Alice in Borderland Review | Male Gaze Theory and Feminine Perspective

I love this show - but why does it make me so uncomfortable?
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[@evelina2548]

I specifically get so thrown out of a story when I watch or read a scene depicting violence and sexual violence in a way that I'm forced to identify or see it as sexual. This is especially present in many scenes that depict rape, like it's supposed to be exciting to see someone in a vulnerable situation be exploited.

[@WitandFolly]

precisely. instead of painting it as horrific and from the POV of the person being raped, it's too often exploitative and from the rapists perspective. the thrill easily overshadows the horror.

[@evelina2548]

​@@WitandFolly Thank you for understanding my point. I don't think sexual assault is sexy, and I don't want to be guided into thinking so, and I'm tired of rape being used as 'character development'.

[@netherworlde]

This is exactly what turned me off from reading Berserk. Excellent characters and story, and plenty of violence, too. But none of it made me as uncomfortable as seeing one particular female character end up in rape/near rape situations over and over again. Couldn't stomach it any more so I dropped the manga.

[@evelina2548]

@@netherworlde that's an excellent example. It also disturbs me because rape would never be used as character growth for a male character. It would just be depicted for what it is, trauma. Like with Jamie in Outlander. - To take an example outside manga.

[@veggie_kller6964]

@@evelina2548 or as comedy or as something that just happens and never gets mentioned again (either for comedy or shock value)

[@YoureSuchACliche]

also the fact that in the beach clothes all men are wearing normal clothes and women are wearing tiny outfits... besides they could hide 🔫 in their clothes anyway so there is no reason for keeping that rule.

[@WitandFolly]

that bothers me a tiny bit lol. I think that the rule was actually established in order to make everyone give in to their more carnal desires. the mad hatter wanted everyone to embrace their new reality and to give in to their most basic needs between sacrificing themselves for his cause. people are not as afraid of dying when they are *living*

[@YoureSuchACliche]

@Joshua Jones yes, i know. i meant that when the mc does it (he even wears a jacket(?) over his shirt) everyone let that slide bc it's considered beach clothes too. while woman has very limited amount of wardrobe choices. this is what i meant, men has more choices to wear and women didn't. but you can disagree it's ok, just my opinion.

[@renab.7390]

True! I get that it's tempting to distinguish characters looks-wise by making them wear different clothes but the whole rule of wearing beach clothing is made pointless by people wearing sweaters and robes, with pockets and lots of room to hide shit. They could have put everyone in speedos/tight swimming trunks and bikinis/tight bathing suits and still distinguished them by the colors of their outfit, their hair and accessories (f.e. hats, sunglasses, tattoos, jewellery, weapons). That would have made more sense and given all viewers some eye candy, not just those attracred to females. 😉

[@arhamramiz7791]

@@WitandFolly That explains it really good.

[@ramahida1529]

Japan: i don't give a shit

[@QueenBee-pb6bt]

Perfect Blue by Satoshi Kon is one of the first movies of this genre to depict "the male gaze" in a problematic way. The whole movie revolves on this concept, it was so ahead of its time.

[@meiji1815]

Yeah that is why I like that film Satoshi kon is a male artist who knows whats up despite him being male he knows that male gaze itself can be bad.

[@azuki_O]

Yes!!!!!

[@banane2279]

R.I.P

[@sarah-leamanning2946]

I still find it male gazey even though i know its a critic of it. The rape scene is very uncomfortable and rightfully so but then you have the nude photograph scene and then where the stalker still manages to rip her clothes off near the end. Meh

[@meiji1815]

@@sarah-leamanning2946 I think that's the point of what satoshi kon is portraying there is a male gaze that a male enjoys the pleasure but in contrast to that it shows how the female who experience it shows the audience( people who watch the film) How the female character feels like it shows that the male enjoys doing stupid things while showing how the female character shows it. Satoshi kon even make the male stalker not handsome as it shows how creepy and disgusting the stalker is and it portrays how the photographer uses art to cover his disgusting agenda towards the female by making her naked sadly the female have no power to that. That's why in the end of the film it shows how the female character gets fuck up in the situation that a male gaze takes pleasure in men but it is totally different when it approach the victims perspective that's why satoshi was able to portray how male gaze can be bad in that female character how male gaze will never be beautiful. It is beautiful to creepy man but to a normal being it wasn't. Dozens of films cannot even captured both perspective of a creepy person and a victim to that creepy person and Satoshi was able to do that.

[@featherlain2012]

I don't like how fans are making edit videos of Niragi assaulting Usagi and viewing it as "hot". Yes, Niragi is (so) hot but I wish we could focus on Usagi's point of view in the scene instead of Niragi's.

[@WitandFolly]

wait, they are??? are women making them cause there's a whole theory on that and it's probably not what you think it is

[@d..b5490]

@@WitandFolly Yeah, from what i've noticed Niragi and Chishiya are often spoken of and portrayed in pretty sensual ways by female fans of the show. Especially Niragi, giving him the whole "good boy turned bad" narrative

[@WitandFolly]

is he explored more in the manga then? I'm not mad about it. if women want to take ownership of the relationship in order to feel powerful, then that's fine by me. the difference is that they are exploring it through rewriting something that has been established. it's tranformative. it's taking something back that belonged to them. taking control of the narrative

[@Luciferith]

He’s not hot 🥴 The assault wasn’t hot and I don’t know how some women thought it was sexy, I was literally disgusted I almost 🤮

[@d..b5490]

@@WitandFolly i'm unsure of that. The most I can say for Niragi in the manga is that e he looked a lot scarier, in the way a typical anime villain would. His role is relatively small in the grant scheme of things. The way I see it about him is that people find him attractive through a combination of the actors attractive features, the style of clothing he's show in, his general crazy demeanour and his "tragic" back story. Those elements of him seem to be brought up most often, I've barely seen anyone of these fans actually adressing the rape scene

[@kuraikonguyen9303]

Alice in Borderland is a good, engaging show, but you're right on how "male gaze-y" it is, to the point that it is distracting and uncomfortable. And as for the scene with Usagi's sexual assault (cause that's what it was tbh): I know that it's supposed to come off as bad, uncomfortable. We as the audience know that, based on Usagi's obvious disgust and struggling, but the scene doesn't 100% convey this. Look, women are put in danger (just as men are), but from the words of coldcrashpictures's video of "Top 5 Annoyingly Sexist Tropes" (a really good video and film analysis channel. Highly recommend): that there's a difference between "shooting to horrify and shooting to titillate." In the video, the movie used in example was the "Hills Have Eyes," in which a girl gets assaulted by the zombie/monster. And the scene is already horrifying in and of itself, but the scene was taken from the POV of the attacker and has long, lingering takes of the victim in a way that is taken to be "stimulating," i guess. What I'm trying to say was, that scene with Usagi reminded me of that: that her assault is horrifying, but the takes of it, with the licking and the shot of Niragi slowly unzipping her jacket and all...made it seem as though it was meant to be almost titillating rather than a terrible scene in which a girl is getting sexually assaulted. For me, a movie that depicts an extreme sexual assault and did it well in terms of making it actually terrifying was "The Nightingale" (dir Jennifer Kent) in which the assault of the main character is taken from her POV and that you can also see her facial expression and know that this is horrifying and disgusting and wrong. And yes; the scene of Usagi's assault was longer than it needed to be.

[@WitandFolly]

thank you for this! this video was intentionally short and I didn't have enough time to get in to everything. some people in the comments have said "but the assault was meant to be horrifying for everyone" and it's honestly difficult to explain that something horrifying can also be titillating, but this is the perfect explanation!

