Starship Troopers: Sci-Fi's Endless Tug of War

[@TheAlmightyLoli]

I FORGOT TO SHILL THE SHIRTS. 😭

[@LuxiBelle]

I am safe from the shirt police this month.

[@Jacob-hx7kk]

No shekels for you this quarter!

[@MarioTGP]

BUY HIS SHIRT, I'M NOW MAKING AN EXTREME THREAT OF VIOLENCE, IF YOU DON'T BUY HIS SHIRT I'LL CALL THE COPS ON YOU, THEY'LL PLANT DRUGS IN YOUR HOUSE, GET YOU ARRESTED AND BEAT YOU IN JAIL, BUY HIS SHIRT

[@cmykrgb1469]

Now you can't send the cops to my door! Ha!

[@wisemankugelmemicus1701]

The Starship Troopers movie began life as a film called Bug Hunt on Outpost 9. By some estimates (if I recall) the script was as much as 80% complete before it was switched to a movie adaptation of Starship Troopers. The only thing that Paul Verhoeven tweaked from being to being about fascism was characters and set designs.

[@ElderScold]

Even if you pretend the book doesn't exists, the film fails as satire. At no point do we see the bugs doing anything other than killing humans. While the Terran Federation might be bombastic and clumsy propoganists, they aren't wrong. That contrasts with Robocop, where the corporation is seen as evil from the get go and the satire works perfectly.

[@shorewall]

100%. It's like rooting for the zombies in a movie unironically.

[@austincarter5691]

I think you're misunderstanding the satire argument. The movie is a movie that the humans would make and go see in the theater. The bugs are mindless and the story has plot holes because it is made by a Riefenstahl propagandizing the populace to either sign up and become a citizen with rights or accept their role as protected second class citizens.

[@Crimson522]

The Starship Troopers movie might be one of the only examples of a spiteful deliberate mistranslation of the source material that not only was actually accepted but became the most widely recognized version of the franchise. Anime localizers wish they were this good

[@misanthropicservitorofmars2116]

Even book fans like the movie cause it’s just fun.

[@distantsea]

​@@misanthropicservitorofmars2116 yeah that's a big part to remember. I don't like the idea that it changed the book to make fun of it, but that doesnt mean I don't like the movie and am unwilling to engage with the movie on it's terms.

[@bmetalfish3928]

Personally I think vertoven and his kind are idiots who think they're geniuses. There's one quote from some itallian I think who says "A core principal of facism is making your opponents too weak to be a competent threat and a present danger." As if every other society in history doesn't do that. There's a reason no one knows of his non american films.

[@Minnesota_Fatts]

A success like the ST movie would require anime localizers to have creative intent, not an agenda to soapbox at any opportunity.

[@joshuabacker2363]

@@Minnesota_Fatts Verhoeven didn't really have much creative intent. He was kind of just an idiot with some really good assistants in the art design and effects departments.

[@famalam943]

“If you paint a beautiful picture of flowers because you think it displays how ugly they are but everyone agrees the flowers are beautiful then you have failed”

[@-Zakhiel-]

Or not.

[@famalam943]

@@-Zakhiel- you sound like someone who accuses others of no media literacy

[@-Zakhiel-]

@@famalam943 Says the guy who uses a quote as an argument from authority. If a guy painting a beautiful picture of flowers thinks that these flowers or their depiction is ugly/kitsch, then it doesn't matter if people think the picture is beautiful.

[@famalam943]

@@-Zakhiel- If your work of satire only works as a work of satire if I *reflexively* buy into your world view you can’t then complain when other ppl don’t get it. And the fact is, I do get it, it just wasn’t good at making the point. What you’re trying to give is not being received. Which I refer you again to the flowers. If I hated flowers and I painted a beautiful portrait of assuming everyone would self evidently share my revulsion to them but then start whining when ppl actually think they’re pretty; well that’s you. That’s you and your ‘media literacy’

[@-Zakhiel-]

@@famalam943 I'm not whinning and I never saw Verhoeven whine about the movie. The most he complained about was how some journalists said his movie was fascist. That's not me and my "media literacy". I just don't understand how people can complain about Starship Troopers being a bad satire and sayin' that Verhoeven failed when they say that, at the same time, it's a good movie... Again, let's take your example of the artist painting a beautiful picture of flowers thinking that they are ugly. It doesn't matter if people think it's actualy a beautiful picture of flowers. For different reasons. It's a testament to how the artist made a good job on a formal level. And it can also just be what was supposed to happen. Someone makes a beautiful picture, he thinks that it is vulgar, kitsch. If people like it, it doesn't matter, people like shit anyway. Yes it's cynical but that doesn't mean the artist did a bad job. You could argue that it reinforces the concept. A lot of artists do that, they make kitsch art that they know people will think it's beautiful even if it's low art.

[@thefanwithoutaface8105]

Kind of funny how both Tolkien and Heinlen were both military Veterans and responsible for creating basically the bedrock for most modern day interpretations of their respective genres, those being Fantasy and Sci-Fi.

[@kingofhearts3185]

Makes me wonder what they would have thought of each other's works.

[@lukalovric2463]

​@@kingofhearts3185 Their works are to different to even comapre honestly

[@TheNwahDango]

@@lukalovric2463 Disney's works were very different from Tolkien's but that didn't stop him from having a lot of harsh opinions about them.

[@lukalovric2463]

@@TheNwahDango Truth

[@kingofhearts3185]

@@lukalovric2463 Not necessarily their worlds but how their stories reflect the human condition. How would Heinlein view the ring's corrupting influence and how it weighs on the heroes for example.

[@namuzed]

The book is still a favorite read of mine. People give it grief for being a vehicle for Heinlein's philosophy and call it fascist, but then seem to ignore all the clear allusions to it being a generally free liberal society outside of voting privilege's that are open to anyone to pursue if they want.

[@brandonl.1061]

I re-read it often. I find it incredibly motivating and even though they are sparse, I love the combat scenes. I've always found it odd that some people give it a lot of grief. It has a lot of aspects/ideas that I would imagine people would label progressive today. The protagonist is hispanic, the society is largely cosmopolitan, women serve throughout the military and are even the BEST pilots because of some physiological reason.

[@enclaveherewhyisntyourvide3089]

Starship Troopers is incredibly optimistic imo, only slightly less so than Star Trek.

[@g00gleisgayerthanaids56]

People who call it fascist have never read it.

[@misanthropicservitorofmars2116]

@@brandonl.1061women aren’t mobile infantry in the book.

[@chaoticiannunez2419]

Well, it was written in the 50’s. If Heinlein ever thought about female infantrymen, he probably decided not to, because it it would’ve been a tough swallow at the time.

