A Simple Approach to Correct Saddle Height (for road cyclists)

[@2XFactor51]

I love this dude. He just explained my issues over the last 3yrs in 5 minutes...true bike fitters are VERY hard to come by

[@dreyn7780]

Wrong. Recent concept. He didn't explain YOUR issues to us. You were conned by salesmen just like most people. Not once did this 'so called ' expert ever mention bike features the designer has engineered into the frame. Engineering design isn't particle engineering. When are you going to talk about the wheelbase? Trail braking technique. Rear wheel rotation When cornering. Change the riding position in the wheelbase and corner rotation speed changes. They keep crashing in the tour de France cause they listened to blokes like this. They crash in corners cause they don't realize the wheels are only designed for long distance straight roads AND there's too much rear wheel rotation When cornering.

[@nihilisticfella]

@@dreyn7780 Loser lol

[@dreyn7780]

@@nihilisticfella You failed to reply. And now you’ve got yourself reported to the authorities. It’s not your opportunity to attack. Your reputation is trash before you read any comments. Bike owners are crazy.

[@lalremruata_chongmang]

@@dreyn7780 talk less

[@cvbfvre]

@@dreyn7780 I believe he kept it simple on purpose. He couldave gone way more in depth but that was not the purpose of the video.

[@nhattran1074]

its 12 am and i'm adjusting my saddle height......

[@梁寳文]

Did it too! :P

[@KillteeLenny]

Hahahahhahaha 11 pm for me

[@edwardarango7287]

Same

[@JamesWalters1]

1:20 am

[@joesantos7196]

@nhat Tran you are dedicated

[@knoxindy]

The best saddle height video I’ve ever seen. All of his tips are incredible for every part of the bike fit.

[@topaz_climber]

100% agreed!

[@justforfunm8994]

I couldn't agree anymore.

[@Pods619-t1d]

Yeah Neil (Neal?) is awesome. Love all his appearances, he doesn't mince words and is really effective at communicating

[@dreyn7780]

It's a pitty It's 50 years TOO late. Wise professional experts have always prooven to be unwise clowns. The experts gave us ROCK Hard plastic seats. The experts didn't tell us anything. The experts went off and left us to work it out for ourselves. Etc. You shut up about experts. The staff at bike shops are useless uneducated and disrespectful.

[@keithchang8566]

Picked up cycling a year ago and I'm back at this vid to inform my head about the changes I've made to my bike so far. He's absolutely spot on about the 'right range' where that 2-4mm difference can feel so much better or worse. Coupled with seat angle and fore/aft, the saddle alone is enough to drive me mad on the bike fit!

[@donsinyard8857]

As a Physical Therapist and a competitive cyclist for 37 years,,,,, You are spot on!

[@rolffuchs2737]

Thank you, you really saved my life. I was really desperate because of cramps in my calf and persistent pain in my lower back. I did workouts, stretching Quigong (which are all good things to do), but nothing really helped. Then i measured my saddle height after watching this and it was at least 2cm too high. I corrected it, rode my bike and it's like heaven, the pain has gone and i`ve even more control over my bike. Thank you!!!

[@dc1316]

Every time i see this guy on a video thumbnail i have to click. Easily the most knowledgeable person ive ever heard, with proof to back it up!

[@timjones4594]

Generous of you guys to share this. Practical, easy to implement, this is gold.

[@evanmacdougall9715]

Wow, I totally needed this video. Been fiddling with my saddle height for a year. Felt too high. Dropped it down. But then brought it back up. Now, listening to all the symptoms of having the seat be too high, I can tell my saddle is still too high. Definitely going to be making some adjustments. And also some of the best tips on how to test out those adjustments. Great video. Thank you so much!

[@drewridikas4055]

From an anatomy / physiology perspective this is the best explanation of saddle height that I have seen.

[@Jin_KX]

Absolutely spot on! Lots of similar references drawn from Steve Hogg whom I learnt from. Good video and I urge everyone to stop using formulas if you've tried it and it doesn't work. Learn to feel for your bike fit and let comfort be your guide. Very important mention that the fatigue in your legs is meant to be evenly distributed and not localized. Love the bit when you mentioned how a too high saddle tend to load your hands as this is how I've resolved hand pain and numbness - by lowering my saddle sufficiently so that i am well balanced. To those who are curious, I've experimented with almost every available stem length and handlebar width and these didn't resolve the issue with my hands due to having a saddle that was too high.

