Al-Ghazali's "The Incoherence of the Philosophers" - Abdal Hakim Murad

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[@sajids2]

Most engaging

[@haledhajdari1154]

Excellent and very helpful as always ! While a don't go around doing takfeer and I certainly appreciate the minds and achievements of those philosophers, their idea of supremacy of the philosophy over Revelation had to be dealt with. And it was done through a debate. It had to be made clear what is what so young intelligent people would be guided, unlike in the West where philosophy eventually took over. But in the West also there was banning of books and inquisition which resulted in a push back eventually. In the Islamic world you can always pick up a book of the philosophers and Al Ghazali's victory did not mean doing with philosophy completely. Parts of their opus remained in use. The discussion here is on Imam Ghazali and kalam versus the philosophers. As the Shaykh said, kalam is smart and sophisticated and you can be an intelligent and educated Muslim without being a philosopher. because back in the day, if you are educated and especially involved in science you suppose to be Aristotelian. The love for philosophy in some was so huge that they did not attempt to accommodate, conform the philosophy to Revelation and they should of. Kudus to St. Tomas Aquino who although admired Averoes (ibn Rushd) so much, never the less did his effort to conform Aristotel to his religion.

[@lionelchan1601]

I highly recommend watching the Caspian Report's point of view on the same topic, in his series attempting to explain why the Muslim world was clearly the leading edge of intellectual thought, and is now so "backwards". As someone that believes in modernity and it's values, in his critique of Al Ghazali that commentator actually solidifies the case made by Shaykh Murad here.

[@John-lf3xf]

Disagree. Shirvan is not an expert in the philosophy whatsoever. Science as the replacement of human telos which has happened to the West post Renaissance will be its own demise. It is not a good thing. Science is a purely practical tool and nothing more.

[@JustinHerchel]

@@John-lf3xf yeah Shirvan has bought into the myth himself. Here's a better paper on the topic: yaqeeninstitute.org/asadullah/the-structure-of-scientific-productivity-in-islamic-civilization-orientalists-fables/

[@sigabra3274]

qenuine question bismAllah قُلْ اَعُوْذُ بِرَبِّ الْفَلَقِۙ Quran 113:1 how did they the 'ulama's of yesteryears in a Language that thay are well versed 'read' or 'understand' the Verse? from the 'Book' or did they read it as a 'foreigner? alienated from the Adab?' *** bismAllah And We have made the night and day two signs, and We erased the sign of the night and made the sign of the day visible that you may seek bounty from your Lord and may know the number of years and the account. And everything We have set out in detail. Quran 17:12 The month of Ramadhan in which was revealed the Qur'an, a guidance for the people and clear proofs of guidance and criterion. Quran 2:185 *** what were 'they' arguing about? salaam

[@swarnadeepsen9123]

What about the incoherence of incoherence?

[@furtivedolus2504]

Oh, he doesn't wanna talk about that.

[@John-lf3xf]

application of greek philosophy to islam

[@John-lf3xf]

its just aristotelian metaphysics

[@John-lf3xf]

6:20 What do you think he's talking about there?

[@John-lf3xf]

@@furtivedolus2504 6:20 genius

[@GS-pv7bh]

This video contains a subjective view of Islam in general. It has many polemical views on philosophy in Islam.

[@Cytololo]

You may resume speech once you wear a hijab

[@walid.Z]

@@Cytololo grow up

[@walid.Z]

@@Cytololo weak minded fool.

[@rafiq9991]

@@walid.Zfor telling others to follow ways of islam, hes sure a weak minded fool. Right right

[@nazeerpasha2075]

