A Disagreement in the Alitalia Cockpit Has Deadly Consequences

[@Mario_1611]

I hope that guy got a chance to say "I told you so".

[@badluck7092]

Mario1611 I personally believe in that day

[@emperorryanii]

Mario1611 , me too, the captain would have been demoted, lol.

[@Xtiansldrs]

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@ispringxdreams5663]

lol same

[@I.have.an.std.]

bad luck .

[@IceAge20017]

I am a (private) pilot. I was told if there is a disagreement always take the safe route and abort.

[@samsmith3025]

He let his ego take over and made it a battle of will.

[@JoeMicalizziMPC]

@@samsmith3025 Sorry, I'm going against Italian Captain be on the Sea or in the Air. They are truly the worst and I'm embarrassed for them disgracing an Italian last name. The culture in the cockpit is probably the worst in the Asian airlines where Captains have been known to slap their co-pilot for even questioning their decisions. Say whatever bad about Americans in the cockpit the co-pilot will speak up and that Italian bird would have aborted that deadly landing with a "F**k You Captain we're going around!!!" Choose wisely what airlines you fly on.

[@christosvoskresye]

@@JoeMicalizziMPC "But first, let's swing really close to this island. I want to show off to some people there."

[@redgringrumboldt8983]

@@christosvoskresye Wow I forgot all about that! Talk about criminal negligence!!

[@alessiopucciarini1796]

@@JoeMicalizziMPC Shut up, Alitalia is one of the most safe air companies in the world.

[@matthendricks9666]

I am an airline captain myself...and this freaks me out entirely. If my co-pilot wants to go-around....we go around.... and talk about that later. As simple as that.

[@catbunny5921]

Yes sir, you're right.

[@davidnavarro4821]

Back in 1990 this rule wasn’t probably around to save people

[@joshuaguzman9648]

Well said Captain 👨‍✈️ 👏

[@daviddavis3389]

Are you sure that you are actually a Real life pilot, or are your a pretend play station pilot like I once was when I was on my plaid games on my computer? I'm inclined to believe that you are a pilot similar to me..lol...

[@matthendricks9666]

@@daviddavis3389 Am I a real pilot? hmmm It depends on who you are asking. I got my ATP 22 years ago and my A320 rating when I was 23yo. Since then I got 14000 hours on A320, A330 and A340. So..if you ask a Boeing-pilot...yeah...I have never flown a real airplane since flightschool.

[@V-D.]

When you don’t see the pilot in a interview after the names are mentioned you know it’s gonna be a bad flight...

[@theirishempire4952]

Yes

[@marce._.]

@@urilou777 It means they're all dead

[@mregg1047]

Ikr

[@amandak.4254]

Actually, it could just mean that they didn't want to be interviewed or something. That China Airlines flight that burst into flames after parking episode, everyone survived, but neither the captain nor the first officer was interviewed

[@northernleigonare]

So "deadly consequences" wasn't clear?

[@TheSecondVersion]

Captain I have a question: Can trees fly? "No, of course not." "Then why do I see them outside the window"

[@proaaron578]

"No you don't"

[@breeknow]

“ Hey, is that a dime?”

[@-jaan6943]

LOL

[@naverilllang]

H0ld tH3 GlYdE!

[@heerkitten6085]

They crashed into the *mountains* . There's a mountain about 2000ft tall directly between the aircraft and the runway, which can't be seen during the night. Additionally, the NAV receiver malfunctioned, allowing the aircraft to capture the glide path about 1000ft too low, while also preventing a warning system from sounding off. Not only that, the altimeter is using the flawed drum pointer design, which a survey by the NASA indicates that, out of 169 surveyed pilots, 137 pilots had read the altimeter wrong, which can induce a reading of 1000ft off . The captain *was* pretty domineering and was incorrect in not letting the first officer performing a glide around, however, it was not the only thing, and it's not as simple as "hurr why tree 5000ft tall". The Swiss had installed lights on the Stadlerberg Mountains, where this flight had crashed.

[@maxhess3151]

Moral of the story: If one of the pilots wants a go-around, GO AROUND.

[@PANZERFAUST90]

heueheue

[@macman975]

That's now compulsory i think.

[@SimRacingVeteran]

@@macman975 - correct.

[@jyjt2903]

Plane companies more concerned about fuel consumption rather than life.

[@nyikasplace9886]

@@jyjt2903 no stupid. Loss of lives costs them billions

[@fedec8854]

The captain set everyone's fate because of his attitude. Unforgivable.

[@reallyhappenings5597]

It wasn't his attitude, it was his angle of attack.

[@jesuslopez9223]

It is called the cockpit

[@jeahhh]

Your attitude determines your altitude. Lol

[@brenttaylordotus]

Fede Cimbaro88 This is a dramatization so we have no idea what his attitude was honestly.

[@RRJOfficial]

So it is called attitude when he trusts everything is correct?

[@suzyqwho516]

Arrogance has no place in the cockpit.

[@Mantis_Toboggan_TrashMan]

I wonder if that was the actually words said. Even if they were at the airport pulling up would have no consequence. It would have saved them or at least gave them a chance.

[@jettgriffith7216]

SuzyQ Who one person plz dislike so we can be a 420

[@400millionbymonday6]

Can you hold the comment? BOOM!

[@PabloGonzalez-hv3td]

There is far more to this story than is being represented here in reality their aircraft was outfitted with a NAV receiver with a known manufacturer defect and the FO was justified in being confused and the Captain was justified in believing they weren't in immediate danger

[@The-Rose-and-the-Cross]

@@Mantis_Toboggan_TrashMan They were, 19-5 seconds before the crash according to BFIJ report.

[@heinrich3427]

I lost my father in this flight. He was an engineer working on a project there and was on the way home.