[@jodyhodge2129]

I had a bike fit last year and result was my saddle was too low by indication of saddle pressure and knee angle. Put me in spd's and raised my saddle. Was an improvement but I have lots of pressure on my hands. I have installed a new saddle so I am gonna follow his advice and see what happens. I ride for fitness and leisure with a desire for 1-3 day touring.

[@Jin_KX]

@@jodyhodge2129 hey buddy! If you never had hand discomfort at your previous saddle height then it is very likely that your saddle is too high.. Knee angles and saddle pressure points can be wrong! These methods never worked for me.

[@melbournewoman]

Neill was trained by Steve Hogg

[@Jin_KX]

@@melbournewoman yeah just found out eventually 🤩

[@PeterPutz82]

Great vids Cam, thanks (and thanks Neil). My experience - I've had a Steve Hogg bike fit six months ago + been through lots of tweaking and learning about fitting. Diagnosed twisted hips from an old injury. Since then I've corrected it and removed the cleat wedges Steve installed as my twisted hip is now fixed. All that Neil is saying is spot on, can't fault it. To add another 'check' for saddle height after you've done what Neil has said, while decending and cornering say left, right foot should be in the 6 o'clock position, weight loaded to the right foot, you shouldn't feel that you are stretching or shifting in the saddle to reach the pedal. If you are, saddle too high, lower it bit by bit until you are no longer reaching. You should be nice and neutral on the saddle for both sides when cornering. Initially, you will feel too low, but trust me, it's the correct height, stick with it. Also check both sides, if you feel like you are reaching with one side, but not the other, you may have a leg length discrepancy / twisted hips / cleat position / stack height needs checking. Also, when doing bike fit, it is imperative to warm up for at least 10 minutes. Quite often I start riding and my quads start complaining / position feels crap, but my hammi's and glutes take longer to warm up so the quads carry the load until everything is warmed up, then the position is perfect.

[@TheHerrMan]

bro the legs straight protesting at the beginning of the day is scary when starting to put regular trainings in

[@whatsitwhosit]

Visually speaking, I have to admit having difficulty distinguishing between his examples...For instance, the "too high" setting seemed fine to me since I didn't notice the negative knee flick he spoke of. Enjoyed his explanations though..

[@moshdeenotabot]

The seat too high, you'll see the pedal stroke is more choppy. More stomping, less circular

[@honzabe]

Yep, you and me both. I keep returning to this video and I have watched it like 20x and yet I still cannot see the difference between the correct height and saddle too high. Seem same to me. I wonder if it is related to the fact that I have really bad proprioception.

[@chrisdelaplante5515]

@@honzabe No, it's not your proprioception, it's just that you need to change your glasses.

[@ZackZavage]

I feel so lucky to have stumbled upon this video. Having just started with the sport a couple of weeks ago, this exactly the advice I needed. It made me realize that my saddle was way too high.

[@aashiqkumandan130]

Hi Cam and Neil. Just wanna say thanks again for the great advice. After watching the video I immediately noticed after a ride what Neil was referring to with excessive strain on quads and almost no pain at all elsewhere. Decided to drop my saddle slightly and immediately noticed after this morning’s ride a better spread of strain across the hamstring and calves. Quads are still burning but at least I can notice burning elsewhere as well. Great stuff guys👍🏼

[@seanoneil277]

Neill Stanbury is so well informed on anatomy and exercise physiology. It's amazing how many little insights he has. The part about compensation, starting around 7:00, is brilliant. Thanks very much for this, Cam.

[@frankmaykut7266]

Neill is very knowledgeable and has an incredible ability to communicate information. Great show Cam!

