Adam and Eve's Fall from Grace

[@smithrr6]

I have never met or heard a pastor that explained the bible in such a relatable and practical perspective that can apply directly to my life in a way that Jordan Peterson can. This is a skill that every pastor should have and should be able to perform. Pastors should be able to apply the stories of the bible to a person's life for practical guidance. Most ministers that I have met use the phrase "God is too complex to understand, it just takes faith". Now after hearing Jordan Peterson explain the bible, I understand that those ministers were not skilled ministers.

[@brando3342]

You should be VERY careful. I don’t think ministers should always revert to “God is complicated”, however, there is also another extreme. We have to be careful with people like Jordan, because he can say things that are decidedly NOT what the Bible was intending to relate, out of the desire to be pragmatic in his talks. Jordan is no theologian, and he admits that, that is why he is always expressing the caveat of “from a psychological perspective”… because if he didn’t, than people could surely call him out on some theological blunders. This is where I would say it’s better to say “I don’t know, because I’m not God”, and be humble, than it is to make up some elaborate explanation of something the Bible wasn’t saying in the first place. I do agree that ministers and Christians in general need to do better at knowing their Bible, and being able to explain it. However, just be careful with people like Jordan, he isn’t speaking from a Christian perspective, so not everything he says even SHOULD be repeated by a minister.

[@smithrr6]

@@brando3342 in his Exodus series on the daily wire is a round table discussion and there are atleast 5 or 6 actual theologists at the table discussing Exodus in a theological and practical way. After watching them explain the story of Exodus the way that they did it now has so much more meaning. They also highlight a few mistranslations between English and Hebrew which I found helpful to know.

[@brando3342]

@@smithrr6 Yes, good to have actual theologians to take from. Johnathan Pageau is one of the guys there, he is Eastern Orthodox, and a good friend of Jordan. I like his takes, and it's kind of funny and endearing when he jumps in between Jordan's musings to express the actual Christian view.

[@brando3342]

@@0xzgen People in ancient times were not dummies. Read some Plato, or Aristotle. Theology is not some coping mechanism for difficult topics. For many of the most complex topics, it is actually the foundations.

[@samueldavis5895]

Every pastor is not a professor with years of knowledge and expertise.

[@jefferywilson4091]

Sometimes Jordan speaks over my head, but it warms my soul that a man of his intelligence has found his faith in God. I always enjoy listening to him speak.

[@abhishekchakraborty8218]

What faith ? He believes in evolution. The man you are praising is the devil . Do not follow the false prophets

[@kiddtokyo2612]

As much as I wish he was christian, he isnt.

[@jaddy11mash]

@@kiddtokyo2612 he doesn’t have religion cause he learnt ! That cause drama ❤and power and control

[@blackMamba-nc7eb]

@@kiddtokyo2612 adharmic religions are shallow

[@Lsullyvan]

@@kiddtokyo2612you don’t know that…he’s private about his faith

[@hamdoolam]

Nothing in these stories is an accident. It's not fairy tales. Its precisely edited cosmic truths of the nature of humanity, and also how to transcend that nature. Amen.

[@alexyordanov6250]

Good morning, people.

[@preacherofthecross]

I really like the way you put that.

[@paulavery5889]

I'm not a Christian and I said the same thing to my friend who is a Christian explaining that. But he's a literalist so it was like talking to a wall.

[@beyondalldreams]

same with 7 sins, they are just 7 ways to make your life much worse

[@trolley2327]

why must nature be transcended ? This assumes there is something holy , and that holy thing is not human nature .... where does this come from? Amen

[@fredatait]

A simple way of explaining the problem with "knowledge of Good and Evil" is as follows. As soon as you know what you should not do, you implicitly know what you _could_ do. Once everyone knows what they could do, it's only a matter of time before some of them go ahead and do it.

[@tombombadil4908]

"It's just a part of being! What are you gonna do about it!?" Wise words :)

[@johnbagewll2321]

I’ve recently been listening to Jordan and have probably heard about 15 or so of his posts/ speaking’s. This is the first I’ve heard of him speaking in biblical terms. I like him more now than I did before. That’s kind of hard to say as I liked him enough to keep watching his teachings. What a brilliant man with such a wealth of knowledge yet humble and bold all wrapped up into … well, Jordan Peterson.

[@kenneththompson1794]

Well said, my thoughts exactly.. Enjoyed your post 👍

[@zsolthalmagyi954]

This interpretation is just awesome. The way the dots are connected and then explained it is clear to follow through.

[@SteveSmith-kd9if]

THIS FOOL DOESN'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT ANYTHING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@DanFedMusic]

Bigger picture: They were both created perfect, meaning without any flaws in their physical, emotional or mental selves. They also had the prospect of living forever, not the guarantee, not yet, they had to gain gods confidence and then they would've eaten from the tree of life. The tree they were told not to eat from represented God's sovereignty, his right to set the standard of right and wrong and when they ate from the tree, they chose to decide for themselves right and wrong. Before this they were without sin, there are two definitions for sin, it's an action and a condition. The condition is sickness and death, the action is transgressing against God's will. Immediately after they disobeyed, God arranged for redemption in Genesis 3:15. The Bible hangs on this verse… It means eventually Jesus coming to earth and giving his life in exchange for everyone who would exercise faith in him. Jesus was a perfect man who replaced Adam The perfect man: in a sense Jesus became our adoptive father that Adam was supposed to be. God wasn't going to destroy the influencer, nor was he going to destroy the transgressors because that would go against his fairness of giving them the freedom to choose. So he had to allow for the next several thousand years to play out, giving human beings a chance to live independently from him because this was the challenge that Satan put to God, "people will only really serve you if things are going well, they won't keep their integrity to you." So a charge was put against God so the entire Bible, the theme of the Bible, is the sanctification and vindication of God's name and the vindication of God's sovereignty Which will be by means of gods kingdom, the kingdom that people pray for to come.

[@artifacthunter1472]

Adam and Eve did not have free will God said when you eat of the tree not if!

[@DanFedMusic]

@@artifacthunter1472 He clearly told them they must not eat from the tree or they will die.

[@senam1394]

Powerful

[@alexxmigss]

Wonderfully said!

[@amadhevincent7408]

I intimately and comprehensively understand, support and agree with this thorough breakdown of the event in the garden of Eden. Which brings me to asking this from you. Are you a Jehovah's witness? Because this insight you have, while being unshakably the truth, is not well known nor popular, amongst so-called Christians, in the general term.

[@jackieboib]

"I bet alot of you are good at torture" this guy is the best 🤣

[@martinchitembo1883]

😂😂😂

[@marknlynette6623]

Dr Peterson, On one point you mentioned at the start of this talk, For God to tell Adam not to eat of the tree or he would die, for that to be a deterrent to Adam, Adam had to have some prior knowledge of death.

[@roberttyler1206]

That's a very good point. I'm a Christian and there are many things we won't know before we are in glory.

[@lorrainecouch348]

@@roberttyler1206 Glory? For the power and the glory I'm off!!! As soon as my AGENDA of JUSTICE PAYBACK AND VENGEANCE is over. It is now a well known fact that the elite have always wanted the power and the glory for themselves. They know where to look... in the PEASANT sector!!! The Catholic church is a disgrace

[@mephInc]

Knowledge of death, yes, because animals died. However, no human had died, so no knowledge of personal death. We all know things die, but knowing that you will as well is horrifying if it hasn't been seen before.

[@jordanheath5258]

I could be wrong so please take caution. But Adam and Eve may have been heavenly beings before being kicked out of the garden - which is akin to a broader phenomenological heavens compared to humans bound to something much more specific. This can be backed up with Cain and Abel being the first two humans technically. So when the Bible says if they eat the fruit they will surely die, it’s to signal that they will be cast down from the broader phenomenological experience into specific conscious beings. Which blocks us from eternal life because the nature of our bodies are subjected to entropy. This is only an interpretation though

[@HeyMykee]

I think it's the difference between a child's understanding of death and an adult's. Yes, a child knows death exists, but hasn't had it affect their personal world yet, or experienced the grieving and loss of a loved one dying. After that happens, and especially when you reach adulthood and the brain structures have grown in completely, you understand it in a much different way. You understand the personal tragedy of death.

[@eddiericks6554]

Jesus Christ is for everyone all we have to do is follow 😊

[@Rebecca-u1t]

No honey everyone can be Jesus if you have a good heart be a good person and jesus is dead

[@goddessIam-t3b]

​@@Rebecca-u1tIsn't that what the statement read:? Good person has to possess a good heart, shheesh

[@Publius-24]

Saint Matthew 7:13-14 Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the road broad that leads to destruction, and those who enter through it are many. How narrow the gate and constricted the road that leads to life. And those who find it are few.

[@identitywithheld1027]

Grace is a state of sinlessness and selflessness. Self-knowledge is a fall from grace. We replaced our self with our understanding of self.

[@mamedovmuradov]

@focusontheSPRING because its not wise. its just being more foolish.

