#4 Tesla Battery Factory Deep Dive // Manufacturing Revolution

[@thelimitingfactor]

1) The slide at 10:00 should say March 2021 instead of March 2020. 2) Yes, the lab scale machine does include a cutter, but this isn't ideal and would generate huge amounts of waste when you are running 60 tonnes of material a day through the machine. That material cannot be thrown back into the dough hopper because it's already been heat activated. In my view, the ideal solution would be an optimised feed/coat mechanism that results in zero waste. The wet slurry process coats with zero waste and resorting to an additional cut mechanism would be a band-aid fix...not first principles.

[@danbrownlie]

What about precisely machined rollers that are very slightly hour glass shaped so as to push the material back toward the centre when it tries to escape sideways. If this ‘lateral pressure’ increases non-linearly as you move toward the edge, after passing through a series of rollers this should result in a sort of reversion to the mean between the wobbles, a straight line. This comes at the expense of some uniformity in thickness, the edges would be thinners

[@artsnow8872]

I don't understand your (Jordan) reference to the benefits of a wet slurry process. The dry coating process was developed to move away from that process. There are multiple ways / designs to get away from the wavy edges. This is a mechanical problem, not a chemistry problem. Tesla has mechanical engineers to find solutions to edge-spread.

[@thelimitingfactor]

@@artsnow8872 What I'm saying is that wet slurry creates a straight edge. By implication, it would make sense for Tesla to move backwards and add a cutting machine...better to use a solution that involves feeding the material properly.

[@robinlawrence6891]

@@thelimitingfactor Second statement missing 'not' (make sense)

[@stevendunn5664]

@@thelimitingfactor In their video they show large rollers for compressing the material. Is it not possible to scale down the roller to the size of the width of the material and put sides on the rollers/in rollers to create the perfect edge. They would have to micro manage the amount of material being put through the rollers.

[@olegs79]

One of the most underrated Tesla KZbinrs. Nothing but pure content.

[@erickelly5587]

The most underrated Tesla youtuber. It's not even close.

[@steveperreira5850]

This channel is the best by far regarding Tesla transportation transformation

[@Carutsu]

the amount of time you must spend on these videos is astounding. Thanks buddy!

[@russellegan-wyer5669]

Thank you. Great info. well explained. No stupid music. No adolescent, ranting hyperbole or high fives. Superb.

[@mikefranzoia]

Always look forward to your insight and research, thank you

[@thelimitingfactor]

Thanks man! Glad to provide value for you :)

[@jamesbell8861]

@@thelimitingfactor ... No !!! THANK YOU !!! I look forward to your insights.

[@MrFoxRobert]

Thank you!

[@thelimitingfactor]

You're most welcome!

[@aussie_al]

@@thelimitingfactor thank you so much for this video. I have tried so hard to understand battery's and you do a great job but my eyes are still always glazed over. Im just not the scientific type. However you did an exceedingly good job this time in dumbing it down this time so thanks again. I do have one question though. Do you think Elon may be stretching the truth a little with his forecast by including the 2170??? There doesn't seem to be enough raw materials for Tesla to reach those goals considering there are other battery manufacturers out there as well. Oh, one last thing. Rob Moura on Tesla Daily reported that sources claimed that Tesla had orders for Powerwall out to 2024. And that doesn't include MegaPacks which has orders growing steadily. Where are all these materials going to come from and is he planning on the other battery manufacturers to produce his 2170 stationary energy needs???

[@haydenmacfarlane7194]

I’ve rewatched battery day at least 3 times by now. I can’t believe how much conviction I have that they will grow into a gargantuan company. I have over 2/3 of my net worth denominated in Tesla stock and I still keep buying more shares even at these prices. Truly a generational opportunity

[@nakfan]

For a long time there has been a focus on the cell and it's chemistry by the main stream media. You turn our focus to the true core of batteries - the production. Thanks for sharing your knowledge and insight with us all 👍 BR, Per (DK)

[@omrigodijn933]

Wow! I only just found your channel & I've had to rewatch each of this series a couole of times, but I've enjoyed each and every run through. Amazing, thank you

[@thelimitingfactor]

Awesome! Your welcome

[@eamonstack4139]

Jordan, you are as systematic as Elon. Many thanks for another deep dive into fresh crystal water, Eamon

[@TimothyParker1]

Another incredible example of dedication and tenacity needed to understand the facts and their implications. All of which are presented in a tight, well produced package. You're my hero!!!