[@GinnySiska]

at least the rape wasn't real it's fiction. you know what was real and something you should actually be concerned about? the actress of Asahi (you see her at 6:24) only being around 16 1/2 years old while they where shooting this so being a literal minor

[@jennidiaz2809]

@@GinnySiska you entirely missed the point of the analysis and this entire video if you dismiss the rape scene as not being significant because it’s “not real”

[@GinnySiska]

@@jennidiaz2809 so and you think fictional rape/the way it's presented in this show is worse than sexualising REAL MINORS on set? okay. [yes being 16 is being a minor and Mizuki Yoshida was still 16 when they where shooting AiB starting summer 2019. she only became 18 not even 2 weeks ago. technically she still IS underage in japan because the legal age of adulthood over there is 20 but they will lower it to 18 next year]

[@jennidiaz2809]

@@GinnySiska no I literally never said that, you’re just assuming things. Never in my previous reply did I doubt that the actress was a minor during production OR that her sexualization is worse. What I meant by my comment is that it’s nonsensical to bring light to another issue on set of the production while invalidating the need to critique other elements of the show including how it treats the depiction of RAPE when using minors on set and its depiction of rape both play into a larger issue in the film industry as a whole. Just because a rape isn’t real doesn’t mean it’s depiction should not be concerning. Media plays a large role in the way anything is perceived and failing to depict the severity of a rape scene does nothing but perpetuate rape culture, that’s why the “at least it wasn’t real it’s fiction” argument falls flat.

[@winonapurple7957]

the scariest thing is most people especially men aren't even aware of the male gaze and many women are so desensitized to it

[@michfreedom2588]

@@mikays7059 You understand they said “most” you are the exception.

[@hanh6822]

@@user-lg3yj2fz2j but what's wrong, the show never showed that you had to look like that

[@NorrisFoxx]

Or perhaps, not everyone - regardless of gender - sees it as an issue. And, maybe, it isn't a case of not being aware of it or being desensitized. Are you saying every creator should forgo their creative freedom and relinquish their sensibilities to cater to that of yours and your ilk? There isn't anything wrong with an artist pandering to a certain audience.

[@NorrisFoxx]

@@user-lg3yj2fz2j Quit with the tired old disproven argument of entertainment (such as movies, video games, animated works etc.) molding people's behavior. Anyone with any kind of sense knows that's not how human psychology works, we can very much so distinguish between reality and fiction and between what isn't appropriate in real life. What does affect a person's behavior is what they see in real life, whether it's their immediate surroundings or how a public figure carries themselves, or in non-fiction literature et cetera, none of which can or should be curated by anyone thinking they know better or has the answers - 'cause personal freedoms. Parents should do their jobs and if they're sh*tty at it, well, so it goes. "Think of the children!" Okay, Mrs.Lovejoy.

[@vincentfox4929]

Because its biological? Are people really ignoring biology? Its the “MALE” gaze.

[@kim-berly]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who felt uncomfy, especially during the scene where she's tied down and he undresses her, I felt that it went on forever and I just couldn't understand why it had to be so long

[@Hellsichtig]

It really IS uncomfortable...stay strong.

[@dalleravn]

haven't seen it, but from the clip i guess it is the point of the scene... i mean rape aren't supposed to be comforbel.....just saying

[@kim-berly]

@@dalleravn the problem was that they were trying to make it seem "sexy," forcing the audience to sexualize the situation rather than focusing on how horrific it was for the girl and empathizing with her, it also went on for an unnecessary amount of time

[@dalleravn]

@@kim-berly is it somthing you know? behind the scenes or? I wouldn't be surprised since it is japanis, but for western audience. i bet more would fine it disturbing then hot.

[@0912sooli]

Maybe to show how gross it is?

[@chaos_production]

What bothered me was that there was hundred of people at the Beach bit for some reason only Usagi and Arisu were so innocent and worried about their future rather than having "fun."

[@michaeldeanmalonzo2423]

No. A lot of people like Momoka, the cap guy, anne, kuina, and mny more are not having this kind of fun. They just need to blend in since they might be killed.

[@random-zz8ut]

That’s why they’re my favourite characters. People who like Niragi I just don’t understand them at all

[@cannoneermike]

As a gay man i get tired of the male gaze too. Like, it's straight up gross sometimes. I do appreciate female beauty, but it's in our faces so often that i often find myself skipping through scenes when it's too much. I love Alice in Borderlands, but now looking back at it it's apparent who they are targeting and it's kind of disappointing, especially since it's such a good show :/

[@NorrisFoxx]

Are you saying it's wrong for creators to target or cater to particular demographics?

[@cannoneermike]

@@NorrisFoxx I am saying there is a surplus of media created for a straight cis male

[@NorrisFoxx]

@@cannoneermike Well, in that case, it's more sensible than others who instead of pushing (or asking) for more diverse takes they demonize the "male gaze" and try to dismantle it for an equally stifling one. As creators people should be given the freedom to express their art in whatever way that is pleasing to themselves. And there is more than enough room for a variety of approaches. I say this as another gay guy who doesn't care much for fanservice targeted to straight males but I support its production.

[@paolazeledon9661]

@@NorrisFoxx I kept going back to this comment because something about it just bothered me. I am not surprised you defend the male gaze tbh it's just so weird how you defend a creator's "freedom to express" when it is clear that "freedom" is damaging. But again, not surprised that you're defending it. Oh, and before you try and twist my words (just like you did with the main comment) "so you're saying creators should not cater to straight men?" No, I am saying that the way they cater to them is damaging and needs to be fixed.

[@NorrisFoxx]

@@paolazeledon9661 You are making the same nonsensical argument as those who were saying video games and movies negatively affects people's behavior. This, of course, has since been proven undeniably wrong in studies. As it turns out, people are able to distinguish what is acceptable in works of fiction and entertainment from what is acceptable in real life - something anyone with any sense knows seeing as millions of people part-take in said past-times and the vast majority remain uninfluenced by it. So, no, it is not at all damaging. It's literally harmless entertainment. You're all just a bunch of prudes.

[@cresitonia6819]

once i got older, and learned about sexism and racism. it's soo hard to enjoy anything without thinking of the underlying tone. of it all.

[@banane2279]

That's soo true! It makes me feel like we'll never be able to get over it. Makes me feel all the more happy when I finally see a little piece of media that subverts bad tropes.

[@jimerodriguez8332]

I think it gets easier over time,we learn to identify patterns and recognize the flaws in things that we like,we can critically think about them ,and enjoy them with a less gullible pov, I do that because I feel that if we just don't watch anything ,then it would be like cancel culture,just saying -let's not acknowledge this anymore _ without any other real discussion or debate around it and no critical thinking on the matter.

[@crowned2088]

@@banane2279 I like tropes not everything gotta be deep and meaningful...like writers who just go straight for it

[@banane2279]

@@crowned2088 yeah, but you don't have to reinforce racist, sexist and other shitty things that's been done thousands and thousands of times before

[@crowned2088]

@@banane2279 Even those are okay tbh, just depends if the story is interesting enough or what's it going for... But yeah I get what your saying they should innovate more on characters.

[@mateorodriguez6882]

The bar is so low for shonen lmfao.

[@fauziomudiue2443]

True

[@ItsDarcey]

It really is

[@joe-hk5dn]

right I'm sick of it. if we learn to raise the bar higher they'll eventually stop.

[@stereogrl]

it really is and at this point it just kind of disgusts me

[@laoyue5924]

read seinen

[@TheLeah2344]

I thought I was only one that was bothered by how little clothing the women were wearing. It was definitely for the male gaze. They weren’t seen as actual human beings with their own dreams but simply disposable objects to please men.

[@komos3719]

Yeah I can't lie, I'm getting tired of having to mentally pretend I'm not being forced into peeping all the goddamn time. Especially when it's rape. Like holy shit. Especially because as a woman, I'm susceptible to being the victim in the situation. Which is horrifying and extremely uncomfortable! The show's still really good tho Also, even if your japanese pronunciation was a little off lol, I'm happy to see you at least giving it a shot.

[@WitandFolly]

lol thanks. I've actually watched a lot of Japanese media, I just don't ever say the names aloud so I have very little practice

[@KairiKH21]

@@WitandFolly totally understandable. I still butcher names. In the Word “Manga” it’s a soft a at the beginning. Not as if you are saying man then guh. More like mahn-ga. Wonderful Video, it’s just this pronunciation that takes me out of the video from time to time. You’ve don’t a lot of work on this video and I thank you for that :)

[@KarlSnarks]

Unlike many of the other examples, I don't think that rape scene was intended to excite straight men or gay women, but because it made the villain look more gross and evil, and people (both men and women) tend to sympathize more with female victims.

[@komos3719]

@@KarlSnarks rape does make him come off as worse but I don't like it when my POV is that of the rapist, ya dig?