[@LordViral2]

Power Rangers Lost Galaxy uses the Starship Troopers uniforms for the space colony soldiers, and the overarching villains are insectoid beings, even the foot soldiers they use are bugs. Just a fun fact for those who are curious.

[@AdeptusMumbles]

Loved that show as a kid.

[@kamikaze5528]

I watched both when I was a kid and those uniforms threw me for a loop on how Starship Troopers connected to Power Rangers.

[@worldcomicsreview354]

@@kamikaze5528Now I need to find mental gymnastic'd fan theories. Like how The Rock was a stealth Bond movie. It just was, the end.

[@ThelronFjord]

This funfact reminded me of the Linkara review for that, with the same funfact. Now I wanna rewatch History of Power Rangers.

[@wildghoul7485]

Aw yeah, I forgot about that. I saw Starship Troopers before Lost Galaxy. You can imagine my shock when I saw the Colony Soldiers.

[@Rolf97]

All I know is that between humanity and bugs that want to eat my face... I'll choose my own species.

[@Jedishill680]

When it's Humanity or aliens, humanity every time

[@josedorsaith5261]

Not letting bugs eat your face is literally fascism -pod dweller #3569087

[@MarioTGP]

all i know is that my species is not black

[@wisemankugelmemicus1701]

@@MarioTGPyea judging by your name, you're brown actually

[@seg162]

Okay but what if the bugs were cute

[@chaoticiannunez2419]

“The most noble fate one can endure is to place his mortal body between war’s desolation and his loved home.” -Starship Troopers.

[@MrLolguy93]

"Frankly, I find the idea of a bug that thinks offensive"

[@Noperare]

In the movie, the federation leader recognized his military failure and voluntarily stepped down. That is more accountability and respect for the people than any of democracies we have today.

[@Dangerpurple]

Let's be fair here, that's just the public television version. I can't imagine a scenario in that movie where he wasn't dressed downed, threatened, and strong armed out of his position.

[@kalashnikovdevil]

@@Dangerpurple Which is still more accountability and respect for the people than any of the democracies we have today.

[@IconOfSin24148]

@@Dangerpurple Or it could be that in a society where virtue, and accountability are paragons, that someone might genuinely think they should take account for their own failures? The human condition isn't on some default where everyone wants to hold their position at all costs. The reason we even had as a military concept a deep state needing to force a leader out was because that was a DEVIATION from the military norm throughout history. Are there careerist desk jockeys in Starship Troopers? Naturally there would have to be. But are the conditions for them to THRIVE, the ecosystem conducive to such people there? In ST, the answer is definitely NO. Also, he's the federation leader. Who the fuck is going to strong arm him and make him resign? Unless the political system portrayed suddenly has this deep state described nowhere in the book, which makes the entire society Heinlein is trying to write about just a lolrandom lie.

[@worldcomicsreview354]

Also they show the Human army when it is defeated, and even have live coverage from battlefields. Contrast this to Toothbrush-Face's Germany, WW2 Japan and even Saddam's Iraq, still claiming to be "winning" even as their capital city is being invaded / flattened.

[@hungedteddy7971]

​@@IconOfSin24148"Who the fuck is going to strong arm the Big guy". The guy who owns the weapons company making all the gear and equipment for the Soldiers and is most likely a former infantry officer The leader of the Psychics who are by themselves very dangerous to begin with. Other Generals who had power over large sections of the military. The thing about this society I find fascinating to explore is that it is still a fully functioning democracy so I can definitely see certain parts of the military having political affiliations close to their general like some units are democrats and others are big fans of Donald Trump

[@joekane5746]

Regarding Heinlien, people also casually forget that Heinlien was a Roosevelt democrat in the 30s/40s who ended up drifting more to libertarianism and why he stressed how his big three books, Starship Troopers, The Moon is a Harsh Mistress, and Stranger in a Strange Land were for understanding his perspective, all of them are basically 'liberatianism with a focus on social responsibility', most of the people who decry SST as 'muh bascism' only engaged with the setting through the movie or worse a video essay about the movie.

[@joshuabacker2363]

There's almost no libertarian parallels with Starship Troopers though. "Functional, strong, authoritarian government that actively pursues collectivist goals" is arguably its polar opposite. The first instance in which he even called himself a libertarian one was nearly a decade after publishing Starship Troopers.

[@venomrobot8940]

@@joshuabacker2363 I don't know what in the world you think Authoritarian means, but the federation is about as far from it as you can get, while still having a state.

[@joshuabacker2363]

@@venomrobot8940 How so? The Federation is a state that limits the franchise to a narrow selection of people, the selection of which it exerts *extreme* control over, and has a rather powerful military arm, and rules a society where the goal is not to have liberty, but *order.* Sure, people in it have liberties. But those liberties aren't ideologically tied to the Federation. They are products of convenience and efficiency. It's why, for example, many authoritarian states in the past (Most monarchies, for example), required by law that civilians be armed to a certain standard dependent on their personal wealth. In theory, every man having a sword or being trained in a bow, also gives the public a measure of liberty by granting them power. In practice though, these laws existed for the sake of military strength, which was integral to survival.

[@completelyferrouschemist6776]

@@joshuabacker2363Man, you really outed yourself to have not read the book, dude.

[@joshuabacker2363]

@@completelyferrouschemist6776 I own it and have read it. You clearly haven't lmao.

[@TheTurtalitarian]

A few years ago I downloaded the Starship Troopers audio book just to have something to listen at the gym. I thought I would hear something along the lines of the movie, but what I instead found is an amazing story of selfless service, personal growth, and the bonds between father and son. It is my personal favorite book and I would recommend it to anyone remotely interested.

[@enclaveherewhyisntyourvide3089]

Based gym listener? Was thinking of buying it myself to relive the book but I noticed there's actually due to be another Starship Troopers audiobook released in about 3 days (3/26/24)! I kind of like the old one too, but it's 25 years old and in my opinion audiobook quality has spiked in the last 10 years or so. I'll come back in a few days to give a review if anybody is interested.

[@TheTurtalitarian]

Yeah, there's only so many times you can listen to the same workout playlist before just going to audiobooks and podcasts. Thanks for letting me know about the new one, I had no idea! The previous narration might be a little dated but I think it still works as the book is dated as well lol.@@enclaveherewhyisntyourvide3089

[@IconOfSin24148]

Heinlein does that. Stranger In A Strange Land is another book of utter beauty, if the cover alone didn't sell you on that.

[@RogueFox2185]

“The only good bug is a dead bug!”

[@SMAXZO]

Would you like to know more?

[@Sakattack2023]

Commie* the bugs are a stand in for communism. And I agree.