[@bartgomez4872]

I'm so very sorry to hear this. 🥺

[@blinkse5955]

i am so sorry, may you father rest in peace.

[@KM-ql4eb]

I'm so sorry.

[@ronditchen6664]

So so sorry.

[@titounoundici7920]

May I ask you an unfair question... answer if you wish: how much money have you been given for the loss you underwent?

[@SCADOOSH69]

"I'm in charge so I'm automatically right" syndrome.

[@BlGGESTBROTHER]

I think we all know people like that...unfortunately

[@algorhythm4593]

POOP STINKS Don't ever seek healthcare services if this bothers you...😨😒

[@BlGGESTBROTHER]

@@algorhythm4593 Even healthcare providers can make mistakes. That's why people get second opinions!

[@algorhythm4593]

Big Brother No, people in healthcare make mistakes ALL THE TIME. But you'll NEVER be able to take one of them to task over it as the legal industry is no help, either. Neither industry has a lick of accountability.

[@ViaMirage]

It’s Italians, come on! Lol typical Italians

[@Jason-hz6cm]

“When you’ve been right so many times it can be hard to acknowledge when you are wrong”

[@jaysmith1408]

Who said that?

[@prufkazuya5712]

@@jaysmith1408 Experience said that

[@magonmmen7406]

Let's call it Fatal Conditioning

[@mandarkastronomonov2962]

Well said. I will have to remember that.

[@DL-rz6tw]

Tell Kobe not to shoot that game winning 3. He would of spit on you

[@doktorsljukex4174]

To anyone wondering: Out of 46 passangers including crew none have survived

[@xenaprincess8820]

That's really sad and disheartening...

[@shadipahlavi]

😭😭

[@bigbrainnoob3308]

underrated comment. RIP to the people who died

[@doktorsljukex4174]

@@bigbrainnoob3308 yeah. Reast in peace

[@mauriceouellette7514]

Bonjour a tous du Canada We have compasion what's happened for crew and passenger

[@theotherside931]

*Given the pilot's experience, why wasn't he worried that they were not seeing runway lights from a distance of 1200+ feet?*

[@lilrobux9553]

The Other Side He was

[@aarons4996]

The Other Side because they trusted the technology way too much in this instance instead of common sense

[@happybeingmiserable4668]

Cause more experienced people never make mistakes (Sarcasm) You could have one person that works a job for 10 years and all 10 years never encountered a problem, you could have another guy that works the same job for 2 Months and experiences a lot of challenging issues...who really has the most experience? From a promotional and higher up viewpoint, the 10 year guy, but in reality the 2 Month guy

[@theotherside931]

@@happybeingmiserable4668 *Sad but true.*

[@theotherside931]

@@aarons4996 *(Coughs), Boeing and their MCAS.*

[@BrianThePilot1640]

That's why nowadays even if it's first officer flying, if pilot flying says go around, that really means go around.

[@michaelcanart]

@Mudit Kedia Incorrect! Either pilot flying, or pilot monitoring can call a go-around and it MUST be executed! No discussion! Same applies to a Reject call on take-off.

[@dirtyblond2332]

@@michaelcanart - OK, 21 years Navy flying, and 11 years private rotor wing/fixed wing ferry since. You are right on one level, but not completely. Either can "Call" a go around or abort, but the PIC absolutely has the final say. Case point, it may be called, but the PIC may not think its safe to do so for any number of reasons including weather, traffic, fuel, mechanical/electrical issues. The Pilot In Command ALWAYS has the final authority over the operation of the aircraft.

[@michaelcanart]

Dirty Blond I am an active airline pilot, and in the three airline operations I trained in, what you are stating could not be farther than reality and the safety principles we train under as professionals. The pilot flying does not have the the same picture and full picture as pilot monitoring and sometimes vice versa. There is no time for discussion and debate in these critical phases of flight. We are trained for go-arounds and rejects and they are safe operational procedures to avert a hazardous or potential hazardous threat. If the crew member calling it is in the wrong for doing so, it will be debriefed later and is a learning opportunity for all involved including other pilots in that operation. The examples you state as giving the PIC final authority to validate or not the FO call. If you were ever stuck to that extreme, the situation would be critical, even desperate, and it would have been briefed and actively continually discussed up until that point. I have been there! I don’t want to diminish your career and your experiences, nor do I have any right to but what you are stating is one of the many reasons why even 10,000 hour captains have flown 300+ passenger planes into ground. Please keep in mind that I am talking about airline operations in fixed wing machines.

[@WestAirAviation]

@@michaelcanart I think what Dirty Blond meant was that, if an abort or go around would obviously cause a loss of airframe event, it would be ignored by the PF. Case in point, say you have a cabin fire that is building up intense and thickening smoke in the flight deck. You're on short final now and the computer screams "Windshear. Windshear. Windshear." Your PM/PNF calls go around, but in YOUR MIND you know if you abort, the fire will cause structural failure before you can attempt a second pass. It's a tough call, but IMHO ignoring the windshear aural and crashing onto the runway at 130 knots is way better than crashing into a school in pieces at 200 knots. 99.99% of the time a good brief would prevent this hypothetical, but you might not always have the time to give a thorough brief before attempting an emergency landing, and you won't always be flying with someone who will immediately realize saying go around is a bad idea.

[@dirtyblond2332]

@@michaelcanart - You may want to do some re-reading to familiarize yourself with laws, rules, and regulations. It doesnt matter what the internal policies ot training structure of your employer is. 14 CFR 91.3 clearly gives PIC final authority and is what you will be judged by should things go tits up. I also dont want to question your career, as a professional courtesy, but have serious reservation of any training you received that stressed having discussions, talks, etc., with a debriefing as a learning opportunity, should 14 CRF 91.3 be ignored and shit hits the fan. There is ONLY ONE PIC for a reason. It is elementary principle that should have been drilled into you from the first flight, before you had your first signature in your log book. "I have control. Affirmative, you have control. (Repeated) I have control." At the end of the day, flying, certainly as a civilian career, or as a combat pilot like myself, is a dynamic environment. Sometimes pucker factor reaction is measured in milliseconds. But, if you or your copilot dont understand the principle rules and trust eachother without question when one assumes total command, then maybe another career path is looked into.

