Alma 23-29 Part 1 • Lori Denning • July 8-14 • Come Follow Me

Can people change? Professor Lori Denning brings to life the story of the Anti-Nephi-Lehis through understanding the power of poetry, covenant, and conversion to the gospel of Jesus Christ.
SHOW NOTES/TRANSCRIPTS
English: tinyurl.com/podcastBM28EN
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Portuguese: tinyurl.com/podcastBM28PT
Spanish: tinyurl.com/podcastBM28ES
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TIMECODE
00:00 Part I - Professor Lori Denning
00:46 Background to the chapters
03:34 Bio of Professor Denning
04:28 Come, Follow Me Manual
05:46 Professor Denning shares a story about volleyball
08:39 Can people change?
10:23 Mormon’s teaching moments
12:53 Power of stories on the human brain
16:54 Alma 23 - Literary techniques
18:49 Alma 23:1-2 - Resumptive repetition
23:15 Powerful first words and difficult missions
27:04 Alma 23:3 - King converted through love and a literary motif
32:47 Gathering Israel
35:21 Alma 23:6-7 - Never fell away after conversion
40:47 Professor Denning shares a personal story of a new ward
43:25 Alma 23:13, 25 - Laid down weapons
45:44 Abraham Lincoln story
49:20 Alma 24:7-16 - a speech and a new identity
52:18 A name change
56:33 Nicknames
58:02 Alma 24:16-18 -Burying swords
1:00:25 Professor Denning shares a story about using her powers for evil
1:06:15 Living in contention
1:09:00 - End of Part 1 - Professor Lori Denning
Thanks to the followHIM team:
Steve & Shannon Sorensen: Cofounder, Executive Producer, Sponsor
David & Verla Sorensen: Sponsors
Dr. Hank Smith: Co-host
John Bytheway: Co-host
David Perry: Producer
Kyle Nelson: Marketing, Sponsor
Lisa Spice: Client Relations, Editor, Show Notes
Jamie Neilson: Social Media, Graphic Design
Will Stoughton: Video Editor
Krystal Roberts: Translation Team, English & French Transcripts, Website
Ariel Cuadra: Spanish Transcripts
"Let Zion in Her Beauty Rise" by Marshall McDonald
www.marshallmcdonaldmusic.com

[@sueellenlacey18]

I make crochet sleep mats for the homeless, and this is what I do during your podcasts!

[@kathrynquinn6889]

I love the thought: When you’ve had an experience with the Lord, you’re never at the mercy of a person with an opinion.

[@jessicasorenson4829]

Lori is one of my favorite guests. I'm so glad she's back on! I love her unique insights. I'm definitely a literary nerd and I love learning from Lori.

[@gatorcorinne]

I absolutely love Lori Denning's teachings! Please please please bring her back. She is both entertaining and enlightening! Her teaching makes me want to dive back into the scriptures.

[@judysessions3364]

This is the first time I have heard Lori Denning. I absolutely enjoyed her, she is very down to earth and one feels like what she is telling us can be accomplished.

[@RuthReid-p1b]

I mow our school lawn every Tuesday and listen to this podcast!

[@hciammt365]

Lori is a fencer, so it does not surprise me that she collects helmets and swords. Years ago, Lori and I were in the same YSA ward. She was my Relief Society president. At the ward talent show, she performed a fencing number-- in her full fencing gear, with "DENNING" properly printed down the side of her uniform. Everyone was so impressed. I was so happy to get her updates when she was on the show last year. Great to hear from her again. You should ask her about her fencing next time.

[@R3dR1der70]

hey! great to hear my nerdy fencing made an impression!! Hilarious. I didn't even remember doing that....

[@taniasadarakamahoni4639]

Lori was so wonderful. Enlightening and inspiring. She was so down to earth and made the stories so relevant. Loved her and this podcast.

[@lindamoody4094]

Elder Bednar’s conference address in October 2012-“Converted Unto the Lord”-goes along so well with the thoughts shared in Alma 23!

