flames are SSS. Oil usage is negligible, and aoe is huge.

My personal thinking about Factorio lore is (not in very details) : a team of engineers, scientists and other people has been sent to conquer the new world Nauvis and study it for humanity, sadly once the giant spaceship enters Nauvis system, the asteroid belt formed by the shattered planet is a unconventional surprise to the team and the spaceships gets damaged. Every people try to get safe in escape pods but only us the engineer survive, and after deriving for days we crash on Nauvis (maybe the crash caused other people's death in the escape pod). Finally our engineer has one goal, get out of the Nauvis system and join humanity back, but he/she will have to exploit resources, research, and build a new spaceship. I can't really explain how the engineer can escape with the asteroid belt of the shattered planet, for now I'd say its because a breach got used in the belt or maybe while the engineer developed the new spaceship, asteroids had time to change trajectories and be less of a treat. Important thing to note is that asteroid belts in real life are not complete walls impossible to pass, there is usually few kilometers of space between asteroids to slalom around.

I wish artillery was viable in space. Not for shorting down asteroids but for orbital bombardment

my personal tierlist (as i like to do with these kinds of videos is as follows: Gun turret B tier, Laser Turret A tier, Flamethrower Turret S tier, Artillery A tier, Rocket Turret A tier, Tesla Turret S tier, Railgun Turret B tier, Walls A tier (definitely optional lol), mines F tier, Stone furnace C tier, Robots S tier, Landfill A tier. my list aside great video!

Anyone who plays deathworlds knows flamethrower is S tier. Between lasers & guns there’s a choicebut it is *nearly impossible to go w/o flamethrowers. Also furnace walls are extremely helpful in early game deathworld before brick/wall production scales up

Considering artillery but ignoring spidertrons is crazy

Now now, we are in space age, the best defense for navis and gleba is putting a wall of tanks with personal lasers they are (tanky) have high damage and supper easy to move and repair.

I wish i could get Anno 1800 to run correctly on Arch Linux, it runs a 20 mins or so then crashes. Anno 1404 is one my favorites (because of land combat). I bet Anno 117 will replace that if they return land combat

Lasers are great later in space, where they can be used to 1-shot the small asteroids (Need a few infinite laser damage upgrades, but affordable, even 2-shotting is fine, thanks to their crazy fire rate), (smalls seem to only exist once mediums are destroyed, and mediums are what you encounter when you leave Nauvis orbit.) Also, instead of accumulators for lasers, you can simply build more steam engines/turbines then you can actually supply with steam, and that way you can easily handle massive spikes in power draw. With the new fluid mechanics, the cost of that is trivial. Also, solar + accumulators for power is crazy expensive, and I wouldn't recommend ever doing that.

Flamers are an absolute godsend if you want to wall off certain areas. Piping in a fluid is infinitely easier than setting up belts+inserter+power for the inserter for row of gun turrets, and they do WAY more damage than lasers.

I use flamethrower turrets as offensive weapon for biter nest removal during early game

Artillery is overrated. It's good, but not S-tier good. Unlike Tesla turrets which are undoubtedly S-tier if you spawn on the desert.

I have never liked laser turrets: they tap your power and can potentially accidentally cause a brownout if you spam too many. Im going to be building a wall design whos lategame goal is to be fueled by resources entirely made form space, IE infinite material, to gap the argument for lasers that they dont cost you valuable quantities of resources

Flamethrower singlehandedly carried me through the massive biters settings deathworld... lets just say they were firing 100% of the time and the whole map outside my base was just red. And slow projectile doesnt really matter that much when it has support from other turrets, it will deal massive damage to everything behind the first enemy making it hold the line extremaly well (as you can see in 8:20)

