$300 vs. $3,000 Espresso Machine Challenge

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[@SeattleCoffeeGear]

Here's our follow-up grinder challenge! kzbin.info/www/bejne/g6q7loeplNGHqtU

[@marcderk279]

Hey Seattle Coffee Gear I was hoping you could help me, my curch is trying to run a small café and i was wondering what espresso machine should I get our budget is not that big, if you could point me in the right direction it would be greatly appreciated

[@brucesherborne408]

Seattle Coffee Gear v

[@joseantonioromeropalma3835]

I would like to suggest abour include some tutorials to open a business, here in México in a barista course school.. But I definitely I preffer you guys teach us that great filosofy about coffee, please do that to you lovely suscribers please.

[@user-dt1rf3wz9c]

Answer : Both are almost same performance. Just difference is design.

[@slikerdet]

This test is not a very good test as she say. There are only 2 cups of coffee and then it’s a 50/50% chance it’s right or wrong. If it had been 10 cops of coffee and then she had right , then she is good. But this is just guessing

[@arieagung]

The moment she having difficulty to tell which one is which, the test is done.

[@blizzbee]

This is an Ad.

[@A.00]

God bless you

[@blizzbee]

@@h.a.6790 I'm fine, thank you.

[@annaoop2484]

Blizzbee R. PERIODT!

[@jeffbabbie1524]

This makes me wonder why I spent $3K on an espresso machine with this company earlier today...

[@alksjda]

i know which one taste better.... the 300 dollar one... because you saved 2700 dollars.

[@monster762]

Could buy a lot of good quality beans with that money.

[@yancysipes5085]

Hear, hear

[@stueymorris]

Exactly, I wouldn't even be arsed with a machine, get a good quality French press, Mokka Pot and Turkish coffe pot and bang $2900 left

[@stueymorris]

@@mynameorsutin I hate clutter in the kitchen and appliances filling my workspace which is why I went traditional plus I don't drink fresh coffee everyday, not only that but they'll also last decades, something machines would never do

[@MorzenMebs]

Exactly what a brand new ek43 cpsts

[@pschroeter1]

I would say in this case since they were so close, the question isn't which tasted better, it's did it taste $2,700 more better.

[@SeattleCoffeeGear]

Hi there! There's a great conversation happening in the comments here about that very question! Main points of discussion - frequency of making drinks, longevity of the machine, ability to steam and pull espresso effectively at the same time, etc. Check it out!

[@carpy1970]

If you're just worried about being able to steam and pull coffee at the same time, you could just buy 2 of the $300 machine and still save a ton of money :-D

[@KoflerDavid]

You got it. Or, even more cheaper, a 30$ second-hand one just for its steam wand :)

[@AtlasReburdened]

+David Kofler Mine is a $10 braun from a thrift shop and does better than the stoner run rig at Starbucks. It just took a few cups of practice to figure out when to throttle down the steam to the grounds and open it up to the milk. I probably haven't paid $300 for all the espressos I've ever made myself.

[@mlawlor472]

you would divide that cost by the number of shots you'd have over a lifetime of the machine

[@greennbean]

When you have to take 3 sips to guess it means to buy the 300 dollars one.

[@spacecoffee9447]

green amean no, its fake. An ad!

[@eeljify]

@@spacecoffee9447 no it’s not. She’s stating that, for most people, the grinder is going to be more important to espresso’s taste. The more expensive machine’s value would be more apparent if she were to make a frothed milk drink, especially for more than one person.

[@laserflight]

Yes but don't forget the expensive grinder to go with it.

[@isodoubIet]

If all you care about is the ability to make one shot, yes. But there's other reasons you might want to spring for the more expensive machine. 1. Ability to brew and steam at the same time. 2. Stronger steam. 3. Hot water tap. 4. 3-way solenoid valve makes cleaning significantly easier (just knock a dry coffee puck into the trash bin, no need to clean a soupy mess off the portafilter). 5. You can backflush to clean some internals. 6. You can plumb the machine into the wall. 7. More consistent temperature for more shots back to back (bigger = more heat capacity). 8. More rugged construction. 9. Easier maintenance. This just off the top of my head. Of course, everyone's needs are different, so whether any of the above will apply to you is a different story. If you're just starting out you may not even know what your needs are so in that case you're probably better off with an entry level machine (hence the name, entry level), but that doesn't mean there's no reason to spend more. I myself started out with a $70 machine from target that was a little janky but served me well for a few years, and then for several years more once I gave it to my parents when I upgraded to a Gaggia Classic. That one gave me a lot of problems and didn't have the features I wanted (particularly brew and steam at the same time), so I eventually upgraded to a Rocket Cellini ($2k price point, not $3k, but still much pricier than anything entry level). That machine has paid for itself many times over since I got it in 2013 or so.

[@jhomrich89]

The grinder and the barista skills are more important then the machine. However the people buying the $3000 machine are looking for the many capabilities that the $300 machine does not. The machine does increase your chances of making better coffee but as mentioned by Gail and me the grinder will make a world of difference and so will your barista skills...

[@GeorgeLee85]

"This is tough!" And that's all I want to hear.

[@voce3337]

But try a secound shot after that....and then you see a clear difference, because the cheap machine will overheat and burn the coffee.

[@bleepboop]

@@RakanWD Guests?