[@solitaryrefinement6787]

This is one of those videos that I wish I could give a ❤ instead of a 👍. Great explanation by Neil that even us lowly layman can understand. I got fit for my first bike at the LBS, but found that as my fitness improved, my saddle height needed adjusting until I'd find a sweet spot. Putting in mega miles and riding with an Allen wrench and noticing how I'd feel every few miles with tweaks up & down really helped me nail down the right position. But as Neil put it, that has to be a ride where one is fully paying attention to what their body is telling them with each adjustment. Thanks for posting Cam. Your channel is undeniably one of the absolute best resources for cyclists.

[@ticklefritz5406]

Love listening to this fella, great information eloquently delivered. Neill is the MVP!

[@hbeevers]

The description of a chopping motion at the bottom of the pedal stroke is spot on!

[@juanbautista5541]

It's just fantastic, I have had an injury for a long time and after a lot of readings and videos (and also physiotherapy), but specially putting attention to my sensations on the bike I started to understand the problem, and this video helps me to clarify all of that amount of information I've been collecting. Thanks a lot, great video, keep going on this way

[@dreyn7780]

Associating with the lower classes. That's what your problem is. I used to associate with riders who couldn't be bothered to put air in the tyres. That was a big mistake.

[@SoilworkZA01]

This is the most important road cycling video on KZbin. Thanks Cam and Neill!

[@ccmp23]

It feels inadequate to just give a single like/thumbs up to Neil videos, should be able to superlike! Great stuff again 👍👍

[@behappychef158]

I’m a Physio and a cyclist as well...absolutely brilliant and helpful. Thanks for sharing!!!

[@gilroy78]

Cheers Cam and Neil! This content has been a game changer for me. To be honest I’ve never had a bike fit and I’ve just relied on calculations to determine my saddle height. Having followed the advice from Neil I’ve ended up lowering my saddle height by a total of 27mm from where I was. I’ve noticed an immediate difference in overall comfort and I feel much better after the couple of rides I’ve done since making the adjustments! I appreciate that there will be other things I’ll have to consider to further refine my riding position but I can’t thank you both enough for the advice!! Cheers!!

[@Seiskid]

Thanks so much guys. This series has been super super helpful. After running through the "drop 15mm go up 3 at a time" my long term seat position is now set 11mm lower and... just like he said I'm putting less weight on the bars.

[@10067498]

Good one Cam. I found I fiddled with my cleat position on the bottom of my shoes just as much as my saddle height. As the man said.....just kept going until everything felt right. Cheers

[@jjgunningjr3574]

+1 ....would really love to see you cover saddle fore/aft in a follow-up video. Thanks for this!

[@strandlie92]

You and Neill provide so much value through these videos! I had a bike fit here in Norway a few weeks ago and we spent half the session experimenting with the saddle. I experienced just what Neill is talking about - loosing control when its too high and feeling fluid when its right.

[@helicart]

This is good stuff. Too many fitters do not understand the importance of hamstring contribution to smooth power transfer from 5 o'clock to 7 o'clock. This is why I start with seat height at 35 degree knee angle when lower limb fully extended. This however is dependent on knee injuries/degeneration and relative strength of hams. Many less experienced riders are not used to using hams significantly for pedalling, and need to adapt to doing so. Finally, higher cadences are critically dependent on knee extension (hams:quad length) and power contribution.....which is why one criteria for determining ideal saddle height is maximal cadence, without bouncing.

[@lukewalker1051]

Brilliant words explaining saddle height. Can't be said better from Neil.

[@michaelc3416]