[@bt2149]

0:53 Why does this dude look like he's being held at gunpoint and forced to read a script

[@JacobConkin]

I thought the same thing!

[@basasbrenda]

Dude didn't even blink

[@firemangan2731]

Probably agents who work for Mcdonald douglas who wants to hide their bad reputation, so they threatened to shoot this guy if he speaks sh*t about the DC-9

[@DrForrester87]

Too much coffee. What he says is accurate. The DC-9/MD-80/90 family of aircraft were incredibly popular and very common. There are a lot of people who hate on anything McDonald Douglas because mostly because of the DC-10 which had some very high profile crashes. Not all of them were the fault of the company who made the airplane, but it's edgier to ignore that McDonald Douglas aircraft have had long and mostly prosperous and overall safe careers. Not that it matters anymore. The entire MD series of jets is out of production because they're old and the company that owns them all now, Boeing, is more focused on Dreamliners and trying to get the Max-8 back in the air and the airlines are retiring them for newer more efficient planes.

[@Ro6entX]

I always call him crazy eyes; dude rarely ever blinks

[@dmrxy.]

"GO AROUND!" "Nonono" Stupidest thing ive ever heard in aviation history

[@ohtych1004]

“We don’t need a checklist” Famous last words

[@penkatadrums]

What about those guys who tried to take off without the flaps... I think it was in Brazil or smth...

[@Nathanator]

penkata drums Spanair Flight 5022?

[@JustRememberWhoYoureWorkingFor]

@@Nathanator yeah but that wasn't on purpose, they didn't say "hey let's try to take off with those flaps retracted"

[@naverilllang]

@@Nathanator I wouldn't call that a flight.

[@ApplePotato]

The captain’s lack of common sense is amazing. With visibility at 9km, they could have just look outside the windows and they should see the runway...... and clearly it is not there.

[@stefzac9707]

ApplePotato or maybe even the lights, and besides if they weren’t sure they were in the glide slope why didn’t they check the PAPI or any type of lights. SMH

[@quaxky326]

Wot.

[@Naramsit]

And they say pilots these days maintain heads down too much. It's appalling to see nothing much has changed since then

[@plateshutoverlock]

"They had already checked the MAMI which is why the pilot on the left thought they were headed in the right direction" I thought they were taught to cross check between different sources of information :\

[@pingu255]

If I'm not mistaken I think it's pretty hard to see the runway on approach to Zurich because there are a lot of big hills around the airport

[@businessjetguru1298]

I was booked on this exact flight, but arrived at Milan Linate airport early enough to board the earlier flight, operated with the same aircraft, and crew members. I was horrified by the distractions on the flight deck. Flight attendants were allowed into the cockpit throughout the approach into Zurich. As a pilot, and having made this approach, over the mountains, I complained to the ground agent, after we landed at Zurich Kloten. I took a taxi to my hotel, with a colleague, and we ate at a restaurant. Returning to the hotel, we were peppered with phone calls and messages, trying to establish if we were OK. My wife was smart enough to ask if I had already checked-in. Having found out that I had, she knew that I was safe. My colleague was so badly shaken, I hired a car and drove us back to England. I have never flown with Alitalia, since that date.

[@iluop3623]

Alitalia went out of business 5 days ago 😮

[@nizammahamood5909]

Wow...what a story. Didn't you share your experience before?

[@THEPCBUILDER01]

You are blessed

[@Ludographic359]

Alitalia was a great airline back in the 90s... and you should be ashamed of what you wrote, just because some innocent people died it doesn't mean that you're allowed to say bellushit.

[@minibuiIder]

@@Ludographic359 just?

[@airplanewhat5316]

Poor first officer😥 and all involved

[@BlahBlah-ep6hc]

No replies..?

[@lennysolano]

fu colpa del pilota per l'arroganza

[@AviwimGaming]

Lol 1k likes 3 comments

[@nathancard884]

3 comments? Wow...

[@pop5678eye]

Most airlines adopted the policy that if either pilots call for a go-around it takes precedence. Of course that policy has only been implemented after multiple deadly crashes like this.

[@williamvasilakis9619]

It seems to always take a tragedy for change to happen. So sad.

[@mikedamat]

@@williamvasilakis9619 At least change actually happens when people die in plane crashes. Imagine we just shrugged our shoulders every time someone died due to preventable airline crashes the way we do with preventable car crashes. It's a big reason why flying went from the most dangerous form of travel to the safest.

[@williamvasilakis9619]

@@mikedamat Although, i acknowledge your points, as a private pilot myself with many hours accidents transpire in a series of chain events. Many are human factos errors and if we work hard to prevent these and can, why should we not, afterall the cost is always human life. Yes, i agree flying is safer but there are also a whole lot of factors statistically which make it such like the percetage of people who drive as those who fly airplanes. Pilots are in a greater minority and are governed by higher FAA requirements, but flying will still have inherent risks like anything else. I just would like to do my best to reduce those risks as much as possible, that's all I am really saying. Your point is well taken howver. Safe flying to you.

[@andersonrobotics5608]

@@mikedamat i mean there are also other reasons like how not literally everyone is flying a plane

[@GanzuGinisu]

@@williamvasilakis9619 sadly in life, that's how it is. Every rule is made from blood.

[@pauldarlington5589]

I remember decades ago, even as a student pilot, if I was in command and I called a go around I would never be questioned, challenged or over ruled. If something looks off about a landing it's always a good call to go around and it's the command pilots decision alone. Another pilot actually touching the controls without first taking over command of the aircraft is even more shocking.