[@spacecoffee9447]

It’s a Add! Dont believe everything you see on KZbin!

[@nomiguda]

remember that's a 400$ grinder they're using with the 300$ machine, your experience may vary

[@bravo4104]

@@spacecoffee9447 No it's not you dumb fuck. Stop spamming everybody's comments and piss off

[@larodmusic]

I just want to go to Seattle and have a cup of coffee with Gail.

[@Jonathan-ex3sl]

Hmm. This makes me want to invest more in good coffee and a good grinder than go overkill on the espresso machine

[@isakaldazwulfazizsunus7564]

Fundamentally a good old Italian-style espresso machine probably won't even cost you $50,00, but if you invest in the right ingredients (quality water and good beans), you're sure to make a delicious coffee with just that.

[@isakaldazwulfazizsunus7564]

I recently picked up a french coffee press for $20 and quality's just so brilliant.

[@MrTwins95]

That’s what I’m doing. I have a $40 espresso machine. I bought myself a some what decent grinder, whole beans, and I should have a tamper coming in the mail in a few days. I also started weighing out my coffee to try to get the proportions right. Gonna try to use good technique and pull the best espresso possible out of my cheap machine instead of investing in a really expensive machine. Maybe some day!

[@bekeneel]

@@isakaldazwulfazizsunus7564 If u can get a used one maybe, but for 50$ u won't even get a Senseo... I got an about 750$ costing Melita Barista which was on sale, and it really has everything, double beans chamber, everything to customize, fully automatic, all milk drinks etc etc... If u don't need the milk drinks u can get a good automatic machine for about 350$ too, at least if u want a reputable brand. Nespresso for example is a waiste of money cuz the caps are so expensive in the end ur fully automatic bean machine will be cheaper...

[@isakaldazwulfazizsunus7564]

@@bekeneel My bad, I was thinking about the one you put on the stove, not the one with the portafilter.

[@p.c.h.6721]

Thank you so much for doing this challenge, I’m about to buy a coffee machine and now I know there’s no need to spend a lot of money, instead I’ll just buy a decent grinder and I’ll be fine. Thanks a lot!!

[@ahmettanriverdi5238]

Which machine and grinder do you have now after 3 years?

[@p.c.h.6721]

@@ahmettanriverdi5238 I hate to disappoint you but, I’ve been using the typical “Italian coffee machine” our grandparents used to use, one of those aluminum coffee machines (stovetop Espresso maker) And the grinder is actually my grandma’s grinder, one, two, three... and that’s it! I couldn’t be happier, both are very cheap, no need for technology or nonsense, perfect coffee every single morning, I’m so glad I didn’t go for one of those expensive machines, give it a try before you decide to buy an expensive machine.

[@aldoruiz5683]

*Costs 3000 dollars* “I’m going to have to take a guess”

[@apdsouza]

She's more passionate about her coffee than I am about my life

[@irislynn4970]

Agree!

[@hawkeye454]

Check out James Hoffmann's channel....I think coffee IS his life.

[@jagmaxwell1147]

Excess caffeine me thinks

[@cupofjotv8195]

That’s what we drug addicts are like!

[@Tbass17]

Spoiler; the machine is not what makes a significant difference. Grind, beans, water and ability to make a decent coffee.

[@BensCoffeeRants]

Without even watching complete the video yet, I can tell you from my experience as well, the grinder will make more of a difference than the machine. The cheaper / smaller machines can do a great job and compare to the expensive one (or get close most likely). The benefit of a nicer / more expensive machine, is that you will get more repeatable / reproducible results. You have more control over temperature and more steam pressure. If you're making more than one shot in a short period the small machine most likely won't be able to keep up. The bigger machines are usually easier to work with and will have better quality parts that will last longer.

[@SeattleCoffeeGear]

Very true Ben!

[@SilverBack_Props]

Totally agree !! Was a barista for years and if you have either too coarse or too fine if a grind it can make or break your shots also how hard your tamping is along with having a level tamp

[@May04bwu]

Yes, that sounds right. Thank you for the tip about good grinder :)

[@The_ChrisStrutz]

Any grinders you recommend for a newbie who is going to be starting of with a cheaper machine?

[@henrywiltcher]

@@The_ChrisStrutz I'm a newbie and went straight for a Commandante C40. It's very expensive but it makes the best coffee I have ever tasted (Using nice coffee beans too)

[@hairyputter5363]

Haha great👍 Sips Nescafe instant coffee*

[@hectorgomez502]

This hurt to read

[@ThPappas]

me too,sip Nescafe organic, 100% Arabica.

[@ananon5771]

them being close worrys me on the value of an expensive machine

[@kribusjoe]

I was thinking the exact same thing! I just ordered a $2,000 machine a few weeks ago and are waiting for it to arrive... this leaves me wondering if it was a waste of money!?! :-O I guess the quality of the steam wand will be on a whole other level though... but that's a lot of money for a steam wand xD

[@Logical]

Don't forget, you are paying for durability, consistency and volume at least. All things a 300 dollar machine cannot provide. That said, if you drink like 1 or 2 cups a day, I would invest is a great grinder rather then a machine. It all depends on the user and the needs.

