America's Obscure Steam Locomotives 3

[@thepiratepilot1507]

Glad to see someone covering the UP's forgotten 3-cylinder design, however, I would like to add a bit more clarity regarding the UP 4-10-2 locomotives though. First, regarding the name, the reason they were called "Overlands" wasn't because the 4-12-2s had already taken the name "Union Pacific Type". (keep in mind that 8000, the original UP 4-10-2, was built in 1925, whereas the 4-12-2s were built beginning in 1926) The name instead came from the UP's iconic "Overland limited" passenger train, and the Overland Route (like you said). Second, it's no coincidence that both the SP's 4-10-2s and UP's 4-10-2s were built in the same year. The SP and UP 4-10-2s were both constructed by ALCo (The SP ones were constructed by Schenectady, and the UP ones were constructed by Brooks). The reason both were ordered and delivered around the same time was due to ALCo advertising their 3-cylinder locomotives to the companies, as locomotives that were more powerful than a standard rigid frame locomotive of the time, yet faster than the mallet locomotives of the time. And third, the UP 4-10-2s were not only used on the Overland Route, they were also used on the LA&SL in California, where they fared better as the 2-cylinder rebuilds. All of these can be excused because, as this series implies, these locomotives are obscure, thus information regarding them is scarce, I myself am fortunate enough to have a copy of "The Union Pacific Type: Volume I" by William Kratville, which also covers the development process of the 4-10-2s. Overall, this is a fantastic video and I, in no way shape or form, am trying to be rude or anything like that.

[@ROBERTNABORNEY-f3k]

In the CNJ's defense, the NYC did not save a single one of its vaunted Hudsons and the Jersey Central was having cash flow problems by the mid-Fifties. BUT, the 774 still runs! In HO scale. It was imported in the Mid-Sixties by Red Ball - the house brand of THE Model Railroad Shop in Dunnellen NJ, my local hobby dealer. I wanted one so badly, but a 14vyear old just didn't have money. Imagine my joy when I opened my Christmas presents that year and found myself the proud owner of one! Mom and Dad have been gone for years, but every time I run it, I think of them. I had it painted with no weathering, bright and shiny parade ground style, ready to head a fan trip. I have installed DCC, Kadee Couplers, a working headlight and replaced the original magnets for the "Pittman" type open frame motor with rare earth super magnets (notably increasing pulling power and low speed ability)

[@mattsmocs3281]

774 and 831 were both meant to be preserved but both faced weird issues such as 831 accidentally being cut up on the B&O tracks in JC and 774 was gonna be bought by a group but they missed the chance, the B&O nearly scooped it up but it was used to fix 592 up. 113 is atleast running, the best of any anthracite road steamers in operation (made up almost entirely by mine locos and reading T1’s outside of her)

[@moosecat]

When I think of the Jersey Central, the two things that pop into mind are "The Blue Comet", and the Camelback 10-wheelers.

[@willhorowitz8806]

The name “Lollipop” either came from the fact they were long by 1915 standards and were the largest engines on the Pennsy system at the time. Or it was the name of a horse (not sure if it was drag or race).

[@amtrakproductions-mx9ib]

Or maybe its because some of the L1s ran on lollipops LOL

[@Pensyfan19]

Great episode again! Never knew that the semi streamlined Wabash hudsons were originally Mikados. Likewise, the famous Reading T1s were also rebuilt from much smaller Mikados, which also initially had chonky boilers.

[@jonathanj8303]

I'm 99.9% sure that there are HO scale drawings of the Wabash hudsons in the steam edition of "Locomotive Cyclopedia". I've also seen drawings of the Reading T1's but I can't remember if it was in the same book.

[@mikestudioz216]

Correction: the Reading T1s were rebuilt from Consolidations, not Mikados

[@williamclarke4510]

The Reading T-1 s were rebuilt from large consolidations.

[@SouRwy4501Productions]

Indeed. I used to have a model of one of those consolidations. They were classified as i10sa, and were numbered 2000 to 2050.

[@Sleeper____1472]

I wouldn't quite say the L1s are obscure, but they are definitely in the shadow of the Decapods. Also, fun fact about 520; she is a boiler explosion survivor. And a note on the UP stuff, you'll almost always hear an overland referred to as an 8000, along with the Union Pacifics as 9000s.

