4th Order VS 6th Order subwoofer Enclosures

[@BrunoPOWEEER]

I made a 16x subs band pass wall that I used for large outdoor events, it was the only thing that could evenly produce loud subsonic frequencies outdoors. This was before computer software calculations, all ear-tuned using oscilloscope, playing frequency by frequency 10hz all the way to 120hz, a lot of time real life tuning and AMAZING results. I started with 4th order then moved on to 6th order in series and parallel. 6th order is by far the BEST, most powerful and trickier design but computer software helps a lot nowadays. I had my subs tuned rear 22hz front 45hz and it was a MONSTER in subsonic frequencies, could barely hear over 80hz but I had other full-range speakers with woofers covering from that above. Also I could pump 3x the rates power without exploding the subs as the cone displacement is controlled by the port’s limits.

[@Dakoustics]

awesome, it's funny to see how just recently companies have started making 6th order PA subs, true innovation starts with people

[@TimpBizkit]

Well if your subs are as powerful as your electric bikes then I've gotta hear a video of that with a good mic.

[@jismo7]

@@Dakoustics Bose have been using 6th order for years.

[@zayreason9903]

Acoustimass had like a 4th order firing into a 6h order lol #Bose

[@Alkatross]

I thought bose used a paralell transmission line ​@@jismo7

[@Classic-lips]

I've been a bass head for over 30 years. I've been building sealed and ported subwoofers and full range enclosures (bookshelves, towers, etc) all along. I understand this pretty well through trial and error, then after college, and the advent of the internet, I got pretty dangerous, but never liked reading and most youtubers have at least a small amount of ignorance and arrogance. This video seems really solid to me. Unlike college, i can go back and re-watch it as many times as it takes to sink in! Thank you very much!

[@davidjames1684]

I think I understand 4th and 6th order but my woofers are haven't arrived yet so I would classify them as "still on order".

[@fishfire_2999]

Second order is when you blow the first pair ,6th order they decide for you that just not your game and block your #. Bear with me it's 4am lol

[@gladboy7722]

😂😂😂

[@PastaWaffleGaming]

Great bit on sub boxes. People new to lower frequency audio AND those with intermediate knowledge can take as little or as much information as they want from this video. VERY clear and direct information sprinkled with a bit of personal experience from yourself make this one of the best, most detailed explanations of how bandpass works and it's delivered with a lot of technical specifications while also being simple enough for those who don't have an engineering degree to understand. Bravo and thank you for this. You have gained a subscriber from me.

[@terryjohnson7080]

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[@transkryption]

So glad you included the graphs! Love the data to back up the theory

[@TimpBizkit]

Modelling a 6th order parallel bandpass I have found that it is best to start off by designing a vented box which is slightly bigger and has what is called the chebychev response. There should be a bit of a peak around tuning and a couple of dB dip in the centre of the range. A driver with an EBP (FS divided by Qes) of between 100 and 120 for tunings in the 35 to 40 Hz range and lower if you want to tune lower. Once this is set up on the simulator (I use hornresp) the second chamber should be around half the size and tuned twice as high. If the lower tuned portion is about a third larger than a flat vented box (so the total can is about twice the volume) then you will get a flat response but if you go a bit smaller you will have a slight rising response which is okay to save space in a car and will level out with cabin gain.

[@robwithrbk]

Thomas Jester Tarulli of team orion has/had a (6) 15" sub system in a 6th order that is very high output with a wide frequency response. It's quite legendary his performance. His set up is 1:1 and tuned at 25 and 50hz. As always it seems it's about trial and error as each car/home is so different.

[@TheAlanFish]

I built a 1:3 6th order bandpass with dual12s in an isobaric arrangement for my cousin's 1990 VW Corrado back in the mid nineties. That thing was ridiculous in the amount of output you could get out of it in such a small car. 130 dB or so if I remember correctly The 1:3 ratio also created an interesting big box on the bottom, small box on top sort of shape that gave me room to integrate an amplifier rack for the two Soundstream Reference 500s into one side of the top for a nice clean install. Took a while to figure out how to package it all into the small trunk and still leave some luggage room, and the final design literally came to me in a dream, the only time that has ever happened in my life. It wasn't the most audiophile solution I have ever come across, but it actually sounded cleaner than I would have guessed going in. Was difficult to balance the sound though, as the sub seem to be WAY more efficient than the front stage. Unfortunately some thieves took advantage of the clever packaging and made off with the whole thing after smashing the rear glass a few years later.

[@Dakoustics]

Yeah, car audio is a popular target for thieves. The 6th in my trunk would likely but a thiefs back out, and the amps are under it. Kind of bitter sweet, half the reason I'm into audio is because of the 15" sub my brother gave me, which was the only audio component from his car which wasn't taken.

[@TheAlanFish]

@@Dakoustics Yeah, there were certainly more than one of them when they hit my cousin's car. You would have to be one of those world's strongest man types to make off with a large, awkwardly shaped object weighing roughly 150 lbs on your own. :) He actually found out who it was through the grapevine on his college campus, and there were three of them if I remember correctly. Couldn't prove it unfortunately though.