[@bryceschieving7865]

Bro Smith, The nugget that you share here when you say ""...it seems the staying power [related to remaining faithful to the gospel of Jesus Christ] is I came to know the Lord, I had my own experience with the Lord. Because once you have your own experience, a person with an experience is never at the mercy of a person with an opinion." This is a MUST learn principle for EVERY member of the church. Thank you for this!

[@trishakunz4305]

I love Sister Denning! She is smart, funny, and interesting. I could listen to her all day! What a great teacher.

[@peggybogar3059]

I think of how hard it must be to give up an addiction. I hope for it for the conversion of someone I love dearly. This has been a wonderful session, so lively. Thank you all.

[@mikecarver8166]

I'm always excited when I see sister Denning as a guest on these podcasts. I just relate to her. I think because she's just so honest and vulnerable. I'm glad people much smarter than me show me that I'm not alone in my struggles. I was moved by the "burying the scriptures as a weapon" metaphor. I was the same way on my mission. I hate to admit that. And I'm still like that today at times on social media. But you've made me think - burying my overzealousness is probably a good idea. I could say the same about my driving. Man, I gotta bury that really deep. Thank you for that. Personal application of the scriptures is what its all about. Not reading just words on a page. ❤

[@LindaSpotts]

You can still have an amazing spiritual experience, and fall away from the church. It happened to me, and it was because I fell to the influences of the world. But I have held on to those experiences, which brought me back to the gospel. It's just been a hard climb, but well worth it!!!! I know the Book of Mormon is the word of God!!!

[@disney_freak57]

So great!!! I love her comments and testimony! So real and helpful!!!

[@janette2.0]

Former middle school English teacher here, and self-proclaimed Literary Nerd! I love all of the nerdiness in this episode! Thank you, Prof. Denning! I was so excited to see that you were back. I remember the sandwich story, too. I also love the props you brought to this episode!

[@mikegillettify]

Professor Denning has been a favorite guest!! Great show. I listen on apple podcast, often watch on living scriptures, and am in Wichita Falls, TX

[@jacobtryon6402]

This podcast is amazing. Have enjoyed John by the way for years. You guys are so insightful! Listening from scorching Mesa, AZ

[@BeKindRemind]

Love this. Thank you so much! Conversion is our process, through the grace of the Savior, of becoming like Him. It is a conversion like any chemical or physiological change (like a caterpillar becoming a butterfly). That is why we must be converted to Him. We must be changed to be like Him.

[@sharmsmith1672]

Buster and I are loving this from Springville! Funny and life changing!

[@aroumamatautia4206]

Love yous all especially Lori for simplifying the lessons to yourself n each of us helping motivate me to Change from the old me to become more converted to the Lord

[@CynthiaC.Rodriguez-rt5fr]

Sometimes, in our zeal to share the gospel, we inadvertently can say too much or say it in a way where the words come out of our mouth condescendingly. I' m guilty of the latter. I repented. I asked for forgiveness. But that person chooses not to return to church. My heart aches because I can't change what happened. Lesson learned. Henceforth: What ( or how) would Jesus do ( or say)? And then I act accordingly.

[@jstaheli222]

Thank you, thank you for your goodness and testimony of our Savior and the Book of Mormon!

[@aroumamatautia4206]

My Dad named me Arouma after the movie he watched while mum n me were in hospital "Arouma of the lsles"

[@terripontius6257]

I love this lady! Lori is as brilliant as she is authentic and real! This is one of my favorite lessons ever. She really spoke to my soul, and I felt a great spirit of truth here. I hope you have her on lots, Hank and John!

[@amyfallon4951]

I love love love this episode! Lori is so fantastic! I needed this particular episode on so many levels! Every few minutes I got a whole new humbling lesson that I needed personally! Stories vs lecture is where the principles come so powerfully! Thank you! ❤

[@normapellett1606]

Those lists always amused me because in raising 3 boys, I had to be very specific in advising my sons not to hurt one another. You may not poke them or hit them or taunt them or swing things that might hit them or say mean things or . . .

[@truthseeker3154]

I just want to express my gratitude . I am so grateful for this channel. It has been an anchor for me. I look forward to listening in part one AND two. I feel connected to Hank and John and the scriptures and the special guests. Great scripture friends that I have been needing. Thank you!

