Yajnadevam's Indus script decipherment hosted by Steve Bonta

Yajnadevam presents his Indus script decipherment and AMA
00:00 Opening
01:35 Brief history of the Indus valley
08:42 Indus script timeline
19:40 The Indus script problem
22:50 Decipherment using cryptanalysis
31:49 Information Theory: Is every script decipherable?
33:49 Unicity distance and uniquely provable solution
37:00 Can I decipher a script as ANY language? (Phonotactics)
39:52 Is it an actual script? Which kind? Which language?
47:30 Direction of writing
49:34 Different signs vs variants of the same sign
53:58 Allographs and distinct signs
55:25 Numeric signs vs numbers
57:17 Deciphering signs one by one
1:00:58 What happens if a sign is incorrectly deciphered?
1:02:20 Why is the only correct decipherment?
1:05:39 Reconstructed sign names
1:06:05 Whole signs vs composite signs
1:08:27 Brahmi is standardized Indus script
1:09:09 Example inscriptions
1:10:48 Yajur Veda
1:11:40 Rig veda
1:13:02 Common Objections
1:14:10 IA Arrived in 1500 BCE?
1:19:54 Continuity of iconography
1:22:10 Horse and chariot objection
1:22:56 Multiple allographs per symbol
1:23:54 Genetics
1:28:12 IVC Symbols in the Steppes?
1:30:46 Other decipherments
1:32:39 Other fallacies
1:36:03 Steve's comments
1:44:45 Demo
1:58:05 Q&A

[@yajnadevam]

For the decipherment paper see: www.academia.edu/78867798/A_cryptanalytic_decipherment_of_the_Indus_Script

[@NirmalKumar-ru2ke]

Your Evidence os fake and false..Your propaganta is waste of time..Why? I HAVE PROOF..JOURNEY OF CIVILIZATION INDUS TO VAGAI BOOK IS MAIN PROOF ...Then i am also lot evidence available people speak to Mainly Tamil language only.. Why? ..I have proof. 1.)TAMIL language total Number of inscription 67000 nos..Then inscription age 700.B.C. 2.)SANSKRIT total inscription is 4500 only..Sanskrit INSCRIPTION is 100.B.C 3.)Sangam literature lot proof avaialable..Sangam Literature land wise People how survive lot poem available. Kurinji land - mountain land, Mullai land- Tree land, Marutham land -aggreculture land , Neythal land - sea land , Paalai land - Desertland or Sand land or waste land ,So land wise poem avaialable..Sangam Litrature lot poem avaialable in desert land poems..Sangam Literature writing 2500 year ago.. This is the mainly Proof .. India lot INSCRIPTION avaialable 1.)Tamizhi inscription 2.)Poly language inscription 3.)Ashoca inscription 4.)Devanagari inscription.. 5.)SANSKRIT inscription Then Tamil language world wide Lot of evidence is available. But Sanskrit evidence little bit only available..

[@yajnadevam]

@Cr00kedKnight Yes, the carvings on the seals are mirror images so that when impressions are taken, the sealings have the right orientation

[@yajnadevam]

@Cr00kedKnight Seals are read left-to-right because they are designed to create mirror impressions. Seal impressions (ie sealings), bas-relief items, copper plates, implements, everything else is read right-to-left

[@saleelapatkar732]

I hope we are at a cusp of something significant 😊

[@laxmivasudevan7576]

Yagnadevam . There is a prize money for the person deciphering Indus script . I sincerely wish you get that prize and money .

[@laxmivasudevan7576]

Neeraj Rai Molecular geneticist and one of the authors on the paper “ Cell “ had made it clear that Steppe gene has maximum diversity in Indian population compared to that of Europe implying that it had originated many generations earlier in India than in Europe . Genetic studies also do not support AIT / AMT

[@itsoblivion8124]

Which form of Sanskrit is it? We know vedic Sanskrit is oldest form of Sanskrit and earliest layer of rigveda contains archaic Sanskrit. Language you deciphered has to be proto-sanskrit

[@cryptonash16]

Another thing I would like to check is if we can use this methodology to prove if Aramaic came from Middle East or it came from the Iranian Plateu/BMAC/Indus.