Old video, new rider... Well, at 60, I'm not exactly "new", but I did just take up riding. I recently purchased a bike at my LBS and was fitted on their trainer. Of course, I knew nothing about bike fitting... The fitter measured some angles with my in different parts of the pedal stroke, used a plumb bob on my knee position, etc., and pronounced it good and I started riding on a local paved bike trail, that for ME has some torturous hills! And I started toiling away, noticing some fitness gains over the next few days of riding, where the hills became a little more manageable, and I began increasing my cadence and doing significantly less "coasting", and more pedaling. Was feeling pretty good about my gains... Then, my left knee began to hurt just a bit at the back. It felt like the hamstring tendon at the outer rear that you can feel with your finders when your knee is bent. I pushed through it thinking, "It's just because I'm new at this...". The next day I rode 30 miles on this same route, which was 10 miles more than I had ever done before. And by the end, the pain was worse. Nothing debilitating, just uncomfortable. But this told me that maybe something wasn't quite right. I started researching the subject and found this video... As I watched, it all began to click... It was my left (nondominant) knee. I had been fitted by angles of my joints. The pain was at the back of the knee which made me suspect that I was over powering and thus overstressing the hamstring. Plus, I think I was trying to advance too fast by increasing quite a bit with each ride. The combination, of those two things, as well as me not being 20, was probably causing tendonitis of the hamstring tendons. And my fatigue was always quad dominant during and after a ride. After watching this video at least half a dozen times or more, it all made too much sense! I used the LeMond method and took measurements. Then I used the "heel on the pedal" method. Both resulted in the original seat position being what it was. So, I lowered it 20mm, took the bike to a nearby school track so I could avoid hills and hopefully be better able to FEEL what my legs were doing. Took a couple of laps to warm up a bit, then raised the seat 3mm. Did a few more laps and raised it another 3mm. Rinse and repeat, raising it another 3mm for a total of 9mm... Did some experimenting with balance and feel reaching to the bars, etc. Then decided to move the seat forward 3-4 mm. And BAM! That combination made me feel lighter on the hands, the seat felt better and I felt like my sit bones wanted to stay where they belonged rather than creeping forward as I rode, and I felt like I was actually pedaling CIRCLES. Then, I raised it another 3mm for a total of 12mm... And now it felt like I was beginning to pedal ellipses rather than circles. I equated that to Neill's term "flicker" as that's sort of what it felt like. I was dumbfounded by how much just a 3mm height difference changed the feel. And this was STILL 8mm lower than the original seat height! Everything just didn't seem quite as natural as it had before that last 3mm had been added. So, I lowered it back to 9mm over the starting point, which was 20mm below the original height after being fitted. I rode several more miles at around 15mph (remember, I'm new!) and it felt better all around! I think this video helped me A LOT more than anything else I've found on the subject. I'm now 11mm lower and 3-4mm farther forward than originally (well, I know that the lower also contributed to the fore aft change, but I didn't take the measurements to account for that difference. And I still may play with the position a bit with more saddle time and experience. But, it's already far better than it was when I left the bike shop.

[@jonpoon3896]

Best tip was to ride at threshold. Everything can seem comfortable when you’re just lightly spinning

[@adamkubiak1933]

Jon Poon from my experience it’s the other way round. When I’m just cruising with my wife, and not generating as much power, my hands and rear end are more likely to get sore. At higher speeds, I’m comfortable with my bike and and able to spend three hours before any symptoms of discomfort. As you generate more powers, you also lift your body a little, decreasing the “weight” that your apply to saddle and bars.

[@chadschoenauer7232]

Both correct in my opinion. Performance vs recreational vs loaded touring riding fits are different! Simulation of various effort levels, and inclines also help to get the issues worked out for each individual. Proof that one dogmatic method only works for certain dogs 🐶

[@rolandoinductivo8013]

this is what I do. I tend to bounce during high efforts and adjust the saddle until it stops.

[@amadlover]

Does tht mean your seat heoght was too low. Speaking from the other replies

[@bigboss-Miami]

Thank you for this video!!! I’m tired of bike fitters saying that the best angles are 25-35!! Definitely going to drop my saddle!!!

[@Riprazor]

This is an amazing video. I thought my saddle was in the correct position, however, I quickly realized it was to high. I lowered it by just 2 mm and rode 60 kilometers. I immediately noticed several things. 1. My left pinky no longer goes numb when I am climbing. 2. I definitely noticed a smoother pedal cadence. 3. My right foot is less likely to pivot "in" when I ride which it has historically done in the previous seat position. I am going to take it down another 1-2 mm and see if my power meter will show a more even pedal stroke since it currently is indicating that I favor my right leg. Thanks for this Cam!

[@Cad1900]

Neil...you are a genius mate!!! Best bike fitting talk I’ve ever heard and this is my 50th year road biking. I’ve been struggling with knee issues and thanks to your information I’ve learned that my bike fit is wrong. I have it close now and looking for more tweaks to get it just right. Helping the knees greatly...Thank you 🙏

[@roadcyclingacademy]

Great to hear mate - happy to help! - Neill

[@danboads6233]

Hay, thanks so much for this video! I'm returning to cycling after a couple of yrs break and this series was by far the clearest in understanding what was happening. I've never felt so fresh, and so comfortable on my bike. You are a wizard.