[@joesmutz9287]

@@Sakattack2023 It gets better once you realize the bugs in the book are a stand-in for fascism as well They were supposed to be representative of any society where the individual is subject to the collective, be that the "masses" in the case of communism, or the "state" in the case of fascism It was all about individual responsibility standing above any kind of civic duty or social requirement

[@bgvo4373]

@@Sakattack2023no, the bugs are a stand in for another race conquered by human colonialism. That the humans dehumanize them and see them as ugly and evil. Tell me, has that happened before in history?

[@Sakattack2023]

@@bgvo4373 lol did you just totally eat everything your clown professor told you with zero critical thought. Rhetorical question, you’re too low IQ to have critical thoughts you commie clown. lol the Author himself said the bugs are a perfect communist society, unthinking and unfeeling, top down control. I understand why you’d want it to be your weirdo clown version. Because it implicates you and your filth, tantamount, to bugs. You’re gross inhuman, creatures, and you do it to yourselves.

[@THERI0NdotAI]

When you revealed Broomstick Cowboy as the opening theme for this review, I gave it a listen. Damn that's one of the few times a song alone has brought tears to my eyes.

[@ZX-Gear]

It really hurts to watch as you listen to the lyrics and then see what is going on. Paints a perfect picture.

[@mrscruffles801]

It paints a perfect picture of why hating bugs is completely justified.

[@GrassesOn97]

Helldivers 1 & 2 is closer to what Verhoeven wanted Starship Troopers the movie to be more than what the movie actually turned out as.

[@FirithPanda]

Loli did not mention Earth Defense Force, the Japanese BLATANT parody that's fun as hell.

[@dean_l33]

Now that you mention it. Yeah they do just blatantly rip off SST but I did not expect All you need is Kill to also take inspiration

[@666slateran666]

That's because he has shit taste

[@bobsmudger3979]

So much fun!! Much better on co-op 👍

[@Bloodycupcake54]

EE-DEE-EFF EE-DEE-EFF

[@paleflame]

Oh my god, the Aliens, they are just like us!

[@b3rz3rk3r9]

For the book, it was described as Heinlein's ideal government with included expected failings. The man was a Libertarian with a deep respect of the military; even serving during WW2, I believe. The government in Starship Troopers is largely based on both Choice and Service in a very Roman Republic kind of way: You choose to serve in the Terran armed forces to get citizenship, because you chose to be a citizen. And to be a citizen, you have to show you're willing to fight and risk your life for it. You can easily choose NOT to enlist as the Civilians of the Federation can still have rights without being able to vote or serve in office. Though, given Verhoeven's political views, I can see how he'd think this was Fascist. Because to Communists or Socialists, anyone that doesn't fall into line is a Fascist threat to the Greater Good. Especially since Heinlein was a Military-respecting Libertarian that was part of the Free Love moment; basically the diametric opposite of Communist or Socialist beliefs.

[@ethanhinton4549]

Not to mention that the book's characters repeatedly bash communism, and describe the bugs as being a species biologically designed for it.

[@b3rz3rk3r9]

@ethanhinton4549 Yep, Heinlein's perfect communists were a perfect Hivemind: entire swarms of beings with no say or will, bowing to a higher authority's demands specifically because that's all they can do. In fact, correct me if I'm wrong: wasn't this the first book to create - or, at least popularize the concept of a Hivemind?

[@daniellewillis2767]

You should check out Verhoevens Black Book...

[@josedorsaith5261]

​@@daniellewillis2767 Nah, I'm bored of exaggerated WW2 movies

[@ethanhinton4549]

@@b3rz3rk3r9 wasn't the very first I think, but one of them.

[@MrTwistedLizard]

As much as I enjoy Paul Verhoeven works, I can't help but chuckle at the ironic "Death of the Author" moment Starship troopers (The movie) represents for him. Just as he DotA'd the book to twist this movie into his Anti-Facist satire the viewing audience ended up twisting it back into its pro-militaristic roots. The ones he made the movie to satire ended up loving the Mobile Infantry and got hyped up by the world spreading that hype to others enjyoing it despite the satire And the ones he assumed would understand its satire the "Educated" Film critic instead lambasted his movie as the very thing he set to satire calling him a "Pro-Facist"

[@ChucksSEADnDEAD]

DotA is almost unavoidable as irony and deconstruction became a crutch, so audiences appreciate being earnest or post-ironic as a response. "Yeah, actually we love being meatheads firing automatic weapons at bugs controlled by a hive mind. There is no joke. Go Earth!"

[@mycoolhandgiveit]

@@ChucksSEADnDEAD >why yes I do want to defend humanity against giant monster bugs from outer space, how could you tell?

[@mrscruffles801]

The author: You Americans are a bunch of ravenous gun-toting meatheads Americans: And proud of it! The author: Wait no that's not how you were supposed to react! Every. Single. Time.

[@dansmith16]

@@mycoolhandgiveit And be compensated by the state to build a family like those National Social...oh...

[@tau-5794]

Tell me, why shouldn't people be given incentives to marry and have kids? Not everything the nazis did was inherently negative you know. Just saying something is bad because the wrong people did it isn't critiquing the thing itself.

[@Snow-Foot]

"Violence doesn't solve anything!" Oh yeah? How about we ask the Carthaginians how their war with Rome went? Oh, we can't because violence solved that problem.

[@andrewryan1946]

“Violence doesn’t solve anything? I wonder what the city-fathers of Carthage would say to that”

[@Mrkabrat]

To be fair, the Third Punic War was Rome looking for an excuse to destroy Carthage and get their hands on all the lucrative fertile lands

[@Snow-Foot]

​@@andrewryan1946 yeah the exact quote from the book.

[@gs4011]

It's even funnier because Rome not only destroyed Carthage, but they salted the earth around it so nobody could live there anymore. Petty as hell

[@Mrkabrat]

To be fair, the 3rd Punic War was Rome looking for any excuse to destroy Carthage and get their hands on the wealthy north african lands

[@Arcadies223]

What always surprised me was how prophetic Heinlein's view of the future was. The moral decay of western democracies. Gangs of youth committing crime without punishment. Adults that are to immature to hold authority. “The junior hoodlums who roamed their streets were symptoms of a greater sickness; their citizens (all of them counted as such) glorified their mythology of ‘rights’ . . . and lost track of their duties. No nation, so constituted, can endure.” Heinlein wrote a lot about Individuality, independence, self betterment, patriotism and duty. Plus he wrote some of the best female characters in sci-fi.

[@KissatenYoba]

Sounds like Western societies haven't advanced past Heinlein's days, huh

[@joshuabacker2363]

Y'know, the really funny thing is that the news insists on calling them "hoodlums" and "youth gangs" too, instead of addressing the real issues.

[@creed8712]

I wouldn’t exactly call those “predictions” that’s quite literally what every older generation has always thought the younger generation was. You’d be hard pressed to find any era in any culture that thought differently to the point we have written documents about how reading was corrupting the youth.