i think you value too highly access to the turrets vs their usability and what defenses you already have. adding something like a tesla turret or a railgun turret is so incredibly easy to do, though that's about the only thing i think i really have to say about the video itself. here are my thoughts on the turrets themselves, with stuff being semi-relevant to the video: for tesla turrets you dont need anything other than electricity and it literally _just_ makes your existing defenses objectively better period and there's not really much of any downside and it completely negates the one weakness of flamethrower turrets as well, and for railguns because you get them so late its completely trivial to use logistic chests to supply them ammo. so i dont think adding new things to your wall is really all that much of a barrier to a turret's usability because you can _just do it_ and get huge benefits from them or _dont_ and you _dont._ it's just that simple. for railguns their late access isnt much of a big deal unless you're speedrunning or your ONLY goal is to get a game completion. if that is the case, then there isnt much you'd ever do with railgun turrets, but that's not the only way people play the game (you say so yourself in the video). that said, there is something you didnt mention that is a huge limitation to railgun turrets and that is that they *always* damage anything in their line of fire including your own buildings, so adding them to an existing defensive wall is pretty much not doable for that one singular reason alone. you could maybe design new defenses that incorporate this big limitation, though, but i dont know how much that'd really be worth it. i would also argue that Flamethrower turrets are *easier* to use than gun turrets up until you get robot logistics at which point you can supply gun turrets with bots, but before then flamethrower turrets are by-far easier to install and use and you can address problems like them buffering fluid like crazy whereas it's practically not possible to address early-game gun turrets fed by a belt buffering bullets like crazy and doing huge belt loops beyond early game is so impractical because of how much iron you'd need and how much pollution you'd create to buffer the entire belt that its objectively a lot worse than pretty much any alternative such as flamethrowers or lasers. walls are imo not actually all that necessary for most of the game if you have enough damage upgrades on gun turrets, flamethrowers, and lasers. by the time you have robot logistics (which is a little easier and quicker to access in Space Age now as well) gun turrets start to become significantly better again and its pretty easy to place only a couple of them around everywhere and it will keep almost all kinds of biter attacks out of your base on Nauvis, and coupled with the ability to have Nauvis have very little activity because you can supplement a lot of it with space or other planets, attacks on Nauvis are so much more mellow now than they used to be which is where Gun Turrets become the most efficient they'll ever be (killing only a few biters here and there) and generally they outcompete lasers at this point if you have uranium ammo, but even piercing ammo at this point is still impressively high assuming you have bullet damage 6 and laser damage 6 (~35 for bullet vs 64 for laser). mines would be so much better if there was a delay to replacing them. one of the biggest disadvantages to mines is that your bots *immediately* go to replace them which then *very frequently* got the bots killed. there needs to be upfront damage and then the mine needs to not be removed for a few seconds or something, or the mine needs to get triggered and then be an over-time damage effect instead of what they currently are and then at the end of that duration they die after wich ideally most of the attack wave should already be dead. they are otherwise just so impractical in normal Nauvis or Gleba defenses because of how frequently they need to be replaced as well. there however is 1 very good key use for mines and that's against demolishers, especially if you have lots of explosive damage upgrades, up to 6 can easily make mines blow right through even a medium demolisher's health regen. landfill can also be pretty nice on Nauvis if you can take advantage of it in a very particular way, especially now that it can be removed in the base game by making artificial choke points or manipulating biter pathfinding so they attack your base from a different angle, but beyond that landfill doesnt serve much of a defensive purpose. i think that's all i want to say :D

This tier list was clearly made by someone who doesn't play the game

This is like doing rock paper scissor tier list

Putting Flame turrets in C just confirmed to me you don't actually understand anything, running out of oil is fucking impossible, a single oil extractor can handle actual hundreds if not thousands of Flame Turrets, the speed of the enemy does not matter because they will be stuck on your walls burning to death- as well as the fact that biters GROUP up meaning that once it fires at one of them it fires at 40 of them that are still running in. And who cares about its usefulness on Gleba? It is a fucking monster on Nauvis the only planet where you actually need a solid defense. Overall I rate this Video a solid F tier. Also Early Game Mines are more op then fucking walls if you bot rush- so Actually fuck this your Video gets a Double F Rank.

Probably, I wouldn’t try to build your channel by creating videos for a game you’ve never played.

Damn. That's sad.

Flamethrower feels low. It has been the core of most mega defence on navus pre space and still are the strongest turret before you go to space

S - artillery and flame A - tesla B - laser and gun C - rocket D - railgun

never let bro rate again

HAAARD disagree on landmines. they are singlehandedly the most overpowered thing in this game. no, you dont need to pair them with bots and in fact they are probably better without them because bots like to just endlessly place them infront of spitters. im 200 hrs into my current save and my evolution is at .97 which is about as high as you will ever see. i dont have a single wall or turret placed on nauvis. just landmines. yes i do have to spend about 10 minutes running my tank/spider around replacing them with bots....every 6-12 IRL hours. its so ridiculously easy to upkeep. i urge anyone reading this to try it out. just drag rows and rows of them. make the landmines thick and dense. spam them as tightly pack and chaotic as you can. its literally 0 effort needed. also using them without bots does NOT result in the beeping noise because biters dont attack them.

