084: Borge Fagerli - Myo-reps for efficient muscle growth

[@ReviveStronger]

Time Stamps: 08:16 Borge Fagerli explains how myo-reps came to be & a summary of the method 16:05 Borge Fagerli's myo-rep method summarised in practical terms 18:10 Borge Fagerli explains the difference between myo-reps and Blood Flow Restriction training 24:25 Borge Fagerli defines junk volume 34:30 Borge Fagerli touches on why he doesn't overreach his clients 38:38 Borge Fagerli reveals the number of hard sets you might want to do in a week 40:36 Borge Fagerli tracks the following markers to find what is optimal for his clients

[@ssdabel]

great one, props to you for bringing someone on who swears by different methods that are generally advocated on your channel and daring to actually dive into it!

[@ReviveStronger]

Glad you liked it Abel! Really means a lot and yes, I do agree, different opinions are the one challenging your way of thinking! ;)

[@Panda395]

Myo reps on lateral raises is the ideal way to train em love it

[@ReviveStronger]

Hell yeah, one of the exercises where I implement it as well!

[@Panda395]

Revive Stronger awesomevand hell of a pump

[@GlacialScion]

Help. I can't lift my arms.

[@chendadon7168]

Great one! Get more of him..

[@ReviveStronger]

Thanks mate. We definitely will!

[@Panda395]

And what i learned from this today: you can do reverse pyramid and go all out in 3 sets or do 4+ moderate sets and achieve the same stimulus, again everything comes to personal preference and periodisation, great interview!

[@ReviveStronger]

Absolutely agree! There's no one perfect way

[@gamerchristina1079]

I LOVE this episode 🙏🙏🙏🙏

[@ReviveStronger]

Thanks Christina! - Pascal

[@seanwilson281]

Fantastic delve into this very effective technique

[@ReviveStronger]

Glad you think so, thanks for watching! - Coach Jess

[@richardtrass]

That was excellent!! Get to hear from sometime with some different ideas.

[@ReviveStronger]

Thank you so much! - Coach Jess

[@reinerheiner1148]

Here is why I think myo reps have potential especially for higher rep sets: With high reps between 15-30, you get lots of metabolic stress. But thats both positive and negative. Positive because of the possible anabolic stimulus, but also negative because the chance that the muscle stops working because of metabolic buildup instead because of a lack of more ready to go muscle fibers. So basically, the chance of a metabolic muscle failure is mich higher. Now of you tske a break, the metabolic end product buildup can be transported away from the muscle, and now additional muscle fibers, that were unable to work because of the metabolic stress can now be recruited. The end product is a set with both high metabolic stress and high muscle fiber activation, with low risk for injury because of the low loads. Add to that, that fiber activation might even be higher than in a traditional set, because short rests also let some muscle fibers recover. Which would not be the case with a normal set. I have a hunch that because of that high rep myo sets are much better then normal high rep sets for hypertrophy.

[@turnippatrol4607]

A lot of his ideas fly in the face of the concepts Dr. Israetel presents. These low volume/high intensity protocols have gotten me into trouble in the past. It's one thing to avoid excessive 'junk' volume, but it's quite another to train so low in volume that you are not even reaching your minimum effective volume. As Israetel has stated before, sets above 60% intensity are never junk volume, so long as they are not causing you to exceed your MRV

[@turnippatrol4607]

To expand on this and be fair to the guest, his Myo-reps system is not high intensity as he described it as 40-60% intensities. But this concept of effective reps seems to suggest that the only way to generate high muscle fiber recruitment is through proximity to failure. Muscle fibers are also recruited based upon force requirements. So incorporating paused reps wherein you focus on generating high concentric forces would also lead to high fiber recruitment, but without the proximity to failure.

[@ssdabel]

I would still add that Borge's general methods (besides Myo-reps, even) don't advocate high intensity low volume trianing - he is just for lower/more moderate volume in general. As for Mike saying that 60% or more intensities are 'never' junk volume, I don't think he said quite that. You can definitely get to the junk volume territory at any intensities - i.e. at some point you're not eeking out more/better adaptation, you're just simply doing more volume and digging yourself into a bigger and bigger recovery hole.

[@turnippatrol4607]

In a podcast with Steve on this channel Mike discussed junk volume extensively within the context of an effective training stimulus: kzbin.info/www/bejne/mavZh2yGesSkaqM

[@ssdabel]

unfortunately I'm big enough of a nerd that I knew right away which episode you're talking about, but I believe what he says there is that if you do so much volume that you need to lift very light loads to even do enough reps that you would normally do with 60+%, then that's definitely not effective. that doesn't mean though that you can't get to the junk volume territory at any intensity - 60%+, 70%+, 80%+. I guess the only difference is that it's not 'just' junk volume at that point, it will probably put you in a serious state of underrecovery at some point, or it may even get you hurt .

