2013 Mac Pro + eGPU - my 9 Month Update

[@ConstantGeekery]

I made a mistake in this video when I referred to needing OpenCore to fix eGPU in Bootcamp. I was speaking from memory a couple of months after researching it and confused it with something else. Enabling eGPU in Windows requires a DSDT override, not OpenCore. Apologies for any confusion.

[@damiansmigielski9246]

HI, nice review but from video editor perspective is little bit lack. Show the RAW speed test (app from BM), and put the Braw files on timeline in DR studio and show framerate indicator when you adding a noise reduction node or some grading nodes. This test will be more useful for video creators. Good luck with another tests. Cheers.

[@ryanwdavies1]

thanks fab video may I ask ehich monitor stand you use there?

[@ConstantGeekery]

@@ryanwdavies1 Thank you. It’s just a cheap glass shelf I found online somewhere.

[@MichaelSidneyTimpson]

Hello friend, I am asking you because your the one with the knowledge. I was not able to upgrade my system past High Sierra because I was using a third party drive (OWC) and Apple requires the OEM drive to have the proper firmware installed to go beyond High Sierra. So, following the OWC's advice, I installed the OEM drive and tried internet recovery method but nothing happens, the screen remains blank and no internet recover comes up. Perplexed, I switched the drives back (I have an enclosure the OWC provides for the OEM drive) and I was able to do an Internet Recovery, although only to Yosemite and could install on the OEM drive in the USB enclosure. I put the OEM drive back internally into the computer, but yet, the computer still would not start the same exact way as before (blank screen and nothing ever comes up, except fan speed.). I then made a Monterey USB installer, and although it would let me do the install process on the OEM drive while it was in the external enclosure, it would always abort because it would say "updating firmware failed". I then figured I would try the same process with it internally, but it still did not recognize the OEM drive. So, giving up, I switched back to my original config (OWC internal; OEM USB) and now when the computer starts up, I get vertical rows of horizontal bars across the screen. Then after the Apple log appears, the main monitor will go blank, and my additional monitors turn a bright blue. When I boot from recovery via the ssd efi, it still has the bars but it can go further to the utitlities, and the mouse seems to create its own "bars" that drag with it as well. However, if I still try to either boot fully from one of the drives or internet recovery, it always results in the bars on the screen and then always goes blank/blue after the apple logo and status bar. My fear is that somehow the graphics card (likely on the SSD side) has gone bad after multiple swaps of the SSDs. I should mention that the plastic tube bracket that holds the screw into place for the SSD popped off on one of the original swaps and I had no choice but to use Super Glue to reattact it (because the drives were not making proper contact.). This had not cause a problem during my initial swaps, but the bracket kept coming off and I had to always apply a little super glue to reattact it (many times) and now there is a stain on the circuit board going in the direction of whatever that is (square transistor?) to the right side. Please help, what is your prognosis. I feel like I killed my Mac Pro and am eager to hear potential fixes.

[@MichaelSidneyTimpson]

Also, from what I told you, do I just need to replace the SSD side graphics? it is a D500, and I see one I can buy for a reasonable price actually (unless you think eGPU would the better fix.)

[@AliCan-ni3uy]

Finally somebody talking about performance in its real work life! Cheers!

[@All2jPro]

I have the 6 core version which I still recommend for 1080p 4K raw work flow… I use it for short films, music videos weddings and multi cam commercials … I use final cut Adobe and Resolve…. They run very well with FC100% Resolve even better 100% Adobe 75% And have used Avid media compose and protools on it… SPECS are standard only using external hdd/ssd 4K timelines with proxy are quicker… I still love the machine

[@photo_n_art]

It is very refreshing listening to an actual professional instead of a clueless "influencer". The difference is that you know what you are saying compared to those who say what they know. Thank you for taking the time to share with us your knowledge and expertise. I have gladly subscribed to your channel.

[@ConstantGeekery]

Thank you 😊

[@Composercleo]

I feel like we are all a part of this process with you and your setup is also OUR set up 😂 My Mac Pro is also still doing well! Thank you again for being the driving force in helping me with my decision!!

[@ConstantGeekery]

Thank you. I’m glad it’s been useful.

[@AlexandreLollini]

I was fed up with crappy audio devices, so I treated myself with a Topping D30 pro with usb in and XLR outs : the audio quality of this is really making a difference : like when you remove grills on the speakers. The refinement is huge in that it does never send a pop or whatever noise no matter the audio level or if you hot plug / unplug either usb, power or the XLRs. I did that purchase just to correct problems, but in the end I got loads of pleasure on top of this. I rediscover all my music and all cinema.

[@RMNummi]

Thanks!

[@ConstantGeekery]

Thank you - very kind of you. Sorry it's taken me so long to spot this!!

[@ameenbadri9696]

I have ranked you channel number 5 in my list of 20 channel I really love. just after watching two videos for you. man, you have the best very convincing speech i have ever list to. thank you sir.

[@ConstantGeekery]

Very kind of you - thank you 😊

[@JobDyer]

I run one of these with a 12 core, 128gb of ram, 2tb ssd and duel d700 gpus running Sonoma, Win 10 and Ubuntu. Runs like a dream. Faster than the much more modern laptop I'm typing this comment on. I also don't really notice any performance issues when using modern web apps. I wonder if its more of an issue with his particular mac than the 2013 pro in general. The only real issue I have with it is excessive heat and a small drop in FPS (down from 80 or so to 30 or 40) when playing modern games on high settings in Windows 10.

[@gregdeligne2689]

Thank you for this update. I appreciate your honesty with the caveats of the eGPU with the Mac Pro 6,1. It has helped me make the decision to buy a D700 model as opposed to go that route for now.

[@ConstantGeekery]

Glad it was useful 😊👍🏻

[@davidniositech]

What are OpenCL and Metal Benchmarks in Geekbench with the D700?

[@ConstantGeekery]

@@davidniositech 30358 Metal, 29335 OpenCL. Bear in mind that GB5 on Mac is not multi-GPU aware, so that’s the score for one card.