[@thelimitingfactor]

Tight package. I want that on my tombstone, lol

[@TimothyParker1]

@@thelimitingfactor Let's hope life extension tech is on an exponential curve. Then you can have it inscribed on your new robot body ;)

[@ianoverseas]

This content is gold!! Just when I thought i knew everything about Tesla, along comes The Limiting Factor.

[@craigwells3655]

Thanks for the great work. It all looks like there's a massive leap forward due soon. Wouldn't we just love a Battery Day update from Tesla.

[@tomerhacohen7732]

Beautiful video. Very professional and clear. Jordan, You've outdone yourself..

[@tjnightingale]

I love your breakdowns of incredibly complex topics. You do such a great job presenting this in such a clear manner...all while being incredibly thorough. Thank you

[@eddylagrand7762]

Hi Jordan your deep dives onto batteries are brilliant for providing better understanding for non technical persons like me. Is SALD on your radar - Spatial ALD innovators who are working on solid state batteries - nanometer in thickness - protects the anode or cathode active materials (CAMs) from the electrolyte

[@wwjjss33]

I am a new subscriber. You are producing solid content--detailed and informed. I spent a career in design & manufacturing. When I started designing wafer handling equipment, wafers were 75mm & 100mm dia. and it was excited to work in the field as wafers grew to 300mm. It was amazing. And now, it is so cool to see battery tech & biotech taking the same trajectories of scale needed to make them commodity items. Thank You for sharing your insights and clear diagrams and presentations.

[@thelimitingfactor]

Damn! You were doing some high end manufacturing! Welcome to the channel!

[@ralphwagenet852]

Excellent analysis - you hit the key points and discussed their significance very instructively. Thank you.

[@rogerstarkey5390]

Par for the course... In fact.... "Albatross"

[@Marc83Aus]

I don't know why I took so long to subscribe, this channel is a great resource on the science behind Tesla.

[@thelimitingfactor]

Hey thanks Marc!

[@bkkposterboy2]

interesting ....the material formation, rolling reminds me of a factory I worked in as a kid, it was a linoleum manufacturing factory in Lancaster, PA owned by Armstrong (was at that time Armstrong Cork), similar terms that you are using. They were rolling out linoleum

[@thelimitingfactor]

Roll to roll is where it's at! Interesting!

[@chrisstearns10]

In my opinion your videos are the best of all the like minded individuals that make content like yours. Keep up the top quality work my friend 👍 👍👍👍👍

[@dirtlint8311]

This is a very deep engineering presentation. Thank you very much

[@GridConnections]

Great job bringing all of these together in one video and their importance!

[@GridConnections]

Who have you been using for your animations (they also look amazing)?

[@thelimitingfactor]

Various! One is a channel supporter and the other is a guy out of Ukraine.

[@senior1110]

one of the best videos on battery in general. Thanks and looking forward to more on battery and TSLA.

[@timyarrow8844]

Jordan, your deep dives, and this Battery Day series in particular, are so fascinating and valuable that I scarcely have the words to say Thank You. Greatly appreciate your effort and generosity with your knowledge.

[@thelimitingfactor]

You're most welcome!

[@LoneWolf-wp9dn]

i need to limber up for these

[@thelimitingfactor]

Lmao

[@rogerstarkey5390]

Mental Gymnastics?

[@ulfasplund3514]

The importance of the manufacturing process is so undervalued in the "just in time" and "core business" have been mantras in the manufacturing world creating disjointed and slower production, where the thought of cutting cost of inventory in single steps is more important than cutting total cost. The magic is the machine that builds the machine that builds the machine. :-)

[@YaMumsSpecialFriend]

High quality presentation, as usual, thanks mate🖖🏼

[@GR-sg2lv]

Excellent research and presentation. Top quality and it was made to be easily understood.

[@johnnyjohnny6174]

Thanks for taking the time make these videos.

[@epgui]

Thank you for taking the time and putting all this work into these videos. Very appreciated.

[@kylecramer8489]

I love it. Elon ACTUALLY went down to the atoms with First Principles just like he’s been saying for a decade.The Mad Lad!

