2022 Compact Tractor Buyer's Guide #2 Selecting Frame Size & Transmission Type

Looking to buy a compact tractor this spring? Tractor Time with Tim discusses the differences in frame sizes for tractors that have the same horsepower.
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00:00 - Intro
00:21 - EPA Regulations
00:59 - 3 Frame Sizes Same HP
07:17 - Hydrostatic vs. Gear Drive Transmission
11:33 - Summary

[@bigbearhungry983]

I have had several Tractors over my life time. I'm now 74 years old. My rule of thumb is " What ever size Tractor you think you need, go one size larger. You won't be sorry.

[@JordanHaisley]

I agree completely, in general I think as big as the property and budget allow should be the starting point for most folks considerations.

[@Valiant8086]

if those EPA regulations on the 25 and under engines don’t take displacement and weight of engine into account, lets go back to the old torque monster days. My Farmall m with 35 hp would out pull our mf250 with 65 I am pretty sure. Big flywheel, large displacement, lower rpm, better fuel consumption, better sound, better reliability. Lets have mitsubishi toughen up there bigger engine. Run it at a low enough rpm to stop just shy of 25hp, put heavier bearrings on it maybe stronger crankshaft, and put a heavy flywheel. Heck, even fords from the 80s like our 4610 take a week to spool up all that weight, and another one to idle down again. The way a real tractor should be.

[@kidsythe]

just bought my tractor yesterday based on this comment. went with a L2501 from Kubota.

[@philsmock4943]

This series is going to be very helpful for anyone looking to buy their first time tractor. Looking forward to the next one.

[@kdegraa]

Only if you live in a nation whose government feels small farm tractors that often do not operate more than 50 hours a year, are an existential threat to the future of humanity and the Earth.

[@bekabeka71]

@@kdegraa in my country the government doesn’t care about agriculture or anything. So I’m saving up money to buy a small Chinese 22hp tractor for my garden to ploughing potatoes

[@4-LOW]

I actually started my tractor search knowing that I wanted a sub-compact. I was especially drawn to the idea of being able to get the tractor and multiple implements/attachments for the same cost as a compact tractor and loader alone. After I looked at them in person, I began to realize that they would struggle mightily with a 5' box blade full of gravel climbing a grade, or plowing, or running a 6' bush hog, or most of the other jobs I had in mind. Mainly it's a machine weight issue. The power is there, but as my father would say, the sub-compact "just doesn't have enough ass to get the job done." So, I ended up buying a compact tractor instead and I couldn't be happier. There are times it feels like I could have even gone larger, but the compact size with 40 HP has been able to do all the tasks I need.

[@gaffster787]

Our water delivery panel truck driver wandered off the driveway and was past axle deep in the mud. We both could not believe it when my 3025e pulled it right out. It has been a joy when brush hogging.

[@garycox7508]

I wish you had made this video about 2 years ago LOL when I was just entering the world of tractors. I think it condenses about 3 months worth of research into 13 minutes. Great info!

[@doncampbell5685]

Solid overview, couple points worth mentioning. The larger frame tractors get you bigger tires and more ground clearance which can be important if you get into soft/muddy offroad places. Second, the downsides to HST being higher fuel consumption and it also contributes to reducing the PTO power compared to a gear tractor. In many cases that compromise is fine (like mentioned loader operations) but a gear tractor larger frame could be an equalizer to a medium frame HST if the frame and weight are more important than the transmission.

[@tonyz2897]

Ground clearance can become even more of a concern on a small tractor when you throw a mid mount mower into the mix. That's something I wish I'd given more consideration before buying my Mahindra Emax 22, and now has me looking at larger machines or ditching the MMM for a 3pt finish mower.

[@davidschomp1131]

Makes me wonder how many would be interested in a turbo kit for the 25hp... especially on the larger frames to get around the DPF

[@Formulabruce]

Block off the EGR at the exhaust manifold and stop trying to burn up the exhaust = more power.

[@jasonhof81]

No kidding! I always wondered about those holes in my bucket. It’s a shame my dealer couldn’t tell me where they came from.

[@dwayneloftice2326]

Great "Info-ma-tion" segment, Tim. I am current owner/operator of a HST tractor that is perfect for my current needs but also have many, many years of a larger gear-drive tractor that was purchased for the previous heavy-duty applications. Your comments on those differences are right on point!

[@Bob-vb8lc]

That was a good conversation Tim. It will certainly help people to narrow down their tractor choice. I love my 1025R

[@Kcolby47]

Very good observations that point out that horsepower is not the only or even main consideration for those who are looking to make buying decisions. Well done. Blessings.