[@DillianTrainzStudios]

If you decide to do another episode, I want you to discuss the B&M’s T-1s (despite the fact that they were shitty locomotives.)

[@the_greenwood551]

At least some were lucky to ended on Santa Fe and Southern Pacific, who actually fix them and make them decent looking engines.

[@kingkoopa64]

Fun fact: the Wabash p class made a cameo in the anime series baccano. There are also my favorite semi streamlined engines

[@roberthuron9160]

For a real rarity,how about the DL&W,2-8-2 Mikado 3 cylinder class,as another obscure engine type! Also,on the Long Island,the G-5's,and G-53's did both freight and passenger work! And the LIRR had quite a few Camelbacks,up to Atlantics,but that's another obscure railroad! Thank you for an interesting video! Hopefully,the data will be useful 👍! Thank you 😇!

[@theimaginationstation1899]

Nice video. With the three-cylinder jobs Alco's policy at the time was to have the client road for any new wheel arrangement name the type, and the UP and SP were both the client road. The material difference between them was the the SP carried a higher boiler pressure, which gave a higher rated tractive effort. The trade literature of the time suggests that SP were going to use the name 'Sierra' and that the type was intended for passenger service over the Sierra Nevada range - but the long wheelbase was a hindrance, thus they were deployed further south, and thus the name was done away with. UP named them for their corporate logo. Lasting through to the end of steam would count as a success in my view. The Overlands rated about 10% more tractive effort than the TTTs. But UP wanted more than that, hence the Big Nines. The conversion to two-cylinder came with an uptick in boiler pressure to keep them at about TTT level in terms of rated tractive effort.

[@jerryswift1956]

If you do another video you should include the Soo Line G class decapod 950

[@844SteamFan]

How are the PRR L1s and SP MTs Obscure? They are large classes(/group of classes) from large, well know railroads. I feel like locomotives from railroads like The Omaha Road (CStPM&O) and Monon fit that description more, I only know about The Omaha Road because I picked up a book about it from my local library, and I know about the Monon because of the At The Railyard review of an MSTS Map made based on it. An interesting locomotive from The Omaha Road is their J-1 Class (491 & 492), built as 2-10-2s in 1917 by Baldwin. At some point they got transferred to the C&NW and rebuilt to 0-10-2s, becoming hump switchers at the Proviso Yard. 492 was scrapped in 1949 and 491 in 1953.

[@yourfellowpancake6335]

7:00 love the “Great Big Rollin’ Railrod” in TTTE style

[@orientexpress567]

Nice that the cnj was mentioned

[@lnproductions3227]

Very nice episode! It would be awesome if you could do the L&N M1 Class "Big Emma" in the next episode of this series

[@nssrrailfan]

Tuxedo Junction! 0:45 Man I love that song! Love the video too!

[@jwrailve3615]

The Gulf coast lines 4-4-0’s. Had the latest operating remaining revenue service model either in all of Texas or the country can’t remember which it crashed in kingsville Texas in 1938

[@JoeysMunchkin]

A type of locos that are I find very nice but also very underrated are the 'P-5(a-g)'s class 0-8-0 Switchers' (Mainly the Grand Trunk Western #3800s/Northwestern Steel & Wire Co. of Sterling, IL). the P-5a's were built by Alco in 1923 while the b-g's were built by Baldwin from 1924-1929. I feel they're often overlooked by 0-6-0's or the Penny's 0-8-0's and I feel they need some more love.

[@IndianaNorthWestern]

I'm gonna say it, camelbacks are acceptable at best. I find them ugly and awkward, and I love the messy thrown together look of freight dominant locomotives

[@OfficialSEIC2K6]

Yeah the steam engines we have forgotten about. MEC Hudsons and many more i had no idea existed.

[@awildjared1396]

7:31, the overlands were testbed locomotives for the 9000's, and the name 'union pacific' wasn't occupied until the following year.

[@ohiovalleyrailfan]

I looooove camelbacks. Your opinion on them is 100% based and i guarantee you won't get cancelled.

[@ethangbb]

Fantastic video, loved these choices

[@marvwatkins7029]

Perhaps some super rich fan can get some of these reproduced like Britain's Tornado.

