#10MinuteTalk

People often say trust the process. Well, a trust can be an important part of your silencer ownership process. Silencer Shop specializes in everything silencers. Purchasing, to tax stamps, to setting up an NFA trust, Tyler Walters from Silencer Shop joins Mark Boardman and Reuben Aleckson for a succinct, step-by-step rundown. Silencer Shop is an A-Z solution that dramatically minimizes the pain points of silencer ownership. Don’t wait. Enjoy the benefits of a suppressor as soon as possible…which will likely involve a wait.
As always, we want to hear your feedback! Let us know if there are any topics you'd like covered on the Vortex Nation™ podcast by asking us on any one of our social media platforms and using #VortexNationPodcast.
Follow Vortex Nation Podcast on Instagram:
vortexnationpodcast

[@89sirmonk]

Treating a muffler like its a explosive/destructive device is ridiculous.

[@Perry2186]

Yeah it's just Soundwave Filtration

[@YZFoFittie]

Yup, 100%. Now go pay your $200 cuz its unfortunately compulsory...

[@DaveL9170]

I have 39 NFA items. The truth is that if you hunt with a silencer you will NEVER NEVER NEVER go back to hunting without one!!! They are that awesome

[@DinoNucci]

Show off

[@coltcomphbar]

$7800 just in extortion tax stamps 😮

[@tinaann3323]

Look at how much money you have paid for tax stamps! I’m sure the Government will refund it when Suppressors become legal. But, please don’t hold your breath on that one!

[@DaveL9170]

@@tinaann3323 YOU paid for it. Used my VA Disability and Military Retiree Pay to pay for each and every one of my NFA items. That means my fellow Americans were kind enough to fund my hobbies. THANK YOU!!!! 🙏

[@jamestannachion8405]

I absolutely agree. I won't hunt without mine.

[@sammylacks4937]

Thanks for a needed " class " on this issue. A neighbor came to shoot at my range and the topic of suppresors came up. He told me 30 min away there is exactly this. I told him I had seen what he was talking about on this podcast so I was familiar with this procedure. He then told me of two friends he has that got their first suppressors by this method. It took two weeks and the call came. Im sure not all will go this quickly but its encouraging news.

[@Rushingaroundtown]

Number 1 reason why most folks won't buy one..... The 200$ we have to piss away to the guvmint for no good reason.

[@jasoneverett7343]

Pay the atf to raid us later. No thanks.

[@RT-iy9pu]

Don't forget sending your information over that "WON'T" **wink** **wink** be saved and stored to create an illegal firearm/user registry.

[@ToastbackWhale]

@@RT-iy9puWhat? The NFA is overtly a registry. That’s the point.

[@jeepinintexas6215]

Isn't it sad the hoops we have to jump through just to purchase a tube with baffles. Not to mention all the crap about what happens to them when you pass away. You can purchase an actual firearm more quickly and easily along with the ammo than you can purchase a tube of baffles. The government is more concerned about which plebs have baffled tubes for their firearms than they are all the 3rd world welfare trash they let come over our borders illegally.

[@chrissewell1608]

True! But how many times have we paid taxes on the same car tag? More than $200.00 worth!

[@varmint87]

I just bought two suppressors on march 22 and they were approved on the 28th. I was blown away I got them in one week.

[@75Beef]

Did you go through Silencer Shop?

[@varmint87]

@@75Beef no I bought them through a local dealer.

[@JuanSouth2010]

Did you go single shot or trust option?

[@varmint87]

@@JuanSouth2010 individual form 4

[@Leothelion357]

@@JuanSouth2010what does that mean, those options I mean?

[@bodynfocus]

Went through this process with Silencer Shop last year. Purchased and began the process in December 2022. Received my "black tube" in September 2023. Typical 9 months. Great customer service.

[@shawn_ten_toes]

It's awesome to see people getting theirs quickly. I bought one through silencer shop back in December, and it took 2+ months just to get form 4 certified/ submitted to the ATF. I'm hoping to get my can for a hunting trip next fall, but I'm not counting on it.

[@rickschwertner282]

The very last one. Yep, you reminded me to get the bullet puller. Thanks guys, great show.

[@jmythngdmb]

I recently moved from NY to NC and decided to save my ears after you guys did the original podcast with silencer shop. Thanks to them the process is simple and I am just waiting now, should be anytime now I get the call from my local dealer.