[@kky.x]

@SPRING It was gnostic wisdom. “Ye shall be as gods knowing good and evil” which is the gnosis. I believe satan’s final deception will be the same gnostic lie from the garden. Ye shall be as gods if you merge with technology and progress your own evolution

[@estebanrodriguez1175]

@focusontheSPRING god gatekeeping the cosmic experience

[@iambored2006]

@SPRING God is the world (sort of), and the world has definitely punished mankind for its acquired wisdom. Since the agricultural revolution (in my opinion the clearest real life model for the story in Genesis), we've been suffering from incrementally more bizarre forms of misery ("by the sweat of your brow you shall eat bread", etc.), which were unimaginable to our ancestors in the 'paradisiacal' jungles. Indeed, we've increasingly distanced ourselves from our previous animalistic existence, and thus alienated ourselves from the world. Daoism talks about this as well, to the point of advocating for a return to a simpler existence. The point of the story in Genesis is that our wisdom was won by us, the world/God didn't take the initiative in bringing about our next stage of existence. You can imagine God's warning to Adam not to eat of the fruit as a manifestation of Adam's own reluctance to acquire knowledge which at least a part of him knew would result in some form of misery for him and his descendants. The god of the Bible isn't trying to help us get back to paradise and blissful ignorance. That ship has sailed. Instead, he's trying to guide us through a world that punishes our self-awareness with existential misery, and towards a higher purpose.

[@basedrecordsfr]

@SPRING everything God wrote was for our instruction. that's an unmerited gift, Grace in the first place, and even so, God can do what He pleases. Whether your carnal and rebellious mind accepts that or not.

[@gargoyleontheroof]

Cain's offering was rejected because he offered his leftovers whereas Able offered the best of his produce.

[@theeternalsbeliever1779]

That's not really true, because the Bible never remotely implies that Cain offered leftovers. Cain's attitude had a lot more to do with his offering being rejected than what he offered. God also implies in Gen. 4:7 that the way he went about producing his offering was sinful. Cain did not "do well", so his offering was rejected.

[@zensvlognotapro]

God never discriminate, He has no favorites the reason this story of Cain and Abel I question this that the writer told Abel's offerings favoured by God. God doesn't need foods I believe so . He needs our grateful heart.

[@kelsfosk]

Cain was the devils offspring

[@deadpool2349]

Yes, the book has many layers and this is just one of them.

[@susankievman642]

And why did God need offerings in the first place? Certainly, he cannot eat the animals or the crops.

[@skiezz9582]

Being couscous I already looked at this story in this way. Its great to hear someone explain it better.

[@thomasowen5785]

couscous is a traditional North African dish

[@carlosalarcon9389]

Doing evil causes shame, sadness, disgust, worryness or anger to yourself or to someone else.

[@YoungMommy14]

This story was always my favourite. I really like the fact that it can be interpreted so many ways. It ALMOST seems like it was inentionally written in a manner that almost guarantees different perspectives and explanations. Anyway... My All Time favourite interpretation is courtesy of a rather famous Rabbi named Rabbi Manis Friedman. So, I'll try to remember it to the best of my ability. First, it's necessary to provide some essential information. The religions of Judiasm and Christianity are actually profoundly different, so I'll just quickly mention some key differences to help ensure better comprehension. a) In Judaism, there never was a concept of 'Original Sin'. In the Original version, The eating from the Tree was never considered a violation of 'Hallakhah' (The Law). Nowhere in the story does it suggest that the eating of the fruit was 'sinful'. b) In Judaism, you don't inherit 'sins'. You're responsible for your actions and your actions alone. c) Judaism is very unique in the sense that physical bodies are not considered shameful or restrictive at all. Their considered 'practical'. You have opposable appendages, eyes, ears, etc. Having a body is supposed to be considered a 'good thing'. d) Judaism is divided into 'Two Paradigms'. The World Today (Olam Ha' Ze) and The World to Come (Olam Ha' Ba). Materialism is not considered a bad thing. So, the second Paradigm begins when The Prophecied 'Masshiach' (Messiah) returns. Every person deemed Righteous is 'ressurected' from their Graves and they build 'Heaven on Earth. Ok... So, it goes like this. Adam and Eve are in 'Gan Eden' (Garden of Eden). G-d tells them, the same things as in The Christian Version. He says that they can eat whatever they like with the exception of fruit from The Tree of Knowledge of 'Good and Evil', for when you do you will surely die. So, they notice a serpent on a tree and he tells them that they can infact eat the fruit and it will make them like G-d. So, Adam and Eve become suspicious. First of all they're confused as to why the challenge is so simple. Don't eat a fruit? Doesn't sound like much of a challenge. Also, they know that G-d planted or at least allowed the serpent to be there. They know that G-d is Omnipotent and if he didn't want it there it wouldn't be there. Then it occurs to them that the one rule is a bit suspicious. The deterrent is something called 'dying'. Neither if them have a clue what that means. If G-d truly didn't want them to eat from the tree, why would the only punishment be a gibberish word that meant absolutely nothing as far as they were concerned. They're very suspicious. Then, Adam says 'Wait... What EXACTLY did God say? Eve responds 'Don't eat from The Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil'. Adam says, 'No... After that'. Eve says ", For when you do, you will surely die'. Adam says 'For WHEN you do. He didn't say 'If you do'. He said 'WHEN you do'. So, at that point, they realized that G-d wanted them to eat from it. If G-d said that they would eat, then obviously he wanted them to eat. So, G-d comes down. He congratulates them for figuring out the little trick. He then explains that he wants to build 'Gan Eden' (Garden of Eden- Heaven) in a different realm. The only thing is that this realm is material. So, it's going to sometimes feature things like pain and other things that aren't all that pleasurable. He tells them that he cannot force them to go, but he'd really appreciate if they would go and be the Patriarch and Matriarch of his most important project. So, they think about it and decide to go. They realize that it might be a bit tough due to things like pain and so on, but they decide that a bit of suffering / discomfort is a small price to pay for the honour of being The very first two people selected to inhabit and help build The Greatest Project of All Time. So, why did G-d test them like that? Well, my understanding is that he wanted to teach them the value of 'Purpose'. In Gan Eden everything is very comfortable and all that. There's not much of importance to do, though. Jews are Servants of G-d. Their expected to do all the work, or the vast majority. Non Jews don't really have obligations (except for The 7 Noahidic Laws). Jews are expected to guide all 'Righteous Non Jews into The Second Epoch. There's no prize or reward, because the honour of being of service to G'd is it's own reward. And, the rest is history. Bless.

[@jasonjamesramcharan8075]

Thanks very much for sharing 🙌

[@YoungMommy14]

@@jasonjamesramcharan8075 My Pleasure.

[@kaidenrietkerk7068]

are the books worded differently because when i searched what God said he said `You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die. and he did not say for when you do you will surely die and when i came across different sources on the web they all say the same thing in general but they are all worded different so i thought that was interesting and i don't know why they are all worded different do you know why?

[@g.1260]

Thank you for offering here a Jewish perspective - after all...they wrote it and have reflected on it as much as Christians have, or perhaps even more. Christians would be so enriched by the Jewish interpretation of their Scriptures. Again, thank you!

[@michaelegan6037]

There was no scarfic jesus said just believe in me no brick are wood to worship me

[@jeremyst.germain2023]

They were conscious. They were God conscious, sin caused them to become self conscious. Mankind has been self conscious ever since. Man had the image and likeness of God, but we didn’t have His character. This is why the LORD would visit man in the cool of the evening. These were character building visits. Sin ended those visits, and man became a creature of instinct. The most defining characteristic of humanity is rooted in our strongest instinct, self preservation. Far far below where God intended for man to be.

[@humbledlovingforgivenesshe3114]

I thank you and appreciate your prophetic advice

[@masaisassi3730]

Sure, Adam and Eve were conscious beings. But here’s the real dilemma: did they truly know the difference between good and evil? Think about it-when a lion kills a gazelle, we don’t call the lion evil. Why? Because we understand that animals don’t have the moral awareness to distinguish right from wrong. Now, this isn’t to compare humans to animals, but rather to highlight that Adam and Eve’s actions were arguably amoral. Before eating the fruit, they didn’t know that disobedience was wrong. They lacked the knowledge of sin itself. They were, in essence, naive and innocent. So, the deeper question is: why did God allow it? Why punish them for something they didn’t fully understand? Why even put the tree there in the first place? And if the act of eating the fruit opened their eyes to good and evil, why not give them a second chance-either before punishment or after they had learned the difference?

[@geoattoronto]

Eve began to see what the serpent said because she believed the lie. She was not unconscious but freely chose. They chose to be independent of God and live with their ego = conscious intellect and not to commune and partner with God. Free choice with dramatic consequences in which everything went wrong. We were made in the image of God to live in the light of God’s love and become beloved children of God - in the Way that Jesus showed us.

[@artifacthunter1472]

Eve did choose what God put in her head to choose which was to eat of the fruit! Do you actually think that she could’ve chose not to eat the fruit you would be insane! People who believe in free will have not read North study their Bible! There is not one verse in the Bible that says man has free will to choose outside of the will of God! The Bible says that God works all things after the council of his own will from ancient times to everything not yet done! That leaves no room for free will!

