Is Free College As Good As It Sounds?

College costs are insane these days. It’s getting to the point where unless your last name is Bezos or Zuckerberg, a college education kinda feels like a pipe dream. One answer is FREE COLLEGE paid for by the government, which many liberals and even some conservatives are getting behind. But, “free” college really isn’t free. That money has to come from somewhere. Is free college really as good as it sounds?
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Compared to just 30 years ago, students are now paying 129% more at private colleges and 213% more at public colleges. And the cost increase isn’t stopping anytime soon, due to increased demand, more available financial aid, and a lack of state funding. To pay for it all, most students have to take out loans. It’s become the largest form of personal debt in the country-larger than credit card debt and car loans! States like California, Oregon, and Tennessee are all beginning to experiment with some version of a free college program.
Supporters say that this kind of access to higher education helps the economy, strengthens our democracy and is critical to the health and success of future generations. But opponents of free college worry it will be too expensive to maintain, will increase taxes, and might persuade students who aren’t college ready to enroll but who then don’t make it all the way through to graduation, which would increase the already high college dropout rates.
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How much more expensive is college now compared to 30 years ago?
The average cost of tuition and fees for the 2017-2018 school year was about $10,000 at public colleges and $35,000 at private colleges. That’s just ONE year of college! It wasn’t always like that. In 1987, in today’s dollars, a year at a public college cost around $3,200. At a private college, it was around $15,000. That means today, only 30 years later, students are paying 129 percent MORE at private colleges and 213 percent more at public colleges.
How much debt do students end up graduation with, on average?
Students who borrow end up graduating with an average of $34,000 in student loans. That's up from $20,000 just 10 years ago. Graduating with all that debt means you’re less likely to buy a house or a car and you’re more likely to live at home with your parents.
SOURCES:
College Tuition Rates Over Time
studentloanhero.com/featured/...
The State of American Wages
www.epi.org/files/pdf/122078.pdf
The Case Against Free College
www.forbes.com/sites/richardv...
A New Look At The Lasting Consequences Of Student Debt
www.npr.org/sections/ed/2017/...
Household Borrowing, Student Debt Trends and Homeownership
www.newyorkfed.org/press/pres...
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[@AboveTheNoise]

What do you think: is the cost of free college worth it? Watch the video to understand why that's not an oxymoron.

[@gokublack879]

Above The Noise Nothing’s free

[@logixindie]

If that means people who don't get benefit from colleges have to pay tax for it then this is madness. Primary education is important, but college is an investment that an individual should be responsible for, not everyone else.

[@MichiganUSASingaporeSEAsia]

Above The Noise kzbin.info/www/bejne/m3KrnmSLibFkj5o free

[@reagancapwell685]

Have you heard of Berea College?

[@reagancapwell685]

I think offering work+study programs could make it more affordable. For everyone really. And having it free for those with disabilities is a start. Don't know if it's actually free for them.

[@declup]

Go to "college", people say. Shouldn't they mean, "strive to educate yourself"? When did the word 'learning' become nothing more than a synonym for 'college'? And why aren't there societally accepted alternatives to universities? Internships, apprenticeships, vocational programs, tutoring, library outings, events with public speakers, book clubs, recreational math competitions -- these are all ways people organize to impart knowledge to others. People are creative and practical; just because the university system is the one that's in place doesn't mean we can't come up with other educational programs that can be valuable too.

[@jamesticknor1134]

Well, he kind of answered your question by detailing typical employer requirements for a degree in entry level positions.

[@galek75]

College isn't just education. Its teaching and research, which is dependent on institutions to make intellectual collaboration possible.

[@peterhuehn6137]

To all the people saying "no one is forcing you to go to college" you obviously don't know the tremendous pressure a lot of kids are put under by parents, teachers, and guidance counselors to get a 4 year degree.

[@chinookh4713]

Not to mention required for many jobs

[@TrekkieBrie]

I'll be honest, I stopped buying textbooks a few semesters ago. I either share one or don't buy one. I gave up after for 3 different classes, I bought a book and it wasn't used once. If a textbook is required I go to the campus library to rent it for a few min, take pictures of the pages I need and boom, save a few grand.

[@AboveTheNoise]

Yeah, there are many creative ways of making textbooks open source content. The textbook publishing industry is sweating! lol www.insidehighered.com/news/2017/01/31/textbook-publishers-contemplate-inclusive-access-business-model-future

[@rayxr]

Cough cough libgen

[@michaelregis1015]

Honestly, the library has been my haven for this reason. I know it's kinda obvious saying this, but you really can find all that you need there.

[@jrodd05]

I think we need to talk about why tuition is so expensive and the quality of education is mediocre

[@mrmanguylol9330]

Blame the government

[@apersononlineyes6554]

@@mrmanguylol9330 Based market socialist?

[@mrmanguylol9330]

@@apersononlineyes6554yes I am a Illyrian Market Socialist so yes

[@tylerharris4392]

Exactly, education should be this expensive

[@BlackHatTy]

Pipe dream? No. Go to your local state college, live at home for a few more years and work a part-time job. I paid off all my student loans and went back for my masters. You need to know where to go and how to do it.

[@AGuitarFreekOfficial]

Ok but doesn't most of the insanely high tuition comes after community college? CCs are already the "cheaper option" for the first 2 years. 1 quarter at my university costed more than all my tuition from community college combined

[@AboveTheNoise]

AGuitarFreekOfficial community college is definitely less expensive than most 4 year colleges - which is why there is a movement to make it even more affordable to try to help more people have that opportunity to save on tuition for 2 years and eventually transfer - or at minimum earn an associates degree.

[@jordanwartell-composer]

Fantastically unbiased video!!!

[@AboveTheNoise]

Wow, thanks! We are trying.

[@Arthurian-s9e]

@@AboveTheNoise You're not trying, you're really unbiased

[@daralic2255]

One of sources listed is an article is a ‘Case against free college tuition’

[@MegaEricPham]

Listening to this video, I never realized many of these things and now I actually went into a mutual debate with some friends and I am doing research on why it is a bad thing (even though I am on the "free" side) this and some other videos have been a very refreshing perspective.

[@nathanielbarnes5047]

Rich kids going to free public college is a BS talking point. No rich parents are going to send their kids to any community college or community universities.