[@jamesyates5191]

Great review Tim. I went from a 54 hp New Holland gear to a JD2038R. The NH was way too big for my property with numerous trees (it came with the property). I love the hydrostatic transmission and I would probably not anything else. As far as the regen issue goes it rarely gets in my way. If it starts up just before I want to quit I just shut it down and it starts up the next time I use it.

[@joenemeth6072]

Don’t forget about the 3025D good mix of both. That’s what I bought! Thanks

[@Keith.Zielinski]

I enjoy hearing your honest opinion! Thank you! 😃

[@me98025]

Great public service. Thanks for sharing with those of use who are lacking in tractor knowledge.

[@michaelmartin9618]

This is a very helpful series for new (and old) tractor owners. Thanks for doing this series. What I really wanna know is........what are the metal tabs with the holes in them at the top ends of the new buckets. So far no one seems to know their purpose.

[@dougthegrouchdacof6170]

I watched this at work last night. Excellent video.

[@lcee6592]

Great explanation of frame size vs hp. It seems that figuring out what “size” of tractor will meet all needs then add as much hp as needed or even a bit more if affordable.

[@jasonbarthel4155]

Super informative as always, Thank you Tim!

[@chasbass5321]

Thank you for doing this series. In the market for new tractor. I have yet to see a video that discusses the reliability of the newer tractors that use a multitude of sensors/electronics. Last year I tried to help a friend with a green tractor that would start but not move. The info online was all over the place as far as troubleshooting. Ended up at the dealer and $300 bill to diagnose and fix a bad or dirty connector. So one factor to consider is complexity and reliability of an hst vs gear vs shuttle-shift after the warranty runs out.

[@bill29456]

Hey Tim: Great video. One thing that i learned watching Messicks review the same topic of same HP and different size frames is WEIGHT. If you need to run over lawns or grass areas, a bigger size will weight considerably heaver and most likely tear up the lawn. So an assessment of what the tractor will be normally used for is also a factor for consideration.

[@RockhillfarmYT]

Nice thorough explanation

[@tombarnes1871]

Enjoying this series Tim!!

[@livedlearnedDIY]

Another great, informative and entertaining video Tim. Keep them coming.

[@tractortalkwithgary1271]

Hey Tim,great job on this. You covered a lot of ground with this video. This was loaded with info.

[@vincentvanpaepeghem4844]

Great video Tim! Lots of great information! Thanks for sharing! Have a great and awesome day!

[@ralphfarmer7621]

Howdy Tim and Christy, I love your videos and have watched them for years. That's why I bought my 3025E and I love it. I live in north Florida. I use it mainly for grapple work. I have a Westendorf Brush Crusher and it works great. Remember just because it's 25hp it's a different engine than the 1025 and 2025. The 3025 power comes at a lower RPM. It pulls a 60 inch frail mower with no problem.Thanks again from Stray Away Ranch

[@RCPSU4]

Only time I ever operated a gear-drive was at least 20 years ago when I was helping our neighbor at the time get a fence put up. His tractor was an older 8N Ford and part of me wishes my dad would've adopted it when our neighbor moved south. I've seen him use this tractor with a rotary cutter in his sheep field and outside the fence, but don't know the cutter specs. We used it and a rear blade to spread big #4 limestone when we were extending our driveway. I'd have wanted to see what all that old Ford could really handle with PTO attachments like a chipper/shredder, flail mower, etc.

[@earlyriser8998]

Excellent series on the various size/hp options

[@Zanderthelab]

As usual, Tim and Christy, another great video!

[@MRSketch09]

Great video. Informative. Thanks for the heads up. I was curious about this myself.

[@javabean215]

Something I'd point out when considering frame size: smaller is *usually* more nimble and can get into places that the larger frames can't, like in/around stalls. However, since they have less weight they also have less tractive power. A 25 hp tractor that weighs 1500 pounds just can't pull the same load that a 25 hp 3000 pound tractor can pull due to traction limits.

[@Formulabruce]

AND the 3,000 pound Tractor has a much BIGGER 25 hp engine, with a LOT more torque.