[@CalebBrown228]

Great stories!

[@saragroves4103]

Thank you, Hank Smith, for your comments about "once you have a spiritual experience like Joseph Smith's, you can never go back! The spiritual experience I received when I learned of the Sacred Grove experience has been my strength upon which I continue to build! And like Joseph, I knew it and I knew God knew it and I could not deny it, nor would I ever want to deny it! 46 years ago this October and it is still as vivid as when it happened! That happened in Ohio, where I was born and lived for 79 years, before moving to Utah for my final years. Love how you, John and your guests teach and share!❤

[@sarahmacdonald4362]

Love this podcast one of my favorites.

[@dalegibson3443]

From Kaysville; I loved Lori's story about turning from bashing with other religions. We may have differing doctrines but we should unite as followers of Christ, regardless of our religion. I also served in Spain and the church was relatively new in Spain (I served in the late 70's). I saw many new converts to other churches and I frequently felt, "Oh, if we had only been here sooner we could have had that person a member of our church. They would be such faithful members."

[@brendaorozco1203]

My mom and grandma grew up in Kaysville! I have such good memories of family reunions there!

[@kristayates8942]

Lori is one of my favorite guests! She is a phenomenal teacher! I love her stories, and they have helped me become converted to the Lord. Great episodes (part 1 and part 2 😉)!

[@sarahfunk8879]

I always always listen to parts 1 & 2, love every episode so much!

[@pocybassnovice4798]

Each time I see/hear Professor Denning she bring my joy.

[@brycehall2311]

Working a puzzle together on a Sunday afternoon is what we do in our household - it helps us to stay alert and focused on the FollowHim presentation of the week. In the time to complete that week's podcast we are usually able to finish a 300-500 piece puzzle. It is our new weekly routine.

[@elizabethpeterson9914]

This was so excellent! I kept hearing wonderful ideas that I thought would be great to use as I teach this lesson in Young Women's on Sunday, but then I remembered, I only have 50 minutes! And this is only part one!

[@terivaughn2575]

Hank and John you are soooo right, when you are converted to the Lord you have staying power for good ❤

[@evaang3616]

Beautiful podcast❤

[@SusanSouthworth-oz8de]

I do diamond art while I’m listening to Follow Him.

[@user-ym2rc2mt9q]

SOOOO THANKFUL.......

[@anniecardon8769]

She taught was my favorite class at Women's Conference, it was testimony changing. ( Hank and John loved your class too!)

[@cindykinser7850]

Same experience of Bible bashing when I served in the Deep South (Bible Belt)…… what a lesson I learned! Totally related to that

[@AdamBlack-k1p]

Hank you always mention people that might be folding laundry or walking to class on campus. How about those of us that are hunting axis deer with a bow and arrow on Maui?This is a great midday listen. Love the program. Haha

[@renatemckendry104]

Awesome!! Love her! Definitely will watch part two tomorrow evening! More hats and swords!?! Hopefully more great stories! 🇨🇦❤

[@janetwarner7710]

I love book of Mormon. I have a list of my favorite words.My very favorite is FOR. Others are AND, THEN, THING/WORD, THAT, THIS/THAT The list just goes on. Praise the Lord for Mormon and his unique writing style

[@steelers639]

I loved the episode! I’ve been listening for several years. I always listen while I am feeding, herding, sorting, loading, transporting and medicating cattle on a large Angus Cattle Ranch in Okarche Oklahoma! Thank you so much for helping me make come follow me more meaningful, insightful, and fulfilling! I love the spirit that is here every week and I love love love your guest. I even love the dry humor, but especially Barney Fife! Hahaha Again, thank you for what you’re doing. It definitely strengthens. My testimony. Gives me a lot of things to think about! You guys are doing an amazing job!! Todd Waltman

[@christineduke673]

I love that you pulled out the phrase “converted unto the Lord.” I checked the Scripture Citation Index, and in all the standard works this phrase is only found in the Book of Mormon. And in the Book of Mormon it is only found in Alma, 3 Nephi and 4 Nephi; 12 are in Alma. I think it is an incredibly important principle for our day when Satan would tempt us to be converted to so many of the teachings of the “great and spacious building.” Thank you for all your incredible guests who invite us to truly study the scriptures and make them the roadmap for our lives to find our way back to the Savior and be truly converted to Him and become His disciples.