I can't help but feel flame turret in C tier was bait

stone walls cost approx. 4 times as much to cover a given length, while also requiring additional research and decent automation to make enough of them it's especially cheap since a lot of players spend the early game by collecting rocks, which provides a surplus of stone to make a ton of furnace walls with if you're putting turrets in A because of their usefulness in the early game, even though they're basically suckass once biter evolution kicks in, then idk why stone furnaces don't get the same treatment

laser turrets are pretty nice on big ships when destroying small asteroids as they have bad laser resistance and that way you don't need ammo turrets to retarget. If you just set targetting for normal turrets to medium asteroids and laser to small you will save a decent bit of ammo and not use that much power. Furthermore, laser turrets are also handy on space ships on remote locations on the ship where u can't really bring ammo to.

C tier flamethrowers is insane. Am I getting baited.

What about landmines?

Landfill is A tier. You can section off all of your energy infrastructure (or other things) across bodies of water to isolate them completely (on Nauvis?)

Ranking of offenses next (armors, combat bots, guns, vehicles, grenades/capsules, etc)?

Gun turrets with green ammo can kill Demolishers in a split second if you place a bunch of them. Flame turrets carry Nauvis defenses on their own.

flamethrowers are so god damn overpowered, it shloud be in S tier. Also where is locomotive chainsaw? Where are pipes as walls? (ik stupid idea, but i do use pipes as walls in the absolute early-game)

is this ragebait

Few things you missed: - Resource efficiency! Specifically in the early game. Gun turrets consume ammo, which costs resources to make. On higher difficulties, you can even get into a situation where the ammo required to kill a single biter creates more pollution to make than that biter cost to spawn, resulting in a death spiral. Flamethrower turrets, on the other hand, require only a *tiny* amount of oil per shot, and are available much, much sooner than laser turrets. Many Deathworld runs come down to 'can I get oil and flamethrowers working before the bugs kill me?'. - On Gleba, while your primary defenses will be tesla and/or rocket turrets, you still want some gun or laser turrets backing them up. The strafer pentapod's projectile spawns a wriggler when it hits, and having a line of gun or laser turrets to take those out means the tesla and rocket turrets, both of which are rather slow-firing, don't have to waste time doing so. (It's especially important with rocket turrets, which have a minimum range and, if using explosive rockets, will cause friendly fire.) - Land mines have a niche use: biter eggs and pentapod eggs. Both of these spoil into their respective enemy after a certain period. Worse, because all items in a stack share the same spoil timer, if you have a full stack of them spoil, you suddenly have _50_ biters or pentapods spawning at once in the middle of your base! However, if you surround the chest where the eggs are stored with a few land mines, then the moment the enemies spawn, they set off the mines, which do area damage, thus killing them all at once. (The explosion usually also destroys the chest, which is actually a good thing, since destroying a chest destroys all the items in the chest, meaning if you has any additional stacks of eggs in there that were just about to spoil, they are no longer a problem.) - Railguns cannot fire over walls; their projectile will damage anything friend or foe, that's in its path when it fires. This makes them a lot less useful on Nauvis, where walls are standard, but is less of a problem on Gleba, where many enemies can just walk right over walls anyway. - Railguns can be useful on Gleba, where even the smallest stompers have more HP than behemoth biters on Nauvis. - Railguns and artillery are both useful for killing demolishers on Vulcanus. Though technically that's not them being *defenses* but *offenses~*

I always found accumulators to expensive...just was storing steam in tanks instead for power spikes...or you go nuclear.

My defenses late game: 2 row of lasers on nauvis, same + rocket turrets on gleba, same + cannon on spaceship.

... did he just call the flamethrower turret one of the "most unused" turrets? The popularity of flame turrets is so high that it's kinda obnoxious. ... Now I'm wondering if he deliberately put flamethrowers low to drive "engagement". You know, as flame bait.

Good rarity scaling? They only get range. Tech is really good because it upgrades both the turret damage bonus and munitions damage. With the flame turrets you can set target priorities to focus on the range biters first. With the artillery you still need other turrets in the short term, because destroying the bases provokes biter attacks.

No automated train grinders?

