my adult children) who actually LEAD [us, God’s people] into our Lord’s ‘manifest’ presence. No, it is Jesus who sings with us, his brothers, according to Hebrews 2:12, when we praise our Lord God in assembly. The wonderfully inspiring & very talented MUSIC Director and his/her equally gifted team are all humble instruments of beauty in God’s hands to facilitate our unity in singing & praise to our God. This is glorious servanthood. Like washing the disciples’ feet. All glory be, to God, our King! 😊

[@gundercubing7021]

In some point I do agree to what the preacher had emphasized. Worship leaders does not lead us to the presence of God but they help us more "aware" of God's presence and the Glory of God. Worship leading is a gift so as pastors teachers evangelist etc etc... They help us know more about God in the area they are designated to.

[@josiah8351]

no where in the bible does it say to recieve jesus in your heart doesnt mean its wrong

[@bluesky1960]

So confusing

[@simonsays3577]

The Oxford dictionary defines ‘lead’ as ‘causing a person or animal to go with one by holding them by the hand while moving forward’. A worship leader’s responsibility is to have a personal relationship with the person of the Holy Spirit whereby the obedience and deliberate pressing into God of the worship leader results in God pouring His fire (as in Psalm 5:3. As such whilst the worship leader is not responsible for creating the presence of God, they lead people into worship by holding them by the hand, moving forward into worship and showing them the way that God pours His fire and annoints those who worship in spirit and in truth and who diligently seek Him. I do not completely agree with this video.

[@chrisw1462]

Umm.. What??? Quote from 2:30: "We are hopelessly incapable of connecting sinners to a sinless God." That seems to be contraindicated by the verse you are referring to: Heb 10:24 - And let us consider how we may spur one another on toward love and good deeds. Ok, yes, we all have to make that final connection for ourselves, but people still need to be led, taught, to witness His Love in action, and to be strengthened and reinforced in their faith on occasion (a couple times a day for me!). I think you're being a bit too literal and Absolute in your thinking. If you want to keep in that vein, we cannot ever lead people into God's Presence because we are Always in His Presence. We cannot "give Him glory", because it is already His. We cannot pray in the name of Jesus, because his name is Yeshua (best I can do in English). That kind of strict adherence to the literal leads to the Law, and I'd rather not go back to the days of the Pharisees. Yes, we all have to make the decision to follow Him for that final connection to be made. But the rest of the journey to get there? Yeah.. that's where we can, and Are Called to, help.

[@acrock21]

do the work for none of the credit, because that belongs to God! if you want to lead worship or play in a worship band, you must first realize you are going to be a vessel for God to use. not that he needs our help but he does in fact use it.

[@rickylimbu3668]

Worship leaders can lead people into the manifest presence of God. That is my part as a worship leader. I beliver worship leaders should teach and take people how to dwell in the manifest presence of God

[@lotuspink7300]

What kind of title is this video has? Not good