[@anuradham8435]

21:28 the picture is story of hunter (lubdhaka) which is read out during mahashivratri in many areas of india

[@lewisrobinson3380]

Is there a list somewhere of proposed deciphered symbols? I’d love to cross compare the symbols with various other scripts.

[@yajnadevam]

See section 3 in the decipherment paper: www.academia.edu/78867798/A_cryptanalytic_decipherment_of_the_Indus_Script

[@lewisrobinson3380]

@@yajnadevam I really appreciate this. I was hoping to see some kind of sound correspondence with Linear A or B, that didn't pan out at all so I decided to look at Elder Futhark just to see and I am so glad I did... So far it looks like Elder Futhark an Early Germanic scripts bears some resemblances to certain sounds you've attributed to symbols. For examples Elder Futhark D "dagaz" looks pretty similar to a couple of the D or Dh symbols you have which makes sense as PIE *dʰ = d in proto-germanic at least at the beginning of a word. Elder Futhark A "ansuz" looks like the edge of the symbol you describe as "an" Elder Futhark N "naudiz" looks a lot like a couple of the symbols you describe as "Stalk" and reconstruct ṇāla with. Elder Futher ï "iwaz" is a dipthong vowel that's close to or identical with æ in sound. The iwaz symbol looks identical to one of the ā stick[AV] symbols but is also used for one of the O symbols you reconstructed as opasa. What makes this even more curious is the PIE *o becomes ā in Indo-Aryan and æ in some of the Germanic languages such as Old English. Elder Futhark h "haglaz" looks related to the symbols for ladder/sopāna what makes this interesting is that PIE *ḱ becomes h in proto-germanic ; ś in Sanskrit; s in Avestan Elder Futhark k "kauna" and g "gebo" look related to kṛtam dice[ŚBr] symbols with sounds like k and kh. PIE *k can remain K in Indo-Aryan but in Proto-Germanic frequently become H or G in the case of PIE *kt = ght in Old English for example. PIE *g typically becomes K in Proto-Germanic however which might explain this similarity. Elder Futhark m "mannaz" looks possibly related to maya horse[VS] with the M sound. PIE *m for the most part correlated in Proto-Germanic and Indo-Aryan the name of the rune itself is cognate with Manu. Elder Futhark w "wunjo" looks like vartī lamp wick[MBh] with a sound starting with V. PIE *W becomes V in Indo-Iranian and remains W in Proto-Germanic. Elder Futhark þ "thurisaz" looks a bit like tardū wooden ladles with a sound of T. However this comparison seems weaker than the above. Elder Futhark t "tiwaz" also looks a bit like some of those symbols, but looks closer to the Latin and Greek alphabets. Elder Futhark z "algiz" looks related to śikhā peacock crest[MBh] which has the sound of ś. What makes this curious is that proto-germanic Z comes from PIE *s particularly at the end of suffixes. PIE *onos becomes proto-germanic *anaz. Granted it also looks like Ancient Greek "Psi" Elder Futhark j "jeran" notably looks a lot like the correspondance you have for Brahmi Script "jh" which is under jhara waterfall[Prab] which is quite noteable since "jeran" looks nothing like Roman or Greek characters especially since Latin didn't have a "j" until after the 2nd century.

[@yajnadevam]

@@lewisrobinson3380 That's pretty cool. If you have research on this, can you point me to your papers

[@lewisrobinson3380]

@@yajnadevam unfortunately I’m a amateur who just loves reading these papers and listening to lectures.

[@Sneaky_007]

Me too

[@laxmivasudevan7576]

Indus script is Early Brahmi script which later became Brahmi from which later Sanskrit and Tamil evolved is what I understood from the talk . Tamil is a natural language , simple , very few consonants , most suitable to ordinary people while Sanskrit was developed by scholars to make this language rich in alphabets and words with well developed Grammar by Panini. As yagnadevam states Panini came later , classic Sanskrit came later .

