WTF - TFW

This video is a little bitching and moaning about TFW. Skall did a review on a TFW Panabas and noted something of a flaw. A day or two later TFW noted that they found a flaw in the Panabas and discounted the blade. My criticism comes from TFW not explaining the issue to customers. A little nubby tang could hurt someone.
Published on Jan 17, 2018 - Link to Skall Review - • TFW Panabas - Excellen...
Published on Jan 19, 2018 - Link to Post - / 10156070953893599
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[@Skallagrim]

Hm, it's odd that they don't mention the flaw in the product description. It's "kind of" important to make clear why it's on sale. It's good that they're working on an improved version, but I agree that the issue should be mentioned not only in a separate post but also right on the sales page.

[@Matthew_Jensen]

I think that is especially important given how TFW markets their pieces. The owner has at least one video where he wacks a log with one of his pieces until he cuts it in half. If someone were to do that with the one you have, it could result in a lot of danger. I was a little too drunk while recording to mention that point. It is not as though they are advertised as pool noodle cutters.

[@bushimotter]

Really bad business practices from these guys in this case...

[@MasterofOssus]

If the defect were only cosmetic, then industry policy is to mark-down without specifically identifying the fault (e.g., Ronin Katana's Scratch and Dent sale; Kult of Athena's S&D page) - but this can only be ethical when the blade is fully functional and only the aesthetics are harmed. When functionality is at all compromised, then KoA (for their "Damaged and Blow Out" section), Sword n Armory and their associated Munetoshi line, Devil's Edge, etc. do this right when they specifically call out the problems with specific blades that they're selling that led them to be in that section (twisted; bad heat-treat; improper grind; etc.). Hanwei (with the issue they had on their Sword of Maurice) immediately identified the defect and replaced the blades to everyone concerned. Good on those other vendors and virtually everyone else in the market; bad on TFW. This is important because all those other companies show that there is a market for "nearly functional" weapons like this one: there are people out there who will buy a weapon like this one even knowing that it shouldn't (or even can't) ever be used. The only thing I'll say in their (very partial) defense is that I'm glad that they're addressing the problem: really hoping they can come out with a safe, fully-functional version in the near future that can put the issues with the product itself behind them. In the meantime, I think BCI produces a similar panabas that I haven't seen a full review on but most likely is more featured.

[@Chaosism]

This [potentially] speaks a lot of TFW's ethics, but I'd love to hear their response to this. Not much room for them to dance around a direct and pointed response such as yours, here. I don't like to draw conclusions when I've only heard one side of things, but this is enough to make me avoid them, since there are other options (namely something like Blade Culture International).

[@erichusayn]

you have a point. I agree. Not only shady, quite dangerous too...

[@project86xero]

I'm not a fan of TFW. I don't like the temper they use on their swords. Their fit and finish is good but that's all. I also talked with there U.S. distributer one time and he danced around my questions a lot. So I sold or returned all their blades I owned at the time and will never buy another. Had a similar issue with Darksword Armory too. However they had good customer service. Even so I won't buy t heir stuff anymore either. But I won't sell what I have though.

[@raymondduncan4635]

Hopefully no one will get injured, pretty shitty to do business that way!

[@temperedsteel142]

I'll definitely agree with you. There's plenty of bad swords for sale on the internet that are marked battle-ready and shouldn't be. From manufacturer trying to hide it looks like shady business practice

[@mattmanbrownbro]

No. You are not alone in feeling like TFW should disclose that there is a major flaw in the core construction of a deadly tool, and that it's a shitty move to not disclose it. You are not alone at all.

[@jesseboyd8660]

This is right up there with Darkswords tang issues. This is dangerous and irresponsible on TFW's part. As a HEMA practitioner, I rely on the manufacturers to make a safe implement for training. I don't want to be at a full speed flourish practice and as you said, have the damn thing fly apart and skewer someone. I do zero training in any kind of Asian martial arts, but even if I did, I'd not be throwing money at TFW. Vids spot on Matt, keep it up.