[@wildbill23c]

@@Formulabruce AND the 3,000 pound tractor usually has more hydraulic flow for quicker loader operation, and hydraulic remotes that can operate some hydraulic motors that the smaller tractors cannot. The larger tractor will usually have a 3 range hydrostatic transmission, or a manual transmission

[@WackadoodleMalarkey]

The bigger tractors will also leave bigger ruts in your yard and wallet after your in- laws get done with it

[@LedgemereHeritageFarm]

I agree. I bought a small 26 HP for the clearance and nimbleness to get into stalls and under the barn. A big tractor wouldn’t have worked. The same holds true for mowing around and under obstacles. I know several people who busted the glass out of their cab tractors because the didn’t see that limb😫

[@PurpleCollarLife]

This is excellent information! I'm enjoying the series. I'm looking forward to the PTO video. I saw the clutch on a hydrostatic tractor I was looking at and it threw me. I didn't quite understand what it was for until I had a chance to talk with the salesman.

[@TractorTimewithTim]

We will explain Friday am.

[@cpk4772]

Have a 3025e so far so good,nice little tractor

[@sprucegoose1016]

Thx you for doing this series :) I'm looking to buy one in the next few years 👍

[@RobbyLucey]

Great video as usual. I received my 3025E in December. I've been using it with a 1.35m offset flail mower to cut heavy brush to reclaim a few meadows. I find it brilliant to be honest in terms of power, stability, etc. My understanding is that the 3025E is in fact, 19HP at the shaft even though many technical brochures state 17HP. I would say it's 19HP judging by the way it handles my flail mower. Anyways, keep up the good work. God bless.

[@nickg2366]

The L2501 is the same class as the 3025E. For me price was obviously the biggest factor as I think it is for most. I don't find the HP to be that big of a deal. Whenever I'm using my chipper, brush cutter or stump grinder (bought it from the green tractor store :) You just have to go slower and that's it. So by going with the L2501 instead of the L3901 I saved 10k and I just have mow a little slower, turn the feed down on the chipper and only take so much of each stump.

[@SeamrógCreek]

Super helpful! Thank you Tim!

[@coypatton3160]

My son just about 1 year ago, needed the lift capacity that was offered by the larger frame tractor. It was wanting a Kubota not sure of the model now but I think the L2501. Problem was that covid was affecting available. He ended up with the 3025 Deere. He has been well pleased with it once he was able to up the hydro pressure to take advantage of the the lift capacity.

[@zachturner8872]

Thank you for putting these together

[@rickseibel2069]

As a potentially new tractor buyer, I want to thank you for this series and love the scripture at the end!

[@jonathankerner2094]

Informative, well-presented in a logical manner. Thank you.

[@philhart8864]

Anther great video alway good to hear talk about the difference things on tractor. I wish I would have seen these before I bought my last tractor.

[@OldMeanGeezer]

This is VERY good information Tim! Thank You

[@gregoryflewellyn6369]

Great video,fully agree,need more than25hp for large frame!

[@MarkJohnson-pm6cx]

Again Tim great information, thanks for what you share

[@osagejon8972]

Hydrostatic is great for the folks who don’t have experience with running equipment. I would like a gear drive with a torque converter like a 580 case back hoe but I’m also use to running those. When I bought my L3901 that I use for my tree service I had wrestled with a mini skid steer or tractor… tractor was less $ and I figured new helpers could handle a tractor better quicker because it’s more like a car.

[@j3ah0o]

I have the same HP in a BX2230 and a McCormick 1.25XH. The Mac has a larger frame. I'm really impressed at how much more workability I have with the larger frame.

[@thomasburton5843]

Thank you for talking about the 3025e

[@chappie222]

Great episode as usual!

[@randalmiddleton8068]

Sooo many choices and decisions for the new compact tractor owners to think about. It was good to have TTWT and GWT plus many others to help ease that pain. Even learning what "not" to do lolol

[@mcd5082]

Excellent video Tim!

[@thehawkc]

Great info as usual thanks.

[@zoidsfan77]

I bought a Kubota B2401. It is a 25hp compact unsyncronized gear drive tractor. It also has a 2-speed pto. For my purpose, it works well. No DPF, 2-speed pto, gear drive, mid pto. Mine has a loader, mid mower, and backhoe. I will say it isn't for everyone. Definitely need to be a certain type to want a tractor like this, but I love it. Excellent videos Tim.

[@wildbill23c]

I guess if you don't have to do much loader work the gear drive would be fine...but I'd think having to shift back and forth all the time would get a bit tiring? Plus I'd think additional wear on the clutch if you are doing a lot of loader work.

[@zoidsfan77]

@@wildbill23c The hydrostat is no doubt more productive for loader type work. Regardless I use mine for loader work frequently, and I enjoy it (but not everyone would feel that way). I'm sure the clutch will wear out eventually, and I'll cross that bridge when I get to it. I don't let the clutch slip much when changing directions. Full stop with brakes and clutch out quickly.