[@MARK-gp9hb]

lol Sanskrit may actually be the language of the gods for real

[@zojozojo-ox6wj]

You are right 👍

[@garudagaming2019]

Sanskrit is far far old

[@Bigkahkistan]

Lol you know nothing about Tamizh

[@anuradham8435]

Please provide a link to your paper. Thank you

[@yajnadevam]

see pinned comment

[@AbhishekTiwari1111]

Ancient Indus script is indeed sanskrit in proto Brahmi.

[@subramaniyamm2288]

I am not Archeological expert, old tamil era literature deacribed how the city will be looked. How people do the day today activity in the city. Even they mentioned desert in so many places in the sangam literature. At present TN, there is no nearby desert. Then how the people described about desert. Also tiger and man sitting on the tree seal;. The tree may be Pterocarpus marsupium, its name is vengai (yellow and black flower). So people use to call tiger and that tree as Vengai ( வேங்கை). Even that tree woods found in indus valley. Presently it not exist due to 4.2 kiloyear event.

[@Ragnar638]

Sangam literature contains many vedic gods too. So how will you describe that then?

[@vv6533]

great talk. Do you know why Ashish is inactive on twitter these days? Is he working on a paper or something?

[@manassurya2019]

This is eye opening. Thank you.

[@SriramNA-k7v]

I commiserate with you on the difficulty in having these theses peer-reviewed. The methodology appears sound; perhaps the only proof can come from discovery of further artefacts...

[@Joseph-yu4lx]

Indus civilisation people migrated from Sindhus region for some valid reasons. They consisted mainly of traders who had stationed there to trade conveniently with the western countries like Sumeria. Wherever they settled they always provided themselves with comfortable residence facilities. Originally they were from ancient Tamilnadu. There were other supporters and dependants and other technicians.

[@Joseph-yu4lx]

They travelled towards their homeland and found eastern port city Kaveripoompattinam It was then a growing capital city and so they settled there and traded with the eastern countries. When very later this city suffered massive sea erosion the people travelled further south and settled in a place away from from sea and flooding rivers. So the descendants of Sindhus civilisation people still living in Tamilnadu, still practising their traditional practices and cultural customs. The people are called NAGARATHHAR meaning people living in cities. The area is called Chettinadu.

[@curiouskid1547]

Not at all. They were just indigenous to Haryana.

[@MTd2]

how did "u" become "a" sunzida/samdiddha and szuillisu/shailesha? Shouldn' shailesha be szuiliuszu to keep the "sh" conversion?

[@yajnadevam]

Cuneiform is polyvalent and their sound values are approximate. Many sounds that use the /u/ sound in Cuneiform are attested as /a/ in Sanskrit, including meluha>melaha

[@MTd2]

@@yajnadevam I checked your paper. There are very few words with vowels other than a. It seems very unexpected in a natural. Perhaps you shouldn't assume what is the vowel, like in the abugidas. I also miss practical messages, with things like quantities, products. Perhaps that is a consequence of assuming that the vowels are almost all "a"?

[@yajnadevam]

@@MTd2 No vowels were assumed, the derivation process resolved to consonant+a. Due to scarcity of space on the tiny seals, they used synonyms that minimize other vowels.

[@MTd2]

@@yajnadevam I mean abjad. But have you seen Rajesh Rao talks? He also analyses the markov chains of seals and figures out that some should mean numeric sins in binary, agreeing with Bonta (he cites him indeed)

[@yajnadevam]

@@MTd2 There is no binary number system in 3000 BCE and it doesn't make sense to use binary, which takes up so much space when they have numeric signs available. The script is not an abjad, because then there wouldn't be any vowel signs. Note that Indus signs are embedded in Brahmi inscriptions, which is evidence that Indus signs are also abugida.