[@RPG_Angie]

On the topic of shooting sexual assault in a "sexy" way, Jill Bearup has an amazing short rant about how physiological arousal is easily misattributed when one or both characters are displaying aggression, intimidation, hatred, fear, nervousness, etc. If anyone's interested, look up "Hogfather | Susan/Teatime & Unresolved Sexual Tension" here on YT. Male-gazey sexual assault scenes make full use of that ambiguity. They'll have the victim pant (not hyperventilate or gag), writhe (not fight to the point of hurting themselves without stopping for dialoge or freeze and basically dissociate), and whine in a soft way that could be interpreted as moaning (not full on cry or scream). I just grossed myself out writing that, so apologies to those who have read this far.

[@linseyspolidoro5122]

Great video, the male gaze in media is a very interesting subject. I would like to add that (10:00) while I agree with the other genres I’ve often heard people ask questions like ‘Why do women love horror?” So I think women’s relationship with the horror genre is slightly different than the rest even if there is just as much if not more of an exploitative and voyeuristic tendency in the genre. I am sure there are many reasons for this but I think horror, in particular, can be cathartic for some women because the every day feelings of fear and paranoia are validated and able to be processed especially since many of the protagonists are women.

[@WitandFolly]

very much agree with this. i kind of stumbled in that area of my script because i thought of that too, but i also think it's generally unknown ~how~ women digest it. it is different how we digest it compared to how men digest it. i couldn't go into it here, but i do have a video on tau and other thrillers that sort of covers this. also, there are so many different categories here that could fit into horror. some are far more exploitive than others

[@linseyspolidoro5122]

@@WitandFolly I don’t think you stumbled, I understand that you were probably just making a point, I apologize if it came off as pedantic. And I’ll definitely check out the other video.

[@WitandFolly]

oh no, I very much appreciate the discussion on the point 🙌🏻 thank you

[@trilsoweird17]

I can't even watch Usagi's scene without feeling anxious and nauseous, the entire scene is gross and strike fear into me.

[@-AnGeLuS-]

Because it's a digusting scene, if you felt like that then they have made it out to be perfect. But in no way was it depicted sexy. Only psychopaths view that scene as sexy.

[@gabrielasilva3561]

Because that's the point!!! It's not supposed to be warm and fuzzy and it's not supposed to be sexy, if you can't take it, watch only wholesome stuff I guess

[@gabrielasilva3561]

@@-AnGeLuS- No but you see, a women exist in this scene, *therefore* it must be sexual /s

[@m3lona]

@@gabrielasilva3561, I think the writers used her especially to be the one raped because we're attached to her sort of innocence and to see what happens in a world with no rules it is an obvious thing that will happen, we are more disturbed by this event taking place and the nature of humans taking advantage of others, I don't think it was despited to be sexy in any way but brutal especially hearing what he was saying to her whilst trying to rape her highlighted that, this world without rules was made brutal so it was natural that something like that would happen especially from a psychopath like Niragi that feeds on exploiting others to try and make up for his own insecurities.

[@zmelody2111]

and the fact this guy is still ALIVE TILL THE LAST FEW EPISODES is more terrifying and annoying. WHY DO RAPISTS LIVE, BUT SLUT DIES?

[@sweetteenage8072]

This is really good analysis! I enjoyed the show a lot, but the aspects you’ve mentioned did bother me

[@alexandrathompson2901]

If they really want to depict sexual assault and not have the audience misinterpret it as sexualy enticing, then all they have to do have the frame on the girl's face, focus on her reactions of repulsion (it will still be triggering to some viewers but this framing won't leave any space for depicting this as "sexy" unless you really are fucked up) instead of framing the scene in the predator's perspective where the focus is his domination over a vulnerable person and their body. Like I don't get it, there really is no fucking excuse

[@garbledsand-which2321]

Its weird that more comic artists don't want to depict that horror? That could potray both the reality of SA and a turning point for the tone of the story.

[@MJ-jj4ux]

WOW this was incredible! i really thought your main focus was going to be on niragi’s scene intimidating usagi, but you had a lot more to say. what you analysed about kuina’s fight scene was also very interesting, since she’s definitely portrayed as more feminine in the manga, but it’s something i hadn’t noticed before. thank you for bringing this up!

[@WitandFolly]

In the manga, it's definitely a lot different. I think the manga was trying to almost humiliate the reader with the reveal. Like "haha, you were oogling a dude." Especially with how she says (after the Beach burns down) "I used to be a guy." It's just handled so poorly. Definitely happy the show changed a bit in that regard, but they also knew that the people who read the manga would know she was transgender, so I think that's why she was framed in that way. All of this was so complicated to get into in the video and I wasn't sure if I had the right words for it then.

[@kaiella7573]

idk something that annoyed me and really drew me out of the story (although i loved the show) was how when Arisu first met Usagi she was so driven yet once they got to the beach she became a background character and I get that Arisu is the main character but it felt like they set Usagi up and she was such an interesting character but then they got to the beach and she was sidelined and became this meek background character when she had previously been shown to be tactful, sporty and intelligent, but she just sort of lost all of that, almost as if she was just used for Arisus own character development

[@obasan3981]

I noticed it as well, it bothers me so much how it happens all the fucking time like in one piece: Nico Robin was this horrifying woman that had a huge bounty on her head when she was only 8 y.o. Yet once she joins the straw hats suddenly she needs and protecting and her powers aren’t explored much.

I agree, when they said Arisu had potential I was like wait a minute what about Usagi? Girl has been jumping on roofs and staying alive on her own this whole time

[@steph8455]

@@obasan3981 robin learned to depend on others, she didn’t trust anyone because of her past and she was afraid to be vulnerable, she knows how to defend herself and is still relevant to the plot however oda doesn’t give her much screen time which does bother me. i’m not caught up to one piece from what i’ve heard robin was given a fight in wano, so i guess that’s some progress?? considering the last 1v1 fight she had was in skypiea.

[@mus7c]

the show is so good but the male gaze in this show also made super uncomfortable at times. i dunno if i'm the only on who noticed that there were several lingering shots of kuina's body, her chest was almost always center and she had her arms crossed under, making it the emphasis when she was talking. there were also several shots of her walking or from behind that were clearly meant to emphasize her butt. i literally remember saying to myself, "god, you're so badass. i wanna know more about you and your story, but when are they going to stop oversexualizing you so i can actually enjoy this." i got that prayer answer the moment she reveals she's trans. the moment it's revealed suddenly kuina is no longer under the male gaze, despite her wearing a bikini she no longer lingering shots emphasizing her her chest. suddenly she seems a little more humanan too. her fight scene is absolutely outrageous and one of my favorite of the show, it gave me almost the same pumped up cheer as to when i watched wonder woman fight in the first ww movie. but you really can't deny the underlying transphobic shift in the way she's shot from then on. usagi's torture scene made me so angry i almost turned off the show completely. it's interesting to me that arisu's torture is getting tied to a chair and beaten, yet usagi's is getting restrained and sexually assaulted. like you mention, a big theme in the show is binaries. so i can't help but wonder what the writers and directors were trying to say. are they saying these two are comparable? and furthermore, why is arisu's torture scene getting beaten up and restrained when we know of the two usagi is the one that poses a bigger physical threat. shouldn't she be the one getting physically restrained? i have so many more thoughts on this show and how male gaze-y it is but i'll leave it at this for now.

[@snakelemon]

Fantastic video! May I add one thing that you could make a video about if you like: the gay male gaze on women. As a gay man I know how objectification in the gay community is super common on men of course, and weirdly-accepted aaand even expected to such extent that its shortcomings and issues are not usually addressed and if one were to, one would be met with being accused of prudishness or stuck up or conservative. But one thing that is also not usually addressed is the objectification of women by gay men. Of course this type of male gaze has a different history and functions in a different way, but have a look at films by gay male filmmakers (especially those who are over 40/50 but not limited to) and if you have the time and energy, it would be interesting to hear you what you think.

[@markbrandt3252]

I personally find it super refreshing that gay men objectify other men. I legit occasionally forget that there are people that find manly men attractive. I understand that women find being objectified uncomfortable, but personally I wouldn’t mind it. Better than being ignored.