[@chrissewell1608]

Welcome to Freedom!

[@brenn330]

The kiosk system is awesome! Went through silencershop multiple times now with zero issues. Love seeing the wait times down to weeks now is amazing. Hopefully it stays that way

[@jonquirk9582]

The kiosk is great. I got approved for my first one in a week

[@44Mag]

What was your wait time between your DocuSign and your Ready-To-Certify email? - Thanks

[@pogo458]

My sign to cert was about 5 days… my approval was 3 days… this was 2 weeks ago

[@44Mag]

@@pogo458 I am over 2 weeks since my Docusign and still no certify email. (and the can was showing as in stock too)

[@swampyproductions6755]

@@pogo458that’s insane, guess i’m finally biting the bullet on a black metal tube

[@tinaann3323]

I bought a HuxWrx’s RAD .45 from Expert Voice then went through Silencer Shop for a Single Shot Trust. It’s all bought and paid for. 1 year and 11 days later, I’m still waiting. My gun dealer here in Wisconsin told me it’s a very common occurrence with Single Shot Trusts. Btw, I’ve been to the Vortex headquarters several times and have many Vortex optics. You guys treat customers like family. I love you guys!!

[@unlisted9494]

Damn Tina, go off queen, always great to see a woman exercising her 2a rights

[@MrBigdaddysdaddy]

I’ve been waiting for going on 13 months. Silencer Shop needs to let viewers know the truth on wait times!.

[@owenjamesk]

The good thing is that we live in a free country where the Constitution is definitely respected

[@timnicely1579]

Silencer Shop is awesome for navigating this process. I picked up 3 NFA items last week, suppressors, one just under five months the other two under 30 days. All Trust purchases.

[@44Mag]

What was your wait time between your DocuSign and your Ready-To-Certify email? - Thanks

[@timnicely1579]

@@44Mag a little over a week

[@jeepinintexas6215]

I bought 2 cans back in October through them. Went with the single shot trust. Still waiting to pick them up.

[@chrissewell1608]

Wow!

[@EBFNOQMAGNO]

Patiently waiting on mine...........after the backorder is filled..........and then it's sent to my preferred ffl..........I wonder if the back order will be as long as the old 1 year ATF wait.

[@jonquirk9582]

After watching both the previous videos on supresssors with Ruben and the one with the owner of SS, i finally pulled the trigger on my first nfa item. I did individual instead of a trust. But i got my first suppressor approved in 7 days! It's going mind blowingly fast. I chose the silencerco omega 36m, absolutely love it

[@RCx44]

No reason to have a trust anymore after Obama ruined them. Individual is the way to go and you found out why with that quick approval

[@johnnysapper]

They made it so stinkin easy to do. So happy with it and texting in to talk to them about different types of cans was really great and informative. Thanks but no thanks cause now I’m hooked! lol

[@exodusz19]

Bought my first back in February. Silencer Shop really did make the process easy and quick.

[@44Mag]

What was your wait time between your DocuSign and your Ready-To-Certify email? - Thanks

[@cwilliams3324]

Just got my approval.....350 days!!! I am retired LEO with ZERO criminal record!

[@chrismartinez8393]

Welcome back to being a regular guy. Being a LEO means nothing to the ATF.

[@RCx44]

🐖

[@gene_pool_exotics3261]

That's crazy

[@georgevasquez8866]

Ridiculous I’m the same boat and I’m still waiting for my approval

[@catman5546]

Me too !!!

[@meisenhut31]

One caveat to silencer shop kiosk fingerprints is that they are only good when used with silencer shop purchases. You cannot get an eft file of your prints from silencer shop. It's worth it to go to a UPS store that does fingerprints and get your eft file so you can use it at any class 3 FFL.

[@stevemarklin3192]

This has been very interesting and informative news great to know about thank you

[@nickwarren5800]

Just made my first quiet order yesterday. The kiosk was a smooth process. Hopefully i wont have to wait long. I filed individual because I'm impatient.

[@robertpontisso4953]

My NFA inventory for SBR,s went from single digits to double digits thanks,s to Silencer shop, my last one took 7 days to get approved.Awesome service, the old way was a pain in the butt.All done with the multishot trust.