[@cliffwoodbury5319]

Great Series So Far. This is the only one with no time stamps.

[@kennethjackson7574]

I am going to suggest doing a video about a type that were obscure in their own way because few people saw them in operation- the Geared Locomotives that worked in logging and mining. Principally Climax, Shay, and Heisler, but there were a few others. Some regularly worked on grades as steep as 14%.

[@pastaweasel5088]

So funny story, the Wabash wanted to preserve a P class. They offered one to the city of Decatur Il, but the city declined. The next day, the city changed their minds, but the engine was already in pieces in a gondola.

[@pastaweasel5088]

Oh, and 4367 was the last of the MTs, being cut up in 1961. It was planned to be put on display in either Eugene Oregon or another city (maybe Salem I forgot), but both declined. The story goes a yard manager went to inspect the yard at Eugene, and found 4367. “What’s that doing there?” No one knew. “Cut it up” he said, or something along those lines. And so the last of the MTs met it’s end. If you search in the right places, you can find photos of 4367 being stored tender first.

[@rayvaul3539]

Dad gum! That is sad! But the moral of this story is; when you’re offered something that could be once in a lifetime, the chances are, by the time you decline and change your mind last minute it will be gone so fast, you won’t have time to blink or think about it more a tiny bit more. The Decatur city council should have taken it right away! You know what? This actually makes me angry. If this were the case, we were just a day short of saving a Wabash steam locomotive class!

[@rayvaul3539]

@@pastaweasel5088 So, instead of digging and finding out why the 4367 was there, that manager told them to cut it up without a thought or care? What a careless fool! That makes me angry!! So this means that we were once so close to saving an iconic class with the last in existence in 1960, but that was ripped away from us all because of a careless man who I am to presume cared more about money and himself than a jewel of a steam locomotive, good traditional values, and goodness in general. A man once said that “almost nothing compares to something being taken away from you before you even know it existed.” That makes me so mad! 💥 And that’s the moral I learned about the MT-class and P-class you mentioned.

[@themanformerlyknownascomme777]

nice episode, for a future one, how about the New York Central's 2-6-6-2 the Pittsburgh and Lake Erie 0-8-8-0 and "Aeolus" the CB&Q 4-6-4

[@TheLongIslandRailfan]

He already covered the CB&Q engines.

[@ThePaulv12]

The Camelbacks make me smile. What's not to like about a utilitarian steam loco that can do everything well?

[@Jeisr4207-bc5ui]

Next episode you should cover the New York Central shays

[@davidmaki542]

Maybe you have covered them previously. How about the "Yellowstones?". Just as large as "Big Boy" these monsters were used in northern Mn. to haul iron ore. There are two that I know of on static display. One in Proctor Mn. and one in Two Harbors Mn.

[@riderstrano783]

Third episode in a row asking for the New Haven R3a’s, please I’ll even give you their spec sheet just please talk about them!!!

[@MarkJensen706]

It’s great to see the P-1’s getting some more recognition. I didn’t know they existed until my freshman year of college. They are definitely interesting engines for sure and it would be nice if we could get some models of them in HO and O scale (aside from the Hallmark Brass HO models from the 70’s). A new build would be cool since the T-1 is happening but with the state of the railroad and preservation industry the odds are probably low for that to happen

[@Jeisr4207-bc5ui]

I mean if they’re rebuilding a PRR T1 they can most certainly rebuild anything else

[@doge_sevens]

If you ever did one of these on canadian locomotives you'd probably have to name off every single one other than the royal Hudson since CNR and CPR steam is so underrated and obscure to the greater railfan community lmao

[@daneolson1483]

gotta admit, kinda chuckled at the mispronnounciation of the CNJs as Came-L-Backs, not Cam-El-Backs

[@williamclarke4510]

Wood tried to raise money to purchase the 774 by running it on railfan trips. It failed.

[@thecapisoffyt]

first youtuber that i have seen that says "Stasburg" correctly, about time.

[@struck2soon]

Tractive effort: surely that should be 41,000 POUNDS not Kg?

[@midnightexpress8556]

Because of the B&M Hudson’s how about the Lightest Berkshires the Norfolk Southern 2-8-4.

[@midnightexpress8556]

*I believe in North America.