[@cryptonash16]

Nice, can you use your algo to track patterns between Avestan, Vedic, Puranas, Yazata? From my research, it seems like battle of the 10 kings is at around 600BCE/500BCE an it refers to the invasion of Darius as Druhyus and his Achaeminids empire along with his mercenary tribes such as the Sakas etc. The battle of the 10 kings clearly mention these tribe names, and the Scythian confederation does not exist before 900 BCE. If you study Persian history, after Cyrus (Kurush) from the Aryan Kamboja tribe expansion to the Indus, he setup a Satrapy near Indus whereby the later Darius the 1st's father Hystaspes ( Vishtaspa in the Gathas) controlled a Satrapy near Indus, and it seems that his dad studied from the magis in India. Soon after that we see a boom in Zoroastrianism, before that in Cyrus time we never see any mention about Zoroastrianism. Hence it seems like the Zoroastrianism concept, formulated in the Kuru Kingdom and Haryana was Airyanem Vaejah, Sarasvathi As Haraxvaiti and Sapta sindhu as Hepthahindu.. So they brought the memory along with them to BMAC, settled there for a while and moved into the Iranian Plateu. @yajnadevam you may refer this to your colleague as well.

[@linguistme6870]

Sarasvati's indentification with haraxvaiti is not accepted by many scholars only few minority of them do Secondly if you bring 10 kings around 600 BCE that would have drastic implications like if that was the case why does Buddha mention Kurus of ancient past in Diggha Nikaya ? Also the entire Samhita literature should be over before they start writing Upanishads reasoing being Chandogya Upanishad and Taitriya Upanishad were popular around time of Buddha we know that from Diggha Nikay Chapter 13 of Volume 1 but Chandogya Upanishad in 7.1.2 itslef refers to them , now since we know chandogya was popular around 600-500 BCE we should conclude that it would have been written somewhere around 800-700 BCE if that is the case than definitely be older. Though there is an "alternate theory" according to HINDUS Traditions which shift Gautam Buddha around 1800-1700 BCE and Mauryas to around 1500-1350 BCE

[@cryptonash16]

We need comparative timelines for these. First or all no written evidence remains and most of these literature was orally transmitted.. Idk. Also if you compare with Prince Vijayas arrival to Sri Lanka, around 600 BCE.. He doesn't bring any Buddhist culture along (Siddhartha Gautama being the the most prominent one among a list of his 20 other predecessor Buddhas), although Sramana (Shaman) culture had been preexisting in the IVC for thousands of years. Buddhist culture starts in Sri Lanka slowly after Asokas invasion of Kalinga, as there there was a movement to spread the Buddhist teachings. Why didn't Chandragupta Maurya adopt Buddhist philosophy, because the Buddhist theology did not really take shape until Siddhartha came along, or was not adopted by the general population since ruling classes/aristocracy /kings did not take a liking to it as of yet. We can agree to disagree, but I don't agree of trying to backdate Indian culture to thousands of years just to prove a point to other people that Indian culture is a very old one, truth should remain truth. Many scholars do not accept Haraxvaiti to be Sarasvathi why? Are they looking at at just rivers, or trying to Geofix its location? Human history is a history of migration..The Zoroastrianians or Kambojas has a fallout with the general Kuru tribes and are labelled as Anarya because of their habits. They brought the culture and memory with them (Hence, Haraxvaiti and Hapta Haendu) and they always refer Haraxvaiti and Hapta Haendu as one of the 16 perfect lands created by their prophet Zoroaster. They also labelled the Vedic Devas as evil and the leader as Angra Mainyu(Angiras?) and called their God as Ahura Mazda., this is probably the logical explanation why the schism began. For example, If you look at Turkey, there is a place called Adhiyaman, and in Tamil nadu there was a king called Adhiyaman. The memory of older settlements continously linger in peoples memory. Take for example in kerala, they have built 100 kaurava temples dedicated to their ancestors, and the community managing these temples belong to the Kuruva people. Kuru is just one of the tribes in Ancient India, and they were an adventurous one. Hence they are a well known, We also see striking similarities with the Quraysh tribe of Arabia. They were a merchant tribe which controlled and managed many temples in the Arabian peninsula. We should do a deep study about the Kamboja, Gandhara, Sakas, and Kuru connection to understanding better of Indian history I suggest because these are major players in the Mahajanapada.