The worst calamity in Islamic History. Two heretics. ...... Al-Gahazzali (died 1111 CE) and Ibn Arbi Mohiuddin (did 1240 CE) Al-Ghazzaaly - - said: ((Abu Turaab en-Nakhshuby oneday said to one of his followers: “If you have seen Aba Yazeed” - Al-Bustaamy - he said: I'm busy with someone else, then when Abu Turaab said this phrase a lot : “If you have seen Aba Yazeed!!” the follower became angry and said: woe to you! What do I do with Aby Yazeed? I saw Allah and that sufficed me!! Abu Turab said: so I got angry and I couldn't take it, so I said: woe to you!! you take Allah for Aby Yazeed, if only you saw Aba Yazeed one time that would have been better for you than seeing Allah seventy times! He said: so that follower was shocked and he denied this saying, so he said: and how is that? He said: woe to you!! don't you see Allah at your place, so He appears to you according to your rank, and you see Aba Yazeed with Allah where He appeared to him according to his rank)) (Al-Ihyaa: 4/305). In Ehyaul Uloom vol.2 p.52 Ghazali goes on to say, Imam Hasan used to divorce four women and marry four women at the same hour. That is why the Prophet has said, “Hasan is from me” (p.55). The messenger of Allah said, “No work is dearer to Allah than remaining hungry and thirsty.” (Imam Ghazali, Kimiya-e-Saadat p.483). In Ehyaul Uloom vol.2 p.52 Ghazali goes on to say, “When a man’s organ is in erection, two thirds of his mind and two thirds of his religion have departed from him.” After finishing your meal lick the cup or plate and drink its washings. That becomes a marital gift for the hoors (p.13). Junaid Baghdadi used to say, “I need sex as much as I need food” (Ehyaul Uloom p.53). Hazrat Umar Farooq used to break his fast (not by eating or drinking), but by having sexual intercourse. During Ramadhan he used to have intercourse with three concubines before Salat-il-Isha (Ehyaul Uloom 2:52). The best prescription for good health is to marry young women (Ehyaul Uloom 2:37). Men of knowledge sleep on their right side, kings sleep on their left, and Satan sleeps with his face down (reference same, p.39). Comment. Imam Ghazali (1111 CE) His famous book is Ehyaul Uloom, which translates as "The Renaissance of All Knowledge." As we proceed, it might occur to you that the proper title should have been, "The Demise of Common Sense."

[@furtivedolus2504]

Lot of dishonesty here... Al-Gazali LITERALLY said that fire doesn't burn things; Allah does. That is pants-on-head idiocy.

[@John-lf3xf]

in a metaphysical sense you dumbass

[@furtivedolus2504]

@@John-lf3xf You seem angry... And, it's not metaphysical or metaphorical. That dumbass Al-Ghazali was being literal there. Islam was already a garbage religion and HE made it worse.

[@John-lf3xf]

Furtive Dolus Ah. Gotcha moron

[@miralabualjadail4206]

@@furtivedolus2504 lol "you seem angry" proceeds to attack and insult using uppercase capitals. A metaphor is a figure of speech in which a word or phrase is applied to an object or action to which it is not literally applicable. Metaphysics on the other hand, is the branch of philosophy that deals with the first principles of things, including abstract concepts such as being, knowing, identity, time, and space, of which AlGhazali is also a scholar of along with a number of sciences. You seem to be angry that the orientalist theory that Alghazili was against philosophy and scientific inquiry is not only false, but comical based on historical sources and just common logic. I advise you to read more on the topic from other sources and to read the actual book if you can comprehend its propositions, its seems many so called orientalists have failed to or maybe its just another internet Islamophobic attempt (most likely), since most western trusted sources have actually disproved this theory a long time ago stating that the downfall was mainly due to the Mongol invasion.

[@furtivedolus2504]

@@miralabualjadail4206 That's a nice little word wall you have there. Here, have one from me: Lets look at the timeline of events... Islam was doing pretty well conquering and stealing other people's land, bringing in pilfered resources. This also brought in ideas and philosophy from non-Islamic sources that caused an intellectual revolution that created the so-called Islamic golden age. Then, comes along men like Al-Ghazli, who have this most idiotic and reductive ideas about how God and the Universe must work. After his faction of thinkers managed to purge the Islamic world of the people who saw the value of the philosophers discourses, the Islamic world entered a dark age it STILL languishes in. Now, why is this? It's kinda simple. Islam is about conquest, not maintaining civilization. It NEEDED the philosophers to provide that stability. When it purged them, it became like a fire that constantly needed to be fed, or it would extinguish itself. And as we saw, when India and Europe finally stopped the Islamic conquests, the Islamic world slipped into ignorance, superstition, and inbreeding.