[@brymoTube]

The Bronze Tank you are paying for more components. Dual boiler or heat exchanger means you can extract espresso and steam milk at the same time. Which is more efficient if you're serving for more than one person. If youre buying for espresso alone then yes maybe 2000 is not worth it

[@xschakalx]

The value does not only come from the quality of a single espresso shot. It also comes from the things a single boiler can't do and that is steam the milk right away. For someone who only looks for a machine to make plain espresso a dual boiler might not be the first choice anyway.

[@kribusjoe]

All very good points :D

[@seeanthonyn]

An average person wont be able to tell the difference. Still want that Rocket though. The experience of making espresso on such a beautiful machine is just so cathartic

[@Kernow76]

Grinder comparisons on an expensive machine and cheap machine would be good. Love your videos.

[@Do7a1337]

+1

[@Kernow76]

Let's be honest. It's probably a cheaper way to get better shots out of whatever machine you have.

[@akul5]

Agreed! I have been considering the purchase of a grinder. So I would be curious to see a decent casual test of cheap vs expensive grinders (consistency, course/fine range, etc.).

[@n.m.8363]

exists already

[@IlanDavid]

Just search the channel. They've done it a few years ago.

[@aquamanGR]

Thanks for doing this video and for saving me a bunch of money :). I wish more experts did tests like these!

[@florianbenkhofer4187]

Try to prepare a Cappuccino and you will see the difference of 1 boiler vs. 2 boiler especially if you brew several beverages in a row.

[@SeattleCoffeeGear]

Bingo!

[@pdelgado4547]

If every small expresso last for JUST one year, you can run 10 years of the small one. I think before that moment, the expensive one should need expensive services. Or I'm wrong? Of course, not for business Services! It's work for home Services.

[@hucksenteh8295]

that was what i was thinking, because I have used a older espresso machine and the boiler can not keep up, after the 3rd or 4th shot, the water pressure gets low, + i cant use the steam wand while pulling shots.

[@dickarbot9283]

lol, oh boy you have no clue. My one boiler dripper beats the heck out of your 2 boilermachine...

[@20wrighty12]

@@dickarbot9283 what a looser you are..... ☺

[@mugman100]

Shoulda done it with the $88 Delonghi and a $500 Breville

[@nimaakhtarkhavari8766]

I don't think the 88$ Delonghi is able to pull a real espresso shot...

[@JanZamani]

​@@nimaakhtarkhavari8766 Used Delonghi EC155, with the depressurised basker and a modded botomless portafilter

[@nimaakhtarkhavari8766]

@@JanZamani That's a more expensive machine, and it can pull a real espresso shot cause is a 15 BAR machine.

[@JanZamani]

@@nimaakhtarkhavari8766 You can get it for a good price used

[@Griselda_Puppy]

I believe she has done that comparison now 😊

[@pavel5515]

2:25 "Oh, screw me up! Go ahead!" ... that slipped out from a different scenario

[@martinzhang1470]

Paul haha, you’re an old driver.

[@marylandflyer5670]

The main value in the $3k Rocket is its capabilities for consistency over multiple drinks, the ability to serve up many quality drinks in succession, and the outright beauty of the machine itself. There's a great pleasure in using a high quality machine that is cannot be replicated by the cheap machines. No contest.

[@Bardamu]

Amazing!! What are the chances of her picking the expensive machine on the first try?!! Oh,....50-50. Pick the shot from the expensive machine out of a field of 20 and then I'll be impressed.

[@ipissed]

More like 100%, you don't actually think she would ever make a video of her getting it wrong do you? The first rule of selling snake oil is always lie about the snake oil.

[@Danielle_1234]

It would be easier, because what makes a 3k machine that expensive is the consistency. It's really easy to make good coffee with an expensive machine. You can make good quality with a cheap machine, but it takes a lot of skill and imo from a hobby standpoint is more fun, because you get to play with a cheaper machine more.

[@jkling1717]

The grinder is totally key! Every time I upgraded my grinder that was THE difference. I can pull astonishingly good shots using my Baratza Sette 270 grinder with any of my espresso machines - including the old inexpensive Saeco with pressurized portafilter.

[@choatelodge]

Her first comment was it was a wild guess. Then when the marked cup turned out to be the one she guessed she started becoming more and more convinced she could tell the one was 'a little bit smoother' Bullshit. She guessed and initially she admitted it. They were exactly the same. We all saw it.

[@kelien7592]

calm down and enjoy the coffee.

[@pablo-zn1mg]

I actually thought they were gonna make several tests and see how many times she guessed right

[@einstini15]

Even if she was able to tell which was the more expensive one, that isn't the issue. My question would be, is the $3000 espresso 10x better than the $300 one... NOOO.

[@bradysundheim]

I personally think she plays dumb for the camera. Given how often she drinks espresso and how much she knows about all types of machines from all types of price points. I would think she knows instantly which is which just by looking at them.

