B-17 Bomber Ball Turret Station, Detailed External Walk Around

Enclosed is a detailed part 2 Video, external walk around and factoids of the Sperry Ball Turret adopted by the B-17 bombers in WWII. Discussion topics include location of turret construction, mechanics, gunner Training, ammo, and crew relief considerations.
Library of B-17 Gunstations and Gunsights:
B-17 Tail Gunner Survivability (part 1): • B-17 Bomber Crew Tail ...
B-17 Tail Gunner Combat Effectiveness (part 2): • B-17 Crew Tour of Duty...
B-17 Ball Turret (part 1) Crew Survivability: • B-17 Bomber Ball Turre...
B-17 Ball Turret (part 2) External Features: • B-17 Bomber Ball Turre...
B-17 Ball Turret (Part 3) Combat Effectiveness: • B-17 Ball Turret, Comb...
B-17 vs. B-29 Gunsights: • WWII B-17 vs. B-29 Bom...
B-17 Gunsights for Ranging: • B-17 Bomber, Using Rin...
B-17 Gunsights for Tracking: • B-17 Bomber Tracking a...
B-17 Browning .50 Cal Machine Guns: • B-17 Bomber's Browning...

[@Semyon_Semyonych]

My Granddad was one of those Soviet officers who built and set up the US Air Force base in Poltava, USSR (now, Ukraine) in 1944. I grew up with his stories about B-17s and American pilots, navigators, gunners, radio operators, mechanics -- you name it! I moved to this wonderful country some 25 years ago. And guess what? One of my kids is, in fact, a US Air Force pilot! I wonder if any of this would have ever happened without my Granddad and his stories...

[@davidweston6653]

Proud dad. Tks for your families service

[@Semyon_Semyonych]

@@davidweston6653 Thank you!

[@BrownEyePinch]

Glad to know not every Soviet is bad

[@TRUMP_WAS_RIGHT_ABOUT_EVRYTHNG]

amazing story! love reading these types of comments. awesome news about your child too! a grateful immigrant and a family that serves their country two thumbs up !! As a child of immigrants from Greece i am extremely thankful that my family took the chance and floated on over to America in the 40s escaping the hell that was Europe. immigrants were a lot different than what we have coming into the usa now.

[@hugodesrosiers-plaisance3156]

I love the clever, simple and elegant way of preventing the gunner from doing a Henri Jones to his mates.

[@songojune]

Great series, love the historical details like the training setup at 3:31 and the crew relief procedures

[@garfieldsmith332]

Never knew about the "piss tube" leading of the aircraft. I figured they "passed the can" around and dumped it every so often. The British had the Elcan for 'larger' jobs.😁

[@BrownEyePinch]

I love piss tubes

[@StefanPaul5]

With all the engineering that went into the B-17 and the Ball Turret, the relief tube discharge had a tendency to spray all over the ball turret. You would've thought they would've quickly fixed that little detail. Being a ball turret gunner was a dirty job.

[@elebeu]

These are the videos I have been looking for. Finally, some in depth, coherent information on these units. Thank you very much for your efforts.

[@salvagedb2470]

Great pic of the multiple Training rig for the Ball turret ..good vid

[@oliverscratch]

Several years ago I met a former WW2 ball turret gunner who was acting as a docent at the Palm Springs Air Museum in California. He had some wonderful stories to tell. What I remember most is hearing him say that when inside the ball turret he felt safer than he did when in the fuselage.

[@TRUMP_WAS_RIGHT_ABOUT_EVRYTHNG]

id be scared to death but i get it, those friggin planes were what ...1/8' , 3/16" thick aluminum lol i could fart and dent a panel on those tin cans.

[@stratotramp6243]

The relief system is funny. Regarding icing. something you would never consider. but obvious on those long flights.

[@Knuck_Knucks]

I can't even image how the ball turret gunner relieved himself while in the turret! 🐿

[@johnned4848]

Great videos clear and concise. I’m glad you answered the question of how the crew relieved themselves in flight. Although a catwalk in the Bombay probablymade a few hold it in until they returned to base. Have to British had the right idea with the elcan sitting toilet

[@paigetomkinson1137]

Some of those guys could be in the air for 12 hours at a time. That would be an awfully long time to hold it, whichever it it was.

[@ronaldtartaglia4459]

Very detailed Thank you

[@rbhkg3]

According to my grandfather who was a ball turrent gunner on a B24J the machine guns were 30cal. It sounds like the b17 had 50 cal guns for its ball turrent. That's considerably more firepower for the b17.