[@rogerstarkey5390]

You ain't seen NOTHING yet! Wait for the next Jordan vid!

[@MrAlRats]

I believe this is just the start. The endgame should be for Tesla to start manufacturing the commercial vehicles required for the vertical integration of the mining of all the expensive minerals required to manufacture all their products. When Tesla's products eventually reach the end of their life, their products can also serve as high grade ores from which their new products can be manufactured. Many components can simply be refurbished before being integrated into the new products. Tesla should also manufacture electric boring machines for The Boring company, along with many other commercial electric vehicles which can be used for their logistics and mobile service fleet. The Boring company bricks and Tesla's HVAC system should be used by Tesla to construct net-zero-emission smart buildings with communal veg gardens and vertical farms; for Tesla employees. Finally, Tesla should start synthesising methane and hydrogen via electrolysis and the Sabatier reaction using renewable sources of electricity. Methane can be used for seasonal storage of energy and also as rocket fuel for SpaceX. Eventually a single subscription service should include rent, insurance, electricity, satellite internet and transport with the option to stay at any Tesla smart-home anywhere in the world and the ability to travel anywhere by Robotaxi or Starship.

[@grahambrown42]

Excellent as always 👏

[@Graham_Wideman]

Jordan -- I just have to say you're doing some very well-thought-out and insightful content. A good balance of enthusiasm for the subject, some science, engineering, manufacturing and even economics background, and some careful speculation. Great work!

[@davidstevens8417]

Outstanding presentation many thanks

[@darhmakarma4838]

As always you are really well researched and your explanations are fairly easy to understand.

[@aaronweatherson4379]

WOW - What a tour - Thank you...!

[@larryteslaspacexboringlawr739]

yes part 1 of a 100 part series, awesome

[@babbaracos]

Thank you very much for the update, can't wait for the next video!!

[@fredpsimas1874]

These manufacturing processes are right on target...similar to cigarettes and high speed packaging...many of h the hear processes are controlled via mechanical cams.

[@bobdyck8508]

Another great enlightening presentation. Thank you.

[@ghostindamachine]

Outstanding documentary!

[@TheMightyGonzo]

Commenting to help with the algorithm. Great vid

[@Phoenixklinge]

Never clicked so fast in my life!

[@thelimitingfactor]

peow peow!

[@bongobrandy6297]

Careful, don't hurt yourself!

[@kllrbny]

@Phoenixklinge I take it your mom never walked in on you visiting adult websites as a teen then

[@Phoenixklinge]

@@kllrbny now that you bring it up....

[@arthyualagao8279]

Thank you!

[@goodyKoeln]

Oh noooo, not now, I don’t have time now. 😱

[@Finlaymacnab]

Great Job. I'm hoping that your patron William Gibson is the author of Neuromancer. At this rate his next book will be a history book!

[@jasonmajere2165]

The ragged edge on lab scale seems to be cut off on top of the next roller on the right.

[@khut2u]

I love the effort and level of detail!

[@NickoSwimmer]

Hey Jordan, great video and analysis as always! With 4680 cells requiring 2-3 weeks of aging, would be interesting to do the calculation for floor space required to store millions of cells. Could an analysis of the Kato rd building size give us an idea if innovations have been made to reduce that 2-3 week time? Also, fyi, font on slide at 2:11 is pretty hard to read on mobile. Can't wait for the next vid! Cheers!

[@thelimitingfactor]

Hey man! No more than the numbers that Tesla gave us at battery day. Yeah, I appreciate it would be hard to read. The main point of putting the slides side by side one one page was to show that there are fewer boxes.

[@metooo668]

Well Done sir. Have you considered making a snippet version the would be roughly 5 minutes or less for people who don't have a hole on a time to watch the whole thing?

[@war6193]

If there is a way to _cut_ bonded layers of the active and inactive material without introducing defects then a lot of the problems you mentioned with formation and aging would virtually disappear.

[@hobbit1953]

Extremely well done and informative presentation. Thank you!

[@christianvanderstap6257]

The scary thing is that I believe they are already passed pilot and are already in ramp.

