1946: The year the word homosexual was added to the Bible - unCOMFORTABLE Podcast 170

[@stevebennett3495]

Thank you for having your guest Dr. Karl Pagenkemper on your show. His presentation of the reality about how the ancient texts were hand written by human scribes who omitted words or added words or phrases to the scripture that they were copying from ...shows our human fallibility.We have ALL made mistakes at one time or another in our lives....some are by accident. The fact remains like the good Doctor stated....they wanted to keep the 'orthodoxy' of the sacred texts in perpetuity for the next generations to have to continue to grow the faith and the kingdom. The insight that Dr. Karl Pagenkemper brings out about the relative few ancient manuscripts that were used to compile the revered King James bible were relatively newer versus the older ones that have been found since that time. So again the King James was based on only the knowledge that they had at that given time in history. How can we blame them for their shortcomings? Words and culture changes through the ages...so do we as a people and as a society. We are not the same people as those who founded the colonies or wrote our sacred documents that we hold in high esteem for our way of government...but they are still used as the foundation for our future and we strive to reinterpret them to adhere to our current modern day world. The words and the ideals that they embody allow us to strive for continued greatness and truth and equality to this day. As a 70 year young gay white man whoi gave his life to Christ at the age of 16 in a SOuthern Baptist church so long ago....my faith has taught me that i must have a personal relationship with my Lord and Savior and do everything that I can to be His hands and feet while I am here on this earth to do all that I can to glorify Him so that others can see he is LOVE!!! I cannot and will not try to force my lifestyle or way of live on anyone....I am just a humble servant to the Master.

[@edwinbetancourt7301]

You should also not shove your religion down someone’s throat. Crazy how people assume that’s LGBTQ people that does that but how many missionaries are killed by indigenous tribes for trespassing to “preach” the word of the lord?

[@JamesAaron-h8o]

That's correct, and they shouldn't try and force their lifestyle on you!

[@ddrse]

You can be LGBT and Christian 👨‍❤️‍👨

[@RobertMichaelTodd]

well... no usually when you come out you gain intelligence and wisdom about the world and realize god is fake.

[@lalaland956]

Ofcourse you can ♡♡

[@ddrse]

@@warr3473 wrong you probably create them

[@mikelynnehemen2992]

CCC is so fortunate to have Karl on staff...Love to hear his thoughts on the podcast. Thank you.

[@linetteruffino9576]

Yesssssss. Exactly why Trusting in the true connection of secret place is crucial here. His mercy in understanding his own real time as we continue to choose his light and choose Life.

[@lalaland956]

Why has it been illegal throughout history in Christian theocratic countries?

[@linetteruffino9576]

Exactly. Its His will. Truly feel theres a calling to Him. Just like the Shepherd.

[@fuzzycounsellor9147]

Faith is a gift, trying to convince a natural man/person of the scripture's validity is a course in futility. If the Father is not drawing them, they will only ever continue to debate, mock, ridicule & slander. Those who ask gotcha questions are not teachable, but want only to win an argument. You can generally tell those who want to know the truth & those who don't. Those who wish to remain in their sin are of the latter group, although we've all been there. The Holy Spirit is the one who gives us the desire to please the Father, this is spiritual not carnal. Agape is keeping the commandments, it seeks to please God & bring truth to men. Agape & the commandment cannot be separated, they are one & the same.

[@exgaywatch]

Cults are the same way. People on the outside see their beliefs as nonsense, sometimes dangerous. Once they are indoctrinated they "understand" and see the "truth" of their beliefs. That this action is also at work among Christians is not something to brag about. If the Bible doesn't make sense to the non-Christian, it doesn't make sense. It is self-referential with lots of circular reasoning, full of contradictions and inaccuracies. These are objective facts that evangelicals and many other Christian sects just ignore once indoctrinated.

[@AnUnhappyBusiness]

Leviticus 20:13 (LXX) contains αρσενος κοιτην which is two words, and it seems Paul combined them to form the one word αρσενοκοιται.

[@pinguy2334]

That says to kill.

[@MusicalRaichu]

that's unproven conjecture.