[@BlahVideosBlahBlah]

Huh. By mid-war almost all fighters and interceptors had significant protection against rifle-caliber guns. You could still hit a radiator or any number of soft parts that would mission kill the plane, but that wouldn't necessarily stop the pilot from landing a killing blow on the bomber before falling out of the fight. .50s were definitely more potent, and had better range, too. Ideally you'd have 20mm hispanos, but that's a LOT of gun to cram into a turret.

[@markbecht1420]

I'm afraid your grandfather mis-remembered. The turret on the B-24 has .50 cal guns. In fact the turrets themselves are nearly identical, but differ in the mounting. The B-24 has a hydraulic ram to raise the ball into the aircraft for takeoff and landing, and the B-17's is fixed.

[@bacharles1]

Outstanding video, as always

[@jasonsabourin2275]

Well Done!.... Very Thorough. 👍

[@dahlbergt]

So much information! Thank you!

[@damegaKing]

like the first part this is a nice video straight to the point and no BS. ty

[@animationcycles7109]

Didn't know about relief ports installed by ball turret gunners. Must have been a hell of an awkward crouch to piss out of that thing.

[@mandolinic]

Since it was jury-rigged and unofficial, I'd expect some would have a flexible tube, with one end connected to the outlet and the other to ...

[@Thomasnmi]

@@mandolinic one flexible tube attached to another flexible tube? :)

[@flyingfortressrc1794]

Great information.

[@Kangaroojack1986]

very interesting and informative, All these videos

[@joepapp01]

Really great channel.

[@ronaldtartaglia4459]

Somewhere on this planet there must be a official tutorial on operating and servicing the ball turret.

[@MonkPetite]

There is .. on periscope film

[@BrownEyePinch]

@@MonkPetite they have everything on that channel

[@TRUMP_WAS_RIGHT_ABOUT_EVRYTHNG]

@@MonkPetite is that a website or a channel on a website? cause periscope film is a website where they charge money for all those manuals and books which is bullShit seeing how usa tax dollars likely already paif for those 10 times over lol so we own them thanks to gen x grandparents. :)

[@johnt.4947]

I love the photo at the beginning of the video.

[@Tubes12AX7k]

One of my old coworkers was a pilot in the Navy. I asked him what his most memorable memory was from flying, and he said "the relief tube."

[@paigetomkinson1137]

I have to imagine that it was a bit, umm, uncomfortable for those guys. Having to use that device in the balmy -50°F cabin!

[@0836whimper]

Very interesting, but why have an exterior tube that sprayed all over the ball turret and froze etc ? Would using bottles that are emptied at the end of the flight not have been easier ?

[@ninus17]

I would like ti know more about the differences in the turret. Som Seem to have a lot of side Windows. Some have a plate covering the tronion and turret sides. While some Seem ti have no side Windows at all. And there are also differences in the forward looking Windows that are above below and to the side of the central round Window.

[@Plainview200]

I wonder what the total weight penalty is for the system. If the turret itself weighs 800lbs, what added aircraft structure is needed? What are other added weights? e.g., hydraulic components?

[@davidweston6653]

Great info. Other than defusing bombs one of the crappiest jobs during WW II

[@wakes_inc]

These guys stayed in the ball turret during the entire mission? That's insane.

[@Rammstein0963.]

Once the plane was officially airborne under it's own power.

[@BrownEyePinch]

What a nightmare. Imagine being trapped in that thing when your plane was crashing

[@gaveintothedarkness]

How loud would it be inside the turret?

[@SliceofLife7777]

There was a tv series called Amazing Stories. One of those episodes is titled: The Mission. It centers around a B-17 ball turret gunner who becomes trapped in his gun position. If you're in the mood to mix the supernatural with the historical fiction categories, check it out. It was directed by Steven Spielberg.

[@sixstringedthing]

I really enjoyed that episode as a kid. I remember chuckling to myself when the big finale came to mind while watching _Memphis Belle_ for the second or third time with some friends several years later. I had to explain why I was giggling during one of the most tense final moments of the film, which led to quite a lot of fast-forwarding through assorted poorly labelled VHS cassettes until I finally found the episode. :)

[@TRUMP_WAS_RIGHT_ABOUT_EVRYTHNG]

there was a recent movie , last year i think....absolutely crazy b17 movie. interesting story line with one hell of a wacky and cool twist. anyway a woman is trapped in the ball turret and hits a fighter from great distance and the action sequences that follow were intense as hell! unrealistic but still, intense! wish i could recall the name. hot blonde famous actress was in it too. dammit....what was that??? ahhhh bingo..... kzbin.info/www/bejne/nnS3oIF3l5yEfbc

[@russguffee6661]

I watched that episode when I was a kid........ Man, I really miss the eighties.