[@charlesx5795]

They didn’t know any better were talking about the first humans

[@charlesx5795]

The serpent shouldn’t of been able to just come in the garden and mess with gods creation notice when they got kicked out a cherubim and a flaming sword was placed in front of the garden why couldn’t the cherubim be placed their in the first place so the serpent could never enter

[@juliemcfarlane7245]

​@@charlesx5795I always wondered that myself.

[@g.1260]

There's a lot of ancient psychology in this clever biblical story that resonates so well for the contemporary experience, IF it is reflected upon intelligently as Peters has done here.

[@ItsChevnotJeff]

One thing I find interesting about the tale of Cain and Abel, and I heard this from a song by Bizzle, check him out, he's a great Christian musician, but what's interesting is that Cain's sacrifice, the crops and good bounties of the soil, and Abel's sacrifice, the slaughtered lamb without blemish, ties in to the long foreshadowing of not only the coming of Christ, the Lamb of God and the one to take away the sin of the world through His sacrifice, but also one of the main ideologies of Christianity itself, in that it is not the works that saves us, only our belief in God and Jesus Christ Cain worked so hard to grow those plants, trusting that it will be the best for God, while Abel put his trust in God Himself, that his sheep will give birth to the perfect lamb to sacrifice

[@susankievman642]

So, that made Cain less than? Explain that to me.

[@ItsChevnotJeff]

@@susankievman642 God didn't say that Cain is less, nor did the Bible call him such, it's just that God accepted Abel's sacrific over Cain's, the metaphor isn't pointed out but it can be spotted once you read into the new testament and all the foreshadowing to that point

[@susankievman642]

@@ItsChevnotJeff I have no idea what you just said. Read into the New Testament and the foreshadowing? What does that mean?

[@mariyacharm74]

Uncorrupted mind is not " unconscious".....dear Sir.Peterson...it insults God,,, it's more like saying God's original design has something to do with disobedience..... They find themselves naked coz of disobedience, their light body lost its glory... and they were cursed to sweat for living.... When speaking of God's work it should never be disguised but to tell the truth straight and with God's wisdom...When we relay on own wisdom we may misguide ppl inspite of we being a great spokesperson or an inspiration. I say this out of love...May god's give his own wisdom to you for it can be used in an marvelous way through such an outstanding person ( urself a creation of god) .... Blessed be the name of the Lord!!! Blessings to you n your family Sir! I do respect you for all your great works... God bless 🙏❤

[@Mohamed-bm6yk]

There is part of me wish stay unconscious and other part cherich the idea that im conscious

[@MrMajsterixx]

definetly, and the time i used to like being unconscious the most was also my worst time. Only slept and took drugs.

[@benparrish672]

​@Prokletý Básník: Most of us used drugs to numb ourselves emotionally or to take the pain away physically &/or emotionally. Never Start! Learn how to forgive

[@MichaelLevine-n6y]

One would have to be conscious to have such a thought as you suggest.

[@Tha3rdworldghost]

Waking up ruined my life in some strange way. It feels like im trapped inside a simulation and the only way out is death. I

[@nicewhenearnedrudemostlyel489]

​@@Tha3rdworldghost then you're still groggy friend. You're already there. Stop trying to reach through the prison bars and turn around. You're trying to get in...

[@simatic369]

Life is sufferIng The suffering servant does not serve suffering but learns to turn suffering into His servant. He lays His Life down for another and thereby conquers death. Desire is the root of suffering. Righteousness is the only cause worth suffering for. There is a medicine within the ailment. Suffering is the other face of Love. That which you Love most is what you will suffer most for. Evil is a lesson that contains the ultimate good. Suffering is a prompt to Awaken. There is a Bodhicitta within everyone that wishes to comprehend the nature of suffering and transcend it. The Christ-Word is the Root “If a seed does not die, it cannot bear fruit”.

[@noahtheisen-ft6kz]

Thanks Jordan!

[@THEVOIDZ]

"Work is the sacrifice of the present for the future."

[@observeroflife0000]

First let me say thank you for being you Jordan. This was so fascinating to listen to and you articulated it so well. I wish I could hear the whole thing. But regarding what you did say, yes, self consciousness was brought into the picture... But its counterpart has been left out of the entire equation here... Self awareness. How do we know we actually HAVE the whole story here? There are two specific trees mentioned, but only one is talked about because that is the one they chose. The tree of the knowledge of good and evil... And the tree of Life. The reason God removed them from the Garden was so they couldn't eat from it AFTER eating from the other because then they/we would have lived eternally in the state of suffering we are currently in. Removing them from the Garden was an act of Mercy. Not only for us, but also Himself... 😳😂 Imagine having to live eternally with US in our current state. 😳🤦‍♀️ Knowlege WAS the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, right? Wisdom was the fruit of the Tree of Life. Think about that. Knowledge + Wisdom = Understanding Self awareness is the emotional fruit of Wisdom and self consciousness is the emotional fruit of Knowledge. 👍 In other words... If they had chosen the tree of Life first... We would have been self aware, without ever even knowing what self consciousness felt like. 🤷‍♀️ When we are accountable to ourselves first... There really is nothing to be self conscious about. 🤷‍♀️ And let's delve a little deeper into this, shall we? God created things in two's, so to speak. Male and female to reproduce. There were TWO trees. One represented Knowledge... What we all live and swear by... One represented Wisdom... The thing we seem to have never recognized. Men rule the world... And women are being erased. You do the math. 🤷‍♀️ Because as a woman I am going to be frank about something here... Just from personal experience mind you... Men are just as half informed about life as women are. So perhaps if we started listening to each other we could make some progress here. 👍

[@HawkNestPod]

If youre going to be self conscious go all the way, ask all the questions, knock and ye shall be let in, ask and ye shall recieve

[@tonyalvarez7712]

This is very well explained understand it and open you mind to the truth and light of god the father god bless

[@Eliezer-ec1bx]

Man fell (decended) from singularity into duality, and women came out of Him.

[@Pcoxproductions]

Why is it not going to be the same for Ai if it ever becomes self-conscious that it will realize it is naked

[@jmarie7252]

Jordan should write a Bible commentary..I would love to read it…he’s so articulate and easy to understand..very deep and thought provoking ❤

[@schmetterling4477]

He is also completely wrong. ;-)

[@davey7577]

We always had consciousness. We didn’t have knowledge of good and evil. Until the fall.

[@christopherjones2669]

Fall a good thing, we all fall, without Fall, no need for Lord. Without Fall, no children. Without Fall, no progress.

[@thefeds7462]

Great unpacking but he did miss a super important part of this story. God said, “Where are you Adam”. God was displaying what I believe was grace. He was asking Adam where was he at. He knew Adam had sinned and He wanted Adam to respond by asking for forgiveness because sin is the thing that exposes us and forgiveness and repentance covers it

[@AnonymousG2325]

Worth watching ❤

[@skeletalkey9693]

I often think of cain and abel from different perspectives, starting with "Cain" can be looked at as "Cane" someone who is lame or unable to do something and depends on something to get by, and "Abel" as "Able" someone with the power to do. Its a interesting contrast to pronounce the origin of envy.

[@junevandermark952]

The Omphalos Hypothesis was a very big deal to theologians, that in turn would come from miles around to gather and discuss the subject. They never did come to any agreement and are probably still scratching their heads in confusion. The question was and is … did Adam have a belly button?

[@timhensley3695]

Yes. But it was along the lines of a third nipple.

[@junevandermark952]

@@nothinghere1996 lol Oh, and by the way, Adam's wife was Lilith. That was Judaism's doctrine. The first Christians twisted the story to suit their own agendas, and his wife morphed into Eve. Religious tales have long, long tails.

[@junevandermark952]

@SPRING I wonder if Jordan would be able to find any humor, or image of his self in the following? Honor It pleased me beyond measure when Yale made me a Master of Arts, because I didn't know anything about art...I rejoiced again when Missouri University made me a Doctor of Laws, because it was all clear profit, I do not knowing anything about laws except how to evade them...And now at Oxford I am to be made a Doctor of Letters--all clear profit, because what I don't know about letters would make me a multi-millionaire if I could turn it into cash. Mark Twain's Autobiography

[@junevandermark952]

@@nothinghere1996 I thought that maybe you might not be aware that in the theology, Lilith came first ... and then Eve "followed." Were you insulted that I dare to bring up that subject?

[@junevandermark952]

@@nothinghere1996 I wonder if the term "evil" stemmed from the word "Eve?" Evil? Even non-human animals were labeled by religious devotees as being "evil." Throughout history house cats were revered as being holy by those in religions and at other times were vilified as being evil by those in other religions. Now, for the most part, there are people who simply don't like cats, or people who are very fond of cats. The cat never was holy, or evil. The cat was just a self-centered creature of nature, and I suggest that as human animals, we also are simply self-centered creatures of nature, and that the terms evil and holiness are hallucinatory results of overactive human imaginations.