[@thisguy253]

Most of Skallagrim’s cutting footage show the sword being gripped behind the tang... Scary.

[@CountOrlok22]

When the "flaw" is a potential safety issue due to a short tang and the possibility of the grip breaking during use, it seems not only irresponsible to not let customers know why the sword is being discounted, it also seems legally inadvisable in terms of liability. To not let customers know is essentially endangering them. That is unacceptable.

[@highlander200268]

by discounting a flawed product, I think they are leaving themselves open to a legal issue, it is a known issue and they are trying to profit off it, kinda disgraceful imo

[@CountOrlok22]

This seems like a mad rush for profit before word gets out when it should be a recall and a detailed explanation to protect their customers.

[@highlander200268]

yes and it is a legal issue i am sure when people start to hurt themselves, this is despicable behavior on their part, good way to loose business

[@dubstepbronx]

Stuff like this worries me. The fact that someone can get hurt then makes the prices cheap... Really glad you brought this up for all us sword collectors. Thanks Matt.

[@AdoreYouInAshXI]

They know they have a bad product, they know Skall has a lot of viewers, they know that this bad product isn't going to be "saleable" for much longer so they are trying to cash out as quickly as possible with the current stock they have. One sure fire way to slow that down would be listing that the defect is not only there, but that's it's a potentially dangerous and possibly even fatal flaw. I may be being a little dramatic by saying that but I find it insulting and absurd that they don't even list the reason as to why it's on sale. The only reason they listed the sale on Facebook with a vague reason is to get word out that the product is in fact on sale, I assume. Good video, glad you brought this to light. Especially with the way these are marketed by TFW as being for chopping and heavy cutting.

[@xiezicong]

I've seen Skallagrim on SBG. Has he ever commented here? I've been looking for local smiths in the Philippines for a custom panabas with the purpose of having the edge on the "historically correct" side as opposed to the more marketable side you see on TFW and one other Filipino sword producer. When I heard Skallagrim's video on this, I feel like I needed to lament about the lack of custom smiths who could make me something better and more historically accurate at a reasonable price.

[@OGDamnnation]

From the price it looks like you’re paying for just the blade now. Like skallagrim said it would be a great project blade

[@Garlicjoe1]

your point, "seems to be a dangerous thing to do", is exactly what this is. Thanks for the heads up.

[@MattsGreatHall]

I saw that video too, and it seems incredibly dangerous. It’s like swinging a dowel rod with a sword attached at the pommel with duct tape or something. If you remove the handle, I’m sure you could make the blade functional with a little grinding to make the tang longer. But I doubt buyers will do this. I’m glad you’re getting the word out too.

[@jaimeflor4181]

I know this is 6 years old. I like the TFW swords I have, but I think you have a point. If anything though, I wouldn’t have minded having a flawed Panabas as a decorative piece.

[@thisguy253]

You are not being a bitch, this is a problem.

[@wbc1256]

Very cheap wow i really want one

[@Matthew_Jensen]

If you are buying one knowing what you are getting, then I say gratz on a new blade. I hope it serves you well.

[@jordanwilliams6972]

I can't remember the name of the law but it goes something like this - never attribute to malice what can be attributed to incompetence - and I think that it really should be applied here. It's a huge discount for a just as sizable flaw, and they probably assumed that most of the people checking out the sword on their site would have already seen Skallagrims video, on KZbin or other sites. Should they have stated the flaw in their post and on their sale page? Yes. But I don't think they're trying to trick anyone. Maybe I'm wrong though and they are evil salesmen.

[@Matthew_Jensen]

That is a fair point and one possibility that would explain the situation without ill intent entering the conversation. It does seem a bit weird though that even in the facebook post, they did not note what the issue was. They simply said we found an issue with one so we are discounting them all. I am not sure what to make of it and I suppose that is why I asked for community feedback. Thank you for sharing your perspective!

[@KF1]

"never attribute to malice what can be attributed to incompetence". Shit, that's a maxim worth back-pocket space. Oh yeah, and sucks about the tang and dodgy sale. Sorry to but in. Good show.