[@Flower-gb8co]

mark brandt objectify doesnt mean “to find sexually attractive” it means to see something as an object. (Often when talking about gender it means to see something as a sex object).I feel like you are confusing those two very different things and that wasnt really the point of the original comment anyway. Also with men “not getting attention”, it is not women’s problem where they need to compliment you more and give you more attention. I feel like you should look into more as to why men dont receive as much attention from women as women do from men. (Spoiler alert: it has a lot to do with men objectifying women in the first place, who wants to hang out with people who see you as a sex object?)

[@markbrandt3252]

@@Flower-gb8co I personally wouldn’t mind it. I don’t have the time for a committed relationship right now so something more transactional would be perfect. I don’t need a partner to respect me, just to understand that we’re both looking for the same thing.

[@teresagoncalves531]

@@markbrandt3252 Respect is the basis of any and all relationships, if you don't respect your partner or they don't respect you, leave.

[@markbrandt3252]

I suppose I didn’t express myself well enough in my original comment. I was just trying to say that I think it’s a good thing that lgbt people can talk about their sexuality, with less worry about being seen as creepy. I’m bisexual and have always had a much easier time with relationships with other guys than women. So the idea that we should stifle ourselves so as to not be seen as objectifying each other makes me bristle a little bit. My strait guy friends don’t mind being relentlessly hit on the rare occasion we go to a gay bar either.

[@undertaker9991]

I don't think the rape scene was supposed to sexy. It was made to be disturbing. Or at least me as a man thought so.

[@Waywardpaladin]

Yeah, the whole thing isn't titilating, it is about power rather than sex, but they can get that across in a much shorter time than they did, it just became gratuitous.

[@undertaker9991]

@@WaywardpaladinIt was Quite brief to me.

[@petalchild]

@@undertaker9991 well it feels like forever to women who have experienced similar things.

[@naomileggoneverland6267]

Yeah, it wasn't that long but I watched 5 seconds and feel it like years...so disgusting

[@undertaker9991]

@@naomileggoneverland6267 What your not suppose to find rape repulsive? If so that's a normal reaction.

[@olakruk1615]

Although I'm very into video essays regarding social problems the male gaze in AIB didn't stand out to me that much because I was very mesmerised by the show. Despite being very excited while watching it I immediately felt off with the way they portrayed Usagi in her sports clothes and her training. It felt as if I was watching some male fantasy. Also I couldn't not notice that Kuina as well as many other female characters didn't wear anything beside swimsuit for the whole series

[@moonjain454]

Exactly.. I don't even remember the scene that's talked about here. And I remember others in great detail and enjoyed it a lot.

[@victoriacocoz]

Sometimes in cinema different symbols used such as color of clothing or even type of clothing someone is wearing can actually speak more about the character than a lengthy flashback. Many directors will actually opt for this since it does give the viewer slightly more engagement and also gives you something to think about rather than just telling you who the person is and what their intentions are. At the end of the day, as a woman, I don't see anything wrong with this happening since it happens to men as well. That is just how storytelling and symbolism works. For example, a character that wears white versus a character wearing black. One could guess which is good and which is evil. These details are actually used to showcase the characters change and/or qualities. As a viewer, its a bit much to expect a director to hold your hand throughout a movie or show and expect them to spell it out for you when you as the viewer should be engaged enough to understand certain tropes. side note: There were plenty of men in bathing suits as well as women. Equal amounts I'd say. And, there were also women that we didn't see in bathing suits. I also think you fail to realize that this is a dystopian society where there is no room for morality or respect. Of course you're going to see instances of violence against women because unfortunately, we live in a world where that exists. These characters aren't living in fear of authority figures or punishment. They can do whatever they want and get away with it. So that is what you see happening. That is the world in which these characters live. It is an escape from reality just as what they say in the show. For some people, that escape means hurting others. The show makes it VERY clear that this is what it is about and these are the kinds of people that exist. It is actually very similar to our own world.

[@KarlSnarks]

I disagree with your criticism of the rape-scene. It's clearly meant to be gross and appalling, and the lingering of the camera is to make it feel closer and inescapable. It serves to make you hate and despise the villain. The gross sound effect makes it extra clear to me that the writers did not intend to make this a fan-service moment. Some of the other criticisms are fair though.

[@plaingirl212]

exactly!! I can't believe some people thought it was fan service or something wtf!

[@OkadaKek]

My thoughts exactly, the scene was also being accompanied by the protagonist tied up in a chair, literally a "oh no what are they gonna do now" moment

[@random-zz8ut]

Yes finally someone who’s talking about the sound effects! They threw me off so bad I was traumatised just watching that scene alone. I can’t believe there’s people who think that was hot. Like I’m sorry I’ve seen plenty of fan service in different media but THAT SCENE WAS NOT IT. Here’s an example of good fan service: In the 2015 drama for Death Note (yes the one with Kento Yamazaki as L who also plays Arisu in AIB), L casually and constantly takes his shirts off but he has a good reason to in the show (germaphobia), obviously it was fan service, but it was done right.

[@PrincessxSugar14]

The fight scene between the girl and the bald guy with the tattoos (can’t remember their names) was actually my favourite scene and the scene that made me LOVE that show, and you’re SO right! I didn’t even realise how much is in it. Some of those scenes I noticed the male gaze (the girls dancing in bikinis in the club) but others (the ‘femme fatale’) I didn’t at all!

[@nothingirsiatwia7454]

the alice in borderland manga is great as well but its just weird how almost every woman is portrayed as a sex goddess with noticeable cleavage even when they're minding their business and doing a normal task, while the male characters are drawn like normal people (by this i mean that there are good looking characters that you can tell that they're good looking without needing to see them almost naked, there are regular looking characters, overweight, skinny, old, young). kinda comes off as if they think women can only be interesting if theyre stunning bombshells, and even then the male characters are usually given a better story

[@jessicadufour6595]

yes think one piece

[@renab.7390]

Unfortunately this is a big problem with shonen in general. 😑

[@francisconavarrete2390]

@@renab.7390 people love it tho

[@margaretswanson5365]

I feel this so much. It really pulls me out of a story when suddenly I’m forced to view other women like they’re something to be consumed. And I like other women! But the way cameras leer on people is just jarring.

[@blueberrylu5964]

A controversial take from someone who isn't trans: I don't mind that Hikari isn't played by a trans actor. I imagine it must be horribly difficult to find a trans actress from a good agency in Japan, even more, a black trans girl who can speak Japanese like in the manga. I'm contempt with her being confident, badass, charismatic, and surviving to be a possible side character with more development (and the wink that God blessed us with). Also, I'd like some female gaze at least to balance the fanservice. If they want it so bad they better do it for all.

[@mfriz5317]

I kinda disagree I’m sure they could have scouted trans and/or black actor since there are a lot of us who enjoy acting but are refused places in agency’s (like you said) this could have been an opportunity to give them a carrier. I also agree with the last part. If you “must“ add fan service add it for everyone ;)

[@yeettherich]

she isn't actually black in the manga tho. she's tan with dreads but still japanese

[@blueberrylu5964]

@@yeettherich I'm not sure if that's better or worse

[@princesspinhead4516]

It’s called acting

[@rinasakurai8857]

@@blueberrylu5964 .....I mean I think they coulda tried harder to find a trans actress but being tan and having dreads is....pretty natural for a fuck ton of Asians. Millions of South asians have naturally darker skin and have dreads and or hair that naturally dreads. Western media of course does not normalize that the hundreds of different ethnicities in the Asian continent so people who are exposed to the idea of the genetic diversity present in Asia are often "shocked" or uncomfortable with it when first presented with it.

[@chadherbert18]

Very interesting. I can see how one would could play with this concept of gaze to help tell the story, as opposed to helping to sell to men. I can imagine someone creating two versions of the same episode, one with male, and one with female gaze. I think that would be super interesting to watch, compare, and talk about... :)

[@firstnamelastname7640]

I'd say this type of show is rather prevalent in Japanese media (or eastern asian as a whole?), a fascinating story setting with some well-developed visual effects but little to none effect in character building (every character is essentially some sort of an archetype) and story developing, let alone they often adhere to gender stereotypes and merely serving male fantasy. (you too! Demon Slayer) Every so-called plot twist was so predictable. Maybe it seemed novel to western viewers?