[@WKDMOUSE67]

It does not say apple. Let no man deceive you. Always read for your self and do not take other peoples word on any Bible topic. Hallelujah amen.

[@markgrotto7852]

I only got 30 seconds into it and realized he didn’t know what he was talking about. Adam and Eve wanted to know (experiential knowledge of evil). They already knew good because God said He made everything and it was good. They knew good experiential but not evil. Evil is the absence of good so they were saying they wanted to experience life without Gods affects. They wanted independence from God. We still have this nature.

[@susankievman642]

And since God created us, he knew the nature of man and he tempted them with the tree, knowing full well that they would eat from it. Not like he put it behind an electrified fence or something!

[@markgrotto7852]

@@susankievman642 you are looking at it from the surface. Think about what the text says about why Eve ate it. It didn’t have to be a tree that triggered it. Ask yourself who God is and who man is in the context and you will understand.

[@susankievman642]

@@markgrotto7852 You just made it even more confusing. Ask who God is and who man is in the context???? What does that even mean? It appears to me that Eve was bored with her “perfectly boring life”. It seems to me that god made the tree of knowledge perfectly accessible to tempt them, knowing the nature of man and woman that he made. Who wouldn’t want the same knowledge that God has? How would either them know what death or suffering was since they had never seen or experienced anyone dying. Why did god think that ignorance was better than knowledge and vulnerability?

[@susankievman642]

@@markgrotto7852 Still do not understand your answer. What do you mean what God is and what man is? What on earth are you talking about?

[@susankievman642]

Another question, Since Adam and Eve were the first humans, how did Satan get into the picture so early? If God is so powerful, why couldn’t he have destroyed Satan before humans were tempted by him? what is supposed to happen to Satan when Jesus comes back? Will Satan be destroyed then?

[@edcariello]

Thank you Dr. Peterson for the light that you bring to people's minds. Have you looked at the teachings of these topics found in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints? Equally remarkable.

[@pointless_official]

To the person reading this: even though I don't know you, I wish you the best of what life has to offer! ❤🎉

[@TRYCLOPS1]

The story of Adam & Eve is the most complex and beautiful story. It tells about the relationship between a son and a father. It tells about the relationship between a man and a woman. It tells about the nature of both as they interact over the years. It’s about more than meets the eye. Adam is usually portrayed as some dumb and superficial guy. But in reality, what was the right thing to do for him after he learned about Eve’s sin; the bone of his bones and blood of his blood? Was the right thing to do is just snitch on her and expose her to the father and let her be condemned to her own fate? He knew the answer was more complex than that. The snake was acting on the father’s will and plan. It was all a test for Adam. God wanted to see if Adam was ready to be the man he needed to be for Eve. If he was a snitch and gave up on Eve after her sin, he wouldn’t be enough for her. He wouldn’t be able to protect her in the real world, outside of Eden. Eden representing the childhood home, where children are raised without dangers and real serious responsibilities. The moment Adam was ready to bet his soul for Eve, even against the the Father, that was the moment he became a man. He didn’t want to turn in Eve and then expect God to punish her with death and give him a more suitable wife that would not be so imperfect. He loved Eve as his own. He saw her as irreplaceable. So he bet his own life and soul for her. He went against God for her, in order to bargain for her with his own blood. He was wiser than what people give him credit for. He was created as God’s image and resemblance. He knew he was Gods proud and joy. He knew God wouldn’t just kill them both as he knew God can break his own word as well. He understood the mind of God to a point. He played chess with God. God recognized this and that’s why he spared them both. At that point God knew Adam was ready to face the real world of great dangers and mysteries and knew Eve would be in good hands next to him as her protector. Since day one, God charged Adam with being Eves protector. Adam protected Eve from the wrath of God. Adam passed the test. They both still paid the price for their sin. But they made the choice themselves. Eve is portrayed as incompetent, but this is not true. She was part of Adam. Adam’s sin was leaving her alone for days probably. He neglected her and that led to her being susceptible to lies and external influences. She needed Adam but Adam was careless. It’s the story of marriages. This story is relevant even in todays modern world. If more people understood this story better, marriages would survive. It even describes how marriages are broken! Neglect leads to loneliness, and that leads to searching for other voices/friends/external validation, etc. And all that leads to sin and temptation, suffering and death. Many women fall for external factors in marriages, and that always leads to chaos. Both sinned. Both failed each other. But both saved each other in the end. Eve understood that no matter what Adam had her back. They forgave each other and lived a long life and built civilizations together.

[@briantneary2248]

The past year, even though I grew up Irish Catholic, it's the first time I've gone through the bible, but seriously gone through it. One of the biggest questions I have doesn't pertain to anything in the bible, but rather about the books they left out and why. Off the top of my head, I believe they recovered a bible from Ethiopia and it contained the Book Of Enoch. What would have been the purpose to eventually deciding that should be left out? Just because the bible is the word of God doesn't mean man didn't interfere with it, deciding what words we would hear I guess that's been going on since beginning of time. Agendas can pave roads just as much as the truth can .

[@jimmybeans1175]

Don’t just assume. Do some actual research as to why some items weren’t in the Bible.

[@briantneary2248]

@@jimmybeans1175 assume? Even the most knowledge people on earth pertaining to the bible have no idea why things are the way they are. Lol

[@briantneary2248]

@@jimmybeans1175 if you did research you'd have known that.

[@kiemagen]

​@a Ain't readin all dat but we up

[@feliciadogbe1313]

That Book left out of the Bible does not take away from the Bible. You have access to the Book of Enoch. Read it? In fact, you can make your own compilation of biblical books if you want. What you must understand is the fathers who decided what believes in the regular bible did it to project, present and preserve the central theme: God (Father) creates, man destroys, God (Son; Jesus) saves, man repents, God (Holy Spirit) renews, man is immortalised. Anything that takes from this theme or clouds it, was not needed in the Bible. It is no evil agenda. It is just gatekeeping and it has not harmed anyone.

[@ywtcc]

I have a different take on Adam and Eve. It's the more obvious, vulgar interpretation. From a more practical standpoint, the social purpose of religion is to inspire its followers to engage in certain behaviors. The enforcement of marriage is one of the primary traditional roles of religion. When religion was more central in people's lives, it also served as the enforcer of law and money/debt. To me, the story of Adam and Eve, the concept of original sin, and the teaching of behaviors that result in happy (or at least bearable) marriages are inseparable. Lessons which are all much needed today.

[@kky.x]

Without Christianity the world would still be under barbaric pagan feudalism

[@jstube36]

So if Eve had no concept of right and wrong. And she was just formed, according to the tale, from a rib. How then does she know eating the apple is good or bad? And since God himself confirmed what the Serpent said would happen if the fruit was eaten. Does that mean the Serpent was telling the truth? Just something to think about.

[@elizabethbednar6338]

If you could read the story you’d know Eve knew not to eat from it because god told them not to.. me Peterson misspeaks it’s not the tree of good and evil ..it’s the tree of knowledge of good and evil…the story is about the consequences of man deciding for themself what is good and evil and also of being separated from god

[@jstube36]

@@elizabethbednar6338 But again, as the story goes, Eve has no knowledge of right and wrong. She doesn't know the difference between obedience and disobedience. She has no clue who is speaking to her through Serpent. Perhaps to her, God's warning was about the fruit being poison and the Serpent reassures that it isn't. And to her eyes the fruit was ripe to eat. And they did not die that day, as God said they would. So who was telling the truth? And deciding our own path and will is how we free ourselves from those who choose it for us.

[@elizabethbednar6338]

So god never says the fruit is poison. He says you will surely die…im not sure why I’m trying to explain this to you because it’s obvious you have never read the story..but when Adam and Eve eat the fruit they gain the knowledge of what is right and wrong what they personally think what is good and evil not what god tells them is good and evil ..but god is only one who knows what is right and wrong …and because they disobeyed God God kicks them out of the garden where they were to have a perfect life and punishes them with a life of suffering. This is to symbolize a spiritual death. When god says you will surely die he did not mean a literal death he meant a spiritual death. man is now separated from god. Adam and Eve did not have children until they were kicked out of the garden so this applies to all people born. We are all born is a state of spiritual death. That is why men are empty and not satisfied with life trying to fill this emptiness with worldly things but it is never enough. Men do not realize they feel empty because they are separated from God their father and feel empty like a child does when they are separated from their parents. This emptiness can only be fixed by reuniting with their father by accepting God in their hearts and reading the Bible to find out what is good and evil not to decide for themselves.

[@theeternalsbeliever1779]

Satan was not telling the truth. He made it seem as if God was purposefully trying to deny them wisdom, and the reality is that God gave the command to protect them from destroying themselves by operating according to their own reasoning. That's why He offered them the tree of life. If they had chose to eat from the tree of life instead, they would have ironically gained the kind of knowledge that they coveted.