[@MFEeee]

I want one. Looking for a maxed out version. I do video editing at 1440p and computer aided designing. This beast is more than suitable for my needs, for far less. Everything in house and with windows boot camp I won’t need another computer for a very long time

[@DocMacLovin]

I like your calm and information packed style of video making. Subbed

[@TubeDisplay]

Thank you for this detailed review that helped defragmenting my mind around this topic. Not only by sharing the extremely useful conclusions, but by unfolding your experience map that took you there, too. It’s a hell lots of hours and complications to be addressed before collecting this amount of information and knowledge, so this résumé, provided in a such meaningful manner, is extremely valuable! I myself am looking to upgrade my old 2009 MBP to a workstation and since the economical factor is paramount, I have been looking into these 6,1 Mac Pros. The main use will be semi-professional 3D rendering and architectural projects development with Unity (which as far as I understand only the Metal API will be supported for development with and for macs). I am still researching to find out if such investment will include the perspective of taking use of the interesting (though still unfamiliar to me) topics such as VR or «Ray Tracing» techniques and if/ how well they would play with an old workstation like the 2013 Mac Pro (maxed out, rigged with an eGPU or not), so any input by anyone is more than welcome. Of course, Mac Studios are out nowadays, but they are still expensive.

[@ConstantGeekery]

Thanks for watching 😊 I'm glad it was useful.

[@IgnoreSolutions]

As a developer, I actually just bought an 8-core D500 model (upgraded already with 32gb of RAM and 512gb SSD) for

[@IgnoreSolutions]

And, "for fun" I'd like to experiment with splitting GPU workloads across the 2x D500s. I also don't plan to use an eGPU at all.

[@WarriorsPhoto]

Good to see that this machine is still useful. It better be considering what it cost new. (:

[@Cooper3312000]

I picked up a maxed out D700 12core 64gb ram on eBay for $400 broken. Was lucky the Thunderbolt controller was just shorted out replaced I/O board behind the power supply and works like new. Great little machines IMO.

[@MacSociety]

Thanks for the update. I am with you... Going to keep an eye on the Apple Silicon but love so far my 12 Core MacPro 2013. If I ever do get a new Apple, the wife can then get my MacPro 2013 and we can keep it chugging along and we can retire off the older Mac Mini she uses. Your channel is great.. and I see you blew past 1000 subs and now at 6K. Wow.. great for you!

[@ConstantGeekery]

Thanks TJ 😊

[@JobDyer]

I run one of these with a 12 core, 128gb of ram and duel d700 gpus running Sonoma, Win 10 and Ubuntu. Runs like a dream. Faster than the much more modern laptop I'm typing this comment on. I also don't really notice any performance issues when using modern web apps. I wonder if its more of an issue with his particular mac than the 2013 pro in general. The only real issue I have with it is excessive heat and a small drop in FPS (down from 80 or so to 30 or 40) when playing modern games on high settings in Windows 10.

[@QCJSiteB]

I have Sonoma set up. Got a sonnet egpu with 650w psu and a Radeon Vega 64 frontier edition for a combined total of only 229. Got my Mac Pro for 400 and after disassembling it realized it was already upgrade to the 12 core and 64gb of ram (with dual d700s). Got a 4tb raid for 100 and I’m sitting pretty. It’s a tank and works amazingly and it’s a fraction of the cost of new Apple silicon without the soldered on ticking time bomb ssds and ram of their laptops, minis and studios. I’m very pleased.

[@user-bz7hz4jl1t]

Its a good price to performance, I've had some hardware issues but at the price its pretty competitive

[@dokh22]

Really enjoy this channel - keep up the amazing work!

[@ConstantGeekery]

Thank you 😊

[@photo_n_art]

Call me a masochist but I have traded my M1 Mac Mini base config for a Trashcan 8 core, 64gb ram, 1tb SSD and D500... and I love it! The M1 is damn fast but boring... Trashcan on the other hand with all its quirks and challenges make it fun and engaging to use, not to mention that it is one of a kind computer design and looks almost like art piece... I love to hate it!!!😂😂😂

[@photo_n_art]

I should add that it is not my daily driver of cause, just a fun project to mess with.

[@tomscott88]

Great vid, and always wanted one years ago but as you have shown they make little sense now. For me the modern iMacs do so much more so much better. At my workplace I have maxed out 2019 and 2020 iMac and they have been fabulous 👍🏻

[@ConstantGeekery]

Thank you 😊. The iMac is indeed fabulous!

[@PauloParreira]

I'm a wedding photographer still using as main pc a late 2010 Mac Pro 5.1 with Mojave, thinking to upgrade, thought in Mac pro 2013, old but capable for a few more years. I could find a few for around 1200€ but then i thought in Mac Mini M1 (used to own one late 2012 and still own) and for 1500€ i get a full today update for a lot more years.

[@ConstantGeekery]

A friend of mine is a photographer and he got the 16GB M1. He is extremely happy with it! I think it makes more sense than the Mac Pro at this point.

[@PauloParreira]

@@ConstantGeekery Yes, exactly . Thanks

[@DevstepAV]

I had the same noise interference issue with my egpu and audio interface. I was able to remedy the situation by plugging my egpu into a Ebtech Hum X

[@ConstantGeekery]

I’ll check that out - thanks 👍🏻

[@professorthiagocabral]

Good post-review experience! I have a 2013 Mac Pro 12 core, 64GB of RAM and 2TB storage for a audio professional production and post-production works running ProTools 2020 and many many plug-ins. Very good performance and stable. I buy after to listen to your opinion in first review and upgrade tutorial in your channel. Thank You!

[@fleekwoodmac3705]

I'm in a similar situation (studio one). I'm looking to upgrade my hd as I'm still running the original 256gb. What make and model did you score? I want to down load superior drummer 3 but the fucking program is 238 gigs. That most of the hard drive! And I am not giving up my izotope and brainworx plug ins. Any help?

[@professorthiagocabral]

@@fleekwoodmac3705 see the topic for SSD Upgrade in blog.greggant.com/posts/2019/05/07/the-definitive-mac-pro-2013-trashcan-guide.html. I use an Adata NVMe SSD SX8200. Very good performance! God look!

[@fleekwoodmac3705]

@@professorthiagocabral I will tell tales of your bravery and daring to my grandkids.

[@Listenerz1]

Try focusrite for your audio connection for the speakers... you can also record audio for live instruments and boards...there are many models and they can be pretty cheap compared to the quality you get... hope that helps... I had m-audio speakers and they were pretty good, but I have since switched to Yamaha H8’s

[@ConstantGeekery]

Good shout. I used to have a Focusrite - good kit. I went with an Antelope Audio Discrete 4 in the end. Not so cheap... but it is excellent!