[@joshuabacker2363]

@@creed8712 Old people complaining about young people isn't new, but to pretend it's a commonality throughout history is equally dumb considering we don't see much written on the matter in the last few centuries, which are quite thoroughly documented.

[@dansmith16]

It is mentioned in My Struggle. It was foretold since ancient times about the flaws on having a Democracy, which is mob rule.

[@1234redwing]

The book is pretty different, for example the bugs are described as having plasma cannon, satellites, and cybernetic augmentations, basically the brain bugs have satellite relays installed directly into their brains so they can give commands directly to the workers

[@sgtmarcusharris4260]

Starship troopers A film about facism by a man who doesn't understand facism based on a book he didn't read that wasn't about facism

[@warcat2469]

Best summary I've ever heard lol

[@hansgerman3437]

Starship Troopers : Extermination is a fucking wild ride. The comradery of people who just love the movie is insane. At the extraction section of a mission I once got lost. The entire team charged out to get me. Shouting quotes from the movie like "Remember your training!" while they where picking me up and getting to the evac zone, while Bugs just charged in on all of us. It was beautiful.

[@bilbobagend8155]

Haven't touched that game in half a year. I just hope Helldivers hasn't killed the momentum it had. There's definitely room in the bugkilling genre for 16 player coop.

[@cloroxusthestainlessone4324]

​@bilbobagend8155 there was a patch a while back that fucked up the performance but i dont k ow if theyve fixed it yet

[@benlubbers4943]

Did you make it out?

[@hansgerman3437]

@@benlubbers4943 The entire platoon made it indeed out

[@Sorain1]

@@bilbobagend8155 I second that sentiment. There's room for both, but boy is Extermination in a rough place right now.

[@JAY_X1]

I'M DOING MY PART!

[@kamenriderfan322]

I didn’t do shit

[@jolt06]

I'm doing my part

[@xxXTakno46209Xxx]

IM DOING MY PART!!

[@speedkingoz5879]

IM DOING MY PART

[@bio_5467]

And I’m doing my part too

[@connorperrett9559]

"Noooo, the attractive, fit people selflessly sacrificing their lives in heroic combat with alien insects in service to their people are meant to make fun of you!!!!"

[@mirceazaharia2094]

Hehe, Service Guarantees Citizenship goes VROOM!

[@coolcat001100]

“I don’t get it. Where are the soyjaks?” -You, apparently

[@mordorderly1473]

It's not in service to their people, though. An illegal colony provoked a giant war with space bugs that could've been avoided if the Federation didn't escalate conflict (at least in the movie).

[@JohnSmith-j7n]

@@mordorderly1473 That has nothing to do with the soldiers themselves.

[@mordorderly1473]

@@JohnSmith-j7n It means that they're not fighting in service of their people. If you sign up for a false war continued under shady pretense, you aren't actually fighting in service of the people.

[@devilord3271]

The idea that Verhoeven got the idea that Starship Troopers was fascist from the first couple of pages is funny to me because the first couple of pages has Rico describe how diverse the mobile infantry is

[@misanthropicservitorofmars2116]

First couple pages is power armor troops blasting the skinnies. It opens in a military operation against the skinnies, it’s awesome.

[@gimzod76]

And how many religious beliefs they have.

[@joshuabacker2363]

To be fair, it doesn't mean anything. Writing down that a character is hispanic if he acts like your typical white, midwestern youth (Conveniently, the exact place Heinlein grew up and lived in!), isn't much different than fulfilling a DEI quota. It's like Elizabeth Warren calling herself a native american, nobody serious believes her.

[@Snakedude4life]

"Brain? Bugs? Frankly, I find the idea of a bug that thinks offensive!" 🎩 🐍 no step on snek! 🇺🇸🇭🇰

[@ximthedespot4673]

If they think too hard they'd hurt themselves.

[@hakai124]

I love the movie but I don't think the intended satire was even effective, society in the movie seems far more cohesive than the real world

[@dean_l33]

If you want a more culture war take, I recommend watching Arch Warhammer analysis on the SST movie and book. I would also recommend Sargon but I suspect Loli would call me a fag for that

[@SergioLeonardoCornejo]

It failed as satire because Heinlein's book is so coherent the director couldn't corrupt it and just made a simplified version of it by accident instead.

[@hakai124]

@SergioLeonardoCornejo yep, I have read the book as well, it outlines its message extremely comprehensively

[@dean_l33]

Wtf my comment got shadowbanned in a Loli video!

[@hakai124]

@@dean_l33 weird, maybe KZbin flagged it for manual review

[@kalashnikovdevil]

Not just power armor, but it was verifiably the first instance of 'cap' or 'capsule' troopers along the lines of the ODST, Space Marines and, most recently, Hell Divers. Also people can say that he hated the book all he wants, but Verhoven explicitly didn't read it. Yes you mentioned it. It's still the hill I'm going to die on.

[@IncredibleMD]

Paul Verhoeven's greatest gift as a director is making anything he's attempting to critique seem super awesome and badass.

[@NefariousKoel]

Ummm.. Does that include Showgirls? 😬

[@IncredibleMD]

@@NefariousKoel No, that was just him being horny, which is why Showgirls sucked.

[@mrscruffles801]

Like what Aman Moore did with Rorschach. Or what leftists do with Donald Trump.

[@oz_jones]

​@@mrscruffles801 Aman Moore, Alan Moore's Indian cousin

[@DSFARGEG00]

I wouldn't necessarily say that Heinlein was describing his ideal society with SST. He was quite fond of envisioning unusual future societies and having them described in borderline-polemic fashion with the narrative serving as greater or lesser stage dressing. Like, there's little comparison between the Federation in SST and Luna in The Moon is a Harsh Mistress beyond a handful of things - voluntaryism, racial egalitarianism, equality between the sexes (even recognition that there are serious duties women might be naturally better at than men, not exactly a popular notion when he wrote SST).

[@Ravewolf24]

Earlier literature often has troubling subtexts that I think are worth being aware of and discussing, but that shouldn't mean we can't enjoy them. Cancelling older genre fiction is not the answer, but having an honest discussion and acknowledging where it is coming from is just healthy and honest. All media is a product of a certain time and place. Also, the Internet just seems to have problems grasping satire.

[@shorewall]

I also think that our modern society is the children of the ideologies that won, so we see other ideologies as weird, foreign, or "bad". That doesn't mean that our modern ideologies are the only ones or even the best. And any system is only as good as the people who make it up, so we must place an emphasis on personal accountability, if we want to live in a "good" society.

[@solidsnek1776]

Holy fuck, youtube censoring my "im from Buenos Aries" quote...