[@tiffanynicole7260]

You helped make my mind what style box to build. I’m doing 3 4ohm dvc.15 Skar DDX 6th order 25hz and 50hz with a sundown salt 4k at .67 ohm. With some lithium and a 350 amp alternator to Supply the juice. Should wake those subs up nicely. I can’t wait

[@Brandencarroll1]

What an excellent breakdown!

[@adaboy4z]

Thanks helped me understand more about Qts and 4th order. I'm working on a 4th order for a JL 12W6 for fun!

[@Ichabod_Jericho]

How did your build turn out? If it’s monstrous I’ll put the same in my civic.

[@adaboy4z]

@@Ichabod_Jericho I scrapped it and went a massive audio 12. It can handle more power and hit way harder deeper bass. Sold that W6.

[@Ichabod_Jericho]

adaboy4z I knew it! Part of me wants to go JL, part of me knew big brand names have cheaped out

[@adaboy4z]

@@Ichabod_Jericho Don't get me wrong that JL W6 is a beast on 600 watts but there are better subs for cheaper and can handle more power. I already had a Kicker KXA800.1 amp and a Kicker KX1200.1 so it was natural to use that power!!!

[@kylewilson9809]

great video! very informative and really helped breakdown the differences.

[@jamespappas8205]

Lots of info here. Good pace..well spoken

[@Dakoustics]

Cheers!

[@davidspl]

Hey man I appreciate this video's explication of the 4 th order & 6 th order keep the good video coming.

[@juststuff5216]

Just in case you missed this: Audio Dynamics SoundVlog - Counting Enclosure Orders - kzbin.info/www/bejne/amLLdYWPpb-Ag6c 5 Enclosures You've Never Heard Of - kzbin.info/www/bejne/eYvEg4SKaLepl9k

[@agghell224]

one of the most interesting videos i ve ever seen !!!

[@jjbled]

Oh and thank you for exposing for others about inefficient designs and tuning build heat wish causes catastrophic failure due to coil heat. I've been there. And taught myself

[@olekristianrannekleiv762]

Bandpass subs are known to be bad because of bad designs and lack of understanding from the user. Check out the "STM S118 SUB" it is a pro audio bandpass sub intended for most demanding concerts and festivals. When bandpass subs are designed by professionals and used by engineers, bandpass designs are very powerful and accurate desings.

[@Boogerweldz]

Ole Kristian Rannekleiv c

[@AllSoWavyReese]

Can subs face the sealed portion of the box instead of the ported side

[@Bassotronics]

I personally use a compact chamber almost the same size as the subwoofer itself but with a very long port tube (4" diameter x 90" long Approx. in my vehicle). Goes down to 10hz loudly. :)

[@Bassotronics]

BASSN SANE I always tell people that the vids do not do justice to the sound. But I do have a few pictures on Facebook of it.

[@BARBELLS-AND-BUDS]

Id love to hear that design

[@zacharyhafer2806]

That makes a very inefficient enclosure for reproducing lows that anybody would consider loud...... I did the basic math on it assuming you used .1-.2 of a cube, with your suggested port length the tuning would be entirely too high to effectively play 10hz without sounding like a wet fart and unloading the sub so "I will take things that didnt happen for $600, Alex"

[@Bassotronics]

@@zacharyhafer2806 With all due respect, if the enclosure was so bad I would not make it in the first place; in fact it’s my favorite enclosure for playing infrasonics which is what it’s mainly designed for. “I will educate those who have no experience for $1000 Alex”. Here’s a video. kzbin.info/www/bejne/hJa2dGN5ZrdpqsU

[@Hertzsogood219]

I'm debating a 6th or a 4th. Really good info on the 6th Order enclosure.

[@robertkurtz7587]

Will never go back

[@Hertzsogood219]

@@robertkurtz7587 From a 4th or 6th?

[@agghell224]

Your videos are great-the best !!! Thank you for sharing your Knowledge.

[@Dakoustics]

Glad I could be of service, enjoy!

[@flex-ranger2]

Great video mate, very informative. Thanks for taking the time to make this help me a lot, cheers 👍

[@Mr18729]

Thank u for all this...now i know why guys can get that heavy lows

[@princenoa1906]

Just built a 6th order bandpass i just notice its canceling lower frquencies then i try to sealed one port and i like the sound much more fuller sounds but still it have a downside when i play higher beats i cannot feel any impact the punchy hard bass

[@tony187soundproof5]

I have a sundown x15 v.3 should I put that in a 4th or 6th order

[@Dakoustics]

From the specs on the website, if you've got the Dual 2 ohm, either, really up to you. If you've got the dual 4 Ohm, 4th order would be preferred, but still either or. They have a good multipurpose spec.

[@Petrezen1982]

And that's what I call an informative video!