[@shaguftahussain3247]

Don't runway radar guide the landing or atc?

[@DMVRailfan]

I mean I agree. If one of the two, three or at least ONE pilot wants to go around, you go around and you discuss what happened later.

[@maxkruse7690]

The first officer in heaven sending a message to the pilot be like “I f*cking told you”

[@jayhoyechaluse3370]

Ako din ganyan

[@firemangan2731]

Haha for real

[@رضاشیرانی-ر2ه]

@@jayhoyechaluse3370 ok

[@Moshe.1972]

🤣🤣

[@macioluko9484]

Hate to say I toe da so but I F@cken toe da so! -Ricky

[@SC707V8]

The co-pilot was a hero but he and innocent passengers lost their lives to a captain's arrogance.

[@Turtle-.-]

Why is the co-pilot a hero?

[@ajitsen6927]

@@Turtle-.- why not ?

[@minaminitta7686]

3:30

[@smokaa1202]

@@ajitsen6927 correct me if i misunderstood but the young pilot is supposed to be flying the aircraft ad the old pilot is supposed to be the co pilot

[@sgtransportations7103]

he should just quickly take control of the plane

[@BucketofDoge]

Wait why didnt it go “terrain terrain” “pull up”

[@edgzta]

I read this in the computer voice lol

[@TrapKingz.]

I read because the captains altimeter was giving them false readings so the warning sign that says “pull up” wasn’t triggered.

[@ibraveheart5700]

Mario Eduardo Me to 😂

[@keensta123]

TrapKingz I’m pretty sure the sensor will not use the altitude to decide if there’s ground below it sends out a signal and if it detect ground below it warns them, unless the flaps and gears are extended. Which is could of potentially had deployed if they where on glide slope.

[@TrapKingz.]

A you’re right, I think this is an old plane or something but that’s what it said in wikipedia

[@LyndaWhite-ju1gj]

Man,,,, who put that mountain there !!!!!!!!!

[@Des_Christ7]

man whenever I come to read comments related to the crash or more info I come across these craaaazyyy comments!

[@LyndaWhite-ju1gj]

Cristiano Lover I was trying to convey the pompous attitude of the pilot disregarding the critical information of the first officer which if acknowledged would have avoided the crash and saved the lives of everyone on board including the captain.

[@Des_Christ7]

@@LyndaWhite-ju1gj yea okay calm down. 😅I get it, I misunderstood the comment.

[@LyndaWhite-ju1gj]

Cristiano Lover. Oh that’s ok iv been an airline employee over 30 years plus if watched the recreation of every major airline crash since the famous midair over the Grand Canyon in the 1950’s and there are so many cases where the senior captain disregarded life saving information from the first officer or maybe even someone riding in the jump seat. That’s why for the last 20 years there has been such a heavy emphasis on CRM or cockpit resource management.

[@Wirgah]

God

[@electronicsNmore]

Always fly higher than the mountains.

[@epicplayz260]

electronicsNmore find you

[@GueVonez]

I try to fly under them

[@sunrise5710]

Giovanny you’re just built different

[@VictorNidas]

@@GueVonez of course you would

[@The_Chitrakarist]

Ok

[@patrick40592]

Its a miracle the camera crew survived such a crash

[@mtarique92]

do you get this is not real

[@TheAmelia0820]

@@mtarique92 It's a joke...an overused one.

[@mtarique92]

@@TheAmelia0820 yea Exactly

[@jgwentworth6735]

​@@TheAmelia0820OH GOD ITS SO FUCKING FUNNY THOUGH!!!!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA ITS SO FUCJING FUNNY!!!!!!

[@VivekWilfred]

What we've been taught. If anyone says go around, first go around. Then after reaching a safe altitude,ask why. Every regulation is written in blood.

[@jamesfunk7614]

That makes sense, even if the captain had doubts about the copilot. This crash was 30 years ago, and that became the policy because of this crash.

[@janeryan2709]

That regulation was put in place after this incident because of incidents like these.

[@ShaunHensley]

Similar in my field of construction. Called Stop Work Authority. Critical in crane work, for example

[@jamesfunk7614]

(topic drift) Decades ago, an automobile maker had problems with quality. One of the changes they made was to install switches that would allow any worker to halt the assembly line, if a quality issue was spotted. Of course, emergency stop switches should have been there for safety. I imagine they were.

[@neverleft636]

Essentially yes. Lol. Some safety rules and regs are there without accident but mostly it’s because someone died if it’s in aviation.

[@browneyes2674]

I work with a boss who is like. Thankfully not flying planes

[@browneyes2674]

@I Em Hoo I Iz I hope you get someone who has empathy

[@huntbunt117]

Fuckin eh !

[@MoneyWicks]

Same here dude

[@roboticski]

@I Em Hoo I Iz yo, update us

[@roboticski]

@I Em Hoo I Iz wow man. Sorry to hear that. Things went downhill really fast. I hope you find a strong footing along the way.

[@ZenZanoman]

I will use it for my management and leadership students. "Having 4 stripes doesn't mean you're always right"

[@janellirving4625]

The captain talked to him as if he were a child.

[@flaviobriggs]

The biggest rule to remember is never ever EVER question a go around under any circumstances

[@gerardkeaveny9979]

My rule don't fly

[@indrajityadav4331]

@@gerardkeaveny9979 so would u rather cry for not roaming the world

[@rmsteutonic3686]

@@indrajityadav4331 ships

[@brizzle3903]

@@rmsteutonic3686 ships can’t go everywhere…

[@justanaviationguy11]

@@gerardkeaveny9979 horrible rule

[@odysseyguyperson]

3:30 Witness the dumbest move in the DC-9’s history.

[@m.hstudioproductions6642]

It wasn't the plane's fault, it was the pilot's.