[@WitandFolly]

I'm no stranger to anime or Eastern storytelling. This particular show was very male gazey, even compared to shounen stereotypes.

[@WitandFolly]

I even make the point that real bodies are different than animated ones. Creators know they need to be careful when adapting the stories from animated to flesh.

[@Vor567tez]

I don't get it with Demon Slayer. Can you explain.

[@hoominbeeing]

@@Vor567tez Yea, idk how Demon Slayer has the same issues she described

[@iamperish]

Glad to know that I wasn't the only one who noticed or felt something was off when the episodes would take time out of the very interesting plot to gaze at topless women and crap.

[@guineabable08]

The person who played Asahi was actually a minor when they filmed and there were countless low camera angles of her from behind. I started getting anxious thinking how many of the extras in the beach scenes might actually have been student age and it made me sick. I was feeling weird about this otherwise great show they entire time and you, wit and folly, have expertly explained it and given words to my feelings. Thank you!

[@WitandFolly]

I didn't catch that in my research but lordy I am not surprised!!

[@ramahida1006]

I mean, it's Japan. Just look at Gravure idols (bikini model, scantily clad, fanservice-y model or something like that, generally more provocative than regular models and usually marketed towards men. It's like the equivalent of Playboy). Most of them are making their debut at age 15. It's a big industry since the 80s and just as popular as other pop idols. Also a lot of Japanese A-list actresses were once a Gravure idol. So... i wasn't surprised.

[@j4smjne]

i felt so guilty watching that scene with Usagi and Niragi

[@barbaramarina0]

I think it's unfair to say the female characters in this aren't nuanced, but the problem is that they too fall into those old same shonen boxes as women in the story. Women are not either this or that. I loved the story and the pacing was so good, basically everything it takes for people get hooked, this binary is what kills it. I hope with all the attention the show is getting, they listen to the criticism in this aspect. I love the female protagonists and I hope they keep evolving in a way that's not limiting just because of their gender. This show has so much potential.

[@sonnysmith5671]

Honestly idk why she's focused on all those scenes specifically, as a man I watched the show for the thrill of the life or death games like the tag one or the hearts games or the scenes where it show how each character figured out the trick or solution of how get through the diamonds games and the transitions for them and all the music just makes you feel like your there playing

[@tamaraami5613]

Same for me tbh

[@bombomb23]

months ago when i watched alice in borderland, i thought it was terrible because of its issues with male gaze. :/

[@freazeezy]

For me it's the difference between doing something WITH your audience and doing something TOO your audience. Anybody getting off to the creep shots are clearly having the experience the director wanted them to have but being forced to creep on uncomfortable scenes feels like I'm the one being assaulted

[@TheToxic35]

Quick question. I know the video focuses on the series and not its source material, but I have a hard time watching live action international television. Would you recommend checking out the manga? I also find it interesting that you specifically use Seven Deadly Sins as an example of the Japanese female character written with male gaze in mind. There are certainly more obligatory examples (Chi Chi in Dragon Ball for example), but Elizabeth is definitely one of the most recent examples. Her and Lucy from Fairy Tail are just a couple of the reasons I am so grateful Fullmetal Alchemist was my first shonen series. Anyways, excellent video!

[@WitandFolly]

actually yes, I would recommend the manga! some of the best scenes from the show are taken almost frame-by-frame from the manga.

[@diydrivenGA]

I would...It was a good read and a great bit darker than the live adaptation was or will be down the road I think. There are also quite a few side stories and additional content that won't make the cut into the adaptation. Also a follow up mini-series that came out this year that was pretty good.

[@-AnGeLuS-]

guess she has never seen High school of the dead. That's a male gaze. This imo isn't.

[@shadowboxing7029]

Whenever my daughter and I see a gratuitous shot in a movie or show we'll roll our eyes. It's so obvious that the shot has no purpose whatsoever. Sure sure it's just media but it plays into a bigger narrative of painting women as objects, I'm so over it. I'm all good with sex and violence and what not, just not framed like this.

[@Leshenn]

I just found this channel and have been binging all the videos. I love the analyses, and they give me a new appreciation for these small nuances in our media and our stories. Tbh the Rey video also helped me understand so many things that I experience as a masculine woman who is trying to learn to embrace the feminine.

[@WitandFolly]

love this! thank you so much for your comment 💗☯️

[@ohlambert3562]

Thank you so much for your videos on the male and female gazes, they've opened a world to me. I think it is a huge and very important topic we really need to talk more about. Thanks to you I can finally see when a scene is a male gaze and it makes my life so much easier bc I am aware of it. Such scenes have always bothered me but I could never realize what is "wrong" with them until I watched your videos.

[@bobiuu6675]

I (an adult) had to cover all THAT type of things while watching this series. It was so badly done and you could see how nro.1 uncomfortable most of the sexualised women were while "acting" to be okay with it all and nro.2 the scenes without the characters consent and against their will were filmed to be "hot and sexy" and NOT LIKE THE AWFUL ASSAULT IT ACTUALLY WAS. The most sensual scene was the usagi scene. And that scares me

[@Ragnarobb]

Your channel is a godsend. Thank you so much for a huge backlog of amazing content to watch. (Like, subscribed, bell rang)

[@itsalwayshalloweenexceptwh5118]

I wondered about making this comment or not because it might not be the right place to do it. Some context; I've always been kind grossed out when a piece of media depicted sexual assault/attempted rape/rape. But as I saw more movies and series that had these scenes in them I started noticing different depictions of them. In some movies/series these depictions are only presented/shot as horrifying, but other depictions seemed to be shot to titillate as well. That grossed me out so much, and has ruined movies for me, so I started being more selective with the movies and series I watched. I started googling "does insert movie or series here contain rape or sexual assault" before deciding to watch something or not. Or I would talk with friends about a series, if they'd seen it and if and how it depicts these kinds of topics. When I watched this video and read some of the comments a few questions popped up in my head. What do you think makes a writer/director choose to depict/shoot these scenes as solely horrifying or titillating as well? (like what are they basing their decision on). What do you think the decision to shoot/write it as titillating says about what the writer/director thinks about/views their audience? And what does it actually say about the audience that writers/directors are still putting these types of depictions that were written/shot to titillate in their media?

[@WitandFolly]

I think it's rather simple. When choosing to shoot something a certain way, they think titillating and horrifying are one in the same. They think that vulnerability is both scary and sexy. This occurs even in comics. Why do men draw violence against women by focusing on how volumtuous her breasts are as her clothes are ripped away? They think they're being bold, daring, or artistic. Or they think they're paying homage to some artist they admire that they grew up with, and the cycle just keeps repeating itself. A good director who is aware of the gaze is Tarantino. He may objectify women when the gaze is from the POV of a violent man in the story. Other times, the gaze focuses on their strength or interesting character traits. I think he's incredibly self aware of his own gaze

[@itsalwayshalloweenexceptwh5118]

@@WitandFolly "they think titillating and horrifying are one in the same. " I see. "They think they're being bold, daring, or artistic." yup, I've heard that one as well, as well as "shock value" and "it's important to the story". Thank you for replying, have a great week.

[@neptunite5973]

I haven't heard of the show or manga before, i feel like it would be a good idea to start with a very short summary of the story before heading into the analysis :) that being said: fantastic essay/analyses/review!

[@KiMuranaka]

Oh wow. I didn't really notice that while watching the show. I was so mesmerized by the concept and i'm excited for season 2. Maybe will read the manga too. But wow. Also does anyone know what the intro sonh to thia video is? I love the tune 😊

[@LoneLionLeo]

Sadly the main demographic of this type of shows are very closed minded and hate anything close to “sjw”. Even if it makes sense to move away from thise tropes and make necessary changes, these guys wont like it.

[@mrrattrap1488]

Hate SJW's , Sure. Close-minded, Take a good close look in the mirror before saying that.

[@LoneLionLeo]

@@mrrattrap1488 huh?

[@treasuremage7546]

@@LoneLionLeo SJWs are infamous for being close minded in that they condemn everything that doesn't conform with their own extremely narrow SJW world view.