[@stevereitnauer8406]

I had a single 12 Orion XTR in a 6th order box in the early 90’s, it was ridiculously loud. Everyone swore I had more than 1 sub. Sound was sorta boomy.

[@luckystrike656]

Hi! I have a Magnat subwoofer (30cm) that I installed in a box thats very similar to the one at 4:02 (1:1). I made the box 15 years ago with no calculation or experience. I don't use it in the car anymore, its connected to my home theater but its not performing well. What type of box should I build?

[@Dakoustics]

I like the idea of a 5th order, so front of the driver is in a transmission line, and the rear of the driver is in a ported box, could be cool

[@vaikeaa]

Just a heads up guys: WinISD cannot simulate series tuned 6th orders.

[@BARBELLS-AND-BUDS]

What program do you recommend for series tuned 6th order?

[@jessied733]

@@BARBELLS-AND-BUDS you can check out bassbox pro 6

[@rickytrevino8281]

I have a ported box tuned at 34 around 4.5cuft but barely any songs get that low and everything above 40hz sounds super muddy and bad Was thinking about just putting a sealed enclosure over the speaker and make a 4th order but might just cut the box and make it around 3cuft

[@tpro4853]

Has anyone created a 4th order Bandpass enclosure, but on the ported chamber did two ports instead of one? I am having trouble finding information on such a build. Please & Thank you

[@CarAudioLoudnClear999]

hello i have question in PR or colombia they have car pro audio with 4thh order without port the question is how to calculte the tunning

[@hyperdriverr]

2 woofers I like are the Dayton dcs255 and the DC audio level 1 12". Both model almost identically. The dcs255 is a reasonably efficient 10" and the DC 12" is a high xmax 12". I built a 60L bandpass for the Dayton, I tuned high in a 4th order, people forget how much bass is above 50hz sometimes. It sounds beautiful and above 40hz its way more efficient than my nvx vcw15 in a 180L ported box. Above 40hz my nvx build needs about 10x the power to match its output. But the bandpass falls on its face below 40hz at high volume. I'm planning on using the DC in a future built with its 19mm xmax.

[@angelohoepel5753]

For sub with QTS of 0.38 what would be better 4th or 6th order

[@Dakoustics]

Right inbetween 4th and 6th, but I'd suggest 6th over 4th.

[@AllSoWavyReese]

Is a skar zvx good for a 4th order box?

[@NearZoneSiona]

I think about 6th order wall 1:1 (200l/200l). It would be for two DD audio 9918f on Soundigital 12k. Rear chamber tune to 25hz and front to 55hz. I have hatchback (skoda felicia). Its good idea to make this 6th order wall or choose normal bassreflex with +- 350l and tune it about 42hz?

[@Dakoustics]

100L each for 18" subs in the rear is pretty small, but 6000w each is a good amount of power, so a smaller box should prevent too much excursion. I'd go 6th order. Not sure what kind of constraints you have, but you'd get a bit more efficiency down low if you make a bigger rear chamber, 300L; on DD's website they suggest 5 cu ft, which is 140L as minimum suggested for an 18", but joniK's got 8 15s in a 450L box so it's not law.

[@NearZoneSiona]

@@Dakoustics So rear chamber 300L tune to 25hz, front chamber 200l and work on front port until it will play good? Also changing front port will change my peak right? I want to play low but at least have 150db+ on windshield.

[@Dakoustics]

@@NearZoneSiona oh yeah on 6k rms on a 6th order wall i'd be surprised if you weren't at 152 at least, I've seen 6k trunk systems to that, all increasing the back chamber should do is increase the lows, the highs will remain about the same, when it comes to the front port the higher you tune it the higher peak you'll get, both db and frequency, so its up to you when its tuning is no longer musical. Highest I'd go is 50, mine is tuned 50Hz and actually peaks at 60Hz oddly enough, but it is supposed to be a musical system, it's 210L tuned to 20 and 70L tuned to 50, and it's perfectly musical, but to get loud you'll want a larger than 3:1 ratio.

[@djijspeakerguy4628]

I’ve seen dual 18” 6th order pro audio subs that contain 2 drivers facing each other in a sort of “loading wall” like you show here. Basically, there’s a port on each side, then this big open almost horn-like mouth in the middle. (It slightly tapers out, but I wouldn’t consider it a horn.) That design has the most SPL of any subwoofer I’ve heard.

[@ManuelHernandez-ko8sc]

So my question is what is best for 2 sundown zv6 d1 15s a 4th order or 6th order box with Size dimensions of the Box as a blowthrough build for a pickup truck?

[@JackCarver10]

There are filters for cabin gain and such in WinISD

[@Dakoustics]

Just had a look in my curent version, couldn't see it, is it a default filter in a more recent version?

[@JackCarver10]

@@Dakoustics Okay because you are a good man and taught me a more with this video than I care to admit I'll revisit it again and see if I can show you how that works. It's kind of unintuitive and I'm high as a kite right now. Good video mister

[@MykeHawke-r9r]

Thank you for making this video

[@jiviteshpandab6194]

how to tune the ports of a sixth order bandpass box, is it the same as a ported sub box?