[@audreyschmidt2916]

Thanks from Southern Colorado, for the stories a d nerd words!

[@gerihallows2204]

Sister Denning makes me laugh! She is amazing!😅

[@treberbell]

I obsessed with Lori, but not in a creepy way. I love her take on things and that she gives Hank and John assignments! I love how much fun she is and how, even though she is a self proclaimed gospel and literary device nerd, she still makes things accessible for the rest of us mortals.

[@jennysaxton2826]

She is FABULOUS! So relatable!

[@alyssaromney9451]

I listen as I get ready for work in the mornings! Also, thank you so much Hank, for what you said about YSA women and missions. Looking at Alma's mission from that perspective helps me see more of my value since I didn't serve a mission.

[@dinocollins720]

Fantastic lesson! Thank you!

[@kathrynquinn6889]

A person who has had an experience with the Lord ( and my experience is that witness of the Holy Ghost confirms that experience) is never at the mercy of a person with an opinion-including when I am the person with an opinion

[@user-ki6rd2rw7s]

Oh my goodness, my sister played softball and volleyball in San Diego! She went on to play for UCLA, and won 2 national championships. It's so much fun to see someone who has so much in common with my sister and I.

[@charlottehatch6696]

Denning is my top 5 guests of all time.

[@vickiewiderberg510]

Lori taught in a retirement center we were serving in. She was awesome and the residents loved her.

[@kenpearce3269]

Thanks for another beautiful lesson! ❤

[@alisonbock8527]

Yea! Professor Denning in the scriptures. A very favorite thing! Thankyou and many blessings. ab

[@user-wu3bk6vs8n]

I agree! The staying power is being converted to the lord. ❤

[@kentolmstead7558]

I haven't finished the episode yet, but love the literary nerdiness. I love that Professor Denning is shouting out Alma as the possible author of much of these chapters, as Mormon clearly calls out before Alma 17 ("...according to the record of Alma."). Can't wait to see why Alma 29 is her favorite chapter. It's mine too. (And eventually more people will agree that Mormon likely learned "Thus we see" from Alma in these chapters and was then moved to use this literary method in the balance of his abridgement. Eventually I hope we see this section as "Comprising Chapters 17-29" closing with Alma's testimony of the Lord, the universality of His work, and Alma's great joy from the mission of his beloved brethren.)

[@12ZekeS]

Two "literary nerd" moments of mine in these chapters: 1) "All we can do" - In 2 Ne 25:23, Nephi states that "for we know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do." There have been many addresses given in relation to what this means, but the best discourse (in my opinion) is from The Book of Mormon itself. In Alma 24:11, the new king Anti-Nephi-Lehi teaches that "since it has been all that we could do to repent of all our sins...for it was all we could do to repent sufficiently before God". "All we can do" is exactly what King Lamoni's father did, in offering to "give away all [our] sins to know [God]" (Alma 22:18). 2) "Anti-Nephi-Lehies" - A second significant conversation revolves around why those converted by Ammon and his brethren chose the name of "Anti-Nephi-Lehies". I think we have complicated this too much by searching for Egyptian roots, etc. To me, these converts were forsaking the curse of separation from God, and laying claim to the promise made to their forefathers (the children of Laman and Lemuel) by Lehi in 2 Ne 4:3-9. They were, in effect, saying "While we are not descendants of Nephi, we are descendants of Lehi, and therefore lay claim to the promises made to his posterity by the Lord." Thus, while there were not of Nephi's lineage, they WERE of Lehi's lineage, and were identifying themselves as part of the covenant family that God brought out of Jerusalem. Just my 2 cents that I wanted to share for all you other literary nerds out there!

[@trainguy7261]

Our ward still does missionary farewell talks and homecoming talks like it always has.