[@Mabeylater293]

That is provably wrong

[@Mabeylater293]

You are wrong. Even from a linguistic perspective, “homosexual” isn’t even capable of being synonymous with arsenokoitai. Note the Greek from the LXX: Lev. 18:22 - meta arsenos ou koimethese koiten gynaiakos (with a man do not lie [as one] lies with a woman) Lev. 20:13 - hos an koimethe meta arsenos koiten gynaikos (whoever lies with a man [as one] lies with a woman) In each of the two quotes, how many times do you see a male-referenced term? Once. And for comparison, note the Hebrew: Lev. 18:22 - V'et zachar lo tishkav mishk'vei ishah to'evah hu (And with a male you shall not lay lyings of a woman) Lev. 20:13 - V'ish asher yishkav et zachar mishk'vei ishah to'evah asu shneihem mot yumatu d'meihem bam. (And a man who will lie down with a male in beds of a woman, both of them have made an abomination; dying they will die. Their blood is on them.) How many times is there a male-reference here? Once in 18:22 and twice in 20:13. So the actual Hebrew for Lev.20:13 uses two words, “man” and “male” to literally communicate a “man who lies with a male”. Where as the Greek, doesn’t do this. Nor can it. When you look at the phrase “lies with a man” for Lev.20:13, “arseno” is the word for ‘man’, while “koit” communicates the ‘lies with.’ And the Greek adds the word “whoever”, not “man” like the original Hebrew does, as the one who lies with a man. The Septuagint’s rendering of Lev.20:13 represents more of a transliteration than a translation, and points in the direction that the translators understood Leviticus 20:13 to be condemning anyone who (or as the Greek words it - “whoever”) lies with a male…….., be they male or female. So if even a literal translation of the Septuagint’s Lev. 20:13 doesn’t make reference to a “man lying with a man” using the terms “arseno” and “koit” when constructed within a sentence, ***then it most definitely doesn’t equate to a “man lying with a man” when the words that surround “arseno” and “koit” are removed. Which is the highly faulty claim, their position tries to make in regards to Paul’s use of the word “arsenokoitai” in 1 Cor. and 1 Tim. ***

[@linetteruffino9576]

I think he said it best. The next redemptive step....

[@JamesAaron-h8o]

I feel in my spiritual connection that the Bible is more anatomy and astrology, more spiritual than physical religion,, our spirit is divided into our bodies, not vice versa, we are spirits first, and in the spirit we have chakras, but in the physical our chakras houses what we call the spine ect.

[@linetteruffino9576]

Thank you so so so so much for speaking on this. God is so Good! I appreciate you all so much for your confidence in advocating for The Word. Much appreciated. 🙏🏽🕯️🧩🌴🤲🏽🙌🏽❤️‍🔥

[@linetteruffino9576]

Yessssss

[@robertmorgan5467]

Thx

[@coffeebux]

@11:31. Is what you clicked for

[@brettschlee7090]

I've always been partial to the words sodomy and sodomite... those words aren't controversial at all, and using these terms would be so winsome and engaging to all the sodomites that have been excluded and marginalized by the church. 😉

[@MusicalRaichu]

the concept of so-do-my (non-reproductive secs whether between same or opposite secs), came about in the middle ages. neither the categories so-do-my nor homoxesuality existed when the bible was written. the Bible doesn't say that having secs is not a sin, it's hurting someone in the process it that's a sin. so-do-my is indeed controversial in scholarly theological circles. catholics consider it a mortal sin, some protestants consider it acceptable between husband and wife, and some agree with western society in seeing no problem with it. it's just that you can't condemn it from the pulpit without losing half your congregation. but you can get away with condemning homoxesuality because it only affects a small percentage so won't hurt church income significantly.

[@brettschlee7090]

@@MusicalRaichu Tell me you've never studied the Bible without saying so.

[@MusicalRaichu]

@@brettschlee7090 Huh? The Bible makes no reference either to the category of non-reproductive secs (so-do-my) or to innate attraction to the same secs (homoxesuality), at least not as categories. These categories developed later on. Look up the history books for yourself.

[@Daedal71]

Saying that homosexuality is an orientation is the same as saying being fat is an orientation. It is a problem with appetites. It's so clear that the more you feed an appetite, the more normal it seems to yourself.

[@cccomaha]

Is there a specific comment in the episode you are referring to?

[@Daedal71]

​@@cccomaha "Is it a thing, we think it is" 21:21

[@RobertMichaelTodd]

Says a straight person…

[@RobertMichaelTodd]

Straight people talking about things they know nothing about.

[@Daedal71]

@@RobertMichaelTodd Interesting. Actually, says a person with appetites and the understanding of where those can lead.

[@RobertMichaelTodd]

Maybe don’t have a conversation about people you know nothing about.

[@cccomaha]

This conversation was centered around textual criticism and the Bible, not around people. However the crew did a series on sexuality with friends & family who are part of the LGBTQ+ community.