[@maggot1234]

Brady Sundheim i personally think by that comment you're just trying to rationalize your shitty 3000 espresso maker purchase lol

[@t0m714]

So glad to see genuine blind taste testing - humans are absolutely awful at overcoming our 'bias', believing we can taste or hear differences which simply aren't there as soon as the 'knowledge' of what is supposed to taste better is removed - keep this kind of objective, quality review coming

[@chefalbino]

i compare it to the photo-camera-topic: 1. coffee (1. Light) 2. Grinder (2. Lenses) 3. Machine (Camera) as the camera only opens and closes the exposure, the Machine only applies Water and Pressure. iknow, it's not 100% accurate - but give it a thought

[@PavalonTech]

chefalbino interesting :)

[@chefalbino]

THX had a ls spaziale vivaldi 2 for 6 years - now a la marzocco strada ep-1 don't think that the coffee improved. what improved is my feelings to the usage, hopefully the longevity and the interaction

[@IlanDavid]

I was going to say : 1. Barista (Photographer) 2. Grinder (Lens) 3. Machine (Camera body)

[@lucasrem]

chefalbino 1 pressurized machine 2 what ever coffee in a Turkish grinder 3 save $4000 Photo? Most shots are taken by cheap camera's and lenses, people only care if you shot contains something good, some moments that lasts, or tell the viewer a story. HiFi freaks buy $300 audio cables, not needed, Photo guys do the same thing, coffee noobs too.

[@SeattleCoffeeGear]

That's a great way to think about it!

[@Crimson_626]

Its awesome that Gail did this Video!!! So cool that they are keeping it 100% real on coffee and espresso machine., they have my business 4 life.

[@MsSteffie1991]

Gail is such a nice presenter, I love seeing her in these videos! 😀

[@Cut2sizemetals]

Fun comparison, Gail! I had a Silvia for about 15 years and a few years ago updated to the Alex Duetto II and Baratza Sette grinder with the acaia scale built-in. To the people questioning the value of a more expensive machine, I would suggest that this comparison is like comparing two movies by looking at a single frame of each. It captures one moment in time on each machine, but beyond that doesn't show the capability of either. For me, the value of double boilers, PIDs, etc. is that you can dial in a shot and control the variables in a way you just can't on a $300 machine. Or put another way, I pull fewer bad shots on the Duetto than I did on the Silvia, and if I take the time to dial it in, can pull really great ones on the Duetto, that I could never get out of the Silvia.

[@weasel101]

Clint Eastwood of Coffee

[@Junkmail_01]

Thanks for listening to the comments and doing a blind taste test, as well as drinking some water in between. I feel much more informed now with those two variables accounted for!

[@MS-uj5ui]

This proves that it’s more about the grinder quality than machine.

[@StringBanger]

I have a Lucca M58 presently I bought years ago. The single most important factor is the grinder. My grinder costs 900 bucks but I can dial it in perfectly and though a smooth shot can come from a 300 machine for me it's about longevity and function. My Lucca has a dual boiler and I ran a dedicated 20 amp circuit to it and also water line and drain. I can pull a shot and froth the milk at the same time while maintaining the correct psi. The water is treated through a 3M filtration system you would find at a coffee shop. Back flushing the machine regularly is also very important. I had 300-500 dollar machines and each broke within a year. Also keeping temp under control is vital when it comes to sensitive beans because you can end up with burnt bitter shots in no time. I take my espresso seriously and always try to extract the best flavor profile out of each pull. It is such a fun hobby and saves alot of cash pulling shots yourself instead of hitting up a coffee shop daily

[@andrewp1308]

Love the concept behind this video. I'm using a Breville duo temp pro at the moment, and although I will upgrade to something a little more expensive when it dies, at the moment I don't see any need to. I'm no A grade Barista but I can pull excellent consistent shots from it every time, I don't think I could justify spending the extra $1000............. for now

[@SeattleCoffeeGear]

Thanks for watching Andrew!

[@elmasloco6538]

She said it, she is honest very close as long as you have good coffee and good grinder you can save 2,700

[@helpfulnatural]

Great vid! Would love to see a comparison with a high end espresso machine paired with a lower end grinder. And the opposite combo of high end grinder paired with a lower end espresso machine! :D

[@NielsLieman]

helpfulnatural that would be great. High end grinder & low end machine vs low end grinder & high end machine. I bet the high end grinder & low end machine would win I the taste test.

[@helpfulnatural]

That would be my bet too! But, you never know! :D

[@andyaqui]

This is a great comparison. Tells me that I don't need an ultra expensive machine to get a decent shot :) in the morning. Thanks!

[@ExplodingPiggy]

"Which one is which?" "Uhhhh, I forgot"

[@carlcat]

If you couldn't clearly say one machine was better than the other my guess is you had a 50/50 chance of going either way. My feeling is getting good shots boils down to strengthening the weakest link in making a shot. In a lot cases it's a poor grinder and possibly more often, stale coffee. I find it amazing how often friends of mine buy a week or older coffee, dump the entire amount in their grinder's hopper and use it for weeks letting it get even more stale. Filling the hopper works for a coffee house where they use up the hopper in one day but not for the home brewer who could take weeks using up the coffee in a hopper. Love your channel.

[@vb6code]

I figured out what's wrong with my brain. On the left side, there is nothing right. And on the right side, there is nothing left.

[@MsNIMRA]

amzn.to/2tD4QZs Buy expresso machine with 50% discount

[@louispower7822]

MAN, the winner was the Ascaso Basic, if you can drink an espresso and save $2700, you know you got your caffeine hit, smooth enough to be top notch and a hit in the bank. Nice.