[@cryptonash16]

Also to add, prior to the battle of the 10 kings.. These adventurous Kambojas who were part of the Kuru dynasty settled in Badakshan province/north east Iran about 2000 BCE to control the gem route of Turquoise, Carnelian and Lapis Lazuli. These ones slowly assumed a new Iranian identity due to the BMAC influence and migrated into the Iranian Plateau/Anatolia/Arabian Peninsula. There were many sects of these Kamboja tribes, there were the Parama Kambojas, Kambojas etc...These trade guilds retained their idolatry/paganistic/circumbulatory Indian practises that you still see in the middle East. Another thing is that these merchants had an army of their own and built places of worship wherever they go.. Take for example Angkor Wat by the Cambodians (Kampuchea/Kamboja). Hence some were Indic/some Iranian, some become Arabaized, and even Jews (Anjuman/Anjuvannam). If my guess is right, Cyrus the great and Family descended from the ParamaKambojas (Royal Kambojas). Let's hope Darius l was not lying in his inscriptions at Nashq E Rostam & Pasargadae 😅

[@cryptonash16]

​@@linguistme6870As long a confusion/doubt remains, scholars remain relevant. They never formed a consensus and come to a common ground because the subject is their bread and butter plus egoism plays a role here. The concept of Zoroastrianism was formulated in the Kuru Kingdom of present day Punjab. A sect of these tribe, the Kambojas settled in the BMAC region to control trade etc, and they have some memory of the Vedic religion. Hytaspes, Darius the Greats Satrapy Father later enhanced the Zoroastrianism religion by infusing Indic knowledge...by branding this new religion. As you know religion was a way to control the masses, hence his son Darius killed the true heir of Cyrus and pushed his agenda to the Achaeminids (Haxamanushiya).

[@Lerner7]

19:39 I am from Rajasthan and in my village we have similar human paintings (exactly the same)culture it is called Maya

[@yajnadevam]

Can you send some links to yajnadevam at proton dot me

[@Lerner7]

@@yajnadevam वो पुरानी कालकृति नही हे हमारे यह हर एक शादी में इसे दीवार पर उकेरने की प्रथा हे बहुत पुरानी हे शायद जब मेरे दादाजी से मेने बचपन में पूछा तो उन्होंने कहा पुरानी प्रथा हे सिंध पर कासिम के हमले के बाद हमारे पूर्वजों ने जोधपुर की ओर पलायन कर लिया था तो वहा तक का इतिहास बताते हे मनुष्य की हाथ ऊपर की हुई सात चित्र सात देवियों की प्रतीक हे पर वो आकृति आपके इस तस्वीर से बिल्कुल सेम मिलान करती हे उन्हें हम हमारे यहां मारवाड़ में माया कहा जाता है अगर आप फिर भी फोटोज लेना चाहते हे तो में गांव जाने के बाद आपको जरूर भेजूंगा

[@Govind_rana500]

Continuation ❤

[@kshitizrai926]

@@Lerner7 Did you send the photos?

[@triptouniverse1509]

​@@Lerner7 you're talking about "Mandanã" graffiti on walls or on ground??? Konse Gaav se ho aap?? Main bhi rajsthan se hi hun mewad region se.

[@jainvarunn]

@yajna , would you be intereste in developing and Ai to convert the indus valley text into sanskrit and hidi , i htink it would be great and could help prove ur research

[@yajnadevam]

You don't even need AI, its almost readable with little effort.

[@jainvarunn]

@@yajnadevam this hypothesis has to be peer reviwed and be widely accepted, if you create a basic ai and prove your hypothesis , you will be the man

[@jainvarunn]

@@yajnadevam for everyone the indus script it still no deciphered

[@lewisrobinson3380]

58:08 not all number systems are decimal. Sumerians did not use a decimal system for example.

[@yajnadevam]

There is evidence that IVC did use a decimal system. for example, there is no sign with 11 strokes.

[@cyb-m]

I went through your paper. This is amazing. From Section 3, by how the phonemes::glyphs have been grouped, it looks like the script was originally used for Tamil and later adopted to write sanskrit. This is just an observation.

[@yajnadevam]

The reconstructed sign names are Sanskrit, so I believe it was invented in a Sanskrit locale.

