58: Shaping up TWICE... Game changer! - Bake with Jack

What's better that shaping up once? Shaping up Twice of course! Building more tension, and more structure, every single time.
This video is the sort-of sequel to "How to stop your dough from spreading out flat!": • 24: How to stop your d...
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[@kayaram8597]

Wow, as a home baker I've been doing this for 40+ years by instinct! Nice to have my method confirmed as people often ask why I do two or three restings rather than just one and for me it was more because the crumb had a better texture, didn't realise I was creating tension! Love your channel as you can always teach old dogs new tricks :-) Thanks Jack!

[@foxInGloves]

Discovered you at the start of lockdown!!! Homemade bread makes life so much happier. Thanks Jack

[@Bakewithjack]

Nice one Fox 🤗🤗🤗

[@tomanth4981]

Jack, as you know there are infinite folks on the net who relate as bread bakers. But I am here to tell you, YOU, Y O U, are the best, knowledgeable, not suffering from meglomania, concise, and truely accurate about details! DOCTOR JACK! LOL

[@powderriverfarrier]

Mate that video was so popular with us because it addressed an issue many have/had and you resolved with with an easy to understand solution and your cheeky humour. This particular video is icing on the cake. Keep 'em coming at us. Educate us. Make us better bread makers. An army of followers of Jack.

[@paulmcdevitt2038]

I used to subscribe to different bread related channels but only watch this one now...educational, practical and above all...fun. Keep it up Jack

[@Mixedbaby76]

Im literally learning a ton from each of your videos and I have to slow down and not get too overwhelmed :-)

[@alejandria0221]

I just noticed I have been watching your videos for a while but I wasn't subscribed. You have completely changed my bread game dramatically. I thank you very much for that. I absolutely love your videos, Jack! Much love from Bogotá, COL.

[@cheevocabra]

How many times do you shape up your hair? That's some serious structure there.

[@Bakewithjack]

Twice 😂

[@TheGstvjd]

@@Bakewithjack shaking my head...

[@mesimar]

@@Bakewithjack I BELIEVE

[@voidremoved]

@@Bakewithjack Yeah right, Jack. Roll over and hit the snooze button twice, then get out of bed and brush off any extra flour before baking

[@lilyvucenovicdaudert5022]

Wonderful tips. I reshaped, even a few times, and it certainly helped. Thank you so much! Love watching you from Oregon in the States. Been baking for years but only recently with a starter. Loaves have always be lackluster. You are certainly experienced and a pleasure to watch.

[@ImForgivenToo]

Jack, love your videos...you're a great teacher ! Learning a lot from you !

[@Brachydios]

Love your personality Jack. Gonna have to get me one of those dough scrapers.

[@homemountain333]

The best boule-shaping video I have seen, bar none! The oven spring of my sourdough boules has improved tremendously and I can't thank you enough for the guidance and expertise. Love all your videos!

[@The_AI_Artist]

thank you so much Jack for your advices!

[@gilbwhatmore8417]

Hi Jack, just received my order. Super speedy service and great quality. Keep the tips coming, really helpful. Cheers Gil.

[@kristysmythers5102]

One of my favorite channels now...ur awesome. ..thanks for the great tips..l

[@minicazz]

Found Jack & this video after 3 bulging loafs. Was amazed & so excited with the results of my 4th loaf. Jack - yr my go to for anything & everything about bread now. Thanks, yr vids are fun & packed with great info.

[@amyv7901]

I'm from Czechia and I LOVE your videos. It helped me solve some of my mistakes during bread baking procedure. Thank you so much for them 💜🙏

[@paulsmith7793]

Thanks jack,your video saved me.i did not know anything about tightening the the dough up,i watched your video result i had a lovely bloomer taste out of this world so thanks for that i will keep watching

[@yakmansgirl]

Great will order one in the next two weeks.