[@LoneLionLeo]

What sucks is that now a days if people are vocal against misogynistic/sexist or homophobic tropes, they get named “sjw” but we as a society really need to move forward with inclusivity and create good stories with these types of characters. Now, sjws need to leave alone the edgy stories targeted to other groups of people that obviously not meant for them. So everyone can enjoy in peace with what they like.

[@treasuremage7546]

@Millenium Man You didn't just describe SJWs. You described how SJWs see themselves. Because as I said earlier, they're extremely narrow minded. Roughly. 99.9% of people in the west want equality and inclusion, but 99.9% of people are not SJWs, so from that alone it should be obvious your definition is not sufficient. The SJW is not defined by the things they want, but by how they go about it.

[@petrfedor1851]

3:05 When this shot appear on screen first thing that cross my mind was AoT meme "If she show you her nape it was her mistake" I saw recently.

[@larissafonseca4007]

This stuff is so interesting! I’ve really been into this male and female gaze thing lately

[@brittf1847]

As a women who loves horror/thriller movies - I absolutely loved the plot and concept of this show (having never heard of the manga). However, every time there were overtly sexualizing shots they seemed super unnecessary and did make viewing more alienating especially the focus on male fantasy at the beach. For example, sex was always presented as available to men as the women always seemed to be offering it while being barely dressed/naked in contrast (at the parties or hooking up with the hatter). There didn't seem to be any attempt to pretend that the paradise would apply to women and their sexual enjoyment. It would have honestly made more sense to me to focus on unagi's sexuality even in the context of a romance between her and Arisu but then less on the random or minor characters at the beach/shibuki's gratuitous scenes with her boss. Also, disappointing that there were very few meaningful and capable female friendships shown in the games (in contrast to Arisu and the men, other players', hatter's etc.).

[@carplays9740]

It will be because men are the ones who write .y. also there are a lot of movies that are based on female enjoyment and it is not because it is something "bad", but it is from perspective, it is also fiction!

[@moodswing_whiskey]

youre so right hfbhfsjrktfa i thought some of these scenes were very...strange , especially usagi's sexual assault scene (coming from someone who was sexually assaulted). this show is so alluring and great at first but now that more of its iffiness has been brought to my attention its just....not anymore.

[@vincyagain]

Excellent video analysis, I was very excited to watch the show but I felt to uncomfortable and let down by it but didn't really understand why. Thanks for sharing your perspective.

[@SgtHawk13]

I stumbled across this video while watching squid game reviews and honestly wasn’t expecting much from the start but you really got some interesting things to say ! 💯

[@WitandFolly]

aw thanks! I freaking loved squid game

[@xeeveeluverx]

i somewhat disagree with this take. i think the beach definitely has a deeper meaning. meant to seen as escapism from their horrible situation, like "we're all traumatized and risking our lives, let's let loose and not just be miserable all the time". it's also a way for hatter to control them, as well as keep them vulnerable. it's terrifying watching the militia massacre everyone in the entire hotel, their outfits emphasize how defenseless and vulnerable the people were. as i watched the beach arc, i didn't see it as a "male gaze" fan service arc, but rather more just... a romanticization of the beach; a perfect getaway, filled with people wanting to just have fun and enjoy themselves. i also don't think they purposely tried to make hikari "boyish", she is shown to be open and encouraging towards sex, telling usagi and arisu that they should go for eachother, and "why not" have sex since their lives in borderland are so bad, as well as winking at the super tatted guy. additionally, the actress herself is not boyish at all. sure, they don't close up on hikaris breasts every 2 seconds in the fight, but they don't do that with any other female characters either (other than shibuki). i do agree that the rape scene was unnecessary and drawn out, but i don't think it was meant to be "male gaze"y either. i think (and hope?) men would be disturbed by the scene as well, and the only people i've seen sexualize the scene are actually women who think the actor is hot.

[@xXWithoutMyHeroesXx]

i think what you say doesn't necessarily contradict her points, the Beach is indeed a "dream" and "paradise", a Male Dream. For example almost every woman in scene is wearing small bikinis, and that could be fine, but it is the camera focus and the contrast of most men wearing shirts and long shorts that sets it as Male Gaze. Men dressed for enjoyment/comfort and women dressed to Be Enjoyed. (i dont think bikinis are anyone's comfy dreamy outfit) Regarding the rpe scene, i agree it seemed to be more to show Niragi and the Beach followers as disgusting people that shouldn't be easily excused, it felt purposefully disturbing to watch.

[@EveryTimeV2]

It must be hard being called Alice for real. And always being reminded of wonderland.

[@skuggikuwa8989]

Theres nothing wrong with the male gaze in cinema as long as its not the only gaze that is gazing. Not every movie should be for everyone but there should be a movie for everyone no matter your race, creed, or gender. Not one type of film should be dominate in the mainstream and only one specific audience shouldn't be the norm when creating movies for the masses. As a male I'm tired of the same tired tropes designed to somehow convince me that this film is for me. The only thing I ask of the film's I watch is to be enjoyable and to hold true to the themes the movie itself presented to me. If I'm watching Magic Mike I know to expect shallow "this is what women want to see" (or what we think women want to see) bullshit but I wont be upset because it was expected of such film but watching Transformers there's really no reason for me to watch Megan Fox being sexy fixing a car. Its cheap and not related to the themes or story as a whole. It's designed to get me, a straight male, to pay attention because "hot girl fix car yay" Sorry for the rant.

[@ThunderTaker1215]

Where did you get an English copy??? I’m still searching.

[@cucu4844]

i don't usually watch anime because of how male gaze-y it is, but i really didn't have that with AIB. I've been reading some of the other comments and I do get what everyone means, but why didn't I feel uncomfortable with it? My thinking is that I unconsciously expect action/horror/thrillers to be worse than this when it comes to the misogyny. I didn't mind the amount of bikinis because women were still being shown as strong and capable, like to me it even felt a little empowering. Even that one scene didn't bother me as much as it seems to bother other people. I've come to expect male saviour tropes from this type of media and at least a huge amount of time was given to portray female suffering, rather than the male angst over not being able to save xyz loved female. It was disgusting in a very visceral way for me and how grossed out I felt, felt very much like only me as a female would be able to understand. (Not saying it was intended to be catered to female viewers and their personal horrors, but only why I personally didn't feel alienated by the scene) I wonder how I'll come back to it in ten years though, when more action movies/anime might have strong female characters that I can relate to. Thank you for the video!

[@-AnGeLuS-]

I agree with you. I didn't view this show as male gazey because I was totally immersed in the show. I think this video is reaching, stretching etc. Alot of generalizing going on in this video if you ask me.

[@jamilabrownie]

Yeah I agree for you aside from the rape scene. Honestly the ultra sexualized beach scenes seems to be more a deliberate critique on the mindset of the lowest common denominator during an apocalypse

[@seaweedjeff9187]

I think the "male gaze" concept is such a hyper critical way of veiwing and interpreting something. This type of thinking is ironically such a narrow point of veiw, and so is the female gaze. The heroine pure girl, is only seen as pure, why because she hasnt been seen having sex? She have led people to their deaths, she understands thats a scummy part of her yet she chooses to live. The rape scene was shown as a tragic and a sad reality to what happens when men in power, abuse such power, it was made to be uncomfortable thus raising the stakes. Ofcourse some men find it oddly sexy and im pretty sure some women also do. We have this notion that if women are seen to seem sexualized its immedietly made for men and its just that. Its not trying to.present women as mere sex objects for veiwership. The series i think has shown a good portrayal of women on the series. The "slut" girl was shown to not be the main girl because she threw her morals to just climb the corporate ladder, basically just doing the easy way out. Main girl is shown to be pure, but she isnt, she was shown to be mentally(not smarter) and physically stronger than arisu. Sunglasses girl was shown to be a smart bad ass woman, who is a very smart interrogator. Transgender girl showed the stregth in being yourself and not forgetting where you came from. Men if given the power will be pigs, thats not explicit thats reality. I honestly think all these male gaze are partly done for marketing and veiwership, but thats only for the shallow part of people. The characters and story if you delve into them are made to be such deeper than "this is just made for horny dudes". And props to mostly women and gay people that look into the "gaze of men" there are shows that just appeals to making men horny and nothing more. But this show isnt one of them, if your watching this show and always thinking "oh thats for the male gaze" then i honestly think your not.looking into the themes and concepts of the story, i think you are ironically also looking at this at a very shallow level, the same way these men who get errotically enticed by the rape scene.