[@RemindMeToBuiild]

I have the same setup and stumbled on to this. Great vid, thx. Going to try to plug my razor core x into the lower left port to see if it will boot in that position like yours. Thanks again!

[@ConstantGeekery]

Glad it was useful for you 👍🏻

[@jasongrey5712]

where can I get the thunderbolt 2 to tb3 adapter or the right cable?

[@ConstantGeekery]

@@jasongrey5712 The adapter is this one: amzn.to/2K0gnhh and the cable: amzn.to/3gSMGuh (though any certified Thunderbolt 2 cable should be fine).

[@jasongrey5712]

@@ConstantGeekery Thank you!

[@jasongrey5712]

@@ConstantGeekery I just have a question, i got a 2018 13“ macbook pro with 8 gb of ram and 4 thunderbolt ports, would i have any limitation while creating music because of the 8 gb of ram?

[@All2jPro]

To resolve the audio interference on the my Mac Pro, I couldn’t put all my desk set up on one power outlet so I used a grounding loop noise isolator.. even the cheap ones under £10 do the job…

[@zednik8956]

Im very much looking to do the exact thing youve done with your mac pro when i get a new job :D

[@okay1904]

Good job. Great video. The Mac ecosystem is tempting - very tempting. If I had the money or needed OSX specific apps like Logic or FInal Cut Pro, then I would have no choice. But the world is moving more towards open multiplatform support and most of my apps have OSX versions as well as Windows support. The key issue about Apple Silicon is app native well tested support by apps and plugins. Especially in a business setting, I would rather run a 2013 Mac Pro for most uses, unless I absolutely needed some of the video editing power that the new M1 chips and the ARM processors provide for editing certain compressed video formats, better than an Intel/AMD based platform is able to. And even then if my clients needed such high end productivity, then best to find the money and get the latest Mac Pro with a good GPU config - expensive yes - but less risky than becoming a guinea pig on an M1 computer, if I wanted to handle the kind of work where huge RAM, and the ability to reconfigure my computer specs after purchase is valuable. At this time, many key apps and plugins do not yet support the M1 natively, so for demanding users, the M1 is a bit of a non issue, cos migration to the M1 will not be seamless. And even apps that should run in Rosetta, sometimes have issues. So for most high end users, who typically need a proper desktop machine, there are at this time only three choices really that are stable - Intel Windows, Intel Mac Pro(choose 2013 or 2019), or AMD Windows. And most of these options allow the level of configuration flexibility that high end users need. The way to look at this is like buying a Toyota or a Luxury German Car. With a Toyota you get fewer options, but you get 65% of what you need, in the base model, at a lower price. Which is what most people need - a Toyota - start - drive - arrive - safely - at an acceptable price - in comfort - and you can go anywhere a Mercedes can (if you also need to drive within speed limits). If you have special customers for whom its important that you arrive in a Merc, then you have no choice - get a Merc - e.g on your wedding day. I'm typing this on a 2014 Laptop - Intel, i5, Windows 10, and I can see myself continuing to use this for another 5 years, unless something irrepairable breaks. Cos as a daily driver I cant see why I need anything else to browse the web, and conduct personal computing. No need for an upgrade. This is similar to what most other people need. But many will buy and M1 Mac, not because they really need one, but Apples marketing makes them feel they need one. How fast can you browse the web, when most of the speed at which you use the web, has more to do with the network communication speed, than the speed of your CPU or GPU, i.e most modern computers will perform about the same, for browsing the web or using office apps, as long as they have enough RAM. So Apples shiny new toys, in all their products are for those who like toys, to make them feel better about themselves. I have not work a watch for 4 years, cos my phone, and computer tell me the time. Why would I need an iWatch? I do all my ilistening to music on Spotify - streamed - so why do I need an iPod?, I have no absolute need for an iPad - none - just a nice desirable fascinating to, but not a need. Same with the M1 Macs, nice shiny new toys - not absolutely needed, unless I must identify myself and brag about having one, or I run the kind of business where displaying apple devices makes me look more compliant. Let's face it - Apple is not a computer company, they are a lifestyle business, fo people who need an iWatch to tell them when its time to take a break and go for a jog - or stupid things like that, which apps on one's phone for free already do the same. IN spite of all the published stats, the number of use cases where an M1 provides an advantage for most people, are few, and most people will save a lot of money on a competitively prices Intel or AMD computer if thy know where to look for one. For those in the UK, who need custom PC's I suggest scan.co.uk - well recommended custom PC builder, with high quality parts and in-house post build testing + warranty. And you get a good new computer and save yourself quite a bit of money. And this is a computer whose configutration you can upgrade and extend the life of, if needed down the line.

[@smurf6595]

Could you make an update using Kryptonite? Supposedly this supersedes PurgeWrangler and is supposed to be much better

[@ConstantGeekery]

It is basically the same, just the name changed and development continued. I sold my Mac Pro last year, but I have been toying with the idea of trying to find a cheap project one... if I do, then I'll make an update vid.

[@macguru9999]

I built a similar machine to you and found that the add ons to compensate for its limitations (graphics, thunderbolt 2, usb 3 ) were a bit much. So I sold it for $4k AU and went back to my 2012 mac pro. (I am not encoding video; mainly office work, playing media and backing up client files ) specs below. Mac Pro 5,1 6-Core 3.46GHz X5690, 64GB, MVC Sapphire RX580 Optical -- LG Internal Blu-ray burner Samsung 970 Pro 1TB M.2 NVMe PCIe/10.14.6 USB 3.1/1TB 860 EVO/2x 2TB Crucial SSDs/8TB - Seagate Barracuda (Time Machine)

[@MarcusMonkey]

Hi I bought 2013 Mac Pro and I bought new maxed out back in 2014 and ive had it since. I considered up grading my Mac but to get a new version I dont think is finically worth it for the little upgrade you get. I use it to video edit. I film with a GH5, Red raven, red one, red dragon, red Komodo. I use primer pro and After effects. Would you recommend me buying a eGPU for a faster work flow.

[@ConstantGeekery]

I haven’t tested in Premiere Pro, so I can’t offer any recommendations I’m afraid.