[@drewmcvicker1445]

Great information Tim!

[@daveschmidt5713]

Keep them coming. Perhaps after the PTO episode, you can do one on the differences in hydraulic pumps and flow.

[@FelipeColby]

Very cool video, thanks!

[@dougraimondo4683]

2038R is my favorite size and great HP and hydrostatic is smooth.

[@davidtenley5993]

I bought a Kioti ck26 HST. My needs were focused on loader and ground clearance more over the pto capabilities. However, if I want to expand my working options, I do agree to upgrading hp.

[@williamcoffman7149]

as a owner of a 2020 1025R because of this channel, i haft to just put a plug out there that this tractor even thou it's the smallest, it's very mighty in it's power and had impressed me just about every way it's helped...do highly suggest that if you choose to buy this size of tractor, also get the frontier pallet forks and the frontier PG11 grapple that attaches to it if your doing any picking up logs, debree, or want to clamp down on things when needed (only $550.00 at summer of 2021 pricing)..remember buying a bigger tractor isn't allways the smartest way to go about things as Tim has pointed out here, the price of the attachment go up the bigger the tractor you buy....happy with the purchase, now only if deere gave this tractor a 3 speed setup...

[@questamerica9873]

The answers to my questions are out there I just need to look. And it looks like you really like the 1025r. That really helps when I'm ready to purchase. Thank you.

[@wildbill23c]

They have plenty of power, the problem is the lack of weight to put the power to the ground effectively. You end up losing traction long before you run out of pulling power LOL. The 1 series is great for smaller properties for sure. Pallet forks are a must if you buy a tractor with a loader LOL. So many uses for them, other than just for pallets.

[@EOTG_AK]

One good thing is the tasks that make 25hp too low are also the things that keep the DPF cleaned out. Namely running up hills and doing PTO work like brush hogging.

[@CSmothersForge]

Good comparison! I was just by the crawfordsville JD dealership over the weekend! Thought it looked familiar

[@PastorDavidFranklin]

Well done Tim!

[@je1279]

Having a LX3310 you may disagree Tim, but I find the LX2610 to be a great fit for a mowing/snow plowing setup that can also do well with occasional loader, grapple and box blade work. I guess it all depends on your uses. I agree that it would not be ideal if used it with ground engaging attachments on a regular basis.

[@matthewerwin4677]

A manufacturer needs to make a 25hp tractor with oversized fuel system, powertrain, and driveline. All made to support a aftermarket turbo. Throw a turbo on it and bam! A 50hp emissions free tractor all legal!

[@BobsOutdoorActivities]

That was really imformative.

[@philipchamberlain9563]

Don't forget hydro generates a lot of heat when pulling (check for oil coolers on hydro if ya live in hot areas).

[@MarcStLouis-cr7yk]

Tim is correct! Lager frame offers much more & if pricing is an issue, sacrificing hp for larger frame may make sense. I owned a 2025R for two yrs. & traded it in for a 2038R cause it lacked hp doing heavy duty work & tilling. Have a friend that mainly uses his for cutting grass & doesn’t mainly need the extra hp. Both are excellent tractors & if I had to I could of made the 25 hp work.

[@stephengmeiner3264]

My L3301 HST has a clutch which I love for the PTO. I like being able to slowly engage the PTO and bring it up to speed for things like a finish mower or chipper. I hate that “clunk and it’s going” approach.

[@TractorTimewithTim]

Will discuss next episode.

[@hhazelhoff1363]

Always buy the biggest tractor you can afford. That’s all you ever need to know. All modern brands of tractor today make a really decent product. Stick with a brand that has a service center near buy. It’s like you garage. Always want it bigger

[@joshmiller3673]

Good information Tim! You shot a video a while back at my place, I had the 12 hp Kubota. Since then I upgraded to a 30 hp Kubota, then to a 70 hp Gehl skid steer. More powaaah!

[@TractorTimewithTim]

I loved that old 12 hp Kubota, Josh. What model do you have now? How is the field? Need mowing this year?

[@joshmiller3673]

@@TractorTimewithTim The little Kubota went to my dad, so she's still around. Bought and sold an old L295DDT, now I have a Gehl R190. Also got a John Deere 27C mini ex. Starting a little side business doing projects kinda like you.

[@joshmiller3673]

@@TractorTimewithTim As far as the field goes, I'm digging a pond! So some of the field won't be a mowing issue anymore :)

[@jlamb6463]

Thank You

[@pc5569]

Great video info Tim. Correct me Tim, but I believe shuttle shift needs to clutch and the power shuttle/power reverser does not. On compact tractors you can find both from what I've seen although the power models are usually in the 3/4 series size.