[@swamee9966]

College needs to be cheaper but if you think it is logical for it to be free, you need to do more research and deeper thinking

[@9299paulo]

quality over quantity

[@lavenderdeng6364]

Why should students be paying for general education when k-12 education is already lacking greatly?

[@Diabolical05]

Stop giving so much money to students and you will see how quick colleges becomes cheaper once everyone cannot afford it. Colleges are taking huge advantage over the fact that these students are able to get an insane amount of money relatively easy to go to college. You see these colleges build massive football stadiums, gymnasium and other entertainment facilities to get students to come, but the actual education is declining.

[@Brain_Damage101]

Why should I pay for Sammy's gender studies degree at a 4 year college when she'll be washing dishes at Starbucks aftwr graduation anyway?

[@thetecno5800]

Congrats you paid 5 cents for her while you could have the same opportunity by taking a engineering degree for free.

[@FunnieApple]

Because you also paid for Alex's 8 year degree in heart surgery who eventually saved the life of your mother. Alex who would not have been able to pay for that degree if school had not been free. You have to think about this from multiple angles man, and I think paying for the Sammy's is worth paying for the Alex's. And I don't know how anyone could disagree with that.

[@oceanman6327]

@@FunnieApple Alex would have taken on some debt as a student, but because he is a _fucking heart surgeon_ and would have payed the debt off.

[@benpetrocci3883]

@@oceanman6327 Wow its like you think you immediately become a heart surgeon after school. Still a lot more work and it takes a doctor about 20 years to pay off their debt, which adds stress to them. Nice job trying to point out that a good paying job should be able to pay off their debt without acknowledging that they have much more debt to pay off.

[@uh-huh]

Why should I pay for a voucher for little Billy to have a religious education where they will teach him some of his fellow humans are beneath him cause Sky Daddy says so?

[@SplitSniper7]

HALF?? What kind of monster has their textbooks cost that much?! That's disgusting!

[@centauria9122]

I get used books, reduced the cost to 1/3rd of what how much the "new" textbooks are. I could tell you right now, my College Math textbook was crazy expensive like $250 since none were used books and about $130 just to get an online code to ConnectMath just for the professor to slam us 175 so math questions for a time limit of 2 weeks...

[@glitch2615]

That's probably paper books, e-text books don't cost nearly that much.

[@glitch2615]

Use Library Genesis and you can find just about any book you want for free or at least at a deeply discounted price.

[@1polonium210]

I have taught geology (undergraduate and graduate) as an adjunct faculty member at two universities. I stopped requiring students who scheduled my course in physical geology to buy the approved textbook because I refused to have my undergrads fork out $100 to $150 dollars for glossy texts that most were going to discard or sell to used bookstores at the end of the semester. I knew what I wanted them to learn, so I used handouts, Powerpoint presentations, youtube videos, and required readings from internet sources.

[@EuropeanQoheleth]

@@centauria9122 There is such a thing as new.

[@1Fruitninja1]

Where I live free college is completely normal and I think this debate is completely ridiculous lmao

[@tschichpich]

Why is it ridiculous? What do you mean with "where you are from"? your family, your area, your city, your state or your country? You know that it's meant so that people in poor families can go to college as well and not only the ones that have the money (not necessary rich). Also because education is a great way to combat poverty edit: i'm for free college just read it wrong

[@1Fruitninja1]

@@tschichpich I completely agree with you and I don't see any reason against free colleges. That should be applied right away, I think it's ridiculous that there seems to be a debate necessary to convince people that paying for college isn't an acceptable thing.

[@tschichpich]

@@1Fruitninja1 haha, sorry mate. I miss read your statement and thought you were against it

[@AboveTheNoise]

The problem in this country is that there is a very lucrative industry built around college tuition (let’s not even get started with the government interest earned from federal financial aid!) and a very small appetite for taxation - not a good combo for free public services

[@eminemlandsteiner168]

Donot forget that these tuition fees fund many researches and that's why the US has over 340 nobel prizes in sciences

[@PnoyBoi4Ever]

I love that he covers both sides of the issue. Very educational to people who rely on Facebook and social media to judge who they vote for.

[@michaelrivera6989]

In terms of return on investment, educating its populace is one of the best things a government can do. How to pay for it? Take it out of the DOD budget.

[@0z372]

Michael Rivera If you hurt the DOD this country will become weak and be taken advantage of this country needs to be strong to keep our enemies of freedom at bay.

[@tschichpich]

sounds like a better return of investment than tax cuts

[@michaelrivera6989]

@@0z372 I'v worked for DOD contractors for 35 years. The waste is enormous.

[@CalBruin]

To speak on that point of investment, N.B. why public schools exist and is free to attend. Free K-12 has not improved society as promised.

[@michaelrivera6989]

@@CalBruin No, just the entire industrial revolution and onward.

[@lordbender2540]

Loved the video, worth mentioning that college tuition rises in large part due to administrative salary’s rising yearly

[@itonner231]

Why should people who cannot get in to college or have no desire to go to college pay for someone else’s tuition? Let’s look at market based solutions, such as income share agreements or stronger underwriting for student loans. The easy access to credit is funneling young, naive kids into poor performing schools and worthless degrees.

[@secretaltruism4174]

Or you could just do what we Australians do and a have an economically sustainable system, where anyone can afford to go to university (well, almost everyone) and we don't have to raise taxes.

[@majesticface3631]

Elaborate please? What system does it run on?

[@ryukobestwaifu3319]

0:15 yet college grads have all that debt and most likely dont even get the job they wanted

[@krishantaneja8316]

Ryukobestwaifu not if you get a 100%scholarship

[@mikeycost6917]

I know I’m really late in seeing this but I would like to say can we get a shout out to this channel!? I see you trying to respond to comments and answering questions and providing information. Bravo to you sir!

[@AboveTheNoise]

Mikey Cost aww- thanks for watching and noticing!

[@oceanman6327]

Was the chart for prices rising inflation adjusteD? Also if comparing changes do left--> right.