[@winterkhan]

Thanks for the review, very useful, some technical data would be much nicer. Can you compare the performance of egpu and mac pro(12 core/d700/64gb/1tb) for 1300$ and Mac Studio (M1 Max 10cpu/24gpu/64gb) for 2750$, is the performance very different?

[@jalil0b]

is it possible to run Ollama for LLMs on the egpu with the 2013 Mac Pro? it would be worth sharing as a KZbin video if you can manage to do it

[@frankfeng98]

I believe that the lack of usage of eGPU is because your mac is alrdy using a relatively powerful discrete GPU, so FCPX decided that the on board GPU should be prioritized. For 13inch baseline MacBook Pro where an integrated GPU is concerned, connecting to eGPU would make FCPX utilize that eGPU as much as possible.

[@ConstantGeekery]

It does work better with my MBP Pro 13”, but Davinci Resolve just seems to do a better job of distributing the workload. What I didn’t mention in the video (but I have covered in previous videos), is that it used to work fine. eGPU support got messed up when FCPx was updated for the 2019 Mac Pro, and Apple have never fixed it.

[@frankfeng98]

@@ConstantGeekery right, the 2019 update really messed up the eGPU support, from the version which they decided to remove the 'prefer eGPU' option in the app preference, eGPU has been really baddd. Just wondering if the upcoming 10.5.0 would make a big difference, right now 10.4.9 still sucks, and in-screen acceleration does not work at all, even for baseline 13mbp...

[@ConstantGeekery]

@@frankfeng98 I’m very interested to see what happens to eGPU in the new version. I’m hoping that it will be better supported, but the fact that Apple has stopped selling eGPUs is probably ominous.

[@alandances7261]

Can you make a video on how to get an egpu set up on a Mac Pro 2013???? With the thunderbolt 2

[@ConstantGeekery]

I did this one three years ago: kzbin.info/www/bejne/sHKrcn-hiMiAl5Y As far as I know, the basic principles are the same, except Purge Wrangler is now called Kryptonite.

[@thatsaloadofcrap]

Thanks! Like you I'm limping along with my trashcan.... waiting for an M2 version Need help: I missed a link to the SSD you upgraded to....

[@ConstantGeekery]

I bought a used Generation 4 Apple SSD. You can find them on eBay, though it’s cheaper to take the NVMe route.

[@thatsaloadofcrap]

​@@ConstantGeekery I haven't tried it, but there's OWC.... $239 for 1TB. I tried an NVMe from Ebay, didn't work.

[@ConstantGeekery]

@@thatsaloadofcrap I’ve seen comments from a few people saying they used OWC drives, so that may be an option.

[@TravisLohmannMusic]

omg. that Faderport 6!

[@lagenebved130]

Thanks for these wonderful series on the 2013 Mac Pro. A quick question: What's the optimum RAM upgrade one should get for this if one is using -- lightly -- FCPX, Da Vinci Resolve, Aperture and Capture One? I have the 3.5Ghz 6 Core machine, + D500 3GB + 16GB RAM (one 4GB module has errors) and 1TB Flash drive. Thanks.

[@ConstantGeekery]

I’m glad you’ve enjoyed the videos. 32GB would probably be OK, but given the prices on used DIMMs, I’d go for 64GB in four DIMMs. Technically you can go up to 128GB, but this will actually hurt performance, so there’s no point in going that high unless you have a specific need.

[@lagenebved130]

@@ConstantGeekery Thank You!! Look forward to more of your videos!

[@ConstantGeekery]

@@lagenebved130 Thanks 😊

[@timbald]

Superb, as ever. Many thanks. Was hoping mid way through you'd mention Adobe Premiere CC performance on the 2013+eGPU rig, but still, the DaVinci Resolve into was very intriguing. I'm wondering whether the 2013 might make a good Logic Pro workhorse even now for 4 to 5 years. Guess it entirely depends whether BigSur+1 or beyond will be supported on a 2013 Intel machine. Thanks again!

[@ConstantGeekery]

Thank you 🙏 I’m not an Adobe user any more, hence no tests with their software. I would say 2013 Mac Pro is ideal for Logic Pro, even if you stayed on Catalina for some years. I will install Big Sur on mine... and make a video about it. I have a spare Apple SSD I can throw in to test. Even if Apple lock this machine out (which I doubt, since they were still selling it new a year ago), someone will figure out a workaround, just like they did with the Mac Pro 5,1.

[@jaredise5132]

I have a 2013 Mac Pro with 6cores, 64 gigs ram, and 512 gigs SSD. I almost never have issues with logic with this thing. I think the most I’ve pushed it is with about a 300 track session and even then the CPU runs less than 50%. I’d say if you have bigger sessions then get the CPU with more cores for sure, but the 6 core works just fine for me.

[@thelastrenaissanceman3012]

I loved FCP from user friendly standpoint but found it to be incredibly resource intensive and cause insurmountable lag. After using Adobe Suite a few times, I taught myself how to use it better because it was far far more usable than FCP. Was your user experience different?

[@FirstInProductions]

Thank you for your great videos, they have all been very helpful!

[@FirstInProductions]

From your experience in FCPX, do you think the 6,1 with dual 700s would add much performance over the 300's in FCPX 10.4.6 using the 12 core chip you have (without an eGPU)? I'm looking for improved background render for effects like stabilisation as well as final render times with 4K Prores footage. Thanks

[@ConstantGeekery]

The D700 definitely has more horsepower so I would expect you would see better timeline performance and better render times (for codecs that aren't CPU bound), especially where you are using effects or have multiple layers. That said, for many scenarios the new Apple M1 Macs are probably quicker for FCPx.

[@ConstantGeekery]

Glad you like them!

[@SilverBpark]

Hi I have a question.. I'm using Mac Pro(late2013) /.3.7 GHz Quad-Core Intel Xeon E5 / 48 GB 1866 MHz DDR3 / AMD FirePro D300 2 GB and watching your video... I am going to get Razer Core X Chroma for Cinema 4D + Octane render ... Do you think it's gonna work with Octane if I get the eGPU that you recommend?? Then I need to get it ASAP.