[@roberttoomey1755]

Thanks!

[@davidmartin7660]

Sure wish my Deere dealer was as accommodating. I do agree that before you buy anything you make a list of your work needs based on your property size and then add on the desired options then go shop. Lots to consider here.

[@joetterolison4093]

I had rented a Kubota with a Backhoe 3 times and was very pleased with how it ran and ease of use. I also own a 1948 8N for more than 10 years and it has been a Great Little tractor but it can't handle the Front End Loader like My L-2501 The 8N was the type of tractor I drove as a kid on the neighbors Dairy Farms in Ohio back in the 1960's Buy the Make that You feel happy about and ignore others that tell You what You should have bought Once You have it then it is what You have so be happy I am happy I only have 15 more payments left.

[@tylercruit6261]

You forgot about the IHMT transmission, best of both worlds and easy to use. Owned one for a while now and still love it. Was disappointed at your review as we talked about at the farm progress show. Not blaming you. You rock. 😎

[@TractorTimewithTim]

What machine has that?

[@tylercruit6261]

Yanmar YT347 and I think YT359.

[@Formulabruce]

Tim, the 1025R, and small frame 2025R Both have exact same engine that is 77 Cu in, and same Torque. The 3025D and 3025E have a 100.2 Cuin Engine with Much more Torque. Might be rated at a different rpm at Still 25 HP, but it is NOT the same animal....TORQUE Moves things...

[@royscarbrough3589]

When you mentioned the lower power being problematic I immediately thought of the heavy flywheels used in older lower power equipment to aid in getting through tough spots. I wonder if those might be returning to help offset the HP. Probably not but that where my brain went. Blessings

[@Formulabruce]

No, Bigger engines are. The 3025 D and E have a 100.2 Cui inch engine, and the 1025 and 2025 have a smaller 77 cuin Engine. The 3 series has much more TORQUE.

[@warrior4-u]

Tim I agree with you on the loader work being better with HST, but I’ve always heard, and specs seem to agree, that gear drive transmissions have slightly higher HP at the PTO over the same models with HST transmissions. This is why I got the shuttle shift version in my Kioti CK3510SE, since I do lots of brush hogging with it.

[@jaylapointe1654]

From the kioti spec sheets I have looked at, it is a pretty minor difference. Not sure about the others.

[@matthewerwin4677]

HST is worth the lower hp

[@javabean215]

HST always consumes engine hp, even when you're not moving, so it does take some hp away from what's available to the PTO.

[@wildbill23c]

It will have a lower HP with an HST because the engine is having to drive a pump or multiple pumps in the HST, where a gear drive has no pumps, just like a manual transmission in a car. With the HST, the PTO is typically a part of the transaxle unit so its relying on those pumps in the HST as well, so you'll lose a bit of PTO HP over a gear drive model. Some tractors in the same size/HP range give you the option of a HST or gear drive, some do not...I don't think the sub-compact tractors offer a gear drive at all, maybe some of the no-name imports might? Regardless which one you go with, the tractor's weight plays a huge role in the capability of the tractor when it comes to pulling things....you typically will run out of traction long before you run out of engine power....at least that's what I have found with my sub-compact...I'll spin the wheels long before the engine runs out of oomph.

[@TractorTimewithTim]

Add some wheel weights and Rimguard in the rear tires. You’ll stop that premature loss of traction!

[@kellyforgnone2765]

Very informative, good job explaining the difference in drivetrains.

[@richardglandus1576]

Très belle vidéo Très belle collection de tracteurs Doivent être très agréable à conduire J'adore 👍😀

[@brianfarrell5240]

I have a gear drive 3025D. I agree that a 25 hp hydro like the 3025E is gutless in that frame size. But a gear drive 3025 is awesome. I pull a 5’ brush cutter, box blade, and gear drive tiller no problem. I don’t see why anyone would buy the 2025. For me it was either gonna be the 1025r for towing ease and maneuverability, or the 3025D. The 3 series is far more capable carrying heavy weight on the bucket than the 1 series.

[@jimmcknight3021]

One that might matter in hot and harder work conditions is that HST Will run hotter. Especially if you are running ACin a cab. I have some get hot on ytube channels where they have to cool them off. I just like the convenience of the HST.