[@rd6203]

I've seen two different variations of the "free college" idea; in one instance, tuition was free but nothing else, and there were only so many universities in the country, so they still mostly excluded poorer students who didn't live in or have family in the cities and also they had to take entrance exams which only the top scoring students were even accepted. However, you could try again an unlimited amount of times The other one, the government paid for your college (no idea about the books, etc) if you opted to study for a career that they suggested to you based on your high school scores. Most of the people I knew supported this system, whether or not they were steered toward a subject matter that they loved, because it enabled them to have a career that they were likely to succeed at while pursuing their dreams. Admittedly, there are flaws with it, but it seemed like a much better system than not having enough schools to educate your future or sending an entire generation so far into debt that some Depression Era songs start to seem poignant again...

[@dublbude]

I'm 35 and conservative on a federal level, i lean farther left as government shrinks....or in other words, hard right federally (no negotiating here for me, Feds are Military, Interstate roads, and meeting of State Governors should play a bigger role, vs the US Congreess), bipartisan conservative on a State level (willing to negotiate starts here), and City Level ( where I'd be more than happy to vote for tax increases on good ideas, still should be a vote though). Friends and Family (ill pick up the tab as much as i can afford). I had to begin by putting that into perspective, so you understand where I come from politically. I also had to stay tap, because I think sometimes conservatives get blamed as if they do not care about children or education, or at least the person they are debating accuses them of that even if they know that is not the case. As far as the federal government collecting taxes from the entire country and then redistributing, the money for kids over the country, nope, bad bad bad, and you ain't getting my money for that. ,That's great that a couple states offer free colleges, and I feel that is their right, I live in Minnesota, and I do not have children. If Minnesota wanted to create some legislation For some sort of payment help for college students, I would consider that for sure, I would have to hear the plan of course too Vote yes or no. On a City Level, I'd be more willing yet to here out a proposal, for more kids to go to college, FROM MY COMMUNITY, with some funding from me. I hope the younger generation can start to see the importance of State governments, taking back control of this nation. PLEASE YOUNG PEOPLE, I BEG OF YOU, stop crying for the federal government to make more and more and more programs. The federal government is highly inefficient at anything and everything it does.....many of us middle aged and folks don't disagree with some of your vision, we disagree with where to go for the help to get it. We have a.m.the federal government make many more mistakes than you have. Trust us, i beg you. Want to make a impact, star Geelong take back STATES RIGHTS. Basically, if you live in Florida, your next door neighbor most likely has similar concerns to you, at least more similar than somebody lives in Minnesota or California or New York city or Chicago or Wyoming, their concerns are similar to yours, that's why government works on smaller levels, but trying to create programs that effect over 300,000,000 people at the same time, don't always work because those peoples needs are so different by region of the country they live in.

[@mrsammyg3125]

So free colleges should be funded by state governments?

[@dublbude]

@@mrsammyg3125 would UP TO the states to fund it. Some states would probably choose to fund it, some would choose not to. An old thing called STATES RIGHTS!

[@cazonmalena9528]

In my country we have free college and believe me, it worth.

[@9299paulo]

I bet there is an over saturation of college grads in your country. Moreover, I bet there are members in your country's work force over qualified for their current positions since the market does not have enough positions for every college grad. It is the same in my country, trust me, it is not good for the economy. It devalues a degree.

[@cazonmalena9528]

@@9299paulo so... Only rich people should study and poor people should work attending rich people needs

[@cazonmalena9528]

@@9299paulo sorry, I rather having a lot of doctors than a lot of waiters

[@cazonmalena9528]

@Rich 91 I searched on Google and there says an average doctor earn 299/329K a year, not 600k. (Some doctors can earn 600k, I'm not saying ur lying, but thats not the average) By the way, don't think doctors earn that much their first year out of college. I Google it and the first salary is usually 87k and then goes up. But here's the thing: Medicine is 59k every year in college. Thats almost 700k when ur done, and if you want to use those chinesse and Indian immigrants as example, all of them must have an student loan (like %80 of medicine students have loans) Wich is usually gone only 13 years later, so the salary is not really 299/329k. Sooo if ur poor and u can't pay college u start studying at 18/19. You end medical school at 30. And you finish to pay the loan at 40/45. So... What's the point? Enjoy life when ur 50? I'm not saying doctors have a bad life, they have great salaries, but that big amount of money it's not really thaaaat big. And see all the stress they have to go through until they can chill. And I'm not including the fact that an average people in US spends like $11k in health insurance per person. And an average family of four spends 28k. Why I'm saying this fact? I want to compare the amount of money we spent in our universal health care system. $348 dollar per person every year in taxes. Here in Argentina a doctor earns like 12K. That looks like nothing in your country. But here is a good amount of money and the fact that we pay almost nothing for college is important I think. We have no loan, we have no debt. Those 12k are all for the doctors. I don't even know how much cost is studying medicine here but I want you to have an idea: I'm in the first year of vet school and I paid less than $5 dollars the whole year. (of course transport, food and textbooks doesn't count) so out of that u can imagine how much a med student spend. And idk how much we spent in the Free college system in taxes, but if we can pay doctor's/nurse's/other's salaries, medicine, vaccines, treatments and a lot more with only $348 per person every year, I think it would the some similar amount of money to pay college teachers and all that. And last but not least, I personally think that doctors can earn that big amount of money, but I believe that's meaningless when a big part of USA population can't afford one🤷

[@cazonmalena9528]

@Rich 91 The years that will take u to repay the debt depends on your life style. And remember this is about medicine, one of the most expensive career. If you live frugaly you might pay the debt in 5 years yeah, but aren't the average. (And in MY opinion, colleges like more to say "you can pay the loan in 4/5 years, instead of saying "Most of our students repay the debt before 10 years". That's not a fact, just my opinion) But what is a fact is that before 5 or more years of studying, when peoole have more than 25 years and they can call themselves a doctor, now they want a house, a car or even some of them alreadyhave kids, they are tired of living like poor students counting pennys so instead of pay the loan in those "incredible 4 years" they decide to keep it so can start enjoying life. Basically repay it will take them Like 10 years. And I searched on Google "How long does it take to repay the loan from medical school" and the first things that appears is a comment from a lady who say that is possible to pay it in 5 years, yeah. But usually takes 10 and she knows people who even had the Deb from 15 to 20 years. (search it yourself if u want) of course that a rare case, but is not an impossible fact. Is something real that can happen

[@vanthachhim]

I like that you provided the other argument to free tuition

[@davidmizak4642]

The remarkable information you provide to your viewers needs to be applauded. I sincerely appreciate your effort to expand your viewers knowledge. A sincere thank you!

