10EE part 24

[@BillyHardcase]

This new angle cleares up a lot and also leaves a lot of new questions.. Could the rattle come from inside the machine head? maybe behind the top left gear perhaps. I had to go back and watch the number 22 video again. I also noticed the sparkel in the contact point up under in the front of the machine. I believe this is from a defect capacitor. When the contact point starts to throw out sparks like that the capacitor in front of this contact point is dead. You can probably find th closest one to the contact on a diagram. That's the first one to direct your attention too. They are easy to replace and not too expensive. also (and this is important) after changing the capacitor the contact it self must be cleaned. the sparks will cause build up on the contact surface and over time cause the contact to fail to make contact. The build up does not allow current to flow. if it makes a spark after as long as the spark is small and blue you are good. when the spark is yellow or orange it is burning the contact point. I know this from fixing the old traditional tattoo machines. the color of the spark is just as important as the color of the exhaust smoke on a car. except if the smoke from the car is blue you are in trouble.

[@fourpondsshop7940]

Thanks Lars, Great point on the bad cap...didn't think to check that. I will and provide an update...Thanks!!

[@robineanes1489]

What I hear going back several posts is gear rattle which I think is normal with age and the fact to its having hardened straight cut spur gears with no load similar to Chevy (rock crusher) transmission gears . These gears don't get much oil splash from secondary transmission which is normal , some are louder than others (luck of the draw) I use Hi-Tach brand oil additive from auto store (similar to STP) straight out of the bottle for the past 30+ years on open lathe gears with good success to quieten them down (it's some what sticky and clings to the gears unlike grease). I added some to the secondary transmission oil to my 10EE and other lathes which quieten them all down with out adding too much heat friction to transmission. Most of the time these gears when engaged for threading don't run fast anyway . Hope this helps !

[@fourpondsshop7940]

Thanks Robin, great info and suggestions!

[@bid6413]

No words of advice at the moment. I’ll see I can measure the backlash in my gear train, maybe tomorrow. It’s a machine, it can be fixed. Call the tech at Monarch. I’ll bet they’ll take a few minutes to help if they can. Cheers, Will

[@fourpondsshop7940]

Thanks Will, I'll give Monarch a shout. They're usually very helpful

[@diondecker9895]

I havent finished the series and im a couple of years late, but if it quiets down holding the handwheel, it may quiet down while cutting threads.

[@fourpondsshop7940]

Thanks for checking the videos out!

[@acme4786]

Would Blue Moly be a consideration since the gears are slow moving? You mentioned that those top gears get some oil sling from the bottom, thus not sure how compatible the Blue Moly would be mixing with your oil. Just thinking that the suspended Moly particles may help fill in the voids between where the gears mesh.

[@fourpondsshop7940]

That's a thought...I'm pretty sure I'm going to try some grease before I tear things apart

[@MrJimhayes1]

If you happen to have access to a strobe light put a mark on each gear then dial in the strobe light until that gear becomes stationary listen for the sound defect . as all the gears will turn out different RPMs it will become obvious when the noise and the strobe becomes one then as one of your other viewers suggested try swapping the gear with your other machine to see if it helps resolve your problem good luck

[@fourpondsshop7940]

That's a pretty cleaver way to isolate the problem. I do have a strobe, I'll give it a go when I get back to my shop...thanks!

[@NJTLove]

Did you record any video of the machine running pre the refurb? Could listen to that to check if the noise is at least the same as last time and that you've not tweaked anything in the reassemble. Already looks incredible and hope you get it sorted to where you're happy with it

[@fourpondsshop7940]

Hi Neil, I did but it was very short and only while in open belt, not the threading gears. I'll certainly do that if I have the chance to pick up another lathe!

[@glennstasse5698]

I wonder if the noise is cumulative such that the backlash at each point contributes some fraction of the total. If that is so, replacing only one part will eliminate only that part’s contribution. Ugh! Is it possible the teeth are just worn from use therefore noisy in operation since the face of one tooth slaps into its mate rather then rolls into it like a new, full sized tooth would? Short of bad bearings, what else is there? All that implies new gears or noise canceling headphones! (I hope not.)

[@fourpondsshop7940]

Ha, I like the noise canceling headset suggestion!!

[@Randallvgc]

I believe that you adjust the 127 tooth gear and it will take out the slack of the other two top gears.

[@fourpondsshop7940]

hmmm..I'll give that a try, thanks

[@gregnilsen5851]

Can you add any drag in the gears by adjusting the clamp load on the shafts the gears run on? Maybe a fiber washer? If you do that to one gear it might preload the teeth to one side and not rattle

[@fourpondsshop7940]

Thanks Greg, great suggestion! I think there might be a fiber washer in the lead screw end where the ELSR switches are so that might be a candidate

[@pauldepilotpaul]

What do you think about some grease on the gears?

[@fourpondsshop7940]

Hi Paul, That might be a good idea as it seems those gears generally run at slower speeds. They do get lubricated by the lower gears picking up oil from the lower gearcase.

[@waltsmith8416]

Did you have any issues aligning the tailstock to the head? I did a lesser rebuild on a 1954 10EE and discovered a 0.02" sag in the tailstock once I had everything back together. I cannot adjust it out...the offset is up/down. I temporarily shimmed it up to see if that helped and it did. I fear I have to do something more permanent

[@fourpondsshop7940]

Hi Walt, yes on the first 10EE I did, the tailstock was a few thou low. It was already shimmed. I redid the shims to get it very close in fact I cannot measure the error. I think shimming is ok

[@jdpayne737]

I think my 10ee has similar gear noise. When I put in the metric change gears, which are new, noise doesn't change much. Hard to tell from the video but I would say the back lash in the gear train in my lathe is similar to yours. I would suspect the majority of the noise is just resonance from an unloaded gear set. My lathe does have less gear noise when you're actually threading so that may be the case for you.

[@fourpondsshop7940]

Good to know that it's only my lathe! I may have mentioned it before but for some reason its much more pronounced in the video than in real life. I was re-watching the video on my phone when I really focused on the gear noise but when I went back to the machine and tried it again, I was surprised at the difference in sound. I know it's no where near as noisy as my old South Bend that was quite a rattle box!

[@jdpayne737]

@@fourpondsshop7940 Also, from your video the gear engagement looks very similar to mine. At first I was a little put off by the gap between the gears but the back lash I recall being similar to yours. I would say you're in good shape.

[@Anotherhomeshopguy]

If it's not too much of a pain in the butt you could swap one gear at a time with the other machine and see if any one gear makes that much of a difference until all three were swapped?.

[@fourpondsshop7940]

hmmmm, that's an option I hadn't thought about

[@Anotherhomeshopguy]

@@fourpondsshop7940 are all of these on ball bearings or bronze bushings? If bushings I'd make sure they were good cause wear would add gap in teeth and a slight potential for noise.

[@danielabbey7726]

Hmm, surprising that Monarch wouldn't have mounted these gears on eccentric bushings, or some other way to adjust backlash. I'm no expert, but would a heavy grease on these quiet the gear noise?

[@fourpondsshop7940]

Hi and thanks for the input. I would agree that it seems strange that Monarch overlooked the ability to adjust those gears...but I haven't pulled them off yet so I might be surprised to find eccentrics. I'm going to try some grease

[@earleclemans4836]

Spur gears are noisy

[@fourpondsshop7940]

Yes they are!! Thanks for watching!