[@blackbirdgaming8147]

I’m not sure the MEC Hudsons were the smallest in North America, I believe that title belongs to the N de M Hudsons.

[@DMIRyellowstoneFan]

Here are some future ideas for this series: Chicago Burlington & Quincy 2-10-4 Colorado types and Bessemer & Lake Erie H1's Atlantic Coast Line R-1 class Baltimore & Ohio T class mountain types Frisco 4500 class Pennsylvania Railroad E4 and E5 atlantics Nickel Plate Road H6B mikados Virginian Railway AE class Norfolk & Western Z class Santa Fe 3800 class Northern Pacific 2-8-8-4 yellowstones Erie K class pacifics (all of them) Western Maryland challengers New York Central heavy mikados Florida East Coast 4-8-2 mountain types Central of Georgia Big Apples Boston & Maine 4-8-2 mountain types Southern Pacific 2-10-2's Frisco 4300 and 4400 class

[@wesw9586]

Great video! Thanks. My only comment would be that these are American locos. Let's get those tractive effort numbers in freedom units or both standard and metric. Still great content and much appreciated.

[@awildjared1396]

The PRR L1's were also the base design for the USRA heavy mikados after WW1.

[@russellgxy2905]

How curious! That'd make L1's to the L2's what the LMS 8F's were to the WD 2-8-0's

[@HistoryForEveryoneProductions]

Great video. Loved it

[@kevinb9327]

Great video. If I may, it's pronounced Berk sheer.

[@bnsfperson3421]

The st louis san francisco railroad had a fleet of 2-8-0s that were rebuilt into 2-8-2s

[@Toledo1940]

Maine Central Engine 173, an 0-6-0 switcher shown at 0.35, looks just like a New York Central B-10 or B-11 0-6-0 switcher. Was she acquired as a hand-me-down from the NYC???

[@TheTransportationFanfromCA]

You should do an atsf Hudson or the SP 4-10-2s.

[@abuBrachiosaurus]

Could you do one on the Great Northern's M-2 2-6-8-0 and/or on the Great Northern S-2 4-8-4? (if either of those are obscure enough of course)

[@JamesBrown-dg8le]

I think the CNJ k class of 4-8-0 camelbacks would be a great addition to these lists. It is a bit more obscure than the ten wheelers. You can see it at 12:51

[@railroadactive]

Quite informative! Any plans for obscure canadian steam Like the CPR's w1 0-10-0s or 4-8-2s?

[@lordvader1672]

I hope we see Maryland and Pennsylvania no.4,5,6 in this series

[@ryancrooks2515]

The Wabash used to run through my town

[@KCamp-uk2px]

can you do a rolling line skit on the northeast corridor?

[@TrainLovers-TL69]

They're really big

[@danieljones1861]

I have some suggestions if you ever decide to do another video. 1. Baltimore & Ohio C-16 2. Boston & Albany D1-A 3. Chicago & South Side Rapid Transit Forneys (Or just Forneys as a whole) 4. Kanawha & Michigan H-Xa and H-Xb 5. Pennsylvania A1 6. Chicago & North Western E-4 7. Lima Class D Shays 8. New York Central B-60 9. New York Central K-5b 10. New Haven Y-1 (Formally Boston & Providence) 11. Norfolk Western S-1a 12. Southern Pacific TW-4 (or any 1880s SP twelve wheelers) 13. Southern Railway F-8 14. Southern Railway Ps-4 15. Timken 1111 16. Texas & Pacific I-1

[@timl6039]

Brah. There has NEVER been a railroad called “Norfolk & Southern” And there were 75 S-1as on the n&w and they were ubiquitous AF, on the railroad serving every corner of it.

[@danieljones1861]

My mistake. And the reason I suggested the S-1as is because they were the last steam engines to be built in the US for a class I railroad. (1953) Obscurity and scarcity don't always go hand in hand. There are several instances of famous engine classes that didn't have that many members, and others that had tons of examples that most rail enthusiasts have never heard of.

[@Alapaloozalover2000]

14:43 “NOTHING! ABSOLUTELY NOTHING!” Me to the CNJ: STUPID! YOU’RE SO STUPIIIIID! (I love UHF)

[@marvwatkins7029]

"Kaymelbacks"?