[@AboveTheNoise]

Thanks so much for watching and sharing this feedback! We appreciate it.

[@GameTesterBootCamp]

"But, rich students won't have to pay?! NO FAIR!" is a flawed argument. It should be free, for EVERYONE. Regardless of if they are rich or poor. The "NO FAIR!" argument is the same as people fighting against Student Loan Forgiveness. "I paid for my loans, they should have to as well!"

[@dejaharris5037]

As a college student, I agree with this video because it shows us how the price of college as changed over years. In an article stated Abigail Hess, an career reporter with the CNBC, "70 percent of college students graduate with a significant amount of loans." Like quoted inn the video college has never been really free, it is something that people pay through taxes. Hess also also mentions that "Over 44 million Americans collectively hold nearly $1.5 trillion in student debt. That means that roughly one in four American adults are paying off student loans"(CNBC). This tells us that college overtime will be an issue until more states find ways to make it affordable. This video does a great job at giving viewers a grasp of what the it is like on the student side of things and on the government side as well.

[@drunclecookie216]

my niece came from a very low income family and she applied for a bunch of grants and financial aid. she got tuition covered for all 4 years, room and board covered all 4 years, and on top of that she's clearing $5,000 a semester. she's basically getting free college and an extra $40,000 over 4 years to boot.

[@NorthernRiderOffroad]

I got on as a part time fireman and they had a tuition reimbursement program. The department paid for my associates. There are ways to get college reimbursement. I believe the military will do the same if you serve. Like others said as well community college is a much cheaper option to start.

[@MrDarudin]

I don't get the price tag on most degrees in the U.S anyway. I get it, Uni staff and facilities need to be paid for by someone. However, 10 grant for something like 8 hours of contact time?

[@Gjm1822]

What people are saying in the conversation in the comments is I think there should not be free college. Some people are making a good points when talking about community colleges. They think community colleges should pay for the education. They also talking about the people that who are in college debt and can’t pay the founds and that they can help by not paying the debt. Other people think that colleges shouldn’t be free because they want to earn it. They want to say getting into the college you want to go there was worth it because you have to earn it and pay it. The other argument people try to say is people need to pay for other stuff that you need like plates and couches and beds so why not college. Toni Parker, I feel like you know a lot on what you are talking about when it comes to college loans. I could only imagine paying off your own loans and paying off your kids tuition. I think that alone is a great reason why college should be free when talking about tuition. It’s not fair for you expully if you worked really hard for your degree. I have to say, I personally think that college education should be free. I think if you don’t have the money for the college tuition and you have the grades and GPA coming out of your high school you should get in because you never know what a college degree would do to someone’s family in a positive way. It’s not like that you get a college degree when you go straight to college. You have to earn that degree. You need to put in the time to earn that degree. The last thing is more students will go to the college which is good for the college because they will have the opportunity to teach more students and watch them grow in the classroom. College should be free in America because it is good for America’s economy and gives everyone an equal chance to get ahead and succeed, as referenced in this article. edsource.org/2020/tuition-free-college-is-critical-to-our-economy/641232 College tuition should be free because many people don’t have the ability to pay for it. This means a lot of people who have potential don’t go to college. www.demos.org/blog/five-reasons-why-debt-free-college-helps-more-just-upper-middle-class ,In a commit section a committer gives an example why college should be free. He says someone who 34 thousand dollars is going to struggle to pay back 34 thousand student loans. That being said, I understand why people think college should not be free, It will increase taxes, it will not solve the job shortage problem, and it will not help solve current student loan debt. Ether way both sides have good evidence to support them and we don’t know what will happen in the furture.

[@jeffreydamonte67]

Florida already has the Bright Futures Program where you get to go to college for free if you did well in high school. It also has very affordable community colleges that offer a surprisingly high level of education and guaranteed admission to a 4 year state college if you graduate. These community colleges also offer scholarships and accept anyone who applies. Most top private universities have generous scholarship programs and grant programs if you got the skills. There are some people who would benefit but you would also be raising taxes thereby taking money away from the people who earned it. Free college is too simplistic to be an optimal solution and it is far from the panacea these political extremists claim.

[@tiago_mota]

Other people commented the same thing, but it's worth noting: nothing is free. Free tuition - or free healthcare, for that matter - is always paid for by people's taxes. When Sanders say it's a basic human right, he's simply saying "let's share the expenses of public education amongst all population". So, in a sense, yes, wealthier people pay more than mid-class and poor people, because they pay more taxes - or should, anyway. If you look at places where there's free tuition at public universities, you are bound to see high taxes. I don't mind paying high taxes for services that improve the lives of everyone.

[@thefreshprincessofeverywai4302]

Based on my experience, college should be free too. Like it says in 3:34 y is k-12 free n not college??? What is the difference??? I love learning n I don't ever regret going to college and getting my associates degree even though I work in the non-professions n make such little 💰. I just regret going through the process of paying for it. (I despise fasfa/Pell til this day) N Cuba has verrryyyy smart ppl I don't know y and no one pays for school but they have problems. N I wish they could make a video about student loan forgiveness. Is tht even in effect right now? I don't get into politics so I don't know. I just talk about my experiences that's all. I'm not voting f politics.

[@drunclecookie216]

the problem isn't just the cost of college here, the problem is everyone who's profitting off of these high costs. putting the burden on the tax payers is just going to make everyone broke. there needs to be an analysis as to why these schools are so expensive and how much they should cost. why does a friggin' college football coach get to make millions? who the fuck is paying for that? also what about kids who party and fail their classes, or change majors multiple times, or spend well over 4 years in school? should their college be free too?

[@mrsammyg3125]

"wealthier people pay more than mid-class and poor people" *laughs in Jeff Bezos*

[@xwrtk]

My classmate went to a free college. They just had to pay for dorm and meal plan for one year as freshman have to live unless doing all online. It was fine but they didn’t always like being on a small campus.