[@TheFrogination]

They are still in small production - not really ramping up. They only produce the once for the semi atm. I guess they are trying a lot of things at that pilot line right now. Rampup will trully start in a few month when production in berlin is rolling. Cant wait!!! :O

[@christianvanderstap6257]

@@TheFrogination that is not the same terminology for ramp that I would use. Normally it is pilot (can we make some product, yield be damned) and there is hvm (high volume, aka can we make lots of product at high yield). Then there is the part in between which would be ramp (we know it works, "just" fine tuning processes / machines to get yield up). Only question is, how far are they.

[@LarsPallesen]

Another great one, Jordan. You are THE man when it comes to Tesla batteries. No one else even comes close.

[@vincentpluvinage5834]

Excellent video. Thanks

[@rwhirsch]

Jordan, if tesla is starting to build "terafactories"...don't you think they would have at least 8 up and running by 2030 and therefore producing way way over 3 twh of batteries. i suppose material constraints might slow their ramp.

[@billhuggin733]

Wow! Incredibly helpful content. Thanks!

[@hardernl8893]

Sorry if covered in #5 - #18 (not yet studied), but can you give some metrics on electric power requirements for a giga scale battery factory? That may also fall in "The Limiting Factor" discussions. The recent Northvolt video's talk about a very large power demand (250-360 MW for 32 GWh battery production if I recall), but they have hydro power nearby and promote all-electric production methods. Thank you for your reply.

[@stefanscheinert1471]

very informative. I love your videos; keep doing your good work

[@boooosh2007]

Thank you so much! Great content. I’m a happy merch owner!

[@morninboy]

I believe the 75% reduction in formation foot print is due to the elimination of the drying process

[@paulelkin5161]

all your stuff is so the best

[@discountprintingexperts8078]

Thank you for such clear and concise interesting battery technological videos. But I have a question I hope you don't find to off topic. Where do you see or do you see a fit for the wet batter lithium processing technology that Nano One has in the works, possible ready to be commercialized soon?

[@thelimitingfactor]

I'll cover this in my cathode video. Tesla's process is very similar to nano ones, if not the same? Nano one uses a wet process to create the cathode material, and so will Tesla. The dry process refers to the manufacturing of the battery, not the raw materials that go into the battery.

[@zarkomeseldzija5584]

Great video Jordan!

[@thelimitingfactor]

Hey Zarko! Thanks for stopping by!

[@trvkim9435]

This is wild....what a breakdown 💯

[@johannel8104]

Thanks Jordan. Total revolution. Glad to see that Tesla is getting partners to go 4680 (and hopefully tabless like you said). Question. How can Kato Road support Berlin MY if those vehicles will probably have LFP or NiMn packs when Elon and Drew stated Tesla will focus on high Nickel electrodes only? MY was not shown under high Nickel electrode applications on BD. I have to assume that Tesla has already resolved dry-electrode coating for LFP and NiMn chemistries and can switch the Kato Road pilot line to these if needed?

[@thelimitingfactor]

Hi Johan, I don't even know if Tesla knows at this point. I'll cover this in a video. Flexible archictecture allows many options.

[@Josh-cp4el]

Sick content as usual, keep it up Jordan!

[@fredriklindberg5193]

Awsome video as usual, thank you!!!

[@homeloans2611]

You are the reason they fired their PR department ha ha Awesome video

[@homeloans2611]

The best Process is no process the best PR department is no PR department LOL

[@RichardPeterShon]

Very few people understand how extremely mind blowing what Elon unmasked on that day. Scaling battery through manufacturing innovation, logistics, vertical integration by reinventing the whole supply chain is absolute genius. He cracked one of the most difficult equation that was two centuries old.

[@rogerstarkey5390]

First run-through. DBE "Lab" machine. Roller on the right. Those look like cutter wheels often seen in the print industry. Used for perforating or cutting paper. You print "2 up" side by side , then slice the paper in 2 at the exit, effectively doubling speed. NO reason they couldn't have a wider sheet and split it into multiple (3?) widths as it leaves the machine! EDIT. It's basically a "pastry cutter"!

[@thelimitingfactor]

Correct! But also not ideal. Wet slurry doesn't produce this waste edge cut. It can't just be dumped back into the binder dough because it's already been heat activated and bonded.

[@ps-gq5km]

You might be the only person that I don't get annoyed by when they say "Lets take a deep-dive". =)

[@ThePeterR66]

Same for me but I must add also my Wife.