[@Dakoustics]

yes

[@AZTechLabs]

position of a box inside a vehicle adds to the ratio which i never find anyone seems to know about. ex: speakers in a trunk try positioning the speakers towards the back horizontal about 6 inches away from the back vs turned around to the front.

[@hippo-potamus]

On a 4th order which part of the subwoofer goes into the sealed chamber, the cone or the magnet part? Does it matter? What is the difference?

[@Dakoustics]

I'd personally put the cone in the sealed part, unless the motor makes a ton of chuffing

[@Dpshort1]

It’s best to have motor in the ported side. This helps with motor cooling as well as you being able to smell the coils if it gets too hot

[@BrianDoughboyLynch]

No difference except better cooling of the voice coil if it on ported side and you see most front firing into the sealed side simply for space reason if the enclosure is a 1 to 1 then the side you put the magnet on will be less air space so when designing make sure you add your speaker displacement to the correct side or your ratios will be off

[@lawr3nc3mann84]

Hello thanks for the videos. I'm looking for opinions for 15" memphis MOJO box. I'm thinking 3rd or 4th order

[@hermantonngb8869]

Any recomend for 12 inc bandpass 4th..tanks

[@rjaudio101]

In 4th order. Is there any difference in output on which side of the speaker is in the sealed chamber? I see some they install the speaker the magnets out.

[@BrianDoughboyLynch]

Not really just better voice coil cooling if magnet is on ported side

[@dainellpauletta7514]

Bro your content is so informative that I feel very dom 😂😂

[@2strokediaries]

When i was a kid 12 or 13 yo i salvaged a 4 inch woofer that i used in cardboard boxes, it was nowhere near powerful enough but once i made a 6th order bandpass enclosure out of cardboard and it sounded like shit on almost every song but there was this one song (lil wayne - kush) and when it starts there is a very low bass note, and that shook the whole room, it didn't worked on any other song. It was really fun times, none of my friends thought building cardboard enclosures was fun. But i had the time of my life.

[@BrianDoughboyLynch]

Sometimes it's the most simple random stupid waste of time shit that makes us the most happy and gives the fondest memories! Basshead scientific name creature simplificus

[@deonjos8874]

On a parallel tuned 6th order which is 1:2 ratio, should both ports have the same size (port areas) or should they be in relation to the size of the chambers?

[@Dakoustics]

In relation to chambers, though for my 6th the low tuned side needed a port so long I just made them the same surface area. Sounded fine, but a tad muddy, so same area is preferable.

[@deonjos8874]

@@Dakoustics thanks man

[@TOMMY-WANT-WINGY]

In series tuned 6th order, kniwing the front is tuned higher than the rear, It seems that the front port doesn't load below tuning, where the rear one does, so the lows is coming from the rear port. Correct?

[@tiagonegociacoes]

So for the 20hz the better option is the 1:3 enclosure right?

[@hisinvisibleness-fn8qj]

I had a prefab jl pro with a 8w7 Not sure if 6th or 4 th But it was impressive

[@edifierbass7821]

can I make a big box using 4th or 6th order for outdoor events will it sound good

[@Dakoustics]

if you design it properly yes, im seeing a few 6th order PA subs here and there, only recently though, so i wouldn't be surprised if pa is behind in tech due to car audio competitions driving spl and efficiency forward, just make sure you use winISD to design the box, 4th and 6th orders can be super peaky if you don't

[@edifierbass7821]

@@Dakoustics Thanks have not tried it yet, cause most design box i've seen was this folded horns, scoops, intimidation and w.box in out door events so I will try the 4th order much simpler to build thanks

[@Dakoustics]

@@edifierbass7821 yeah makes sense, im making a folded horn right now and i can tell you its a pain in the ass, but from what ive worked out, horns are 4th orders, though due to the shape of the horn high frequencies are still produced due to its shape, instead of from tuning downward, its more complex than that, but might make more sense in your head that way

[@edifierbass7821]

@@Dakoustics yes in some ways, I wanna make also a small version of folded horn a home size but comes lots of work but hey just one of my future plans tho thanks for your guidance

[@randomtube8226]

A series 6th order is similar to a tapped horn design.

[@Hotecce1]

What is that box calculator you are using. im looking for an accurate one.

[@Boomie0419]

So, I was a my first Bass show (idk what they're called). A guy had a box that he said was switchable from 2,4 and 6th order box with PVC pipe and some ball valves. The ball valves let him switch between them. How does one design something like that?