[@sarahpeltzer6612]

I love that this video brings attention to both sides!! Thank you for being unbiased! This is a concern that is going to need critical thinkers!

[@itsbeyondme5560]

Same

[@271cosme]

How many undergrad college students are going in debt to get remedial education?

[@CanaldoSora1]

In my country (Brazil), we have both types. Free colleges tend to be really better, and they are funded by taxes. The best brazilian college is a public college called USP (University of São Paulo). No one ever questioned public colleges not being funded by government taxes, and the few politicians that do talk about "charging for free education" aren't even taken seriously.

[@AboveTheNoise]

Canal do Sora so interesting! Do you think this system helps create more equality in Brazil?

[@CanaldoSora1]

@@AboveTheNoise It didn't use to, because our SAT-ish exams are really difficult, and the public scholls are really bad, so poor people didn't really have a chance. So, around the end of the 90s, they passed a law to reserve a percentage of colleges' enrollments, firstly, to african-brazilians, and more recently, to people of low income. It's just that our enrollment process is a little different. We don't have to apply to a college. After we take the SAT-ish exams (it's called ENEM), we can directly enroll in the college we want to. The exam grades go from 0 to 1000, and each school has a grade cut. So, let's say you want to go to med school in a really good college. The cut would be high, around 980 or so, and then you would have to get the highest score you could, 'cause if the school has 200 open spots, you would have to be in the top 200 scores that apply. In the event of a tie, they see who got better scores on the areas of knowledge regarding the school you're enrolling to (for Med school that would be biology and chemestry).

[@chigrikmarak3107]

I'm currently attending a teacher's training course and it's free and we get stipend at the end of the year but we have to pay it back incase we dropout or don't graduate. Imo we there should be a system like this so people don't abuse the system and the system runs smoothly,also there should be alternatives to college.

[@z.mar.]

In Poland most of colleges are free, especially those best... Why only 4 country in Europe you've told?

[@redhood6525]

:v

[@boiyolo8659]

in my opinion, I think making all colleges free is actually worth it because number one in order to get a better job better living is all based on college degree which to explain it furthermore if we have all colleges free, it will help our economic society over there, where I low-income family and people that couldn't afford it, have chance to take that chance to educated and for a fact, student and parent wouldn't struggle about the debt they have if student gets low GPA failing and get kick out of college. another aspect is that having college free would be a great idea cause then we wouldn't be having homeless people out of the street over there cause of lack of education, good job for them to pay off their shelter and all and also it would be less crime if people were actually educated.

[@glitch2615]

I don't think free college is a good thing unless you want to double your tax burden( just look at Canada as an example). Colleges and universities however, should not be so insulated from our economy's present state.

[@djviddo2620]

I wish Americans can really look into it. How many billionaires does your country house? 540! Combined worth of about 2.4 trillion! You really think If they were taxed properly, you'd not have the money?? Amazon paid NO tax in 2018 wow!

[@jesusgonzalez1316]

It wouldn't be fair to just take away money that they worked for. And amazon did pay taxes but it just wasn't federal tax. And where are you from?

[@markzajac9993]

So my state recently rolled out a free college program called MassReconnect. In Massachusetts, community college is now free if you're 25 and older and don't have any college experience. But I have a very big concern. Retention rates at community colleges are low. Less than half actually graduate and that is the students that came to a college wanting a degree. Now think of marketing free college to older students. I am guessing that you will have a lower retention rate for these students. The problem I foresee is that all this free college isn't really free. Yes it is free if you make it to the finish line, that is if you graduate but if you don't, say you can't finish the program for some reason or even wish not to, you are obligated to pay all that tuition back to the state. That means more than half of the Massreconnect students will come out of this program poorer than they were coming in. I hope I'm wrong about this but it's a concern.

[@eminemlandsteiner168]

I am not American, but I think that the costs of the free tuition would be covered by the taxes that the educated graduated students will pay. I mean you showed a study which says that people with a college degree earn in average 53% more than those without a degree. Another source would be the military budget. USA spent 600 billion USD in 2015. Taking a couple of billions of this tremendous budget is also an option. On the other side, free tuition is not that great. Here in Austria where I live, it's almost impossible to do a research in basic science since the industry is the one who is funding the research. Most of times, we cannot even chose our Master's and Ph.D's projects!!! We get a list with very limited options that we can chose from. That's the reason why most of us try to go to north America.

[@AboveTheNoise]

That is a fascinating perspective -- thanks for sharing this comment. Seems that there are compromises in either system -- a state/taxpayer subsidized education system vs. a free market driven system (with severe funding shortages for our public education system due to overall free market orientation of government and cultural mindset). It's really interesting to hear that there is a cost involved with having universities tied so closely to government priorities. Can there be a happy medium??

[@eminemlandsteiner168]

@@AboveTheNoise this could be a topic for another video :)

[@mikeycost6917]

We can all agree book prices are ridiculous

[@BetaCupcake]

In Latvia we have subsidized university and college but for limited amount of people. If you want free higher education you have to get in a free budget-paid spot. You get there by being the "best" out of all contestants. How many people can get "free" education depends on study program, the rest just pay or wait until someone drops out. If their grades are high enough, they can get the free spot, if someone from there droped out. That system only affects public schools

[@AboveTheNoise]

Thanks for sharing how it works in Latvia. Really interesting system.

[@BetaCupcake]

@@AboveTheNoise if you want to know more, I could go more in depth. That was just the surface of our system

[@elllie3630]

Here where college or university is free and as person who is benefiting of it rn I think it’s great ok taxes are raised like 20% instead of 6-8% but I think its worth it. Ik in England it’s paid like 9k a year cause there system but here it is free and idk about other but my university have said if you are in financial trouble they can help

[@antiquarian1773]

if all colleges are free, and more and more people start graduating with degrees. what do you think is going to happen to the job market? its going to be overloaded, overloaded to the point where you have thousands of applicants applying for one position. There must be a balance in the work force.

[@kaktus3856]

Strange that this didn't happen in countries like Germany, Norway or Austria, although the universities there are free of charge.

[@compilationvideos9314]

Very fair view of the issue. I for one think higher education benefits us all. Having an undergraduate degree in the workplace now is kinda like a high school diploma when our parents started their careers. However I don't think it should be free. Infact, I think the government should be removed all together from the student loan equation. If banks have to take the risk they'll naturally reduce the amount people can borrow and tuition will sink accordingly.