[@johnbowring3475]

I wonder if Novonix are involved to gain consistency of particles?

[@ParaSpite]

All of this IRL stuff, along with Elon's comment about speedrunning Factorio IRL, makes me wonder if he also played Shapez.

[@static75]

There were a lot of predictions in this video. Is there an updated version of this video where you advise on the current-day status of production and circle back to some of the predictions to see which were correct and which were way off?

[@thelimitingfactor]

I do those updates when it's salient. Like when the new information drops. That's why I do updates every quarter and the teardown videos.

[@dr4jm]

That explains the ads for pastry chef wanted at Tesla. Its a pastry & dough problem. And would not be surprised if they got Gordon Ramsay to run the line.

[@zcleary1]

Curious to hear everyone's thoughts on what's next for Giga Nevada? Is the hypothesis that they stalled build out of the facility once they realized the former giga scale plan with Panasonic was insufficient? Do we think they'll start growing that facility again as a Terafactory with Teslas own production lines? Or will that be reserved for Panasonic partner production and be left as is in favor of concentrating efforts on Berlin, Austin, Shanghai and whatever is next?

[@elshanvaliyev9595]

Could you please put the links of the other videos of this serie? Thanks a lot!

[@thelimitingfactor]

There's a playlist 😉 "Lithium Mine to Battery Line" kzbin.info/aero/PLyvdbTy3v1d5luwdDGPFPab9WWPmMW_cJ

[@Jason-ut8iu]

So much great lithium content. Maybe temporarily change the name of the channel to the lithium factor.

[@thelimitingfactor]

ahahaha, nice word play

[@titaniumjoeszigeti]

Slide at 13:23 shows graphite source material and then "spheronize" as the next step. Why is there no Speronize step for the silicon? Is it because the silicon will already be spheres?

[@jambay4785]

I'd like to know the yield rate for various battery productions relating to size and chemistry. I'm somewhat optimistic that "new" 4680 will both be faster for production and more reliable.

[@brucec954]

When Tesla bought Maxwell, I thought Maxwell said "they had been working with a major auto company on a pilot line for 6 months" and given Battery day was delayed by 6 months, I was a little surprised that DBE wasn't further along at Battery Day. Hopefully they are still on track. Of course as the saying goes "if it was easy, we would have hired someone better looking".

[@rogerstarkey5390]

But, Maybe Maxwell thought they'd be aiming for 30 GWh per year, not 3 TWh?

[@magnamic5614]

You’re notification interrupted me watching Airwolf videos. I forgive you.

[@thelimitingfactor]

LOL, Airwolf kicked ass!

[@TheEvilmooseofdoom]

Airwolf? There's a blast from my past. Can you get whole episodes online? Goodness as a kid me and friends almost came to blows over which was better Airwolf or Blue Thunder. :D

[@carldavies4776]

God I loved airwolf..made me the nerd I am today

[@magnamic5614]

@@TheEvilmooseofdoom, It’s difficult to find full episodes. I think I’m going to have to purchase the DVD set. Funny thing is it was the design of all Tesla’s that made me think of Airwolf again. The look of a Tesla is so iconic (to me) because they look almost like they could talk. Almost Pixar like. That made me remember how I thought Airwolf when I was a kid and how it looked amazing and like a sea animal in the air, a mix of dolphin, whale and other things. The perfect helicopter design to me. Edit: I like Blue Thunder but would take Airwolf every single time. That design is just too beautiful.

[@magnamic5614]

@@carldavies4776, IKR!?! I’m currently working on a design for a Tesla VTOL that looks like a cross between Airwolf and the Tesla Roadster...more Airwolf in design language though.

[@OmgEinfachNurOmg]

"Teslas goals were on the aggressive side of aggressive" sums it up pretty neatly

[@mrapp8918]

Great stuff!

[@skyhoon]

Loved the video and hashtag (not selling till 10000)

[@take5th]

Could you address the silicon anode? Elon said they would go to pure silicon and account for the 4% volume increase. And that’s it. How do they do that? Does it represent otherwise wasted volume? Does the density of the anode remain constant during the cycle? Thanks.

[@dfaulk2660]

it sounds like from your anode film and what Elon said that the anode may not be ready for 3 years, can 4680's be made without the anode component now and include the anode component later? in other words, use the form sector, the tabless design, and the manufacturing process, and any chemicals that don't require the anode to work.