[@ameybirulkar7503]

@@m.hstudioproductions6642 I read that the plane's computer was giving incorrect information to the pilot.

[@gamer4life592]

Copilot: No balls, you won't crash the plane Pilot: Bet

[@mike88g1]

Ryan Hood not wat happen

[@gamer4life592]

@@mike88g1 It's called a joke

[@jessiefrye3045]

@@gamer4life592 I laughed. So now, you're GROUNDED! 😂😂😂😂

[@dimitriwilliams2207]

People can criticize, but with him being new it’s hard to override someone with much more experience than you .

[@carryeveryday910]

mike88g1 r/wooosh

[@paulnod]

A shame to see a bully at work, this still happens in lots of work places.

[@sl4983]

Ugh I hear ya

[@stephenbate933]

almost all work places have bullying at some point!!

[@Kira7130]

At least the bully's dead

[@saulfernandez8876]

...sometines routine does that, the darn routine, man

[@kaptainkaos1202]

Thank Goodness at my work all it takes is one person to say no. If a no vote is thrown we stop what we’re doing and start discussing the situation and come up with a solution that we all agree on.

[@alejandrob5616]

Should have listened to your first officer

[@coach714]

I've said elsewhere that the most dangerous factor in any piloting, driving or ship navigating is EGO.

[@Hammett175]

Maybe in life in general

[@bskee001]

What’s that, like an Electronic Guiding Odometer?!

[@r0xdab0x96xo]

In the Pilots defense, there was a glitch in the instruments giving him false information. Though, truth be told, it's always best to pick the safest option in a disagreement

[@greatking5214]

Thanks coach

[@WingedEternitys]

Coach Ego and attitude.

[@AurioDK]

Experience doesn´t make you a good pilot if you automate your mind.

[@usaslastresort1126]

Well said old sport 🙏🏽

[@olli2591]

He didn't automate anything, he actively decided to ignore instruments showing different results. The video doesn't tell the real story, it's just very superficial.

[@Horseluvver]

Ask Sully, right...

[@vexingrabbit1824]

Experience does help, however some people relied on tech too much rather then their flight instincts.

[@blessedi8138]

Correct

[@Vesalius21]

Capt : "hold the glide!" Trees : "yes"

[@danmclaughlin1180]

The first officer had initiated a go-around but the captain aborted it. Investigators working with McDonnell Douglas concluded that, if the captain had not interrupted the go-around, the disaster would have been averted. Investigators believe that the reason for the bad call was that the captain was completely dissatisfied with the first officer's performance during the flight. As a result, the captain showed a lack of trust in his co-pilot.

[@sl4983]

@s That really didn't change anything. Where did you get your info?

[@julosx]

@s Your info, wherever it's coming from (why don't you quote your source ?) miss a critical point : the failure of the NAV receiver that prevented the captain to have reliable info displayed on his drum altimeter and the GPWS to have the data it needed to set off an alarm.

[@hrthrhs]

There also shouldn't be both pilots flying the plane at the one time. But that's what happened when the captain put his hand on the throttle as the 1st officer was throttling up.

[@D_Thang]

The irony..

[@cashewnuttel9054]

Then the captain should have taken over.

[@1Maverick747]

This is what happens when the captain thinks he’s too smart.

[@sl4983]

Pride

[@ItsSimplyAless]

his ego led to a tragic disaster

[@Boypogikami132]

Lol

[@johnboythai1514]

Just like the canary Islands 747s! "Assume Nothing" I was a satellite controller for 30 years!

[@nathancard884]

Well in this, the first officer was definitely smarter.

[@shiljugangadharan7581]

From start to the end, both actors were acting like a dysfunctional family couple who hesitates to look each other.

[@soulpowar]

I want to hear the real black box of this recording!

[@lemon651]

They are only allowed to realease manuscripts of the black box recordings. idk why tho.

[@henneburymarc]

@@lemon651 There are tons of black box recordings online.

[@chootanf]

@@henneburymarc never heard much, sure there are some but not that many since FAA prohibited the release of recording

[@Amanda-C.]

@@henneburymarc Do you mean ATC recordings? I've seen even reputable news sources confuse Air Traffic Control audio with audio from "in the cockpit".

[@chootanf]

if you guys wanted to hear many cvr, theres this channel named chilloutjr cvr & atc, where there are my cvr.. but if you compare it to the number of aviation accidents since the first production of cvr, then technically its very few (only 30 or so), especially after the FAA prohibits the publishing of cvr

[@Diptonil_Mukherjee]

20 years experience doomed in 20 minutes. Last year's experience did the last try but.....

[@PeterNGloor]

This fireball at the end is what a friend of mine saw when he was at quite a distance from the crash site. Another acquaintance told us he missed the flight because he decided to linger at the airport's bar and take a later flight. He said he was born twice.

[@steveystovey]

"Go around!" "Nonono, hold the glove. Can you hold it?" optional response: "Sir, that's not a runway, that's a forest"

[@nickduarte1778]

*Glide not glove*

[@robloxtipshelper]

Mysterious Rider omg just noticed that 😂

[@smx6544]

Bruh

[@smx6544]

*glove*

[@patricke170]

Haha glove

[@blitzblutz]

When I do any kind of work, I ALWAYS listen to my son's advice. He is 15 and I am 50. I am also a Fire Captain. He sees things that I do not. I know more than he does and I have a lot more experience but it is amazing what another perspective can do!!!

[@XwpisONOMA]

OK then I hope it's not your engine coming if my house's on fire! 😱

[@ElixirOfEuphoria]

@@XwpisONOMA So you want the dumbass who doesn't listen to others and gets people killed, got it!

[@A_10_PaAng_111]

Arcade Dominator Hope you feel the same way when it's your box that's on fire 🔥

[@DMVRailfan]

First Officer in Heaven: I f**king told you so!