[@ryangold8517]

Frisco had 4-8-4s if you need another locomotive.

[@Railbrony]

Could’ve used the L&N m1 berkshires

[@jonathanpan6110]

When is the next AOSL coming?

[@BnuuyBoi2005]

Can you do SP Thank Engines or ATSF 2-8-4, 4-6-4, or 4-4-6-2?

[@qpr543]

Why they never used a design similar to Garratt?

[@PatrioticCoservativeAmerican]

Were any locomotives of any of theae classes saved?

[@hb4174]

If you do another talk about the Norfolk Southern Berkshires, they’re very odd to say the very least

[@Jeisr4207-bc5ui]

Wait NS owned 2-8-4’s?

[@hb4174]

@@Jeisr4207-bc5uiyeah, tho not the modern ns that we know of now, but there was a different ns

[@trainman264]

Can you tell me how you found the music you are using?

[@Jim-ic2of]

Walk don't run .

[@huttongilgeours4997]

Plz do the lirr g5s

[@kimberlyknox4426]

He got 5k sub in one year

[@brucewellman]

If it wasn't for WWII most of the steam engine would have been gone a lot sooner. the reason why was the diesel engines for train engines went into submarines so steam engines were not replaced till after the war

[@maozilla9149]

nice video

[@ChicagoRailLines]

HERITAGE UNITS IN 10 words or less NOW PLZ

[@Kamberry-1]

*sad NP Northern noises*

[@ffjsb]

Maine is UP, not "down" in the US... just sayin'.

[@DaGamingIdiot]

Welp I managed to be the 1000th viewer on this vid. Somehow that happened Oh…. Your still here? Ok… I just have one thing to say… THIS VIDEO IS PRUE GOLD.

[@timl6039]

I would hardly call the Espee MT class “obscure”. While not as prevalent as the bigger GS stable mates. They’re still pretty widely known. Want obscure…. Pick a little engine from the N&W… like the *Second* J class…. Ya know the 600-606….

[@Jimboliah3985]

2:20 Hey, it's Rodney!

[@mikestudioz216]

Who?

[@rayvaul3539]

Great episode dude! I thoroughly enjoyed and hope to see a part 4! 😀The explanations seem well-met and pretty accurate. I say that at least one of each steam locomotive class should been preserved instead of allowing the greed and carelessness of man take hold, but we know we can’t change the past now, but work with what we have in these perilous times during Biden’s tyrannical administration 😒. I don’t mean to get political, sorry.😅 *Quote -* “Almost nothing is worse that makes you more frustrated that compares to something being taken away from you before you even knew it even existed.”

[@0fficialdregs]

2-6-6-6 > all other locomotives

[@ChargerusPrime]

ALL SP engines were oil burners from the start with the most notable exceptions being the AC-9s. NONE of the MTs were EVER coal burners. Even on their T&NO Texan subsidiary ALL engines were oil burning so much so it's believed they influenced many surrounding roads to do so as well, including the Mopac and MKT. The mopac however held onto coal in areas rich with the substance. Texas is NOT rich in coal, oil on the other hand well.. word is there's enough oil still under Texas to float the whole country for another 200 years on its own. But no, back on topic, the SP only ever had VERY few coal burning engines and from my research I can say with certainty that crews HATED the coal burners. Makes sense why, WAY dirtier to clean and work on.

[@thatonecaledonian812]

2:34 bruh

[@joelongjr.5114]

Please don't mix imperial and metric units. It is confusing.

[@kimberlyknox4426]

I liked my own comment

[@Jeisr4207-bc5ui]

Who cares

[@CrazyPetez]

Stopped at 1:24, when I saw you list tractive effort in kilograms. This feet and inches America, and it was definitely NOT metric when that locomotive,was new. Goodbye.

[@timl6039]

And I bet the OP is Canadian, you ignorant potato.

[@Fox_Eh]

Ok? So? Other countries than America exist and most use the metric system.

[@CrazyPetez]

@@Fox_Eh Can you define exactly how long a meter is? Careful, it’s tricky. And how does that relate to ANYTHING?

[@gonzoengineering4894]

​@CrazyPetez A meter is pretty rigorously defined as far as units go, now what the fuck is a yard?