[@PhotoGib]

It's been my impression that the line would not be running at 7x the speed. As I understood it, the machines may be running a a similar or slightly faster rate to the existing lines. The larger cell diameter and volume translated to 7x fewer cells needed per vehicle. Does that sound possible?

[@serta5727]

Some quality news here

[@pauldale260]

13:46 series versus parallel formation. You say series would reduce capital costs. Why? Series would need voltage sensing and bypass control for each individual cell, to achieve accurate load balancing, no?

[@stcredzero]

Could a new Tesla battery have self-formation capability? Could the circuitry in a Tesla battery pack be dual purpose, and do the formation step to itself, while powered from the outside? To do this, Tesla would have to have a high enough yield to abandon cell binning. Domestic auto battery packs could be binned as a unit, based on the capabilities of the cells that happened to get built into that particular pack.

[@rogerstarkey5390]

"Line speed" Was your estimation "7× the number of CELLS" or "7× the GWh" leaving the factory? (I think it may be the latter, ie, line *Capacity* ) If each cell contains "5× the energy, 6× the power" and the Tabless connection eliminates the "stop to weld" process, that an easy "7× GWh" with the same number of cells leaving the plant.

[@Sn0wZer0]

Good point and something I was also thinking, BUT it does imply the first part of the line is much faster, because the 5-6x mostly comes from a larger cell/roll. From my rough estimates, coating and winding is running at least 4x faster.

[@4michaelmccann]

Hi Gordon, I love your great videos especially these last three battery day deep dives. One concern I have relates to LG Chems Lithium-ion battery and it's potential for dendritic arcing and witnessed at the McMicken fire and with this most recent massive Chevrolet Bolt recall. Is there any way you could use your battery knowledge to dive into this and compare with the Tesla batteries, their proposed different chemistries and hypothesise to us TSLA investors how we might rest assured Tesla technology is ahead of this dangerous curve? Thank you for all you do. Michael

[@thelimitingfactor]

There's no way to determine this from the outside. How Tesla deals with these issues would be trade secret. Any time you are storing a huge amount of energy in a small space, it carries the risk of fire.

[@1flash3571]

Tesla is planning on using LFP batteries for majority of their lower end vehicles and maybe for power packs and megapacks. Those don't burn easily after the batteries are compromised. Other battery chemistry is more volatile.

[@WarrenRedlich]

Great video!

[@joelomondi5815]

Great Video series

[@tangent2658]

They should be able to produce these in parallel and there may be a pretty high theoretical limit on how many batteries you can make alongside each other, perhaps a few meters width, call it 85mm per battery, just to allow for waste or overcut, tabless folds, etc that's well over 20 battery parallel battery streams within one line. Think multi-ply toilet paper production, the slicing is obviously more complex with the tab foldover and happens earlier in the production line. I can see it in my head but I'm probably explaining this badly.

[@ronlivaudais6523]

Everything Elon Musk touches brings disruptive innovation to the highest level of productivity and efficiency!

[@rogerstarkey5390]

He's disrupting the process of disruption!

[@edthe2nd]

How do I get him to touch me

[@melanoma7220]

That's what she said ;)

[@bobwallace9753]

It's largely because Elon and his companies are mission driven as opposed to profit driven. I can't think of another manufacturing company that is mission driven. Perhaps some small companies created to give workers in the garment or food production businesses a better salary and/or working conditions. But companies whose goal is to solve serious global problems? My list is blank once you get past Tesla, SpaceX, and BoringCo.

[@ThePeterR66]

@@rogerstarkey5390 So true

[@andyonions7864]

Great stuff again. I wouldn't be too hard on yourself regarding your predictions. They were pretty close and it's forgivable to be on the low side when pitted against Elon:-) Liked the bit at the end. Yes, we are on the verge of seeing massive manufacturing return to the US. I've held the view for a few years now that Elon is putting the mojo back into America. An aggressively capitalist hard smart working ethos which only gets litigious when confronted by unjust roadblocks.

[@1flash3571]

Only problem is that Elon is the only one doing this type of manufacturing at this level. No other businessman or company is doing this, even other ICE vehicle companies. IT can be done, but we need more Elon clones to do it or willing to do it.

[@binsun8384]

Great Video.