[@turnippatrol4607]

I'm unclear as to what your interpretation of junk volume is. If you are claiming that doing excessive volume that is not recoverable is 'junk volume', then I would agree with you. But in what OTHER situations would those 60-80% intensities ever be junk volume?

[@gokukakarot6323]

So @mountaindog1 training principle has been right all along .. 😁

[@GeorgeLocke]

Repeat after me: Burr+guh. Burr+guh. Not byorg. Love the show!!

[@ReviveStronger]

I have to admit, I myself mispronounced his name due to I speak Danish and I only assumed that his name was Burrhua - Coach Pascal

[@GeorgeLocke]

Yeah, Danish and Norwegian look similar on paper, but, woah, Danish is bizarre. (One of my favorite examples is how to pronounce Strøget, a big shopping street in Copenhagen. It's like, start saying "strong" but dry heave a little before you finish.) I'm friends with a married couple where he's Danish and she's Norwegian, and the way he says her name is completely different from how she says it...

[@shaunhamer307]

Different perspective but I'm struggling to see a massive reinvention of the wheel between this and Dante Trudel's stuff from a number of years ago.

[@ReviveStronger]

Ouw, would you mind directing me to something from Dante? Haven't looked into his stuff

[@milktruckcopilot]

Revive Stronger A year late but look up Doggcrapp training lol. That's the name Dante goes by .

[@mascherock2040]

@revivestronger How do you recommend implementing the "Progressive Overload" concept over time for hypertrophy training with myo reps?

[@ReviveStronger]

I'd only implement Myo-Reps for a short time, such as one meso cycle and then via sets. - Coach Pascal

[@cussyrichards6121]

So, doing the 15 rep set, then the rest, then 5 reps, then rest, then another 5 reps...etc...until you can't go on - that's counted as ONE myo-rep set, isn't it? So how many of these myo-rep sets are you meant to do on each exercise?

[@ReviveStronger]

Exactly!! Until you're about 1 reps from failure or can't perform another set with the given rep ranges

[@soofitnsexy]

dogcrapp baby

[@celineschneider1672]

very good episode, I really liked that one! However, I have one question directed to Borge: you said that in your opinion it doesn't make sense to overreach because the body immediately adapts to stimuli (hours to a few days as opposed to a week(s)), but how would you then for example explain the positive effects of tapering for powerlifters right before a meet? because the really strong powerlifters sometimes start tapering already ~2 weeks prior to the meet...

[@ReviveStronger]

Not Borge here but tapering isn't the adaptative effect but a manipulation of the fitness/fatigue system. Fatigue drops quicker than fitness so when planned intelligently, in theory, you should be able to perform your best.

[@davidbakker3]

Post training of course

[@ReviveStronger]

:'D God, I'm honestly, just waiting for this comment, hahaha

[@raffaelecorrente1123]

Maybe I'm missing something. Borge suggest something between 9 and 18 sets per week. But how many session for muscle group? In past, borge suggest high frequency. Is he always supporting high frequency? Does he person training 18 sets having more volume per session or more sessions per week?

[@ReviveStronger]

I think he's still an advocate of high frequency training but unfortunately I can't fully answer that question.

[@Tom_North]

Great video man! A couple of questions if that’s alright, Can you use myo-reps along with straight sets? For example, if you do 4 straight sets of leg press can you make the last set or last two sets a myo-rep set? Also, if you were just doing myoreps separately, how many sets would you do? I hope that makes sense!

[@ReviveStronger]

You can do more than one intro set for sure, but I wouldn't use too many of them if you still want to be able to do the myoreps sets after! As for the myoreps separately, not too sure what you mean? Myoreps usually go intro set, breather then AMRAP to RIR and repeat the minisets! - Coach Jess

[@jacobm7026]

@@ReviveStronger I think he meant that in the interview Borge suggests 9-18 total sets per bodypart per week as the optimal range. The commenter was counting 1 "myo rep set" as follows: straight set + 3-5 myo reps + 3-5 myo reps + 3-5 myo reps. Then asked if he were only to do those "myo rep sets," what is the optimal number of those sets

[@mdd1963]

I did myoreps for curls today, hitting failure at 17 reps, but 15-18 seconds later, could only do an additional 4 reps, and, short break, and then only 3 reps. Shut it down there, as first time for my myorep curls.

[@77dris]

So, do you count each myo rep set as 1 set toward your total weekly volume? I've been combining myo reps with BFR for months now and like it a lot as part of 3 full body workouts per week. So I will do say 20 sets, 5,5,5,5... is that 5 total sets?

[@ReviveStronger]

I would count myo reps and every other intensity technique differently towards the volume landmarks. - Pascal

[@andyandy2684]

Regarding legs. Would 9 - 18 sets per week be for quads and hamstrings combined? Or should it be treated as separate? Thanks.