[@philjackson6859]

During the approach to runway 14 of Zurich International Airport, the pilot's instrument landing system display gave incorrect values due to a faulty receiver. It falsely indicated that the aircraft was about 1,000 feet higher than it actually was. The ILS receiver of the co-pilot was working correctly and displayed the dangerously low approach. Without thoroughly examining which value was correct, the pilot decided to ignore the second device, aborting a go-around manoeuvre initiated by the co-pilot. Shortly afterwards, at 19:11 CET, the plane struck Stadlerberg Mountain at 1,660 feet, killing all 40 passengers and six crew. The aircraft's first impact was with trees on the right side of the aircraft, causing several essential parts on the right side of the aircraft, such as the right wing flaps and the outer right wing, to detach. As a result, the aircraft produced an asymmetric lift force and began to roll to the right, finally slamming into the mountain in a nearly inverted position. Firefighters and police were immediately dispatched to the crash site but the fire was so intense that it took an entire day to put out. Eyewitnesses stated that "the plane was burning like a volcano." Linate Airport immediately set up a crisis center to handle the relatives of the victims aboard the flight. A Swiss investigation concluded that the crash was caused by a short circuit, which led to the failure of the aircraft's NAV receiver. The malfunction went unnoticed by the crew, who likely believed they were on the correct flight path until the crash. Swiss authorities also blamed inadequate Crew Resource Management experienced when the pilot vetoed the co-pilot’s attempted go-around, along with the absence of lighting on Stadlerberg Mountain and the Drum Pointer Altimeter of the aircraft. The final report by the Federal Aircraft Accidents Inquiry Board requested several major changes and made further recommendations

[@VoltSnake]

ty for the information, helpful to understand how the crash was caused

[@algeria3033]

Phil Jackson did anyone survive?

[@mariogarrido6273]

In other words the old pilot was responsible

[@marin_real_estate_photography]

So both the pilot and co-pilot have separate ILS Receivers?

[@aliamashmoushi1100]

Mazot Hortlak so why did u comment u couldve just stayed quiet smh

[@WORLD8NSH5KNIGHT1]

This tragedy will be 30 years ago this November (2020) RIP to all 46 victims :(

[@jnbien971]

don't worry is ok to fix

[@sl4983]

46?

[@sunnyfon9065]

@Jn Bien how to fix???

[@jjosten529]

The captain was salty with his first officer and killed everyone on board because of that. Thank goodness they changed protocol.

[@mustafamelihdemir9788]

What is the protocol now?

[@vydarkenya2165]

Mustafa Melih Demir u can over rule ur Captain if u think he or she might cause an accident

[@julosx]

It wasn't only captain's fault. His ILS device was malfunctioning which prevented the GPWS to set off, he should have believed his first officer instead and his instruments which displayed to right data (that they were far below the glide slope). Also the then drum altimeters were displaying ambiguous information. Of course the captain's arrogance through the flight until the end, when he vetoed his first officer attempt of a go-around, sure didn't help.

[@jamesfunk7614]

@@mustafamelihdemir9788 The protocol now is to never abort a go around.

[@IslamicReminders904]

How do the camera man survive Everytime??

[@wjatube]

why don't passengers wear safety suits made from the same material as the black boxes?

[@worldwidewonders681]

😂😂👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

[@worldwidewonders681]

It would cost

[@OttoMatieque]

he didn't - it was live streamed and that is how the footage was saved

[@Nonamelol.]

These unfunny overused jokes are so fucking annoying smh 🤦‍♂️

[@O_Marco1501]

When one Pilot say go Auround Nobody is allowed to stop him

[@trollege9618]

@Daniel Treadwell see you in a wreckage

[@stefanrichter6775]

Der HSV regiert die ganze Welt !

[@wanja-]

HSV

[@Masonwhite12796]

Anyone

[@PInk77W1]

Except Alitalia captain

[@theodorej.burkhardt8844]

Before I get on an airplane, I always make sure there’s no Smithsonian cameras on board

[@drenogatti7644]

I am Italian and I remember that evening thirty years ago when the news of the accident was reported on the national news. Sad story.

The ego gets many people killed.

[@ItsSimplyAless]

agreed

[@tokamohamed4078]

The pilot shoulda listened to the co-pilot. Everything would have been fine if he had. I just hope that the co-pilot had the opportunity t say I told you so.

[@Ragluvvulgar]

This made me so mad .I can't even begin to tell you how disgusted I am

[@PANZERFAUST90]

Tell us.

[@razorblade7408]

"would you like to know more?"

[@hanicuhati8506]

Umm, tell us, *w e w a n n a k n o w d a t r u t h*

[@mwheheh]

This is the Captins fault

[@scqvenger]

I call it the death chamber 9 for DC9

[@holthogan5562]

@Francisca Cabrales I think your thinking of the DC-10.

[@holthogan5562]

@Francisca Cabrales I could be wrong though.

[@yoopernow]

NSS

[@crimsonwolfdragonsatsuna3322]

vFirey agreed

[@obamiumofficial4298]

Cause of these videos whenever I go on a plane I get the chills

[@aziez2011]

😂😂😂

[@hmmhmm7029]

If someone in the cockpit says "go around", no one is allowed to stop that person even if you're the first officer.

[@bluejaysbaseball]

Captain: Can you hold it? Both pilots: Sees trees *Thomas The Tank Engine Theme begins to play*

[@WhakataneMaori]

Its a re enactment stupid. That wasnt a live scene. 🤦‍♂️

[@denissealdana7816]

Tyler Reddick now every time my son watches Thomas and friends I’m going to think of this

[@repsreplays9275]

All airlines as of March 2020 will be required to program their aircraft to blast Thomas The Tank Engine theme on the PA system in the event of an emergency. The theme must get faster in 10 second intervals.