[@ginobee]

Hi, Jack. Hope this message finds you happy and well. I wanted to thank you for making me feel like a professional bread baker when I watch your videos. Great work, Bud. However, when I follow your instructions - precisely, of course - my results are a compilation of joyful surprises, but never what I intend. LOL! Pretty sure it's an end-user problem. Regardless, thank you for helping me feel like a master chef every once in a while. Stay safe.

[@bigpapi3636]

Thanks for the instruction. Your first video on creating structure totally improved the quality of my bread loaves. But I didn't get the connection that you could re-tension multiple times. It does make sense though. I'll be baking a boule on Saturday for Sunday dinner and I'm going to use this technique. BTW you make the shaping look really easy.

[@davewatson3833]

Jack, your shaping method saved my sanity! Thank you. May have to order a bowl scraper.

[@potpourri1011]

As a beginning bread maker I have watched many of your videos. The tip in this video has really improved my bread making. Before pre-shaping my loaf, the baked shape of my loaves were inconsistent. Now, when I started pre-shaping the loaf before the final proofing as you recommended, I can bake much more consistent loaves, with little to no dough spreading before baking. Thank you very much for giving us this insight!

[@lissyperez4299]

Thanks, Jack!

[@deneb3552]

Jack my man, this worked instantly. You sir changed my game, again. Thank you!

[@peteskyrunner4845]

I've just started making bread and pizza a couple of months, ago and this (and the previous video about dough spreading out) is by far the best tip I've seen about making bread. I was just using the scraper to walk the dough to tighten it up. But the technique you show looks to create lots more tension.

[@gabyguala]

Excellent information thank YOU, Jack!!

[@rosemarypatterson]

I've been baking bread for quite a while but, at times, have had the spreading problem. Have two loaves rising now following your technique and in 20 minutes plan to shape yet again. Thank you Jack for your easy to understand techniques!

[@Bakewithjack]

Nice ☺️ you’re welcome Rosemary

[@LightZone9]

Another excellent video Jack! Thanks from Arizona 🤠

[@flowergrowersmith449]

Very cool! Thanks Jack - love it.

[@Bakewithjack]

You’re welcome! ☺️

[@user-vj8cm9cl8y]

Thanks for this wonderful video!!I've always had problem giving tension to my dough.I tried your shaping in a 62%hydration dough and it worked.I would be grateful if you made a video about high hydration dough shaping!!

[@bellamaldonado]

I really appreciate and look forward to youThursday tips. Yes I’ve helped a great deal and answered questions I couldn’t find on websites. From California USA HELLO and FYI I use a scale and weigh grams sooo much easier and less washing.

[@Bakewithjack]

HELLOOOO! 😃

[@TheMapleMoose]

I watched your spreading video for my last loaf but it was still spreading so I had to shape it twice, it definitely worked out and if i had more time i would have shaped it 3 times.

[@hannabaal150]

This video shaped up well. I have a question or two about hydration...oh, look, a video about hydration, whaddaya know. I watched the folding technique on 1/4 speed so I could keep up!

[@troyborlongan7444]

That's great. it would be somehow what laminating is about. great content!

[@hanzosbm1]

Hi Jack, I've been baking for years and always knew about developing a nice tight skin, but I could never manage to figure out the rolling technique used at the end. Your video helped me to understand it. I just pulled my rolls out of the oven and they have the best shape of any bread I've ever made. Thank you!

[@Bakewithjack]

Nice one Steven! You’re so welcome ☺️👊🏻

[@ImForgivenToo]

Jack, followed your method and my boule bread turned out beautiful ! 😊 Do you have a video on HOW TO SHAPE A BAGUETTE ? (looked but could not find one) thanks !

[@beabeeeee]

Spot on explanation, thank you very much!

[@Bakewithjack]

You’re welcome, thank you ☺️☺️

[@ShoshiPlatypus]

Thanks Jack - great video. My sourdough handling and shaping is improving, and I’m getting less spreading than previously, but this should clinch it, I think. I have a silicone dough scraper for removing dough from the bowl, and a bench knife which is very handy for gathering high hydration dough and cutting it, too. Keep the videos coming - you are very good value on KZbin and I love your cheerful approach! How can your dough be flat and sad with you around? It looks as bouncy and cheerful as you are! Shoshi

[@Bakewithjack]

Thanks Shoshone! I’ll keep going ☺️

[@Stephane1750]

As you said, this was a game changer for me too, so thank you for that!