[@nickpatten5263]

The best and most detailed video on saddle height I have ever seen. Absolutely brilliant. I am now going back to my bike and following the information to make sure I am at the correct height. Thank you.

[@5FWS5]

Just watched this. You sir are a genius! I've been riding a vintage Cannondale Team Comp for YEARS. I was given the bike so it wasnt purchased/sized for me but the giftor is an avid cyclist and helped set it up for me as best we could. It was never perfectly comfortable but thought it was as good as it was going to get. Well after seeing this video and a couple others, I decided to experiment - Seat height, Seat fore or aft adjustment or Bar height? After watching a few of your videos, I tried what seems the most wrong- I lowered the seat about 4-5mm. Wow! I really couldnt believe the difference. My morning ride today I felt I had more power, better power transfer to the pedals and instead of aches and pains at the end , I was tired but no specific pain just as you described. My legs were evenly tired front to back top to bottom - NOT sore. And maybe just the power of suggestion but I felt better after this ride than I have in a long time. I wouldnt believe it if I didnt experience it. Now, I started realizing this well before the end of the ride and so was thinking "what else"? After a few more miles of experimenting I decided that my seat was too far forward so I tried sitting back on it and it felt more "right. When I got home and looked - sure enough the seat is almost all the way forward on the rails. Sunday is my next ride and Ill move the seat back a bit - maybe a cm or 2 and see how that feels. Thank you for making me re-evaluate this! This was a true revelation for me - Thank you!

[@chadschoenauer7232]

Greetings from AVL, NC, USA! As a fitter who threw out the calculator and plumb-bob long ago, this is spot on! Thank you, Cam, Neil, (and Hogg) for getting this out with a proper explanation! Something I will share with plenty of folks! KEEP IT GOING!

[@edhendrix7327]

I love the Avl and Black Mountain area cheers from SC.

[@davidhopp]

Your videos towards bikefitting helped a lot in adjusting my bike! Turned out I was way to high with my saddle and had a lot of the symptoms Neill mentiones in some of the videos. Thank you for sharing these insights and all the best from the Black Forest in southern Germany!

[@matthewtomaszewski3269]

I’m a physical therapist who cycles and this is the best info I’ve ever seen on seat height.

[@paulturner7137]

Neill is a master at explaining technical information that is so easy to grasp.

[@mark-1234]

Yup, wish this guy was in my neighborhood. Most comprehensive explanations I've ever heard.

[@alexsandberg7854]

Could you do a simple video like this about seat fore and aft position?! That would be very helpful! Ps love your content. Thank you!

[@CamNicholls]

I’ll hit Neill up.

[@deanos1993]

Second this!

[@rkwjunior2298]

Definitely

[@bertholtappels1081]

Absolutely hoping for this, too.

[@helmsandrose5372]

@alexsandberg & @deanos1993 & @BertHoltappels here you are: kzbin.info/www/bejne/kImWl36loa5la7M

[@mannysamaniego702]

Having spent thousands of dollars on bike fitting and not getting much as far as positive results, your series with Neill’s have done wonders on my fit in a matter of weeks. And now I’m considering the shorter cranks!!! Thanks to you and Neill for sharing all the advise. Keep it coming!!

[@CamNicholls]

Good stuff Manny, thanks for sharing. Cam

[@binitbob]

Another brammer of a video Cam thank you. Thanks to you and Neil I fell more comfortable on my bike (even after having professional bike fitting), cadence is up, speeds are up. I am starting to enjoy my cycling again after feeling like my performance had stagnated. So a huge thanks from this 50 year old pom.👍😉

[@CamNicholls]

Cheers mate and thanks for the support 👍

[@phoenity1]

This is the same as Steve Hogg's explanation of saddle height watching for the acceleration of knee extension at bottom of pedal stroke. But this guy explains it so much clearer by detailing the mechanics of how saddle height and pedal stroke is affected by the quads and hamstrings, and lists symptoms of being too high which finally makes sense.