[@bradolsen8629]

Hello Tim I wish I could say I could use the tractor but I’m going to senior high-rise that won’t do much good but I still enjoy watching your videos keep them coming God bless you and your family have a good 2022

[@TractorTimewithTim]

Keep watching, Brad! Thanks!

[@bradolsen8629]

@@TractorTimewithTim 👍👍👍👍👍👍😇😇😇😇👍👍👍

[@chrismalchoff7552]

Yes. Bigger is always better but I found something out. When you move from an old limited gear clutch tractor to a modern hst you loose some hp but hp is not everything. If you are getting older and you would like to have more safer control of what you are doing you can stand the hp loss. The hst allows much better use of a loader. I went from a old iron 50 hp tlb to a 28 4x4 hst tlb and am very happy and I can teach my grandchildren to use it before I can no longer.

[@shawzall404]

I gladly bought a Massey Ferguson 1825e, Syncro-Shuttle. These HP numbers are all a ruse. Get a gear drive 25hp and it levels the playing field. A 25hp has all the same lift and weight specs as the 40hp in the same chassis, you lose PTO hp, but also all the T4 headaches. It's a numbers game that you need to make work for you.

[@shawzall404]

I'll add, I had a MF GC1725M and it was a GREAT tractor for what it could do. Subcompacts are an excellent compromise. They are great tools and definitely have a place. You just have to know and expect the limitations. It pulled a 5` finish mower and 5’ brush hog but rear lifting was low. Getting to the PTO sucked LOL. I use mine for firewood and it could handle some small logs and was great for skidding, but it couldn't move full ICB totes of wood, so I'd have to double handle the material. I did that exactly 3x. I knew I needed the extra weight and lift capacity. What we don't see is torque numbers and that's what I really want to know. HP is marketing jargon. When I bought the 1825E, I added a 3rd function and a 4in1 bucket that the machine handles with ease. These are things that would be great on a 25hp SC, but a waste of money due to limited weight and lift capacity. Moving up in the frame size also means that it is a larger displacement engine. The 25hp engine is the same engine as the 35 and 40hp, but they have to add turbos etc. My guess is, that in a few short years these 25hp will have aftermarket companies that will sell upgrade kits, that will achieve more unregulated HP. For me it wasn't a budget concern, but a simplicity desire. I'm quite mechanical, my dealer is about an hour away. If the T4 system fails in warranty, I'm out time. If it fails out of warranty, I'm out time and a lot of money. A large frame simple diesel is much easier to repair at home, reducing downtime. If I needed more power, I wouldn't mess around and I'd get a common rail diesel like the 2860 and avoid it again, altogether.

[@madtater5948]

coming off a Ford 801 power master unsynchronized manual transmission for the past 30 years and then going to a shuttle ship is the difference between night and day for me I'm a happy camper

[@pyroman6000]

Another way to look at the frame size difference is purpose. Looking at JD, the 3 and 4 series are compact utilities. The 5 is a Utility tractor. The semantics don't come close to the big differences between the two. Different uses, different target markets. If you're a landowner, landscaper, or tree service guy, for example- the compact utility is aimed at you. Smaller, lighter, yet still able to do a wide variety of jobs. (and still get into tight yards and not tear things up too bad) Ideal for those who need to move it from place to place on a trailer. A utility is aimed at agricultural and municipal markets, primarily. Applications where you WANT heavy, more ground clearance, and rugged construction. Heavy duty uses, primarily off-road, and where trailering isn't necessarily as important. Brush cutting, haying, livestock feeding, barnyard clearing, hauling, dirt work, etc. They tend to have larger, higher flow hydraulic pumps, too. The preponderance of gear drives reflects the fact that these units often do jobs where you have no need to change speed constantly. These tractors tend to get a lot more hours put on them, as they are daily drivers/chore tractors. I agree that 25hp seems kind of silly to put in a frame the size of a 3 series. I mean, if you're going to upsize wouldn't you want MORE power to go with that more tractor? The 1025 seems like the best bang for buck in this engine power range. Best options, etc. You don't really gain that much moving up to a bigger series with the same hp, and actually lose options. Going with a more powerful model would be a good equalizer. Just as 45hp seems a little low for a 5 series. Although, that is on a smaller frame than the 5075E you showed. But if you don't need to do a ton of PTO work...

[@sassafrasvalley1939]

Thanks Tim… that was a most excellent comparison. My Deere dealer forced me to change to Kubota. (Their service sucks on compacts and sub-compacts. Even if you need warranty work, it is put on the waiting list behind ag work! My neighbor waited almost two months to get his in for a brake recall! And, almost two weeks to get it back.) As a result, my familiarity with JD models has atrophied. It was illuminating to get up to speed on JD’s sub-25HP models.