[@iknowyourerightbut6246]

2:46 lol, We need coffee beans to cleanse the nose before smelling anymore perfumes, and we need sparkling water to cleanse pallette of coffee taste. We humans are weird ;)

[@lejulius2688]

Yeah and dog shit to get rid of the taste of water

[@martinzima868]

One important difference between cheap and expensive espresso machines that many people here seem to forget is the reproducibility of the shot (consistency of your results), especially for less experienced baristas. Sure, an experienced barista might be able to pull two very similar shots from the machines once, but being able to pull 10 identically good shots in a row from the cheaper machine is another story (e.g. due to lower thermal stability). Then there is the other thing that you usually might be able to tweak the extraction with an expensive machine (generally) in a way, that you simply would not be able to match with a cheaper one (e.g. by playing with pre-infusion, profiling pressure and temperature, etc.) - thus getting more distinctive espresso shots.

[@wildwedding]

"I'm going to take a wild guess". Well, I think that about says it all about the differences.

[@mauricecohen3830]

I have one those fully automatic built-in coffee makers. I know they are overpriced but mine makes a really good espresso shot plus lattes, cappuccinos etc. I just love the convenience and ease of use.

[@RobinDude]

Wow she nailed a 50/50 chance

[@oscarvalle9508]

1:29 - A legend was born.

[@chasingjaunts1515]

Just finished going over what I spent on coffee for 2019 and 🙈it was almost $1,000 now i'm looking for a machine to offset that cost a bit to grind and pull shots at home as often as possible, going to check out more reviews before buying thanks for this one though Ascaso is on the list!

[@chasingjaunts1515]

@@Max-wl5ll we ended up buying something called a "flair espresso press" it's a manual press and portable. Made from metal very strong and has a pressure gauge so I can pull shots up to 10 bar. We don't have a lot of space in our kitchen right now and if we move i'll upgrade to a better espresso machine. For now the flair does fine pulling shots just the grind needs to be slightly coarser than espresso

[@Griselda_Puppy]

1k/year, not too bad far as habits go 😂 But if you can make better, on your own *and* save $$? Even better! 😊

[@ludwigvonn9889]

Buy a Saeco Royal professional my guy... Ive had the machine for the last 10 years, got it repaired only once, it was leaking water somewhere. Other that that probably the best machine out there for less than 500$. And its fully automatic. I use it at my restaurant, so yeah... shit ton of coffees every day

[@Discoworx]

Biggest factor of coffee is quality and freshness of the actual coffee.

[@liuton2005]

The secret to a good coffee is having a good coffee

[@michaelsingh843]

Best Video Gail, I watch it every now and then to remind me its the man not the machine 🙃

[@OhioPrepperOne]

there is no winner when you have to take a wild guess, cheap wins out.

[@abdulrahmansaadi8812]

$58.99 espresso machine will keep me awake and does the job just right

[@valicourt]

Nice :) I drank my first coffee when I was about 25. The drip coffee I tasted before was just awful. Now I own an Italian coffee machine, grinder and roast my own coffee beans. The day I tasted proper coffee was my financial ruin.

[@Fajita.tamale]

Best KZbin reviewer and relevancy award?

[@pgeorg01]

This was great! Would love to see more videos like this with various grinders too :)

[@SeattleCoffeeGear]

That's a great idea!

[@rickstokes2239]

Espresso results are always more on the Person’s knowledge of their tools than the tools themselves. I recently sold my old friend a Saeco Via Venezia and got a Breville Barista Touch. I made great shots with the Saeco but the Breville’s speed, convenience of pre-programmed selections and a good temp/time controlled frother are a joy to use and create excellent drinks.

[@royng6370]

Now comparison how about the steam wand for texturing milk can do a test lol

[@petemacfarlane6478]

Good on you for being honest about this! Not generally the sort of test that the coffee machine industry are comfortable with. A good grinder and a $50 moka pot makes a pretty nice coffee too!

[@IlanDavid]

I am mostly commenting as a response to a few comments I read: The main difference between expensive double boiler machine and a cheaper single boiler has very little to do with the taste of a random single shot. the expensive machine will excel at shot consistency - not just one shot but being able to produce consistent shots even when preparing a large number of cups. In addition to the consistency, there's an advantage in performance: The double boiler machine will be able to produce multiple cups faster because you don't have to wait for the boiler temp to rise and come back down again when you froth your milk. The milk foam will be consistently better on the expensive machine. Regarding the value issue that some of you are concerned with. Whether it's x10 better or not is up to the user and how they appreciate consistency, foam quality and multiple shot preparation. Someone who makes a single cup every time and doesn't understand the process shouldn't get the expensive machine. Also - if you watched the entire video - Gail says that the important component is the grinder. When you have a good grinder and you make a single cup every time, you could produce beautiful shots even on a cheaper machine.

[@charliewecker]

This video just saved consumers a butt load of money.

[@TheCoffeeField]

Excellent video. This confirms what I already knew when I had my Silvia. I went to the NY coffee festival and was given shots from Slayers, Nuova Simonellis and LaMarzoccos and frankly I didn't think that they tasted any better than shots extracted from my Silvia (w.PID). I really do think that expensive machines are better suited for milk drinks but if you're just pulling straight shots and drinking Espressos or Americanos then an expensive machine won't be needed.