[@user-eb3jx7wf5n]

Mine was submitted Wednesday April 24, I filed Individual, I know it’s been only 3 days but I can’t help but be impatient and excited with everything I’m hearing lol. Hopefully I hear something next week.

[@Gunny11795]

Bought their Unlimited Single Shot Trust access, when i got my first and originally only planned suppressor. 3 years later im at 9 cans, and 3 SBR Form 1s all with SS Trusts and all but 4 are fully digital. Elite service and truly the easiest process. My fastest approval on a form 4 w a SS trust is 19 hours and my longest was 14 months. Form 1s all came back between 5 and 14 days after filing w the trust. worth every penny.

[@user-tv3yp2jm1i]

Good talk gents. Thanks.

[@jjgriffin3275]

As a 1st timer this year getting a Shush, its still confusing but Silencer Shop did make it easy, even tho im still confused

[@nathant3897]

That really helped thank you! Now I gotta figure out what attachment system and what’s the best first suppressor to get with the intentions of at least handling 30cal rifle and 9mm. 45acp seems to far of a stretch to 556 and the decibels I’d like to hover around. I know you can change end caps but the baffles still have all of that space where it’s not capturing gases efficiently

[@BRADASSOFFGRIDHOMESTEAD]

Great vid, thanks!

[@hghunter44]

I’ve used SilencerShop to form4 NFA items that they didn’t sell. Once your info is in their database, the process is so simple.

[@NoBody-jm3qt]

Two Form 4's and a Form 1 via Silencer Shop, all with a Sinlge Shot Trust. Silencer Shop has made the process painless!

[@44Mag]

What was your wait time between your DocuSign and your Ready-To-Certify email? - Thanks

[@NoBody-jm3qt]

@@44Mag Most recent was a Form 1 and wait from Docusign to certify was a day. The Form 1 was approved by ATF yesterday and submitted Monday. Lightning fast!

[@darkside59]

I bought my Dead Air Primal at Scheel on Jan 31st 2024. February 28th my stamp got approved. Fastest I got mine back. My first suppressor took over 13 months.

[@pepe65644]

All good info EXCEPT the part where ss checks everything before submitting to atf. 10 months into wait time I get notified my single shot trust not signed!WTF! Now have to start over.

[@DrbBeeper21]

First 2 suppressors took 9 months. Been waiting for 1.5 years on my third using e-file. All with silencershop

[@mattschmidt9333]

Bought 3 Suppressors this year. Took 5 days for all of them. Things are changing.

[@user-qo3yy9nv1u]

Thats a stupid amount of time.

[@matthewaldana2196]

Just submitted for a suppressor, over heard an employee tell a customer that the fastest they’ve seen very recent is 16hours.

[@BigPatriot84]

My buddy just got one in 7 days from the kiosk and a dealer

[@jordanm6m637]

Silencer shop made things really easy.

[@sabregunner1]

so if i understand this right. I can do a single shot trust for a single NFA item, after it gets approved i can add an allowable person to that trust, and they can have that item without me being in thier presence for them to use said item. or do i have to be in thier presence while they us it? and its a shorter waiting time for the "paper work" to get approved or i can do a trust and add the same people, list the items i will allow them to access (i dont have to be in thier precense while its used?) should they want to go through the process of what it takes to set up an account (so to speak) at a kiosk, but it will just take longer for the "paperwork" to process? Hopefully i understand this correctly as i am looking into doing SBRs and getting some supressors in the next few years. Just trying to figure out what the best solution is

[@Mrlebowski78]

So true. I'm on day 100 for my 1st form 4, about to file for my 3rd

[@chrissewell1608]

Patience Grasshopper! You are a 1/3 of the way there! I hope not! But eform4 trusts are still going 8 months...

[@randyslone-wh6ki]

Do you sell sets of three or ? Sup. For one tax stamp. All serialized same

[@joescopo8933]

If my trust already has a few NFA items on, and I want to add someone as a trustee in the future, do they still need to register and get fingerprints even though the NFA items are already on the trust?

[@evanmorgan3573]

I guess different jurisdictions handle regular, NFA Trusts differently? I have a NFA trust that I got with my first NFA item around 2008. Shortly thereafter, I added someone to the trust. I don't recall that process; but several years ago I had that person removed from the trust, and the office that had set the trust up for me said there was an official process for removing someone from an NFA Trust, beyond simply taking the page with their information on it, and ripping it in half. I still intend to use that trust for future purchases, but I'm definitely more wary of who I add to it now.