[@cyb-m]

@@yajnadevam i can see that the reconstructed samples are sanskrit. I am not disputing that. But the way the phonemes have been grouped to correspond to allograph groups, kind of suggest that it might have been used for Tamil originally and later used for sanskrit.

[@yajnadevam]

@@cyb-m Yes based on the lack of distinction between aspirated/unaspirated, and the fricatives. However, voiced and unvoiced have distinct signs (d/t, p/b etc) which is not the case in Tamil

[@cyb-m]

@@yajnadevam there is distinction in Tamil between voiced, unvoiced, geminate, approximant, and voiced-fricative, but they are positional, and use the same phoneme. Tamil phonology is positional. K is k in the beginning of a word, g after a nasal, h when preceded by the aaytham, and velar approximant after a vowel. same is the case for other consonants. I have done analysis of tamil phonology and concluded that there are only 12 primary phonemes in Tamil which expanded later to the current 31. But even these current 31 are written with the same phonetics rules of the old 12. I dont think youtube will let me post links on comments. Let me know where I can send you a link to my document.

[@cryptonash16]

​​@@cyb-mYajnadevam mentioned he's using Paninian Sanskrit as a reference which is basically Classical Sanskrit. As you know Panini basically compiled all existing grammar in India to create this structure/format around 600BCE to 300BCE. Maybe we should try with Vedic Sanskrit as well.

[@exerjiexerji289]

Brilliant, Yajna Devam.

[@Apastambha]

Why Sanskrit only, how about Prakrit/Brahmi spread even to Andhra Pradesh before 300 BCE? I assume there may be a couple of languages especially in a span of 900 years, according to Professor Mark Kenoyer. More excavation and more open-minded research are needed.

[@aroyleo]

Our text books should contain this info.

[@joydeeproy1580]

i am sorry but desertification is not convincing why they moved. People still lived there

[@cryptonash16]

Any agragrian society would migrate to greener pastures when there is prolong draught. My ancestors migrated to South East Asia due to famine and draught in the Madras/Deccan Plateu.. Induced by the British cotton industry to cater to their industrial revolution.

[@LS-ql4wp]

Why wd not mass migration happen

[@joydeeproy1580]

west punjab, sind is still very much fertile and agrarian. Some migration could have happened.This was 2000 BC.I doubt it was so bad then.

[@yajnadevam]

You haven't lived through a 100 yr drought.

[@bobroy3746]

​​@@joydeeproy1580 There is evidence of population increase at Lothal in Gujrat and other settlements to the west of Mohenjo daro and Harappa around the same time. That proves the migration happened out of that region both inwards into India and outwards further west away from India. This can happen only due to climatic change.

[@debuttarly]

it was same as the previous

[@bindisumi1650]

How can you name a devil,s name ...BRAMII

[@ranapratapsingh3416]

For Sanskrit, the oldest archaeological evidence goes back to 1400 BCE . Kikkuli's horse training text (circa 1400 BC) includes technical terms such as aika (Vedic Sanskrit eka, one), tera (tri, three), panza (pañca, five), satta (sapta, seven), na (nava, nine), vartana (vartana, round). The word Vartana is exclusively an old Vedic word . It was used in Rig Veda. Ṛiveda 8.9.8 used Vartana . आ नू॒नं र॒घुव॑र्तनिं॒ रथं॑ तिष्ठाथो अश्विना ।. The third word is a compound - “ragʰúvartaniṃ = swiftly roll/move” . Horse training Manual of Kikkuli also uses the same word for turns ( Vartana ).

[@yajnadevam]

Many Mittani words actually have elements of prakrit, and late sanskrit

[@mevenstien]

✨️🙂✨️

[@AnupamSurey]

May be he is unassuming but his work has dismantled the Aryan immigration, and his work also push back the date for Rigveda.

[@dr.samadhanawane6450]

There is no India without indus

[@mikedesi5513]

These people used fish sign often I believe they were Vedic fish eating Brahmins who caught fish in rivers such as saraswati

[@uniqguy111]

Why do u claim everything to belong to Brahmins.They are only 1-5% . Aren't there other fish eating ppl ?