[@geuros]

depends also on quantity. You can bet that making 40 coffees a day with Silvia won't end that well as will Linea Mini or GS/3. I as well think that La Marzocco is an overkill for home use, but as I am maaaaaad into latte art, I may end wth GS/3 one day as well... but first step is definitely going to be Silvia :)

[@corwinblack4072]

Well, Silvia is pretty much "pro" packed for "home". As for regular "one to five a day" it doesnt get much better till you pay something like 300% of Silvia price. Probably even there. Its much like audio equipment or photography. You pay insane money for last 5% of performance.

[@geuros]

honestly, Silvia - roughly 600-700USD machine (depends on region) - is a no brainer under good 1500USD, maybe even more. And for me it would need to be probably much better to justify not buying Silvia but anything "better". For me it is always Silvia until I have enough money to spend it on GS/3 :D I wouldn't buy anything between these two.

[@corwinblack4072]

Yep, its about same with audio, small increments dont have much point. Either getting "reasonable high end for good bucks" or top end (and starve for next 20 years :D). GS/3 is beauty tho.. if I dont mind that 10x times Silvia price.

[@geuros]

I must admit I fell in love with GS/3 at first sight. That's the only reason I could justify buying it at any possible time in the future :D but I want Silvia to be my first step :) (I have also 0 step, Zelmer espresso, which, well... :D u know...)

[@mdasifrezwanshishir742]

so in short: get the 300 dollar machine + a good grinder, rather than a 3000 dollar machine if it's really that close call.

[@od1401]

I've bought a £3k laptop and 3 different £2k-£3k desktop computers before on all of which served me well for hours every single day for 2-3 years each at a time. The difference between a £300 and a £3,000 laptop or PC is blindingly obvious of course. In a lot of cases with gadgets and luxury items, the difference of 10 multiples will make a huge and very noticeable difference to quality. Take headphones, tvs, speakers etc. Or guitar amplifiers or guitars themselves. There is of course varying curves of diminishing returns in each situation. But what I'm seeing here, is that the difference of 10 multiples is not all that great in the case of coffee machines. For something that you are not going to use for personal reasons more than a handful of times a day, I really don't see the value in a £3k machine unless you have tons of disposable income and seek perfection. The longevity argument is moot, because you can buy multiple £300 machines for the cost of a £3k one. Still, there's something to be said for perfectionism, and the £3k machine as others say will make some value back on its longevity, and quality across all different types of drinks.

[@earlyu7906]

Go Away Couldnt agree more.. but for now, Ill stick to the cheaper one since I dont drink coffee every day and I prefer less complicated to use.

[@alanschmitt9865]

My first thought was that they would taste close because Brendan appears to pull exceptional shots. The crema on both of those is sublime.

[@dmbworks8094]

im late to the party but the difference would not be as easily noticed with 2 new machines.. break out both machines today, 2 years later and had then been both used an equal amount, chances are high that the 300$ version just doesn't work anymore. haha

[@briankendalll2093]

I have both a inexpensive Breville Duo-Temp Pro and an expensive Expobar Brewtus IV. What this video really proves is that the grinder is one of the greatest variable when making quality espresso. My Expobar is for more consistent per extraction though. The Expobar will function well for 10+ years just like the Rocket (with proper maintenance). Regardless of your machine choice, purchase an espresso worthy grinder.

[@gregft1979]

Now i'm a bit pissed having just bought a 2500$ Rocket

[@clowntrooper61]

Unlucky dude

[@ImportedFromSerbia]

U have paid for quality of the machine, durability. Don't regret for your purchase. U have bought what u could have paid, nontheless.

[@drind7686]

Hopefully you have a lot of people you can impress with that machine at home.

[@KoflerDavid]

+ImportedFromServia Exactly. This machine could actually survive him, which is probably not gonna be the case with a 250$ one.

[@rubenkristianto6106]

I have a cheap krups espresso machine. Trust me it sucks

[@andyBryFilms]

Gail..”I’m sure you guys all know my name by now” 💪💪

[@redleader]

Wait....What??? That was NOT a comparison. You simply tried to guess which was the Red RockeT(?) machine..! You did not compare shots vis-a-vis aroma or taste. I trust your palette to guess one from the other. We winemakers do it all the time with single barrels. BUT...which was better?? or at least tell us what characteristics they shared , contrast them! INFORM US. I dont really care about 300 vs 3000! I will never buy a $3000 machine no matter what you tell me...I will just live a sad life! But teach us about differences! We winemakers do it dozens of times per day..... of course in the end something will always taste "better" than the other...But then you have to compare pallets from many individuals....ARGH!!! lOVE YOU GUYS ALL THE TIME, THX.

[@BensCoffeeRants]

The idea was basically that they were both good shots. Characteristics coming through in her coffee would most likely vary based on the type of coffee used and other variables as well.

[@okaea]

this guy deserves an answer!

[@tobymarol7329]

Right, watch the cheap vs expensive coffee video on epicurious, THAT's how you compare coffee aroma, not "oh i guess this one is a little smoother" (esp. since smooth isn't always better in coffee..)

[@monkeythief5]

There’s a difference though. He was testing two different coffee beans whereas she’s testing the same one. She may not have told about all the nuances of the coffee, but if she really couldn’t tell much of a difference then that’s pretty telling right there.

[@976nathan]

I have to agree.. sniff,drink yum.. cleanse drink, yum.. drink the other one oh mannn Cleanse..drink.. do not describe anything.. oh I’m gonna go in blind... I win...