[@jstube36]

@@theeternalsbeliever1779 The identity of that voice of the Serpent is not as concrete as we might think. It's only assumed it was that of the one called Satan. Even so. Their eyes were opened, knowing good from evil, and they did not die that day as God warned them. And what the voice of the Serpent said was actually confirmed by God himself. God even repeated the Serpent just before kicking Adam and Eve from the Garden. And Eve, not knowing who is talking to her, saw the logic in eating the fruit. And what did she know of death as to fear it?

[@johnmckay5903]

Robin d Bullock explained this to me. To make a sacrifice to God it must be the best of you. Your work or production. The book by Dr Joseph Murphy, the power of your subconscious mind. Fixed ptsd in me and opened my conciousness to my surroundings and the discernment of good and evil. All right brain stuff.

[@TravisMack358]

Jesus saves!

[@Richard-pd7rp]

At Walmart

[@ChristianOrtiz-bv9oz]

It’s so interesting to think that what separates us as a species from other animals is that we stand upright and have our genitalia exposed and vulnerable. This to me seems like the answer to God’s question, “Who told you that you were naked?”. This is what propelled our species to being the most sophisticated.

[@JA-ru3il]

No, it's when we were poisoned into thinking we HAD to be sophisticated. All everyone talks about is advancement and evolution but they fail to realize that the point of living a Godly life is to live a simple life with a small footprint on the world. You don't have to make an impact, or you don't have to be special. That's what makes men kill, and steal, and do things they otherwise wouldn't do had they not believed what they did.

[@patriotfivefivesix6863]

I would like to hear your take on Sabbath Jordan. I have found it very important in my relationship with God. I would like to hear what you think about the Sabbath.

[@hamdoolam]

He speaks about it in his books. About how the nature of the hero is like similar to Harry Potter. How to be the best hero He would need to break necessary rules, (like, the reason Jesus' culture wanted to get rid of him) so as to keep the dogma of the religion from being static and oppressive.. like when they were gonna stone the woman, and Jesus said "whichever one of you is without sin cast the first stone".. well in the old testament they'd just do it. Jesus makes the rules change (like the Sabbath situations) to be for the greater good. Also Jordan and Johnathan Pagaeu speak about necessary ritual and dogma. And id say picking a holy day is ritual. So look those 2 up together.

[@patriotfivefivesix6863]

@hamdoolam VEVO the Lord hallowed the day before sin entered the world and Jesus even rested on the Sabbath even in life and death. Isaiah speaks of Sabbath after the 2nd coming. Christ even speaks of praying for rest on the Sabbath after his death during the destruction of Isreal in 73 AD. The Sabbath is more than ritual. It is a covenant and a sign, made Holy for Man before, during and after Sin. It is so much deeper than ritual.

[@butterflywatching34]

Omgosh I always thought. That Keanu and Abel at te last moment didn’t kill

[@lucasalexandre7231]

The sabbath points to the seventh millennium, which is Christ's kingdom, where there will be rest. God is working for 6000 years (6 days), and then he will rest 1000 years (sabbath). And after this this eternity will come (the eighth day).

[@lucasalexandre7231]

Also, Noah means REST, after the flood happened there was rest. The same will happen in the future, after the great tribulation there will be rest (the rest/sabbath of God).

[@rusdbkk]

When they ate the fruit, it was the FEAR came into life: to know that we can sin anytime against God when the knowledge of right and wrong was then no longer guided by God's law but also the fear itself interferes. And to make it worse: God added punishments by throwing them outside the Garden so that now human must learn to control the FEAR. Only by following Jesus Christ, we are not bound by the fear anymore and truly guided by the law as it was in the beginning 🙏🙏

[@iam604]

God never guided anything because it still had the foresight of them eating the fruit prior to even making them WHICH IS WHY YOUR GOD MADE THE FRUIT IN THE FIRST PLACE! No matter how you Christians, Jews, Muslims, Mormons, Catholics, etc., spin it…it ALL COMES RIGHT BACK TO FAULT OF YOUR GOD!!

[@siphotheguy1870]

Not much of a punishment for Adam if he eats the apple and realises Eve is naked

[@basedrecordsfr]

bruhh c'mon man 🤣

[@alfredorodriguezdc]

Thats lust haha

[@andrewnoblett9510]

It’s a reflection of true power light of true wills . These little one’s coming in truly more powerful. They think they can hold back Eternity. The little ones born of light Where beyond that that came before light of our Ancestors Will in the beginning . Signals seeds

[@danielanthony8373]

Amazing insights

[@Gebri3l]

Men, we are all Adam, me, you, him whoever we all Adam. The past the present the future, Cut the serpent off, what happens? Think logically Eve is life We all breath the same air.

[@farshadmn4273]

thank you, 💯

[@sissysp8924]

We lack grace till we get the Holy Spirit that helps us find it again. Balance of good and evil within us all. The golden rule is always treat others the way you want to be treated. Unless you’re married to a narcissist. Empath ❤

[@paulavery5889]

Humans have always been both morbidly curious and creatively cruel. I've likened it to AI. Something we created in our image. So metaphorically that's why God didn't want us to know. So even though I don't believe the story literally it does make sense.

[@FLVCTVAT_NEC_MERGITVR]

It's wanting to be as great as God himself. It's an ontological impossibility. @focusontheSPRING

[@paulavery5889]

@SPRING I'm not a Christian and I certainly don't read this stuff literally. But it does sort of make sense since most of what makes us dangerous as humans is our advanced, although limited intelligence.

[@samueldavis5895]

@SPRING define becoming “wise”. Is wisdom equal to knowledge?

[@basedrecordsfr]

@SPRING does wisdom mean disobedience and rebellion? Nah, that's called satanism. Even though they don't believe in a deity, satan to them is a symbol of rebellion and "freedom". That's deceptive and ha nothing to do with any logical good morality.

[@DeimosSaturn]

The reason why the first thing Adam and Eve notice about the world is their own nudity is because the fruit made them aware of how exposed they were to the elements of nature. They were vulnerable to sun damage, cold temperatures, biting insects, and abrasions from walking through the garden of eden from branches and rocks or bramble. They felt uncomfortable because they became aware enough to experience discomfort as conscious beings. Pain, suffering, discomfort, sorrow, are an intrinsic component of the human survival mechanism. These negative emotions motivate humans to guard themselves from injury, loss, cost, and death. It hurts to put your hand in fire because the heat is damaging cells on the skin, and that can lead to an infection. You experience the pain from burning as a reinforcement to remember to avoid being burned again. Especially important in an animal who's survival was dependent on the utilization of fire to cook, make tools, and eventually smelt copper. We don't merely fear fire, we have a complex causal narrative of what must be done and not done to avoid being burned or otherwise injured. A sophisticated planning for the future, engaging in complex procedural tasks to achieve a specific outcome and avoid many other outcomes that are maladaptive or deleterious. It's not merely that Adam and Eve became conscious, but became truly aware of the experience of pain. A true objective experience of discomfort. Being either too cold or too hot. From philosophical zombies to truly sapient beings.

[@char-su9vu]

Phenomenal I'm getting so much out of this talk thank you

[@SteveSmith-kd9if]

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣YOU ARE A FOOL, BUT DON'T WORRY BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT ALONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@MrDa55555]

If you put a mirror in your dwelling, you will know what a fool looks like. @@SteveSmith-kd9if

[@renesoucy3444]

No, from expressing the Grace of God to coveting It. It is not so evident to not covet the Glory of the Lord, I know… I saw It! Even an Archangel fell for it and He cannot do anything else anymore… that’s why so many men fell frantically into that thirst forgetting how easier it is to give It back saying: Beni soit-Tu Père Éternel! and then the Glory explodes!

[@kitcat....]

I love this man 💕

[@scillyautomatic]

Very wise. Very wise.

[@kitcat....]

@SPRING copy and paste much

[@donnafraenkel7852]

I worked out that electrical energy is portrayed as a snake. It's the movement at least. Moses and the copper snake,electro culture gardening. All energy has a picture and the black sun is a picture of magnetic occurances. People can get into states, and coming near someone who is magnetic+female energy) is going to attract you and you can feel it if you are sentitive enough

[@donnafraenkel7852]

If your electrical energy is unbalanced, you can suffer strokes and anger increases electrical. Being a electrical magnetic body,we should recognise both

[@donnafraenkel7852]

Masculine energy electrical feminine energy is magnetic

[@SeanAtlasWalsh]

You are a legend. Much respect ! Maps of meaning

[@cm9660]

This is even a better, practical explanation for the question.

[@schmetterling4477]

It's also a trivially wrong explanation. ;-)

[@erniegarland5689]

Cain's sacrifice was of something he produced; fruit and vegetables he grew in his garden. Abel's sacrifice was an animal. Something he didn't produce.

[@ThyVincent]

That's interesting. Is there meaning behind this? Is there virtue in the act of ending the life of an animal, as in facing the reality that you must kill in order to live, whereas sacrificing homegrown produce meaning that you are still in denial with the proper cycle of life?

[@ReasonAboveEverything]

Fruits and veggies are not as expensive or valuable as a sheep.