[@hhattonaom9729]

LMAO

[@Katwoman4318]

Tyler Reddick oh shit!

[@ripnob]

If your 1st officer notices somethings wrong, You need to notice it quick.

[@ahyanahmed3998]

Alitalia 404, Flight not Found

[@balto2455]

pretty funny

[@Everlast_37]

NDABEZITHA you realise he made fun of those who died?

[@habyaram.alphonse7249]

FYI: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alitalia_Flight_404

[@sonario6489]

@@Everlast_37 You realize 404 is an error, right?

[@Everlast_37]

Sonario648 yeah still made fun of the whole thing

[@londongamer3907]

CO pilots tomb stone says "I told u to go around!"

[@jakeclark405]

“So many times in life when you think your right, it makes it harder to believe you could be wrong”

[@thelambopenguin]

you’re*

[@solwen]

When the comfort of experience turns into mental lazyness...

[@crummybcd6061]

The animators on the smithsonian channel must really love airplane crashes...

They look oddly satisfying to me

[@samobadie]

Smithsonian didnt make the animations lol

[@mrsalvatore608]

This videos are taken from the National Geographic show

[@chenfeilo6313]

CrummyBcd I don’t think so

[@Katwoman4318]

CrummyBcd lol

[@heatherlynsey3092]

Every time I click on one of these I know that twenty more will follow in my recommended but I still click anyways. They are like watching a trainwreck, you just can’t look away.

[@godfather4047]

Human error is something which we cant eliminate, it happens somehow or the other no matter the training given.

[@olivermener2907]

If they survive - suspend them permanently (take their pilot license) and give the airliner a big fine. If they die - blacklist their living family from being a pilot, perhaps even any other aviation-related job.

[@MrRazorblade999]

That's why we should have pilotless planes.

[@godfather4047]

Logan Arendt that cannot happen as robots cannot think independently and nothing can be matched with human brain. humans have the ability to execute actions which could save an airplane from imminent danger, robots would not be able to do so.

[@godfather4047]

Logan Arendt i do agree with you about robots used in manufacturing and production, as it is based on a fixed set of instructions. But when it comes to flying a plane, you need humans to implement decisions based on judgements, where as a robot cant. For example, the japan airlines 123 crash, was due to the fin ripping apart mid flight, this severed hydraulic lines and causing loss of hydraulic pressure. The controls were no longer effective, but the pilots managed to prolong the flight by another 30 minutes, just by using flaps and engine thrust to maneuver which was a tough task. In such a case would a robot be able to perform such actions? And could a robot think independently on what actions be carried out ?

[@WarriorsfanDubnation]

D'Ascoyne terrible idea

[@airbusman5514]

Standard procedures today, thank god, dictate that as soon as one crew member calls for a missed approach, it's to be completed without objection from the other crew member. I'm guessing this accident, where the PF called for a go around and the PM enacted his final authority as pilot in command to override the go around attempt, contributed to that requirement.

[@pirroshuteriqi3411]

Does the ATC has to with the accident shown in the video? Could they possibly avoid it the crash?

[@beverlyarcher3744]

It's sad that it takes tragic deaths to do something about stuff like this 😢😢😢😢

[@PabloGonzalez-hv3td]

That's true but specifically with Alitalia 404 blaming the accident soley on the Captain for vetoing the FO is unfair when the short circuited NAV Receiver was telling him he was in fact on glide and it even disabled the GPWS they were both justified in their perceptions

[@louisazraels7072]

@@PabloGonzalez-hv3td there was no reason not to go around and just try again, so yeah he was to blame

[@PabloGonzalez-hv3td]

@@louisazraels7072 If you're going by this video you're not getting the full story they had faulty instruments

[@Noodlyk18]

And that's why you adhere to procedures. When your FO says to go around, you don't question it, even if it's his first day and you're 99% sure he's wrong, you go around and talk about it later, write a report if you have to, avoid flying with him, whatever, but you go around. Both pilots need to have a single doubt that it's safe to land. It's so infuriating when people die because of the ego of one man.

[@ervingranlund3744]

Hold the glide "Yea i'd love to captain but the trees are in the way"

[@hrthrhs]

Captain: Nononono can you HoLd iT??

[@nathancard884]

@@hrthrhs yes sir

[@КајмакамЕфенди]

"Go around" in a cokpit, no matter who says it, should have the power of the constitution in a country !!!

[@mef12727]

I believe almost all Airlines nowadays implemented that.

[@rodracer4567]

Thats how it works now, but sadly it took crashes like this for it to happen

[@mannyc6649]

After this incident, it became forbidden to abort a go-around once it has been initiated, regardless of the rank.

[@atptestysetabandonedforeve9472]

Date: 14/11/1990. Survivors: 0. Deaths: 46. Flight: Alitalia Flight 404.

[@kwanming4751]

What a disaster, that all could have been avoided had he listened to the advice of his first officer. Tragedies like the flight of 140 Showcase why CRM or cockpit resource management is vital. R.I.P to all the victims of this crash.

[@mlol6000]

if anyone even the second officer says go around, they should go around to be on the safe side

[@ReflectedMiles]

That is standard procedure. Maybe at Alitalia back then it was a matter of the captain looking at the first officer like, "Look at you, huh!?!" so he just said, "Yes, sir" out of embarrassment and capitulation, being the new guy.

[@quellamasputacchione1126]

@@stephenhunt8912 This rule wasn't applied in 1980-1995

[@williamvasilakis9619]

This is a cockpit mismanagement issue. First officers need to speak up more and work as a team. In this case the Captain made a huge error on judgement. Unfortunately, they perished as a result.

[@ahsanulibadradif1539]

Yeah, visibility 9 km but still they can't see the runway becon when it's less than 4 km.This is absurd.They should have go around.Idk why no system alert!