[@claymiller9192]

Sooo many questions I was told that once you add people to your trust, you can no longer add a suppressor to that specific trust. If you purchase another it will need to go on another trust. Also, no one can be added to a trust while an approval is pending

[@wolfkin73]

I think they answered that. They said the people you added need to go to the kiosk and answer questions, finger prints and pictures. ATF will run everything over like a new trust. I don’t see the advantage to forming a new trust if that’s true.

[@jacobcline7076]

I keep waffling between getting high end ear protection vs a suppressor. I do a fair bit of shotgun hunting around unsuppressed shotguns.

[@mariob4243]

how do you make an address change on a trust, i figure a lawyer would have to ammend it but then do i have to resubmit it to atf? i know you have to let Atf know of the change but do you have to ammend the trust?

[@erick1076]

Is it possible to submit fingerprints and information to the silencer shop without purchasing a suppressor at that time that way your silence your account is already made and they already have information on file

[@f550lover]

I have 2 NFA items. Suppressor and SBR. Both under a single shot trust.

[@Marvelous7695]

What’s normal timeline yall seeing from Individual Form4 purchase time til Sil shop actually sending the form to the ATF for approval ?

[@shermrock345]

Also it takes longer for them to do background checks for each item if its in a trust because they have to do a background check on every person in the trust.

[@256NATO]

That's not what they told me and they didn't get my wife ssn at silencer central and I asked them multiple times the trust is only if something was to happen to you and I've researched this heavily Maybe silencer shop does ot different idk

[@philiptrump8472]

I think we could use some more Lead Balloons talks. Or an update on Ryan's 338 Fed

[@ajhartman9858]

What if you have had a finger cut off. have you seen problems with the kiosk, taking them

[@sentineloffreedomforever1381]

Not that this makes it any better but actually the wait time is around 4 days at this moment and at the time of the release of this video it was at four days or five days they're going really fast right now for some reason

[@murphytoadster9864]

Ok here's the big question.. how long are "paper form 4's individual to individual no FFL just private sale between two guys from the same state, taking?

[@zlanderson3378]

I live in a state where suppressors are illegal. Could I purchase a suppressor out of state, fill out all of the federal forms and own a suppressor?

[@v1-vr-rotatev2-vy_vx31]

When a suppressor gets dirty is it actually more quiet

[@jodyrockhill7200]

I've used digital fingerprint machines. The biggest issue is to not press down too hard. That distorts the ridges on the fingers.

[@POSSUM3K3]

Got a question maybe someone here can answer thats bought and sold their own suppressors can answer. So with a single shot trust unlimited say you have your buddy on that trust and you want to sell one of your suppressors to him does he just buy it off you since he is on the same trust or does that person need their own trust to do so? How does that work? I have no NFA items at the moment but would like too.

[@maxcole3930]

Can u turn a single shot trust into a regular trust? If I did a traditional trust through you, do you guys get it notarized? I found my local kiosk last week. This video is good timing. Im planning on going to kiosk this coming week

[@jamestannachion8405]

Unfortunately no. Going through that myself. Have to either resubmit and pay another $200 each to convert to a standard trust from either a normal purchase or single shot trust. I have 2 that I either have to convert or my wife can't use them. FML

[@elzippo488]

@@jamestannachion8405 Not true. You can add more RP's to a single shit trust after the approval.

[@markniekranz671]

Why have I been looking at "Ready to Certify" on my dashboard when my dealer says everything is good to go?? Is your website really 3 months behind or are you dropping the ball?

[@paulhughes3961]

I will never own a suppressor as long as there is any kind of a registration, period!

[@itsjustashow]

Cool story 😂. Registration is a part of life on everything. Grow up peter pan

[@josephcrider5574]

Now the only problem is there is no stock and now prices will inflate.

[@RTbrown910]

Can you file a form 1 with the single shot unlimited?

[@tluigs]

@SilencerShop If I buy my item through silencer shop and it gets sent to my local shop should they be charging me to pick it up once it’s approved? Like a transfer fee. I bought a few in 2018 and my local shop now closed down, charged me a transfer fee basically to pick up my items.