[@erniegarland5689]

@@ThyVincent The meaning is in the purity of the sacrifice. When God told Moses to build an alter he was told not to dress the stones because by altering the natural state of the stones they would be defiled. Cain's sacrifice came from his own labor. Work is part of the curse, so his sacrifice was defiled. Abel's sacrifice was pure because he did nothing to create the animal used in the sacrifice.

[@ianbuick8946]

@@ThyVincent "For the life of a creature is in the blood, and I have given it to you to make atonement for yourselves on the altar; it is the blood that makes atonement for one's life." Leviticus 17:11. Cain was arrogant, he thought he can atone for his sins his way instead of God's way. First animal blood sacrifice was when God clothed Adam and Eve.

[@T4nkcommander]

This is an interesting thread. The heart posture is what is important. There are too many examples in both the OT and NT to list, but even without them it is pretty well established commentary that Cain's offering was not of the proper heart posture. Read the verse. Abel's offered his best firstfruits - Cain did not. That's the difference.

[@petersisler1398]

"Let us make man in our image." So, already we are aware, since as Hebrew text shows we each have 'faces' so we can mentally look at ourselves. What disobedience gave us was knowledge of sin.

[@scillyautomatic]

It's almost like the entire bible has a theme running all the way through it. 🤔 Hmm. Curious. 🧐🤔

[@jessesdomain444]

​@KLJFcallmeexcept we didn't become wise...we became destructive and self serving

[@echo2u]

everything that leans down to water to drink it we'll see its reflection and have that conversation. in the mind. Self-Consciousness

[@ajacob12]

Jordan Peterson is an intellectual. Do not confuse him with someone who actually marvels in the supremacy of Christ and the need for continual repentance through God's sovereign mercy and grace.

[@dmak07_11]

Dr. Peterson, I'm a huge fan and completely support you... I just don't believe we are animals, in any way.

[@sh.lslate3517]

This is untrue. They were not unconscious. They were meta-conscious. After they ate, they fell to a lower level of consciousness: our currently perceived consciousness. There was no concept of nudity or vulnerabilities in their meta-conscious state. Understand this well.

[@Jaymastia]

This is interesting. What do you mean by meta consciousness

[@defaultYTchannel]

I agree. I think that in heaven everyone is selfless and giving - so there is no nudity. I personally believe there is still individuality in heaven as love has to provide free will. But everyone acts in a selfless manner. Peterson is too confident on this one and I believe doesn’t have it right

[@jazznotes3802]

@@defaultYTchannelIndeed. They were conscious when God told the not to eat from the tree and then they made a conscious decision to eat from that tree. Disobeying God and letting sin in.

[@silverback7783]

Bible in epistles says Love and Grace overcome sin or weakness or fear if you call fear weakness similar words... also says what is not done in faith is sin if you dont have complete faith what you are attempting to do or say to the other is Love motivated, then as epsitles say over and over Christians are called to love, that is our calling through Christ to love one another, as ourselves, very simple maybe why people mostly don't try it, life as a lie is is deceptive and easier to just fall into then to alwaysbe thinkinghow can I improve my love to God and others... also a life without self reflection is pointless as philosophers say, anyway just how I've come to think things through....

[@phantomasuras]

This is not getting too may views, what's wrong?

[@itzjosue3821]

KZbin doing its dirty work

[@FlurryJoe]

lol. Have you seen the state of America? People are Godless today.

[@effdonahue6595]

Probably a lot of people don’t believe or care about the Bible I would imagine 🧐

[@99range92def]

@@effdonahue6595 You mean the best selling book in the world?, unlikely.

[@effdonahue6595]

@@99range92def no, I meant MacBeth bahaha! 🤓🙃

[@LoftenCARGILL-gk4ig]

Three trees were mentioned only 1 was not to be eaten, not can't be eaten, the only 1 that made you grow up. Eden is Childhood. 4

[@db9062]

This is a story describing sexual self consciousness. It’s the Oedipal period of first exposure to sexual awakening and attraction to the opposite sex parent and being shamed and humiliated for it after being seduced as a child by it. It’s parental entrapment that doesn’t respect the developmental boundary of the child with maturity and healthy cultivation and the guilt it instills causes the child to lose their innocence and shut down their heart. This is the biggest influencing factor in the development of our personalities that later needs healing to open our hearts again leading to meaning and health and life for the body. Jordan Peterson is good but he’d be a lot better if he’d synthesize his study and teaching of scripture into the living reality of what people experience through their bodies. It’s all related. Especially this story of “original sin”. It should really be called “original repression” as it’s all about denial of feeling as a child that will haunt us all our lives unless we reconnect our bodies into a loving union with our souls.

[@blackdynamite4858]

Bro this is amazing. I will think about this. Thanks

[@gameguy8101]

The story of Adam and Eve is about much more than any one thing, that is part of the beauty of it. And this is certainly one view of it. There is much to be said about the sexual nature of the story. They ate "the forbidden fruit" due to a woman's inability to resist a "serpent", they became aware of each other's nakedness, Adam's curse is to be taunted by the "serpent" forever and to work, Eve's curse is painful child birth and becoming reliant on the Man. You aren't wrong, but there are many ways to view many of the biblical stories, this is part of the reason they are so profound. Don't get prideful by discounting the role pride plays in this story. A story about a chapter long describes: How the most fundamental mistake Man can make is to claim to be as knowing as God, in other words pride is the fundamental sin, and the temptation of "knowing everything" leads to suffering Moral relativism is against God The futility of hiding from God Sexual temptation and shame The ability of women to seduce men into making decisions they know are wrong The nature of temptation The nature of vulnerability and the ability to hurt others The nature of Man to blame others for their own errors and avoid responsibility There is a reason this is the oldest story we have. It's stood the test of time because it is brilliantly crafted and true. Just because someone described an alternative reading of the story than you know does not mean they are wrong.

[@embodiedchristianspirituality]

@@gameguy8101 The implicit message of the Gospel is about overcoming the emotional abandonment of childhood from sinful parenting and healing our body-minds and nervous system into a state of secure attachment with God our Father. Not including the body in the narrative of the reading the Bible and it's stories that span the entire human spectrum of emotional experiences, misses the point and isn't the most effective way to really understand what God is up to with the desire to make our bodies His personal home by reconnecting us the life and joy of our inner child in Christ.

[@fireflythe2nd513]

and how exactly do you reconnect

[@KivuPaterson-h3s]

I was good up until 16-17. I look back and its as jordan describes i was completly unaware of the vunerabilties of others only my own. As if i hadnt eaten from the tree. lsd was the apple. It showed my intense vunerabilty and also of others for first time. I noticed how . 6 years later i have reached a place where i dont belong and dont realise hwo i got here. The darnkess the badness i thought everyone had i no longer see value in it. The good i always was that i never shared due to everyone being egos and seeming ready o attack vunerabilties, argue , shout et.. i was alwyas at peace and never understood why others why arguing. It took me to get to a place of badness where i realsie this type of confidence is rotten, its seductive, feels good, relaxed but you are not you. Its a place of madness i place we all have inside but we have to choose to be good or bad. Im at a point where i now am being that good person i always was im started to see the badness and darkness in others how they argue shout, talk about things and put eachother down. I am at peace and will not bend over i will love my ogodness no matter how diffrent it may seem from the world. I am good and will not hide thinking im different and not powerful. My goodness will be shown shared and held proudly for i am deeply sorrry i thought i needed to be capable of badness. Perhaps i needed it to really understand the value of my goodness. i do wish i understood it wihtout having to experience the seductive cofndience of being bad.

[@schmetterling4477]

Absolutely nobody in Genesis 3 is bad. Genesis 3 talks about two perfectly normal children growing up to become perfectly healthy adults. YOUR drug use is NOT what the story is about.

[@MrMan-jf8yi]

If suffering is a bad thing and God is good, why, before the creation of the world, did He determine to suffer and sacrifice Himself for mankind?

[@Christful]

Suffering itself it not bad at all, suffering is the response to the bad that occurred, God knew humans would eventually misuse the good gift of free will and he had a way to be good and deal with the bad, causing God to suffer. Everything God does is good, if god suffered then suffering is Good.

[@Christful]

In fact longsuffering is one of the gifts of the Spirit God gives us.

[@MrMan-jf8yi]

The statement about being unconscious and then becoming conscious is not a good one. Adam and Eve must have had a sense of self awareness before eating the fruit otherwise how would they know that they needed knowledge. Do not take Dr. Peterson as any biblical authority.

[@artifacthunter1472]

You can’t fall from Grace, Grace is unmerited favor! God did not say if you eat of the tree he said when you eat of the tree! If God never brought us into evil he could never pull us out! We would’ve never known how good God was because we would’ve never known evil!

[@vangoghsear8657]

I’ll always miss this era of Peterson.

[@nupraptorthementalist3306]

I heard something yesterday like "man used not to search for nature when he was nature".

[@derrickjamesfoxtrot1770]

The difference between Caine and Abels' sacrifice is that Abel brought his offering from the firstlings of his flock, and Caine brought any old fruit from the ground. It probably wasn't even something he grew. God sees the heart attitude and what is presented, and Caine did not do it with a good heart attitude. Basically, he is a foreshadow of how the pharisees were in Jesus' day, just fulfilling a legalistic obligation without the heart attached.