[@jeffreyxxx6176]

I had the same experience with Deere. I also went with Kubota.

[@wildbill23c]

Never even got to try a JD...their salesman completely blew any chance of me ever going green. When a potential customer asks if you have a 1025R in that they can look at, after I had looked at the JD X758, and thought heck for the size I may as well step up to an actual tractor....salesman says "Why? You can't afford one"...I said well then I will buy a Kubota from down the street...definitely not sorry about my choice...My BX is already proving to be a huge timesaver and I've only had it for about 8 months...this spring it'll get put to use again quite a bit. I have a small property so I didn't want/need a huge tractor, just something bigger than my lawn tractor that can run a loader, and PTO implements and 3 point attachments...my box blade gets quite a bit of use on the driveway, and been using the loader quite a bit moving gravel and fill dirt around....projects will start up again this spring once the ground unthaws and it warms up.

[@sassafrasvalley1939]

@@wildbill23c I had a 10yr old BX24 that had 900 hours on it… (It was the one I bought when JD service went to hell.). I decided that I wanted to trade it in before it hit1000 hours. So, I loaded it on my trailer and took it around for trade-in comparison. Kioti, Mahindra, JD then Kubota was my plan. The first two dealers were welcoming and offered a decent deal… but, I didn’t like their equipment. I pulled into JD at about noon. I browsed the 1025’s for about 15 minutes. No salespeople in sight. So, I went inside and broke up the covey of salesmen that were watching the college football game. When I asked if I could test drive a 1025, one of the sales jerks asked me, “Are you serious about buying one. Or, are you just wanting to joyride.” I pointed to my trailer and BX outside and said, “I was thinking about trading… but, I guess I need to find a serious dealership.” The Kubota dealer was so happy to get a BX TLB in perfect working order at under a thousand hours… he gave me a great trade in and the first year maintenance free on a new BX23S + grapple. I drive by the JD dealer almost daily… no one is ever in the lot browsing. The Kubota dealer has people double parked in their lot… I think I know why.

[@wildbill23c]

@@sassafrasvalley1939 Must be a JD thing then with rude sales people...not sure why anyone would deal with people like that at all...so many other options out there with cheaper paint LOL. With the rudeness of my JD dealer they'll never get any business from me, I'd buy a Kioti, Mahindra, or other brand never JD.

[@sassafrasvalley1939]

@@wildbill23c you’d think that at some point… they’d get the hint?

[@barelystablefarm7151]

Wish Deere made a large frame 25hp R model with all the fancy stuff and mid PTO

[@harmab2]

Very enjoyable 😉

[@stephbarbershop2518]

I have a 2020 JD 2025R TLB I put 320hrs on it and loved it. I decided to upgrade to a larger one. ended up with a 2022 3033R TLB (really wanted the 3039R but was unavailable). I put 40hrs on it in the last 2 weeks. I have to say I'm unhappy with the power to weight ratio. I have a hilly property and 33hp with a DPF and 4000+ lbs leaves me wanting more. The loader is far more powerful with 260% increase in hydraulic power. engine is rated at 31.8hp and PTO 23hp. I really want to load the tires up but I'm afraid the extra 8-900lbs will be too much. Something else to consider is the repairability of the transmission itself. Break a rear axle on a 1 or 2 series and you might be buying a new $9000 transmission. break it on a 3 series and its easily repairable. If I had it to do again and these things were actually in stock I would get the 3046R with cab. I use to think the cab was a luxury item but after working in 20deg weather and running into ground hornets last summer, I would spring for the cab.

[@davidhuff1375]