[@ReviveStronger]

Most likely separately. Same principles apply to back and chest. While there might be some crossover going on, targeting them specifically is a different story. - Coach Pascal

[@andyandy2684]

Cool thanks for the info. Btw...LOVE your channel.

[@workoutunleashed]

@revivestronger How would myo-reps work amongst your daily workout? Would you still look for traditional mechanical stress training then add metabolic stress training at the end or within the traditional set/exercises? Your thoughts?

[@ReviveStronger]

I would only implement them every now and then as a method for metabolite work. Myo-reps can be mentally draining and of course, leave you pretty crippled :) So, perhaps only for a meso cycle and only for some exercises at the end of a workout.

[@workoutunleashed]

Revive Stronger That's how I have generally used metabolite training with my clients, plus I find your body adapts very quickly to this type of training.

[@ReviveStronger]

Yes, I've seen the same things!

[@chadwtf2473]

1 myo rep set is equal to how many straight classic set?

[@ReviveStronger]

It depends a bit on how many activation repetitions you're doing with followed "down-sets"

[@chadwtf2473]

Revive Stronger so for example.. 15 reps activation And aftet this 4-4-4-4-4 myo reps.. Is likely 3-4 straight set?

[@soofitnsexy]

@@chadwtf2473 yes but dont look at it that way! the body does not...!!its one huge amazing set...dogcrapp style training

[@mdd1963]

I will give this approach a try on bench presses with 60-70% of 1RM…. (Also mixing in the 3-7 method as well; done quite quickly!)

[@gamerchristina1079]

💪💪❤️❤️‼️

[@ReviveStronger]

Thank you! - Coach Jess

[@mikeanthony8699]

Can you explain more about metabolic stress not creating hypertrophy itself but rather it increases mechanical tension? When I read schoenfelds work I thought metabolic stress itself caused hypertrophy

[@ReviveStronger]

Right now, it is unclear to what extent metabolic stress causes hypertrophy or if it even plays a role in it at all. However, at the current time, I like to think it does and go with Brad's 3 model system

[@tommcgivern8020]

Two guys in dark rooms.. together live

[@copernicus99]

Because myo-reps/rest-pause training involves short rest intervals, and short rest intervals blunt hypertrophy (as shown in a number of studies now, e.g., below) I am having second thoughts that this style of training is going to be beneficial rather than detrimental for muscle growth. Short inter-set rest blunts resistance exercise-induced increases in myofibrillar protein synthesis and intracellular signalling in young males.McKendry J, Pérez-López A, McLeod M, Luo D, Dent JR, Smeuninx B, Yu J, Taylor AE, Philp A, Breen L.Exp Physiol. 2016 Jul 1;101(7):866-82. doi: 10.1113/EP085647.Longer Interset Rest Periods Enhance Muscle Strength and Hypertrophy in Resistance-Trained Men.Schoenfeld BJ, Pope ZK, Benik FM, Hester GM, Sellers J, Nooner JL, Schnaiter JA, Bond-Williams KE, Carter AS, Ross CL, Just BL, Henselmans M, Krieger JW.J Strength Cond Res. 2016 Jul;30(7):1805-12.

[@soofitnsexy]

BULLSHIT...have you yourself experienced your "hypertrophy" blunted??? I have been training with short rest interval DC stylr training for years,,,The exact opposite is true....You see short rest intervals when applied correctly such as what Borge is advocating and many many others puts an incredible demand on the muscle therefore it must grow and quickly! The key for naturals such as myself is RECOVERY!! It wipes you out!:) Hows it going for you? your personal experiences?

[@reinerheiner1148]

You confuse the pause between sets with the pause within supsets of one set. See, if you do traditional sets and you have a too short pause, your muscle fibers will not have recovered enough, therefore you cannot activate them in that new set, and subsequently without activation no tension so no hypertrophic stimulus. For those muscle fibers. Now with myoreps, especially for higher rep / lighter weight sets, you go near failure, you just take a short break, then again a few reps, then another break, and again a few reps. This way you are able to recruit more fibers overall for that myo set than for a normal set. Now, after that myo rep set, you should absolutely apply the fact that longer rest means more regenerated muscle fibers, so that you can activate as many muscle fibers as possible in your next set. But that set then again can be a myo rep set. Don't confuse intra set rest vs rest between two sets.

[@copernicus99]

@@reinerheiner1148 Thanks for your thoughts. So basically you are saying that the crucial difference between traditional sets with myo sets is in the temporal distribution of the rest intervals- with traditional sets having uniform rest intervals while myo sets have a non-uniform distribution. Is that correct? What does the current research say regarding the superiority of myo sets over traditional sets for muscle hypertrophy?

[@tionamos9402]

Dam, that background noise is very disconcerting .