[@georgelincolnrockwell6248]

🤔

[@Turahk]

lol mine is gone aswell

[@Acesahn]

The algorithm has been aggressively stifling lately... and I notice it kicks into overdrive around topics of politics or things like Starship Trooper! I tried to explain to a guy who left a comment on a post I made that 'No, the reporter questioning if the war was right wasn't the smartest man in the movie and that the bugs did diplomacy via drinking your brain' but none of my comments ever showed up!

[@TheStonewall117]

Remember: violence is the supreme authority from which all other authority derives.

[@eddoh2701]

Absolutely, people will deny it till the last breath, but "Might makes right"

[@Sakattack2023]

@@eddoh2701might doesn’t make right but right doesn’t matter when everyone except the strongest are alive.

[@georgelincolnrockwell6248]

^This, this is at the bedrock of Fascism. It isn't a celebration of the brutality of life and of nature, it is a healthy acceptance and understanding of it!

[@DM-mi4je]

​@@eddoh2701 Not right, but authority. Every law is held up by the state having the might to enforce it's will.

[@mrbigglezworth42]

@@DM-mi4jeit also understates the importance that the moment people can question or even resist that enforcement, you don’t really have a government anymore.

[@kingbash6466]

I find it funny how people give Zack Snyder shit for missing the point of Watchmen, and then at the same time, praising the Starship Troopers film for being a "critique on fascism" even though the director is like the biggest example of "missing the point" when it comes to dissecting the original book.

[@mrscruffles801]

Because one is a point they agree with, the other is not. Author's intent is a sheild they use when it's convenient and toss aside when it's inconvenient.

[@tau-5794]

Watchmen is one of the most direct and faithful adaptations of any comic- scratch that, of any novel that's been made, the alterations are exceedingly minimal and the meaning of both pieces of media are nearly identical. The only important differences are: Making Ozymandias slightly more transparently evil, but he's just as evil in the book even if Moore thinks he's the correct one. Changing the genocidal macguffin from a squid to energy blast, but that's just a stylistic alteration, it doesn't affect the story. Toning down Rorschach's less noble aspects a tiny, tiny bit, but he's still inherently the same character and the movie only exposes how based he is to a wider audience than the graphic novel.

[@mordorderly1473]

@@tau-5794 It's the presentation that makes it so different, not the specific plot details. Snyder's style lends itself to highlighting how cool something is which is at odds with the comic's tone and presentation.

[@mordorderly1473]

It's because the ways they missed the point are different. The differences in Verhoeven's depiction are intentional, even if he misunderstands the book. Snyder's adaptation is clearly intended to be faithful while it's missing the point, which makes the differences more apparent.

[@mrscruffles801]

Paul Veerhoven amd Alan Moore are perhaps the two biggest examples of why being a talented creator does not exactly make you an intelligent person.

[@DarranKern]

Robocop is based, Starship Troopers the film is still based *in spite* of veerhoven. Its a perfect example of how mindwarping WWII propaganda is. Robocop couldn’t possibly be considered left wing in the current world.

[@mrscruffles801]

@@DarranKern Robocop wouldn't cause it makes cops look like the good guys, which the left only does when it's the capitol police for some reason...

[@jackdaone6469]

So here’s the thing about Veerhoven trying to make the ST film a satire of fascism: He may have not read the book because he hated it, but the screenwriters for the film DID read the book and they loved it. It’s why, despite Veerhoven’s best efforts, his “fascistic” elements of the Federation are undercut several times by the screenwriters sneaking in Heinlein’s philosophy. The biggest example of this is the Sky Marshal scenes in the movie; after the failure of the Klendaathu assault after the declaration of war, Sky Marshal Dienes accepts responsibility for the failure and resigns, ceding his post to Sky Marshal Tahat Maru. In a fascistic dystopia, Dienes would refuse to take responsibility and likely be shot for his incompetence by the government. Instead, he’s allowed to resign and continue serving the Federation military under Tahat Maru. That’s meritocracy, not fascism.

[@joshuabacker2363]

Your point here seems completely unfounded. What policy, exactly, would have Dienes step down instead of doing the normal political routine of refusing responsibility? We have generals who did this in recent history, and still do this today, mind you.

[@jackdaone6469]

@@joshuabacker2363 It’s the fact that Dienes wasn’t just shot or imprisoned for his failure that’s my point. Under a fascist system, the dude would’ve just been executed or imprisoned after Klendaathu.

[@joshuabacker2363]

@@jackdaone6469 You didn't actually answer my question though. *Why?* What policy would have that occur?

[@jackdaone6469]

@@joshuabacker2363 It’s literally one of the most commonplace practices under fascist governments, which can observed throughout human history.

[@joshuabacker2363]

@@jackdaone6469 You're still not answering my question. What fascist policy, exactly, would have any of your unsupported assertions occur? If you can't answer my question for a third time in a row, I'm just gonna assume your real answer is "I have no idea, and I'm just making things up."

[@slamshift6927]

The irony is the 'satire' backfired so hard that it came back around to glorification

[@asumjessen2013]

ST is one of my favorite books of all time . The issue with the book is that there are people out there who will just outright make shit up about the book, trick themselves into believing that what they just made up is in the book, and then get mad that it is in the book and claim that anyone who likes the book is fascist. Starship Troopers is an example of a classic people want to have read but no one actually wants to read, which is a shame because it has led to a lot of bullshit being spread about the book from people who only watched the movie. It's frustrating as all hell. The book is a right-wing libertarian power fantasy of a multi ethic, peaceful Earth united by ideas of liberty, self determination and responsibility by an author who was rejecting an ever growing leftist and collectivist world who wanted to point out that the systems of power we have are based at their core on violence, and thus that violence must have as many checks and balances in place to protect the people. Otherwise you get nightmares of secret police and individual destruction as in Communism and Fascism. Its not a perfect book. The system of government is very open to corruption, It slows down in the latter half and not as action heavy as people would like it to be, but it at least has an interesting message that you will never see again without 1000 layers of irony on top. Shines the name, shines the name, Roger Young.

[@MemeGene6969]

Their intent of parodying facism failed since that society seemed more cohesive and transparent than ours. Anyways i am doing my part

[@Sakattack2023]

So true verhoven is so dumb he forgot to show one instance of fascism in his movie, he thinks it’s a style you shoot movies in and that’s it.

[@mrbigglezworth42]

@@Sakattack2023his directors commentary made it appear like he figured if he dressed Carl and the Intel guys as mid century Germans as being enough to call them that.

[@Sakattack2023]

@@mrbigglezworth42 lmfao. I love Robocop and Starship troopers but verhoven is a complete clown.

[@Noperare]

The leader of federation, a white guy, recognized he f*cked and voluntaraly stepped down. This alone is more accountability than any democracy we have today. But more than that, a black woman then filled his position. Add the shower scene and this shows a society of absolute racial and gender equality.