[@Dont.trust.the.bean.dip1]

Yeah that’s normal. It’s $100 where I’m from

[@tluigs]

@@Dont.trust.the.bean.dip1I guess I misunderstood the whole no transfer fees through SilencerShop. I guess I assumed if it was a powered by SilencerShop dealer it would be no fees. 😞

[@tluigs]

To anyone reading this. I contacted my new local gun store that is powered by SilencerShop and they said any shop that is powered by SilencerShop should not be charging transfer fees period.

[@jasonrad9332]

“Can we do that off air” 🤣🤣🤣

[@LackLusterMedia]

I'm 8 months in on my wait... 😢

[@dbeardsley0]

I dont shoot without my suppressor anymore. Nomad 30, goes on all my bolt guns so easily

[@ALovelyBunchOfDragonballz]

I have 3 cans with one in process. I should have done single shot trusts but i am typically impatient. My next can is going on a trust and im going to move my existing cans over periodically.

[@RCx44]

No reason to have a trust anymore after Obama administration.

[@tcbkkb1]

folks are reporting wait times down to hours and days and weeks now!

[@boknight3269]

I wonder if they’re collecting all the data through that new red flag center & fast tracking approvals now since the government is in dire need of money to send elsewhere.

[@CA_Outdoor_Reviews]

Please do 6.5 grendel vs. 6 arc gel test cartridge talk.

[@POSSUM3K3]

Great rounds I wish the military would have just swapped out the Bolt and barrel and went to either one of these rounds would have been easier, more effective than 5.56, cheaper, and lighter ammo but still have a lightweight longer range rifle. I loaded up on a bunch of 6.5 grendel when they became really popular bit I should have doubled or tripled that lol. But these days ammo for anything isn't really cheap anymore. Hell just look at how much a brick of 22lr costs compared to just 10 years ago. It's nuts I miss the $8 bricks of 22lr lol

[@leesmith8646]

You need to make it were there is a chaos that there is also a person that is a notary for that area

[@shermrock345]

I just want to point out that the ATF is processing individuals realy fast for suppressors now. Im talking the next day to a week fast. Apparently they said this will be the norm now. But we will just havebto wait and see.

[@RCx44]

Trusts have been irrelevant since Obama administration

[@tsteinour]

Ok so I have myself, my wife and my best friend I trust with my life. No kids ... Single shot trust right....then ad my wife and buddy. Also what happens if silencerco ever goes out of business. Is everything concrete after its done ... sorry if its a dumb question. ..I wanna get a multi cal black tube and a 22 one

[@mattlewandowski73]

Feels more like a paid advertisement than a podcast segment.

[@rickschwertner282]

How dare you not have an NFA going through the process. If you arent waiting on a suppressor you need to be .

[@gotwide]

When comparing the traditional trust to the single shot trust, I’m wondering if there really is a reason for the single shot. If adding and deleting people from your traditional trust is as simple as writing down that you’ve added them and then tearing up that paper to delete them… you could in theory just delete them all before buying an additional item and then add them back as soon as the new item is approved to eliminate the hassle of submitting all their prints and pics, right?

[@snuman32]

On a one shot trust i know you can add and remove trustees but how do you handle what happens to the silencers if you die?

[@elzippo488]

Make sure you add your beneficiary(s) and Successor to the SS Trust.

[@AdAstra_x]

I'm 6 weeks into the waiting period for my 1st one

[@catman5546]

Good luck, I waited 1 year for mine!!!

[@JNOSNOW]

I jusf find it better to buy exactly what i want at the lowest price and have them form 3 it to my gut who charges $20 transfers. The form only takes 15 minutes to fill out and double check. Super simple.

[@Krisjohnson83]

I’m all about the trusts for nfa items, I just wish silencer shop wasn’t a garbage company with zero customer service. Silencer central should be the company everyone uses.

[@chrissewell1608]

Filing as a Corporation or a Trust, are similar. But, if you file as a Corporation, the corp. has to be keep up and current from now own! And that is an extra expense! $$$$

[@thomasduff2224]

Silencer Shop will not help me transfer personal suppressors to my Trust. 😢 PS. That's the reason I bought their trust.

[@coryk6839]

REUB❤❤❤

[@BeniBen]

I have opted for the single shot trust but I did not designate anyone that that make me the trustee ?.. so how do I add someone to the trust ? do I/they have to pay $200 tax to be added ?