Never thought I’d see a Factorio tier list but here we are.

honestly i disagree flamethrower turrets are hare to set up, either way you have to move some kind of ammo and atleast for fluids you dont need inserters

I use the flame turrets on navius and it is able to be spamed on the oilflieds and it is geart for hordes

Other turrets can't shoot things that have a rocket flying at them, if that rocket will kill the thing. So rocket turrets are pretty bad against fast moving targets

Flamethrowers are S tier

"You can use them all based on your playstyle." I see this man has never tried to use laser turrets on Gleba. Not putting flamethrowers in S tier is crazy. It's dramatically easier to run a bunch of pipes for oil than it is to run ammo belts for gun turrets. A single flamethrower and a single layer of wall can deal with most attacks and even behemoth expansion parties. Go watch some Dosh deathworld videos for an example of how flamethrowers are the only turret in the vanilla game capable of handling the higher difficulties. Watch that one Michael Hendriks video where he supplies his entire endgame deathworld base from a single pumpjack, where flamethrowers are his only defense. The oil consumption is negligible, for a turret that can single handedly take care of all of Nauvis, which is 50% of the base defense you need in the game. Deathworld is basically a rush to get flamethrowers as fast as possible. So much so that a 1000x science playthrough I saw was getting close to skipping unlocking splitters to rush flamethrowers even faster. Seriously, they're the best turret on Nauvis by a huge margin. Nothing even comes close for a turret that only needs red/green science and ~50 military science that you can just craft by hand while you're building the rest of your base. As for rating turrets based on their use in space platforms, that's a bit silly. The space platforms don't function like regular base defenses. There's a clear and obvious progression required for space platforms. One a single type of turret can take care of each type of asteroid, so there's not much use in considering the use on space platforms, because it's a lock and key puzzle. Use gun turrets for the small asteroids, or die. Use rockets for the large asteroids, or die. Use railguns for the massive asteroids, or die. There's not really any choice, so rating them just doesn't make sense. If you want to play Space Age, you are forced to use the turrets the developers intended. Which brings a lot more logic to putting railguns at F tier. They're only used on space platforms, and they destroy your own walls and any other turrets in front. Which makes them useless for anything other than killing demolishers or massive asteroids. It probably makes more sense to rate base defense with two separate tier lists, one for Nauvis, and another for Gleba. Based on that, flamethrowers and lasers are high tier on Nauvis, and the rocket turrets and tesla turrets are high tier on Gleba. Seriously though, if you don't think flamethrowers are S tier, just try playing a deathworld game without them. Gun turrets consume way too much iron to deal with the biters, so the pollution from producing ammo can trigger more attacks than you can kill with that ammo. Relying on gun turrets is a slow death spiral. Meanwhile, lasers almost require nuclear before you can sustain base defense with them, because boilers produce a ton of pollution which leads to the same problem as gun turrets, and solar demands room and steel you simply don't have. With just laser shooting speed 3, each laser can consume ~3MW of power just to fire for a second. That's 100k of iron just for enough solar and accumulators to fire a single turret constantly. Plus, the passive power drain of lasers creates a ton of pollution surprisingly quickly. You're looking at trying to kill waves of big biters with regular gun turrets before you can get nuclear set up to power your lasers. Good luck. Lasers are substantially more expensive at a critical time during biter evolution. Flamethrowers are the back of any good Nauvis standing defense. If you don't think so, you haven't been playing on higher difficulties that show the weakness of the other turrets. With even just a small bit more difficulty, flamethrowers quickly come out on top as the most powerful turret on Nauvis. And if you're not playing on higher difficulties, then base defense on Nauvis barely matters, because the biters aren't a serious threat.

Flamethrower on Nauvis is easily the strongest turret.

interesting, on my Gleba planets I exclusively use gun turrets with red ammo + bots and 2 of those planets are quite big, though not megabase yet, around 40k~ fruits a min. You just have to make sure there are enough gun Turrets in one spot to shred stompers as they are in my opinion the only threat on Gleba actually. Oh on my most recent Gleba planet I just made a Roboport grid that extended quite a bit beyond my spore coverage at max production as Gleba Enemies won't attack it, it's kinda funny seeing Roboports hugging large rafts and the enemies just chilling next to them as the bots expand :P. after cleaning up the rafts inside the Robo area I am done with the defence for Gleba, as Pentapots can't expand into Robo covered land :)

Wuh flamethrowers are ss tier, Death world are near impossible without them

Omg that last tip!!! Landfill on Gleba! Thank you so much you're gonna save me a ton of work.