[@Bakewithjack]

YES! So chuffed for you. GOOD LUCK!

[@nickdrury4931]

Jack, thanks to you I’m a lockdown bread maker. Tried in the past and given up more times than I can remember. You however, have invigorated me so I now tread a new path. Since watching you, I’ve had mostly successes, I still get the odd failure but that’s life I suppose, so it’s back to the Bake with Jack tutorials and I rectify my mistakes and try again. I do have one problem and it’s with a Pullman tin loaf. It’s quiet a big tin and my problem is I never manage to fill it. I have increased my recipe size several times now thinking that was my problem and I can now get to within half an inch once the lid goes on, but that’s as far as it gets. It never rises any further during the start of baking. In fact it sometimes sinks in the oven slightly. It gets two one hour proves in the bowl and the third one in the tin. The first two double, or more than double in size but the third hardly moves. It’s always a lovely texture when cut albeit only half to three quarters of a slice it should be! I’ve watched loads of vlogs whilst trying to solve this and they all make perfect loaves. I know you are very busy to reply to each and every issue you are presented with, so thought it might make a good vlog for you. Please help me. Nick

[@Bakewithjack]

Tricky one nick, I’ll put it on my list, sounds like If it never reaches and never jumps then you might need to up the quantity again.

[@tobsmonster2]

This was very helpful. My free standing loaves are holding up better than ever. Thanks

[@michellewale9048]

My bread turns out great but I always have a problem with my rolls spreading, bursting at the bottom and not rising enough. I will definitely try double shaping when I next make some, hopefully it’ll work. I’ll keep you informed 🤞🏻

[@1998tkhri]

Thank you so much! Is there any way to build tension for plaited/braided loaves? How do you keep tension when rolling out long/thin strands that are plaited together?

[@semiblindbritguy2268]

I like making Quick Bread at the moment with Self Raising Flour, mainly because right now, Bread Flour and Yeast is like looking for Gold Dust at the moment!

[@lakeslover100]

Brilliant ,,, thanks Jack ,,, I'm learning loads :-)

[@Bakewithjack]

You’re welcome ☺️

[@petrchutny]

Thanks for your video Jack! I'll try shaping my sourdough twice now, hopefully it will help creating more tension. My attempts in scoring my loaf are failing… 😅

[@colepdx187]

I have this problem often. I make a dough that looks and feels beautiful then on the 2nd rise it just spreads out like a good plate of risotto. Thanks for sharing your expertise.

[@akshay_ncsehgal]

Try reducing the first rise time

[@colepdx187]

@@akshay_ncsehgal Thanks for the tip!

[@Rob_430]

Great Video. I’ve learned this when doing the Tartine method by Chad Robertson, and your video reinforces it. The reason why some have their dough collapse, over proofed and lack of shaping to create tension. Thank you, Rob

[@Bakewithjack]

Thanks Rob, happy to help 👊🏻

[@midnight121190]

Hey Bake with Jack! Thank you for posting these videos. I'm loving them. Reshaping dough balls or rolls makes total sense and is easy! Question on reshaping though. If you're going to reshape a loaf do you press it back out on the counter, then roll it back up again or do you just tuck the sides underneath? Also, would you do this to a tinned loaf of bread? Thanks!

[@Moharani21]

Thanks a lot

[@simplemarryman5305]

Thanks bro

[@gustavocrispin448]

Thks so much!.

[@glitchtrap264]

bake with jack = jack baker

[@oskarover18]

How to shape Sourdough? Thats a good video for you to make next!