[@AboveTheNoise]

Thanks for watching and sharing your perspective on the issue!

[@LoEaston]

Your book was half your tuition?? Or half of the tuition that wasnt covered by financial aid?

[@rdmcfoxinator2131]

all his books totaled to half his tuition i think is what he said

[@Pottery4Life]

WHY have tuition rates increased so much over the years? Specifically.

[@FunBotan]

Cuz the free murket

[@AboveTheNoise]

This article breaks it down pretty clearly: www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2018/09/why-is-college-so-expensive-in-america/569884/

[@ryoshockwave]

for-profit universities are probably a big factor (aka capitali$m)

[@drunclecookie216]

it doesn't help that the football coaches colleges hire make millions a year

[@rayxr]

Because over the years the demand for a degree has skyrocket. Majority of the population are told its the "next step," so colleges and universities need to increase prices to meet the demand.

[@Siko7000]

works here in germany, all books are also free btw

[@Rumeel12708]

Well it does suck paying for college, text book and everything else that comes with it, but its an investment, well atleast here in cali one can apply for financial aid, grants of all sorts, BOG waiver, but above all scholarships would be the go to thing.

[@9299paulo]

Were yall comparing 1987 money with the 1987 purchasing power to 2017 money with the 2017 purchasing power? or did yall convert the quantities therefore establishing a real comparison?

[@jpleon314]

E eh pq eh memo It was converted

[@user-wy4zb8hn6e]

Who else is doing this for debate?

[@user-wy4zb8hn6e]

Cause I am lol

[@AboveTheNoise]

@@user-wy4zb8hn6e Awesome! Hope you find the video helpful!

[@user-wy4zb8hn6e]

@@AboveTheNoise It is!! Thank you o much for this useful information!

[@insaneicle]

I'm here for writing 115

[@morrisonreed1]

what about senior year is free ? that wd increase commitment and lighten the cost burden

[@rwatson4]

Big businesses should pay for it. We need more black owen colleges and universities

[@AboveTheNoise]

Cool idea.

[@drunclecookie216]

if you want free college there's these things called grants, financial aid, and scholarships. my niece comes from a low income family and she got her tuition covered for all 4 years, room and board covered for all 4 years, plus an extra $5,000 a semester on top of that. and yes we live in the U.S.

[@drunclecookie216]

@Jane Doe no I graduated with a bachelor's in civil engineering back in 2001. I had to pay it myself and I was able to do so 1 month after graduation. My older niece thought that college was too expensive so she only got her associate's then quit school. She's pissed that her sister is getting so much back because now she realizes she could have had that too, but she never tried applying for any grants

[@thetecno5800]

Ryan Cook Ok buddy, paying back a student loan one month after graduation seems like a huge lie.

[@jeffreyrodriguez1913]

I just hope they don’t make college mandatory like public school.

[@diegoseba12]

yeah it is. Just look at the income statistics of people with college degress vs people without them.

[@user-pf2yt3hz7x]

I also think many careers are WAY over paid, some like NBA, NFL, movie stars, singers etc, I calculated a contract of a NBA star and realized that he was making 96,000 a day!!! For what? Playing basketball? something that's fun to do. Thats not even close to some other higher paid athletes. 96,000 A DAY then you have people like most of us that bust our ass and work way harder for 40,000 A YEAR something is really wrong but its to late now to change.

[@binarycascade]

The correct solution is increasing taxes on large corporations to offset the cost of free education. They’ve been leeches to the economy for far too long and it’s time for them to start giving back what they’ve taken from the people.

[@caster863]

But that won't work because corporations will find a way to find many loopholes to avoid taxes, and if we somehow manage to filled up the loopholes, they may either find new loopholes, or move out of the country.

[@caster863]

Also everytime the government fills up college tuition, the universities end up spending the money on decorations, wall climbing, cafes, etc. Look it up you'll find it, and everytime the government funds college tuition, the universities end up raising their tuition fees, making the student debt crisis even worse.

[@LoreEclectic]

@@caster863 Just because someone will try to break the law doesn't mean you don't create the law. It means you create the law and find the loopholes then close them.

[@caster863]

@@LoreEclectic And then they find new loopholes like a sinking boat. In fact, just by taxing the rich doesn't generate infinite money. If you tax the rich until they don't become rich, what are the long-term benefits and how do you know that it's enough money to help the millions of college students? Not to mention that they can just leave the country, which is the biggest and unrepairable loophole. You can't tax someone who's not in the country.

[@LoreEclectic]

@@caster863 Then you close those loopholes. That's what we do with everything. There isn't any law that is made and then never touched again. They are constantly changing and adapting. And if a billionaire wants to leave then they can leave because they aren't paying their fair share of taxes and are just a drain on society. The vast majority of workers under billionaires are in poverty, because they pay their employees in scraps. What their lowest paid employee makes in a year they can make at the snap of their fingers. There is a new study that shows that in every single state that someone making minimum wage can't afford a two bedroom house. Every single state. And in only 7% of counties can they afford a one bedroom. The tax payers are subsidizing those minimum wage workers with food stamps, with low income housing, when it should be these billionaires that are paying their workers enough to survive. If companies want well educated workers that are dedicated and happy to do the work then they should pay their fucking taxes.

[@Anita.Cox.]

You wouldnt need to increase taxes, as you said if you have a college degree you make money which translates into higher income taxes and they can buy more stuff which could mean more stuff bought so sales and excise taxes and they would buy bigger property pay property taxes.

[@JeremyWS]

I don't really like the idea of free college, but I do like the idea of increasing grant funding for college. I was able to get my 4-year college degree entirely funded by grants and scholarships, but that was because I commuted to college (I didn't live on campus, no dorm costs for me). Tennessee does free-college in about the only way I would be ok with. I don't like the idea of higher taxes that comes with free-college ideas. So that's why I don't like the idea of free college.

[@AboveTheNoise]

What's interesting about Tennessee is they fund their free community college program through the state lottery, so taxes weren't increased to pay for it.