[@tankedflopped9251]

i agree. aside from niragi's disgusting scene, i wasn't too focused on what they were wearing. prolly bcoz the story itself is so compelling that u just forget abt what they look like and instead view these characters as actual parts of the story instead of some fantasy fulfilling tools.

[@frannava7175]

What there two whole genre of anime for women

[@cui8789]

What's the name of the song that plays at the beginning?

[@WitandFolly]

it's actually a free to use song provided on the Filmora editor I use. they have a good selection

[@Hanna-mw5lr]

Hello, do they have the manga in English? If so where can I buy it?

[@WitandFolly]

(you can find it online for free!)

[@tamaraami5613]

@@WitandFollyaah where I really wanna read it, :)

[@JonnyKashbeatz]

Really interesting video I liked it Jus a question can you give an example of any scene that fulfills the male and female gaze plz

[@WitandFolly]

check out my video on feminine gaze if you have a chance. a good example I can provide now is The Witcher Netflix series.

[@oioi5149]

What is the song at the beginning?

[@WitandFolly]

honestly, it's a free to use one that is on Filmora. it's good tho right? they have a good selection

[@Meiiiow]

I do enjoy both male and female gazes.

[@idagergely6235]

I love your channel so much!!!

[@GameToonify]

What is the intro song?

[@outplayed_1283]

name of music in the intro?

[@treasuremage7546]

There's a study I once heard of that found when a man is staring at a woman's breasts his IQ will drop up to 50 points depending on its baseline. This is presumably why there's professional female poker players that will show as much cleavage is possible, and why it would also make strategic sense for Borderland contenders to employ similar strategies. Every moment a guy is checking out your body is a moment he isn't thinking about the game. Almost everyone at the beach is someone that's survived at least one round, so most would be serious minded enough to take whatever advantage they can get.

[@savarin0]

while i personally don’t think this was the author/director’s intention, this is a really interesting take. women weaponizing their femininity is definitely a trope

[@user-wg3js6uv7z]

I always rolling my eyes when a strong women in a movie always characterized as to wearing too revealing clothes and amazing body and a plus having 'cool' personality, its just ... come on... and this happened often in an action movie since you know ,,,

[@EmilioReyes_97]

Your analysis is very informative and thought provoking, and a lot of the points you made I tend to agree with. When art is being led by a male's vision, giving more focus on a woman's body, for better or worse, is kinda bound to happen, going as far as exploitation and fan service where even guys will start rolling there eyes at how ridicules it can be. I also liked the argument you made on how a character can/should be the subject of sexuality not the serialized object. As a man and artist myself I do this too in a sense, while defiantly not all the time I am one of the many people who like drawing woman more, in ways that exude some type of sexuality driven theme. Though to coincide with one of your last points I try to have a level of self awareness to make sure what I draw doesn't turn into something exploitative, That said I do have some criticisms id like to mention if feedback is ok. 1st; I went and watched your essay on the feminine gaze and saw how you decided to call it feminine as opposed to female gaze, to try and discredit the idea that only females can produce and appreciate. But you decided ro call this video male gaze, which I think is just kinda hypocritical. 2nd. While being a guy might make me a little bias in thinking this, I find it odd that this idea of masculine vs feminine gaze seems to boil down to Feminine gaze=Emphasis on emotions and good cinematography Masculine gaze= Boys are horny.... Just my thoughts on the matter, if i'm misconstruing anything then maybe ill do more research for myself on this topic

[@WitandFolly]

so I think the male/masculine terms when referencing gaze are interchangeable because of the context. the female gaze is not defineable, but the male gaze is. it depends on the studies and the discourse that exist about that topic. many accept the "male gaze" as a term and the legitimacy of the term compounds based on the literature that uses it. the female gaze, as a term, doesn't have the same weight. my main point in using the term "feminine gaze" is to point out that the white, hetero, male gaze is the prominent gaze in media. feminine gaze is a rebellion of sorts. it stands against it, in many ways. that said, I will try to differentiate more going forward. I don't think the male or masculine gaze = boys are horny. I don't think these are objectively bad. I'm a huge follower of Jungian and Campbellian ideas. I also love the mythopoetic men's movement, inadvertently led by Robert Bly. so it's a weird tangle of terms I feel are fluid and dependent upon what the society is going through at the time

[@magicfist482]

I really was annoyed at the changes they made to Shibuki's character

[@0hate9]

ngl, I laughed out loud when you played the licking sound effect

[@mlr.9257]

Her name isn't Hikari, it's Kuina! ^^ And... I understand and agree with a lot of the stuff you're saying, as a woman myself I notice these things too. Not sure if I agree with everything though. But this was very interesting!

[@thelistener5440]

Thank for the video! I actually had my issues with it, too, that made it uncomfortable in parts to watch. The male gaze in the later parts kind of flew under my radar. So I would like to add some other points: When the Beach was introduced, all the pleasures and "luxury" of the Beach is shown, and the Boss is introduced as a very powerful character. This power/pleasure for him is also depicted by women as objects. I ASSUME that it's supposed to show that he is not the best character from a moral POV, but I am not even really sure. This trope, having women as objects standing next to luxury goods as symbol for power, is still sooo common in media, that it might as well serve as a "neutral" power depiction. This just has to stop. Also I have kind of a problem with this whole plot structure of this typical shonen story (also common in Western media ...). We have a male zero-to-hero story, which is fine, but rarely seems to happen with female characters in the "media mainstream". But while Arisu is shown as someone who would not really have it easy to get a girl at the beginning by the common standards ("shabby" appearance, not interested in a job/taking responsibility, playing video games all the time), his love interest in the show is introduced as a very strong and desireable character from a male POV - physically strong in the games, but also not lossing her temper, acting "cool" at the beginning, and with more knowledge than our main protagonists. But with both getting closer to each other over time, she seems to loose this strength, morphing into that innocent character that is a damsel in distress in some scenes. A male fantasy in every aspect. I am so tired of that. I would love to see her getting her strength back in season 2, independently of Arisu, and I would even more love to see them NOT getting together, but just being friends. But of course this may not exist, a male and female protagonist like these cannot exist without even trying to hook up, it's just such a heteronormative and amatonormative POV.

[@TheReMorseCode]

This was really well done! I loved the show, and didn’t think of any of this while watching, somehow. I guess because I was super into a few male characters I wasn’t confronted with my usual boredom at the male cast when watching shows shot from the male gaze. But what you said all makes sense. The transphobic thing is especially interesting, I would’ve never made that connection but I think that might sadly hold weight. I wonder how one would portray an equal amount of male and female gaze, if that’s possible? There’s a complexity to it, because sexualizing men in the same way that women are sexualized isn’t necessarily feeding into the desires of women as much as it is just flipping the male gaze on its head in terms of what gender it targets. You could say that there is a level of a real female gaze, considering how many women I’ve seen lusting over long haired guy (forget his name) and Nigari on the internet. Clearly, somebody cared enough to make male characters attractive to women. They’re not scantily dressed like many of the girls (though long haired guy Is showing a lot of chest with his half unzipped hoodie, as well as both wearing fairly feminine makeup, both being more feminine in appearance in general, etc.) But, is that all really necessary? Isn’t the male gaze about portraying women in the idealized way for heterosexual men, and what constitutes that is just the consequence of that mindset? I’m not sure if I’m making sense, but I’m not really looking for an answer. Just meditating on what AiB would look like for people to view the show as exhibiting an equal sexualization/objectification of men and women. I know this may sound weird, but I do think it would be more desirable to sexualize both to the same level as the women at in this show rather than desexualize women to the level men are in this show. The over the top sexualization struck me as in line with the style of the show itself, where the character design, show plot, sets etc are very eccentric, loud, escapist, etc.

[@renab.7390]

I think so too. Having fanservice shots for both sides, sexualizing both males and females (in moderation) to entice viewers would not only be fairer but also attract more viewers overall. With moderation I mean getting rid of fanservice in assault scenes by showing the perspective of the victim. Whereas lower-stakes situations should still include some nice eyecandy shots for both the male and female gaze. Also, have both male and female actors wear revealing clothing (they did quite a good job here by showing hatter's chest and half of Chichiya's but they could even out the playing field more) and act flirty/sexy from time to time if it fits the character (f.e. Kuina always playing with that fake smoke).