[@CamNicholls]

He’s done Steve’s training.

[@cpk313]

I have struggled with bike position for the last few years after a surgery. Prior to it, I was a little too high but could get away with it, after I couldn't. Your description helped a lot in what to focus on and the point between too high and not was more apperiente. For me it was being able to put power down evenly throughout the majority of the stroke and something that has not been touched on is my balance on the bike was improved. Riding hands off required little effort/concentration at all. Too high and that oneness with the bike starts to go away. Thanks Neil and Cam!!

[@jamessingleton4856]

Simply the best video on the topic out there! This guy is a genius.

[@peteranderson6935]

I love this stuff, really explaining the fundamentals of the processes and mechanisms, no magic formulae.

[@MrYetibaby]

Dropped the seat 2 mill , with 165 mill cranks. Boom problem solved everything from saddle sores and left knee pain . You two are so brilliant . I love the channel 🤘🏼

[@stevestewart-sturges2159]

All of these videos Neil is so generous to share are pure gold... I tuned up my saddle height with this video back in August and the results have been remarkable, and yes, I dropped my saddle... so subtle but truly proved to be very effective over the past couple of months.. Thank you guys!

[@CamNicholls]

Awesome Steve, thanks for sharing mate

[@ssbagley]

Arrrrgh!! Just when I thought I'd nailed my saddle height, I see this and start asking myself questions!!! Damn you!

[@danrol354]

Wow! After a few years of riding at the set height, I just lowered it 2-3 mm mid-ride yesterday and definitely noticed a difference. Incredible!! Thanks!!

[@evangatehouse5650]

Thank you, thank you, thank you! Sore quads every day after short rides. Adjusted as per your advice and wow - my hamstrings are working too and my quads are not sore tonight.

[@hedleykerr3564]

One of the very best bike fitting podcast out there! I was really impressed with all the video's in bike fitting. Especially when they talked about the majority of people have one leg longer than the other and different cranks lengths very impressive!

[@johnunruh1086]

Excellent series. I finally have no pain from my saddle! Paid $350 for a bike fit, and still had pain in my as@$. Come to find out my saddle was to high and back. After watching your video I kept asking myself when I ride what I needed to feel better. When I hit a bump and came back down I had to push myself back. So I moved seat ahead 3mm. Was better but still had pain issues. So I lowered seat a little. Not really any difference. Lowered it little more, and wow, everything is perfect! Ended up about 5mm. Can't believe what a difference having everything correctly positioned! And I've been riding bikes since 1998, and had pain. I bet I tried 10 different saddles. Thank you for giving me the info I needed to fix it myself!!

[@jasonsolomon7122]

Omg - I had exactly this issue - the clipping and just couldn’t figure the right seat height- and same issue - I really couldn’t tell. This video explained all the issues I was having and why. Superb.

[@glene77is]

... Excellent ! Over Extension also leads to stress on ACL connection. Easy to follow this video !

[@achakhakan4189]

Good discussion, well worth the time to watch the entire video. Most riders and bike fitters seem to think that only a slight bend in the knee is all that is needed at the bottom of the stroke; very wrong.

[@r0mpastompa]

By far the very best and most useful video i have ever seen about Saddle height! Thank you so much!

[@mareklesniak8768]

Great advices there. My own experience is, for me there's a window of about 30-35mm of saddle height where I can easily notice very distinct opposites - one where I feel too cramped with my legs and on the other extreme, where I'm lacking that fluid/smooth rotation and start rocking sideways too much. Another indication is how smoothly I can run at a higher cadence - 100rpm up to about 130-135rpm. On both ends of that range I can only barely cross 100rpm feeling like I have to put way too much effort into it. Around my optimum seat height, I can quite easily go up to about 110 and I can still go higher, up to about 130-135rpm with more effort required, but that still feels somewhat smooth (just spinning much faster).

[@TheHerrMan]

these are the best tips, I used the quad burn/hammy burn feedback to adjust my height. Now my whole leg feels it and not just a small part. thx!