[@orlandomoquete7358]

👏buena explicación 🇩🇴

[@jjbled]

I have a single 15 oldschool power acoustik Mofo with 4 inch dual 2ohm coils. Now I've repaired what we n I bought it for 20 bucks the tensile were burned. I direct connected way bigger pure copper wire and replaced spiders and I upgraded to black flat wound dual 2 coil. My question after rambling is I'm using a ported 4 cube box I built it's a transm8ssion line. I am impressed. But I built a 6th. It is peaking at 22 and not sure high side peak. My sub doesn't move as far as in transmission but it is 10 times deeper and louder. Would a 4th be as 3fficient I am not bottoming out or over excursion in 6th. I'm just playing with it. It's in a 98 3xpedition. I hit 147db at local shop at headrest with single 15 . Is that good or can I get more

[@jjbled]

And my amp is Orion cb3500.1

[@Dakoustics]

it probably wouldn't be as efficient as a 6th, though 22 is a really low peak, you might want to increase the size of the high tuned section, or possibly the low tuned section is too big and peaks at its tuning. Still an impressively low peak. The low tuned side of my 6th is tuned to 20Hz, though my peak is around 28. Problem is there are so many variables all you can really do is experiment, though my answer is a 6th is your loudest bet.

[@kordta]

9:04 it is 1:4 right? Just wander for the picture before the graph the "home type" ratio was 1:3. Very educative! Cheers!

[@Dakoustics]

1:3 or 1:4, either could work depending on the driver. For the example, it should've been 1:3, the 1:4 given is a default for WinISD, not sure why I didn't change it.

[@makskoma]

Lets say series box,how to calculate the thin port? And the large port?

[@charliefrancis6438]

I like your video, wish you would do more multi- sub videos, they are always hard to predict because of cancellations of the waves 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

[@waynehollars5048]

I have a hifonics 15 plan-x and I can't find anything on it ?

[@nathanjames4242]

Absolutely amazing video. Honestly, you helped making the super technical details understandable. I have a question for you. I am more focused on SQ than SPL. I have been seeing a lot about IB setups and the level of lows and spacial presence that are achievable. I am considering a project vehicle that runs a front sub (likely 10 inch single centered or dual 8 inch sealed in the doors) which would be effective from about 150Hz down to 50 or 60 Hz. Of course with SQ getting the most balanced freq response at the cleanest highest levels is best, so, what would you suggest for the rear of the vehicle (most likely large SUV like a Land Cruiser or Toyota Sequoia) to pick up those missing low freqs? IB has is own unique challenges and requires serious modifications but can fill the listening space with sound like no other setup. Is there a 4th order or 6th order setup which can achieve similar levels of presence while not requiring the same level of modification as IB? I have also considered Isobaric as a solution to keep the enclosure size down but i don't know if that is still viable with todays tech.

[@kurupsuresh8463]

Hi, amazing information. Can you please suggest me the best ratio for 4th order bandpass, and the best 10 in subwoofer for 4th order bandpass, please reply.

[@kidsavage86]

Can i 4th order a American bass hd 12 and what should i do

[@Dakoustics]

1 cube sealed, 1.5 cube ported, tuned to 50Hz should do well.

[@kidsavage86]

@@Dakoustics 50 is kinda high will i miss all the 29 thru 40 bass my box now is set on 40 and if it at 50 does it play 50 n down or 50 and up

[@Dakoustics]

@@kidsavage86 45 should still be fine, but you might lose some in the 60Hz range, and yeah it plays 50 and down. Another option is make it 1.5cu sealed and 1.5cu ported, the extra sealed should help it down lower

[@kidsavage86]

Im back again doing a hcca 12 in a bandpass best tuning if i want spl but daily

[@AWThethrower]

Would you class 15.9mm xmax, 0.52 QTS sub enough excursion to be suitable for a 4th order?

[@AWThethrower]

It’s a Rockford fosgate P3D4 12. I’ve got about 4 cu ft to play with and figured I should give it a go, but info on 4th and 6th order sub box designs are scarce.

[@Dakoustics]

Yeah, should work fine. As long as you're not sending it too much power, 16mm xmax is quite decent.

[@Craneop817]

I’m wanting to do a 6th order blow through rear center console enclosure in a sedan. Would this be suitable for daily music? If so what should I tune the ports to for rap/hip hop? Two Sundown NSV4 15s on a Orion 11000.1D @ 14.8 volts.

[@Dakoustics]

Rear centre console was what I was originally gonna do in my car, though after learning a bit more about port loading I decided to have the ports behind the rear seats head rests, and final revision is in my second latest video. I find it hard to fault my current setup, and NSv4s get down, so possibly a 20/45Hz setup, also depends on how low your door speakers can go. With that much power, smallish boxes would be ideal, maybe 3 cubes each tuned to 20, 2 each tuned to 45, for a total volume of ~10cu ft internal. Honestly at this point defining music choice as hip hop is more or less saying things which get low, so it's almost a more generalised sub box in my opinion, something which plays just country might just be tuned to something like 40Hz for drum kicks, which I would consider a more specialised box. Mean sounding specs though, interested to see how it turns out.