[@lutokill4784]

Its because he see the movie through Rico perspective, that is one of the most privileged people on that society The government for example is clearly making propaganda, working and kidnapping the Bugs for study way before the war started. The world SEEMS transparent but it is not, not to mention how the society is insanely militarized to the point that people join the military to have children, not to mention how incompetent the military is. Also, they are trained to kill humans, not bugs

[@oldmangimp2468]

I find all of this uproar over the book/movie hilarious. The book was controversial when it was first published, but the controversy wasn't about politics. Heinlein postulated that morality was a learned trait, not an innate state of being. To illustrate this, he compared aspects of raising a child to that of raising a puppy... ... and the crowd went wild! Popular parenting ideas of the time were to be very hands-off; to let "the inner goodness" of the child blossom and grow. Heinlein stated that if parents didn't take a hands-on approach, teaching morality and discipline, they would end up raising, in effect, a two-legged, hairless wild animal. The book Starship Troopers was about far more than politics: it was a look at the human condition.

[@itermercator114]

Fuck, that statement is exactly what I was looking for to describe hands-off parenting, genuinely cheers for that 🙂

[@rannenw6207]

Exactly it's less politics and more about the raising of Children and teaching them responsibility. Rico even says that his LT and SGT are mom and dad. I think it went something like "Jelly was mother to us and the LT was father." and this statement is very true but reserved in the modern military.

[@MrLolguy93]

*"Would you like to know more?" Intensifies* P.S. : since you did a video on Conan, can you make a video on Tarzan or his author Edgar Rice Burroughs? If Conan is Berserk's grandad, than Tarzan is Conan's grandad. What Edgar Rice Burroughs contributed to literature of various genres is incredible

[@crusader2112]

I would like to see this as well. Burroughs work John Carter of Mars, I believe went on to inspire Superman, Dune, Star Wars, and I think Star Trek.

[@MrLolguy93]

​@@crusader2112 Superman is part John Carter, part Doc Savage. Batman is part Shadow and Tarzan

[@NelsonStJames]

I would too. The OP is correct in that the contributions Burroughs has made to literature hasn’t been fully acknowledged or appreciated by current culture, but the problem is I don’t trust most reviewers now to be objective enough to handle it. I have no intention of watching or listening to some Gen X, Boomer, or Zoomer rant for 30 minutes to an hour on how racist and misogynist Burrroughs and his works are, pretty much like you see whenever most people bring up Lovecraft and are starting to do with Heinlein.

[@redman9493]

@@MrLolguy93 You forgot about The Phantom. That was a huge influence on Batman and many other superheroes as well.

[@justinbowers2749]

To show that the Federation isn’t fascist, at his graduation party, Johnny Rico asks his teacher what he should do, should he join the military? In a fascist society, the Teacher would say “join the military son it’s your duty” or “what kind of question is that?! Join the military!” But instead he says this; “Figuring things out for yourself is the only freedom anyone really has. Use that freedom. Make up your own mind, Rico.” No fascist, especially a teacher in a fascist society, would **ever say that**

[@therussiancomicbookgeek]

Handsome military chads makes space bugs go boom! *Internet Communists REEEEE!

[@kron520]

Luminous-yellow space-fiddles are peak fascism.

[@blazelightzero595]

I can't believe they finally made a movie adaptation of Helldivers 2!

[@AntiDecepticonCampaign]

Stop, just stop. Be quiet.

[@marshalmarshall2109]

reread your comment homie

[@Ralphopotamus]

Also in the book, the bugs were constantly being policed (basically being kept from expanding as much as possible). But the asteroid was the final straw that led to war. Thats why they get power armored troops with nukes dropped on them.

[@jakefrost7404]

*_I am an avid fan of lots of HFY Sci-Fi, so movie or book, I enjoy it, any political stuff is just seasoning (usually)._* *_Note: For those unfamiliar, HFY stands for "Humanity Fuck-Yeah." Would you like to know more?_*

[@dpm365]

So one thing to bear in mind with Japan and Starship Troopers is that a lot of classic pulp stories got reprinted in magazines over there. They didn't just get lazy straight to bargin bin prints either, they got illustrated prints in popular literary magazines. It's a major reason why a lot of anime and manga from the 70s and 80s feels so much like classic sci-fi and fantasy, it's what they would of been reading at the time.

[@hilotakenaka]

Broke: “the starship troopers movie is making fun of fascism because it shows the people having no thoughts and just following the military” Woke: “the starship troopers movie is making fun of fascism because the main characters are Argentinian and we all know what their ancestors did in the 1940s”

[@frankfrankerson782]

Rico is actually part philopino in the book that verhoven didn't read.

[@thematiasmadness7010]

What?

[@He-who-wakes]

​​@@renmcmanusBeyond enlightened: you think (insert minority) are bugs?

[@BrooklynRedLeg]

@@frankfrankerson782 - He's not part Filipino, he IS Filipino. He says something to his classmate out of OCS (Bernard, who is Bolivian) in Tagalog. A lot of people didn't catch this, nor the fact his Mom was visiting (not living there) Buenos Aires when it got destroyed.

[@acrab6527]

@@BrooklynRedLeg His parents were so oppressed by not being able to vote that they were billionaire corporate magnates. I'm sure they had a vacation home in Buenos Aires

[@moistmaidenlover5565]

My Part is being a Breeder. Doing my part. I'm not very good at my job

[@turkeygod6665]

bro...

[@patchmoulton5438]

I feel that. Feels bad, bro

[@IconOfSin24148]

You're gonna make it, you have to find your reason, your meaning. When you find it, babbies aplenty will follow.

[@topcat59]

Starship troopers traitor on Mars is honestly my favorite since it introduce the power armor in to the series and the narrative is also pretty good.😺

[@TheAutistWhisperer]

Good film, awful adaptation.

[@newfate26]

100% this

[@NelsonStJames]

Honestly I have no problem with good films being bad adaptations. Planet of the Apes and Bladerunner are prime examples. It can be done, and neither of those films bothers my appreciation of the source material they were derived from .

[@docdingus6961]

It would be amazing if it wasn't called Starship Troopers. Same Problem with World War Z.

[@joesmutz9287]

Probably worth pointing out that in the book the Skinnies had the opposite position to what you mentioned. They were allies to Humanity, but then betrayed the Humans to the Bugs

[@ericchung3177]

HUMANITY FIRST!

[@cmykrgb1469]

"All You Need is Kill" mentioned? Today is a good day.

[@viktorgabriel2554]

its sad how many people just dont know what Fascism actually is and if they ever return people will not actually stand up to it since everything and its grandmother has been called fascists and nazi. You are doing a really good job here pointing out a lot of facts and actually discussing them not just say fact move on

[@authentic229.14]

Anyone that sees this movie as some critique instead of an awesome movie about minecrafting evil bugs is a bug lover. They are worse than that guy from space pocahontas, because those blue aliens atleast somewhat looked human.