[@juhat785]

Thanks for update. I'm running Mac Pro 2013, 12 core, D700, 128GB, 1TB configuration with High Sierra + Purge Wrangler combo to use GeForce 1080 Ti inside Razer CoreX. I have been using eGPU for mainly 3D rendering such as Octane and Redshift renderers. I was wondering if you have any experience or knowledge if I choose to replace my 1080Ti with Radeon 5700XT and upgrade my macOS to latest (Catalina or Big Sur), would it be more beneficial with Blackmagic Resolve where is multiple GPU options such as CUDA, OpenCL or Metal. Is it still faster to have old macOS and 1080Ti (CUDA) or more up to date macOS with better Metal optimisation? I would hugely appreciate your thoughts. Best.

[@ConstantGeekery]

Good question. I have seen a comment from one of the Blackmagic dev team that suggests there isn't a performance advantage between CUDA, Metal or OpenCL - assuming all else is equal. Obviously, your nVidia card will work best with CUDA, whereas the 5700 XT works best with Metal. Given that the 1080 Ti probably edges the 5700 XT in overall performance, I'm not sure you'll see much benefit with the upgrade. Once AMD's 6000 series cards have full macOS support, that would likely be a better upgrade path... though you may find you're trading some stability going from High Sierra to Catalina or Big Sur. The latest version of Catalina is much more stable on the 2013 Mac Pro than previously, but some people are still not having great experiences (particularly if you upgrade rather than fresh install). I will be testing Big Sur on the channel with the 2013 Mac Pro... and possibly a 6000 series AMD card too. Sorry I can't offer a definitive answer.

[@juhat785]

@@ConstantGeekery Thank you for your reply. Indeed new cards are coming out very soon as we speak so let’s wait and see when we can have 6800 or 6900 support. What do you think how well thunderbolt 2 will perform? With 3D it should be OK as when rendering frame by frame, all information is sent then it calculates frame and continues to next frame so not so much data transferring back and forth to stress bandwidth. Not sure with editing and compositing 4k or even 8k. I was thinking about building Hackintosh, but my Mac Pro is serving so well and it has been rock solid for so long, I am waiting some more “official” and easier solution first. Thanks again.

[@valecharliewalbaumsearle9827]

Hi Constant Geekery, thanks for that video! I have a iMac 5k 27” 2020, running a 3.6 GHz 10-core i9 processor and a AMD Radeon Pro 5700 TX 16 GB and 64 GB DDR4 Memory. Would you recommend using a Razer core X (with which GPU?) for graphics, mainly Photoshop, After Effects and Cinema 4D. I don’t really understand much about GPU performance and so my next question would be, will a eGPU card have to greater/bigger/better than the one on my iMac to perform better at tasks? And if so, what or which one would you recommend? The computer will start going slower over time and when trying to render, the first project will take x amount of time and anything after will take exponentially more time 2x, 3x, 4x… Thanks!

[@ConstantGeekery]

I wouldn't recommend eGPU for your scenario. To get the best from eGPU you need to plug your monitor into it, which doesn't really suit the iMac. Accelerating the in-built display will bottleneck the card in the eGPU, and so it just won't provide much benefit. Drivers for the latest AMD cards are limited to chipsets that are available to the Mac Pro, so there aren't many consumer options beyond the 5700, Vega64 and Radeon VII. The slowing down between renders is likely due to thermal throttling. I have found fan control apps like TG Pro, can be helpful. Apple are very conservative with fan curves, so running them at a higher speed when you're rendering might be useful. The iMac doesn't have the best thermal performance, especially with that CPU and GPU combo, but I don't think eGPU will make enough of a difference, unless you use it with an external display... and even then, it doesn't represent good value.

[@valecharliewalbaumsearle9827]

Thanks for your reply!

[@MichaelSidneyTimpson]

I am still running High Sierra on mine. Do you recommend avoiding Catalina? BTW--my M-Audio FIREWIRE connector still works wonderful (via conversion) on it. Also, I find my Mac Pro is still the fastest "PC" in our house, running Windows 10 purely through emulation on Fusion.

[@ConstantGeekery]

I’ve found Catalina has improved. I don’t have much choice though - there are no drivers for the RX 5700 XT prior to Catalina. Generally I recommend Mojave. These computers are much better than some would have you believe! 😁

[@fastcars3483]

Popcorn time :) i love your videos!

[@TheAppleLab]

as always a great video. could you explain the connection between OpenCore and Windows10? maybe you remember my comments to one of your last eGPU videos, i was comparing the results with my similar setup. i have made some clips about OpenCore on my channel but never see the connection to windows10 and egpu since opencore never use my vega in the external enclosure.

[@ConstantGeekery]

I was speaking from memory and I said OpenCore, but I didn’t actually mean that. The solution requires creating DSDT overrides. Apologies for the error.

[@TheAppleLab]

@@ConstantGeekery : thanks for clearing this, but maybe somebody find a way to use? :)

[@ConstantGeekery]

@@TheAppleLab I’m aware of one user on egpu.io who got it working without messing with DSDT by disabling various PCI resources in Windows Device Manager. I tried a lot of that and got to the point where my eGPU was recognised in device manager, but the AMD drivers wouldn’t install. My eGPU has the ethernet and USB, so it requires more resources than Windows can allocate within its 32 bit addressing space. There are plenty of instructions online, but it’s quite an involved process and I heard of at least one user bricking his MacBook Pro when trying it (by accidentally overwriting his EFI partition). I did personally try one of the tutorials to create my own modified dsdt.dsl file, but despite several attempts, it didn’t work. I’m left with the option of downloading a pre-configured file, which I haven’t tried yet, but based on forum posts, it doesn’t work for many users.

[@TheAppleLab]

@@ConstantGeekery i just have the core x without ethernet and usb and even this enclosure is running into error12...where did you got the dsdt for the 6,1 mac pro?

[@ConstantGeekery]

@@TheAppleLab I think everything you need is linked to from this page: egpu.io/forums/pc-setup/fix-dsdt-override-to-correct-error-12/ - let me know if you have some success 😊

[@tomkarenmax]

Hi. Love the info. Thanks for taking the time to share. Question...for the Man Pro, Would the Radeon 6800 XT or 6900 XT GPU (RX Series) be any better/faster than the 5700 that you have used? Would it be worth the extra cost?

[@ConstantGeekery]

It would be better, but there are no drivers yet AFAIK.