[@JeromeBertrem1]

Very useful video! Thank you! Could you share the timings of the proofings including the rest time between the two shapings? So following this schematic: kneeding - proofing # 1 - shaping # 1 - resting # 1 - shaping # 2 - proofing # 2 - baking

[@dbbrainer]

I will be using this technique to strengthen my pizza dough balls. For some reason, they do not get a completely homogeneously strong structure. I have noticed in this video that you fold it from all angles instead of four and several times more than I do, plus you shape the dough ball more than just once, which is what I typically do. Great videos. Keep em´coming.

[@laetitialalila7390]

WICKED!!! I was waiting for this one! 😀🙆 Can you please explain what it means if the dough tears while you are shaping it? Thanks a ton, keep SMASHING it! 😉👊😘

[@wisdon]

Too much tension, and maybe a little overproofed

[@mewpilot8742]

Very late here, but it means you shaped it too much, you ripped the thin membrane that formed on the surface of the dough. That's why you need to shape carefully, and not too long. You can of course, shape more after waiting a bit, like in the video.

[@violetryan]

I was going to order your farm house baking kit you have it on sale for $12, but to get it delivered in Canada and with the change over in currency it would cost me over $40. You should think of selling on Amazon. Love your videos, Keep up the great work!

[@powderriverfarrier]

The bread pan and the linens that come with it offset the exchange rate. That and making a really good farm loaf with Jack's kit made it worth the cost. Do some comparison shopping and you'll find Amazon frequently charges anywhere between one and five dollars more for common products that can be found at other web sites.

[@claireguthrie1234]

I second that. The cost to ship to US is 10-15 dollars.

[@piecesofprecious]

Great instructions, Jack! I know you talked about room temperature water in another video, but i wondered if you would expand more on the concept. Maybe include fast rise vs regular yeast with the temperature of the water. Currently, i only have fast rising yeast, so I am making everything with that. I also see that you measure things in grams. In the u.s. we use cups. Sometimes, I don't exactly follow you, but mostly it's been okay. Thanks for all of your great tips!

[@powderriverfarrier]

It is a challenge to move from measuring by weight instead of by volume it you're used to it. It has made all the difference. Sometimes reviewing his videos a day or so later reveals things you may not have noticed or understood the first go round. In case you're wondering ... yes, speaking from experience with learning from his videos.

[@piecesofprecious]

thepowderriverfarrier good tip. Watch it again. (: I dont have anything my house that gives ingredients in grams. How would you mentally make the switch for this idea? The Amish measure in weight, so i got a scale to use some of the things in their store more conveniently, but all of that mathing makes my brain hurt.

[@powderriverfarrier]

Jack's Farm House loaf kit came with a no fail recipe in gms. Take you favorite recipe measurements and use the internet converters to convert the ingredients to gms.

[@Bakewithjack]

Good call! You’re welcome ☺️👌🏻

[@pairdice4517]

Love your videos. How long do you let them rest between each shaping, 30 mins? Is there a total number of shapings or time limit you shouldn't go past? Will the dough over proof?

[@VeggieManiac75]

How many times can I shape a sourdough boule? I'm pretty new at this... I've followed your basic sourdough video and it's working great! Just not quite as much oven spring as I'd like. ..... I'm thinking of shaping 3 or 4 times to see if it helps the structure, but I don't want to ruin it somehow! p.s. I really appreciate your videos; you're teaching great beginner's information in an easy to understand way.

[@GokusonSS5]

have you ever done Cuban or Puerto Rican Water bread? if so would you do a Vid....Jack?

[@ahmed_elalfy]

Great tips Jack. Tried the single method for basket proving. Literally proved the dough for just an hour and when I flipped it (gently) it collapsed. Honestly not sure what is wrong

[@b3ar529]

Isnt this the same as in folding section when making sourdough then?

[@iainwallington474]

That dough looks great how do I make it ?