[@PALACIO254]

Glass pandora

[@authentic229.14]

@@PALACIO254 agreed

[@Sorain1]

The Pandorans at least were sticking to their own planet. If they'd just let humanity mine to save themselves, negotiate about it, live and let live could have happened. You can't get that with Arachnids.

[@foisopracurtir6389]

@@Sorain1 Imagine if Sully ACTUALLY did his job...

[@oz_jones]

​@@PALACIO254Sully had ONE job

[@Matheusss89]

I love how Verhoeven made some of the coolest, most badass films of all time because he wanted to make satire and ended up backfiring. He's so bad at it that he became great unintentionally.

[@joshaklese4969]

This is a good take for the most part. Well done. Individual choice is a theme that stuck with me and saved me from brain aids later in life.

[@FunnyTaco143]

I think the cartoon did a good job blending elements from the book and the movie together and if you can deal with outdated cgi a good show to watch.

[@Tosmo]

There’s a lot of videos on Starship Troopers, but this is a pretty damn good. Still pissed there were no Neo Dogs in any adaptation.

[@nobody4741]

3:31 I can see Gundam being inspired by starship troopers, hell the Visual Novel "Muv Luv alternative" is basically the author going "I am making my own starship troopers, with mechas and waifus" (its a great VN btw)

[@IconOfSin24148]

Hell yeah another Mabu Rabuer Plenty of the deep ideas also got explored, ESPECIALLY taking personal responsibility, and belief in your fellow man. Now let us all stand for the blatant ripoff/loving homage of the Klendathu Drop theme.

[@NEETKitten]

Achieve your mission with all your might Despair not until your final breath Make your death count

[@ZontarDow]

The differences between the book, animated series and movie are pretty interesting to think about, but I do think the anime OVA is the best adaptation of the book to date, and is incidentally where Rico being a white Argentinian came from most likely due to a mistake in translation.

[@jedd.0322]

I just watched this a couple days ago. Micheal Ironside is great in any movie Ive seen hum in

[@redman9493]

See you at the party, Richter!

[@GhostLink92]

The Alliance trooper uniforms in Firefly/Serenity are almost 1:1 recreations of the armor in the film. Not sure if that was intentional or what, but it's almost uncanny.

[@bestname527]

That is literally the armor used in starship troopers, many shows and movies used props from ST because of the surplus the movie left when it finished production.

[@NefariousKoel]

Yep, they were the same costumes. Cheaper to re-use what's in storage than make anew!

[@fakesmile172]

​@@bestname527 Even G-Saviour used them!

[@Metalseadraking]

I really like Earth Defense Force as a game that was inspired by Starhip Troopers. It does get the goofiness of the movies right, while also being a pro-humanity game where all of Earth bands together against a seemingly impossible to defeat threat

[@mannaandmonsters]

Have been watching your vids the past couple years. Love the philosophical view you bring to media without being pretentious

[@Ultra_Fine_Point]

Former Marine speaking...You NAILED IT, dude! "Starship Troopers was on our "Commanders Reading List" in 2003-2005. Excellent video and commentary!

[@Fauwkes]

I could have saved Dizz

[@sean7221]

I'm still raw about her dying

[@woolph58]

Robert A. Heinlein is one of my favorite golden age scifi writers. He was very avant-garde and a bit of a perv. Certain ideas like, the importance of individual liberty and self-reliance, the nature of sexual relationships, the obligation individuals owe to their societies, the influence of organized religion on culture and government, the danger of cult of personalities and ideologues, are recurring themes throughout his work.

[@shorewall]

I loved Starship Troopers, but I couldn't get into Stranger in a Strange Land. You are right that he had some pervy ideas. :D I do love the first girl in that book though.

[@D00MerJohn]

I think one of the most hilarious aspects of starship troopers and properties like it are the number of people on Twitter, usually those with certain flags next to their names, that openly sympathize with the genocidal bugs.

[@joshuabacker2363]

You could argue (correctly) that the humans are genocidal towards the bugs, too. I don't think it should matter though. I side with the humans because I'm a human.

[@foisopracurtir6389]

@@joshuabacker2363 Then everything and everyone is genocidal agaist Daleks, the Flood & xenomorphs

[@shorewall]

@@joshuabacker2363 Nature is often genocidal. The reason we think of it as bad is because of genociding other humans in an increasingly interconnected world. But it happened often in the ancient world.

[@FirithPanda]

I'M DOING MY PART

[@flamestoyershadowkill]

Doing my part

[@soldat88hun]

oh wow an actually good video on starship troopers

[@camerondane04]

I watched this movie just this morning and had no idea it was at all contentious, and admittedly maybe a lot of the social commentary flew over my head, though I could see the satire in the premise. I honestly loved the movie enough to get me to read the novel which is pretty rare for me, I’d honestly claim it as my favorite movie at the moment just for how titularly sci-fi it is, under the impression that it really is just a movie about shooting alien bugs it’s just fun as hell to experience the feeling of the world just by pure exposition. I generally cared for the feeling of the environment more than the nuance of the government in it, and like you mentioned you can look at it from either angle. Just thought I’d share my thoughts this movie kicks ass honestly

[@unavailable8282]

Truly the best film for good loyal citizens of Super Earth and the brave Hell Divers

[@Naxel4359]

The problem with the idea of two sides trying to claim it as “theirs” is that it’s only true for ONE side; the left. Those on the right aren’t trying to claim for themselves, but call out that the “fascism” argument fails in every way. “But the Hugo Boss unifo-“ Fascism isn’t when you give your characters mad drip, people.

[@Butmunch666]

The aesthetic thing displays an insanely juvenile way of looking at things. Almost like dressing a guy up in a dress and then everyone pretending...yup thats a woman. It's how children think.

[@okbuddy3819]

just sayin, who do you really think sent those asteroids perfectly to other planets

[@joshuabacker2363]

Nah, I claim Starship Troopers for all trve Right Wingers everywhere.

[@joshuabacker2363]

@@okbuddy3819 According to Verhoeven, the bugs did.

[@Naxel4359]

@@Butmunch666 Unfathomably based sir.

[@thatonefpsgamer1339]

NGL all i can see in the lecture is fuckin Sam Fisher talking to students

[@frankleone7685]

The third movie did solve the FTL issue with the literal bug gods, but people ignore it in these discussions.

[@bloodysimile4893]

The problem is the same movie abmits the bugs didn't know the location of Earth. Of course, if bugs didn't have FTL, they wouldn't have been on other planets. So obviously the bugs must had some form of ftl capabilities since 1st movie.