[@ChetanSachdev]

Is it possible to connect Dell Ultra Sharp on the thunderbolt ports in Mac Pro 2013?

[@ConstantGeekery]

Yes. The ports output DisplayPort signal, so you need a cable with Mini DisplayPort at the Mac end (which looks identical to Thunderbolt 2). Depending on your monitor, you will either need Mini DisplayPort or standard DisplayPort at the other end. I believe you can buy HDMI adapters too.

[@oscarfeatherstone6688]

I use the six-core model as a daily driver. It still is fantastic.

[@MichaelSidneyTimpson]

me too! I bought the 12-core CPU to install, but in no rush since I haven't found a reason to need the upgrade.

[@TheDustin151]

I do too. I find it funny when some of these KZbin personalities rip on this computer because they can’t render their 4K video in under 10 minutes. Well I don’t render any video so I don’t care. It’s a fantastic computer that I plan on using for years to come.

[@inlinesk8r477]

@@TheDustin151 until is unsupported by MacOS in the next 1-2 year(end of life of the product) : /

[@altosack]

@@inlinesk8r477- I’m running Sequoia on mine! It cost $250 for an 8-core w/64 GB; I’ll upgrade to Apple Silicon as soon as I can afford a 128GB model - that may be awhile.

[@deadalkabob]

currently planning on using my rtx 3060 with my 2019 macbook pro..... I

[@impendio]

Also in retrospect, compared to the 2020 27in iMac, is this 2013 pro worth the hassle for someone that doesn't like to open machines if possible? Getting either in my country is pretty impossible but at least shipping a 2013 mac pro or some arrangement of mac mini+eGPU from the US is a lot more reasonable.

[@ConstantGeekery]

The iMac or Mini+eGPU is better if you don’t want to open the machine. Upgrading the Mac Pro is fairly involved.

[@jennifermedia6288]

Hi there , you know allot about this, Could the epgu work with a 2013 MacBook Pro or a 2017 5k iMac. Not sure if I should upgrade the laptop and get a Dell or 4K monitor or upgrade my imac

[@MichaelSidneyTimpson]

Question, if you use an eGPU with a trashcan, are you limited to just the four monitor ports on the eGPU, or can you still attach additional monitors?

[@ConstantGeekery]

You can attach additional monitors to the Mac, which will use the internal GPUs.

[@Fobeats]

Hi, I was wondering if there's a way of using epgu with the mac pro running bootcamp Windows10. I've seen it being used online but I haven't managed to achieve it myself. Spend the best of 3 days trying to figure it out. Both the razorcore x and blackmagic egpu worked with mojave with purge wrangler but none of the work with Windows. I have tried both Windows 1803 and 1903, DDU and EFI processes and non worked I'm just tired of trying to get the oculus rift cv1 to work.... Im using mac pro 2013 128gb RAM 1TB SSD Osx Mojave Blackmagic egpu rx580 and razorcore x rx470 ANY ideas will be highly appreciated.

[@ConstantGeekery]

It is notoriously tricky. Windows uses a 32bit address space for PCIe whereas macOS uses 64bit. The 2013 Mac Pro needs this larger address space, so you get conflicts and the infamous “Error 12”. You need to search for “DSDT overrides 2013 Mac Pro” - this will help with the address space issue. It probably still won’t work after that due to driver conflicts, but there are some threads on the forums to help with that. Some people have got it working with RX580, so good luck!

[@juancelestino8563]

Hey, thanks for the video. If you use 2 monitors? Does the dummy necessary? Thanks

[@ConstantGeekery]

No. You just need the second display, whether real or not.

[@nuvisionmedia-3dcreativeco722]

Great video. I have a similar set up however my monitor is a 5KLG curved screen which I’m unable to get it to work properly. What is your suggestion for this? Do I need to buy the same dummy adapter? I ordered what I thought was a dummy mini display port adapter but it ended up being a HDMI dummy adapter! Evidently this does not work to get my screen to display correctly. The only difference is I don’t have an EGPU connected yet

[@ConstantGeekery]

The dummy plug is just a workaround for the driver bug. If you want to drive a 5K display on the 2013 Mac Pro, I think you need to use two cables. Alternatively, an eGPU will do it.

[@nuvisionmedia-3dcreativeco722]

@@ConstantGeekery two cables? Where does the second one go? As in just plug one MDP in And not connect it to anything.

[@ConstantGeekery]

@@nuvisionmedia-3dcreativeco722 The 2013 Mac Pro has Thunderbolt 2 / DisplayPort 1.2 so, as far as I’m aware the maximum resolution is 4K. For 5K, you need Thunderbolt 3 / DisplayPort 1.4. The earliest 5K monitors had dual inputs which would combine two cables to provide 5K resolution. Newer 5K monitors won’t have a dual combined input. You can see on this page that the 2013 Mac Pro can drive 3 dual-cable 5K displays (support.apple.com/kb/sp697?locale=en_GB), which would use up all available Thunderbolt ports.

[@nuvisionmedia-3dcreativeco722]

@@ConstantGeekery ok thanks. It appears I did not do my research correctly. Sounds like an egpu will work for this set up with a new 5K display?

[@ConstantGeekery]

@@nuvisionmedia-3dcreativeco722 should do. If it’s the LG Ultrafine with Thunderbolt, you’ll need the Blackmagic eGPU.

[@seven_yellow]

will a EGPU support hardware acceleration for H265? I know I can with an interal GPU with my 5,1

[@ConstantGeekery]

All the features of the GPU are available. How much benefit you get depends on whether you are driving an external display from the eGPU and how the software application deals with it.

[@peacetrip5049]

I am a retired teacher, musician, composer - arranger who creates in Logic and works non-professionally in FCP. I love your presentations and am now considering upgrading my 6 core, 64 gb 2013 Mac Pro (I have used and loved since 2014) to a 12 core. (No egpu I have the dual internal 500 gpus) I recall you saying 64 gb RAM is better than 128. I wonder why you think this is so.... Also .... After watching you and others reviews of the new M1 MINI I am wondering about the whole upgrade path for my 2013?

[@ConstantGeekery]

If you put 128GB in the Mac it will result in slightly slower performance overall. If you don't need more than 64GB, there's no point in going above. I will be doing some comparison videos between the M1 Mini and 2013 Mac Pro, so you may want to hang on and see what that brings. I'd also say that professional users should wait until the next phase of M1 roll-out - it'll be even better.