[@user-iq2ek1de6n]

Hello Jack, I am very much impressed the way you explained about bread dough ....I want to prepare Artisan Bread with crust outside and moist inside. Well I have tried sometimes to prepare the bread dough (with all purpose flour) but it becomes always wet and very much sticky while kneading. When I started to make a dough ball and kept it aside for 10 minutes and start the oven for preheating. When its time to keep the dough ball in the oven, I see the ball becomes flat. And another difficulty is, to get it baked at the core of the bread do I need to keep the temperature a bit low (200 Degrees Celsius) and increase the time up to 40 minutes?? well it's for 390 Gms of Flour + 260 Gms of warm water...I am talking about. I was using baking tray not Dutch Oven. Cause I don't have it. Will the glass pot with cover will work for this ?? Expecting your valued reply...!! Thanks.. Devendra India.

[@IDANEDRY]

Hi Jack, 2 questions, do we have any limit in the number of times we can shape the dough ? is it OK to do this process while the dough is in CT ?

[@DelaG29]

Would this also work for baking in loaf tin? (for sandwich bread)

[@meerarajani5709]

Hi Jack love your video s I follow your bread recipe s but when my bread cools down it crumples on the top does not stay like your can you tall me what am I doing wrong?

[@artKarolina]

How long would you rest the dough after reshaping a sourdough bread before throwing it in the oven? You say 15-20 min but I'm going to assume you mean yeasted bread.

[@awaitingthetrumpetcall4529]

Listening to Jack it finally occurred to me to buy bread flour instead of using all purpose. I made my first loaf using bread flour and I like it better than all purpose.

[@Bakewithjack]

YES! ☺️👌🏻

[@M21467]

Love love love your informative videos and sensible approach. A question: What do I do if my dough tears while shaping? I preshaped, let the dough rest around 10 minutes, then during shaping, the dough tore. In the future I will let the dough rest longer after preshaping, but is there a way to rescue the dough if it tears during shaping?

[@philthetoffee]

M S leave the dough a few minutes to allow it to relax then reshape, should be fine then.

[@paulinewild5238]

Excellent video, as always Jack. Thanks. Could you please show us how this could be done with sourdough?

[@cindytarail6529]

And if you reshape sourdough more than twice, will you have enough activity left in the dough for proofing and baking?

[@arthurprs]

Maybe be on the safe side and degas it as little as possible.

[@realnavy3589]

Cindy Tarail I have the same question regarding sourdough

[@venksv]

Hi Jack - been viewing your videos for a while and they are very helpful! have been trying my hand at sourdough and keep running into issues with final shaping. What do you do when the dough starts tearing at the top? I guess I'm being too aggressive with the handling but don't know how else to get it tight. If it tears, should I just let it be and try shaping again after some time? How do I fix the tear? SO MANY QUESTIONS -- AARGH!!

[@aurastratu2176]

Hi Jack! I’ve made your beginner recipe (second try with sourdough) a bit humid my dough - could be from the fact of using different flour? I am aware I did not give a lot of tension to the dough when shaping, also because it was a bit sticky and I did not want to overwork. Can I do a third shaping when I see this problem? Maybe decreasing the time of rest between preshape/ shape / shape 2 and still keep your timing? If the temperature was aprox 22-23 degrees celsius - this may cause to the loaf to be overproofed? Thanks so much.

[@kathyhuricks3046]

My second proof shaped dough shrunk when i put it in the fridge to bake it in the morning . Can i still save the dough ? Like proof it again for the third time ?

[@kaycarney6393]

Thanks, Jack - with your videos I'm finally starting to 'get' the structure building and shaping thing! May I add my request to others, for a video demonstrating the difference in sourdough shaping, please?

[@Bakewithjack]

Yes Kay, on its way ☺️👌🏻

[@ruddiesruddygoodpizza2158]

Love your bread videos can you do one with sourdough ??(

[@Bakewithjack]

Yep! In time George ☺️

[@kcald9891]

So after you shape them twice, is that when you give them a final 60-120 min rise before baking? Or do you put them straight in the oven? Also you mention in another comment that too much dough tension leads to breaking, but in the video you say you can do this more than twice: What's the maximum number of reshaping you'd recommend?

[@VictorBrichaut]

After shaping it for the second time, do you put it straight in the oven or should you wait to let it rise back (and flatten again a bit)?