[@Beemer917]

Quarter inch aluminum casting and even quarter inch thick steel plate is not armor plate. And you got to remember that most of the German Fighters had a 20 or 30 mm Cannon.

[@chamonix4658]

flak protection, its armour

[@AlexDahlseid2002]

The ball turret was fixed to B-17 and not retractable as the B-24

[@johnplaid648]

What?! No mention of "the whole nine yards"?

[@xtr3m3fLx]

I'm gonna go ahead and say very few here would know what that really means. GETCHA SOME! ratta tat tat tat.

[@fordrugs]

first of all, thank you a lot for your videos; second, could you elaborate on the matter of tracers (i.e. why they were removed): were they removed for all bomber gunners? and what about fighter pilots, why it was considered ok to let them have tracers?

[@Thomasnmi]

We found out that the tracers traveled in a different arc than the other rounds. Effectively removing the advantages of tracer roundx

[@raleighthomas3079]

Some fighter aces had the armorers load their guns with no tracers at all, so as not to tip off an enemy that he was being fired at. They liked to sneak in close and let rip at point blank range.

[@SliceofLife7777]

The Sperry gun sight used known wingspan of the target to compute range, and lead. When properly used, the sights were more accurate than observing the tracers. Tracers are not ballistically identical to the armor piercing incendiary rounds, so could distract the ball turret operator's use of the Sperry gun sight. Therefore, tracers were not incorporated into the Sperry's twin 50. cals. I believe that only the ball turret used this sighting system. So the other gunners used tracer ammo, but I could be wrong.

[@fordrugs]

@@SliceofLife7777 makes sense, thanks

[@SliceofLife7777]

@@Thomasnmi Tracers are still used today. While not ballistically identical to the normal rounds, tracers served as a reference point for the gunner. An experienced gunner knew where his/her rounds were sreaming in relation to the tracer trajectories. The Sperry gun sights were only available in the Sperry gun turret at the time. The B29 Superfortress took gun sights to another level entirely. It wasn't till the jet age that fighter pilots had electromechanical or radar guided gun sights. There are benifits to using, or not using tracer ammo. If you are using electromechanical, or electronic sights, or your gunnery skill or tactics are sufficient, tracers become a liability. But if you're using fixed sights, especially on high deflection shots, they are quite useful.

[@marklatimer7333]

There is absolutely not cat in Hell's chance that you would have got me in that thing even without flying around and some bu99er shooting at me.

[@gavinowen2263]

Looks like something out of star wars! 😆 🤣

[@robertutecht3125]

My stepfather was "bellygunner" on B-17 he used oil can for his pee. Said being so cold it would freeze almost instantly

[@rickvia8435]

My Dad's battle station.

[@geraldmiller5260]

Gee whiz!?!!

[@marvinacklin792]

Highly trained gunners

[@briancross7835]

06:02 Man. Imagine being unable to see properly in your gun station because of... frozen piss.

[@email4664]

A common problem with KZbin publishers that self-narrate, is that they fail to use the pause between sentences. Jumping instantly to a different thought with zero break- Not very enjoyable really

[@chamonix4658]

must suck being deaf

[@blueeyeddevil1]

The Death of the Ball Turret Gunner BY RANDALL JARRELL From my mother’s sleep I fell into the State, And I hunched in its belly till my wet fur froze. Six miles from earth, loosed from its dream of life, I woke to black flak and the nightmare fighters. When I died they washed me out of the turret with a hose.

[@Larrye123]

My grandfather was ball turret gunner. I was small when he was alive. I asked him if he killed anyone and he never answered. He showed me the shrapnel scar on his leg and told me there was still stuff inside him. I can't believe how complicated his short time in the army air corp was. Great people came before us and gave everything. I'm truly shocked to see how we have repaid our veterans by destroying the greatest economy in the world and tarnishing our great reputation. May they forgive us.

[@wlewisiii]

Thank your local GOP Insurrectionist for that destruction.

[@MonkPetite]

Again your wrong the picture of the falling ball turret is from a b24 .. and the b17 never dropped the ball.