[@peacetrip5049]

@@ConstantGeekery thanks for that Happy Thanksgiving from the states

[@TravisLohmannMusic]

@@ConstantGeekery thank god I never updated past 64!

[@mikejezo]

That Amazon cable you’re using is slow I tested it against other cables. The one you plug on the left of the tower

[@ConstantGeekery]

Interesting. I didn’t notice any issues when benchmarking, but I’ll test against a genuine Apple cable. Thanks for the heads up 👍🏻

[@frannyfranman]

The ultimate Mac Pro mod would be adapting the proprietary gpu connector to PCIE, cutting a hold in the case and attaching a full size gpu. I'm sure there's a thousand reasons this can't happen, but it would be a nice middle finger to apple

[@ryangardner3655]

Really helpful video, thanks! Do you have any experience with this machine and Adobe Premiere Pro / Media Encoder? I have a 2019 MacBook pro 16 inch with 8gb Graphics, but really want a machine in the background to handle rendering whilst I continue to edit other videos on my MacBook pro. Looking at a 6 core 2013 mac pro with dual D500 graphics and 64gb Ram. My budget is around £1k max. What are your thoughts?

[@ConstantGeekery]

I don’t use Premiere Pro, so I’m not sure I’m well placed to comment. If it is primarily GPU rendering then it won’t set the world alight. You might not care about that if it’s running as a render farm in the background. 🤷‍♂️

[@JWalking]

Which sensors are you monitoring with your TG Pro software on the L2013 MacPro to keep them at 60°c ?

[@ConstantGeekery]

I think it was the GPU sensors, but I don’t have the machine any more and I’m struggling to remember - sorry!

[@oldfinnishfarmer]

Yeah i Luke my mp2013 for music and web design a lot. I can recommend to get uaudio twin tb interface! I have three quad core apollos in a rack :) what is the app called to adjust the fan speed? Great video!

[@ConstantGeekery]

Thanks for the recommendation - I’ll check that out. TG Pro is the fab app I use.

[@MusicForIMAGES]

I have the possibility to buy for 800 Euros two D700 video cards to replace my D300s on my mac Pro with 12 CORE. Have you ever tried this replacement? Do you think it will give a benefit? Thank you for your time and attention.

[@ConstantGeekery]

I have no personal experience with the upgrade, but it's straightforward enough to swap the boards - much like changing the CPU, you need to be reasonably competent and comfortable with dismantling. The D700 is a pretty decent upgrade over the D300 due to the threefold increase in VRAM. In applications which support dual GPU and benefit from additional VRAM, you should see an improvement. Is the performance uplift alone worth €800? Not really - even with today's GPU prices - but you also need to factor in the scarcity: this is the only way to get more GPU performance internally on the 6,1. So, it depends on how tied you are to the Mac Pro 6,1 and what sort of work you are doing.

[@MusicForIMAGES]

@@ConstantGeekery You're right!! but I think the Mac Pro 6.1 is currently the only professional desktop computer that allows me to have 6 TB2 + 4 USB. I currently work with 3 monitors in 4k and I'm hoping the D700s can get me to use another 1080 monitor. I use Logic and Davinci. But it is on Davinci that I have the slowdown during rendering. For this reason I also bought for 130 euros a 12 Core as you recommended on another video. Thanks for your careful and quick reply. I will keep you updated.

[@MusicForIMAGES]

@@ConstantGeekery I also thought that when you have a graphics card natively connected to your computers using PCI Express like D700 you get the benefit of all the bandwidth. Whereas via thunderbolt it has much less bandwidth. What I don't know is how much faster two D700s can be, since they are internal, than an external eGPU card.

[@ConstantGeekery]

@@MusicForIMAGES The majority of the time, the Mac Pro only uses one GPU. The D700 is not a powerful GPU by modern standards. Despite the bandwidth limitations of Thunderbolt 2, a 5700XT like I have in my eGPU can still out-perform dual D700s in almost every area. 🤷‍♂️

[@MusicForIMAGES]

@@ConstantGeekery Thanks to your videos and advice I upgraded my Mac Pro to 12 CORE with D700 instead D300, and I am very satisfied. I'm asking if it can still make sense to find a Razer Core x Chroma with a Radeon 5700 xt considering I work with Davinci Resolve and have 3 monitors. Thanks for your time and attention.

[@CanisLatrans_]

Hello. Thank you for your content- very useful! You mentioned new AMD GPUs. I was actually keen to go for eGPU for my macpro 2013 but also to go with new AMD GPU when it's out. What you think about this upgrade? Would those new cards work? Cheers!

[@ConstantGeekery]

They may work, but to get the most out of it you’ll need an optimised driver. Whether Apple and AMD have done that yet I don’t know, but I’m sure they will as there will be some Mac Pro 2019 owners who want to install these cards. Would it be worth using in an eGPU connected to a 2013 Mac Pro? Maybe - depends what you’re doing and how whether you’re happy to spend the money.

[@dennismurray00]

I use mine as a daily workhorse and it crashes with kernel panics often. Tried fresh install, al apple memory, new hard drive, new processor. Nothing fixes it.

[@ConstantGeekery]

That sucks. If you've tried everything else, perhaps it's a logic board issue?

[@dennismurray00]

@@ConstantGeekery I hear it's an issue with this model, and if that's the case I'd worry about putting more money into it. I could get another bad logic board.

[@ConstantGeekery]

@@dennismurray00 very difficult decision, but probably wise.

[@pigknickers2975]

@@dennismurray00 I think that's true. This model always had this issue and it was probably never solved. One of the reasons they sort of abandoned it I guess.

[@Iamjimpage]

Hi what software are you using the monitor your GPU usage?

[@ConstantGeekery]

Activity Monitor.

[@sunlight7849]

Hello! What keyboard do you have in this video? Is it good for Mac Pro 2013 ?

[@ConstantGeekery]

It's the Apple Magic Keyboard with number pad, and yep, works well with the Mac Pro.

[@sunlight7849]

@@ConstantGeekery Will Apple Magic Keyboard 2 work with Mac Pro 2013?

[@ConstantGeekery]

@@sunlight7849 yes

[@sunlight7849]

@@ConstantGeekery Thanks !!!