[@MedinipuriTuka036]

Bengali, Odia, Assamese and Maithili Brahmins also eat fish

[@cryptonash16]

IVC and Vedic civilization does not belong to Brahmins. The Varna classification came later only. The priest class was just a communication medium with the Gods, nothing else. Who is going to do the farming, fish catching, and food production? How will you eat? Non-violence ahimsa teachings came via the Sramana movement (Parshavanath -9th Century BCE) due to them seeing massive sacrifices being made in the name Gods. Maybe humans used to be sacrificed too.. who knows? There were headhunters and savages at those times.

[@greaterbharat4175]

​@@cryptonash16most bronze age civilization had priestly class , actually priest as class or caste origin from civilization after settlement

[@subratamajumdar]

Bengali, maithili brahmins eat fish ​@@uniqguy111

[@85Sudi]

By prioritising linguistic evidence over genetic evidence you have created a big gap in your hypothesis. Between the two, genetic evidence will always, always take precedence over linguistic evidence because genetic evidence is much less open to interpretations and therefore closer to the fact. For the Out-of-India theory to be proven, you need to prove that INDIAN-ORIGIN GENEs migrated out of the Subcontinent and reached Central Asia, then Eastern Europe, then Greece and Italy, for the Aryan language to be the real 'PIE'. There is of course no evidence of an Out-of-India migration to Europe, and that disconnects your hypothesis from reality.

[@yajnadevam]

Everything you said is incorrect. Firstly, Language is a network effect and not determined by genes. Many HG groups switch languages when absorbed by advanced cultures. The Steppes themselves switched their language twice in recorded history: once to Slavic and second time to Turkic!. Genetically related groups can speak completely unrelated languages. Japanese/Korean for example, share 91% of their DNA. Hungarians have no Turkic DNA at all. Secondly, the evidence here is archaeological, which supersedes everything else, including linguistics and genetic evidence. Thirdly, genetic evidence is statistical, not deterministic. There are studies showing South Asian DNA in corded ware, not that it matters because language can flow even without DNA.

[@85Sudi]

​@@yajnadevamyour assumption is based on the world as you see it today. But you are discussing the bronze age, when the 'network effect' you mention existed to a much lesser degree, as societies were more isolated than they are today. Yes, HG groups sometimes switch languages, but only when RULED OVER BY other cultures for a long enough period, and not otherwise. In the Steppes, entire demographics have changed since the Bronze Age due to Mongol and Timurid invasions, and also possibly those of the Huns before them. Unlike Korean, we are not discussing language isolates. The Hungarian language is Uralic, not Turkic. There is no archaeological or genetic evidence of substantial Indian culture (or religion) traveling west beyond Afghanistan except the Romani migration to Europe in medieval times. Language MUST flow with DNA in the bronze age. This has only changed since the invention of the telegraph, the telephone and the radio.

[@yajnadevam]

@@85Sudi join our discord to discuss more... link in my twitter bio

[@curiouskid1547]

We know the Indian cattle have went outside. The eurasian cattle didn't come to India. That's a great deal for genetics.

[@dtfdtf7860]

awesome work

[@ranapratapsingh3416]

Indus script is logo-syllabic. Indus script is not brahmi . Brahmi is a phonetic script. Indus script is more like sumerian and elamite scripts which are invented at the same time around 3000 BCE and are logo-syllabic in nature. Steven Bonta is close to solving this problem through his approach. But overall your work is good.

[@TheMysticHustle]

I have replied to you already there about the iron age kingdoms, along with a new point from genetic perspective. Did you recieve or not? If not, I'll repeat myself again

[@ranapratapsingh3416]

@@TheMysticHustle No I didn't receive it. Meanwhile, for Sanskrit, the oldest archaeological evidence goes back to 1400 BCE as I said earlier. Kikkuli's horse training text (circa 1400 BC) includes technical terms such as aika (Vedic Sanskrit eka, one), tera (tri, three), panza (pañca, five), satta (sapta, seven), na (nava, nine), vartana (vartana, round). The word Vartana is exclusively an old Vedic word . It was used in Rig Veda. Ṛiveda 8.9.8 used Vartana . आ नू॒नं र॒घुव॑र्तनिं॒ रथं॑ तिष्ठाथो अश्विना ।. The third word is a compound - “ragʰúvartaniṃ = swiftly roll/move” . Horse training Manual of Kikkuli also uses the same word for turns ( Vartana ).