[@portersorensen8814]

You can just add them, since the suppressor belongs to the trust. How you add the person is blurry to me but you will not need to pay another tax stamp

[@wolfgangmittermeyer8970]

9x25mm Dillon > 300WSM Carl may have sent me

[@austinboston5643]

I am still so confused sbout the process

[@Chato4570]

They also ask "Do you live outside city limits" as if they're pre-planning

[@MillisConstruction]

The regular 4473 asks this as well not just NFA

[@chevelleeg]

I still waiting on day 65 now no approval yet

[@HB-kp6rl]

Ima a SingleShot trust kinda guy

[@LibertyJeff]

Can we talk about George Costanza in the background?

[@chrissewell1608]

Buy 1 or buy 27... its a $200.00 tax stamp, EACH!

[@tinkmaster1054]

Who'da thought that within two weeks that 5 month wait would drop down to 5 days

[@keithfranke4739]

Meanwhile, I'm at 350 days on 2 YHM 5.56 suppressors..F the ATF

[@darrellpetri9008]

Me to

[@chrissewell1608]

The kiosk is easier, IF THE DEALER knows how to use it, and help the customer use it! (Mine, did NOT! And they were useless!) Once you finally get it all set up and filed, any future purchases are easy!

[@chetfriday7636]

Now I am more confused. Silencer shops kiosks were a cluster for me. My photo was rejected after my submission, that started a cascade of e-mails three months long before I was able to submit my paperwork. The old system was much faster for me. Someone out there must have a handle on this process and be a good communicator to the point that even an old dumb fart like me can understand it. I tried calling the silencer shop for help, but after 50 minutes on hold, I gave up.

[@sethperry1323]

How long do people normally wait when they back order from silencer shop? I was told 2 weeks an its been over a month 🙃

[@BrettBaker-uk4te]

Depends on how busy they are, the can you're ordering, and possibly your dealer.

[@ianthrockmorton9167]

It depends on the manufacturer. Silencer Shop has no hand in how quickly the manufacturer will create the item and make it available for you. Once the item is created and serialized, they send you the DocuSign email for signature. Then a Form 3 is sent to ATF, takes 1-2weeks and once approved the item is mailed to your dealer. Once at the dealer you inspect and item and finish the process to submit the Form 4 to ATF.

[@jonquirk9582]

Took my dealer 31 days to get my omega36m in

[@carlosr.2484]

Just find a local ffl and purchase it there. It will take literally 15 minutes to do the form 4 and submit it. I have been waiting on SS for a month.

[@JNOSNOW]

Fyi form 4 individuals right now are at 1-5 days approval times

[@codyandrus4441]

Not for everyone. Mine was certified 2/22 and I'm still impatiently waiting

[@JNOSNOW]

For those that are submitting now.

[@ALovelyBunchOfDragonballz]

Mine is a few months in. Approval times are "whenever we feel like it"

[@jonquirk9582]

Yep. Mine was approved the morning of the 7th day!

[@pogo458]

Got mine in 3 days…. About 2 weeks ago

[@mikerobinson6606]

Was told 8-9 months.....waited 13 months.

[@HB-kp6rl]

What happened to Awkward Silence, Tyler?? Where’s money maker Mike at?

[@chipsterb4946]

Suppressors are stupidly expensive for what they are. Think about it - you can buy a decent rifle for less than many suppressors. And that’s not counting the evil stamp. I blame government regulations for the excessive markups.

[@user-nf7ui7dz1z]

Why would a device that makes the sound much less obnoxious not just being installed on rifles by the factory and built into the design? Having one on a pistol for home defense so you don’t have to wear hearing protection to bed even though it’s still very loud seems like a no-brainer. There is absolutely no reason I can think of that makes the suppressor scary or somehow more “dangerous” than the gun itself, so why is it being tossed around in the media and by other anti American groups like it’s this super bad thing? If it’s about stealing money from people who want to buy those, perhaps the government isn’t really being fair or being by the people or for the people because from what I can tell, the whole “tax stamp” is about theft from the people and bullying the people so basically the problem isn’t the suppressor, but rather that our government has become an oppressor. If a criminal gets one of these, how often do they register them and pay the $200 fine?

[@0x80O0oOverfl0w]

Already sus, title is 10MinTalk, but video is 30 minutes 👀

[@stevewort]

:)

[@dkjphills79]

Man this sounds like a roal pain in the rear. Know what would be easy abolish the ATF.