[@io_inc]

what about app development?

[@ConstantGeekery]

I never used this rig for app development, but I have no doubt it would run Xcode nicely.

[@TheNewArtSchool]

Have you tried High Sierra on the MacPro?

[@ConstantGeekery]

I didn’t use it on mine.

[@TheNewArtSchool]

@@ConstantGeekery maybe it will help with all the glitches. Seems to be the best one Apple made for pre 2015 macs

[@ConstantGeekery]

@@TheNewArtSchool sadly no support for eGPU and RX5700XT on the older OS. Mine ram quite happily with Catalina and Big Sur, but I know a few audio pros who favour older versions.

[@TheNewArtSchool]

@@ConstantGeekery Our 2015 mbp’s are extremely noisy on a clean install of anything beyond high Sierra. You are running big sur on the 2013 Mac Pro?

[@ConstantGeekery]

@@TheNewArtSchool I was running Big Sur. I don’t have the Mac Pro any more.

[@dancook4993]

SR19H Intel Xeon E5-2697 v2 12-Core 2.70GHz QPI 30M 130W FCLGA2011 Processor will this work not sure what QPI MEANS OR THE FCLGA2011 OR THE Intel Xeon E5-2697 v2 SR19H 2.7GHz 12 Core LGA 2011 CPU Processor ?

[@ConstantGeekery]

They’re the same chip. Probably just different sellers or product databases putting different things in the name. The key bit is the model number E5-2697v2 which is definitely supported on the 2013 Mac Pro. QPI is QuickPath Interconnect, which would have been on all the Xeons of that era. FCLGA 2011 is the same as LGA 2011. All the LGA sockets are FCLGA (Flip-Chip Land Grid Array).

[@dancook4993]

How did you solve the small apple and then big apple at startup ?After reinstall of Monterey now when I start up it shows small apple then moves to big apple I heard you mention in video ,,,Thank you

[@impendio]

I'm still watching the video but what exactly is you main business? I actually have an engineering background and work on project management but have an itch to do something on digital design and production on the side with some partners and wondering on your work experience and vision on those markets.

[@ConstantGeekery]

I co-own a large web studio. We specialise in bespoke development for ecommerce and providing custom middleware to get various different systems talking to each other. My background is development (20+ years), but I'm currently working on some in-house projects, including video production. There is still a strong market for development, and good project managers, but I believe design is taking a hit due to the rise of the gig economy and the proliferation of websites connecting buyers with freelance designers.

[@Technocrat.]

It’s too bad none one has made a modern mobo that could work in 2013 mac pro, there must be someone in Asia thinking about it lol

[@marcinkozlowski2880]

👍👍👍

[@pigknickers2975]

M-Audio gear is pretty bad as you have discovered. Try Universal Audio - you can't go wrong. The solo would be ok for you.

[@ConstantGeekery]

Thank you for the tip - I will check it out.

[@pigknickers2975]

@@ConstantGeekery Trouble is you are going to need Thunderbolt but maybe in the future? I'm an audio pro and UA has really taken over the sector with amazing products and plugins. M-Audio has always been Mickey Mouse stuff for the kiddies.

[@ConstantGeekery]

@@pigknickers2975 I can use it with my MBP, so not the end of the world... until I change my main rig. I stupidly bought the M-Audio because it has MIDI onboard which is useful with my big Yamaha piano, but I’ve found the quality and stability to be woeful - especially considering it cost as much as the Focusrite Scarlett I had previously. 🤬

[@pigknickers2975]

@@ConstantGeekery LOL, I did make this mistake myself in the past.

[@furkankaya77]

kendime not: varil alındıktan sonra bu videoya dönülecek.(thunderbolt yazılımı, fan ince ayarı)

[@tvcowboys]

I have massive performance issues with my 4K Display using Adobe software. Did you encounter the same? I’m thinking about getting a egpu bc of that. I got 12cores 64gig and D700s. Maybe you can do a comparison e.g. browsing in Bridge with vs without egpu. Keep up the good work!

[@ConstantGeekery]

I've not personally experienced that, but then I don't use Adobe. I object to their licensing model. eGPU might well help with driving the display and smoothing that experience, but it's a lot to invest just for that. Might be worth seeing if you can borrow one first? Thanks for watching 😊

[@tvcowboys]

@@ConstantGeekery thanks! Sadly I got no possibility to borrow one and try.

[@ConstantGeekery]

@@tvcowboys looking at the forums it seems that eGPU performance for Adobe is underwhelming anyway.

[@tvcowboys]

@@ConstantGeekery I think the problem is more the display output. I had no problems on an 1440p display but 4K killed it :/

[@ConstantGeekery]

@@tvcowboys silly question probably... but you're not using the HDMI port are you?

[@sergiom.1714]

the gpu fans where not even on when editing... your egpu + gpu is overkill for what you do. Doesn’t even sweat, that is what I sold my razer core and 5700 red devil. Not worth the price for a couple of seconds faster rendering. I have a 2018 Mac mink 6 core. and for gaming don’t get me started! Games suck on Mac. I also have a dell xps with grx 1080 for gaming. That’s more than enough for my ultra wide 34 Samsung monitor. I rather have 2 different systems.

[@ConstantGeekery]

The fans on the 5700 XT only spin up when rendering, but it makes a big difference to timeline performance and it’s a lot more than a couple of seconds faster to render! Yes it’s overkill for basic KZbin videos, but not for commercial work. Bear in mind I also use it with my MacBook Pro, where it makes night and day difference. I also have a separate gaming PC, and I never recommend Mac for gaming.

[@Technocrat.]

I'll take your Mac pro 2013 lol. :-)

[@artysanmobile]

The free styling of the ‘desktop’ is a great move in the right direction. Apple goes to great pains to convince us all that macOS would be bad for iOS, which is the classic red herring argument. Every macOS feature they bring to iOS improves it enormously. Why? Because macOS is freaking perfect! It causes me great frustration how much of a mess iOS continues to be after literally scores of tiny tweaks. I stopped trusting Apple quite a while ago and iOS is the reason. I imagine a daily meeting in the heuristic department where top management shoots down every improvement that owes its brilliance to the macOS team. Honestly. Files? An ongoing disgrace.

[@SekouGriffin]

Wow. These workflows are being destroyed by AI!