I resonate with the comment because they said they put years of work into drawing before they gave up, I too spent years drawing every day before seeing my drawings from year 3 look practically the same to day 3, I had no improvement whatsoever despite my best efforts, despite searching and learning and practicing every advice from my favorite artists Then you immediately say that you think people who express they want to learn aren't putting in the effort? The comment was right, people who say drawing is a skill are already talented

video games are not the same sadly it takes zero skill or real learning to play a video game. drawing is a Skill that's hard to learn and even harder to master. video games have tutorials that give you all the info you need without you ever having to learn or figure out anything for yourself. Art is the complete opposite. Because you have to learn the skill through trail and error by yourself most of the time. There is no instruction manual for art. There are books that can give you info on how they mastered art, but wheter or not you use that info is upp to you. Video games spell everything out for you while'st art is all trail and error. I remember (dont remember who said it) but he said "video games are bad for you because you dont grow as a person because they dont really teach you anything". And from my years of playin video games i can easily say that thats 100% true. Its rare that a video game gives me anything that i can apply to the real world or even teach me anything of value that can help others or myself be a better person.

if you dont mind me asking what are your end goals in art(full time living,mastery)

Why are you not getting better? Talent my friend. You dont have it. And thats that. End of story. No practise wont do shit if you dont have the brain chemistry to understand art. Why do you think pewdiepie, DDmark and lots of beginner arts just RUSH past you in a few days while you take a whole year to even understand the most basic of basics. In born talent and afinity for the arts. Most of us just dont have it and thats what alot of Art schools bank upon. That your dumb ass will join an expensive art school because some talented guy or gal told you that "anyone can draw with practise" and you go "OH wow" and your off to the slaughter house to fail whilest the talented once move on to become the next marc burnet, yusuke murata and so on. Sry but this is the truth. Also its allways the fast learner that tells people to "enjoy the process" Why do you think that is? Because they didnt have to go through years of failiure to reach the lvl they wanted.

lmao no way

Hi Vincent. Hope your doing good. I just started my Art journey with the Proko figure course but I also want to start the Draw a box course. I have limited time so wanted to asked you how you distributed your time between these courses. Thank you.

250 seems over kill, I would say 100 and then just drawing 2 cylinders each day as a warm up makes more sense. you have to draw cylinders in construction phase anyway. very cool review. I finished the box challenge in 1 month and it was heavy.

You are a genuine, good man. An endangered species of human being, about to get extinct.

Just stumbled across your videos and really enjoying your style - I'm also just starting out with learning to draw (seriously, I'm still terrible but it's been really good for my mind!) and finding people like yourself to learn a thing or two from is awesome.

Nice man.

i want tom fox’s book so bad

Plase make a video for wide lense too 😭

Great explanation thanks!

Question: What are the maximum amount of number of details you can put in a picture? Answer: A one to one copy, i.e. a photo copy of the scenario. Questions: is a photo of a scenario telling a specific story? Answer: it depends on how the photo was taken. Point is: there exists no positive correlation between number of details and the story told. However, there exist a a negative correlation between the number of details and the story told. I.e. to tell a specific story you want to reduce, not increase, the number of details in a scenario. That art of drawing is to find those details that conveys the story you want to tell....

Rather than to say "drawing from imagination" I think it might be better to call it "drawing from memory". This help us reminds of that a) you need to practice to improve your visual memory, b) it's not about talent, but a trained skill.