[@ranapratapsingh3416]

Few clues to Indus script in Sumerian concordance. ) Sansrit. ḍiṇḍima डिण्डिम a kind of drum. This instrument is played till today in India, known as dimdi. Sumerian. dimdim a musical instrument wr. ĝeš dim3-dim3. 2) Sanskrit. सालिका,a kind of a flute Sumerian. SALI a musical instrument wr. SA.LI 3) Sanskrit डमरु ,a sacred drum Sumerian . dimmaršu an instrument (1x: Old Babylonian) wr. ĝešdim3-mar-šu 4) Sanskrit करताल beating time by clapping the hands, clapper, small cymbles, clappers with cymbols etc. Kara (RV)+ Tāl (Tal root (RV)) Akkadian. Katral small cymbles?, clapper? Galpin (1937), Sachs (1940) 5) Sanskrit आडम्बर a kind of drum Sumerian . adab a drum; a song (42x: Old Babylonian) wr. a-da-ab; a-da-ba Akk. adapu 6) Sanskrit . सायन्तूर्य instrument played in the evening Sumerian. sabitum a musical instrument (5x: Ur III,Old Babylonian) wr. ĝešsabi2-tum; sa-bi2-tum 7) Sanskrit मृत्युतूर्य a kind of drum beaten at funeral ceremonies Sumerian. miritum a musical instrument (4x: Old Babylonian) wr. mi-ri2-tum 8) Sanskrit कम्रा kind of musical instrument. Sumerian. kamma a part of a musical instrument ?:tuning? (2x: Ur III, Old Babylonian) wr. kam-ma Sumerian.miritum a musical instrument(4x:Old Babylonian) wr. mi-ri2-tum 9) Sumerian. eštalu a type of singer (2x: Old Babylonian) wr. eš3-ta-lu2; aš-ta-lu2 Akk. aštalû 10 ) Sans. maṅgalatūrya म"लतूय'a musical instrument used at festivals Sumerian malgatum a musical instrument; a type of song (5x: Old Babylonian) wr. ma-al-ga-tum Akk. malgâtu

[@TheMysticHustle]

Sanskrit is foreign to india and reaches here only by around 2000-1500 BCE along with the nomadic aryans. This is proved beyond doubt. Then why putting in this much efforts and wasting time and misleading people?

[@ranapratapsingh3416]

@@TheMysticHustle Wrong. Vedic Sanskrit existed for last 10000 years. Ramayana was recorded in Sanskrit. Mahabharata was recorded in Sanskrit. Only bafoons who don't know about ancient Bharat talk rubbish here. THere is no honesty in dravidian DMK followers.

[@TheMysticHustle]

@@ranapratapsingh3416 You especially pls don't talk about Honesty. First of all, there shouldn't be name callings and hate speech in a healthy discussion. Difference of opinion will always be there between people. First, learn to respect others' opinions as well. And I said what I said based on the knowledge that I possess on the evidences available till date From multiple disciplines and not because I'm a follower of DMK or any political organization. So, go ahead. Give me evidence of the so called vedic sanskrit being 10000 years old. And what proof for ramayana and mahabaratha being historical events rather than myths?

[@ranapratapsingh3416]

@@TheMysticHustle Go and read the analysis of Nilesh Oak about Ramayana and Mahabharata. I need honesty. I don't need dishonest people here wasting time. I don't have respect for garbage believers . I have enough evidence to prove that Sanskrit was indigenous to Bharat.

[@ranapratapsingh3416]

@@TheMysticHustle Sanskrit is indigenous to bharat. It existed in Bharat for last 10,000 years. Don't put your filthy DMK propaganda here.