[@WWIIUSBombers]

Monk, please see the B-17 Pilot training manual dated Oct, 1944 on pages 134 and 135. The manual recommends dropping the ball turret under certain landing conditions and provides step-by-step instructions.

[@ptonpc]

@Monk Petite If you have proof of your claim then show it. Otherwise just accept you're wrong and the narrator, who has the manual, has posted the pages etc, is correct.

[@MonkPetite]

@@ptonpc during my life I have talked to many veterans of all airforces served during ww2 They can’t recall that dropping the ball was ever done during there time up. If so where are al those balles laying around. Never is one found not on land not at sea. No story’s of finding a ball turret.. yes it was possible and it was done but that was a rare event. Manuals are not there to be followed strictly..

[@ptonpc]

@@MonkPetite So. Let's get this straight. The narrator has shown you the manuals, has told you which page the instructions are on, has posted the pictures as show in the manual. Yet you insisted it was never done, even to the point of harassing the narrator. Now you admit it was done. The narrator never claimed this was a regular event, simply that it could be done and had instructions for doing so. Here's the thing. I have interviewed many veterans regards my area of interest and have found they misremember and misidentify many things. You have to be careful not to take everything at face value. It was a long time ago and they would have been in stressful situations. There is also survivorship bias to contend with. As just a couple of examples, I have stories from veterans who swore Lancaster bombers were used in Aden (There is no evidence for this.). Others who thought Daimler Dingos were used in Northern Ireland (What they meant was Daimler Ferrets).

[@MonkPetite]

@@ptonpc you guys are form the usa right ? Well the tendency to change history is a big thing in the usa. “ it’s on the internet so it must be true” It’s like a plague. Find the periscope films read the reports as we have in Europa . Don’t say vets are making up stories as I’m old too. That’s so cheap. The stories as I have recorded do not confirm any turret to be dropped. These “recordings” are form late 50 and 60. Veterans where not making up stories then. Although some dumped the compleet inventory overboard. They never twisted the ball nuts. More confirmation on that was the remark that they did not know how. As I said you not going to read a manual in distress. Even tools where not onboard to save weight. So delete the manual story as that is Bs ( many manuals are online , everyone can have those) and those are designers idea. Not said this was a practice to remember by flying crew. So please stop changing history for the young Americans .. they didn’t won ww2 as history channel makes believe. .. form my research some balls where dismounted by the help of a knowledgeable person onboard. The one photo is made form the ball dropping away is made over the North Sea. ( this phone started my research about it ). The story is it took some time and planing to make fall. Photographer was ready to make that epic picture. To conclude.. the ball was never dropped as the time to do it was not present and lag of skills from the crew. On the b17 it was more work to free the azimuth ring form the ball. The lag of space made it very hard. The retractable version on the b24 was easier to free up form it’s rig. Records of flights prove that what weapon was turned in after the mission. This job was for the crew. Sign out your weapons and report for debrief. On those mission report almost non ball turrets where reported as lost or dropped. Reset my case .. as I know better. Please check and recheck otherwise your video is clickbait

[@gavinowen2263]

(1:25)....mmmm trunnion rings 🧅 😋 😋

[@MrKen-wy5dk]

I wonder what the "relief" mechanics would have been if women had been allowed in combat at that time? Equal opportunity.

[@stevelewis7263]

How on earth did the ball turret gunner pee through the tube while curled up like a dead cockroach, unless he was built like John Holmes lol

[@davidfifer4729]

I don't know, but I presume they first rotated the turret so that the tube pointed down.

[@mandolinic]

The obvious solution is a use a piece of flexible tubing to connect the outlet to the airman.

[@stevelewis7263]

With the difference of air pressure it would probably suck his tackle down the tube, mind you that might actually be quite pleasurable lol

[@mandolinic]

@@stevelewis7263 The pressure is the same inside and outside the ball turret, since the bomber isn't pressurised. I think his tackle is safe from everything, except a stray German bullet.

[@dave_sic1365]

Gunners need good aim

[@TRUMP_WAS_RIGHT_ABOUT_EVRYTHNG]

my god they certainly didn't think a lot of this shit through while designing these flying death traps lol they cant even get the piss nozzle right lmfao. guys pissing all over his ball then he cant see a damn thing which is kind of really detrimental to his ability to perform his seriously important job :() worst job ever = ball turret monkey.

[@jec_ecart]

Coffin turret.