Yes you can become who you think you could be. You have already demonstrated some impressive solid drawing skill. Your problem is that you have knowledge gaps in your constructive drawing skills. You need to fill in these gaps in order to progress, and this video shows you are struggling with understanding what those skills are. According to how constructive drawing is taught in art schools, you are learning things in the incorrect order, an order required to master and further develop drawing skills. As long these knowledge gaps remains you will get the feeling you are not capable of progressing. E.g. One such basic skill is how to draw boxes, cylinders etc and freely rotate them in 3D space. However this is a primordial skill which is assumed to be known before you learn other stuff e.g. human anatomy and how to deconstruct it). However, you went straight to the "fun part" and skipped the basic. This has consequences, unwanted such. In doing so, you have not taught yourself the proper skill on how to visualize the body but merely a bunch of anatomical details. Then as you started to discover, you also need to learn how to deconstruct the body in order to rotate it in space because, unless you are a savant, there is a limit onto how many details the human mind can keep track on at the same time and thus be able to rotate in space. To rotate a few simple form in the mind is a possible task and then pick one of these forms and then recall the details of that form is also possible to do. This is a well defined and precise task which can be taught and learned to anyone. capable of learning However, you did not do this. You did not know how to rotate boxes and cylinders in space before you taught yourself anatomy and because of this all you actually learned in the human anatomy course was not to draw a human without a reference but a bunch of details about the human body, and then trying to rotate all those details in your head and confidently draw them is an almost impossible task and would require some kind of savant skill or magic, i.e. talent. Therefore, lacking the LEARNED SET OF SKILL doing a mental rotation result in your "chicken scratching". However, once you know how to deconstruct the human body into its simpler forms, rotate those form in your mind and then fill in the anatomical details afterwards you will be able to actually draw confidently without a reference. But not until then. This is not magic that clicks after "a lot of time" time spend drawing, nor does it require talent, it is a learnt set of skills. Yes, we do learn at different rates and unless you have learning difficulties preventing you from learning certain skills eventually with methodical and structured learning everyone can get to the same level. So the good news is; talent is not required to become a master artist. And as you discovered yourself in your previous videos, drawing a human body in any position with no reference but memory only is a LEARNT SET OF skill. A person that knows how to draw is doing so by rotating simplistic forms in the mind and then fill in more and more details on the form as you focus in onto a single part of the body. I.e it break sup an impossible task into few manageable simpler task, What kind of details that goes with each form is learnt knowledge recalled from memory, i.e a learned skill . This is how and why someone who can draw confidently can draw anything in one single stroke And this is why uncomfortable from "draw a box" says that they don't use hatching in his course for shading because,as Uncomfortable said, "hatching is just another way of saying "I don't know what goes into this space"". I.e. you don't learn anything from a blob of nothing. In conclusion, drawing is not a talent but a learnt skill including building up a visual memory of how things looks like. These learned skill takes many years to memorize by studding. However, in order to draw them, one thing must be known before the others can be applied. E.g. I believe you now have developed a better sense and understanding of why tedious rotating boxes and cylinders in 3d space is a more basic, but important necessary skills, to master before you get into anatomy and how this affect your abilities to draw the human body without any reference but straight form memory. And as you noticed, the combined skill also allows you to be more productive and creative, i.e. you have become more skilled in your drawing. Once you know how to rotate forms and deconstruct complex form into simpler, the rest is just about learning and memorize forms and their textures. Learning about colour and light theory theory is learning physics, anatomy is learning biology, urban sketching is learning architecture etc etc. It is very hard work, but at no step is any talent needed to learn any of these things. However, by taking the learning path you have, you first learnt to copy details and like you experienced, trying to rotate all those detail from memory is and will be an impossible task for the majority of us and this is why you previously have been struggling with drawing without a reference; i.e. you have not learnt things in the incorrect order and in doing so you lacked the ability to achieve a certain things without really knowing why that is. Being self-taught your drawing skills has become a mix of that of an expert and a first year student at children art school. Maybe by drawing more you may fill in the gaps by luck or coincident. However, to explain any other further progress requiring some kind of unspecified talent of some sort, i.e. you can only progress due to magic, wont help you progress - it will just hinder your further development. In summary, unless you fill in the knowledge gaps you wont be able to progress and become what you think you could be. I am not sure you have the motivation/time/resources to do all the hard work and years of study and education to become a master, but just want to jump into drawing what you find is fun to do, and that is fine, but please don't think of yourself as not being capable to progress or reach a master level, because you can if you dedicate yourself to it. My hope is that this inspired you, and others, to progress further in your development.

your work looks so good!

Right. Most quit too late, after wasting years on this useless thing.

We must manifest more "fuck it we ball"

I can relate. Working as a software engineer i have some colleagues with 10+ years experience who can do magical things and think so far beyond what we're currently doing. Their code resembles visual artwork to me, making it appear effortless and far less complex than it truly is

Every one else is just naturally talented at art

Hi Vincent, spot on with finding books that gel with you! You thought Tom Fox’s book was great while I disliked it. And you didn’t like Bridgman, while I thought it was fantastic 😆

Hey Vincent, do you have a social media account or Discord? Would love to follow you if you do. It's kind of hard to share/keep track of one's art journey together on YT.

I basically came to the same conclusion in my art training as your tips here. 👌

Genius discovery my friend! Another thing I found was a video by ModerndayJames. He discusses how to draw the correct right angles when rotating cubes from any perspective (even wide angles). It’s basically using an ellipse as a clock face and the right angles would be 3 hours apart if a clock was seen from that angle.

thank youuu!!!! i was hating this so much

i think that the burnout is related with expectations and also if you are doing art for doing art, or if you have any second intentio with it. I think that what really separe an artist from a non-artist is doing it for the sake of doing it. I heard this from a music buddy all the time, and he, is a truly musician. As an example i can get my self, i am not an artist, i am not a musician, neither a programmer, 3D guy, but i use all this things to do a game, and this game has second intentios with it, so i also not really consider my self a game dev. The thing that is my true thing is praying, making studys of the Bible, doing some starving, do some social work, see god in everywhere, all this things i do for genuine pleasure, and if you are an artist you will habe this same genuine pleasure with art.