[@Craneop817]

Dakoustics Dakoustics yeah I watched that video nice box especially the adjustable ports! I noticed it’s potted towards the rear in a hatchback though. I’ll be building this box for a 2006 Lincoln Town Car. What’s the benefit of center console port versus port through rear deck? Btw I’m running Crescendo PWX mids and high. (2) 6.5”, (1) 8”, (1) supertweet per each front door. Well I’ve noticed when I’ve tuned my previous boxes to 32 hertz it plays lows well but not much other variations of music. I’ve caught myself sometimes listening to different genre so my idea was maybe a 6th order would come in handy when playing different tunes. Which doesn’t happen everyday but, the idea of playing a wider variety of music with sounding decent interests me. Thank you for you’re knowledge..

[@Dakoustics]

@@Craneop817 The benefits of porting through the centre console would mainly just be convenience and aesthetics, its possible due to the way it loads it'd have a flatter response, though that's just in theory. In general it's best to place the port as far back from the front of the car as possible, so rear deck should load better. The 6th should work well across a broad spectrum, I've only had one 1-note box, and it was a 4th.

[@kristopherdonaldson9569]

I curious to know if I can change my subs up/ports back BR box into a 6th order by adding a second chamber on top. My og box is 2.1cuft @35hz. I've modeled and built the top chamber and it's ready to go on. QUESTION ⁉️ Since my current box sounds best ports back, and the 2 chambers are essentially 180* out of phase with each other (right?).. could I face the port of the upper bass forward? Firing in the opposite direction of the lower bass ports?..or should I just go with the tried and true "all ports exiting the same direction" method?

[@mistanotu8791]

Hey my subwoofer has high qts and I don't think 15mm is a high excursion basically im asking if you think I should build a 4th or 6th order for em? I got 2 alpine type s I want to build a box for

[@Dakoustics]

excursion is usually stated one-way, so its 30mm total, a 4th order should work quite well with those subs, i've seen others put them in 4th orders with success

[@mistanotu8791]

@@Dakoustics thank you so much :-D what frequency would you tune ported too I was thinking 45-50 but I like low lows where should I aim for, the box I was planning is meant for a trailblazer

[@Dakoustics]

@@mistanotu8791 45 should be good, but if you've got a decent set of mids you might be able to drop the tuning to 40 and cross over at 50 or 60

[@mistanotu8791]

@@Dakoustics thank you you been a big help :-) I'm most likely going to tune at 45 and crossover bout 60, I subbed to you bro your very smart thanks for being cool and helping me out bro ✌

[@renejreeves]

I only have 4 cubic feet and I'm going to cram a dayton classic 18' in it, I just want to go low as possible I know sealed is smartest But if I was to get exotic what could I do?

[@Dakoustics]

hmm, some options, possibly a very long external port, say run behind a couch or something, or a tapering transmission line enclosure, but your best bet is probably to put it in a sealed box, and eq to increase the lows

[@renejreeves]

@@Dakoustics food for thought, thanks

[@undercut3494]

Ported is better..sealed keeps ur subs running hot..they won't last long..

[@edifierbass7821]

Nice but which one is good for outdoor big speaker party Box? 4th? or 6th?

[@Dakoustics]

I'd prefer a 6th.

[@jvinsnes]

which would give my the best low freq response while keeping a fairly wide frequency spectrum?

[@joshbrown5684]

A 4th order. I have both and my 4th order is more musical and plays way deeper than my 6th. However my 6th does play louder at a narrow bandwidth so is good for spl.

[@victorprudeaux500]

What about an enclosure that is a front loaded bass reflex with one woofer on each meeting side but where one side fires into a forth order chamber. Would that still be considered bandpass? Would it be like a 4.5 order?

[@Dakoustics]

Interesting. I've seen something which was a ported box, with speakers firing out, but also had speakers inside, so it kinda acted like a 4th order as well. I'm not sure what you'd call that, maybe a 4th quazi 6th series, as it kinda acts like a 4th and a 6th. But maybe since one is 2nd order and the other is 4th order, it averages out to 3rd order, so would in total be a 5th order. Yeah, an odd one certainly.

[@worksmagic89]

I have 2 soundqubed hds3 15s. What box would be recommended for them ? Also my gf has an 10in hds2.1 and I was also looking for custom box for it.

[@chaseleim4773]

Understanding the driver's ts parameters,and what the values affect determines the direction in Wich is "best" for your application,there's allot misunderstood in the box decision for all speakers, I prefer to use speakers with high q values qtc qts etc, in a sixthorder bandpass, The bandwidth gain is phenomenal when designed correctly,and if you run them isobaric loaded, they can use a smaller enclosure

[@greatmind3823]

So is the 4th or the 6th best for hip hop music

[@glengatt3941]

It's large the box ,one claimed to get 14 Herz with the Marty cube,are cars subwoofer drivers good for a home built,it's easy to find car subwoofer drivers but home it's a bit more difficult to find

[@TheRattleSnake3145]

Tline box for the win!

[@osmarbiicyvelazquez7473]

In the example 1:1 6th order series port, how much in2 do you use for the ports?