[@SMAXZO]

The book Bugs are completely different. For starters, it mentioned the bugs having beam weapons and ships...and the Skinnies? Yeah, the Skinnies sided with the Arachnids or at least told the Bugs where Earth is and then joined the Federation side after the Federation raided some of their worlds (we only read about one, Rico and the Roughnecks drop in the beginning of the book but I'm guessing there's more than one raid) Oh and the MI wore power armor hence no tanks.

[@joesomebody3365]

Always loved this series. Thanks for doing it justice in your coverage.

[@LandscapingHeroes]

Star ship troopers managed to become a cult classic despite having like D list actors. They are all very memorable tho

[@RoughnecksSTCfan]

Halo ripped off a very specific adaptation of Starship Troopers - the Roughnecks: Starship Troopers Chronicles TV show from which you get your pictures of the "Skinnies". Someone, I think Fil Barlow, who worked on the show, went as far as to say they had execs touring the Foundation Imaging studios while the show was in development. And the influence is obvious and deep, from Master Chief's armor to some of the human vehicles and the Covenant architecture (rather close to that of the Skinnies.)

[@kaelen9906]

he directed a movie on a book he never fucking read?

[@Acesahn]

Reality getting in the way of lefty ideals. Not uncommon!

[@Sorain1]

One he deliberately refused to read after the first two chapters, and had an intern give him a summary of. So he made up in his head what it was about and what was in the rest of the book, then 'parodied' that.

[@khaorix2667]

Big fan of Starship Troopers (the book) here, and I want to add some perspective on Heinlein's point in ST. For a start, Heinlein was a right-libertarian, which is very apparent in another one of his novels, "The Moon is a Harsh Mistress". He typically refers to himself as an anarchist. I don't think Starship Troopers is "the perfect government" to Heinlein, that's found in "The Moon is a Harsh Mistress" and those societies are very different. Instead, I think Starship Troopers is about what makes a good man, and what kind of man it would take for a government to even work. It's "the best *possible* government" and how to create a man that would be fit to rule over others. It's also not specifically about the military, although that is what the book focuses on. In the book, it is made extremely clear that the service is two years of something grueling, dangerous, and unrewarding, but it's explicitely said that it's not all military. I think the other example is "test subject for experimental medicine", but that would make an entirely different book.

[@nyxnox2135]

You're churning them out lately dude, good on you!

[@BusterKeaton48]

Phenomenal taste in music, I always get good songs to listen to from your vids

[@TheHylianJuggalo]

Starship troopers is a perfect case study in optics (meaning how you are passively perceived from the outside.) Your intent as an author means absolutely nothing if the way that you presented your thesis makes the audience believe you're saying something else. If my story's core thesis is "oranges taste gross," and proceed to write how 99% of the characters love oranges, and overwhelmingly talk positively above oranges.... The audience is going to think that the one character who hates oranges is the bad guy

[@yersiniopestis2553]

To be fair, doctors, fire fighters, police men, and teachers are also included in the voting class. It's not specifically a government ruled by the military, it's ruled by people who serve the country in one way or another. Not saying that this wouldn't cause its own issues, but it's not just military ruling the world thing. It just focuses on the military since Robert and the main character were part of the military.

[@sethvaldez4029]

That movie was my childhood

[@acrab6527]

It's not that we're denying the satire. It's that he tried to make it be a satire of fascism, but then failed so hard they never included any fascism. He was trying, but he failed.

[@misanthropicservitorofmars2116]

That’s the funniest. It’s only a satire of war movies, not fascism. I doubt if Paul could even describe fascism in any adequate way.

[@patchmoulton5438]

@@misanthropicservitorofmars2116 The definition of fascism has been spread so thin to be meaningless. The most common one coming from the people who throw that word around is "anything I dont like" or "anything right of Mao." "Of the State, for the State," is the best one Ive heard so far.

[@Butmunch666]

@@patchmoulton5438 Or if the people are dressed as fascists. Then clearly they must be fascist.

[@misanthropicservitorofmars2116]

@@Butmunch666 style and aesthetic militarism are the only qualifications needed to make the declaration.

[@Butmunch666]

@@misanthropicservitorofmars2116 Clearly :)

[@ElMachoMucho]

A lot of people dont know that the author of Starship Troopers also wrote another book called Glory Road was also one of the first isekai stories. And its awesome.

[@dansmith16]

The story of Jesus ascending into Heaven may count as it, though there were other stories which may have preceded it.

[@tommoritz9088]

I was a big Robo Cop fan when I was a kid, I didn’t realize Vanderhoven was the director of the film, let alone of Starship Troppers as well. I didn’t read Starship Troopers until I had had gone through the US Army OCS twice before washing out, which only reinforced what I learned from the book and my time in, I was busted up after surgery and have never been a political animal. That said, it’s some what poetic the novel and the movie are so far apart as they are as knowledge of both teach you at an academic level what it means to be an enlisted man and an officer in an efficient military force. I’d argue that proper knowledge of both the novel and the film would give one a rough understanding of an ideal force. It takes both side of the coin and a proper understanding of those sides to really understand both sides of that coin and participate in your part to make a better whole. If you’re reading this far, God bless you and let us enter an era where warfighting capabilities don’t matter anymore and we can all live relatively easy. God bless, lads.

[@PseudoUseful]

Shoulda shouted out Roughnecks when you used a couple of clips from it. I swear I have never met another human being that knows that show exists, and despite its CGI aging preeeeetty poorly I think the show is still pretty good overall.

[@username12120]

Roughnecks was a fantastic show, it was pretty big here in Australia during and after its runtime. I'd have the tapes/DVDs in my regular rotation of things to rent at the local video rental place.

[@Sorain1]

One of the saddest cases of 'didn't get to finish their season' out there. Yeah, the CGI and animation don't hold up well, but the writing does.

[@foisopracurtir6389]

I think I saw it, but could never remenber the name

[@Acesahn]

The bugs don't have FTL but they can shoot their spores/eggs through space at near FTL speed to burrow into planets to colonize them. With that biological ability its not hard to imagine how they might be able to knock asteroids into earth, you just have to imagine that the 'brain bugs' are a lot smarter then they appear.

[@adrianalexanderveidt344]

On the topic of Heinlein, you should check out The Moon is a Harsh Mistress. It is a magnificent book.

[@chucheeness7817]

That reminds me, I should watch roughnecks again, and see if it actually was as good as I remember watching it in the early 00's. It was the most stressful 'cartoon' I watched at that time, every episode they almost always only survive by the skin of their teeth. It's like an XCOM or Helldivers mission

[@ruskinmcpaddy1504]

Starship Troopers is literally the easiest litmus test for media literacy. And most people fail. Fuck the bugs, humanity is number 1