[@TheReMorseCode]

@@renab.7390 I agree with all this! Despite him being a horrible guy they did do the flirty/sexy thing with Nigari pretty well with the weird tongue thing, the condescension/intimidation etc, but I do feel like they definitely did it more so with female characters and I wish it was more balanced in that regard.

[@strawbbiez]

that scene of chota came off so wrong to me... i feel like he didn't want her at all. it was very uncomfortable to see

[@WitandFolly]

yeah this was weird. I think maybe they were thinking he thought she was holy? but it didn't fit because he had no reason to believe she was other than her being pretty, which is a very outdated theme, even for shounen

[@TheReMorseCode]

Does anyone know if in the manga it seemed more consensual? When watching it, I read it as a rape scene because he seemed scared, never seemed to be or said he was into it at any point, plus the flashback to a traumatic childhood memory as it was happening. I don’t know how someone could read it as anything else unless it was super different in the manga..

[@hailee176]

@@TheReMorseCode It’s a lot more explicit in the show, they don’t show much of what happens in the manga but I think there was some weird dialogue as well, like “I have needs” or something weird like that. There are missing parts from the show though, like he sees her naked in the river and accidentally walks in on her changing in the manga but they don’t show the sex scene.

[@TheReMorseCode]

@@hailee176 Oh that’s interesting, thanks for the reply

[@Kaustubhdasdehlvi]

This was a really well done critique with plenty of insightful observations

[@lovorka3321]

Your analysis is very interesting thank you 😊 🙏

[@01lei]

I can sit through and watch something but that doesn’t stop me or others from feeling itchy when we watch it 💀💀. I still get uneasy

[@theplanethaskimnamjoon]

I was watching Alice in Borderland with my brothers and I always try to educate them about what we are watching in a way that I explain it in a semantic way and film way. I was particularly not comfortable with Niragi and Usagi's scene and so do my brothers so we skipped that part.

[@nicole-ls4jb]

I agree to the series and the manga being very compelling, but the male gaze and the misogyny (*especially* in the manga) require me to do extra work to disregard many things that make me uncomfortable. The only good thing I can say about Kuina wearing a bikini was when she was facing Final Boss. It drove home how extremely vulnerable she was going up against that sword with only her speed and timing to protect her.

[@linalaamari9288]

Wow, u explained everything so clearly!

[@imanolajide4532]

* Manga Spolier* For anyone thats read the manga are you worried on how they would bring aguni and niragi back into the story because the ending of season 1 made it seem liked they died. but there integral parts of the next phase/ part of the borderlands. Honestly kinda worried season 2 might change even more from the manga.

[@George-ue9qc]

Yep me. They play such massive roles in season 2 in the manga that they have to be alive, unless the show plans to have Arisu and Usagi defeat most of the citizens, like they had Arisu and Usagi beat the four of clubs game :// Without Niragi, Chishiya won’t get the most defining moment of his character arc either.

[@hmyt_]

YOURE SO REAL THIS IS ON POINT

[@leaderstxt]

Loved that drama can't wait for the second season.

[@antonykamau4436]

You have completely opened my eyes, I think the male gaze is in a way damaging towards male views because it repeats an unwanted cycle of females being viewed as solely objects. This type of shows/movies can lead a young viewer unconsciously into "porn" which in turn adds more fuel to the burning house.

[@dogsilliam]

great video!! super interesting

[@xellffs6258]

female gaze link?

[@lightskinninja9340]

“Those who look close to the ground will only see dirt, I hope to see things from a greater distance” -Samuel Johnson Looking to far into something always comes with the risk of losing appreciation for it. It’s not fair to critique someone simply because you believe they could’ve been better or done something differently. To the person creating the subject matter they are simply striving to fulfill their own vision. I will say though your video is very well done and it does point the finger at an issue that more people should have their eyes on. Media should be made for all gazes, I just don’t think every piece of media should be for all gazes. A creator should always be able to choose what type of story he/she wants to create and how he/she wishes to present it.

[@WitandFolly]

I didn't say the show was bad. I enjoy it a lot. Hell, I watched it three times. It was an opportunity to illustrate what was male gaze that I didn't want to pass up. I'm certainly not calling for any sort of censorship on media.

[@lightskinninja9340]

@@WitandFolly I figured you weren’t calling for that. Like I said overall the video you made was very well done and a lot of great insights where made. I actually feel this show needs the male gaze to take precedence in it for it to tell the story the way arisu is experience it. This ultimately is arisu’s story but if it was following usagi’s journey then I think the male gaze would feel out of place. I don’t want you to think I have an issue with your video, I enjoyed it. My comment was centered around the fact that both male and female gazes have their place in media. You mentioned the woman who couldn’t enjoy media after realizing the male gaze was the norm. I think in regards to her she probably didn’t think the world would accept the female gaze, however since then the world has changed a bit and there are some really decent examples of female gaze in media now.

[@WitandFolly]

I appreciate your kind response. I think you may misunderstand male gaze just a bit. The gaze is not created based on the perspective of the main character. Rather, it's created because of the intention of the person who created the story, either conscious or unconscious. A female gaze story can exist with a main character who is male. The creators are putting forth what they think the audience wants to see, what they themselves want to see, or both. No story "needs" to be told from a certain gaze. This story could have been told from a female or neutral gaze. Squid Game, for example, is told from a neutral gaze, with lots of moments that feel like a feminine gaze. I don't remember exactly what I said, but when I said that I had a moment of realization, my moment was about that - the realization. I didn't just not enjoy the media I enjoyed before. I see it differently, I can't help it.

[@WitandFolly]

all that said, yeah, I can't help but be frustrated in seeing this show use some tone deaf themes. I may be radical for me to say this but we won't have a true understanding of female/feminine gaze until women are the majority of writers/creators of western film.

[@lightskinninja9340]

@@WitandFolly I don’t think it needs to a majority one way or another. I just think there needs to be a plethora of the three gazes within the mainstream. People decide the media they enjoy regardless. If you had great examples of all three gazes people would naturally gravitate to the experiences that resonate with them the most. If we use this convo as an example you prefer squid games over Alice and in my perspective Alice feels like the better show. But that’s the beauty of having different experiences. One can choose what feels most right to them.

[@joncudiamat4491]

Great thanks for helping me with my film studies presentation

[@teller2488]

Where’s the male gaze Chishiya I know Im not the only one who wanted it

[@skyalexander8408]

Great video! I really liked this show but did notice some things being a little off, now i can show my bf what I meant lol

[@gwyn7327]

i really hope more japanese series stray away from the male gaze. ive seen a fee but there’s still a lot to go

[@WitandFolly]

Asian dramas tend to carry the feminine gaze quite well. there aren't a ton of Japanese live action dramas, but the ones based on shoujo manga are excellent. ie Good Morning Call and Hana Yori Dango 👌🏻

[@samiadjifr]

the thing is most anime/manga series and its adaptations are so so so so full of male gaze, it’s actually one of staple tropes of the media. it feels like its almost impossible to not have that. it becomes impossible now to start reading new mangas. sigh…

[@WitandFolly]

this is why shoujo manga should be more widely adapted into anime and live action. people forget it exists

[@19eightyforeisnow]

This commentary is the definition of the road to Hell being paved with good intentions.

[@daydreaming11117]

Amazing video!

[@user-th7us1fl9x]

It's a man's world not all humans.

[@zianawind2970]

I’m glad to see all this videos about male gaze. I think by now humanity has been raped and abused by media programming. There are so many dumb things we learned to take for granted instead of realizing how much psychological impact they have on society. Movies and shows could be really deep and teach people about themselves much more if they actually tried. And many people have become so accustomed to being dumbed down that few (though way more nowadays) venture to support more alternative or thought provoking entertainment

[@badcatzgamedevelopmentcomp4808]

It's funny how professional screenwriters, people in a writing room, showrunners, or pro directors, both men and women think the 'male gaze' theory is trash. And they're right, I write for the screen and I write what I want, WHY DON"T FEMINIST?