[@amydingler]

If you are doing sourdough bread, the shaping all takes place before you put it in the proofing baskets for the final rise...so after bulk fermentation you halve your dough, shape it and rest it on the counter, shape it again and put it in the basket for the (rise 1-4 hours) and then bake!

[@SoloBudgetVegan]

Does this technique work with sandwich bread?

[@morehn]

In making challah, would you recommend active dry yeast or instant? Any thoughts on how many times to let it rise using each? I assume 2-3 rises plus a proof is ideal plus using active dry.

[@dfeuer]

I use instant yeast (Dr Oetker brand) and just mix it with the flour. I highly recommend bread flour to get a nice texture; all purpose tends to make a crumbly challah. After I knead it Thursday evening, I lightly oil the dough in a bowl and stick it straight into the refrigerator overnight, sealed with plastic wrap. I give it a few folds around in the morning to knock out big bubbles (all in the bowl), then return it to the fridge. In the afternoon, I take the dough out of the fridge around an hour and a half or two hours before I'm ready to shape it. I divide in six, give each piece a bit of preshape into a little cylinder, then cycle through them to gradually stretch to the desired length. I braid the two loaves and place each of them on the parchment-covered pan and cover loosely but well with lightly oiled plastic wrap. Once they're nice and puffy, I brush them with egg white and often sesame or poppy seeds and bake.

[@marleenseverin1595]

Need one of the bread scraper

[@Bakewithjack]

Here Marleen: www.bakewithjack.co.uk/shop/bake-with-jack-dough-scraper :-)

[@robertnordeen4631]

oh so thats why my bread went flat. Build tention how ever times i need. Boy, you woke me right up when i turned on your clip. I snapped out of it and into making dough. Im tring flat bread. Went by feel. Cup of thick starter cup or so flour, 7/8 cup water. itaian seasoning, pinch sugar, glug olive oil. sprinkle sea salt. I seen your sunflower seed boule. Nice. ... thoght it was to sticky so added more flower. till it came together and felt ok. roller it out on parchment paper. poked a few holes all over it. Never done this before . Maybe i will do a pizza with it. that works out great every time. I seen your basket of all shapes of funny kinds of bread sticks. wild you are. Where is the store link?

[@angiemorley3403]

Ignore idiots Jack, they don't deserve you! 💖

[@royksk]

Hi Jack, would it be beneficial to double shape the dough for a tinned loaf, or would this restrict the big rise I like to get?

[@Bakewithjack]

Yes always beneficial 👍🏻

[@sharonknight1567]

I must have heavy hands and bad timing. ALWAYS, my bread sticks to the board, sticks to my hands, doesn't roll nice and clean...process feels more like gator wrestling. And then after the rise it spreads out like a pancake. Your technique makes it look so simple. I have to go to bread school.

[@Ash_G]

FoodBusker divided the dough into equal smaller doughs. He then flattened them into rectangles, rolled them up like cigars and finally joined both ends and shaped the cigars into balls. Is that better for surface tension (2nd proof)?

[@alicad2190]

Is it ok to shape more than 2x?

[@franco634]

Jack how do you do this when you are making bread with some kind of stuffing like cheese, or figs or jalapenos?

[@aikomaykorenaga1642]

A lil bit off the subject of the video but i just want to ask if you could do a sourdough starter from different kinds of flour or all purpose flour specifically? Ever since i followed your videos my bread has become edible🤣 my family enjoys it and was amazed too.

[@rushbcykablyat1792]

What does this means? You shape a second time, then let it rise again after the second shape?

[@GkIrel]

😊

[@MrStarpeto]

"two nice bouncy balls"

[@starrychloe]

The dough scraper looks like a Lodge cast iron pan scraper.

[@adamburwell2464]

Two bouncyyy balllls

[@carolinecummings111]

Do you have any meat filled buns ?? thank you.from Canada

[@heksogen4788]

What about yeast that will run out of food if you do this too much? :P

[@jillsexton319]

With the first shaping, let it rest seam side up or down?

[@artbarn2624]

Seam down.