I only enjoy playing video games when I'm good at playing them. That's why I stopped playing them.

It’s still a process my friend I think you’re doing great 😊

Just i needed to hear. Thank you so much 🙏

Great Exercise!

Highly recommend "Figure drawing for artists by Steve Huston", one of a few book that gives exercises between topics and "Force: Dynamic life drawing by Mike Mattesi" with a really good approach

Give away ❤ i really want it 😔

First off, I learned a lot from this video, but I have my... thoughts. Draw like Kim Jung Gi... that depends on what you want from your drawings. I'm a writer first, but I also wanna learn to draw because I wanna draw comics of my stories, maybe try my hand at some animation. Sure, if I could do it in one go like Kim, I might be slightly(or significantly) faster, but that isn't really necessary for my goal. I respect what Kim Jung Gi did. Each time I see a video of him free handing a figure with perfect accuracy, I'm blown away. I'm impressed by his work process, but I'm not a fan of his drawings. They're not a style I personally like. So although I also want to be as fast and fluid as him, I never thought of trying to be like him. And I don't think anyone should try to be like somebody else. Just try being yourself. Sure, you might like the style or process of someone else and follow it, but, in my opinion, should always try to make it your own. At the end of the day though, what matters is your end goal. What are you trying to do with your drawings. Do you just wanna sketch away? Do you wanna make a game? Do you wanna draw a comics or animation? Different goals have different processes, different paths to reach the goal. For me, even if I use searching lines, make a bit of a mess, can't really do freehand perspective, need to use reference for a scene I'm trying to construct, I can live with that. Sure, I'll do my best to improve myself, but at the end of the day, for me, the finished drawing is much more important than the process, however enjoyable or frustrating it might be.

Aw man, so you're saying even if I practice drawing a straight line a thousand times every day for a year I still won't be able to draw a straight line if I lack talent? My disappointment is immeasurable and my day is ruined. This is my problem with these 'it's all talent' folks. They found continuing hard to continue and gave up, that's fine. Sometimes some things in life just don't work out cause living is hard and it ain't just about one thing. But whenever they start spouting things like 'you can't draw unless you're talented', they seriously discourage people who are trying. Sure, I accept talent is a thing. The top 1% people who really make it big through art or something. Some people have that intuitive sense of color, or they can visualize a perfect image where I see all black inside my head, but do we know when(how early) they started on their art journey? How they were taught? What kind of experiences they went through? How many piles of sketchbook they left behind in their journey to get to where they are? Cause more often than not, all of those things culminate to create the 'talent' they show off. Sam does art, Kim Jung Gi, they all started way earlier, maybe not different from most of us, but the difference is they continued to pursue art where we gave up at some point, for various reasons. Then you pick up a pencil in your later years, follow some shit tutorials from tiktok that have no substance, scratch a few lines for a few months or so, then give up when you see no visible improvement and whine about talent and whatnot and spread your bitterness to the others who also started late yet are willing to give it a shot, despite how hard it is sometimes. As long as you have enough sense to understand why 1+1 makes 2, you should have enough sense to draw an accurate box. And if you can do that, you can also do spheres, cones, pyramids, all the tools you need to construct an image if you lack the intuition but really want to. There's color theory for people who can't color intuitively, there's composition charts for people who lack that sense. Everything's learnable these days. Yeah, the issue of practice and skill is a big issue, and you might never get in the top 1%, but who says you have to? Even if your drawings are shitty, you can still draw something, create a crappy comics or a shit animation. Sure, it won't look as good or professional, but you can do it if you really want to. Unlike some people who'd been genuinely dealt a bad hand, like being blind, or lacking limbs, or proper mental faculty. They just can't do the things we can even if they really want to. If you are one of those people, then sure, complain about talent all you want. You're justified. Otherwise, you gave up cause it didn't work out, and that's fine. But since I don't think you necessarily need to be very very good to draw, I don't think it's a matter of talent, but willingness. You wanna whine, that's fine. After all, we all feel that way sometimes. But keep any absolutism out of it cause otherwise you're just poisoning others.