[@sharlaisle1202]

One day as I was in High School in Las Vegas, Nevada, I had read a book by John Bytheway. It had said that if someone calls you "Snow White" look at them and smile and say :"Thank-you!" There was this guy I knew and I found out he was on drugs and he knew me. As he walked down the hall way at high school he asked me if I wanted to go with him and do some sort of smoking drug. I told him :"NO!" He turned around and called me : "Snow White!" I was so excited he called me that and I had read that book. So, I smiled and looked at that guy and said: "Thank You!" I was so grateful I had read this book and knew exactly what to say! So, thanks Brother Bytheway!

[@j0l3n3s1m0n]

Thank you all FOR it ALL. Yes. I share kinship with WordNerds

[@ATableBeforeMe]

🎶With helmet in place, sword in hand, with the shield of faith she is worthy To stand🎶

[@master_of_jak]

I'm listening to this episode on my phone and heard you all talking about Anti-Nephi-Lehi and the possible origins of the name. I was surprised that no one mentioned the way I always thought of it, so I figured I'd share that here: After the Lord commanded Nephi to flee with all those who would listen to him, the people of Lehi were divided into two camps: the Nephites and the Lamanites. If you were a Nephite then you weren't a Lamanite, and vice versa. Anti-Nephi-Lehi could mean 'the children of Lehi who were not Nephites', ergo, Lamanites. The name of Anti-Nephi-Lehi could have been a way to help them feel like a distinct people, separate from the Nephites while leaving behind the association with Laman and his rebellions.

[@sarahmiller501]

Hurrah for literary nurds! I think Isaiah is in this group! (Watching from the UK. thank you for a master class every week in how to facilitate others and not show off your own knowledge. I have much to learn).

[@HeidiQuist]

I'm a bit of a literary nerd, though not as good as I wish I was. I like the terms and seeing how they're used. This was a fun episode. I am a bit more of a rhetoric nerd, though also not as good as I wish I was. But seeing how it's used in the Book of Mormon has been a mini-passion I've had. Many years ago, when I was a sophomore at BYU, I wrote a paper for my first English major writing class showing how rhetoric was used in Mormon 8, and it was really eye opening how well Mormon used Aristotelian principles and organization in his letter to his son. I think it was a blessing then that I was able to understand as much as I did in the stacks because I've tried reading Aristotle since then and I get a little bit lost, but I definitely think there's value in seeing how literary and rhetorical principles are applied by the writers of the Book of Mormon. They were very intelligent people.

[@marietripp5667]

This was wonderful!!

[@appleaday365]

Does anyone remember when BYU started allowing shorts on campus? It was 1987. They revised the dress code, stating that knee length trousers would be permitted. This was very much welcomed by the student body. Then someone wrote a hilarious, HILARIOUS note in the "Letter to the Editor" section of the Daily Universe (the campus newspaper) about how exposing our lower legs was wrong. Then signed it "Anti-KneeHigh-Levis.". Every time I read Alma 23, I remember this, and chuckle. 😂 I'm sure BYU has an archive of that letter. Somone should dig it up! 😂😂

[@user-ly9cm7ur4k]

She is so awesome ❤

[@sueburdett8066]

Boy, I really felt this.

[@user-jf3tl7zj1k]

Welcome Sister Denning. I live in Spokane, home of Gonzaga love your presentation.

[@marciaogden8525]

I’ve been reading a book called, Men With a Mission, about the first leaders of the Church who went on missions to Britain. They often signed their letters, Your Brother in the Lord or in the Covenant. Maybe I will start signing my emails, Marcia Ogden, your sister in the covenant.

[@cammilarsen1334]

I want to be part of the club!! Literary? Yes!

[@april1st23]

...when a governmental LEADER converts to the gospel of JESUS CHRIST it makes a HUGE difference in area citizen's acceptance of the gospel...as in this case of the Lamanites in Ammon's day...

[@suzianderson6435]

I’m more of a word nerd rather than a literary nerd

[@judyhansen3272]

Count me in as a word nerd.

[@dinocollins720]

Callandor, the Sword That Is Not a Sword??? Wheel of Time??? 😂

[@elainew6441]

You're very own Taylor Halverson is another word nerd