[@DCBDesigns]

So having 4 18's in a 6th, what rear sq inches per cube is recommended?

[@07wrxtr1]

Out of curiosity: It seemed like every car stereo shop had bandpass boxes available for sale back in the 90's... is there a reason other than cost that they went out of style?

[@Dakoustics]

I'd say size is a major factor, people don't want to remove so much storage space for a 4th order, and if they're willing they'd just build a large 4th themselves. I've got a feeling too that bass reflex boom boxes might've been responsible too, more marketing for ported boxes.

[@CsykKrit]

Italians starting spending their money elsewhere.

[@cfmechanic]

I believe they went out because they had very small frequency range. The old school band pass boxes were very loud and bang good but dont cover lower frequencys so well. I liked them back in the day but preferred sealed boxes for the quick and hard hits. Now i run ported but that is just after growing my stereo over the years i have alot more rumble and airflow with the ported

[@symbolism965]

I got a sketch for a Series 6th Order enclosure… I noticed it had a port within the box, kinda interesting…

[@eamh2002]

Dont get fooled by the real life efficiency compared to the specified efficiencies. My 15" 1000w rms 88db efficient 3inch voicecoil sub is more efficient at 400watts than my 93db efficient 400w rms 12" pioneer, ALOT more bass, if I had to judge on my ears, 3-4times more. So only if you listen at low levels its better to get a high efficiency sub if all other parameters are the same.

[@91rickstar]

+Dakchen Games @Dakchen Games I actually have a 6th order parallel bandpass with a Sundown Audio Ev2-12 which is really good for a hi fi or home cinema set up the motor design is really good you don’t have to worry about the voice coil bottoming out Which is good for a person to buy a 1st subwoofer and dose not have to worry about the power used because of the non bottoming out and the subwoofer is underrated it’s raited at 500wrns put it been getting 750wrms clean power don’t worry Brian chamberlain told me it’s ok to run it at 750wrms just don’t go much above 750wrms The enclosure top end has 75.5L and tuned at 50hz and bottom end has 50L and tuned at 26hz I’m running the subwoofer with a INuke 1000DSP with a WRMS limit to 760WRMS Bridge it also has active crossover at 80hz And a active EQ set from 90hz to 10hz on a 18db bandpass roll off why 90hz because of the deeper roll off I wanted the 80hz louder compared to the EQ set at 80hz the 10hz rolls off to around 5hz at the bottom of the curve I hear the beams in the roof vibrate at around 30hz and so does my next doors windows lol It’s really good to listen to music with it even better watching movies I’ve owned subwoofers before but nothing like this.

[@snhongo1]

Hie please can you help me ...i have a kenwood wps1300d and i was thinking of putting it in a bandpass box .On its manual there is only two options thus sealed or ported...will it work well if i use the specs for the jbl p1220 bandpass box?

[@who.i.am.6549]

Question on doing a 6th order (might be a dumb questionoh well but here goes it anyway lol. Lets say you have this to work with D37"xW52"xH36" then you put a box on each side for D37"xW15"xH36" and port it at 26hz then it leaves D37"xW22"xH36" in the middle of both boxes do i use the D37"xW22"xH36" measurements to figure out the last port i want or the total dimensions? D37"xW52"xH36" that both boxes is in?

[@meverickjnphilip9885]

What's the difference in inverting the subs in 4 th order

[@Dakoustics]

Inverting them gives a bit better airflow to the motor. Only real downside is if the motor creates turbulence it'll be much easier to hear.

[@meverickjnphilip9885]

So it ok to mount them regular in 4th order.skar evl

[@Dakoustics]

@@meverickjnphilip9885 yes, should be fine

[@mjl6425]

Hey just one question does it matter if you face the opening of the port directly in front of the subwoofer in a fourth order box?

[@charlesreedy9330]

How much $ to design a 4th order bp for an 2017 mustang gt. Sub is sa10v2 1000 watt rms. Amp is a skar rp2000. I have 34" wide by 13" high and what ever the depth needs to be up to 24". Possibly a 6th order if there is room.

[@sc0or]

Everything stepper than -6dB/octave sounds like a single elephant in spring. It's good to break a glass, but not to listen to some music.

[@brianj609]

Great vid, is there a way to model a 6th order series vs parallel because I don’t see that option in WinISD?

[@Dakoustics]

Reports say HornResp, but I haven't had a good enough dive into the program to work out how.

[@rogersingh3918]

Bass Box Pro

[@ILKOSTFU]

Solid video, helped a lot. Thanks!👌

[@teslinqueacerservicecenter303]

what is the best box type enclosure for heart penetration deeeeppppp bassss

[@CharlesDowiot-qv7pp]

The trick to getting good sound quality is the Way the speaker is Designed ✨️

[@learner72]

this video helps a lot !!! thanks for the explanation !!!