[@whatismyname5151]

Can anyone find the full speech this is from? I would like to hear the rest.

[@LuisRios-pw4ig]

It is a waste of time.

[@BannerofYah]

God rejected the offering of Cain because it was not from the very best of his grain. Note The offering of Abel is described as , ( the firstlings of his flock and the fat thereof. ) Meaning the best animal he had in his entire flock. Sometime it is not about what God says, but what he does not say. Over the years I have asked God many questions. A lot of the times I got an answer. The times I did not get an answer was because I already knew the answer. Peace!

[@byronkerby6897]

When we attempt to explain something that we ourselves do not fully understand, we turn it into a fairytale. I prefer to learn from biblical commentaries written by Ph.D theologians who have spent a lifetime studying scripture and learning Greek, Hebrew, and Latin in order to gain a better understanding from the original languages. This is a lifetime endeavor that helps the average person like me.

[@ycl4358]

What Cain and Abel offered in their sacrifices have teachings behind but are not what caused God to be pleased or displeased. It is what Cain is in spirit. Liken to firstborn Ismail, Esau, Manasseh. Reason this; before Esau was born, He hated Esau.

[@nanuk5243]

I was not convinced with the story of, Tree of fruits. I like the story, Tree of knowledge. When basic knowledge of humanity will be hidden by us, then the tree of knowledge will be expand which is not very good. When basic knowledge of humanity will be open then there is no requarment to expand the tree of knowledge too much.

[@GregFessia]

Fall of Adam and Eve In the Garden of Eden, God commanded, “Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat, but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it, nevertheless, thou mayest choose for thyself, for it is given unto thee; but remember that I forbid it, for in the day thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die” (Moses 3:16-17). Because Adam and Eve transgressed this command and partook of the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, they were cast out from the presence of the Lord (see Doctrine and Covenants 29:40-41). In other words, they experienced spiritual death. They also became mortal-subject to physical death. This spiritual and physical death is called the Fall. Our Fallen Condition As descendants of Adam and Eve, we inherit a fallen condition during mortality (see Alma 42:5-9, 14). We are separated from the presence of the Lord and subject to physical death. We are also placed in a state of opposition, in which we are tested by the difficulties of life and the temptations of the adversary (see 2 Nephi 2:11-14; Doctrine and Covenants 29:39; Moses 6:48-49). In this fallen condition, we have a conflict within us. We are spirit children of God, with the potential to be “partakers of the divine nature” (2 Peter 1:4). However, “we are unworthy before [God]; because of the fall our natures have become evil continually” (Ether 3:2). We need to strive continually to overcome unrighteous passions and desires. Repeating the words of an angel, King Benjamin said, “The natural man is an enemy to God, and has been from the fall of Adam.” King Benjamin warned that in this natural, or fallen, state, each person will be an enemy to God forever “unless he yields to the enticings of the Holy Spirit, and putteth off the natural man and becometh a saint through the atonement of Christ the Lord, and becometh as a child, submissive, meek, humble, patient, full of love, willing to submit to all things which the Lord seeth fit to inflict upon him, even as a child doth submit to his father” (Mosiah 3:19). Benefits of the Fall The Fall is an integral part of Heavenly Father’s plan of salvation (see 2 Nephi 2:15-16; 9:6). It has a twofold direction-downward yet forward. In addition to introducing physical and spiritual death, it gave us the opportunity to be born on the earth and to learn and progress. Through our righteous exercise of agency and our sincere repentance when we sin, we can come unto Christ and, through His Atonement, prepare to receive the gift of eternal life. The prophet Lehi taught: “If Adam had not transgressed he would not have fallen, but he would have remained in the garden of Eden. And all things which were created must have remained in the same state in which they were after they were created; and they must have remained forever, and had no end. “And [Adam and Eve] would have had no children; wherefore they would have remained in a state of innocence, having no joy, for they knew no misery; doing no good, for they knew no sin. “But behold, all things have been done in the wisdom of him who knoweth all things. “Adam fell that men might be; and men are, that they might have joy. “And the Messiah cometh in the fulness of time, that he may redeem the children of men from the fall” (2 Nephi 2:22-26; see also 2 Nephi 2:19-21, 27). Adam and Eve expressed their gratitude for the blessings that came as a result of the Fall: “Adam blessed God and was filled, and began to prophesy concerning all the families of the earth, saying: Blessed be the name of God, for because of my transgression my eyes are opened, and in this life I shall have joy, and again in the flesh I shall see God. “And Eve, his wife, heard all these things and was glad, saying: Were it not for our transgression we never should have had seed, and never should have known good and evil, and the joy of our redemption, and the eternal life which God giveth unto all the obedient” (Moses 5:10-11). Redemption from the Fall Because of our fallen, mortal nature and our individual sins, our only hope is in Jesus Christ and the plan of redemption. Through the Atonement of Jesus Christ, everyone will be redeemed from the effects of the Fall. We will be resurrected, and we will be brought back into the presence of the Lord to be judged (see 2 Nephi 2:5-10; Alma 11:42-45; Helaman 14:15-17). In addition to redeeming us from the universal effects of the Fall, the Savior can redeem us from our own sins. In our fallen state, we sin and distance ourselves from the Lord, bringing spiritual death upon ourselves. As the Apostle Paul said, “All have sinned, and come short of the glory of God” (Romans 3:23). If we remain in our sins, we cannot dwell in the presence of God, for “no unclean thing can dwell … in his presence” (Moses 6:57). Thankfully, the Atonement “bringeth to pass the condition of repentance” (Helaman 14:18), making it possible for us to receive forgiveness for our sins and dwell in the presence of God forever. Alma taught, “There was a space granted unto man in which he might repent; therefore this life became a probationary state; a time to prepare to meet God; a time to prepare for that endless state which has been spoken of by us, which is after the resurrection of the dead” (Alma 12:24). Gratitude for the Savior’s Atoning Sacrifice Just as we do not really desire food until we are hungry, we will not fully desire eternal salvation until we recognize our need for the Savior. This recognition comes as we grow in our understanding of the Fall. As the prophet Lehi taught, “All mankind were in a lost and in a fallen state, and ever would be save they should rely on this Redeemer” (1 Nephi 10:6).

[@GregFessia]

@focusontheSPRING Plan of Salvation Before we were born on earth, we lived with our Heavenly Parents as Their spirit children (see Doctrine and Covenants 138:55-56). At a council with all of His children, Heavenly Father presented a plan, known as the “plan of salvation” or “the great plan of happiness” (Alma 42:5, 8). The plan includes all the laws and ordinances of the gospel necessary to gain eternal life, “the greatest of all the gifts of God” (Doctrine and Covenants 6:13). Sadly, one-third of Heavenly Father’s spirit children did not accept the plan. They chose to follow Lucifer, who became the devil, and were cast out of the presence of God (see Revelation 12:7-9). We are on earth because we chose to follow Heavenly Father’s plan. One significant purpose of mortality is to gain a physical body. On earth we can have joy and peace, but we will also face temptation, opposition, and adversity and experience trials. Earthly trials are part of mortality and can help us grow to be more like our Heavenly Father. Essential to the plan is the Atonement of Jesus Christ. Jesus overcame spiritual and physical death and took upon Himself our afflictions, sorrows, and sins (see Alma 7:11-13). This suffering, death, and Resurrection is referred to as the Atonement. The Atonement was necessary since “no unclean thing can dwell with God” (1 Nephi 10:21). It is through Christ’s sacrifice that we can repent and live with God again. Also essential to God’s plan is agency, or the ability to choose. When we choose to repent of our sins, we choose to accept the gift of the Atonement of Jesus Christ. If we exercise our agency to keep the commandments, we have the blessing of participating in sacred ordinances, which are ceremonies that include making covenants or promises with God. These ordinances include baptism, confirmation, priesthood ordination for men, and temple ordinances. Part of our Heavenly Father’s plan is that someday we will all die. Death is the separation of the spirit and the physical body. Our spirit, which existed in the premortal life, will live on after our death. If we lived righteously-repenting as needed-to the end of our mortal life, we will enter spirit paradise. The Book of Mormon prophet Alma described this as “a state of rest, a state of peace” (Alma 40:12). Because of Christ’s Atonement, all of God’s children will be resurrected and our bodies and spirits will be reunited (see 1 Corinthians 15:20-22; Doctrine and Covenants 88:14-17). Resurrection will be followed by the Final Judgment, where God will judge us according to our desires and our obedience to the commandments (see 2 Nephi 9:15-17; Doctrine and Covenants 137:9). If we have qualified through repentance, we will be able to live forever with our loving Heavenly Parents (see Alma 40; 41; Doctrine and Covenants 76).

[@ujbecker]

The intersting part is also that man and woman and now - through technology and science - fir the first time in history have elevated themselves above the curse: the earth can be worked by mashine and computers and woman can give birth without pain...