[@mar1414]

This challenge is what am looking for. I thought that low cost machines won’t make decent espressos, they make them great!! Thanks Gail

[@pewl2509]

the coolest elderly lady i've ever seen haha keep it up!

[@kinomanssky]

I love how your videos are naturally presented with these little "mistakes". Tx SCG!

[@huygfc4257]

She chose the better based on luck. RIP 3000$

[@HigherPlanes]

The more shots you have under your belt the less you rely on a $3,000 dollar machine

[@stevenlishman4723]

Like anything, Even a cheap car will get you to your destination as effectively as Bentley, but given the option. you know which one you want.

[@carpy1970]

Yeah, the cheap car, because money can be much better spent than buying a Bentley....

[@stevenlishman4723]

carpy1970 yea, on a Ferrari

[@geomichael1]

Are you driving for the pleasure or driving to reach your goal? A Bentley owner has a Bentley cause it has history and has bespoke luxury and a 600bhp engine.

[@gladitsnotme]

Nah, a Bentley owner has a Bentley because he has a small penis and too much disposable income that he should've spent on philanthropy instead.

[@VWorldWide]

Steven Lishman yeah but if that cheap car has a bently body which one would you take then?

[@Wachuko-1]

Not a crazy test at all. Thank you for doing this!! I have a Rocket and looking to buy a second machine for our second home (we are there only a few weeks out of the year). I am struggling on getting a less expensive machine, while still getting a decent grinder to go along with it, so that I can have a decent cup of espresso while we are there. I want to at least get something with a 58mm portafilter.

[@SeattleCoffeeGear]

The coffee gear rabbit hole is always so fun!

[@papersack4290]

2:20 you're welcome

[@warrenhancock5742]

I have had a Sunbeam & Breville machine, both didn't see two years of service before the problems began. I have friends who to date have had over ten years of service from Viebiemme ($2,100) & a Rocket ($2,900). While the taste may be close the longevity of the machines well & truely warrants a higher end machine. Cost me more however three years down the track its running like brand new and no problems compared to two lower end machines in four years.

[@suziej2796]

Yes I’m afraid guessing does not make one right. The simple truth is both machines produced a good shot.

[@jessybwoy8677]

the thing is about consistency...take this 300$ machine to a shop and brew 200 shots a day ! good luck with that !

[@dasasa2]

This was one of the VERY few videos of Gail i was able to watch. Thanks for using the tripod instead of that girl.

[@UCMPMDHM]

Man it's not even bout the machine it's bout the grind consistency

[@BulletProofSoul11]

It's good to view as such. I have to be honest that beans, grinding and measuring amount all has to tie in. Ok, for her it was close. I want to share that the $300 one is such a bargain. Yet, here is some facts, I have friends/family that have the cheaper wanna be espresso machines but they haven't lasted long enough. Their on their second espresso machine and it looks like they'll be going on the 3rd one. Ok, so that's round about $1000 already. It also depends how much it's used and how many persons it's accommodating for. I have had mine for 15 yrs, I bought it for $2100, it's German or Italian made. Had to have a new casket and my water for making tea got plugged up for not hardly ever using it (water tends to crystallize). It runs like a mad espresso machine still, it's a beauty, when friends/family see it they like say "wow" what a beauty!!! They love what espresso drinks I make and my neighbors that I do invite over usually ask if they could have a cappuccino. You do the math

[@antonb9459]

Ann Taylor What brand is it from?

[@evanmiller9829]

I have a $100 Capresso conical burr grinder and a 15 year old Starbucks Barista Athena $300 espresso machine. ($300 then would be a bit more now) A friend, Eric, has an $1800 grinder and a Speedster ($13,000 more or less) espresso machine. He makes great espresso and so do I. In this test, Gail simply guessed (her words) I will probably upgrade my grinder soon but wait until the Athena quits working. 15 more years? I have used my grinder with Eric's Speedster and compared to his grinder and his Speedster. The difference is noticeable. I am beginning to believe the grinder is the key. Note, we also use fresh beans roasted on Eric's commercial grade roaster. The roast is very important too.

[@MrLombardi]

Poor comparison to say the absolute least. To me (only been in coffee and teaching people how to make coffee for 16 years) that espresso that came out of the rocket was appauling. If you genuinely, honestly can't tell the difference between a $300 machine (which generally would would consist of a heating coil NOT a boiler and would be pumping well above the general 9-10bars of pressure) then you are the wrong person to compare the coffees.

[@rodger1981]

I wish you made blind taste tests comparing super automatics to semi's. That would be nice.

[@rocktehcasedluc]

Nice video. As others have said, insofar as shot quality is concerned, a nicer grinder may have made the difference more noticeable. What's also important to keep in mind, but not covered here are steam power and wait time between sequential shots. Adding the second boiler, as in the Rocket, will give the machine much greater performance in these areas. This is also to say nothing of aesthetics or build quality.

[@dexterdelacruz5879]

Adam Sepe uooo

[@richardcranium9415]

The Rocky is a very capable grinder. Those that whine about 'small' burrs and a stepped adjustment just don't know how to dial shit in. I've owned/used some 64mm burr commercial grinders, the POS Vario and a few others and the Rocky is right there with those and I've done my fair share of espresso over the years to make fair comparisons. Guess some stupid ass morons feel the need to spend thousands for a 3-5% improvement in the cup as they are lacking skill to dial cheaper equipment in.