Hi. The 3025 really would be an excellent candidate for a turbo kit. I worked from August 2000 to April of last year as a mechanic for John Deere in Grovetown Georgia on the kit line which was the line that produced the 2305, 2520, and 2720 when they were still in production as a mechanic, the assembly line that produces 5e, 5m, & 5r series tractors as an assembly line zone leader before going back across the street to the 4000 focus factory as an assembly line zone leader/mechanic on the 3r, 4m/r assembly line also known as the p-cut (premium compact utility) line and ended up being the lead mechanic for the 3e assembly line. I had to deal with Yanmar reps, since that's who manufactures all of John Deere's compact utility tractors engines, a few different times and had actually had a conversation with one of them about the 25hp engine and was told that because of the bore and stroke and lack of being choked by the over 25hp emissions regulations that with tuning and some other upgrades it was capable of producing more horsepower than the 32hp option. Kind of surprised that the 3d gear drive series tractors that are the same frame size as the 3e series but with up to a 46hp model that gets assembled in the building that the Shakti 5e 3 cylinder assembly line and 5e 4 cylinder and 5m/5r assembly line wasn't mentioned in this video. The big thing that is wrong with this video is the point that the epa and emissions regulations had anything to do with all the overlap of horsepower in different size frame models. That was completely wrong and has nothing to do with that at all. It's all about trying to gain market share by offering features that appeal to a wider customer base by providing a particular model/ frame size tractor at a more affordable price through options and filling gaps in the market to compete with other manufacturers by offering things that they either don't offer or releasing something before they do. Just boils down to greed driving complexity of options and those options bleeding over into multiple product lines. Only thing that the epa and emissions regulations did was cause the manufacturers to increase the prices to cover the added cost of the added emissions devices so that they maintained their desired profit margins.

[@Archermotorcycleandtire]

Yes we need some live streaming

[@BG-vq9fd]

I sat on a 3033R at the dealer recently. It didn't have as much room as my 2025R. This surprised me. It seemed like the seat needed to go back farther. They had 4 of these and they all had the seat all the way back. I don't know their age but they were well used.

[@TractorTimewithTim]

Yep. They are a bit tight…cab models are tighter.

[@hammerandnails73]

I would love to see a comparison similar to the Deere vs Kubota you did a few years ago. Only using 1 vs 2 vs 3 series John Deere of same or similar HP. Is PTO output identical or is it advertised lower just to get around restrictions? Plus hydraulic flow tests, pulling power, lifting capacity.. sounds like a 3 part series to me!

[@KevinBigg]

Next up on TTWT, 3025 with turbo

[@karlhungus545]

I'd like to buy one for my 160 acre property where we are going to build, but the prices are so out of hand these days, I think I may have to just stick with my quad and a push snowblower. I used it to push snow at our last place in the country and it works surprisingly well (central Canada...tons of snow and -45C temps). The thing I need is a mower though to maintain trails through the trees (100 acres is forest). I had a 1948 Ferguson Te 20 (basically an older 8N) but the lack of a live PTO made it frustratingly unusable for mowing over anything but perfectly flat ground. The pocket gophers love to mound up dirt right on the trails. Also very hard to find reasonable priced parts for it now.

[@kevingebert4316]

Gump! Yer a genius! Thinking you might be onto something there with buying under 25hp tractor with no EPA mandates and then add an aftermarket turbo which may or may not be cheaper in the long run to boost power and not have DPF on the machine.

[@calebackerman2363]

I think the 3025 would be an excellent candidate for a turbo kit being the cheaper entry cost and you would be able to make more power (and turbo noises) without the EPA extras

[@davidhuff1375]

Hi. The 3025 really would be an excellent candidate for a turbo kit. I worked from August 2000 to April of last year as a mechanic for John Deere in Grovetown Georgia on the kit line which was the line that produced the 2305, 2520, and 2720 when they were still in production as a mechanic, the assembly line that produces 5e, 5m, & 5r series tractors as an assembly line zone leader before going back across the street to the 4000 focus factory as an assembly line zone leader/mechanic on the 3r, 4m/r assembly line also known as the p-cut (premium compact utility) line and ended up being the lead mechanic for the 3e assembly line. I had to deal with Yanmar reps, since that's who manufactures all of John Deere's compact utility tractors engines, a few different times and had actually had a conversation with one of them about the 25hp engine and was told that because of the bore and stroke and lack of being choked by the over 25hp emissions regulations that with tuning and some other upgrades it was capable of producing more horsepower than the 32hp option. Kind of surprised that the 3d gear drive series tractors that are the same frame size as the 3e series but with up to a 46hp model that gets assembled in the building that the Shakti 5e 3 cylinder assembly line and 5e 4 cylinder and 5m/5r assembly line wasn't mentioned in this video. The big thing that is wrong with this video is the point that the epa and emissions regulations had anything to do with all the overlap of horsepower in different size frame models. That was completely wrong and has nothing to do with that at all. It's all about trying to gain market share by offering features that appeal to a wider customer base by providing a particular model/ frame size tractor at a more affordable price through options and filling gaps in the market to compete with other manufacturers by offering things that they either don't offer or releasing something before they do. Just boils down to greed driving complexity of options and those options bleeding over into multiple product lines. Only thing that the epa and emissions regulations did was cause the manufacturers to increase the prices to cover the added cost of the added emissions devices so that they maintained their desired profit margins.