[@Rommie26]

The basic arguments against free college 1. Would you rather pay high taxes for your entire life just so Jessica can get a worthless degree in gender studies 2. Or be responsible for your own tuition and pay off your loan within 10-15 years 3. I agree college should be cheaper tho but we can achieve that only by cutting out all the worthless majors and degrees

[@itsbeyondme5560]

Or get rid of college sports

[@gabrielac4105]

I am researching right now for my essay I have to do and this comment made me laugh. lmaooo

[@samtorres4996]

Or we can cut the spending on the million dollar contracts for pop tarts, Texas Pete hot sauce and Doritos that the military buys and give that to college kids. College should be free

[@EricDec]

In Europe, I paid my college 300 euros (250 dollars) a year and I thought it was expensive... University is usually around 1,000 dollars a year.

[@jacekrak6327]

300 euros is like 330 dollars, not 250

[@Earthium]

Ya that doesn't even cover a single book here. Generic chemistry books can run anywhere from $150-400.

[@KiM-wz9iy]

You pay that money with your half of salary(taxes)

[@mauriciorv228]

@@KiM-wz9iy u can’t assume it’s half. It differs between countries within Europe and to me it’s totally worth it, if u do the math it’s less than what u would need to pay back in the US.

[@azdgariarada]

I'm so pissed that right after I finish my degree they're going to enact free college and I'm going to be one of the last people left with massive debt.

[@mistadude]

I never thought about that...

[@MilesEdgeworth129]

Chances are, they'd have some provisions about recent grads within the last few years.

[@CalBruin]

So what is broken with the K-12 public education that an out-of-date research supporting the advantage of a college degree over a high school diploma encourages everyone to pursue a path originally intended for the higher echelon of society which some are wanting to make free to the same extent or margin as K-12 public education is free now?

[@kolinmartz]

I think it shouldn’t be free college but college paid for if you complete it. That way it doesn’t perpetuate the notion that college is necessary for success and it’s for everyone. That way it is a reward for hard work.

[@cxa011500]

Ronal Reagan is to blame for student debt.

[@animefreak5757]

imo across the board free post secondary education is hugely wasteful. Targeted help, or even free tution on the other hand is good. A cousin of mine had half her student loan forgiven for working as a registered nurse (something we need more of) in a needed area for several years. Plus, since she took a course where jobs would be available with her degree after she got out of school, the government will get that money back since she pays higher taxes on her higher income. I've met a LOT of people who went to post secondary, got a degree, and never used it for anything productive. I'm all for using tax dollars to cover tuition in cases where the person will actually get a higher paying job once they get out, or for jobs that we need more of, but i'm against just paying all tuition with no catch's.

[@AboveTheNoise]

Thanks for watching -- this is definitely an interesting perspective. ROI on taxpayer subsidies is important to consider.

[@animefreak5757]

@@AboveTheNoise Improving public education as a whole is important as well, i'm just not convinced post secondary education is where we need to work on it. I just think that we need to improve grade 1-12 more then we need across the board free post secondary. Even though it's not really free, many people will treat it as such, not caring at all if what they do is wasting resources. This happens quite a lot up here in canada with health care. A doctor can't do anything about a cold, but a LOT of people will make that appointment regardless because it's "free", clogging up the system so that people with non-critical, but time sensitive issues are driven into the ER and such (which is obviously much more expensive)

[@jeffreyburney6161]

The cost of college has gone up while the quality of education has gone down.

[@mks8172]

College through the Internet. Its cheaper or an apprenticeship you even get paid so why dig into debt.

[@issac4936]

34,000 is not bad. However for someone who went for something that makes 34,000 or maybe 2,000 more. Will struggle to pay that.

[@hikiwaltz9546]

Most of the countries you've pointed with "free-college" have spectacularly lower college students / degree holders... College is not for everybody, and they are aware of it... Trade Schools are way more incentivized than college, with good paying jobs (as trade often are in the us too, better than freshly graduates)... Trying to make college as a solution to wage inequality flies in the face of data if you take into consideration the amount of diploma holders not working in jobs that require it...

[@RealityLabsX]

We have free college and we even receive allowance by the government

[@FunBotan]

Hi there, fellow citizen of a sane country

[@AboveTheNoise]

We're curious -- what country do you live in?

[@RealityLabsX]

@@AboveTheNoise Saudi Arabia.

[@AboveTheNoise]

Admiralx S well, good to see the government is investing some of the huge oil revenues into something positive

[@RealityLabsX]

@@AboveTheNoise why do I feel passive aggressive vibes 😂

[@sampohonkala4195]

The cost is not a problem. People with a college degree will make more money and pay more taxes, so they end up paying for their own educaton. But it is fair that you pay after you have got the job that was made possible by your degree, and not before when you are young, have no income and your parents need to pay if they can.

[@MorbidlyObeseChell]

I would also like to add that yes scholarships do exist but they are extermely selective and don't always give out the money to a student.

[@GANTZ100pts]

No one is twisting your arm to sign on that dotted line. So NO it should NOT be free. It was YOUR choice to take a 50-70k loan for gender study's a "skill" that has ZERO benefit to the job market. It was YOUR choice you took 50-70k loan for a socialism course. A skill that once again, has ZERO benefit to the job market. So if you don't want to be crushed by ridiculous student loan debt for the rest of your life, Start by taking classes that will actually give you a meaningful job.

[@bryangonzales1774]

Exactly

[@pnpark]

FRANCE universities have free tuition

[@ronaldolzheim363]

It's a marathon not a sprint --> Their is a lot of work to do in the educational environment, but free schooling will help. The question is: How do the policy makers manage the money?

[@Ceelvain]

When do dropouts actually drop out? Their cost is lower if they quit early. As would probably be the case with free tuition. BTW, I strongly believe that knowledge should be free. Only good things come from better education for everyone. Who the hell could be against that? For the same reason, I think the price of scientific journals is a shame to the whole academic world. But that's another topic.

[@BruceMagnus]

Knowledge is already mostly free - you can go on the Internet and have access to massive amounts of high quality education and even classes without paying.

[@Ceelvain]

@@BruceMagnus It will never be the same as interacting with a teacher.

[@cam7minus1]

College shouldn't be free, drive cost down by having transparency in college prices.