[@rocktehcasedluc]

So to use your words, Richard Cranium, the Rancilio Rocky is a "very capable grinder" "right there with" the Vario, a grinder you just described as a "POS"?

[@richardcranium9415]

The Vario has good grind quality, but is a plastic POS otherwise.

[@richardcranium9415]

Go back to the newbie forums and learn a bit more before calling somebody out, lmao! Even then you shall be put in your rightful place!

[@danielpagnozzi]

It is a true valid test for amature coffee lover. This helps to understand if expensive machine does really makes a difference.

[@johnnyspeedy1344]

Daniel Pagnozzi true, I want to open a small coffee stand, you think the questions should be now...which machine will hold up to the test of being used a lot in one day. Or on a daily basis.

[@alanrothny]

Some folks may make the decision to buy the $300 machine instead of the $3000 machine because of this (single uncontrolled) test. Suffice it to say, there are many factors a buyer may want to consider which were completely off the table here. For example, one of the many important out-of-scope factors is shot-to-shot consistency. But you did show that to Gail, this barista made a pair of decent, similar tasting shots from both machines, and the Rocket shot tasted better. Perhaps a more extensive series of tests with multiple tasters would be more informative

[@diannemacnamara1006]

Alan and

[@MSDJHERO]

Yes, this is not the best way to test this.

[@MSDJHERO]

Given i would have guessed which one was which before even tasting them.

[@shamashel]

For anyone looking to get into coffee, the priorities for what to spend money on are as follows: 1. Get whole beans and grind them yourself. I started out with a really shitty $15 blade grinder, but my french pressed coffee from freshly ground beans was better than anything I could buy outside of a specialty shop. 2. Upgrade your beans. Going from off-the-shelf (or amazon) to roasted-on-demand is another giant jump. Better beans = better coffee. 3. Upgrade your grinder. Grind consistency and the ability to tweak your grinder's settings means that you can actually create a recipe. The Sette 270 is highly recommended because, despite its $400 price tag, it outperforms a lot of grinders that cost more than twice its price. That being said, any burr grinder can work if you're not doing espresso. 4. Get a kitchen scale and something to use as a timer. Weighing your beans and final product lets you begin to figure out the correlation between taste and rate of extraction. For example, some beans might benefit more from being more coarsely ground with a higher final weight while others might work the opposite way 5. Upgrade your espresso machine. As long as your machine is compatible with a bottomless portafilter (which can allow you to 'debug' issues with your tamping) and comes with a commercial-grade steam wand, you're good to go. A single boiler can be good as well since it means more consistent temperatures. Overall, a Gaggia Classic is recommended since it checks all of the above boxes and has a really big community for any modding or repair work that might need to be done. For $500 (or less if you buy one used because it's really easy to find repair parts and guides online), it's a really good machine. On a separate note, I really wonder why they didn't do any manual pre-infusion on the rocket machine and why they used the same exact grinder for both machines instead of using 2 of the same grinder, each dialed in for each separate machine. IMHO, it would've been more clear if those were done...

[@cefimssoas9830]

even 300 is too much

[@mogur00]

bloody hell this channel has come a long way since a few years ago when i watched it (bought my rancilio silvia after hours of watching this channel... was back when the younger girl was seemingly running the show, interviewing gail (sp?) etc. Have to say.... the video quality has improved significantly! Great job guys

[@WahyudiWidodo]

Should do at least 10 pulls and see how many “wild guest” you got right, then only it’s a sensible test

[@mariano4617]

Based on this test, it confirms to me to put my $3000 towards a good grinder and some good beans! I pull excellent shots from my $300 espresso machine every morning! 😊 I think that if you’re going to have a coffee business and you’re going to be pulling hundreds of shots everyday, get a $3000 machine, that would be the way to go! Best of luck everyone!

[@BensCoffeeRants]

I started with a cheaper machine like that, and it does give you some really good results sometimes but the inconsistency, lack of steam pressure, and joy to use is why you might want a higher end machine, also they're typically going to last longer most likely (and have some resale value), if you're planning on making a lot of drinks consequetively or larger milk drinks like Lattes, then you'll definitely see the advantages of a more expensive heat exchange or dual boiler type machine, but damn considering she could barely tell the shots apart that IS A LOT OF $$$ SAVINGS.

[@carryon2197]

In my opinion both are equal for the reason that it took that much time to decide.

[@yuliyalund4831]

Coming from someone who is starting a coffee cart business.. I first started off with a $600 machine that made good espresso but not good for making 50 to 100 cups a day. Later I learned the $1,500 machine still wouldn't cut it. My point is, you can extract a good shot from ANY machine for ANY price. The price tag does not resemble the quality of the shots. The price tag measures how many shots you can extract in a day, wether it's durable, looks, and other things. But it definitely does not resemble the quality of it's shots. If you want a good shot, just make sure your machine is clean and working properly. Also always ground beans fresh and make sure you have the right dosage in your portafilter. Cheers

[@Crysmatic]

a good barista can overcome poor equipment ... we need Tony making our morning coffee :)

[@NicleT]

The difference between a 300$ and a 3000$ espresso machine: the grinder.

[@yrly59e]

I have several espresso machines running from $100 through $2000. Really the result is how well you learn to use it.