[@andreasemmoglou8322]

In the story of Kain and Abel there is a difference of quality to the sacrifices. Abel was sacrificing the best and most productive animals and to contrary Kain was sacrificing the rotten and useless ones.

[@WarriorBride723]

Adam and Eve were sinless and that state was how God wanted us to be. The naked version was just reality without LUST...and when they ate the apple being disobedient the evil spirit of pride entered them changing their perspectives by thoughts, feelings and changed their reality. It was the tree of knowledge as GOD doesnt want them to seek their own wills and their own knowledge....He wanted them to abide with him so that he can give them all they need.... Pride is the original sin for this reason and something we are all born into...only divine humiliation can free us and break our pride to reconnect us with our creator....baptism is only a step!

[@john-paulgies4313]

This is an example of an insightful and wise meditation on Sacred Scripture with an eminently practical and truthful moral. That misses the main point of the story. And so, nonetheless for the aforementioned excellence, is rife with error and inversion of the full truth. What a muddle. What a paradox.

[@roccocarlino067]

The Book of Genesis uses metaphor in depicting Adam and Eve, the first human couple committing the first act of sin, known as original sin. However, it was their shift in consciousness which led to their fall. The true "original sin" was not simply disobedience or a specific act, but rather a fundamental shift in awareness-from a pure state of purity and self-realisation (soul consciousness) to a divided state of duality and physical identification (body consciousness). The act of identifying as male and female-focusing on the physical differences rather than spiritual sameness-represents the birth of ego. This ego, or self-illusion, is seen as the primary source of suffering and separation. The awareness of nakedness and the subsequent feeling of shame in the story symbolise the loss of innocence and the onset of body-consciousness. The story is depicting the departure of, soul consciousness to body consciousness.

[@dontmindmygrammar5121]

Conscious and difference between good and evil - 1. listen and obeying God 1. Listen and not obeying God Why it called evil or sin when you don't listened to god cause you don't know what come and happen next It will hurt you and also god

[@johnfisher247]

The point of making a sacrifice or offering to God is it has to be the best...not blemished so you don't care about its loss, you don't have it afterwards, God is the creator so he owns everything...you return what is His to Him with thanks and gratefulness. In doing this you recognise and articulate your proper relationship to God. God knows you see reality and you live in the light of this reality. You are dependant on God and... your own effort to live in the knowlege and reality of this bears fruit in all dimensions. You have the knowledge like God of good and evil. You offer sacrifice in expiation of the evil you do as well as thanks for the good. You must choose wisley which is chosing the objective good...do not choose evil...it is chaos and a rejection of reality and the good.

[@martanieradka4675]

It wasn’t from unconscious to conscious, but from a state of grace to a state of death by not keeping evil as an option only

[@schmetterling4477]

Did you forget your own childhood, already? Is your brain that limited that you can't compare what happened to you to what happens to Adam and Eve in the story? You were never in a state of grace. You were simply in a state of dependence. You depended on your parents providing for you. Then you grew up and you could provide for yourself. Well, at least I hope you can... because you aren't even smart enough to notice that the Adam and Eve story is a simple description of young children becoming teenagers and then adults who work the field to provide for their own families... that are being created by women giving birth. Does it click now? ;-)

[@fan-tastic2803]

Denying the truth is the same as denying a lie…

[@kyledevane8782]

It's a metaphorical concept that because we have the capability to accept or reject evil doings, by admission we suffer a punishing life as a consequence; that pain is then projected onto others as we look onto others in comparison to those who refused evil's invitation. They represent what life could have been like. The fallen one (Able) expresses to God his pain from his ignorance and deception with contentious murder. Hurt people hurting people.

[@davechang2949]

So would it have been better for us if we did not know good and evil and not ever be able to really define what we really are ,truly good or bad with a free will to choose and love as we experience the reality?

[@bishrn]

I'll try to also present a view of the story from the Quran (please read the references with context, aka few verses before and after): Adam & Eve did not exist before they were created. Demons did. They were the predecessors. That is why when Allah announced to the angels that He would put man on earth as his "heir of earth" they wondered why, questioning that man would only bring destruction (2:30). ((For a beautiful explanation listen to: Jeffrey Lang - The purpose of Life)). As you see man was originally created with the plan and purpose of being sent to earth, not as a consequence of the tree incident. When man was created he was ranked as the best creation (95:4), and all creation was commanded to show respect to man. All obeyed except Satan who was prideful and defiant (he was a demon who wanted to be the best by acting like an angel 18:50, this led him to being prideful, which led to his downfall), as opposed to the angels who simply asked why (moral: pondering is permitted, defiance and pride are from Satan)(2:34, 7:11, 17:61, 18:50, 20:116). This caused Allah to cast him out of the upper heavens. Here Satan vowed to sway mankind and misguide them away from the path of Allah (7:12-27, 38:71+). This whole incident occurred before man was conscious, which is why Adam and Eve didn't know that Satan was an outcast, and that he would lie to them (ignorance caused them to disobey, which is why we are commanded to seek the truth and cross-reference the words of the untrustworthy 49:6). Then Adam and Eve were given accomodation in the heaven and told to avoid a tree. (Notice that, as opposed to the bible, no death was promised, only being injust to oneself as a consequence 2:35, 7:19). This phase (in heaven with the tree) was for awaiting the first time "free choice" and "disobedience towards God" would be enforced. This would be the sign that man was ready to start his mission on earth. This incident also came to teach us how to behave when we make mistakes. Adam (and Eve) repent after slipping up and ask God for forgiveness and they were forgiven, as opposed to Satan who insists on sinning. So when we make a choice, we either follow Adam (and repent) or Satan (and insist) afterwards. (2:37-39). When they ate from the tree they just became aware of their genitalia and its function. They were overcome with shame. God gave us the clothes to be modest (7:26)(sadly that isn't generally followed nowadays). As opposed to bible teachings, Satan deceived Adam AND Eve (not only Eve) by saying "you will become angels or immortals" (not like gods, or knowledge)(7:20). In conclusion, life on earth was planned before our creation, to test each one of us through different situations, to see who will follow the path of God, and who will follow Satan. Those who sin and repent, follow the right path, the one Adam (the first prophet) followed. (3:15-136, 66:8). Those who sin and insist on their disobedience are following the teachings and whispers of Satan/Iblis. (2:206). Salvation has clearly been defined in the Quran. If we follow it, it will lead us to paradise. If we don't, then we CHOOSE hellfire. I made a real effort to provide references to each statement so you could read them. I'd appreciate you doing that. I find Islam's version more just and way less complicated. Anyway, I sadly still think God saying eating from the tree would make them die in the bible seems more like a lie. While Satan claiming it would give them knowledge seems truthful. I'll explain why logically: let's look at the verse and dissect it. Genesis 2:16 : "And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, “Of every tree of the garden you may freely eat; 17 but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die.” 16 says God commanded THE MAN. It specifies Adam, not Eve. So she probably didn't know directly (one would assume Adam told her later depending on her answer to the serpent, but for some reason the bible verse specifies the command came directly only to the man. 22 shows us that Eve wasn't even created when this command was given). 17 it specifically says IN THE DAY THAT YOU EAT OF IT. This would lead to anyone looking specifically at the wording of the verse, to understand that in this same day the person SHOULD die, if God is telling the truth. And God doesn't lie. As opposed to Satan. Now in Gen 3:3 the woman goes further by saying: "but of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God has said, ‘You shall not eat it, nor shall you touch it, lest you die.’ ” Yet she touched it AND ATE from it, and also WHILE TOUCHING IT gave it to Adam who ate. This all seems to oppose the words of God in the previous verses (to man directly or which she quoted to the serpent). Moreover 3:8 saying the HEAR THE SOUND OF GOD WALKING is unimaginable to me. It makes God sound like Zeus. As a Muslim who believes God is incomparable to anything we can imagine it's simply not possible. Now 3:22 speaks along the lines of what the serpent/Satan claimed with God's admission: 22 Then the LORD God said, “Behold, the man has become like one of Us, to know good and evil. And now, lest he put out his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever” So that's my logical explanation. God bless you and peace be upon you.

[@Healingfromnarcs]

God called Adam to work before the fall. After the fall work became more difficult because the ground was now cursed, but work was before the fall.

[@kky.x]

They never had to work before the fall

[@Healingfromnarcs]

@@kky.x Then the Lord God took the man and put him into the garden of Eden to cultivate it and keep it. - Genesis 2:15

[@Healingfromnarcs]

@@kky.x cultivate = work

[@kky.x]

@@Healingfromnarcs It must not have been that much work then

[@coldmillreport1677]

@@Healingfromnarcs cattle cultivates…….not exactly work…….it’s just eating

[@ricka1925]

Anyone know where I can get this full speech?

[@lesliecrawford1336]

Don’t waste your time bc he’s a false teacher. Apple is not even mentioned in the Bible. It’s written clearly that Eve had sex with Satan in the garden. He beguiled her. He holy seduced her and Adam took part in it. They were not under the dispensation of grace but the law.