[@tefltoulouse]

What he says from about 7 minutes in is exactly what I have been suffering from for years, mainly due to endless bike fits putting me too high. "80 or 90% of us will drop our right hip......." Bravo! My only problem is that if I ride with a nice low saddle, I actually get terrible quad and back pain for days afterwards, it is as if my whole pelvis area sort of seizes up. Maybe it is all just contracting after too high saddle for so long...? Certainly the outside of my left knee and saddle sore pains go though.

[@jnj3254]

The best cycling channel

[@jasonmcgrody9472]

This is hands down the best explanation of WHY I want a proper seat height I've ever seen.

[@fonsedyr]

omg finally an explanation that makes sense. can't wait to try this!

[@steveindorset]

What a great vid cam. According to what I’m hearing on this video my seat height is just right. I must have “good body awareness” as I instinctively know when the seat is too high/low. All three muscle groups are equally tired after a ride. Very encouraging! 👍👍👍

[@steveindorset]

@Craig Herriot Nirvana were a 90’s grunge band. Check out their “Never mind” album it’s their best by far. 😁😉👍

[@KevinStorr]

Steve of Staffordshire agreed Never Mind is fantastic

[@richardmiddleton7770]

Remember to push your saddle back when lowering your saddle. It's around 3:1 ratio so for every 3mm dropped you want 1mm more setback.

[@Clashing0N]

In one of the ‘Bikefit Tuesday’ videos by Francis Cade it is mentioned the other way around. For every 1mm of height change 3mm fore/aft change.

[@davidhopp]

What a great advice towards seat hight without all the theoretical calculations that never would fit for me!

[@warcraftmafia]

Man good info, im just now getting serious about biking but for awhile i had terrible knee pain always due to seat to low. I made it what i know now is too high. It fixed my knee pain but i find myself burning out faster. Now i shall i think lower it little by little

[@perrymcguire3806]

Great video and advice from Neil. I can usually tell if my seatpost has been moved 1 or 2mm - which sounds crazy. How can anyone feel that amount of difference... and yes, definitely better to have your saddle lower than higher. I remember having an issue with my seatpost meaning it was slipping. I could feel that the saddle height was not right but was able to finish the final few miles of the ride without having to stop. When I got back, the seatpost had slipped almost 20mm but I could still ride the bike. Had the seatpost been raised by 20mm, I'd have had to stop and make the adjustments there and then.

[@thierryniaison8711]

Great tips with very practical/applicable key takeaways, thanks for this content!

[@blinzi69]

the way i do it is a "single leg test" - i jump on the trainer switching to a pretty easy gear and clip in only 1 leg, i try to maintain like 100 watts with a comfortable cadence between 80 and 90. i do this for around 1 to 2 minutes. if i can pedal without getting the "clunk" sound making my stroke uneven i know my seat is too high. if im not getting that soudn it might still be too low so im going higher until the point when i get that clunk sound. from tehre i go 1-2mm down and this is the best position most of the time for me. funny thing is - most of the time, the heel measure method is pretty spot on already. cheers

[@CamNicholls]

Thanks for sharing on the thread

[@charlespackwood9219]

After watching these videos Over and over again to try and figure out what was wrong with me. I finally figured it Out. My left leg is 1cm shorter then my right. I need spacers. Thanks for these bike fit videos.

[@jotapi4010]

What an excellent video on this topic!

[@MikeKoPhotography]

Been Checking out your channel for a while and like the content but this is the video that made me click to "subscribe" button.

[@markjthomson]

Really good info. I recently set my saddle on my touring bike as recommended... all sweetness and light. I changed the saddle and checked the measurement, was pretty close. Dong a long ride (200km) last week, by 140km my left leg was developing "niggles", discomfort in muscles that weren't normal and of the "do something about this" nature. I figured I would try dropping the seat, as that was the only real change. Took it down maybe 3 to 5mm, all sorted. Finished the ride then did a century back with no issues. Very happy with that! Thanks for the good info.

[@emineaygun561]

Thankyou so much for the tips. I am going to set my saddle again. Hopefully I won't get sore legs anymore after every 20 km ride.

[@klifton]

This is one of the most important videos I’ve watched on KZbin and the best explanation of this I’ve ever heard. Thanks!