[@thegodhoward8037]

I'm an art student and there is no way I can afford a second semester

[@Nelcomarproductions]

Why would you even be an art student?

[@thegodhoward8037]

@@Nelcomarproductions because I want to do comic books

[@Nelcomarproductions]

@@thegodhoward8037 you dont need a degree for that. Just make your own comic and then do a kickstarter. That is what many people are doing now.

[@thegodhoward8037]

@@Nelcomarproductions I've already left art school

[@thegodhoward8037]

@@Nelcomarproductions and I was never looking for a degree in the first place only the skill

[@nestorjrabalos1998]

Depends on your course. If you have a least in demand degree (dont wanna say useless), you will struggle to find a high paying job later.

[@MindLaboratory]

THE VIEWS OF MY POLITICAL PARTY ARE ABSOLUTELY CORRECT AND ANYTHING YOU SAID THAT MIGHT QUESTION THAT IS CATEGORICALLY WRONG

[@AboveTheNoise]

Glad to see you are keeping an open mind and looking at stuff objectively! Lol.

[@EdwardThimbleHands]

Money is a representation of a few different things, but in this instance it is time and resources. If you can find a way to get the resources (like books or at least the information in them) for a reduced cost or free then you've gotten half the battle won. The problem with that is publishers don't want to see a loss in revenue, which is why you'd have to divorce education from publishing. Information should be available to the public for education proposes, and if you do that you'd be golden. Time is the other factor, mainly the teacher's time. You have to find a way to accommodate them in a way that is meaningful and right now that's cash. Though another option is to cut out teachers completely and just program all of the classes. Aside from creative writing or art, I don't see much of a necessity for teachers needing to be there. The last problematic thing is sports. It has nothing to do with education, but hell if my local college didn't build a new gym (when they already have two) and renovate the football stadium with the tuition people are paying, plus they got subsidies from the state. The whole time they are cutting degree programs to reduce costs and building dorms instead of parking lots. Our college was primarily a commuter centric set-up, but instead of focusing on that strength they dismantled it.

[@AboveTheNoise]

EdwardThimbleHands you raise really important points. We could do another episode about whether or not live humans are needed to teach at the college level.

[@EdwardThimbleHands]

@@AboveTheNoise considering that "correct information" should be taught either way and as soon as something is found to be inaccurate it would be easier to fix it with a little editing to a database rather than hoping a teacher is up-to-date on the latest field research. It would produce less physical waste, less fossil fuel emissions, and allow classes to be taught from anywhere in the world. Why have hundreds or thousands of teachers for one subject when you'll have one class with the same information for everyone? It does mean that the information has to be as accurate as possible, but also that *everyone* has access to education at every level and all of the classes would be a "masterclass" which would removes the educational inequality of going to an ivy league school versus going to a community college. Also, the ability to take a class anywhere in the world means we would truly become a global nation that shares the knowledge we gain around the world, hopefully leading to more understand and equality instead of distrust and hate. I'm looking at *you* , Trump... It is the next best thing to a matrix style "download everything into my brain" option.

[@AboveTheNoise]

EdwardThimbleHands very interesting take on this idea. But what about the intangible and occasionally transformative effect that human relationships can have on a student and teacher? You hear time and again from successful people who overcame adversity that it was because of a gifted educator who recognized their hidden potential. No video course or algorithm can detect and nurture untapped human talent and intellect - and that’s so often the make or break ingredient for underserved learners.

[@tiredox3788]

We should lower the price. College shouldn't be free because devalues a lot of degrees and I don't see how it's fair for people to pay higher taxes if they don't believe that much in college or in a useless degree.

[@psatinstormyrahchelzeruiah9615]

Some of the best schooln I ever had

[@realdragon]

Yes it is, I have free college and it's amazing

[@uria702]

Nothing in life is “free”.

[@zweiwing4435]

Why not all the countries offer free education to all people?

[@dalton6173]

Can we get a program where people in lower income homes who have kids who have the capacity to activate more so be given a stipend? I mean yeah we should help all of the poor kids just saying plenty of people who could revolutionize the world are not reaching their potential which is costing the world even more in the long run.

[@adlockhungry304]

Anyone aware of any media (video, audio, written) that goes into more depth discussing the pros and cons?

[@AboveTheNoise]

AdlockHungry check out our sources in the description! There is a lot of good information there.

[@jollygator9080]

Well, the question is, did implementation of free college in the Nordic countries increase or decrease the dropout rate?

[@mavericksization]

Dtr dragging feet leaving ca. due to this free college. Really true ?

[@gudldj]

y'all should have looked at numbers from other countries, asking questions that have already been answered but acting like they haven't is just a lazy lie. Need based aid is just a stopgap, it's important now while we disinvest in higher ed, but universities just use this to help them privatize by hiding just how much the state is investing in them, all the while they'll keep raising tuition. since the public dollars are delivered to the students and not the college, they don't have to log that in their budgets as a source of income, creating private schools propped up by public dollars.

[@chrisamon80]

There are no free colleges and universities. I'm not allowed to do that. It's forbidden.

[@ajr993]

2:05 This isn't an honest representation of the facts. Inflation between 1987 and 2017 was 115%. So its more but its also a lot less than you're suggesting. Private college is only 14% more expensive, in you example. Also it won't solve income inequality at all. When more people have bachelor degrees, then suddenly college is just the new highschool. That means to be at the previous college level before, you'll need a masters. Then you'll be demanding free graduate programs.

[@LoreEclectic]

It has risen so much and yet minimum wage hasn't. That's the problem

[@trasherhead]

From the perspective of a Norwegian; No it is not free. Tax payers have to pick up the bill. But like everything else in society, it is an investment. We as tax payers invest in infrastructure for all because it make it easier to get around, helps businesses etc. We(here in Norway) invest in public healthcare, because have a lot of sick people around lowers productivity on every level. We invest in students because they are the future. They are the ones who are going to innovate, produce things and build businesses in the future, and in turn be able to pay more taxes. And the more people you get to where they should be in life and be the most they can be the better for the state(taxes), the better for businesses(Innovation and competence) and better for society as a whole. It does not matter if the drop out rate increases with X% points if the number of students who complete and go on to do more productive work then they would else have done increases.