I needed this. Im having a hard time finding structure. I dont really master anything, i just stay in a weak/mediocre zone and take all the shortcuts to make it faster. I guess putting out content gets in the way. Also afraid because i have no idea i can make it as an artist, even if just a part time gig. But i need to practice and force myself to stay in practice mode for more than 20 minutes. Of course childhood trauma doesnt help when its time for that PTSD in form of fear and procrastination kicks in. I guess i´ll try again and again in hopes eventually i get it right. Thank you for sharing this video.

Then I guess I'll die a failure

TALENT is something people are born with, like HEREDITARY. It runs in the BLOOD, like sudden boost of urgency of making things BETTER than the other. Like SKILLS are can be taught but it depends on the person if his/her interested on what are they doing. Watch "BLUE PERIOD" anime, you'll see what I'm talkin' about. 😊

A Sakura pen I see? 😏 Good taste.

Man you really inspire me to keep practicing. I having trying for years buy everytime I feel like I just can't, I want to be better I want to put in paper the thing in my mind but I just can't. I start to Practice draw again this Sunday so I wish I don't drop it again. See how you get better and better helps me a lot. Keep going! (Sorry if I say something wrong, my English is not that good)

I love the video game analogy, just what i needed to hear. Your videos are awesome, keep up the good work!

This is a very good video. Very thought provoking. You're absolutely correct. Becoming the best should not be your goal as an artist. If you like to draw, just draw. Obviously, people are going to have different goals which then affects the information they share. Which means not every art tip [especially from the very small elite artists] is going to be in line with what you want to do. And if that is the case, just move on. So for us in the middle, we draw simply because we enjoy doing it often.😀

I know I don’t practice as much as I should. I probably spend more time watching tutorials than drawing. It’s a bad character trait. Keep up the good work. Loving your videos.

I think that learning english, drawing, programming or even how to talk to other person is a skill for me and as much you do and think about it as much you get better, i really think thats not a talent

you are my hero!! 💪

Art is about putting in the time the people that you see that improve a lot in the course of a year. Some of those people are like drawing like 8 hours a day. If you're just like doing a couple sketches and only drawing like maybe 30 minutes a day, you're not going to improve very fast. There's a KZbinr and twitch streamer kaycem. He quit his programming job and basically in about 2 years got into the animation industry. He use to draw but he quit for a long time. Then he got his skills up to a professional level in a 2 years and he was drawing like 8 to 12 hours a day in order to do that. Also a lot of people don't know how to learn properly. They waste their time on a lot of bad tutorials online. They would learn way faster if they like. Bought a couple of good drawing courses if they could afford it. Because those have a curriculum, you know exactly what you have to practice and you don't have to figure it out. If you're just like practicing like random stuff everyday, you're not really going to learn anything. You have to set up your own art curriculum if you're not going to pay for a course where you practice like one specific thing for 3 weeks at a time and then switch to a new thing.

So, that's a lot to unpack. I'll take an easier approach to those questions of skill, talent, motivation, progress and enjoyment and just offer a little tip for those time when you feel like you are not moving forward. When you feel stuck, pick one simple skill, and try and make it better in your next piece. Just focus on making that one thing better than before, nothing more. In the next watercolour I paint, I'll try and render the hair better than in the last portrait I did. That's it, nothing more. I'm not saying that it will be perfect, just a bit better than what I used to make. That's something I can manage. When I'm finished with it, I'll be just a little better as an artist, my skillset will be just a little more complete. It's just one step forward, but it can't be taken away. And the satisfaction I get from it will be real, I'll have something to be proud of. I'll have put some effort in improving that skill, and it will pay off. Now, I'll say that I have no intention of becoming a professional. Art is a hobby for me and I can afford to just enjoy it for its own sake. Enjoy the journey.

how do i draw a goose :(

It's funny, your speech cadence sounds just like Proko in this video. It's clear that you've spent a lot of time listening to him talking haha. Probably since you just spent 6 months on the course leading up to this video

Sounds like your burned out with skill development. That's why Uncomfortable from DrawABox recommends the 50% rule. I ignored this completely and now I see why this is there after I paused drawing skill development for a while (still did drills everyday to maintain hand-eye coordination plus straight line and ellipse drawing skills). I did finish 1-7 drawabox, but still stuggle to draw. Loomis Fun With Pencil has made everything fun. My rotation intuition is being built and my construction is getting better very quickly drawing the caricatures. It is carrying over to non human-caricatures as well. The intuition is starting to develop with that book. Have you gone through any of Loomis books? I still don't follow the 50% rule because I can't draw what I like yet, which happens to more cartoonish caricature-like entities shown in the Loomis books. But after that, I will probably start forcing myself to draw for fun to avoid burn out. Thanks for sharing your experience with your drawing journey. It helped me start drawabox about a year ago. Once I saw that a newbie was able to draw as well as you have been able to , it made the jump much easier.