[@CamNicholls]

👍

[@marekjustus]

I love learning stuff when the topic is fully explained with examples and common sense... thank you!! 🙃

[@danielrantitsch]

I wish I had a bikefitter like this in Austria!

[@dakalla]

please post here, if you find one! But i feel that in bike shops and fitters here in Austria there are not a lot of people to trust. :(

[@whittyp1827]

I’m so glad I saw this. A couple of months ago I was working with knee angles for correct saddle height and within the recommended range, it felt too high so this has just been verified. I did lower my saddle beforehand anyhow but was good to have this confirmed.

[@frankphoto2]

i want an appointment ! Fascinating - i will be riding with a whole new awareness and understanding.

[@Erik-rc7iy]

That bike fitter is awesome! Could you bring him over to Texas Cam?!?

[@ΛάζαροςΠολυμενάκος]

Many many thanks for this vid, guys! Excellent, intuitive discussion of the topic. Love your work!

[@kylehudgins5255]

Unbelievably helpful video. Thanks for putting this out there.

[@robertm1552]

More art, than science. I like it. Good job one again.

[@CamNicholls]

Cheers Robert, and agreed!

[@joeswright86]

What a video. The first half describes years of my riding exactly. Been through bike fits as well.

[@ozzz3365]

The temptation to take the saddle up too high is so strong in our mind, that seems most of us are doing it without even knowing that we riding too high. Once you lower a bit the saddle (5-10 mm), you suddenly feel so good! No more of that uneasy feeling of ballet dancer, pedaling on your tow. No more sacrificing the control on the bike. Less back pains, less neck pains and even less hands/wrists pain. The power from your legs seems more balanced, because the pedaling cycle becomes rounder and not 'up and down' hammering. Well, i have to tell you the feeling is amazing and it makes you feel good on your bike again, just the way it was when you were a kid riding on you BMX to the sea (without garmin yeh yeh..). Thanks

[@sonderfall1979]

Very good video once again!!! I had a bike fit in Switzerland from a very experienced fitter (he fits ultra endurance and TdF riders) and he also pointed out similar things. In my view it is A LOT about EXPERIENCE because as a normal person you don’t see those things. Mathematical models can’t see the person which is very important. They might help but the experience of the person behind is much more important!

[@Zurich80001]

Can you share the name of the Swiss bike fitter? I'm also living in Switzerland and searching for one...

[@sonderfall1979]

Monster Man Er heißt Harald Beck (Harry) von Orthoplus in Zürich. Er geht sehr gut auf das Individuum ein (Flexibilität, Schmerzen) und macht nicht einfach einen Standard-Fit.

[@thepepperboi]

Super helpful video. Been doing it all wrong for years 😂. My seat height being slightly too high explains my lower back pain on one side. Over compensating. Thanks guys!

[@garytilley3217]

Very informative. Thanks Cam & Neill

[@cmdllb]

I adjusted my seat post about 3/4mm thinking it was too low. Within 24 hours I could feel it in my right (dominant) knee. Now I know why! Dropped it back down and hoping it will correct that. Thanks very much for this (whether it works or not, very interesting vid) 👍🏻

[@750vfrman]

So that is why i feel, especially on the left stroke that I have a square wheel. I have been puzzling why I keep feeling this strange bump on every rotation. Off to lower my saddle just 3mm. Ride with friends tomorrow. Will report back.

[@peted9296]

wow. by far the best discussion on this topic i’ve seen. thank you!

[@Rawsan]

This is what I have been waiting for. Cam, you are the man. Thanks, mate.

[@fhowland]

Best saddle height video on KZbin

[@manoelcarlosmartinsesilva2875]

Your videos and explanations are amazing. Thanks for doing it só greatfully

[@forestboy52]

I have always assumed that road bikes were just uncomfortable. I have paid for bike fits before but watching your videos I have gone from a position of discomfort and weakness to a position of comfort and strength. I am still a weak rider but I feel that my gains will be in strength rather than gains in tolerating discomfort. Also I have gone from constantly shuffling about on my saddle to being completely locked in and stable. I can’t thank you enough and would recommend these videos to anyone.

[@CamNicholls]

Thanks for sharing mate