[@shaguftahussain3247]

Didn't the ATC inform thy r on the wrng track.. when there is no runway?

[@PeterNGloor]

go tell that to a captain who believes he is right.

[@MaxaPhoenix]

At least the camera crew survived!

[@acidi]

Brz1up getting my r/wooosh ready

[@Seadog..C5]

Brz1up no I'm sorry the camera crew bit the bullet also.. that's why the video was only 4 minutes

[@crimsonwolfdragonsatsuna3322]

Brz1up wait so everyone died?!

[@dannyrichards6233]

Lol.

[@ScullBayProductions]

It was a Go-Pro camera

[@sagar7154]

As a captain i always listen to copilot and respect each of his decision. Later we can discuss on each decision seperately on ground.

[@Ayks123]

When they say pilots has this many years experience and then you see tragedies like this, doesn't give me confidence

[@karlsandin4515]

Ayks humans are humans.

[@Ayks123]

@@karlsandin4515Your right, humans are humans, but not all humans are the same☝️

[@crisNAGILL]

this accident happened 14 days before i was born. planes that time ddnt have cockpit alarm? no "terrain" sound?

[@supertrix101]

The plane that crashed did have a "Ground Proximity Warning System" alarm fitted into the cockpit. But that alarm system malfunctioned due to a "short circuit" in the system.

[@kewlztertc5386]

@@mtxor in olden days, it was optional equipment. Not every airline bought it.

[@thanosyf3632]

The plane was configured for landing so the alarm was disabled

[@kewlztertc5386]

@@thanosyf3632 even so, when landing there is a spoken audio alert counting down altitude.

[@thanosyf3632]

@@kewlztertc5386 I completely forgot the callouts You're wright

[@jjasb3ar]

The pilots waiting at the gates of heaven with the crew and passengers First officer: I told you so, then we wouldn't of died, I knew something was up, but NOOOOO, you didn't listen and straight into the trees

[@thatxboxchannel4772]

I’m kinda waiting for the info on that Ethiopian crash to become a episode My condolences to the family and victims of that tragic accident

[@robertforster8984]

Unfortunately, there were no survivors.

[@chateaupig826]

I'm amazed at the captain's gruff attitude with someone clearly needing to still learn . The minute he said "didnt we pass it" and with his inexperience you would have thought the captain would have checked the situation properly -RIP⚘

[@rememberingthevictims914]

3:37 there where trees ahead of them why the first officer didn't shout. First officer: Go around! Captain: Nonono let's suicide First officer: yes sir

[@quellamasputacchione1126]

He's watching the altimeter

[@copperheadh1052]

Let's suicide!....my gut hurts from laughing

[@thaatmatt]

it's an animation it wasn't like that lol

[@JJtoob]

This is a dramatization, we don't know just from this if the trees were visible in the actual case.

[@jaysonwastell2602]

😂

[@kristinrandall2681]

*PLEASE STOP breaking these videos up into 4 minute segments with no answers. What is the POINT?!*

[@yoloswaggins1579]

They're trying to sell the full episodes as a paid program.☹

[@dennisdennis3889]

Yes please give us the full story

[@xXAaron102Xx]

@The Creeper answers meaning what the miscommunication was about and what caused it, how it could have been prevented, not the deaths u idiot

[@JamesParker1998]

@@dennisdennis3889 Guys when a plane crashes in a huge fireball usually the end of the story is they all died.

[@santafe7840]

@Shasta Graff u too are the biggest dumb .... u spit on dead ppl while u are sitting on ur bumpy white ass doesnt know anything

[@mancuby6679]

The Captain (an Alitalia Dc9 instructor) humiliated the FO during the flight with a kind of interrogatory about landing procedures, which inhibited the critical-power of the young pilot when he noticed the plane was under the correct glide slope (because of a atavic problem of the Altimeter of the Cpt side). When the survival-istinct brought the FO to grab the cloche screeming ‘Go around!’ Tha CPT said: No! No! No!!’ Few seconds later, the crash on the Stadlerberg hill.... Tomorrow are exactly 30 years from that tragic day 😢😢😢😢😢😢😢

[@trueknowledgeispower]

F/O: Can we go around?? Capt.: No,......we're going to crash the plane into terrain, first.

[@jamesthompson2065]

People who are complaining that it's only a short clip. NO SHIT. They're not gonna give you the whole episode for free are they?!

[@novrie9013]

Yeah true..

[@JoJo-pl6ud]

I have to pay to see what's safe!? One day I will also have pay to go outside

[@funky7127]

@@JoJo-pl6ud You expect a TV Show Company to give episodes for free to people and other TV Channel Companies? A rare but kind of common choosing beggar

[@JoJo-pl6ud]

@@funky7127 that would be great if there was less hungry money creator out there

[@funky7127]

@@JoJo-pl6ud good luck

[@alessandroarcuri209]

"go around" was the last judicious sentence uttered that day.

[@binvlone238]

R.I.P to everyone on the plane 🙏🙏

[@dannyrichards6233]

🙏

[@AsimovXV]

Expect for pilot, he doesnt deserves heaven

[@johnnyllooddte3415]

and thats gonna buff right out.. whoevers flying the plane is in charge at that moment.. thats been clarified a 1000 times since 1990.. if it doesnt feel right,, go around.. hard lesson,,, thats taken decades to learn

[@triggeredcat120]

If there’s ego in the cockpit, then it’s going to be a crappy way to go.

[@addition77]

Don’t argue with the first officer even if you’re the captain

[@3chords490]

.......ESPECIALLY if you are the captain

[@deltawestunitedofficial9502]

They should have gone around like as Swiss001 says, *"You can always go around."*

[@Kevincents]

*This proves that rank does not determine one's professionalism.*

[@dylalogical853]

First officer: Go around! Captain: How bout no

[@rikilamaru]

trees im about to end this mans whole career