[@juststuff5216]

Audio Dynamics SoundVlog - Counting Enclosure Orders - kzbin.info/www/bejne/amLLdYWPpb-Ag6c 5 Enclosures You've Never Heard Of - kzbin.info/www/bejne/eYvEg4SKaLepl9k

[@juhopeltola3993]

4th order is suprisingly usefull. Good transients and good lows. Remember lpf, lot of times peoples forget that. Box don't need to be only lpf, and sub doesen't need to go high. I wouln't build 6th order to home system ever.

[@juhopeltola3993]

Imay have missed a point to be as loud as possible at 1 note. sorry.

[@Crookedletta601]

Amazing video and EXCELLENT THEORY👌🏾👌🏾👌🏾👏🏾🔥

[@sriammansoundserviceragava6434]

6th best

[@1117coolman]

Hey @Dakoustics ! i was trying to understand more about the formula for the loading wall, im trying to make a 6th order with so called "loading wall" as you show it briefly in the video, but i was curious, where do you get the 330 from, is it the lower chamber volume for the 18, cone diameter?

[@goldentiger3310]

what is the app name? that make a frequency responce

[@brandonfiore8982]

My 4th order doesn't play below 29hz like my old simple ported box did. It plays all other stuff well.

[@jasonjackson3114]

The qts figure of a driver tells us the electromechanical damping and amplitude or bias of the system towards resonance (Higher qts means less damped and more biased towards resonance). Lower qts i.e below 0.4 are best for ported or bandpass if there is no eq. because they have a "damp" resonance). QTS and resonant frequency can vary greatly after burn-in, temperature and humidity. For example, a raw Peerless xls 10 measured- QTS 0.38 FS-37hz VAS- 25l. After burn-in for 15 minutes with a 25hz signal (the voice coil former almost hitting the back plate, though not quite) QTS- 0.32 FS- 26hz VAS- 79 litres! - no kidding.

[@lewisgoudy863]

Q is the ratio of reactance to resistance. It stands for "quality" because a century ago good radio transmission, and good radio reception, required antennas that delivered as much energy to the radio signal, and from the signal to the receiver, as possible--the resistance was a parasitic loss spent heating up copper. Since the thermal dissipation is (current squared) times (resistance), increasing Q meant arranging things so that current was low (so voltage high) and there were few and ineffective ways for the electrical signal to get converted to heat (both on the way out of the station and on the way into the listener's home. The claim that low Q drivers have a peakier response is incorrect. The maximally flat amplitude response vs frequency is obtained at Q = 2^^-.5 = .707 = sine 45 degrees (Butterworth); maximal phase accuracy Q = .57 (Bessel); maximal transient accuracy Q = .5 (Linkwitz); maximal efficiency (NOT sensitivity which is usually called efficiency but is not dimensionless as is every efficiency) at Q = 1.1 (Chebychev). Any value of Q greater than unity will exhibit ringing and overshoot. This was all worked out by the Australian mechanical engineer A.N. Thiele and his grad student R. Small and published in IEEE Transactions in 1961 (later republished in the Journal of the Acoustic Engineering Society in 1971 and 1972). Thiele realized that it was necessary to either transform all the electrical quantities into their mechanical analogs, or vice versa, in order to encompass both in a single framework that would enable the well-developed machinery of filter theory to be used. Unsurprisingly, being a ME he chose the former and--regrettably--published in the leading EE journal. By the time the word got passed quite a lot came and went: the Beatles, Jimi Hendrix, Janis Joplin, Cream, and Woodstock. Oh well. Note that total system Q (Qts) depends on the electrical and mechanical Qs (Qes and Qms) of the driver only--which varies widely (15% and sometimes much more) but is independent of the enclosure. Putting a loudspeaker mechanism in an enclosure raises the Q. You are stuck with it when the driver is unpacked--the only way to lower it is via equalization (the Linkwitz transform). The Qs I listed are in-the-box Qs, which you have some control over (a smaller box yields a stronger air spring which is more capacitive reactance, similarly a larger port yields a more massive plug of coupled air, which is an inertance yielding inductive reactance--like a flywheel.

[@7modi092]

How can we determine the volume needed for sealed chamber in 4th order sir ??

[@Dakoustics]

Good question. A good volume is less than the Vas of the sub, somewhere between half and 2/3rds of the vas should be good, unless the sub has a low Vas and a high QTS, then a larger sealed section than vas should be fine.

[@7modi092]

Dakchen Games my subs are soundstream rub. 124 12", am going to have 8 of them in a 4th order but am limited with space, many people adviced me with something from 0.75 to 0.9 cubicft per sun, 0.8 is perfect for me, what u think sir ?? soundstream.com/product/rub-124/ Here is the site if u want to check the specs and give me your opinion, thx sir

[@Dakoustics]

@@7modi092 0.8 should be fine, but i think 1 would be better, but the difference will be negligible

[@7modi092]

Dakchen Games am going to stick with 0.8 bro, cuz that is the only way i can fit the 8 subs in my car, thx bro for your help